Is the Trading Post officially the only way players are intended to make money? Champ bags were one of the few solid ways to make gold through open world adventuring, but they are getting nerfed. Yes, repair costs will be down, but I didn’t die all that often (I’m sure hundreds of times, but that was over a lot of play time, so it balanced out to only a few champ bags per week). Where are the nerfs to the trading post income to balance against the nerfs to the champ bags? Or alternately, where’s the new gold faucet being added to the open world? In other words, how are players who earned more champ bags than they did repair builds supposed to make the same amount of gold per hour, other than just giving up the adventuring game and becoming a day trader?
The thing about the Trading Post is that it doesn’t introduce gold into the game, it actually removes it while moving it between players. In that vein, the Trading Post will always be the most powerful tool for those who wish to make tons of in-game money. You will never earn more gold playing the game than you could playing the Trading Post smartly. The reason is clear: playing the game creates gold, which must be regulated.
Dusk hit the big points. Also – TP (“trading”/“Business”) is most gold because it is scalable. Farming (“labor”) is not scalable.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
There is one, sure fire way to make gold at an alarming rate. I’m pretty sure using this method, I can outdo most TP speculators, gold farmers, and other such tedious methods.
Guaranteed minimum of at least 50 gold per hour.
It’s called “get a job.” At the current minimum rate in this state of a little more than $9 an hour (and $14 in some areas), it is by far the best use of time. Then when you play, you can just play for fun and content. (I know, some people like farming and the TP.)
:D
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
So since you know what methods are most profitable, what method would you use to earn gold in open world PvE content? Currently my favorite activity is to hop from world event to world event, which means that the vast majority of what I earn comes from event rewards and champ bags along the way. Can I expect to make less returns per night while doing this, and if so where would this be balanced out?
The thing about the Trading Post is that it doesn’t introduce gold into the game, it actually removes it
I don’t care about that one way or the other. I’m not concerned with how much gold enters or leaves the economy, I’m concerned with how much gold enters or leaves my economy. If they need more gold sinks then they can add more gold sinks, they could double repair costs for all I care, but they need better gold faucets that don’t involve flipping the TP.
You will never earn more gold playing the game than you could playing the Trading Post smartly. The reason is clear: playing the game creates gold, which must be regulated.
They could fix this though, by limiting the ways that you can turn money into money. Making items Bind on Purchase would be the first step, allowing adventurers to sell off their loot, allowing players to buy items that they personally need, but preventing players from buying that loot and then selling it for more.
Presenting players with accurate “average price _sold”_ data, rather than just sell orders and buy orders, would also go a long way towards allowing players to make wiser decisions. Instead of just seeing that an item has 5g buy orders and 15g sell orders, and wondering if it would move at 14g99 or whether it would only move at 6g, they could see that over the last week it had actually sold to an actual player for around 14g45 several times, so that’s probably a reasonable price to work near. That would help to mellow out the flipping curves, since it would require less market tracking and guesswork to determine a fair price that moves reasonably quickly.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
It’s not that the gold drops were the biggest part of the reward, but it was A part fo the reward. If it was so inconcequential then why even bother removing it? They are removing it to specifically reduce the amount of coin entering the world, so it can’t have been completely inconsequential. If they reduce the coin from an event by 1s by throw in an extra green item, then fair enough, I can deal with that, but the announcement ONLY said that they are reducing the reward, not that they are increasing it elsewhere.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
If even the devs know that champ farming isn’t even that great a way to make money, why is it getting nerfed again? Not sure I quite understand the logic there.
There are plenty of other ways of making money. I usually do gathering runs, myself, while hitting any events I may come across on the way. It’s very consistent as you will nearly always know exactly how much money you’ll earn by the time you finish a specific area.
The gold reward from bags (as in, the actual silver you get opening them) is the only thing getting reduced. The mats you get from salvaging greens and the fine mats that come out of them are the real money you get from champ bags, anyway.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
Champ Farming is not the most economically efficient way to make gold. But that doesn’t mean it’s not the “best” method…for some people.
In particular, it’s clear that for many, farming champs is by far and away the best method. It requires no risk, little effort, and requires almost no attention by the player — this allows people bandwidth to chat with non-gaming friends, watch TV, or even do homework.
