Guild Wars 2

I think me and my guild (and ofc similar experienced people) fending off 2v1, 3v1 or even more odds in WvW against competent players time and time again is more of a skillful achievement then you killing GASP a thousand brainless NPCs.

Get your head out of your kitten. Your NPC farming for achivements is no more epic than a dude that logs in every day and does a daily.
Hence this elitist bullkitten is pointless.

Djemo.7153:

I think me and my guild (and ofc similar experienced people) fending off 2v1, 3v1 or even more odds in WvW against competent players time and time again is more of a skillful achievement then you killing GASP a thousand brainless NPCs.

Get your head out of your kitten. Your NPC farming for achivements is no more epic than a dude that logs in every day and does a daily.
Hence this elitist bullkitten is pointless.

Umm … we’re not discussing elitism here, but whether or not we think dailies should count towards the total … for reasons other than elitism.

And your comment here reeks of elitism itself, good sir. If you don’t have something to contribute, then to troll elsewhere. Thank you.

Its not elitism to deny people points from something just cause you dont deem it worthy enough to be counted?
Yeah case example of elitism right there.

And i was reffering to the people that flaunt their Slayer achivement and the like (jumping puzzles? seriously?) as something that is somehow a better and more rewarding experience. Hence i say its not, cause it takes no skill (hence why should it differ from dailies) to kill a set amount of brainless NPCs.

I play PvE, sPvP and WvW, but i play WvW the most.
I have 3 characters in Arah sets, and the rest in SE.

And unlike most here i dont give a rats kitten if someone gets those sets the way he wants. If its dailies its noones kittenig buisness to tell him otherwise.

Djemo.7153:

Its not elitism to deny people points from something just cause you dont deem it worthy enough to be counted?
Yeah case example of elitism right there.

It’s not that I don’t deem it worthy enough. It’s that it would not push people to try other things. Nothing more and nothing less.

Djemo.7153:

And i was reffering to the people that flaunt their Slayer achivement and the like (jumping puzzles? seriously?) as something that is somehow a better and more rewarding experience. Hence i say its not, cause it takes no skill (hence why should it differ from dailies) to kill a set amount of brainless NPCs.

Some may. I do not. I just feel that it would be nice to at least nudge players into trying more things out for the points instead of only doing their dailies.

Djemo.7153:

I play PvE, sPvP and WvW, but i play WvW the most.
I have 3 characters in Arah sets, and the rest in SE.

And unlike most here i dont give a rats kitten if someone gets those sets the way he wants. If its dailies its noones kittenig buisness to tell him otherwise.

Again I will have no complaints regardless of whether dailies are or are not included in the implementation. I am pretty sure that you and many others in this thread have many more achievement points as I have.

My opinions draw strictly from what I feel would make more people see more of the game. If dailies are included, I will fear that many will only focus on doing just as much of the dailies as possible to maximize their count and ignore the other facets of the game as the dailies provide more points for the time spent.

It is not out of elitism. It is out of desiring for more people to come out and see more of the game than just what the dailies provide. Nothing more and nothing less.

SynfulChaot.3169:

It is just something that I am suggesting. As it stands right now, a large majority of points comes from dailies. As time progresses, that majority will only get larger until it is almost entirely from dailies. Now I have no problem with this, I do think it would be a bit of a misnomer to call it just ‘Achievement Point Rewards’ if in reality it is ‘Daily Achievement Point Rewards’ with a slight bonus if you did anything else.

Can you give me a data, what is % of daily and monthly AP for people which have 10k AP in this (almost) 1 year of GW2 ?

Daily/monthly achievement will be bigger and bigger. This is known fact, but again its need time. Even in 1 year, this daily/monthly AP is not higher than AP total of all achievements from normal activities. But Anet will release new content with new achievement. In addition, they have plan to release new expansion (if not scrapped) in the future which will give you a ton new achievement to be done.

deviller.9135:

SynfulChaot.3169:

It is just something that I am suggesting. As it stands right now, a large majority of points comes from dailies. As time progresses, that majority will only get larger until it is almost entirely from dailies. Now I have no problem with this, I do think it would be a bit of a misnomer to call it just ‘Achievement Point Rewards’ if in reality it is ‘Daily Achievement Point Rewards’ with a slight bonus if you did anything else.

Can you give me a data, what is % of daily and monthly AP for people which have 10k AP in this (almost) 1 year of GW2 ?

Daily/monthly achievement will be bigger and bigger. This is known fact, but again its need time. Even in 1 year, this daily/monthly AP is not higher than AP total of all achievements from normal activities. But Anet will release new content with new achievement. In addition, they have plan to release new expansion (if not scrapped) in the future which will give you a ton new achievement to be done.

I know that I am still under 7k. I have all event/living story completion (out of personal OCD and nothing else) and my daily/monthly portion is nearly 50% of my total, even after taking nearly a one month break from dailies.

@Synful

While an noble endeavour its in a small part a greedy one as well.

Myself i have 2.5k hours spent into this game and only 4.7 ac points.
Ive spent time in every aspect of the game.
Ive owned in sPvP. Since every single one of my dungeon runs was a pug group i had countless times in my quest for the Arah sets been forced to finish off Lupi alone (not bragging).

Ive done jumping puzzles, ive done living stories (MF was kittenawesome and i hope for more) and in the end of it all i settled in WvW. Hence why with such a huge playtime im really low on the points.

If someone enjoys one aspect of the game (i have friends who only sPvP, and its their right to continue to do so) then i say let them.
If they are unwilling to go and kill 10k ogres they should not be bloody forced to.

