Guild Wars 2

Let’s analyze a simple situation here:

Person X got over 20kg. More than enough to fulfill all of his wishes in the game.
Person X continues to make money, question is, why?

What can you possibly do after you broke the limit already?

My point – people with too much money make large scale investments, on the most expensive items in the game. Only to make even larger profit.
And what do they do with all the money?
Well…. first they tell you how much they love you….

Anet is delusional if they think RMT are composed of bunch of bots.

So he can take a screenshot, put it on the forums and make everyone cry.

I dont know why they carry on, perhaps some weird satisfaction in making others peoples lives miserable.

Sort of related does GW2 have a gold cap ?

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

How? I mean…do 15% enjoy making money via the tp? or farming?…etc Sry w/o any clarity that could mean anything.

I generally make money I dont need in every MMO i’ve ever played, usually because i play too much. But GW2 is slightly different as theres not really that much you can buy with your wealth after a certain point. Eve there were always bigger and better ships, WoW there were elusive mounts and pets, but here after gear and a legendary on every character what does actually motivate people ?

ps you could of answered my question about the gold cap

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I don’t understand how earning a virtual currency can be fun if the the intent is to aquire more. Sounds more like psychological disorder to me.

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

If I may, I’m a bit curious as to how you have this number, and the criteria for it?
Are we talking tp trading, dungeon farming like cof etc? Interesting stuff.

Was there a poll somewhere I missed?

Off topic; Sadly in skyrim and elderscrolls I kinda tend to use mods adding weight to gold. Being so rich that you can’t move has its alure…..

I’d like to add that being rich is one thing and being rich with nothing to buy is something else entirely. If you like being rich and you know your money can’t buy you anything you don’t already have; wanting to aquire more is a psychological disorder.

Actually, in single player RPGs, the first thing I do is use the console to give myself more money than I could ever spend (and I’m talking crazy amounts like 5 million gold.) This allows me to walk into shops and buy whatever item that catches my fancy, because if I didn’t have the money, I’d just go out and grind monsters until I did have enough gold to buy it. The way I see it, it’s just saving myself time for the same end result, and it’s not like anybody else’s gaming experience is going to be affected by what I do in a single player game.

Anyway, John Smith is right. The people who enjoy amassing huge sums of money in a game are probably the same people who enjoy creating huge financial empires in real life. Money is no longer the end goal to them; money just becomes the means of how they keep score. One difference is that these business moguls usually give a significant portion of money back to charity or sponsor scientific research/sports teams.

Hmm… I wonder if ANet could be persuaded to set up a kind of “Consortium Lottery” sponsored by these ultra-rich players…

Zaxares.5419:

Actually, in single player RPGs, the first thing I do is use the console to give myself more money than I could ever spend (and I’m talking crazy amounts like 5 million gold.) This allows me to walk into shops and buy whatever item that catches my fancy, because if I didn’t have the money, I’d just go out and grind monsters until I did have enough gold to buy it. The way I see it, it’s just saving myself time for the same end result, and it’s not like anybody else’s gaming experience is going to be affected by what I do in a single player game.

Anyway, John Smith is right. The people who enjoy amassing huge sums of money in a game are probably the same people who enjoy creating huge financial empires in real life. Money is no longer the end goal to them; money just becomes the means of how they keep score. One difference is that these business moguls usually give a significant portion of money back to charity or sponsor scientific research/sports teams.

Hmm… I wonder if ANet could be persuaded to set up a kind of “Consortium Lottery” sponsored by these ultra-rich players…

The bolded part is key…….

Calae.1738:

wanting to aquire more is a psychological disorder.

According to whom?

if youve got too much gold feel free to help me out send some to juniper berry and help a casual gamer get the unicorn bow

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I really do find making money fun, but I’m one of those people that have a mind to know when its time to stop or say “ok I have too much now or enough”.

As for your question. No never has happened to me. Only cause I’ve never played Skyrim HOWEVER, if you were to say Fallout New Vegas instead of Skyrim then the Answer is still no. Sure having 2.1 million caps maybe unnecessary, but when you factor in the cost for repairs,food,ammo,med care,those stupid dino toys in novac then you need Moolah. Let’s Face it. Gun Runners Arsenal wasn’t mean’t for the poor. Most of those weapons was expensive. I’m still paying roughly 56k for Fatman ammo. Nukes. Aren’t. Cheap. or easy to get. unless your playing MW2 then all you need is 25 kills without dying yourself. Not to hard right?