I speculate that this is among the reasons the coin from champ bags is being cut: this allows people to champ farm if they want, but reduces the reward for things that require little individual effort.
Regardless, I will never see champ farming as the “best” tool for earning coin, even if it were 10x more efficient than any other, because I find myself bored out of my skull after 1-2 rounds of the circuit. I far prefer to run dungeons/fractals, open world chains, or WvW behind a strong commander.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
Champ Farming is not the most economically efficient way to make gold. But that doesn’t mean it’s not the “best” method…for some people.
In particular, it’s clear that for many, farming champs is by far and away the best method. It requires no risk, little effort, and requires almost no attention by the player — this allows people bandwidth to chat with non-gaming friends, watch TV, or even do homework.
I speculate that this is among the reasons the coin from champ bags is being cut: this allows people to champ farm if they want, but reduces the reward for things that require little individual effort.
Regardless, I will never see champ farming as the “best” tool for earning coin, even if it were 10x more efficient than any other, because I find myself bored out of my skull after 1-2 rounds of the circuit. I far prefer to run dungeons/fractals, open world chains, or WvW behind a strong commander.
You make a good point. Its not the best but the most effordless. I agree with this change.
champ farming is my main source of gold :L
champ farming is my main source of gold :L
Welcome to competitive and engaging gameplay! I am glad you made the gap,
Removing the gold rewards is less about removing money from the economy as it is getting players to do something else while logged on….
Since the OP seems to be ranting and obviously considering NOT Champ farming any longer, it appears to be working. Of course, the other side to that coin is the OP just not logging in any longer so ANet needs to add some sort of carrot to another activity at the same time (and I’m guessing they are well aware of that….whether they do it or not is another matter).
If even the devs know that champ farming isn’t even that great a way to make money, why is it getting nerfed again? Not sure I quite understand the logic there.
Because some people thought it was a good way to make money, and others thought it was a reasonable way to earn SOME money while also getting xp/karma/whatever. It will encourage those people, specifically, to go do something else since the financial return is decreasing.
In other words, I think they’re doing it to get people spread out into doing other activities instead of grinding champs all the time.
Has it ever occured to any of you that some people simply don’t enjoy flipping items on the TP or doing dungeon runs or WvW? Maybe the reason a person’s main source of gold is champ farming is because that’s how they personally enjoyed the game. Just like some of you only do dungeons, or only WvW, would you like it if suddenly the activity that brought you most fun out of the game had its profitability nerfed? No, you’d be the first people on these boards whining and crying about it.
Anet needs to learn that nerfing the game only makes it less enjoyable and solves nothing. If you’re going to nerf Anet, buff something else to compensate.
note: i don’t champ farm myself, i find it pretty boring. but i’d be pretty kittened if WB events, dungeons and the other stuff i do to have fun and make gold doing it got nerfed without some sort of way to make up for the loss of income.
Champ trains were the most degenerate style of gameplay I’ve seen evolve in this game. From last summer Champs went from not worth the time defeating to something that drew new players who never learned how to survive on their own. The first nerf the rewards helped a lot and now hopefully this change will “encourage” other forms of gameplay returning.
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
So since you know what methods are most profitable, what method would you use to earn gold in open world PvE content? Currently my favorite activity is to hop from world event to world event, which means that the vast majority of what I earn comes from event rewards and champ bags along the way. Can I expect to make less returns per night while doing this, and if so where would this be balanced out?
I would imagine one of the best ways is to farm mats used in ascended item crafting but if more players do that then the amount of gold from that will decrease.
The gold reward from bags (as in, the actual silver you get opening them) is the only thing getting reduced. The mats you get from salvaging greens and the fine mats that come out of them are the real money you get from champ bags, anyway.
Yeah, but if those aren’t being increased, and there’s no indication so far that they are, then if they reduce the cash portion then that means a reduction in the overall reward for the event. If that overall reduction isn’t enough to justify my concern, then why should it be enough to justify John’s concern that he should feel the need to make the reduction in the first place?
Regardless, I will never see champ farming as the “best” tool for earning coin, even if it were 10x more efficient than any other, because I find myself bored out of my skull after 1-2 rounds of the circuit. I far prefer to run dungeons/fractals, open world chains, or WvW behind a strong commander.
