Guild Wars 2

“You’ve placed too many sell orders, please wait a few minutes”.

Do you think I have all day to get this stuff sold on my inventory?

Yes, came here to make a similar post. It’s not that I don’t understand why the check is in place, just that the speed limitation is set too aggressively low.

1) Since the BLTC UI was changed, I find I can make my decisions about what to vendor, salvage or put on the TP quite a bit faster than before. Result? If I have a reasonably full inventory, there’s a very good chance I’ll trip over this “error” well before I’m anywhere near finishing emptying my bags. From that point onwards, it’s just sheer annoyance.

2) As for when I’m trying to sell the results of salvaging…OUCH! Just now, I had about 1800 copper ore to sell. Similar amounts of various woods. Now – the UI won’t LET me sell the whole lot at once, which is frustrating; I have to go through and list them (tediously) 250 at a time. But that’s life, and there may be technical reasons in the design why we’re stuck with that. Fair enough. SO: Choose price; set slider to 250; hit “list this item”. Note – the UI knows I have more I could sell, because it now gives me an “OK” button to take me back to the listing screen, with all my values saved (when I have no more to sell, all I get is a “Close” button). SO. Hit “OK”. Hit “List this item”. Hit “OK” …and so on, about 6 times, then BANG. “Too many sell orders”.

For pity’s sake – the UI knows I’m selling parts of a big batch. If it won’t let me sell the whole lot at once, at least have the goodness not to excessively and unnecessarily limit the speed I can list it at!

Zenith.6403:

“You’ve placed too many sell orders, please wait a few minutes”.

Do you think I have all day to get this stuff sold on my inventory?

You have bots and hackers to thank for this. This prevents bots from selling items in mass before heading out into the game world to bot some more and to prevent hackers from selling everything on the account in like 2 mins.

Same reason why you may be muted in chat for saying the same thing over and over again. It prevents bots from mass spamming about selling gold.

joshc.3129:

Zenith.6403:

“You’ve placed too many sell orders, please wait a few minutes”.

Do you think I have all day to get this stuff sold on my inventory?

You have bots and hackers to thank for this. This prevents bots from selling items in mass before heading out into the game world to bot some more and to prevent hackers from selling everything on the account in like 2 mins.

Same reason why you may be muted in chat for saying the same thing over and over again. It prevents bots from mass spamming about selling gold.

bots might be their explanation for having it, but this implementation of bot-prevention is actually better for bots that people.
A person will sell 7 things, get the error, curse, go do other things, come back and hour later, sell 7 things, get the error curse, go do other things. 7 listings per hour.
A bot will be programmed to sell 6 things, wait 30 seconds, sell 6 things, wait 30 seconds, etc. 720 listings per hour. Also, why would a bot need to offload massive amounts at one time to begin with? There’s no reason it couldn’t be written like this: “gather this tree, sell 3 logs on the TP, gather this ore, sell 3 ore on the TP, etc.”

A better implementation would be to limit it to 1 listing every 2 seconds. So both bots and people would be limited to 1800 listings per hour.
Or, best of all would be to have no restrictions, but flag any account that lists 10 things in a second or 100 things in a minute, investigate, ban.

And hackers are not as pressed for time as you say. They already have control of the account, they don’t need to get in and out before they are noticed. It’s not like in the movies where they wrestle control away and take what they can before it’s wrestled back. at best, they have at least a day before the original owner contacts tech support and are confirmed to be the owners.

I sell numerous items every night at the end of my play session and I haven’t run into this because I don’t try to sell all of them in 20 SECONDS!!! It’s probably because I don’t sell to high bidder and I take a moment to set the price that will be more profitable than highest seller but will likely sell in 12-15 hours.

I’m betting you all think instant coffee and microwaved meals are too slow.

Mystic.5934:

joshc.3129:

Zenith.6403:

“You’ve placed too many sell orders, please wait a few minutes”.

Do you think I have all day to get this stuff sold on my inventory?