So what we are left is people who are disgrunted that their aspect of the game is in shambles (reffering to PvE) and are trying to get people back into doing things in PvE aside from these occasional living stories.

Cause we all can agree whole areas are barren and devoid of players, but we the players of WvW or sPvP or the whatever else people do in this game should not be penalized cause we dont coform to your ideals of farming NPCs or jumping around in a cave.

Its the devs who need to make PvE areas more compelling and worthwhile (which they said they are working on in that new video in the news).

Djemo.7153:

@Synful

While an noble endeavour its in a small part a greedy one as well.

Myself i have 2.5k hours spent into this game and only 4.7 ac points.
Ive spent time in every aspect of the game.
Ive owned in sPvP. Since every single one of my dungeon runs was a pug group i had countless times in my quest for the Arah sets been forced to finish off Lupi alone (not bragging).

Ive done jumping puzzles, ive done living stories (MF was kittenawesome and i hope for more) and in the end of it all i settled in WvW. Hence why with such a huge playtime im really low on the points.

If someone enjoys one aspect of the game (i have friends who only sPvP, and its their right to continue to do so) then i say let them.
If they are unwilling to go and kill 10k ogres they should not be bloody forced to.

So what we are left is people who are disgrunted that their aspect of the game is in shambles (reffering to PvE) and are trying to get people back into doing things in PvE aside from these occasional living stories.

Cause we all can agree whole areas are barren and devoid of players, but we the players of WvW or sPvP or the whatever else people do in this game should not be penalized cause we dont coform to your ideals of farming NPCs or jumping around in a cave.

Its the devs who need to make PvE areas more compelling and worthwhile (which they said they are working on in that new video in the news).

I don’t find it greedy at all. I’m not trying to get anything more than anyone else, nor am I trying to exclude anyone from anything. Again, I am speaking simply of having it used to try to nudge people into trying new things. (This includes myself as well. I know full well there are sections I typically avoid)

I will agree that both WvW and PvP need better/more points from their achievement trees. If all achievement sections, PvP, WvW, and PvE each had the same number of points and you didn’t need to go outside your section, would excluding the dailies still be abhorrent?

It would still hurt the people who spread their attention across all aspects of the game yet excel in none.
Dailies/Monthlies are the only things keeping any achievement score up for those people cause they dont play a single aspect of the game zealously enough to achieve an achievement attributed to the individual aspects of the game.

Djemo.7153:

It would still hurt the people who spread their attention across all aspects of the game yet excel in none.
Dailies/Monthlies are the only things keeping any achievement score up for those people cause they dont play a single aspect of the game zealously enough to achieve an achievement attributed to the individual aspects of the game.

You realize that my suggestion would also butcher my points as well, right? Nearly half of my points are from dailies and monthlies. And many of my in-game hours are from RPing, which gives me zero points.

Yes, it would hurt people’s total scores. But it would also be a system that would nudge people into trying new things and wouldn’t just reward dailies more than anything else.

I’m not saying it’s the best system, nor the worst. Just one that might have the potential to bring people into different stuff if only for a short while.

Why are so many of these “high achievement points” players so selfish? (cough* elitism cough*)

Not every player has time to login for hours a day so dailies/monthlies become their only source of achievement points.

ANET has always wanted a level playing field. For instance in GW2, cheap exotics at 1-2g each has the same stats as a 1500g legendary. This is still evident in GW1 too.

Don’t take it too seriously. It is only a game

The current system is fine and well, if people want to try something they will.
Forcing people into something on the other hand just so they can get a reward is definately not the way to go.

And cause you and others of your train of though wouldnt care about butchering your points doesent mean people of mine would agree on those terms.

Cause in the end when we are stripped of our dailies and monthlies the PvE players, who are already far ahead (you seem to be one) will still be allot less phased then WvW and sPvP players would.

If you take your time to read the WvW achivements you should realize just how ridiculous they are compared to “sit in Harathi Hinterlands and punch a set amout of centaurs in the face”.
So my 4.7 points could well be something like 2k or whatnot, and thats just not right for someone who played 2.5k hours. I deserved those points no more than someone who isnt arsed to do Slayers or puzzles. So are the rest like me which are a huge part of this game.

Supercharged.8914:

Why are so many of these “high achievement points” players so selfish? (cough* elitism cough*)

Not every player has time to login for hours a day so dailies/monthlies become their only source of achievement points.

ANET has always wanted a level playing field. For instance in GW2, cheap exotics at 1-2g each has the same stats as a 1500g legendary. This is still evident in GW1 too.

Don’t take it too seriously. It is only a game

I hope you’re not speaking of me. My count is not that high. My suggestion is solely to try to get people to try out more of the game. I wasn’t aware that doing so made me an elitist.

Djemo.7153:

The current system is fine and well, if people want to try something they will.
Forcing people into something on the other hand just so they can get a reward is definately not the way to go.

And cause you and others of your train of though wouldnt care about butchering your points doesent mean people of mine would agree on those terms.

Cause in the end when we are stripped of our dailies and monthlies the PvE players, who are already far ahead (you seem to be one) will still be allot less phased then WvW and sPvP players would.

If you take your time to read the WvW achivements you should realize just how ridiculous they are compared to “sit in Harathi Hinterlands and punch a set amout of centaurs in the face”.
So my 4.7 points could well be something like 2k or whatnot, and thats just not right for someone who played 2.5k hours. I deserved those points no more than someone who isnt arsed to do Slayers or puzzles. So are the rest like me which are a huge part of this game.