The thing to remember is that this change doesn’t just hurt those heathen “champ farmers,” it hurts anyone who does any events that involve champs. I don’t “champ farm” anymore. I’ve done it occasionally in the past, and still dabble in it from time to time, but I’m not the sort to circuit Frostgorge or Queensdale dozens of times per night.
Still, moving from event to event I probably accumulate a dozen or more champ bags over the course of a night, from all over the world, and all of those will now have less value. On top of that, the blog post not only said that champ bags are being reduced in loot, but events themselves, so every event I do will apparently reward less now. No telling by how much, but both these nerfs hit my playstyle squarely in the junk, without seemingly touching those hat prefer dungeon running or TP farming, or that sort of activity.
If their goal is to laser target champ trains, to make those a less desirable activity, I’d be fine with that. Figure out a better diminishing returns mechanic that perhaps only allow a specific Champ spawn to drop a bag once per hour, or even once per day, whatever, but reducing the rewards across the board seems excessive to me.
Since the OP seems to be ranting and obviously considering NOT Champ farming any longer, it appears to be working.
As the OP, I’ll repeat that I do not Champ farm, and that “doing other things” would likely involve “in another game,” since world events are currently the only activity in GW2 that interest me. I do not like dungeons, do not like Fractals, do not like PvP in any form, but I log on several hours per night to hop from event to event, and champ bags and event credit are two of the primary reward mechanisms for those activities. If world events become unsustainable (and they are already being underpopulated enough) then I just won’t enjoy the game anymore, which would at least free up my time to play other stuff, but it certainly wouldn’t nudge me towards dungeon running or other existing activities.
And for the record, there is nothing they could do to bribe me into playing dungeon content more either, so matter how many carrots they throw at it.
I would imagine one of the best ways is to farm mats used in ascended item crafting but if more players do that then the amount of gold from that will decrease.
I harvest nodes when they are around, but running around with a mining pick is not the type of core game experience that interests me. I do have about 50 stacks of Bloodstone Dust and 50 stacks of Dragonite Ore lying around, but so far these resources are mostly useless because you can’t convert them into anything useful without a ton of other expensive resources.
I would imagine one of the best ways is to farm mats used in ascended item crafting but if more players do that then the amount of gold from that will decrease.
I harvest nodes when they are around, but running around with a mining pick is not the type of core game experience that interests me.
Me neither, champ farming is boring but at least there is some active combat.
Can someone actually post some way to make money without the TP for the average gamer?
I know various ways, it’s just not for average gamer. Like having 100 alts for mining. selling arah path. wining pvp tournament. dungeon speed runs for hardcore players(since only way to find people available to do speed run at anytime is you need to be avaibable all the time too).
Maybe something like karka farming? I can’t think of anything else.
I would imagine one of the best ways is to farm mats used in ascended item crafting but if more players do that then the amount of gold from that will decrease.
I harvest nodes when they are around, but running around with a mining pick is not the type of core game experience that interests me. I do have about 50 stacks of Bloodstone Dust and 50 stacks of Dragonite Ore lying around, but so far these resources are mostly useless because you can’t convert them into anything useful without a ton of other expensive resources.
Hence the “let’s nerf champ trains so people go out and do other stuff” decision from Anet. Frankly, this is a good change.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
If champ train is such a terrible way to make money. why can’t any one post other methods when I asked?
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
If champ train is such a terrible way to make money. why can’t any one post other methods when I asked?
Because 90% of the time when someone suggests a way to make money, the person getting the info doesn’t like what’s involved.
I’m sorry the path of least resistance way to make money is gone but, in all honestly, it was a horrendous way to make money.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
If champ train is such a terrible way to make money. why can’t any one post other methods when I asked?
Because 90% of the time when someone suggests a way to make money, the person getting the info doesn’t like what’s involved.
I’m sorry the path of least resistance way to make money is gone but, in all honestly, it was a horrendous way to make money.
ya I’m not getting any more involved in the topic. I dont’ have a problem with the nerf. I just don’t think what people say is entirely true.
If someone actually know a better way to make money. I’d like to know, so I can cash in some cash.
