Guild Wars 2

I recently was going through my “recently bought” tab and I noticed a weird trend. After a bit of research I believe I’ve found some possible proof of an active bot making orders on the trading post.

I don’t want to go into too many details, because it’ll outline how I make money on the TP. But is there any way to report this at all? There is no way for me to find out who is making the orders, and until this bot is dealt with, it has complete control over the section of the market I like to play; especially since there is no way I can legitimately compete.

Ever thought that there is another person, or heck a dozen more people out there who think just like you and are trying to make money on the TP with your methods?

Why do you automatically assume that there are ‘bots’ on the outpost.

Vol.5241:

Ever thought that there is another person, or heck a dozen more people out there who think just like you and are trying to make money on the TP with your methods?

Why do you automatically assume that there are ‘bots’ on the outpost.

Because there ARE bots(more specifically scripts) running off the TP. Do some Google searches and you’ll find LOTS of discussion and ACTUAL working versions of TP selling scripts.

It’s incredibly obvious with some of the more plentiful markets: you put up a HUGE stack of the item and within seconds(seriously, seconds) the price you listed is undercut by 1c. You can say this is just a player…but it takes TIME to sell all those stacks and this happens TIME and TIME again.

AFAIK, ANet hasn’t really touched much on the subject, as the TP in reality is just a simple webapp overlaid into the game(you can visit the TP via a browser outside of the game once you’ve found the link/your account info/session id/etc).

It happens with just about EVERY other MMO, so to say it does not happen in GW2…is simply being facetious.

The same reason why we think the characters with stupid names running around instantly targeting mobs and killing them repetitively are bots.

If a person puts in buy orders on hundreds of items in the course of 30min, and then minutes later is 1c overbid on most/all, it’s reasonable to assume that there is a bot (or a person with an over-bid notification program at the very least) working with those items in it’s parameters

Is it necessarily a bot? No. But if it happens like that at different times in the day, over and over, then you have to consider it.

Vol.5241:

Why do you automatically assume that there are ‘bots’ on the outpost.

I did not automatically assume. I’ve done some testing and here are my reasons:

First, bots do exist. A search on Google will bring it up. Also, I’ve seen some people admit to it. There were a couple reddit comments about how people used bots on the TP. They ended up getting banned because of the Snowflake debacle, and decided to share all that they were doing.

Second, the behavior I am seeing. I’ve been testing for a bit over an hour now, and I am noticing definite patterns. Patterns that show that: it is most likely one buyer, it is most likely automated, and that it is something that no one simply using just the TP can compete with.

Here is the profile of the bot:

The bot will bid on any rare weapon where the highest order price is less than 3 silver and the sell price is over double. The bot will place an order in for one copper over highest bidder with the quantity of 20. Every 10-11 minutes the bot scans all of its listing (and there are a lot of them, look at almost any weapon that matches the criteria).

When the bot finds that it has been outbid, it will cancel its previous bid order and replace it with a new bid that is one copper higher that whatever outbid it.

I’ve tested this by placing plenty of buy orders, and updating them at random. Always, within 12 minutes, all my buy orders have been outbid by an order that is one copper more, and looking for the quantity of 20. Considering the amount of buy orders that this person has, I really doubt he is manually checking all the items to ensure his is still the top.

I hope that is enough proof for everyone.

Malshew.2418:

I hope that is enough proof for everyone.

Actual sources, please, not just “look it up on Google.”

Malshew.2418:

Vol.5241:

Why do you automatically assume that there are ‘bots’ on the outpost.

I did not automatically assume. I’ve done some testing and here are my reasons:

First, bots do exist. A search on Google will bring it up. Also, I’ve seen some people admit to it. There were a couple reddit comments about how people used bots on the TP. They ended up getting banned because of the Snowflake debacle, and decided to share all that they were doing.

Second, the behavior I am seeing. I’ve been testing for a bit over an hour now, and I am noticing definite patterns. Patterns that show that: it is most likely one buyer, it is most likely automated, and that it is something that no one simply using just the TP can compete with.

Here is the profile of the bot:

The bot will bid on any rare weapon where the highest order price is less than 3 silver and the sell price is over double. The bot will place an order in for one copper over highest bidder with the quantity of 20. Every 10-11 minutes the bot scans all of its listing (and there are a lot of them, look at almost any weapon that matches the criteria).

When the bot finds that it has been outbid, it will cancel its previous bid order and replace it with a new bid that is one copper higher that whatever outbid it.

I’ve tested this by placing plenty of buy orders, and updating them at random. Always, within 12 minutes, all my buy orders have been outbid by an order that is one copper more, and looking for the quantity of 20. Considering the amount of buy orders that this person has, I really doubt he is manually checking all the items to ensure his is still the top.

I hope that is enough proof for everyone.

the snowflake ban had nothing to do with exploiting or botting the outpost. the snowflake ban was based on creating an unlimited supply of ectoplasm.

You claim that you are being outbid by just 1c every 10 minutes. 10 minutes is a LONG time when you have a complicated economy like this one, with many players conducting thousands of trasactions per minute.