For that system to work well, they would need to revamp the WvW and PvP point scaling as to not unfairly punish WvW and PvP players. I am aware of the state of those sections and how much harder WvW and PvP players need to work to get achievement points. It’s not a perfect system and with those sections the way they are, perhaps it is untenable. But the base idea behind it is with nothing but good intentions.

Supercharged.8914:

Why are so many of these “high achievement points” players so selfish? (cough* elitism cough*)

Not every player has time to login for hours a day so dailies/monthlies become their only source of achievement points.

ANET has always wanted a level playing field. For instance in GW2, cheap exotics at 1-2g each has the same stats as a 1500g legendary. This is still evident in GW1 too.

Don’t take it too seriously. It is only a game

Sounds like you’re the elitist one here. You want to force people to log in every day for 1-2 hours to do dailies to keep their scores up with everyone else instead of being able to casually play and finish the actual achievements whenever they want.

That’s basically what this thread comes down to. we have the elitists who think they are better than everyone else because they can play every day and get points from dailies to artificially inflate their scores and we have the rest of the players who think that we should remove that and have a level playing field for everyone where only the things you actually accomplish should count towards this system.

That way a new player can slowly earn the points he/she needs by doing the achievements and putting in the work. They can never do dailies for the days before they played so they can never obtain the same number of points as veterans.

Ok let me close this cause you cant see it from my perspective.
Your good intentions are directed towards yourself, and your likeminded PvE loving players. WvW players have nothing to gain from your good intentions, sPvP players have nothing to gain either.

Only thing they will gain is frustration when they realize they have been shafted for the innumerable time again because they like a different mode than their fellow players. PvE players just have to get over the fact that theres a big part of this games population who does things differently, and they will not change this unless the PvP players themselves want to.

I go to PvE when i want to help a friend, a guildie or when theres some content that came out and peaked my interest. Other than that theres not a single good intention in forcing me to part from my fun so someone else can have their way.

Riddle me this:

What is all the WvW players petitioned that every single person that didnt have a set amount of time in WvW helping their server prosper be denied all the buffs that you so freely and carelessly enjoyed for whatever time you spent in this game.
Now imagine if we could replicate this experience, all of your dungeons, all of your gathering on any node, all your HP/healing power boosts, all your crafting critical successes.

Gone, just gone.
Why? Cause we felt like shafting someone who isnt even related to us or is in no way threatening to our playstyle.
If we dont promote stupid things i would implore the other half of this games community to do the same.

I wont, repeating myself for whatever time, WONT do slayers.
And a removal of dailies/monthlies from the pool will be found with a not so pleasing response from a huge part of the games audience.
Which trust me will hurt more if people just pack their bags then if people find it in themselves to weed out that seed of jelaousy for everyone who has the same armor as them.

@Zudet

Except you know, 90% of the community doesent give a rats kitten about some stupid leaderboards and play this game to have fun, something you appear to lack.

And every newbie that voiced himself in this thread and the others in this subforum agreed it was stupid to even think that.
Cause everyone sane knows you should not penalize loyal customers for their way of enjoying your product. Its like everyone thinks people come in, do a daily and leave.
We go do other things, which dont include “kill the same mob ad nauseum”

ZudetGambeous.9573:

(…)You want to force people to log in every day for 1-2 hours to do dailies to keep their scores up with everyone else instead of being able to casually play and finish the actual achievements whenever they want.

That’s basically what this thread comes down to. we have the elitists who think they are better than everyone else because they can play every day and get points from dailies to artificially inflate their scores and we have the rest of the players who think that we should remove that and have a level playing field for everyone where only the things you actually accomplish should count towards this system.

That way a new player can slowly earn the points he/she needs by doing the achievements and putting in the work. They can never do dailies for the days before they played so they can never obtain the same number of points as veterans.

What exactly are we talking about here right now? I would almost agree with the Leaderboards although it’s hardly worth talking about that since there is no “reward” at all – unless you like to see your name on number 1.

When it comes to the new reward system I’m expecting a mix, some rewards for finishing certain categories, some rewards for the overall score. This will be a set score, I don’t know, let’s say at 1000 points, then at 2000, next at 5000, 10000 etc.

The finite number will only get so high – I never counted, maybe someone knows what that number is – the wiki says for example 622 points for the slayer. So there could be potentially one reward locked – thinking of giants here – for finishing this category.

Other then that I’ve said my piece in my previous post here, I still don’t understand why A-net should limit us in terms of getting those points while limiting their own options.

Djemo.7153:

Ok let me close this cause you cant see it from my perspective.
Your good intentions are directed towards yourself, and your likeminded PvE loving players. WvW players have nothing to gain from your good intentions, sPvP players have nothing to gain either.

Only thing they will gain is frustration when they realize they have been shafted for the innumerable time again because they like a different mode than their fellow players. PvE players just have to get over the fact that theres a big part of this games population who does things differently, and they will not change this unless the PvP players themselves want to.

I go to PvE when i want to help a friend, a guildie or when theres some content that came out and peaked my interest. Other than that theres not a single good intention in forcing me to part from my fun so someone else can have their way.

Riddle me this:

What is all the WvW players petitioned that every single person that didnt have a set amount of time in WvW helping their server prosper be denied all the buffs that you so freely and carelessly enjoyed for whatever time you spent in this game.
Now imagine if we could replicate this experience, all of your dungeons, all of your gathering on any node, all your HP/healing power boosts, all your crafting critical successes.

Gone, just gone.
Why? Cause we felt like shafting someone who isnt even related to us or is in no way threatening to our playstyle.
If we dont promote stupid things i would implore the other half of this games community to do the same.