I think there are better way to make money. Just a tiny fraction of the people can manage to pull it off. It’s like people telling others to do dungeon. Obviously if you spend a whole day using the LFG tool to do dungeon, you really won’t make that much money. I know a person with 11 legendary just doing speed run dungeon, but the only reason he can do it is because he play 24/7. If you want to find people to speed run dungeon 24/7, you need to be on 24/7 too.
(edited by laokoko.7403)
Hence the “let’s nerf champ trains so people go out and do other stuff” decision from Anet. Frankly, this is a good change.
But again, I repeat for the 3rd (4th?) time in this thread, I do not run champ trains, and yet this nerf still looks to be hurting my play style. If they nerf events and champ bags (not just champ trains), then what activities are they going to replace them with? Trying to nudge players towards other existing play styles is not a sufficient answer. If they want players to stop doing the existing content then they’ll need to add a lot fo new content.
Because 90% of the time when someone suggests a way to make money, the person getting the info doesn’t like what’s involved.
I’m sorry the path of least resistance way to make money is gone but, in all honestly, it was a horrendous way to make money.
And again, you don’t seem to be able to suggest an alternative.
champ farming is my main source of gold :L
Welcome to competitive and engaging gameplay! I am glad you made the gap,
There’s not much of that, so they started farming… this really is that simple.
If even the devs know that champ farming isn’t even that great a way to make money, why is it getting nerfed again? Not sure I quite understand the logic there.
Because some people thought it was a good way to make money, and others thought it was a reasonable way to earn SOME money while also getting xp/karma/whatever. It will encourage those people, specifically, to go do something else since the financial return is decreasing.
In other words, I think they’re doing it to get people spread out into doing other activities instead of grinding champs all the time.
My concern is there will be no reason to actually engage a champion (what’s the reward, again?).
There already is a reduced interest in “spreading out” now – I doubt this is really gonna fix that unto itself.
I run all over open world nightly – there are SO few people during the week or even weekends actually running event chains. Running into a group of adventurers (or 1, even, in some maps – Timberline Falls, I’m looking at you) is the EXCEPTION, not the norm.
Why? Because they’re not rewarding on the whole. When anet-driven changes make running an event chain profitable (Linen+Iron Marches), that chain is heavily nerfed (and NO, I am not talking about the time when that chain was bugged… talking about the most recent change about 4-ish weeks ago).
I’ve found very profitable (right now, due to commodity prices) paths I run, but I am certain metrics will eventually dime those out and they, too, will get nerfed.
If this pattern of reducing rewards continues, what is the reason to play?
(edited by KarateKid.5648)
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
If champ train is such a terrible way to make money. why can’t any one post other methods when I asked?
I’ll post what I think are left that are the only things (besides flipping and MF flushing) that turn a quick enough reward for time invested:
Harvesting commodity of the hour and selling on TP
Running dungeons (and depending upon which dungeon, harvesting can beat it on a per hour basis).
I don’t run fractals, so I dunno if they’re worth the time invested.
From a wealth-building perspective:
Running Dynamic Events has never been worth the time invested.
Clearing mobs from open world has never been worth the time invested.
WvW is not worth the time invested (yah, I’m one of those PvE’ers who have mucked up your environment farming bags and harvesting materials)
So, if we exclude the TP, we have two things left to do in this game?
Raw gold drops have a much larger effect on prices than a similar value in items. Adjusting the raw gold produced will have a pretty minimal effect on the rewards of killing champs, but can have a pretty substantial effect on the activity as a gold spigot.
Typical overreaction thread is typical.
But again, I repeat for the 3rd (4th?) time in this thread, I do not run champ trains, and yet this nerf still looks to be hurting my play style. If they nerf events and champ bags (not just champ trains), then what activities are they going to replace them with? Trying to nudge players towards other existing play styles is not a sufficient answer. If they want players to stop doing the existing content then they’ll need to add a lot fo new content.
1. I don’t get how content that changes affects your playstyle if you don’t do that content. Explain.
2. They don’t need to replace champ farming with activities because champ farming wasn’t an intended activity from Anet to begin with.
3. Why is nudging players towards other existing, supported content not sufficient to replace champ farming? It was good enough before champ farming existed, yet somehow it’s not sufficient now? Explain.
The reality is that the only thing Anet has said is that raw Gold drops are being nerfed on champ kills. If someone wants to continue to kill champs for the not-gold stuff (where the real value is anyways), they will still do it.
