The Gold/Gem ratio
it’ll be even higher once season 2 starts. It’ll never go down
never.
The gem for gold exchange is represented as a self-regulating economic system. If the amount of gold needed to purchase gems is increasing, that means that more players want to pay gold to get gems than want to pay gems to get gold.
The OP proposes imposing an external control. This system would benefits players who wish to convert gold to gems by capping their max cost regardless of supply and demand. It would also work to the detriment of those who want to convert gems to gold by capping their potential gain, again regardless of supply and demand. This proposal is inherently unfair — and I say this as someone who has no interest in buying gems to exchange for gold.
Another solution might be for ANet to provide more things for players to spend gold on. This could entice more players who have discretionary income and who don’t have time to farm to buy gems to get said gold. The downside to this idea is that a portion of the player-base already thinks there are too many things to buy with gold.
So, gift the game to people who don’t have a lot of time, but do make a lot of money?
(edited by IndigoSundown.5419)
I’m seriously concerned about this, it can’t be overlooked by Anet.
The option to get gems with gold is one of the key differences that set GW2 apart from most games with in-game shops, but if the price keep raising, we could reach even 20g or 30g for 100 gems at this point, and not so far in the future.This would completely kill the reason this feature was added, and then, would somehow “force” players to actually spend real money on the game because otherwise the alternative would be farm big amounts of gold (for the average player 20g is huge, don’t forget this is a casual players game). The choice to farm or spend would just become illusory and fake then.
The primary reason for the gold→gem is to finance the gem→gold side of the exchange. This way no gold is created when converting cash bought (created from thin air) gems. They are simply being paid gold that other players dropped into the exchange to get gems.
It may be a feature touted in reviews but it’s not one touted in any official GW2 advertising or even listed on the box. ANet needs players to buy gems with cash since that is their chosen method, for now, of funding continuing development. But like F2P games, you don’t need everybody to pay but as the rate rises, it certainly encourage those with little gold and a “need” for that “thing” in the cash shop to drop a 10 spot or get a $25 gem card.
I can earn 20-30g is a week with my Level 80 and that’s 2 hours a night, 2 boss events, a handful of champs and making sure I get my daily done (usually in 20-30 minutes). That’s from selling gathered mats, salvaging items including rares and selling those mats. Sure, lower level characters can’t earn that much in a week but 20g isn’t huge.
RIP City of Heroes
I hate to break this to you man but the requirement is actually already here. Most of us saw this as a central problem a long time ago, we’ve been posting about it for months now, hoping that someone would listen some deniers would realize that this is the direction they had in mind with the gem conversion and DR.
It’s seriously not that difficult to see, however I do have to correct you on one thing though.
This game’s economy is not new or unique. It’s been done a hundred times before. There’s a long history in MMO’s where they tried to make themselves the gold sellers so people wouldn’t try to buy it from the wrong places, there’s a long history of DR where when the developers of other titles tried to implement DR (admitedly in sub only titles) the players protested so loudly the game became barren and the companies went under almost immediately with no revenue. D3 had a similar issue except they bypassed the gems entirely, STO is actually trying to do the same thing as this economy right now by making it almost impossible to gear without hitting up their version of the TP (the exchange).
Anytime the AH in whatever form it takes becomes the center of any substantial rewards of a game or the best method of advancement (ie gathering currency through whatever method and buying the things you need to progress) the game begins to suffer because the game isn’t rewarding any longer. You’re just doing a series of jobs to get the things you need at that point (and occasionally the things you want) but ultimately it’s the same thing.
@tigirius
D3 was the case of have two AH, one where you could sell your loot for in game currency and one where you could sell it for cold hard cash. That allowed you to “pay to win” with Bliz taking a cut like eBay. So all the good items ended up on the cash AH.
Now since nothing in our Gem Shop is better gear, the comparison to D3 doesn’t hold. It’s a straight up cash shop with a proxy currency that’s no different than XBox points.
And since the gold from gem selling is gold players got from playing and used to buy gems, it’s not a source of new gold flowing into the game. Which is what hurt games that had set up legit gold selling in the past.
The purpose of any style of player market is to sell unwanted stuff to players who do. So unless you make all gear soul bound on acquire so you can only sell it at NPC vendors, players will strive to earn in game currency to buy what they want by whatever means including buying it from shady websites.
So how is ANet setting themselves up to be a gold seller hurts the game anymore than black market gold sellers?
You seem to be more against the notion of a player market than the gem shop. Or would it be okay if you couldn’t sell just high end gear there? You sound like a WoW raid refugee my friend. Grinding raids until you got your BIS gear proving that you earned them. Equipping them like a badge of honor.
Sadly for you that isn’t this game which tries to eliminate exclusionary play at every turn. No factions, everyone gets a copy of a mat node for themselves, no penalty to those you help in terms of XP or loot. Low participation requirements for rewards. Etc. Yes it’s a little like every child gets a participation trophy on the team even if their skills are sub average but that’s this game’s foundation. It’s not going to change. Want elitism go pay $15 a month for a game that has that as a core feature. This is just a F2P game with a one time upfront cost. It’s suppose to be accessible to all.
RIP City of Heroes
They could remove some of their services from the TP and put them
in a e shop where you can pay for them only with money.
Like server transfers,game/account upgrades,name/appearance changes.
All these are paid for services in f2p and even in subscription games.
And then regulate and relax the gold to gem rates.
lose a pip,win 2 pips,lose a pip,lose a pip…………..-
-Go go Espartz.-
I’m gonna tell you where is the issue exactly and what is causing it.
RMT “Real Money Trading”, Now hear me out
Lots of players instead of buying Gems to convert to Gold they do the opposite exactly
They buy Gold to convert to GEMS and they get more GEMS doing it for example they buy 1k gold at 60$ yep that’s right and then they convert it to GEMS and that would be how many gems? if 1k gems = 100g that is 10k gems for 60$.
So instead of having more supply on GEMS and Less prices we get the opposite.
A Lot of people isn’t buying gems and their buying GOLD instead from 3rd party sellers and Arena Net haven’t taken any counter measures yet so far! so it will result on having higher GEM prices and ANET will lose more Money since it goes into the pocket of 3rd party gold sellers.
I Voiced the problem but solutions is needed.
You can limit the amount of gold that can be sent VIA mail and limit it only to Friend List that will be a start to fight back! and i’m sure ANET can come with lots of solutions since it concerns millions of $.
— ‘Umar ibn al-Khattab (radiaAllahu ‘anhu)
If you think Anet isn’t doing anything to stop gold sellers you’ve obviously never played a game where that was the case. Yes there are still gold sellers in the game, they’re in every online game, but they do get banned regularly. (As do the accounts they use to farm the gold they sell.)
And limiting sending gold to only people on your friends list wouldn’t change anything. That would just require the buyer and seller to spend a few seconds adding each other first.
“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”
The gem for gold exchange is represented as a self-regulating economic system. If the amount of gold needed to purchase gems is increasing, that means that more players want to pay gold to get gems than want to pay gems to get gold.
The OP proposes imposing an external control.
You really think it is a self-regulating economic system? Funny enough in another topic this came up when people talked about the farm nerf. Someone also said.. well the positive is that if you look at the gold > gem, gem > gold rate. What makes sense. Less easy to grind gold so less gold in the game and less gold being converted to gems should mean the rate should change so you get more gems for your gold or less gold for your gems.