Maybe if you were in the market for some low-demand item, like Mithril Greatsword Hilts, and you saw your buy orders outbid by 1C every minute after you make a post.

But 10 minutes? that’s more than enough time for several players in your market to conduct transactions.

Ursan.7846:

Malshew.2418:

I hope that is enough proof for everyone.

Actual sources, please, not just “look it up on Google.”

Sources? If only 1% of the people used “sources” for their information on these forums :P

I think everyone shares the same TP, that’s a lot of people using it at once, I wouldn’t be surprised to see people buying things instantly after they are up. If we have 500k players and 100k are playing the same TP game I could definitely see why he thinks there are bots. But who knows. Although telling people to look up scripts etc on gw2 on Google isn’t the greatest advice on forums..

-Source
I don’t play the TP game, I play the GW2 game.

For those saying “don’t just say look it up on Google, post sources”…yea and risk getting banned?

Nevertheless, take a few seconds on Google to look for “gw2 trading post bot”. Those are but a TIP of the iceberg(check the lowest result, 1st page, blue eye). There are PLENTY of un-listed results(read: from well known hacking/exploiting forums that require registration).

Vol.5241:

the snowflake ban had nothing to do with exploiting or botting the outpost. the snowflake ban was based on creating an unlimited supply of ectoplasm.

You claim that you are being outbid by just 1c every 10 minutes. 10 minutes is a LONG time when you have a complicated economy like this one, with many players conducting thousands of trasactions per minute.

Maybe if you were in the market for some low-demand item, like Mithril Greatsword Hilts, and you saw your buy orders outbid by 1C every minute after you make a post.

But 10 minutes? that’s more than enough time for several players in your market to conduct transactions.

I understand that the snowflake ban had nothing to do with the trading post. My point was that people that got banned because of the snowflake ban decided to give details about how they were botting in other places. Also, I’m not going to post links to bots because I’m pretty sure that is against forum rules and puts me at risk.

And you are right, 10 minutes is a long time and I typically expect some items to be overcut on. But I really doubt someone is looking through every item they’ve bid on, seeing if it has been outbid, removing their previous bid, and placing a new bid. For every item, every 10 minutes, every hour of the day. There is no simple way to do this using the TP in game.

Not only that, but when I put in 10 different orders, spread throughout the possible weapons, they were all outbid within a minute. It is not possible to search through your 100’s of offers, find all places you were outbid on, remove those previous bids, and place new bids within a minute using the TP interface.

I fully understand that tons of people are using the TP, but this is not normal behavior.

Malshew.2418:

I fully understand that tons of people are using the TP,

That’s pretty much it. Why do you assume that it’s one person doing it? More likely it’s several power traders, which is all they do. They don’t play the game, they just operate the outpost to maximum efficiency, which involves constantly checking buy orders.

If you’re making profit out of it, there’s a good chance there are other people doing the same thing at the same time.

Pretty much Occam’s razor.

Vol.5241:

Malshew.2418:

I fully understand that tons of people are using the TP,

That’s pretty much it. Why do you assume that it’s one person doing it? More likely it’s several power traders, which is all they do. They don’t play the game, they just operate the outpost to maximum efficiency, which involves constantly checking buy orders.

If you’re making profit out of it, there’s a good chance there are other people doing the same thing at the same time.

Pretty much Occam’s razor.

I believe it is one person because each time the outbid comes, they remove their previous listing and each time it is always for the same amount.

If it was a person, it would take time to re-outbid 10 orders, instead of it happening almost instantly without cheating.
If it was a group of power traders, it wouldn’t happen every 11 minutes like clockwork.
If it was multiple people, then they are either in a guild, or are very good on not stepping on each others toes (you won’t find an item with 2 20 quantity bids).
If it was a real person, why do they never bid higher than 3s? Even if they will still make double or triple the price?

Due to the consistency of when the bids occur, how all bids happen within a very short time-frame, and the fact that they stop bidding once at 3s, I believe Occam’s Razor is siding with me on this one.

Doesnt necessarily mean that its a bot, there are tools available that provides information about the TP outside the game, if there is a group of gold farmers out there that uses such a tool to coordinate their bidding then it might look like a bot to you.

Also, ejust because you are flipping these items doesnt mean that they arent using these for something else and that their profit cutoff is lower than the flip value.

I do the same thing you are accusing these “bots” of doing during my play time. I make my bids and during my grinding I am constantly checking in on them, will cancel and redo my bids when I need to up to a certain point of course. I mostly grind and just started messing with the TP. I can just imaging what a dedicated guild or person can do, which is more likely the problem.

I mean, depending on where these people work…assuming they work lol, it would be pretty easy to keep taps on your bids with an app, pop open your laptop or maximize your client and make all the necessary adjustments to your posts.

You made a statement about not wanting to outline how to make money on the TP which leads me to believe you think you have stumbled on items to make money you think no one else has thought of…do you really think that is the case? Of course I am just assuming here.