Guild Wars 2

instead of having skill and traits that grant 25% faster movement speed have them grant swiftness
to improve counterplay and make boon stripping even better
all signets (that grant the 25% faster movement)
swiftness 50 second 50 second recharge
note this could be on the passive but was thinking more of an active effect
warrior
warrior sprint
peroidically grants swiftness
swiftness 30 second 30 second recharge

elementalist
windborne dagger
when mainhand dagger is equiped
peroidically grants swiftness
swiftness 20 seconds 30 second recharge

necromancer
when mainhand dagger is equiped
quickening thirst
peroidically grants swiftness
swiftness 20 seconds 30 second recharge

engineers
they actually have so much swiftness that they would need a reduction to swiftness
seeing that they can get perma-swiftness from 1 of 3 different trait + powershoe + utilities that provide healthly amounts of swiftness
which is why im ignoring this class
however im not trying to directly nerf

the recharge were suppose to long to make more boon stripping useful

First thing, why should warrior have better trait than the rest? Doesn’t make sense….

Second thing, there’s bigger difference between 25% passive speed and swiftness boon (for example traits that give bonuses for each boon etc…).
So it will just impact balance again, which is not too good even now, not worth it imho.

STRanger.5120:

First thing, why should warrior have better trait than the rest? Doesn’t make sense….

Because the op mains a warrior

Jim Hunter.6821:

STRanger.5120:

First thing, why should warrior have better trait than the rest? Doesn’t make sense….

Because the op mains a warrior

Well, that came to my mind too, however I was curious if he will admit it

My take:

• Remove easy Swiftness access from all classes. Swiftness should only be obtained in short bursts and as a result be noticeable (since on average, no one has any of it). Most utility skills giving swiftness would be self-only, and duration would be low, and you can’t stack it high.
• Only Thieves (or whoever, I don’t care, I hate thieves with a passion :P ) keeps a 25% signet. The others get theirs changed to provide Swiftness for X seconds upon leaving combat.
• No Swiftness combo AE finishers. Only self-only.
• Then (after all of the above) re-evaluate the base out of combat movement speed we all use.

In short, if perma- or semi-perma-runspeed is so important, fix it at the root problem. Then, make Swiftness feel powerful and focused on top of that.

Carighan.6758:

My take:

• Remove easy Swiftness access from all classes. Swiftness should only be obtained in short bursts and as a result be noticeable (since on average, no one has any of it). Most utility skills giving swiftness would be self-only, and duration would be low, and you can’t stack it high.
• Only Thieves (or whoever, I don’t care, I hate thieves with a passion :P ) keeps a 25% signet. The others get theirs changed to provide Swiftness for X seconds upon leaving combat.
• No Swiftness combo AE finishers. Only self-only.
• Then (after all of the above) re-evaluate the base out of combat movement speed we all use.

In short, if perma- or semi-perma-runspeed is so important, fix it at the root problem. Then, make Swiftness feel powerful and focused on top of that.

Thief main?

Also, it’s not a good suggestion to totally break the ability of moving fast for classes that are built around it, therefore it would need the complete overhaul of most classes (Ele, Engi, even the Thief etc…) which will bring total chaos to the fragile game balance.

the reason why the warriors was better is because the trait was better in the first place
did you even look at the traits?

to be honest i didnt think about the traits that give +%damage bonus.

STRanger.5120:

Thief main?

Not at all, a class I don’t even have. Mesmer main, but that maybe explains my stance on this, being on the one class without sensible Swiftness access on a class-level. I only mention Thief because initially, they were the only class with such a speed signet.

STRanger.5120:

which will bring total chaos to the fragile game balance.

Good, brings me to another point: The current approach to balancing (“equal chances”) is just silly for a RPG. Makes no sense. Easy to please the sPvP-crowd with it ofc, but meh from a lore/game perspective as there’s no reason a Warrior should have equal chances versus an Elementalist for example.

Rather, balance should centre on “moments of greatness”. Making as many things as possible as overpowered as possible, creating balance in some sort of Mutually Assured Destruction way and the limitation of 1 heal + 3 utility + 1 elite skill.

The idea has merit because the current approach to PvP balance tries to saw off any edge and dull any blade until they can no longer decide a combat in your favour, so “that player skill is the only deciding factor”. But this in turn makes the character feel weak, and there’s just no point or edge to it any more.

Anyhow, digressing. But the point is, upsetting the current balance (or rather, lack thereof) is a good thing IMO.

Carighan.6758:

STRanger.5120:

Thief main?

Not at all, a class I don’t even have. Mesmer main, but that maybe explains my stance on this, being on the one class without sensible Swiftness access on a class-level. I only mention Thief because initially, they were the only class with such a speed signet.

STRanger.5120:

which will bring total chaos to the fragile game balance.

Good, brings me to another point: The current approach to balancing (“equal chances”) is just silly for a RPG. Makes no sense. Easy to please the sPvP-crowd with it ofc, but meh from a lore/game perspective as there’s no reason a Warrior should have equal chances versus an Elementalist for example.