Except for that change there is nothing else going on in the game that should really change it however exactly the opposite of what you could expect happened.
It’s also not the first time. How much gold people earn has been stable for a long time but the gold > gem rate has been going down all the time. Only other explanation would be less and less people are playing / willing to buy gems (to convert to gold).
What would not be that bad really as then Anet would finally get forced to rethink the hole cash-shop focus. However in the last few weeks nothing happened that would suggest this drop while the rate did drop. So I do think they are imposing external control on it.
I will not pretend to know how GW2’s economic system works exactly. I simply do not know. But what I do know is that with the rising gold to gem ratio, I have given up my quest to collect all mini pets.
It was only a few weeks ago when I saw them put yet another down-scaled ambient creature in the gem store as a new mini pet. And then I saw the current gold to gems ratio, and asked myself, why am I still doing this? 400 gems for one mini which is basically just a random ambient creature from the game that they’ve reduced in size? Is that really worth the 400 gems? Is that really worth all the gold I’ve collected so far?
I figured that this was no longer worth my gold. I used to love collecting mini pets in GW1. That’s because mini pets were FREE birthday gifts. And any minis that I was still missing, I could buy from players. I had A LOT of mini pets in GW1:
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/User:Mad_Queen_Malafide/Minipets
I owned 82 of the 127 mini pets in the game.
In GW1, over time the price of any mini pet would slowly go down. In GW2, it only goes up because of the gold to gems ratio.
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)
(edited by Mad Queen Malafide.7512)
Now since nothing in our Gem Shop is better gear, the comparison to D3 doesn’t hold. It’s a straight up cash shop with a proxy currency that’s no different than XBox points.
Just have to disagree with you there. You say that nothing in the Gem store is better gear.
What is the difference between Using cash to then buy better gear, and using cash to buy gems, that you then use to buy Gold, that you then use on the tp to buy better gear?
To me , selling Gold, is borderline Pay2win. And the saddest part is, the devs now have a conflict of interest.
When handling the economy, they can make changes that improve the economy, or…improve their Gem – gold conversions.
Maybe sometimes they MIGHT be the same exact thing. But what happens when improving the economy might lead to less gem sales? Or what happens when what might improve the economy, may also hurt Gem to gold conversions?
I just think that Anet introducing DR is less about " Inflation" which we already have, and more about giving players less ways of accruing Gold…unless it is accrued the way they want. People gaining things they do not want, and then sell on the TP, to be purchased by people that want or need it, that cannot obtain it reliably, and consistently in the game… Outside of buying it on the TP…. while they take a huge cut.
Why else would they Not have a Direct trade window, or add CoD to their Mail system? Other games have it why Not Anet? unless it’s to keep the economy centered on the tp?
(edited by Nerelith.7360)
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
First of all, thats not playing the game. That is supporting the downfall of the game.
Secondly, those 20 dollar get you much more gold now. That is a problem.
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
People are discussing the IN-Game economy.
Fact is that people will always get 1600 gems for $20. That is irrelevant, and you know it. The question is… How many gems to convert to how much Gold? How much can that gold buy within the game?
On another thread you simply said.. that studies have shown that there is no inflation in gw2. As much as i wish i could Just take your word…. common sense says anyone can say anything on the internet, and 90 % of statistics used are made up…. 65 % of people on the internet believe it.
So video or it dodn’t happen. Post the link to your " studies" , and No…Just saying " When the game launched 1600 gems = $20, and Now… 1600 gems = $20." doesn’t prove there is No inflation IN- Game
Kids are on summer break and some have nothing to do but farm gold for the next two months.
You better believe the price for gem exchange is going to go much higher. Don’t even have a glimmer of hope it’ll go down – it wont.
Now since nothing in our Gem Shop is better gear, the comparison to D3 doesn’t hold. It’s a straight up cash shop with a proxy currency that’s no different than XBox points.
Just have to disagree with you there. You say that nothing in the Gem store is better gear.
What is the difference between Using cash to then buy better gear, and using cash to buy gems, that you then use to buy Gold, that you then use on the tp to buy better gear?
To me , selling Gold, is borderline Pay2win. And the saddest part is, the devs now have a conflict of interest.
And the difference in buying gold from an illicit RMT site is …? By your definition then every MMO that a RMT site supported is Pay 2 Win. The difference here is that ANet’s service gives you less gold for your dollar while letting players using the other side of the exchange to use gold to buy cash shop items.
When handling the economy, they can make changes that improve the economy, or…improve their Gem – gold conversions.
Maybe sometimes they MIGHT be the same exact thing. But what happens when improving the economy might lead to less gem sales? Or what happens when what might improve the economy, may also hurt Gem to gold conversions?
I just think that Anet introducing DR is less about " Inflation" which we already have, and more about giving players less ways of accruing Gold…unless it is accrued the way they want. People gaining things they do not want, and then sell on the TP, to be purchased by people that want or need it, that cannot obtain it reliably, and consistently in the game… Outside of buying it on the TP…. while they take a huge cut.
Why else would they Not have a Direct trade window, or add CoD to their Mail system? Other games have it why Not Anet? unless it’s to keep the economy centered on the tp?
What does a direct trade window buy you, assuming it still takes a cut. Limits you to buying or selling to players logged in on your own server rather than all servers including the EU (or NA if you are on the EU servers). How does that maximize availability or provide you a better chance to maximize your income or minimize your costs? Or are you just trying to avoid the gold sink? If not enough gold is being sinked relative to the amount injected they will just turn the reward knob down again.
What new DR have they added recently? Downgrading most of the champs in starter zones is not DR, it’s a straight up nerf.
RIP City of Heroes
The gem for gold exchange is represented as a self-regulating economic system. If the amount of gold needed to purchase gems is increasing, that means that more players want to pay gold to get gems than want to pay gems to get gold.
The OP proposes imposing an external control. This system would benefits players who wish to convert gold to gems by capping their max cost regardless of supply and demand. It would also work to the detriment of those who want to convert gems to gold by capping their potential gain, again regardless of supply and demand. This proposal is inherently unfair — and I say this as someone who has no interest in buying gems to exchange for gold.
Another solution might be for ANet to provide more things for players to spend gold on. This could entice more players who have discretionary income and who don’t have time to farm to buy gems to get said gold. The downside to this idea is that a portion of the player-base already thinks there are too many things to buy with gold.
So, gift the game to people who don’t have a lot of time, but do make a lot of money?
I’m not going to read the whole thread because it essentially ended here. When prices go up, people start to believe they won’t stop going up and then start a buying spree which further pushes the price up. In an economy, the solution to higher prices is higher prices(sounds like a paradox I know). When oil goes up in price and sits there a while, electric cars suddenly become viable. When metals get into a bubble, more mining and production comes online which pushes the price down. All markets have this tendancy. Now I will say that GW2 is not necessarily a perfect comparison because of the gold bots.
(edited by Moderator)
we need players and we need players who buy gold from you anet!!
No thats the worse. Then you support this cash-shop focus that has slowly been killing this game. We need layers who buy expansions.. whenever they would come.
Anyway, it all has nothing to do with the rate people are talking about here.
You really think it is a self-regulating economic system?
Absent any evidence to the contrary? Yes, I take the announced functioning as what’s really happening. Since no evidence has been presented which disproves that the system is self-regulating, I’ll take ANet’s explanation at face value. It helps that the increase in the gold-to-gem ratio was easily predictable to anyone who understands basic economics.