P.S. sorry might of gotten off topic.

P.P.S. I would like to add to my post that I’m not rich. Although my remark about how I enjoy making money may have some players here thinking ( I hope not ) that I’m a flipper or an Orr Farmer. I’m not. 70 something gold from 4 months of play isn’t that great. well 110 gold had I not spent 42 gold on parts of Tier 3 cult armor.

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money.

Problem appears when the remaining 85% finds the ways the first 15% uses that money as not fun for them.

It is not a single player game. gathering obscene amounts of money by some affects not only them, but everyone else as well.

In real life this is usually a self-regulating process – if a small number of people gets too wealthy, it can lead to a “forced redistribution of wealth” (depending on scale and method, called robbery, riots, revolution, tax increase or nationalization).
This is not possible here.

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I clearly fall in the other 85%, then.

Playing the AH/TP/whatever equivalent there is in any MMO has always been one thing I really take zero pleasure in.

To compare to WoW (the only MMO since EQ2 I made any extensive use of an auction system), I find that I dislike GW2’s TP quite a bit more.

That is because in WoW, where I had 5 85’s when I stopped playing (a couple weeks before LFR was introduce to give a timeline – though that was NOT the reason) and each of those had a couple of maxed crafts (I did have a duplicate or two, as I did not have every craft at max), I found that I only ever used the AH if I was feeling impatient about something. WoW was a game where I felt I could easily just go out and do whatever it is I needed to do to make whatever it was I wanted to make.

I don’t feel that way (at all) in GW2. DR coupled with the randomness of some of the drops, coupled again with the vast quantities required for many items in the game means that the best way is to farm gold somewhere and buy whatever it is off of the TP.

I don’t enjoy that in MMOs at all.

In a situation where I need X amount of whatever mat to make Y product, I’d much rather figure out how much of Z mob(s) I need to farm to get X, instead of figure out how many events/dungeon runs will yield Z gold to BUY X mats.

In GW2 I found (I haven’t played since the last new instance appeared for the Wintersday event) that by playing the game how I enjoy it, the long-term goals I have/had got further away, as the cost of the mats on the TP were increasing at equal to or greater than the rate I was making gold.

But that’s because I didn’t find the most efficient ways of making gold in GW2 very much fun (as far as I could tell, that was farming certain dungeon paths over and over).

Bluesavanah.8562:

I generally make money I dont need in every MMO i’ve ever played, usually because i play too much. But GW2 is slightly different as theres not really that much you can buy with your wealth after a certain point. Eve there were always bigger and better ships, WoW there were elusive mounts and pets, but here after gear and a legendary on every character what does actually motivate people ?

ps you could of answered my question about the gold cap

The game’s age plays a role in this. Of course a game that’s been around way longer is going to have more content for you to spend on. Currently there’s only one generation of legendary weapons, there will be more to work for in the future.

The addition of more Karka Shell recipes and my disinterest in collecting them myself has highlighted one newly appeared monetary burden. Though all in all I’m not on the same page with this topic, as all the towers I upgrade and siege I place in WvW has me wondering how people can have trouble with too much money.

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I am a person like this. Actually I’m a person like this in real life too. I like having money for the sake of having money. Most of my salary goes to savings. The other part goes to rent and mandatory purchases like food. I seldom spend my money on any “spur of the moment” purchases. Even in the game world I find it hard to spend the gold on something.

However at the same time I don’t necessarily stare at the price tag if I absolutely need something. I place convenience over getting something slightly cheaper. When it comes to games though there’s no “absolute need”.

I don’t play the “tradingpost” game though. I find it boring.

Edit: Also for OP. If you have too much gold feel free to donate some of it to me!

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I don’t know about ‘making’ but I find ‘having’ money to be quite fun. :P

Did you ever play Fable 1? Even at the start of the game it was easy to manipulate buy/sell prices and create feedback looks to gain a lot of money. Knowing you could then use that to buy henchmen/gifts to make people follow you… then sacrifice the to an evil god… then donate money to a good god to gain favor… it was quite enjoyable.

Though I am slightly curious, where do you get 15% from? Is this from your observations of transactions – in which it would be quite a high number for high rollers… or is it just taken from general economics?

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money.

And roughly 78% of stated statistics are made up on the spot.

Ahh a real-world problem manifest in-game again. Obviously the wealthy person hides his money in tax havens, land and bonds!

Everybody knows that.