Rather, balance should centre on “moments of greatness”. Making as many things as possible as overpowered as possible, creating balance in some sort of Mutually Assured Destruction way and the limitation of 1 heal + 3 utility + 1 elite skill.

The idea has merit because the current approach to PvP balance tries to saw off any edge and dull any blade until they can no longer decide a combat in your favour, so “that player skill is the only deciding factor”. But this in turn makes the character feel weak, and there’s just no point or edge to it any more.

Anyhow, digressing. But the point is, upsetting the current balance (or rather, lack thereof) is a good thing IMO.

Yeah, totally forgot about Thieves being the only class having this signet at first Nice reminder

Well, the balance in this game is kinda wrong, you’re right about that too. Because I guess that the game should be balanced around teamplay, right? Not around 1vs1.
Therefore it shouldn’t be like “equal chances” for everyone 1on1, but every build should have it’s counter, therefore promoting teamplay. However, community can’t understand this type of approach now, it was totally different 15 years ago, ppl actually appreciated this back then….
Now, everything that someone can’t beat with his/her build must be overpowered, right? /sarcasm….

This is the plague of modern MMOs unfortunately….

And lastly, swiftness change won’t solve this issue IMHO.

Aye. It used to be that people think “kitten , I can’t do this, what the hell is wrong with me?!”.

Now it’s “kitten , I can’t do this, what the hell is wrong with it?!”.

Carighan.6758:

Aye. It used to be that people think “kitten , I can’t do this, what the hell is wrong with me?!”.

Now it’s “kitten , I can’t do this, what the hell is wrong with it?!”.

Yeah, this is maybe the most accurate and succinct description of today’s community problem.

+1 m8

Tadsoul.6951:

instead of having skill and traits that grant 25% faster movement speed have them grant swiftness

Why?

@ GreyWraith
to improve counterplay and make boon stripping even better
ill edit the orginal to make it more clear

@carighan
they kinda do have what your talking about with skills like
superspeed on the engie
haste on ele
signet of the wild on ranger
fleet shadows on theif
I like the swiftness because it helps with kiting enemy players. having that speed gap that is an option to take can make some build diversity too

Tadsoul.6951:

@ GreyWraith
to improve counterplay and make boon stripping even better
ill edit the orginal to make it more clear

@carighan
they kinda do have what your talking about with skills like
superspeed on the engie
haste on ele
signet of the wild on ranger
fleet shadows on theif
I like the swiftness because it helps with kiting enemy players. having that speed gap that is an option to take can make some build diversity too

However not every class can naturally remove boons, what would you do with that? Or you want to give an advantage to those who can?
Not that some classes don’t have an advantage with permaswiftness/signets now, of course…

I am totally against the OP on this. It is simply one more effort to conform all of the professions to have access to everything. I see certainly player groups push this in every MMO I play. As far as I am concerned, everyone already has entirely too much access to swiftness and/or speed in general.

coglin.1867:

I am totally against the OP on this. It is simply one more effort to conform all of the professions to have access to everything. I see certainly player groups push this in every MMO I play. As far as I am concerned, everyone already has entirely too much access to swiftness and/or speed in general.

But we need more sameness!!!!
Don’t you constantly pick up class-based games to then complain about classes? :P

Tadsoul.6951:

@ GreyWraith
to improve counterplay and make boon stripping even better
ill edit the orginal to make it more clear

But…it won’t make boon stripping better. It will make it worse.

Only one skill in the game does a total boon rip, and that’s Lich Form 5. Everything else, having more Swiftness means that important boons like Might and Stability are even less likely to be removed. Sigil of Nullification will proc on Swiftness a lot more often and be on cooldown for 10 seconds, instead of proccing when the target actually has a boon worth removing.

Yes, all of those things currently can remove Swiftness and lose efficiency right now, but this suggestion drastically increases the possibility of Swiftness being on the target.

@ STRanger
Not every class needs to remove boons because it isnt their strength the purpose of the change would make the effect of swiftness more noticbly
@ drarnor kunoram
that is a problem you see no1 care enough to remove swiftness
if swiftness became a more important boon to remove (in the right situation) than stability and might this would be good then.

It really won’t become “a more important boon to remove.” because Might, Stability, Retaliation, and Protection will always be more important to strip. Swiftness is helpful, but it’s rare that it actually makes a difference when you are in combat. Plus, there are the movement speed caps, which Swiftness reaches. They can’t buff Swiftness’s effectiveness, which is the only way it would ever become “more important to remove.”

Your suggestion will do the exact opposite of what you intend.

And I’m just sitting here, crossing my fingers that Signet of Inspiration will give me 10 seconds of swiftness.

Tadsoul.6951:

the recharge were suppose to long to make more boon stripping useful

Which would literally make those traits useless. Professions that have boon stripping have it on cooldowns that are far, far lower than 30s. And of course there’s the fact that in some cases Swiftness would be a lesser sacrifice than Might, Protection, Stability, Regeneration, Retaliation.

You could make it something like:
Signet of Insertname
“Grants 5s of Swiftness every 5s.”