Funny enough in another topic this came up when people talked about the farm nerf. Someone also said.. well the positive is that if you look at the gold > gem, gem > gold rate. What makes sense. Less easy to grind gold so less gold in the game and less gold being converted to gems should mean the rate should change so you get more gems for your gold or less gold for your gems. Except for that change there is nothing else going on in the game that should really change it however exactly the opposite of what you could expect happened.
There is a simpler explanation than that the ratio is being manipulated by ANet. That is, that while some farmers are complaining about how much less gold they’re making, the nerf did not have as big an effect on the overall player-base as they’re claiming. Since players are known to complain about any change that affects them, I don’t think that’s a stretch. It’s also most likely that the serious farmers just moved on.
It’s also not the first time. How much gold people earn has been stable for a long time but the gold > gem rate has been going down all the time. Only other explanation would be less and less people are playing / willing to buy gems (to convert to gold).
The explanation that less players are spending RL cash for gems to convert to gold is the simplest explanation that matches the observable facts. As time passes, this is more and more likely to occur. There is no evidence that the player-base is increasing substantially, which would theoretically add more gems-to gold converters. Once people get the items they want gold to be able to buy, they don’t need to buy more gold. Since the game has not added much of anything that requires gold to buy, this means less people need gold. Also, as time passes, even infrequent players gradually earn gold, and need to buy less to get what they want.
What would not be that bad really as then Anet would finally get forced to rethink the hole cash-shop focus. However in the last few weeks nothing happened that would suggest this drop while the rate did drop. So I do think they are imposing external control on it.
You think this because your analysis of peoples’ motivations and economics is colored by your hatred of the way GW2 is monetized. You’re welcome to your bias, but critical thinking is often skewed to reflect one’s biases.
Seriously guys, how is this supposed to get fixed?
Gold-gem ratio has reached around 12g, last time I remember it was around 9g and even that was pretty high because further before it was around 5g.I’m seriously concerned about this, it can’t be overlooked by Anet.
The option to get gems with gold is one of the key differences that set GW2 apart from most games with in-game shops, but if the price keep raising, we could reach even 20g or 30g for 100 gems at this point, and not so far in the future.This would completely kill the reason this feature was added, and then, would somehow “force” players to actually spend real money on the game because otherwise the alternative would be farm big amounts of gold (for the average player 20g is huge, don’t forget this is a casual players game). The choice to farm or spend would just become illusory and fake then.
I’m perfectly aware that Anet is trying to solve the problem by encouraging players to spend real money on gems to balance the exchange ratio, but this system has shown its problem: if there are no more buyers than converters, the ratio doesn’t drop (correct me if I guessed wrong).
So how do we solve this?
I proposed some time ago to set a gold cap for conversions, something like 10g for 100 gems, so for buying let’s say a piece of armor, you would still have to spend 80g, which is not that low (and not everybody are flippers).
Of course I don’t know if it’s a good solution, but at least it’s a proposition.
Everything you get on the gem store is cosmetic and has no real in-game value, anet does not care if you have it or not, and nor should they. People who spend real money on gems and support this game should have cool stuff that people who dont pay cant get. The fact that you want to be rewarded for giving anet nothing confounds me, the fact that they allow you to buy gems in the first place is already extremely generous, dont push for more.
Join us and RISE to the challenge!
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
First of all, thats not playing the game. That is supporting the downfall of the game.
Secondly, those 20 dollar get you much more gold now. That is a problem.
Thats a problem? rewarding people who support the game? how is giving the company money supporting its downfall? are you insane? do you think about these things before you wright them?
Join us and RISE to the challenge!
~
“The explanation that less players are spending RL cash for gems to convert to gold is the simplest explanation that matches the observable facts.”
Just as simple as that with the nerfing of gold-grinding it should have gone the other way. And there is nothing else really going on. So then the question is why people are suddenly out of nothing did stop buying gems.
Assuming Anets about how it works is true then yes this is the most likely so not only explanation. Thats why I did mention it. But taking that assumption out of the equation that it’s a good runner up, not the best anymore.
“As time passes, this is more and more likely to occur.” This suggest a slow rate change, not a sudden drop. “There is no evidence that the player-base is increasing substantially,” To keep the rate steady it does not have to increase. In fact increasing or decreasing has nothing to do with it as long as the gem to gold and gold to gem converters ratio stays the same. You make a logical error here. Yes more players might mean more gems to gold converters but also more gold to gems converters.
“Once people get the items they want gold to be able to buy, they don’t need to buy more gold.” So you are saying we are now suddenly at a point where people don’t need gold anymore because they have anything they need. Why would that moment be reached just now. You are talking about evidence but using assumptions yourself as well. Obviously because it’s all we got.
“Since the game has not added much of anything that requires gold to buy, this means less people need gold.” In game there has not been added much that has also been steady for a long time. Pretty much everything is based on gold. But adding things ingame that cost gold and you can’t buy with gems that has not changed a lot for over a long time.
“You think this because your analysis of peoples’ motivations and economics is colored by your hatred of the way GW2 is monetized.” If it was colored I did not give both both sides didn’t I? I said there are two possible reasons, x and y. You think it’s Y because you base it on the assumption that Anet is telling the truth (what is possible). I think it’s X based on the fact that nothing special really happened what easily could explain the sudden rate change.
Usually I don’t really monitor the rate, it was just that it came up in that other topic. Also there another person did come up with that same suggestion based on logical thinking (that you should start getting more gems for gold, and he said that defending the grind nerf). So no, it’s not just a colored view. Then I would only look at one side ignoring the other. I don’t do that.
we need players and we need players who buy gold from you anet!!
No thats the worse. Then you support this cash-shop focus that has slowly been killing this game. We need layers who buy expansions.. whenever they would come.
Anyway, it all has nothing to do with the rate people are talking about here.
I don’t want expansions.
I will continue to support the cash shop. I don’t think the cash shop is "killing " the game.
Now since nothing in our Gem Shop is better gear, the comparison to D3 doesn’t hold. It’s a straight up cash shop with a proxy currency that’s no different than XBox points.
Just have to disagree with you there. You say that nothing in the Gem store is better gear.
What is the difference between Using cash to then buy better gear, and using cash to buy gems, that you then use to buy Gold, that you then use on the tp to buy better gear?
To me , selling Gold, is borderline Pay2win. And the saddest part is, the devs now have a conflict of interest.
And the difference in buying gold from an illicit RMT site is …? By your definition then every MMO that a RMT site supported is Pay 2 Win. The difference here is that ANet’s service gives you less gold for your dollar while letting players using the other side of the exchange to use gold to buy cash shop items.
When handling the economy, they can make changes that improve the economy, or…improve their Gem – gold conversions.
Maybe sometimes they MIGHT be the same exact thing. But what happens when improving the economy might lead to less gem sales? Or what happens when what might improve the economy, may also hurt Gem to gold conversions?
I just think that Anet introducing DR is less about " Inflation" which we already have, and more about giving players less ways of accruing Gold…unless it is accrued the way they want. People gaining things they do not want, and then sell on the TP, to be purchased by people that want or need it, that cannot obtain it reliably, and consistently in the game… Outside of buying it on the TP…. while they take a huge cut.
Why else would they Not have a Direct trade window, or add CoD to their Mail system? Other games have it why Not Anet? unless it’s to keep the economy centered on the tp?