I am picturing Scrooge McDuck swimming in his money vault right now.

Actually, having more money than is needed atm feels pleasantly…safe.
At least to me, it always feels good to have a substantial amount tucked away at one bank account or another, because you never know what the future holds

Calae.1738:

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I don’t understand how earning a virtual currency can be fun if the the intent is to aquire more. Sounds more like psychological disorder to me.

Nah, it’s just one more way that people keep score. Some people keep score with money, some people keep score with titles, some with experience points, some with achievement points, some with eye candy — I have a guildie who is constantly broke, but he always looks good! I have another guildie with plenty of money still running around in blues and greens because to her the money number is important. For me it’s my guild roster that is my major score keeper. Fifteen percent actually makes sense when you consider the different ways of keeping score.

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I enjoy making money, but not without effort. Currently it is possible to make money just by buying event items and other items that cannot be obtained anymore. All I have to do it buy them and then wait… it’s not fun.

Back in EverQuest I enjoyed making money (called “platinum” or plat). I’m not too concerned about it here. The max I’ve ever accumulated on here was around 250 – 300g, with maybe ~90g in mats. Which soon fell victim to my crafting/legendary material buyin. Not much compared to the big boys on here I know!

I make a lot of money and it’s my end game goal – to be the richest person on my server. Once you have a ton of gold to invest, it’s easier to grow that money.

What am I going to spend it on? More legendaries, t3 cultural sets for all characters, investing to make even more money.

Right now I’m more wealthy than rich, and I doubt seeing myself ever reach 20K in gold in my lifetime in this game. But it’s what keeps me going here – any additions to the game by Arenanet is just icing.

Well, I for one do play the TP and have far more than 20g sitting in my bank. I want to acquire as much wealth as I possibly can for one simple reason…..I don’t want to farm.

I played GW1 from nearly the very beginning (the Feb 2005 Beta Weekend). For nearly 7 years, I farmed. I farmed….farmed some more….then farmed some more. It burned me out on the game, but I never really had the money to buy the vanity items I wanted. I didn’t get Obsidian Armor for my main until almost 6 years in….and I saved and farmed for MONTHS to get it.

I approached GW2 with a different mindset. I knew I’d want / need money in this game, but I also knew I didn’t want to farm my life away. I didn’t want to feel like every minute in the game was meant to be spent running dungeons, farming DE’s or repeating some menial task over and over and over again.

I wanted to enjoy the game this time and be amazed at my surroundings. I spent the first 6-8 weeks the game was released creating, updating, and automating a spreadsheet to help me figure out where to invest my money. I’m now in the process of moving this spreadsheet into a database so that I can make the best use of cross referencing different markets to determine the most efficient path to investing.

The time I spent at the beginning of the game has given me a tool that I can use throughout the life of the game. Any time I feel I need more money….I go to my spreadsheet, do some investing, then collect my profits.

Also, a long term goal of mine is to craft a Legendary. I actually want to craft it….not buy it off the TP. That doesn’t mean that I won’t make 2 and sell one though.

It’s fun for me to make money on the TP, mainly because I had such a difficult time making money in GW1. I love being able to see my profits come in with minimal effort. Don’t get me wrong, it wasn’t easy creating my tool, but the money I make from it now IS easy and I will continue to make money….even if I have 2,000g…..or 5,000g…..or 100,000g.

Farming for money is NOT something I want to do in GW2.

Honestly, I think amounts beneath 10k gold shouldnt even be called “lots of money”
Making Gold is my icing over the Wv3-cake and as arenanet broke Wv3 with their “anti-culling” patch, providing even more cullingissues, I guess I will move my iflational stable good back into the market and try to get out of poor. out of poor to me means breaking the 1k gold again. long time goal is to never need to do any pve for money. Besides Wv3 I love doing the JP and seeing all those hidden paradises whitch only 10% of the playebase even heard of. Tyria is to beautiful to grind!

If someone wans to make money with ori, do it soon, 50k stock coming back into the market in 10, 9, 8,…. :-D

Sarcasmic.6741:

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money.

And roughly 78% of stated statistics are made up on the spot.

If he says 15% it’s 15% (I mean, he’s the dude that has pretty much every transaction in database…). The only problem is, what is the criteria by which he defined who finds money making fun.

goirish.9231:

I am picturing Scrooge McDuck swimming in his money vault right now.

Idea for the next level of Architecture guild upgrade?