(edited by Obtena.7952)
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
I do need to ask, but I’d assume champion boxes will include boxes from Tequalt since they too give gold.
1. I don’t get how content that changes affects your playstyle if you don’t do that content. Explain.
2. They don’t need to replace champ farming with activities because champ farming wasn’t an intended activity from Anet to begin with.
3. Why is nudging players towards other existing, supported content not sufficient to replace champ farming? It was good enough before champ farming existed, yet somehow it’s not sufficient now? Explain.The reality is that the only thing Anet has said is that raw Gold drops are being nerfed on champ kills. If someone wants to continue to kill champs for the not-gold stuff (where the real value is anyways), they will still do it.
I’m pretty sure he or she was referring to the nerfed event rewards, not the nerfed champ rewards.
Raw gold drops have a much larger effect on prices than a similar value in items. Adjusting the raw gold produced will have a pretty minimal effect on the rewards of killing champs, but can have a pretty substantial effect on the activity as a gold spigot.
Typical overreaction thread is typical.
So right now, a typical bag drop from an average champion (let’s use Harathi to avoid the Queensdale emotion) is on average what:
A masterwork (a generous 3 silver sell value for sake of argument?) + ~3.5 silver avg direct drop? + ~5 silver worth of crafting materials (today’s prices)?
Round up to a generous 12 silver – 33% is a hefty reduction, no?
But again, I repeat for the 3rd (4th?) time in this thread, I do not run champ trains, and yet this nerf still looks to be hurting my play style. If they nerf events and champ bags (not just champ trains), then what activities are they going to replace them with? Trying to nudge players towards other existing play styles is not a sufficient answer. If they want players to stop doing the existing content then they’ll need to add a lot fo new content.
3. Why is nudging players towards other existing, supported content not sufficient to replace champ farming? It was good enough before champ farming existed, yet somehow it’s not sufficient now? Explain.
Some of the activities that current champ farmers did pre champ farming are no longer around in the same form that they use to be. There was pent/shelt, etc, but that got dealt with. After that some people mainly focused on cof, while others focused mainly on world bosses, farms in malchor, etc.
Then the big chest from world bosses got turned into a daily, and a lot of people started complaining about how there was no way to make money in open world.
Then the champ train surfaced, and after a few nerfs, here we are today.
Basically, prior to champ train people were upset and complaining about open world loot, that’s what they were doing.
Do what you enjoy the most and what you’re probably good at, and it will be profitable, simple enough. Even with this nerf, the champ trains will most likely still exist.
Champ farming was a TERRIBLE way to try and make gold. It was mainly for XP, crafting materials, karma, and luck, none of which are impacted by this change.
If you were farming champs for the gold drops… I mean… I don’t even know what to say…. maybe “don’t”?
It’s true that champ farming is by a wide margin not the best way to make gold (not counting TP either)
And yet, for those of us whom have come to despise instanced play, you aren’t giving us much to earn. Meanwhile, are you decreasing champion loot from WvW too??? Lastly, I’d like to see statistics on this because the greatest gold creation mechanism in game are pure gold Dungeon Rewards. Why aren’t they getting nerfed?
Oh, and some champs count as events for us family guilds that need influence too.
Has it ever occured to any of you that some people simply don’t enjoy flipping items on the TP or doing dungeon runs or WvW? Maybe the reason a person’s main source of gold is champ farming is because that’s how they personally enjoyed the game. Just like some of you only do dungeons, or only WvW, would you like it if suddenly the activity that brought you most fun out of the game had its profitability nerfed? No, you’d be the first people on these boards whining and crying about it.
Anet needs to learn that nerfing the game only makes it less enjoyable and solves nothing. If you’re going to nerf Anet, buff something else to compensate.
note: i don’t champ farm myself, i find it pretty boring. but i’d be pretty kittened if WB events, dungeons and the other stuff i do to have fun and make gold doing it got nerfed without some sort of way to make up for the loss of income.
If champ farming is what you enjoy, then you will still enjoy the game by champ farming.
If champ farming is how your made your gold, you will now likely move on to other things, as was the intent.
Players who enjoyed champs for fun still get their fun, and players who did it for gold can now move on and learn that there are other, better, ways to make gold.