You have bots and hackers to thank for this. This prevents bots from selling items in mass before heading out into the game world to bot some more and to prevent hackers from selling everything on the account in like 2 mins.

Same reason why you may be muted in chat for saying the same thing over and over again. It prevents bots from mass spamming about selling gold.

bots might be their explanation for having it, but this implementation of bot-prevention is actually better for bots that people.
A person will sell 7 things, get the error, curse, go do other things, come back and hour later, sell 7 things, get the error curse, go do other things. 7 listings per hour.
A bot will be programmed to sell 6 things, wait 30 seconds, sell 6 things, wait 30 seconds, etc. 720 listings per hour. Also, why would a bot need to offload massive amounts at one time to begin with? There’s no reason it couldn’t be written like this: “gather this tree, sell 3 logs on the TP, gather this ore, sell 3 ore on the TP, etc.”

A better implementation would be to limit it to 1 listing every 2 seconds. So both bots and people would be limited to 1800 listings per hour.
Or, best of all would be to have no restrictions, but flag any account that lists 10 things in a second or 100 things in a minute, investigate, ban.

And hackers are not as pressed for time as you say. They already have control of the account, they don’t need to get in and out before they are noticed. It’s not like in the movies where they wrestle control away and take what they can before it’s wrestled back. at best, they have at least a day before the original owner contacts tech support and are confirmed to be the owners.

I have found a way around this restriction, it’s still a pain but just city hop. You go from DR after getting the message to say LA and you are allowed to sell again until the message pops up, then just city hop until you are done.

Behellagh.1468:

I sell numerous items every night at the end of my play session and I haven’t run into this because I don’t try to sell all of them in 20 SECONDS!!! It’s probably because I don’t sell to high bidder and I take a moment to set the price that will be more profitable than highest seller but will likely sell in 12-15 hours.

I’m betting you all think instant coffee and microwaved meals are too slow.

I run into this problem pretty much every time I want to sell dungeon trash loot on the TP.

Go to gnash blade mode, select the loot bag and then one click takes you to the sell screen. It’s efficient and fast, almost as fast as the old TP.

I suspect that the game just can’t handle the transactions.

joshc.3129:

Mystic.5934:

joshc.3129:

Zenith.6403:

“You’ve placed too many sell orders, please wait a few minutes”.

Do you think I have all day to get this stuff sold on my inventory?

You have bots and hackers to thank for this. This prevents bots from selling items in mass before heading out into the game world to bot some more and to prevent hackers from selling everything on the account in like 2 mins.

Same reason why you may be muted in chat for saying the same thing over and over again. It prevents bots from mass spamming about selling gold.

bots might be their explanation for having it, but this implementation of bot-prevention is actually better for bots that people.
A person will sell 7 things, get the error, curse, go do other things, come back and hour later, sell 7 things, get the error curse, go do other things. 7 listings per hour.
A bot will be programmed to sell 6 things, wait 30 seconds, sell 6 things, wait 30 seconds, etc. 720 listings per hour. Also, why would a bot need to offload massive amounts at one time to begin with? There’s no reason it couldn’t be written like this: “gather this tree, sell 3 logs on the TP, gather this ore, sell 3 ore on the TP, etc.”

A better implementation would be to limit it to 1 listing every 2 seconds. So both bots and people would be limited to 1800 listings per hour.
Or, best of all would be to have no restrictions, but flag any account that lists 10 things in a second or 100 things in a minute, investigate, ban.

And hackers are not as pressed for time as you say. They already have control of the account, they don’t need to get in and out before they are noticed. It’s not like in the movies where they wrestle control away and take what they can before it’s wrestled back. at best, they have at least a day before the original owner contacts tech support and are confirmed to be the owners.

I have found a way around this restriction, it’s still a pain but just city hop. You go from DR after getting the message to say LA and you are allowed to sell again until the message pops up, then just city hop until you are done.