What does a direct trade window buy you, assuming it still takes a cut. Limits you to buying or selling to players logged in on your own server rather than all servers including the EU (or NA if you are on the EU servers). How does that maximize availability or provide you a better chance to maximize your income or minimize your costs? Or are you just trying to avoid the gold sink? If not enough gold is being sinked relative to the amount injected they will just turn the reward knob down again.
What new DR have they added recently? Downgrading most of the champs in starter zones is not DR, it’s a straight up nerf.
Not sure why you decided to respond to me, since I never said Buying Gold from a third party was a good idea. Your response seems to indicate that i advocated it.
Secondly, I am not talking about NEW DR. I am talking about ANY DR.
Thirdly: I am not saying REPLACE the TP with a Trade Window. I am saying that many games, include a Trade Window so players can deal with one another directly. That it is an option with MANY games. Along with their versions of the TP, they allow players to completely avoid the TP by letting them trade directly. Here, Players cannot. Here, they MUST trade through the TP, where Anet takes a huge cut.
I noticed you Included a way for Anetr to also get a cut of any trades through a trade window. Why must Anet have their hand in these trades as well? Why must it get a cut?
Lastly You did Not mention CoD in mail. This is also a way that Playrers have always used to deal and trade with one another without going through the TP.
Why must the TP be the ONLY way that players can buy and sell from one another? Could it be the huge cut Anet takes from each and every trade?
There are other games that have all three ways for players to trade with one another. A TP, Trade windows without the parent company taking a cut, and mails with CoD without the company taking a cut. And they don’t have Inflation issues.
Why is it other companies can do it without having to monopolize , and tax every monetary interaction between players?
In almost every other MMO I have ever played…The TP or it’s equivalent is there, to conveninece the player. The Player is given other options to deal and trade. In THIS one… Not so much.
(edited by Nerelith.7360)
Seriously guys, how is this supposed to get fixed?
Gold-gem ratio has reached around 12g, last time I remember it was around 9g and even that was pretty high because further before it was around 5g.I’m seriously concerned about this, it can’t be overlooked by Anet.
The option to get gems with gold is one of the key differences that set GW2 apart from most games with in-game shops, but if the price keep raising, we could reach even 20g or 30g for 100 gems at this point, and not so far in the future.This would completely kill the reason this feature was added, and then, would somehow “force” players to actually spend real money on the game because otherwise the alternative would be farm big amounts of gold (for the average player 20g is huge, don’t forget this is a casual players game). The choice to farm or spend would just become illusory and fake then.
I’m perfectly aware that Anet is trying to solve the problem by encouraging players to spend real money on gems to balance the exchange ratio, but this system has shown its problem: if there are no more buyers than converters, the ratio doesn’t drop (correct me if I guessed wrong).
So how do we solve this?
I proposed some time ago to set a gold cap for conversions, something like 10g for 100 gems, so for buying let’s say a piece of armor, you would still have to spend 80g, which is not that low (and not everybody are flippers).
Of course I don’t know if it’s a good solution, but at least it’s a proposition.Everything you get on the gem store is cosmetic and has no real in-game value, anet does not care if you have it or not, and nor should they. People who spend real money on gems and support this game should have cool stuff that people who dont pay cant get. The fact that you want to be rewarded for giving anet nothing confounds me, the fact that they allow you to buy gems in the first place is already extremely generous, dont push for more.
Buying gems and so supporting that focus on the cash-shop has been destroying this game. Not helping it.
So those ‘cool’ items are more items of shame.
And what is “ingame value?”. You do not need anything and value well an item you earn by killing a boss indeed has a ingame value, an item you buy not. If then the item you buy looks better there is something really wrong. But the game would be much better if people could earn all those items ingame. By having them in a cash-shop that element of the game is gone reducing the quality of the game.
Also not spending money on gems to prevent supporting bad behavior does not mean no willingness to spend money on the game or no willingness to support the game, in fact if you want to support the game you better don’t spend a dime on gems. Let them release good expansions in stead and those same people might be willing to spend there money on that to in fact support the game.
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
First of all, thats not playing the game. That is supporting the downfall of the game.
Secondly, those 20 dollar get you much more gold now. That is a problem.
Thats a problem? rewarding people who support the game? how is giving the company money supporting its downfall? are you insane? do you think about these things before you wright them?
Yes and I am saying that for over a year now.
Spending money on gems is supporting it’s downfall. It’s not supporting the game.
How is it better for the quality of a game to have haircuts available in a cash-shop then having a barber in the game?
How is having this endless boring gold-grind any good for the game?
How is having ‘cool’ items mainly bing in the cash-shop in stead of mainly in the game a positive?
How is having instruments in a cash-shop better then having a musician craft in the game.
How is it better to not being able to hunt down mini’s in the game-world as game-play but having most mini’s in the cash-shop (more gold-grind) or cash.
All that stuff it not better for the game. It’s taking elements out of the game, it has made the game a big gold-grind and so has only made the game worse. By buying gems that is exactly what you are supporting so yes that is bad for the game.
Wrote a whole topic about it: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/A-focus-on-micro-transactions/page/3#post3593248 Have a read.
we need players and we need players who buy gold from you anet!!
No thats the worse. Then you support this cash-shop focus that has slowly been killing this game. We need layers who buy expansions.. whenever they would come.
Anyway, it all has nothing to do with the rate people are talking about here.
I don’t want expansions.
I will continue to support the cash shop. I don’t think the cash shop is "killing " the game.
If you don’t want expansions you should have gone for a F2P game not a B2P game. But your in luck. This game turned more into a cash-shop (F2P) game then a B2P game.
You may support the cash-shop focus. thats all up to your but it’s did already effect the game in many negative ways. Maybe not for your game-play but for sure for many other.
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
First of all, thats not playing the game. That is supporting the downfall of the game.
Secondly, those 20 dollar get you much more gold now. That is a problem.
Thats a problem? rewarding people who support the game? how is giving the company money supporting its downfall? are you insane? do you think about these things before you wright them?
Yes and I am saying that for over a year now.
Spending money on gems is supporting it’s downfall. It’s not supporting the game.
How is it better for the quality of a game to have haircuts available in a cash-shop then having a barber in the game?
How is having this endless boring gold-grind any good for the game?
How is having ‘cool’ items mainly bing in the cash-shop in stead of mainly in the game a positive?
How is having instruments in a cash-shop better then having a musician craft in the game.
How is it better to not being able to hunt down mini’s in the game-world as game-play but having most mini’s in the cash-shop (more gold-grind) or cash.
All that stuff it not better for the game. It’s taking elements out of the game, it has made the game a big gold-grind and so has only made the game worse. By buying gems that is exactly what you are supporting so yes that is bad for the game.
Wrote a whole topic about it: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/A-focus-on-micro-transactions/page/3#post3593248 Have a read.
I agree. By buying gems Under this environment you send a message to the developers that you are perfectly happy if all the cool stuff is hidden behind the gem store. While very little actually makes it’s way to the game.
Another game that tried this was Tera. I remember these very discussions In Tera’s forums.
It’s Interesting that people were saying then." Gw2 just came out, am leaving this to go play Gw2,. the cash shop centric game this has turned to, is Not something I will support." and people there …railed as many here are railing now.
They also said " They will be back, they always come back."
Where is Tera now?
There’s nothing wrong with the gem-gold ratio.
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
First of all, thats not playing the game. That is supporting the downfall of the game.
Secondly, those 20 dollar get you much more gold now. That is a problem.