I don’t see how its a loss.
I concur that something needed to be done to encourage players not to just farm Champ trains all day, but I still think that slapping diminishing returns on the Champ bags would have been a better solution. Removing or reducing the gold from events is just going to make them less appealing, especially if the event in question does not involve fighting foes and so players have no opportunity to earn extra money from them.
Alternatively, perhaps ANet would consider giving a major buff to the karma from events, making them a prime source for karma since I know many newer players are hurting for karma.
I concur that something needed to be done to encourage players not to just farm Champ trains all day, but I still think that slapping diminishing returns on the Champ bags would have been a better solution. Removing or reducing the gold from events is just going to make them less appealing, especially if the event in question does not involve fighting foes and so players have no opportunity to earn extra money from them.
Alternatively, perhaps ANet would consider giving a major buff to the karma from events, making them a prime source for karma since I know many newer players are hurting for karma.
Personally, I prefer this over diminishing returns. If there is some DR placed on champs, and it becomes too troublesome to hop to other zones, and kill champs (they ill be competing with other groups) people may just go back to farming t6 mats directly from mobs.
Also I think one of the major appeals to champ farming is the access, you can log in and jump right in without having to worry about looking for a group or anything. If that access is lost, a lot of people may lose interest.
As of now, even without the coin, champ boxes still give up a lot of cores and such.
My concern is there will be no reason to actually engage a champion (what’s the reward, again?).
I solo’d Kol Skullsmasher yesterday.
The reward was playing the game. Instead of whatever champfarming is.
edit: point being that people in general don’t engage champions. they run the train. so you have nothing to be concerned about.
(edited by RemiRome.8495)
I do champ farm some, but it is more for something to do while waiting for others to log in, which might give me some good drops. That said I would not mind seeing the trains go away, mainly because the people who run the trains constantly can become rather verbally abusive if someone happens to kill a champ outside of the train. I love doing event chains and think that a system should be put in place that would encourage people to get out there and do them. My suggestion on this is to create increasing rewards for each event done in a chain. For the first event you get x for the second 2x for the third 3x (of 4x). If the first event of the chain that an individual does is the second they would get x for that and 2x for the third event (their second). Basically, get people out there doing things. How often have you been in FGS to do CoJ and heard the train saying,“let us know when you have finished the Pre so we can come and do the event.” It the reward from the event was higher because you had done the Pre events it would eliminate some of that. And that is not limited to FSG, QD is as bad with the SB.
In particular, it’s clear that for many, farming champs is by far and away the best method. It requires no risk, little effort, and requires almost no attention by the player — this allows people bandwidth to chat with non-gaming friends, watch TV, or even do homework.
Kill regular mobs. No effort, requires almost no attention (if you dont want to pay attention to the game, why bother playing it?) and once you hit a certain MF level you get good loot.
1. I don’t get how content that changes affects your playstyle if you don’t do that content. Explain.
I explained above. I do not run champ trains. I do tend to kill champs though (Like Risen Priests, champ spiders, Grawl Shaman, Molten Shaman, etc.). I do tend to complete events that award champ bags (such as FE, MKII, and Karka). And of course I tend to do a lot of events, which they also said they will be reducing the cash rewards from. So even though I don’t do any champ trains, this seems like it will cut into my daily rewards by a significant amount. I can’t guess at how much, exactly, until they release specifics, but if it was by an amount large enough that they felt like commenting on it, I can’t imagine it would be by an amount small enough that I wouldn’t notice it’s missing.
2. They don’t need to replace champ farming with activities because champ farming wasn’t an intended activity from Anet to begin with.
It sort of was. Not the “running them all in a circuit and repeating” portion, which again, I’m not a fan of and would be fine if they disrupted that specific mechanism, but they added champ bags in the first place to encourage people to tackle these tougher enemies. if champ bags are no longer worthwhile then they will go back to “Elite” status, where everyone just tries to avoid them as best they can while killing other enemies that are a lot less hassle to drop.
3. Why is nudging players towards other existing, supported content not sufficient to replace champ farming? It was good enough before champ farming existed, yet somehow it’s not sufficient now? Explain.