I wont, repeating myself for whatever time, WONT do slayers.
And a removal of dailies/monthlies from the pool will be found with a not so pleasing response from a huge part of the games audience.
Which trust me will hurt more if people just pack their bags then if people find it in themselves to weed out that seed of jelaousy for everyone who has the same armor as them.

Ok. It seems I have a lot to straighten out here for you.

My view is not solely for PvE. It is for everything. Like I said before, I am aware that WvW and PvP achievements are not on par for points as PvE and would need to be fixed as to be in line with PvE.

I am not trying to deny things from anyone. But look at the situation this way. Right now, for those at the upper end of the scale (people well above me) over/about half of their achievement points come from dailies. As the game progresses more and more of their points will be from then. At that point is it ‘Achievement Rewards’ or ‘Daily Achievement Rewards’. At that point all that will really matter is the dailies. And that would be a shame if that is all that the system devolved into. How many days you did your daily.

And of the WvW thing? I don’t rely or care about those rewards. I’d still be where I am new even without them. And many of your WvW compatriots already want to do that. I’ve seen the more selfish members of that community push for that again and again.

And on the slayer achievements? I don’t grind them. If they happen they happen, but I’m in no rush to make that happen.

As to the last point. Jealousy. Yeah. I don’t care who does or does not have certain armour. If I like armor I will go for it. If I don’t, I won’t. I don’t care about having something someone else can’t get. That’s terribly anti-social behaviour I disdain in all. As I keep saying, my suggestion is not to exclude. It is simply to try to get people to try out more stuff not necessarily in PvE.

Not necessarily in PvE?
Where pray tell then are you implying one should get them?
Is there a magical part of this game we are all unaware of?

As it stands the majority of it is in PvE.
This isnt a PvE patch hence i dont see why it should adhere to the PvE community.
Its the patch for all of us, and the armor and weapons hidden behind these achivement checkpoints are not legendaries, they are just another skin.

A skin that dedication in whatever way expressed to this game should be rewarded to.
And as it stands theres enough e-kitten items in this game, the achievements and the skins related to them need not be another of these.

Djemo.7153:

Not necessarily in PvE?
Where pray tell then are you implying one should get them?
Is there a magical part of this game we are all unaware of?

As it stands the majority of it is in PvE.
This isnt a PvE patch hence i dont see why it should adhere to the PvE community.
Its the patch for all of us, and the armor and weapons hidden behind these achivement checkpoints are not legendaries, they are just another skin.

A skin that dedication in whatever way expressed to this game should be rewarded to.
And as it stands theres enough e-kitten items in this game, the achievements and the skins related to them need not be another of these.

Must I repeat myself yet again? Ok. Here it is:

SynfulChaot.3169:

Like I said before, I am aware that WvW and PvP achievements are not on par for points as PvE and would need to be fixed as to be in line with PvE.

I know that WvW and PvP achievements are not in line with PvE. Anyone who has ever looked at them knows. Now if they remedy that, then this argument is entirely moot.

SynfulChaot.3169:

(…)
I am not trying to deny things from anyone. But look at the situation this way. Right now, for those at the upper end of the scale (people well above me) over/about half of their achievement points come from dailies. As the game progresses more and more of their points will be from then. At that point is it ‘Achievement Rewards’ or ‘Daily Achievement Rewards’. At that point all that will really matter is the dailies. And that would be a shame if that is all that the system devolved into. How many days you did your daily.

Secret of Southsun: 235 points
Flame & Frost: 147 points
SAB: 106 points
Dragon Bash: 195 points
Sky Pirates: 193 points

876 points

Compare average 5 points for daily – 175 days

Remove?

(…)
As to the last point. Jealousy. Yeah. I don’t care who does or does not have certain armour. If I like armor I will go for it. If I don’t, I won’t. I don’t care about having something someone else can’t get. That’s terribly anti-social behaviour I disdain in all. As I keep saying, my suggestion is not to exclude. It is simply to try to get people to try out more stuff not necessarily in PvE.

While this is a noble goal I don’t think this is the right way, you have to give people options and choices. Not everyone wants to create a character from every race to get all the points there, not everyone wants to get 250000 WvW kills.

Don’t underestimate the pressure that many people will put on themselves. Even now many will likely try to do all daily achievements and will try to complete all achievements they haven’t looked at before – just to speed up the process. People who don’t want to slay 1000 ettins have the choice not to – and that I think is a way better option.

It will be way more of a perceived grind if you would remove the dailies.

You can’t say you are excluding anyone if you leave the daily – all it could potentially do is prolong the time. You would however exclude people if you remove them – that would not be “play how you like” anymore at all.

Please, just give players that have thousands of AP some equivalent reward for their time and effort spent on playing the game, but KEEP the MEANING of ACHIEVEMENTS!

Achievements CANNOT be some kind of currency that you are able to SPEND for GODDIES.
Achievements shouldn’t be tradeable for anything, even though i agree with people haveing more rewards for playing more time.

SynfulChaot.3169:

Djemo.7153:

Not necessarily in PvE?
Where pray tell then are you implying one should get them?
Is there a magical part of this game we are all unaware of?

As it stands the majority of it is in PvE.
This isnt a PvE patch hence i dont see why it should adhere to the PvE community.
Its the patch for all of us, and the armor and weapons hidden behind these achivement checkpoints are not legendaries, they are just another skin.

A skin that dedication in whatever way expressed to this game should be rewarded to.
And as it stands theres enough e-kitten items in this game, the achievements and the skins related to them need not be another of these.