Thats a problem? rewarding people who support the game? how is giving the company money supporting its downfall? are you insane? do you think about these things before you wright them?
Yes and I am saying that for over a year now.
Spending money on gems is supporting it’s downfall. It’s not supporting the game.
How is it better for the quality of a game to have haircuts available in a cash-shop then having a barber in the game?
How is having this endless boring gold-grind any good for the game?
How is having ‘cool’ items mainly bing in the cash-shop in stead of mainly in the game a positive?
How is having instruments in a cash-shop better then having a musician craft in the game.
How is it better to not being able to hunt down mini’s in the game-world as game-play but having most mini’s in the cash-shop (more gold-grind) or cash.
All that stuff it not better for the game. It’s taking elements out of the game, it has made the game a big gold-grind and so has only made the game worse. By buying gems that is exactly what you are supporting so yes that is bad for the game.
Wrote a whole topic about it: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/A-focus-on-micro-transactions/page/3#post3593248 Have a read.
I agree. By buying gems Under this environment you send a message to the developers that you are perfectly happy if all the cool stuff is hidden behind the gem store. While very little actually makes it’s way to the game.
Another game that tried this was Tera. I remember these very discussions In Tera’s forums.
It’s Interesting that people were saying then." Gw2 just came out, am leaving this to go play Gw2,. the cash shop centric game this has turned to, is Not something I will support." and people there …railed as many here are railing now.
They also said " They will be back, they always come back."
Where is Tera now?
Your argument seem to forget something VERY critical about TERA and it is that TERA was a terrible game, the only good thing was the combat and they still manage to ruin it by making all skills lock you down.
The game failed even in Korea and they are more acceptable to the game’s mechanics.
Also show me a game forum that isn’t polluted with whining and QQs? People will always complain some because of genuine concern others because they think they deserve more than they actually do, like the OP.
This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.
(edited by silvermember.8941)
Just as simple as that with the nerfing of gold-grinding it should have gone the other way.
This assumes that most of the farmers are farming gold to buy gems. That is not a safe assumption, especially for someone who says that many things one can want in the game are bought with gold — which you’ve stated below as well as in other posts.
And there is nothing else really going on. So then the question is why people are suddenly out of nothing did stop buying gems.
I explained why that could be, and you refuse to accept the explanation as a possibility.
Assuming Anets about how it works is true then yes this is the most likely so not only explanation. Thats why I did mention it. But taking that assumption out of the equation that it’s a good runner up, not the best anymore.
This makes no sense.
This suggest a slow rate change, not a sudden drop.If you are referring to the recent upswing in golds-to-gem, that is most likely a result of people returning in anticipation of LW S2 or returning from having tried other games and finding them wanting.
To keep the rate steady it does not have to increase. In fact increasing or decreasing has nothing to do with it as long as the gem to gold and gold to gem converters ratio stays the same. You make a logical error here.
False. There’s only so much to buy with gold, and gold accrues eventually by playing the game.
Yes more players might mean more gems to gold converters but also more gold to gems converters. So you are saying we are now suddenly at a point where people don’t need gold anymore because they have anything they need. Why would that moment be reached just now. You are talking about evidence but using assumptions yourself as well. Obviously because it’s all we got.
False. I didn’t say that there’s anything sudden about it. It’s been going on for nearly two years. Are you going to deny that if one buys gems to convert to gold to get what one wants, that sooner rather than later one will have what one wants and will not need to continue to buy gold with gems?
In game there has not been added much that has also been steady for a long time. Pretty much everything is based on gold. But adding things ingame that cost gold and you can’t buy with gems that has not changed a lot for over a long time.
Thanks for proving my points.
If it was colored I did not give both both sides didn’t I? I said there are two possible reasons, x and y. You think it’s Y because you base it on the assumption that Anet is telling the truth (what is possible). I think it’s X based on the fact that nothing special really happened what easily could explain the sudden rate change.
No, I think the simpler explanation is the more likely, absent any convincing arguments on behalf of the more complex argument. Since the increase in rate over time is just about a given, and the so-called sudden change is easily explainable without postulating external controls added behind the scene, yours is the more complex explanation — and thus bears the burden of proof.
Usually I don’t really monitor the rate, it was just that it came up in that other topic. Also there another person did come up with that same suggestion based on logical thinking (that you should start getting more gems for gold, and he said that defending the grind nerf). So no, it’s not just a colored view. Then I would only look at one side ignoring the other. I don’t do that.
Bias is not failing to discuss other options. Bias is consistently coming to conclusions that support what you already believe, despite lack of evidence.
“Bias is not failing to discuss other options. Bias is consistently coming to conclusions that support what you already believe, despite lack of evidence.”
No it’s making your conclusion based on personal preference while evidence is pointing in the other direction. In this case all we have to go on is common sense based on the information and we have multiple reasons for the rate being at it is. But because the only change we do have seems to be one that would do exact the opposite to the rate I come to the conclusion I came at.
The stated issue is only a problem for people like me, who are unwilling to spend RL cash to buy gems. The higher the gold→gem ratio goes, the better it is for those people willing to spend their hard-earned money to buy gems.
If we want a free-to-play game, we should also accept that the company will make things easier on those willing to spend their hard-earned dollars, pounds, and euros. I am thankful that the gem shop only offers cosmetic & convenience items, and that top-tier gear is available without ever owning a single gem.
Not sure why you decided to respond to me, since I never said Buying Gold from a third party was a good idea. Your response seems to indicate that i advocated it.
No I’m responding to the notion that buying gems and converting them into gold is Pay 2 Win, the point you made. If buying gold is Pay 2 Win then buying gold from any source including RMT sites would count as P2W therefore every game that ever had their currency available from a RMT site would be P2W.
Secondly, I am not talking about NEW DR. I am talking about ANY DR.
But that’s a dead horse you’re beating. Nothing new here so why dredge it up again? DR allows the player who isn’t pumping one type of content full rewards while “encouraging” those who are to shove off and do something else for a while. Or did you forget those players devoted to running CoF 1 exclusively. Or players getting ticked because someone other than they dared to kill a critter from “their” farm?
Thirdly: I am not saying REPLACE the TP with a Trade Window. I am saying that many games, include a Trade Window so players can deal with one another directly. That it is an option with MANY games. Along with their versions of the TP, they allow players to completely avoid the TP by letting them trade directly. Here, Players cannot. Here, they MUST trade through the TP, where Anet takes a huge cut.
I noticed you Included a way for Anetr to also get a cut of any trades through a trade window. Why must Anet have their hand in these trades as well? Why must it get a cut?
Lastly You did Not mention CoD in mail. This is also a way that Playrers have always used to deal and trade with one another without going through the TP.
Why must the TP be the ONLY way that players can buy and sell from one another? Could it be the huge cut Anet takes from each and every trade?
There are other games that have all three ways for players to trade with one another. A TP, Trade windows without the parent company taking a cut, and mails with CoD without the company taking a cut. And they don’t have Inflation issues.
Why is it other companies can do it without having to monopolize , and tax every monetary interaction between players?
In almost every other MMO I have ever played…The TP or it’s equivalent is there, to conveninece the player. The Player is given other options to deal and trade. In THIS one… Not so much.
I never said you were asking to replace the current TP, just question why should we have one, which you didn’t answer. And no “because others have it” isn’t a good reason. Why do you want a player trade window? What does it get you? Is it only to avoid the TP tax? Do you want to sell for less? Do you want to be sure to not sell to players you dislike or on another server (your WvW most hated foe)? Explain why?