Again, what content? They are reducing the rewards for both champs and events, there is nothing else to do in open world PvE, and so far they haven’t announced adding anything new there.
The reality is that the only thing Anet has said is that raw Gold drops are being nerfed on champ kills.
And for events.
Players who enjoyed champs for fun still get their fun, and players who did it for gold can now move on and learn that there are other, better, ways to make gold.
Most players would like to have both gold, to afford upgrades, AND fun. They don’t want to do things they don’t enjoy to earn gold, because they aren’t enjoying themselves, and they want to do the things they do enjoy while still making the gold they need for the things they want to buy.
I’m not sure why this is such a difficult concept for you to understand.
If having fun in the game means having to give up any dreams of being able to afford the various expensive things I want to eventually have, then I can just switch to a game that doesn’t make me choose.
Kill regular mobs. No effort, requires almost no attention (if you dont want to pay attention to the game, why bother playing it?) and once you hit a certain MF level you get good loot.
Farming regular mobs makes champ farming seem like a roller coaster ride.
John Smith in all honesty can you affirm global repair costs equals to champion bags golds?
And yet another nerf to rewards without touching the TP speculation…
At least more and more people start to notice…….
p.S. FYI champ bags are dropped everywhere….from WWW to fractals…
On reflection, I don’t unequivocally like this change. Not the champ loot nerf, that part is fine. Rather, the nerf to event rewards. There’s little enough incentive to do most DE’s as it is, so nerfing the reward won’t achieve the stated secondary goal of spreading players out in the open world.
Can someone actually post some way to make money without the TP for the average gamer?
I know various ways, it’s just not for average gamer. Like having 100 alts for mining. selling arah path. wining pvp tournament. dungeon speed runs for hardcore players(since only way to find people available to do speed run at anytime is you need to be avaibable all the time too).
Maybe something like karka farming? I can’t think of anything else.
Karka farming is a good start, as veterans give a guaranteed drop of karka shells which go for 8s atm and also drop t6 blood. In general, farming drops that are high in demand, is a good way. High demand items more or less change every day, so the better you know the economy, the more profit you make. Farming Iron while demand was high for crafting the backpieces is a good example for that.
Right now, i would go for ingredients that are used in popular wvw food, as i would guess that their demand will spike with the Tourney coming up, just have a look at lemongrass, omnoms or poultry meat. T4 totems sell for over 5s, Destroyer Slivers (t1) for 35s.
Ever tried to farm those Skritt in the NW corner of the Borderlands? The highest buy order for Heavy Bags of Skritt Shinies is at 11s, for large bags its 40s….
If you want to make gold farming in demand items, be proactive and do some research. Asking on the forums for the best way will mean that the meta already changed to it and as soon as an in demand item is farmed by the masses, its value will drop. So you dont really want everybody to know whats the best way to farm.
p.S. FYI champ bags are dropped everywhere….from WWW to fractals…
Yeah, but they make up a higher portion of the total reward mechanism in different types of activities. Obviously champ farming rewards the highest amount per unit of time, but next would be event trains, then probably dungeons, then WvW, then Fractals. If you’re going into Fractals for the champ bags then you’re doing it wrong.
Karka farming is a good start, as veterans give a guaranteed drop of karka shells which go for 8s atm and also drop t6 blood.
I can’t solo Karka Vets, and I never see anyone else doing this unless there’s a run on the Queen going on, and it sounds super boring even if it was viable.
High demand items more or less change every day, so the better you know the economy, the more profit you make.
How is that different than just TP flipping? You shouldn’t need to keep an eye on the markets in order to make money from playing the adventure game, you should just play the adventure game = good money. If the goal is to make the TP be the only good way to make money then they should separate it out like sPvP was at launch, where TP players can just have fun buying and selling their stocks, and earn “TP funbucks” to show how much better at it they are than everyone else, without mucking about in the actual adventure game economy.
So you dont really want everybody to know whats the best way to farm.
Which is the sign of a toxic economic model. Doing well in the economy shouldn’t rely on knowing things that most players don’t. A good model is one where everyone can know the “best way” and everyone can do it, without anyone being the worse off for it, cooperative, not competitive, PvE, not PvP.
(edited by Ohoni.6057)
This game is all about the credit card, and it can’t stay all about the credit card if players are generating too much gold.
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