Must I repeat myself yet again? Ok. Here it is:

SynfulChaot.3169:

Like I said before, I am aware that WvW and PvP achievements are not on par for points as PvE and would need to be fixed as to be in line with PvE.

I know that WvW and PvP achievements are not in line with PvE. Anyone who has ever looked at them knows. Now if they remedy that, then this argument is entirely moot.

Yet when they “remedy it” (read remove dailies and monthlies) PvE players will be faaaaaar ahead of the PvP ones, due to all the achievements they did.

Even if they make our WvW and sPvP achievements easier and more sane it still doesent change the fact that you already have tons of them done, while we, even with these changed achievements dont have them done.

Isnt that the same injustice you people are crying about when it comes to new players not able to catch up?
How will we catch up to PvE? Are we forgoten here?

Rouven.7409:

Secret of Southsun: 235 points
Flame & Frost: 147 points
SAB: 106 points
Dragon Bash: 195 points
Sky Pirates: 193 points

876 points

Compare average 5 points for daily – 175 days

That says people only do the minimum. You can get up to 15 per day. That makes it about 58 days. Also, there is the monthly achievements for up to 110 a month. Factor that in an it’s about 51 days. Under two months for the same number of points as content that has spanned nearly 9 months.

Rouven.7409:

While this is a noble goal I don’t think this is the right way, you have to give people options and choices. Not everyone wants to create a character from every race to get all the points there, not everyone wants to get 250000 WvW kills.

Don’t underestimate the pressure that many people will put on themselves. Even now many will likely try to do all daily achievements and will try to complete all achievements they haven’t looked at before – just to speed up the process. People who don’t want to slay 1000 ettins have the choice not to – and that I think is a way better option.

It will be way more of a perceived grind if you would remove the dailies.

You can’t say you are excluding anyone if you leave the daily – all it could potentially do is prolong the time. You would however exclude people if you remove them – that would not be “play how you like” anymore at all.

Many will press themselves to unlock things as quickly as possible, yes. But by including the daily it will press more people into grinding the extra daily categories just to get there. It already isn’t, unfortunately, ‘play how you like’. It hasn’t been for a long time.

And what about people who start playing now? If the scale is set including dailies, the rewards will require many, many days to get the good stuff. So a new player that hits all the other content will need to wait a long time to grind out their dailies just to catch up instead of just doing the content as is.

Unfortunately, no matter what we do someone will feel screwed by it. And even with good intentions, we get accused of elitism and general kitteny.

SynfulChaot.3169:

As I keep saying, my suggestion is not to exclude. It is simply to try to get people to try out more stuff not necessarily in PvE.

With all due respect, who appointed you arbiter of others’ choices of activities within the game? Even if your intentions are good, do you have any idea how condescending that sounds?

I know my tastes. I don’t need to be ‘nudged’ to try anything. I partake of in-game activities that interest me, and I ignore those that don’t. Perhaps we should just leave each to his or her own, and stop worrying about who gets what points from where.

Stop trying to fix something that isn’t broken in the first place.

Djemo.7153:

Yet when they “remedy it” (read remove dailies and monthlies) PvE players will be faaaaaar ahead of the PvP ones, due to all the achievements they did.

Even if they make our WvW and sPvP achievements easier and more sane it still doesent change the fact that you already have tons of them done, while we, even with these changed achievements dont have them done.

Isnt that the same injustice you people are crying about when it comes to new players not able to catch up?
How will we catch up to PvE? Are we forgoten here?

The remedy I’m talking of here isn’t the removing of dailies and monthlies. It is giving WvW and PvP players more points they can earn so those sections have as many points as the non-event and non-Living Story PvE sections. If that happened you wouldn’t be left in the dark and you would be caught up to PvE.

Ye Rouven you’re right there are just some achievements that i will never ever want to get no matter how much i need the points to unlock watever i want.

IT IS nice to nudge people to do more/different things, but not everything, not 100% of the things in this game, which is where dailys come in, and dailys are JUST as good at getting people to do different things on a regular basis without getting bored, they’re different every single day. \o/

Seriously , i don’t kno why anyone would argue the point “But it’d be good to nudge people to kill 1000 fish” how does that not just turn this Action MMO into a Korean Grindfest which Anet are trying not to be.

Good boy for doing your daily tasks and helping noob events and reviving 10 ppl and running a fotm and gathering mats and getting involved in the community when you otherwise would have just farmed CoF or something. Here are some Super Mario Points for your Daily Achievements, pat pat.

All is good man o/

Please bring the crying hurt new player or players into this thread.
No please go to LA if you cant find them on the forum and bring them here.

None of them think like you, at least i havent seen anyone.
So please present this damaged party.

Reinhard.8947:

SynfulChaot.3169:

As I keep saying, my suggestion is not to exclude. It is simply to try to get people to try out more stuff not necessarily in PvE.

With all due respect, who appointed you arbiter of others’ choices of activities within the game? Even if your intentions are good, do you have any idea how condescending that sounds?

I know my tastes. I don’t need to be ‘nudged’ to try anything. I partake of in-game activities that interest me, and I ignore those that don’t. Perhaps we should just leave each to his or her own, and stop worrying about who gets what points from where.

Stop trying to fix something that isn’t broken in the first place.

You do realize that ArenaNet does Living Story content to try to ‘nudge’ people to do it and put an achievement cache from what was otherwise PvE content into WvW to try to ‘nudge’ PvEers into WvW, right?

I’m not trying to arbit anything. I don’t look down on anyone. It is simply a suggestion to possibly expand people’s horizons.