And the TP tax is there to sink some of the gold that is flowing into the game. Otherwise players will accumulate gold faster which will lead to general inflation. I’ve seen what happens in MMOs where the gold taps are wide open and there isn’t enough sinks to stem the rising money supply. That’s why I included it in the player to player trade UI. If you don’t we will really start to see inflation and not what some are mistaking as inflation. The only other alternative is to reduce rewards further.
And COD as you call it is totally buyer beware. It’s Craigslist in a bad neighborhood. If you get ripped off, don’t come crying to ANet because you just wanted to avoid the TP tax. If you want to sell to a trusted friend, the mail system does work right now.
RIP City of Heroes
And the TP tax is there to sink some of the gold that is flowing into the game. Otherwise players will accumulate gold faster which will lead to general inflation. I’ve seen what happens in MMOs where the gold taps are wide open and there isn’t enough sinks to stem the rising money supply. That’s why I included it in the player to player trade UI. If you don’t we will really start to see inflation and not what some are mistaking as inflation. The only other alternative is to reduce rewards further.
Addressing this: Anet controls both faucets and sinks for the most part. If they were to hypothetically remove the sink of the tp, ofc they would have to either create a new sink or alter some faucets. It’s not like there would be rampant inflation b/c they would balance it if it were the case. This does not mean they would have to reduce all rewards, just the gold faucets. They could very easily reduce gold rewards and increase item rewards (those that are not directly converted to gold), since they have control over everything.
In terms of reducing gold yet increasing items they could reduce the gold for wvw levels yet at the same time give players a rare per level in its place. The same could be said for spvp matches. Reduce the coin and add an item.
The stated issue is only a problem for people like me, who are unwilling to spend RL cash to buy gems. The higher the gold->gem ratio goes, the better it is for those people willing to spend their hard-earned money to buy gems.
If we want a free-to-play game, we should also accept that the company will make things easier on those willing to spend their hard-earned dollars, pounds, and euros. I am thankful that the gem shop only offers cosmetic & convenience items, and that top-tier gear is available without ever owning a single gem.
Then again ‘we’ well I don’t want a free-to-play game. That is why I got interested in GW2. It not being a F2P game and all. So to prevent exactly this sort of bad stuff in the game.
I have no problem paying. Give me an expansion every year and I pay. So what do you then go for.. A game that uses a B2P payment-model.
“the gem shop only offers cosmetic & convenience items,” Well the fun of an MMO is hunting that sort of items down in the game. Well for many players it is at least. So then you don’t want it in a cash-shop.
No it’s making your conclusion based on personal preference while evidence is pointing in the other direction. In this case all we have to go on is common sense based on the information and we have multiple reasons for the rate being at it is. But because the only change we do have seems to be one that would do exact the opposite to the rate I come to the conclusion I came at.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor
Your hypothesis includes an additional factor that would add complexity to the situation. Thus, the burden of proof is yours.
What I’ve got:
- The amount of in-game currency in any online game goes up over time, unless gold sinks are sufficient to balance gold added to the game through play.
- Games that have such a balance are going to be roundly criticized for making it impossible for players to get ahead with regard to in-game resources.
- Not surprisingly, it is very possible to accumulate gold in GW2, ergo the amount of gold available in GW2 goes up over time.
- New things that require gems to buy are being added to the gem store on a regular basis. Meanwhile, new things to buy with gold are not being added at the same rate. This means that players who want to exchange gold for gems have more things to buy with those gems than players who want to exchange gems for gold. If you want to explain any given increase to the conversion rate, look to what’s available in the gem store that people want without having to spend RL cash.
- The two purchasable goals that would require the most gold are Legendaries and Ascended weapons/armor. These can also be farmed for rather than purchased. Purchasing just speeds the process up. As time passes, it’s inevitable that more and more people have gotten the Asc./Leg. they wanted. This includes players who spend RL cash to facilitate the process. Unless those people are either replaced by new people, or they decide they want more of the same, the demand for gold will go down to some degree. It stands to reason that at least some of these folks decide they don’t need more.
- Reduction in gold from specific farms has happened many times. These previous nerfs did not result in significant downswings in the conversion rate, so expecting the latest one to do so is a stretch.
- Farmers are going to farm. Once Farm A is nerfed, the farmers move on to farm B. There is little evidence that gold gain decreased significantly from any of these nerfs. Meanwhile, there are constant complaints about inflation.
So, what have you got? Remember that — unless you’re going to claim that the conversion rate is 100% manipulated by ANet — you’ll need to account for player desires, player retention and loss, and a myriad of other factors that impact a supply and demand economy. A simple, “The rate should have gone down because of isolated factor X and it didn’t.” isn’t going to cut it.
Seriously guys, how is this supposed to get fixed?
You assume that is a problem so it should get fixed. But did you ever consider that it may be that way, by design?
Besides it being more profitable for ArenaNet, a higher gem price, also squeezes the profit margins of gold sellers which may just be the most effective way of weeding them out of the system.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/bltc/What-s-happening-to-gems/first#post4137559
A high gem price may be bad for you personally, but it is certainly better for ArenaNet. So what makes you think that they would fix it the way that you want it to be fixed?
(edited by DarkSpirit.7046)
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
First of all, thats not playing the game. That is supporting the downfall of the game.
Secondly, those 20 dollar get you much more gold now. That is a problem.
Thats a problem? rewarding people who support the game? how is giving the company money supporting its downfall? are you insane? do you think about these things before you wright them?
Yes and I am saying that for over a year now.
Spending money on gems is supporting it’s downfall. It’s not supporting the game.
How is it better for the quality of a game to have haircuts available in a cash-shop then having a barber in the game?
How is having this endless boring gold-grind any good for the game?
How is having ‘cool’ items mainly bing in the cash-shop in stead of mainly in the game a positive?
How is having instruments in a cash-shop better then having a musician craft in the game.
How is it better to not being able to hunt down mini’s in the game-world as game-play but having most mini’s in the cash-shop (more gold-grind) or cash.
All that stuff it not better for the game. It’s taking elements out of the game, it has made the game a big gold-grind and so has only made the game worse. By buying gems that is exactly what you are supporting so yes that is bad for the game.
Wrote a whole topic about it: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/A-focus-on-micro-transactions/page/3#post3593248 Have a read.
I agree. By buying gems Under this environment you send a message to the developers that you are perfectly happy if all the cool stuff is hidden behind the gem store. While very little actually makes it’s way to the game.
Another game that tried this was Tera. I remember these very discussions In Tera’s forums.
It’s Interesting that people were saying then." Gw2 just came out, am leaving this to go play Gw2,. the cash shop centric game this has turned to, is Not something I will support." and people there …railed as many here are railing now.
They also said " They will be back, they always come back."
Where is Tera now?
Your argument seem to forget something VERY critical about TERA and it is that TERA was a terrible game, the only good thing was the combat and they still manage to ruin it by making all skills lock you down.
The game failed even in Korea and they are more acceptable to the game’s mechanics.
Also show me a game forum that isn’t polluted with whining and QQs? People will always complain some because of genuine concern others because they think they deserve more than they actually do, like the OP.
There is a commonality with Gw2 forums though. The same Arrogant attitude. “They will come back, they always come back.”