Aye.8392:

Calae.1738:

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I don’t understand how earning a virtual currency can be fun if the the intent is to aquire more. Sounds more like psychological disorder to me.

Nah, it’s just one more way that people keep score. Some people keep score with money, some people keep score with titles, some with experience points, some with achievement points, some with eye candy — I have a guildie who is constantly broke, but he always looks good! I have another guildie with plenty of money still running around in blues and greens because to her the money number is important. For me it’s my guild roster that is my major score keeper. Fifteen percent actually makes sense when you consider the different ways of keeping score.

Currency isn’t a high score. It’s a medium of exhcange required for goods and services. The purpose of money is to exchange hands, not to sit in one place. Money that isn’t moving is useless and serves no purpose. In the real world governments are forced to redistribute wealth to keep the wheels of the economy spinning. Especially if the private sector isn’t doing it.

Why does every other form of accumulating wealth in this game get nerfed but not the TP?

Olfinbedwere.5049:

Why does every other form of accumulating wealth in this game get nerfed but not the TP?

Because the TP acts as a currency sink. The 15% tax on all transactions is used by arenanet to curb inflation. Traveling, repair, mystic forge ingredients are also other currency sinks.

Skyrim is a bad example, since making money in Skyrim doesn’t affect other people’s playing of Skyrim.

Playing the TP doesn’t actually accumulate anything….it moves wealth around….and REMOVES some currency in the process.

Areas that get “nerfed” with DR or decreased loot drops are “nerfed” because they are ADDING too much currency to the game. Every time an enemy drops an item or coin, it adds currency to the game.

Jake.1842:

So he can take a screenshot, put it on the forums and make everyone cry.

How did he know…

Calae.1738:

Aye.8392:

Calae.1738:

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I don’t understand how earning a virtual currency can be fun if the the intent is to aquire more. Sounds more like psychological disorder to me.

Nah, it’s just one more way that people keep score. Some people keep score with money, some people keep score with titles, some with experience points, some with achievement points, some with eye candy — I have a guildie who is constantly broke, but he always looks good! I have another guildie with plenty of money still running around in blues and greens because to her the money number is important. For me it’s my guild roster that is my major score keeper. Fifteen percent actually makes sense when you consider the different ways of keeping score.

Currency isn’t a high score. It’s a medium of exhcange required for goods and services. The purpose of money is to exchange hands, not to sit in one place. Money that isn’t moving is useless and serves no purpose. In the real world governments are forced to redistribute wealth to keep the wheels of the economy spinning. Especially if the private sector isn’t doing it.

This isn’t the real world, it’s a game. This money is pixelated, pretend, currency used to purchase pixelated, pretend items. And, just like in Monopoly, it is most definitely a way to keep score.

Aye.8392:

Calae.1738:

Aye.8392:

Calae.1738:

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

I don’t understand how earning a virtual currency can be fun if the the intent is to aquire more. Sounds more like psychological disorder to me.

Nah, it’s just one more way that people keep score. Some people keep score with money, some people keep score with titles, some with experience points, some with achievement points, some with eye candy — I have a guildie who is constantly broke, but he always looks good! I have another guildie with plenty of money still running around in blues and greens because to her the money number is important. For me it’s my guild roster that is my major score keeper. Fifteen percent actually makes sense when you consider the different ways of keeping score.

Currency isn’t a high score. It’s a medium of exhcange required for goods and services. The purpose of money is to exchange hands, not to sit in one place. Money that isn’t moving is useless and serves no purpose. In the real world governments are forced to redistribute wealth to keep the wheels of the economy spinning. Especially if the private sector isn’t doing it.

This isn’t the real world, it’s a game. This money is pixelated, pretend, currency used to purchase pixelated, pretend items. And, just like in Monopoly, it is most definitely a way to keep score.

Like in the real world. You seem to neglect the fact that we invented money, it’s not some immutable, all-pervasive law of physics.

15% of those people find it fun because they can convert their in-game gold to Gems and buy special stuff for their characters without spending real money. I however, cannot make gold for the life of me. Lol

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

so you have surveys for each of those 15% backing up that its fun right, you didn’t totally assume that because they spend most of their time flipping items for profit they find it fun did you.

its not at all possible people will follow the path of least resistance to obtain the maximum rewards while not enjoying it just because it is the most efficient use of their time.

also if your going to make a comparison to another rpg it shouldn’t be something like skyrim where you can steal/craft anything you need and pickpocket all your money back after paying someone while having no major gold sinks

imo i think it would be amusing if for a high amount of gold maybe 1k, they introduced an item that gave a golden aura and as you walked gold coins dropped off your character leaving a little trail

I am really happy people find that fun but I dont. I would however very like to see
the #’s and breakdown if you please and how you arrived at your conclusion.