You say it isn’t broken. Right now nearly half or more of many players achievements are solely from dailies. As this progress that amount will only get greater to the point where it is mostly from dailies. If someone new starts playing how will you suggest for them to get the top stuff? Do dailies for a year? It may not be broken right now, but with time it will quickly become so.

SynfulChaot.3169:

That says people only do the minimum. You can get up to 15 per day. That makes it about 58 days. Also, there is the monthly achievements for up to 110 a month. Factor that in an it’s about 51 days. Under two months for the same number of points as content that has spanned nearly 9 months.

I’m not going to argue that those events didn’t span 9 months – but if you take the extreme – don’t you think that those types of people already completed all the regular achievements anyways?

Many will press themselves to unlock things as quickly as possible, yes. But by including the daily it will press more people into grinding the extra daily categories just to get there. It already isn’t, unfortunately, ‘play how you like’. It hasn’t been for a long time.

Yes, the idea here is that just by playing you will typically complete the daily anyways. While the system is not perfect I think it is very close. Do people chose to visit low level maps to complete the dailies first so as to not miss them in case they have to go offline? Yes, absolutely. We already had that discussion in regards to laurels.

And what about people who start playing now? If the scale is set including dailies, the rewards will require many, many days to get the good stuff. So a new player that hits all the other content will need to wait a long time to grind out their dailies just to catch up instead of just doing the content as is.

They have a chance to catch up even faster then without. Plus if you compare that with the veteran rewards in other games for subscribing for a year etc … I think that’s fair. You decide on your pace – be it like me with 5 points a day – or the “achiever” with 15 points per day.

Unfortunately, no matter what we do someone will feel screwed by it. And even with good intentions, we get accused of elitism and general kitteny.

I don’t feel screwed and I’m not calling anyone anything. I just don’t think it makes sense. Not from the average player’s perspective and certainly not from Anet’s business point of view.

I am sure that Anet will know that hanging the carrot too high does not help, maybe I’m just too optimistic when it comes to that.

SynfulChaot.3169:

If someone new starts playing how will you suggest for them to get the top stuff? Do dailies for a year? It may not be broken right now, but with time it will quickly become so.

If someone new starts playing, how will they get all the points from the Living Story Achievements that they can’t do. And last time i checked, Super Adventure Box was out of business. xD

I’m ok with dailies givin people great rewards and all, specially in the long term. But, achievements?!

How will i know if someone has lots of achievement points because he is a player who do great adventures, challenges and difficult tasks or if he is a player who have been played for a long time and did lots of dailies and simple events?

I think players who accept great challenges and adventures should be rewarded DIFFERENTLY from the players who only do Daylies or WvW, so that other players could identify them and recognize their efforts.

This is what achievements are for. If they were only for points, or to show others how many time you have in game, then you should not call it achievements but instead, something different like Veteran Points, Activity Points, Commitment Points or whatever.

I really like the idea of rewardin people who are commited to the game, whatever their playstylle is. Im not an elitist or selfish. But different things must be treated differently.

brunobyof.3541:

How will i know if someone has lots of achievement points because he is a player who do great adventures, challenges and difficult tasks or if he is a player who have been played for a long time and did lots of dailies and simple events?

Why do you need to know/what does it matter? What do you gain by seeing an arbitrary number next to someones head? (Someone who logged 1000 hours could be “worse” than someone who’s logged 100) Heck despite the fact that people keep talking about a leader board for achievements, I’ve never seen it (didn’t even know there was one) and I frankly don’t care about it.

I think players who accept great challenges and adventures should be rewarded DIFFERENTLY from the players who only do Daylies or WvW, so that other players could identify them and recognize their efforts.

I don’t see why that matters. I play a game to have fun, and I play that game how I want to have fun. I don’t care what others think of when they see me. I think twice people commented on my armor (mostly for the color options), and twice my weapon skin (just asking what it was). I don’t use what I use so others can say “oh look at him” I use it because it’s something I like. Besides things like that already exist, you have dungeon armor, legendarys, fractal skins, high tier pvp armor, etc, why do you need more?

If they do a total achievement point unlock system why should it matter if you only did LS content, or only dailies, or only JPs, or a combination of everything. If they tie each achievement tab to unlocks then they should reflect that content. Personally I’d like to see both.

Skins and what not for X points. Maybe a small dam +% bonus for slayer achievements, things that give flavor, but don’t make you feel like you have to do it.

I totally agree with the remotion of the Daily and Monthly Achievments point
I agree also with putting some achievements for “complete 10 dailies” or something with an hard cap
With this system a person who starts playing today won’t be able to reach the first 500 people in the ladder and won’t be able to reach some rewards
Better removing this and keep infinite things like recyle and so on, that can be achievable without time limitation ^^

I do not even know why this is an issue….

diffrent people diffrent styles… i did not even notice that dailies give achievement points. who cares its just a game.

the more ways to earn points the better. Simply raise the points for the long time invest achievments and you are golden. people that started the game at launch will always have more points then those who bought the game yesterday.

by the way welcome back to “kill ten rats” system…

@SynfulChaot.3169

Also I like that you are at least discussing this (and not yelling at your monitor) [that isn’t aimed at anyone just a generalization at some threads I’ve followed on the forums], it’s refreshing, but I disagree with you. You suggest basically doing 2 things at once. 1) remove daily/monthly AP gain and 2) reward WvW and PvP more AP so they can still gain rewards similarly to PvE players.