Then when “they” don’t, and the game fails, players that are white knights that defend all actions By Anet, even actions that were they in some other game would make people wonder….. look around and ask.’ why are servers merging ( oops been tere, done that… i.e. Megaserver)… Why are people leaving???"
Jus’ sayin…. I can understand Liking a game, but white knighting it against all grievances??
- points to Tera’s corpse.* " There but by the Graces of the Six… go you."
There is nothing to fix because nothing is broken.
You can still get the same 1600 gems for $20 that you could when the game launched.
First of all, thats not playing the game. That is supporting the downfall of the game.
Secondly, those 20 dollar get you much more gold now. That is a problem.
Thats a problem? rewarding people who support the game? how is giving the company money supporting its downfall? are you insane? do you think about these things before you wright them?
Yes and I am saying that for over a year now.
Spending money on gems is supporting it’s downfall. It’s not supporting the game.
How is it better for the quality of a game to have haircuts available in a cash-shop then having a barber in the game?
How is having this endless boring gold-grind any good for the game?
How is having ‘cool’ items mainly bing in the cash-shop in stead of mainly in the game a positive?
How is having instruments in a cash-shop better then having a musician craft in the game.
How is it better to not being able to hunt down mini’s in the game-world as game-play but having most mini’s in the cash-shop (more gold-grind) or cash.
All that stuff it not better for the game. It’s taking elements out of the game, it has made the game a big gold-grind and so has only made the game worse. By buying gems that is exactly what you are supporting so yes that is bad for the game.
Wrote a whole topic about it: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/A-focus-on-micro-transactions/page/3#post3593248 Have a read.
I agree. By buying gems Under this environment you send a message to the developers that you are perfectly happy if all the cool stuff is hidden behind the gem store. While very little actually makes it’s way to the game.
Another game that tried this was Tera. I remember these very discussions In Tera’s forums.
It’s Interesting that people were saying then." Gw2 just came out, am leaving this to go play Gw2,. the cash shop centric game this has turned to, is Not something I will support." and people there …railed as many here are railing now.
They also said " They will be back, they always come back."
Where is Tera now?
Your argument seem to forget something VERY critical about TERA and it is that TERA was a terrible game, the only good thing was the combat and they still manage to ruin it by making all skills lock you down.
The game failed even in Korea and they are more acceptable to the game’s mechanics.
Also show me a game forum that isn’t polluted with whining and QQs? People will always complain some because of genuine concern others because they think they deserve more than they actually do, like the OP.
There is a commonality with Gw2 forums though. The same Arrogant attitude. “They will come back, they always come back.”
Then when “they” don’t, and the game fails, players that are white knights that defend all actions By Anet, even actions that were they in some other game would make people wonder….. look around and ask.’ why are servers merging ( oops been tere, done that… i.e. Megaserver)… Why are people leaving???"
Jus’ sayin…. I can understand Liking a game, but white knighting it against all grievances??
- points to Tera’s corpse.* " There but by the Graces of the Six… go you."
You mean the same arrogance you seem very terrible at projecting? Actually, I am wrong you seem more desperate than arrogant considering you had to resort to calling others white knight.
Players like you exist in every game, even world of warcraft has delusional players such as yourself the delude themselves into believing WOW is going to die because they don’t like the game.
Guild wars 2 has been out for 666 days and so far it is looking more healthier than games that were recently released. If guild wars 2 isn’t dead by now, it wont be dead due to whatever nonexistent reasons you want to give. It will go down due to its inevitable decline like every mmo does.
This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.
(edited by silvermember.8941)
You mean the same arrogance you seem very terrible at projecting? Actually, I am wrong you seem more desperate than arrogant considering you had to resort to calling others white knight.
Players like you exist in every game, even world of warcraft has delusional players such as yourself the delude themselves into believing WOW is going to die because they don’t like the game.
Guild wars 2 has been out for 666 days and so far it is looking more healthier than games that were recently released. If guild wars 2 isn’t dead by now, it wont be dead due to whatever nonexistent reasons you want to give. It will go down due to its inevitable decline like every mmo does.
I would Hope I was terrible at projecting arrogance, since I do not consider myself arrogant, so thank you for the compliment.
That out of the way. Gw2 has flaws. There exist in every forum white knights that champion the company, regardless of the merits. They feel it is their responsibility, as a fan of the product to defend it regardless of whjether the faults are real or imagined, and whether their defence is based On logic or passion. They will resort to any and all methods to get " the enemy" to quiet down.
I am not saying anything you don’t Know, it just seems that me saying it upsets you.
Yes there are also people that will trash the game Just as passionately. …
I am not among them, I defended Anet, when it made decisions worth defending. I explained why I felt some choices made made sense. But at the same time, I am aware, that Anet is fallible.
So calling out faults of a product I payed for…is perfectly within my rights. And mentioning that there is White Knighting going on, may not be something people that enjoy the game like to hear, but it is the truth, as it is true On Wow forums, or ESO forums, or TSW forums..etc…
Or are you saying that white knights do not post on the gw2 forums?
As someone who only ever converts gems to gold occasionally, you have to consider it from our perspective… back when it was 4g per 100 gems = 32g per $10. Would I pay USD$1 for 3.2g? Lol no way. Yes, back then I could buy more things for 3.2g than I can now, but I convert $20~$50 at a time. I’d rather spend my money on something else.
If it was 12g per 100 gems = 96g per $10. I’m happy to pay USD$1 for 9.6g. BUT the rate going the other way isn’t equal, so if we exchange gems to gold we don’t get 12g for every 100 gems we put into the exchange.
You are waiting for the price of gems to drop, I am waiting for the price of gold to drop. As long as there is this standstill, the price will continue to work in gold-buyers’ favour until an acceptable conversion rate is achieved.
~
“Your hypothesis includes an additional factor that would add complexity to the situation.”
Using all the information you have is “an additional factor that would add complexity” and so it’s. Also Occam’s razor just says you should use the idea with the least assumptions. You are assuming that Anet’s statement is truth. I take Anets statement as input but am not assuming it’s correct nor that it is false. I just take it as an input. So what more am I assuming? I just try to apply common sense to the information I have.
“*The amount of in-game currency in any online game goes up over time, unless gold sinks are sufficient to balance gold added to the game through play.*”
Thats overtime. The threads now popping up (you might have noticed this is not the only one) is based on a sudden drop. So based on that alone this information seems irrelevant.
In addition there are many gold sinks and gold-income has been steady for many people for a long time. Lastly we did see one change that was nerving gold-grind what should do exactly the opposite. That was the main point of what I said.
“*Games that have such a balance are going to be roundly criticized for making it impossible for players to get ahead with regard to in-game resources.*” ??? What is the relevance of this?
“*Not surprisingly, it is very possible to accumulate gold in GW2, ergo the amount of gold available in GW2 goes up over time.*” This is exactly the same as your first point.
“*New things that require gems to buy are being added to the gem store on a regular basis. ~*”
Also this is the same for a long period while the discussion now pop up because of a sudden drop while the only big change was a nerf to grinding gold. You also forget the gold-grind in the game. That are not only items but also levelling crafting and if it’s about items most people do not have all legendaries yet. Anyway this is more of an explication of your point 1. Not really a new point.
“*The two purchasable goals that would require the most gold are Legendaries and Ascended weapons/armor. These can also be farmed for rather than purchased.*”
That has also not changed recently.