I sure as hell dont find it fun having to spend countless hours setting up the TP and trades/speculating instead of doing things like well um play the game.

Not rewarding players and forcing them to do things they hate in order to survive is really smart.

Novalight.7568:

Sarcasmic.6741:

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money.

And roughly 78% of stated statistics are made up on the spot.

If he says 15% it’s 15% (I mean, he’s the dude that has pretty much every transaction in database…). The only problem is, what is the criteria by which he defined who finds money making fun.

Based on a number of dev comments about how they have “more advanced” methods of figuring out what the player base wants instead of the forums, surveys, etc – My assumption has been they are using a variety of data mining techniques to infer what players “really” want.

Coupled with whichever behavioral economics papers are John’s favorites, he’s got some funky model for this stuff. However, at least from the perspective of a fairly quantitative biologist, a lot of this (the data mining, the econ behavior models) are borderline pseudo-science.

Joiry.2504:

Based on a number of dev comments about how they have “more advanced” methods of figuring out what the player base wants instead of the forums, surveys, etc – My assumption has been they are using a variety of data mining techniques to infer what players “really” want.

Coupled with whichever behavioral economics papers are John’s favorites, he’s got some funky model for this stuff. However, at least from the perspective of a fairly quantitative biologist, a lot of this (the data mining, the econ behavior models) are borderline pseudo-science.

The only qualifier for this would be people already having more gold over then needed for “anything” – but haven’t bought/equipped/used “anything”. Thus you could deduct that their sole “fun” is the gold itself (/getting more of it).

Of course, if I already expect this kind of answer I can look at numbers and interpret them the way I like to see them. It requires a certain faith to believe that the right questions are being asked.

I always have to wonder if the people who can’t grasp that the TradingPpost is a combative, hostile environment as much or moreso than any PvP match are the same ones that think banks are their friend and credit companies want you to have credit because they love you?

Walk into the (Black) Lion’s den naked, you’re gonna get eaten. Come armed, come informed, and get something close to proper value for your coin or goods rather than passing on the rewards of your efforts to others at day-laborer rates.

On the bright side, John Smith has given me the perfect name for the Adventurer’s and Harvesters guide to the TP: “Using the Trade Post for the 85% – How not to get eaten by Lions”

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

99% of statistics are malleable.

Rouven.7409:

The only qualifier for this would be people already having more gold over then needed for “anything” – but haven’t bought/equipped/used “anything”. Thus you could deduct that their sole “fun” is the gold itself (/getting more of it).

Of course, if I already expect this kind of answer I can look at numbers and interpret them the way I like to see them. It requires a certain faith to believe that the right questions are being asked.

I doubt 15% of the population falls into such a clear cut pigeon hole. Even if they did, I don’t think you can deduce anything from it.

Take me. I’m not rich in game, but I do have more gold than my “needs.” I have around 30g between 4 level 80s (mainly just from levelling). They are all equiped with rares, with 2 of them having 1 exotic weapon each, that I looted myself. A few even have some greens, because I haven’t figured out exactly what builds (ie stat armors) I want to have. I’m also sitting on over 100 jugs of karma…also, because I’m not sure which exotic armor stat combos I want to spend them on.

I have a set of resources, but I’m not spending them for a variety of non-economic reasons. Some are stat/build reasons. There’s other dealing with what armor skins I want, the clunkiness of the transmutation system, and the question if its even worth it because of the murky timeline on ascended gear.

You can use models and statistics to tell you a lot of things about a data set. You can’t use it to infer motivations, intents and other things going on in people’s heads – not with anything that could be reasonably called scientific in its reproducibility.

John Smith.4610:

Actually about 15% of the population finds making money very fun, irrelevant of the uses of that money. Ever gotten unnecessarily rich in a single player RPG like Skyrim?

15%? Where is that number coming from? A poll of what sample size? Most people seem to enjoy actually playing the game and enjoying content. Not sitting in LA hoarding gold to screw up the market even more. I.E. the hilarious precursor market, yeah, that seems legit.

9/10 statistics are made up. Thinking this is one of them.

If you got too much gold, share it with those who get nothing from drops. Like me, lol…
A “fine” makes my day…