Here is my main problem with that. Well by hard capping your achievement points you are forcing people to do things they don’t want to do if they want to increase their AP to gain a reward that they do want. I like my main and spend about 95-99% of my time on him, and I like the two weapon sets I use. I got the weapon master achievements for them a while ago, but now with your suggestion I have to either use a different weapon that I just don’t like the play style/skills of (or that I’m not traited for) or play one of my alts who uses a different weapon, who I just don’t enjoy playing as much. Or I need to make a race/profession that I have no interest in playing just to get more achievement points because there is no other way to get them. Or (going with your suggestion that points are balanced more evenly) play a game mode that I just don’t like that much. I dabble in WvW and PvP but I don’t like them as much. You would be forcing me to play them to get rewards that I could gain in other ways if the Daily/Monthly AP points were removed. I’m saying this because if Daily/Monthly were removed (rebalanced points or not) there would be a static number of points to be gained [if daily/monthly AP should be removed then so should LS considering those already give rewards]. With a static number of points to gain, once people run of out doing things they like they are then forced to do things they don’t like. Sure some may like the new things they try, but I’m sure a lot of us have tried WvW or PvP or X weapon or Y profession and realized that they don’t like it for whatever reason.

Finally, the seller (Anet) should never tell the consumer (us) how to enjoy it’s product. (Let alone one consumer tell another that they don’t use the product the way it should be used).

So lets say there was a reward at 10k achievement points.

Some people will get it immediately upon patch, some people won’t have enough points yet. But those people can EARN enough points to eventually unlock that reward. People seem to think that if daily achievements continue that the achievement points will spiral out of control. But if the “best” reward was at 15k, why would it matter if some people had 120k points? It wouldn’t matter.

And the people who can only get time each day to log in for an hour or two can still work towards these rewards: through the completion of their daily.

The only difference is people with more time invested in gw2 will get the rewards sooner, which is how it should be.

People also act like they’ve never added more achievements, but they clearly have with each living story. Also, now that achievement rewards are here we might see even MORE achievements put into the game.

You guys didn’t get the point i think.
Theres absolutely no problem in having people with 120k achievement points and getting lots of rewards more than people who just started playing now.

The issue is: Why is this called achievement points when you can find lots of people who didn’t achieved nothing but have tons of achievement points?
They can do their dailies or play in WvW forever, never do a Jumping Puzzle, or Guild challenge, nor killing a Dragon, and yet he will have tons of “Achievement points”?? thats not something i would call appropriate for a MMORPG at the least.

Achievements are supposed to be registration of player’s acts instead of their time.

And even if they reach a static number getting all points in the game that are possible to earn (without daylies etc) they wouldn’t be forced to do things they don’t like.
ANET consistently keeps adding more content and achievements for them people to earn. Besides, they can still do PvE normally, achievements are not the only focus or objetive while playing, but something to increase fun and challenge in gameplay and that is why i think they should not reward people who just do the same thing ever with achievements.

Even so, they can be rewarded for their commitment anyways.

Oh, and the reason why i would like to see people with a high number of real achievement points is simple:
To identify possible people that have the same interests than you, and people that could probalbly help you in a difficult task that you are trying to achieve instead of only looking for guides and playing alone. I think this is a good reason for it.
At least this is the way i have seend in all other games and MMO’s i have played before and i liked them this way.

And what did you achieve bruno?
Killed 1k centaurs or something? Whoop dee doo.

As it stands, almost nothing in this game tied to achievemnets is worthy of any special note, especially Slayers and the like.
Now soloing Lupicus is something, and that doesent even give achievements.
Yet people still do it, you know why? Cause they dont give a rats kitten about achievements.

Again, if a new player joins and wants to unlock high AP tiers, he still can’t get all the AP from the temporary content and festivals that are now passed, what are you gonna tell him to do to get AP?

“Sorry newbie, you missed out on a chunk of potential AP by not playing the game on release, you must wait till they release new festivals because doing dailys rewards no Real AP.”

Let me enthrall ye denizens of Tyria with a story most bold, of courage, experience and adventure of finding oneself i had experienced a whole 5 minutes ago.

I was at a bank, storing some gold for my alt. When suddenly i got 10 ac points.
GASP i exclamed, “dare i venture forth down this road of peril?”

With a shaking heart i placed 100g in the bank. With a glorious shower of power and glory of my deeds Balthazar granted me another 10 points.
“Tis’ a day for glorious deeds!” i exclaimed across the mapchat, filled with the confidence of a thousand brave men.

I was then dared by a jelaous sage to test faith once more.
“Dare ye put in 200g in thine bank mortal?” he said with a grin so foul.
I knew this was a test from the gods, and i knew i had to accept.

With sweat pouring from my forehead like the waterfalls of the Timberline Falls i paused before doing the deed.
As i did my beard grew tenfold. My arms once minute norn ones now resembled trees in girth. I smiled at the sage as i took another 10 points from the gods, rightfully making me the hero amongst heroes of Tyira.

From that day all of Tyira would know my name, the Golden Retriver and i would be bathed in all the praise of this realm.
Unlike that plebeian sage who only did dailies.

TLDR: I got 30 pts from placing gold in the bank 3 times, THE BEST THE BEST THE BEST!

nah, okay. You guys don’t give a kitten about achievements anyways. No reason to discuss. Whatever their decision, you are going to be after the rewards not after the achievements specifically.

I don’t even know why arena net created an achievement system to begin with.
They don’t tell nothing. They could just put a reward system like:

X reward for 1 week of continuous gameplay
Y reward for 1 month
Z reward for 1 year

Why differentiate 1000 WvW kills from gathering 1000 blueberries?
After all, you should play the way you like!