“*Reduction in gold from specific farms has happened many times. These previous nerfs did not result in significant downswings in the conversion rate, so expecting the latest one to do so is a stretch.*” Haven’t seen any big gold-grind nerfs before.
“*Farmers are going to farm. Once Farm A is nerfed, the farmers move on to farm B. There is little evidence that gold gain decreased significantly from any of these nerfs. Meanwhile, there are constant complaints about inflation.*”
If that would be true then there would still not be a reason for the rate to suddenly jump into the other direction. You are assuming they move to the next thing ans there is just as much evidence that the gold gain decreases as that gold gains grows or stays steady. So that’s invalid to try and proof that the nerfe in gold-grind does no do anything.
Your points just try to prove a steady grow in gold and so a slowly change in gold > rate overtime. While ignoring that if there are sufficient gold-sinks that’s not even true because then you would keep a steady rate. They do not in any way point towards a sudden drop that we did see (and triggered these threads).
So that’s similar to what I said. Nothing much changed so you would not expect a sudden drop. In addition the one change that we did see (nerf of gold-grind) by common sense would point towards a the gold > gem rate going in the other direction.
Again there might be other reasons. People suddenly stopping to spend gems for gold. But even then the question is why this happen all of a sudden. What was the trigger for that?
“*So, what have you got?*” Exactly the same as you.. All those things point towards a steady change or just a steady rate (no change.. if gold-sinks are working properly). In addition I got the gold-grind nerf that by common sense would suggest there is less gold in the game and more people in need for gold. However we got the sudden drop. The information that triggered these topics.
“*unless you’re going to claim that the conversion rate is 100% manipulated by Anet*” I did never say that. Looking at what we see it’s mainly based on what they say (gold to gem converts vs gem to gold converts). However sometimes there are these sudden drops that are hard to explain. That’s why I say I would not be surprise that indeed they might sometimes change it.
However, it’s not about if anybody has a subjective viewpoint. It’s just about if the current rate is good or bad for the game. You then stated that it would be bad if Anet manually influence the rate (suggesting they didn’t) on what I said you can’t say for sure they don’t already do so and the current drop might even suggest they do so. Maybe they do, maybe not. That’s not the point of this thread.
The rate isn’t the same because the exchange takes 15% of gold going into and out of the exchange. That’s why the Gem→Gold is 72.25%, or 85% x 85%, of the Gold →Gem rate. It discourages market players from playing the exchange over the short term.
RIP City of Heroes
The rate isn’t the same because the exchange takes 15% of gold going into and out of the exchange. That’s why the Gem->Gold is 72.25%, or 85% x 85%, of the Gold ->Gem rate. It discourages market players from playing the exchange over the short term.
and Anet just want your money. Having a different price means people get less from buying gold, so they’ll have to spend more real cash.
Quite honestly, some people want Anet to look good, so they come up with various reason(stop inflation, stop people from flipping). But the button line is Anet want your money, and people are complaining they have to pay real money or grind more gold.
The rate isn’t the same because the exchange takes 15% of gold going into and out of the exchange. That’s why the Gem->Gold is 72.25%, or 85% x 85%, of the Gold ->Gem rate. It discourages market players from playing the exchange over the short term.
and Anet just want your money. Having a different price means people get less from buying gold, so they’ll have to spend more real cash.
Quite honestly, some people want Anet to look good, so they come up with various reason(stop inflation, stop people from flipping). But the button line is Anet want your money, and people are complaining they have to pay real money or grind more gold.
But Anet doesn’t want their players to Grind gold, so what else does that leave?
You mean the same arrogance you seem very terrible at projecting? Actually, I am wrong you seem more desperate than arrogant considering you had to resort to calling others white knight.
Players like you exist in every game, even world of warcraft has delusional players such as yourself the delude themselves into believing WOW is going to die because they don’t like the game.
Guild wars 2 has been out for 666 days and so far it is looking more healthier than games that were recently released. If guild wars 2 isn’t dead by now, it wont be dead due to whatever nonexistent reasons you want to give. It will go down due to its inevitable decline like every mmo does.
I would Hope I was terrible at projecting arrogance, since I do not consider myself arrogant, so thank you for the compliment.
That out of the way. Gw2 has flaws. There exist in every forum white knights that champion the company, regardless of the merits. They feel it is their responsibility, as a fan of the product to defend it regardless of whjether the faults are real or imagined, and whether their defence is based On logic or passion. They will resort to any and all methods to get " the enemy" to quiet down.
I am not saying anything you don’t Know, it just seems that me saying it upsets you.
Yes there are also people that will trash the game Just as passionately. …
I am not among them, I defended Anet, when it made decisions worth defending. I explained why I felt some choices made made sense. But at the same time, I am aware, that Anet is fallible.
So calling out faults of a product I payed for…is perfectly within my rights. And mentioning that there is White Knighting going on, may not be something people that enjoy the game like to hear, but it is the truth, as it is true On Wow forums, or ESO forums, or TSW forums..etc…
Or are you saying that white knights do not post on the gw2 forums?
You might not think you are arrogant but your posts say otherwise. Only an terrible arrogant person would believe just because they hate the game’s direction means the game is going to die. It is the same idiotic arguments a lot of players made when guild wars 2 first came out, when ascended gear was introduce and when the LS was announced. So there is a history of people trying to project their view onto others.
There is nothing inherently wrong with calling out a product flaws. The problem as shown by this thread is that a lot of people are calling out flaws out of ignorance. Their whole argument is based on the lack of understanding on how the system works. You see players complaining how TP player make more money than farming, but without understanding the why. YOu see others complain about the gold to gem ratio without understanding why.
The biggest source of your arrogance is your usage of the word white knight. You are so deluded into believing that anybody that doesn’t accept your point of view is clearly white knight and not someone who simply disagrees with you. A lot of people for example hate the LS, I like the concept of it because it is different than the same crap I have played for nearly 7 years, it has some flaws but what doesn’t. But if you were to read the forum, some people want WOW raid and so anybody that doesn’t want WOW raid is a white knight, anybody that dares to disagree with them is a white knight.
tl;dr
arrogant players consider opinions that make guild wars 2 different from the WOWs, ESO etc to be the white knights and not someone who has a different opinion from theirs.
A lot of players usually claim to want something different the truth is, they want the same thing but somehow different.
This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.
- snip -
So to sum up, what you’ve got is:
- People wouldn’t t stop purchasing gold with gems because their goals are not finite, even though the goal of purchasing gold via gems is to get what one wants quickly.
- The game has plenty of gold sinks.
- Because gold grind.
- You don’t see that the preponderance of the evidence suggests that you’re wrong.
- You’d rather look for manipulation than infer that if the rate goes up, it’s because fewer gems are available while more gold is available, or that the only things added to GW2 since April are another lucrative gold farm and a bunch of stuff players need gems to buy.
Assuming that ANet would risk their reputation by unnecessarily manipulating the exchange to do what it’s going to do naturally is not common sense. That’s adding complexity without adding explanatory power.
Seriously guys, how is this supposed to get fixed?
Encourage people to stop buying gems with gold, and to instead buy gems with $$ and sell those gems for gold. Since you want this number to go down, I’ll assume you’re wanting to buy gems with gold. In which case, you are part of the problem you are complaining about.
People who buy gems with $$ and sell those gems for gold want this number to go up up up. $10 used to only get you 8g, now it gets you 70g. I know which amount I’d rather get for $10.
Mystic’s Gold Profiting Guide
Forge & more JSON recipes