Doing dailies and monthlies doesn’t encourage folks to experience more of the game? I know I very likely wouldn’t have set foot into WvW without the inclusion of those related goals in the dailies. I’m also thinking of trying Keg Brawling to get my point score up a little higher, when that is part of the dailies. (This is not saying that I’m really any -good- at these things, mind, just that the related dailies got me to -try- them!)

I think dailies and monthlies actually do more to get people around more aspects of the game than the regular categories do, especially since they changed them to add more variety and numbers of tasks. They give a good, brief, frequently changing list of things to sample, which does in turn (at least in my case) get them to explore the other achievements as well. They get to find other things in the game that they might like and want to do more, which will make them seek out these things in other zones. Okay, yeah, gathering is there every day, but that helps the game economy, as people who already have all the materials they need will still gather for that achievement point.

So I guess I’m still not seeing what all the kerfuffle is about daily and monthly points. Effort is effort, playing is playing, whether it’s logging on for an hour to do a daily, or logging on for an hour in Metrica to get another hundred or so oozes under your belt. The former is arguably more interesting, as there’s a wider range of activity to discover. It’s also arguably better for the game community as a whole, as it encourages participation in a greater amount of different activities with other people. I think that deserves awarding.

I like dailies. In fact i do them everyday. I just think they are not achievements
I you call daily tasks achievements, then there is no achievement at all….everything you do is an achievement thus removing the purpose and the meaning of the word.

By that token, I’d say that all but perhaps one of the Slayer achievements aren’t really achievements, either, as it’s just useless grind that doesn’t really help anyone or prove any facility in the game. I should know, I have all but three of them completed. All they really involved, by and large, was me stomping around a starter zone solo, targeting any mob that fit the category criteria. Not because I have any great or special skill, but because frankly, I just have -that much time on my hands-.

If you’re going to take an analytical look at whether dailies imply any skill or accomplishment, you should look at the other categories as well, as a lot of them are, by the criteria I’ve seen in these threads, just filler.

If you look at other games, you’d see that achievements are not really for demonstrating any skills one player has or has not.
Devs put them as a way of addicting people to the game, by subtly inducing a feeling of satisfation, of achievement by several ways. That is why they put so manyy kinds of stupid achievements like slayers. Because don’t matter how you like to play the game, or don’t matter where you do it, you will always get the same results predicted by the developers: ADDICTION.
And that is why they put achievements in daily quests also.

But sincerely, this is a bad way of engaging players or earn commitment to the game because you keep playing the game not by its quality or fun, but because you are addicted.

I think that they really do need to limit the number of achievement points given out by dailies/monthlies. It seems that some of you are also forgetting that most of those points came from early game when dailies gave something like 35 AP each, and then there were no WvW or PvP dailies, so those of you who are trying to “defend” the PvP and WvW players should realize that no matter what, PvE players still will hold the upper hand in achievement points. To level it out I would say place a barrier on dailies that takes about a year to fully reach…. it shows dedication and takes time, however I will not feel that my achievement for doing mad clock tower, or even personal space or something similar is worthless (some achievements take a lot of dedication and work and you do them because you want to gain that “edge” over other players not only with possible exclusive skins/items, but also with achievement points, given the nature of dailies this feeling is completely lost, so why even bother with those tough achievements?). Seriously if the daily achievements are allowed to give unlimited AP, all those hard to get achievements become useless and you can just remove anything not related to a title or a reward and maybe reduce the amount of achievements needed for the new rewards. The whole game is built around skins, titles and virtual rewards that you can show off/enjoy, but if you make a huge part of this meaningless (as it currently is) why even bother? Yes you have done all those amazing feats but Bob here killed 50 critters every day for the last year and he has more achievements than you, so beat it! Unlike most of PvE achievements, PvP and WvW have titles (albeit very difficult to get) that you can show off once you do reach them. What does PvE have outside of Dungeon Master and occasional seasonal titles that is exclusive to itself? Really I think that the current daily system trivializes the whole achievement system unless you actually ARE going only after titles/ possible rewards from a few seasonal events. I do agree that the dailies should give achievement points but it should stop once it reaches a certain point, otherwise you can’t really brag (which is what this game is about, I mean half of the gem shop is built on that premise) about things you go out of your way to do.

Shame on Bob, only 50 critters.
He should have killed 1k like i did, shame on him and his family.

I don’t think achievements are meant to be that in-tune with true honorable reward of time and effort, they’re just a gimmick, just super mario points, at least in GW2.

If you want to be ahead of daily exclusive achievers, then why don’t you just do both dailys and regular achievements, which i bet you do anyway, because i do dailys everyday and i have 2600 AP only.

So lemme understand this, half of the ppl for barring daily AP from the total care about ‘showing off’ and ‘having the most points’ while the other half despise those ppl and want to ‘nudge ppl to try different things’.

The former’s reasons are just selfish and obviously don’t fit into Anet’s business model, and the latter’s reasons have been demerited countless times in above posts. So i don’t truly believe people understand what they’re saying and i’m sorry.

i honestly dont care about the points or the rewards. (not yet anyway) but what i do care about and will continue to care about in the future is The Achievements Them Selves! to me the points are meaningless to compete over in any serious way. because doing dailies is boring and not worth bragging about. because challenging achis are not represented in their point value. when the rewards are released, if i even like anything available then i will care about points until my goal is reached.

as for the proposed solutions there are some good and fair ideas out there. but personally they can completely remove all achi points from my account and i would still pursue achievements like crazy because those actually tell a story of the types of adventures i’ve had in the game.