From what I can tell, the limit is 7 items every ~20 seconds. I should test it exactly one of these days. Anyways, if you sell 7 things, you then have to wait until 20 seconds after the first thing you sold. So if it takes you 10 seconds to sell 7 things, then 10 seconds to change zones, then you won’t see the error. I’ll try this tonight to see if it actually does work or is just a way to consume time until you can sell again (once you get kitten, you’ll never go back)

the new TP is less likely to get the error simply because it takes longer to sell stuff. Used to be: click on item, click sell, click on item, click sell. Now it’s: click on item, click sell, click cancel, click on item, click sell, click cancel. 3 steps instead of 2 (or 4 instead of 3 if you want to change the price). It’s the same restriction.

the game can handle it. try buying a million things and it won’t even flinch.

Behellagh.1468:

I sell numerous items every night at the end of my play session and I haven’t run into this because I don’t try to sell all of them in 20 SECONDS!!! It’s probably because I don’t sell to high bidder and I take a moment to set the price that will be more profitable than highest seller but will likely sell in 12-15 hours.

I’m betting you all think instant coffee and microwaved meals are too slow.

I have run into this less than 5 times since the TP went live in September 2012. I buy and sell tons of items. I’m reasonably sure that I am quicker at it than most of my guildies.

So, while I’m sure this is happening to some people, I’m not sure the problem is that widespread. Even if I’m wrong, and it affects more than 0.5% of legit traders, it might be a reasonable trade-off, assuming it succeeds in slowing down gold sellers, botters, and account thieves.

Behellagh.1468:

I sell numerous items every night at the end of my play session and I haven’t run into this because I don’t try to sell all of them in 20 SECONDS!!! It’s probably because I don’t sell to high bidder and I take a moment to set the price that will be more profitable than highest seller but will likely sell in 12-15 hours.

Bully for you.

How you choose to sell your stuff is up to you; how I sell mine, is up to me. I’ll give thought to the higher-value stuff, but I’m quite happy to unload most of my low-value stuff to the highest bidder – because frankly, doing anything else is work rather than pleasure, and my active game play time is too valuable to me to waste agonising over squeezing a few more coppers out of dross (and in the time I’d spend doing that, if profit were my objective, I could earn far more in other ways anyway**). And, yes, I can rattle through the dross at one heck of a speed, deciding whether to vendor, salvage or BLTC it. So – if you want to play your way, I don’t have a problem with it; but please understand that your way is not the only one, and in this case, those of us who want to adopt a different strategy are impacted by an overly-aggressive bot limiter.

(**I have a friend who favours your approach. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with it, if that’s how you enjoy spending your time; but from a purely anecdotal point of view – I’m rather better at making gold than he is.)

None of which addresses the other scenario I described, by the way… I will, today, try to post on the BLTC, at competitive offer prices, a couple of thousand of each of various gatherables, acquired through salvage (salvage is something I can do with my brain turned off, whilst, say, watching something on the other screen) {1}. And I will hit the spurious “too many sell orders” error. The game makes me sell in batches, but already knows I’m repeating a previous sale, because it restores my sell options; there’s simply no reason to limit my sell speed.

{1} Edit: (Well – I thought I would; today, the market in the things I’m interested in has gone crazy, and i have far fewer than expected. That sort of thing happens. The point stands.

The difference in time is only a minute or two more to avoid being held up anyways by the sell limiter. It’s like speeding between stop lights versus going at a slower pace and making every green. Sure you don’t “feel” like it takes about the same amount of time but it is a lot less aggravating.

Behellagh.1468:

The difference in time is only a minute or two more to avoid being held up anyways by the sell limiter. It’s like speeding between stop lights versus going at a slower pace and making every green. Sure you don’t “feel” like it takes about the same amount of time but it is a lot less aggravating.

for fast sellers (ie, players who don’t dawdle or players who sell to lowest sell listing or highest buy order without fully researching price histories), that extra minute or two would only be the case if they would only have been there a minute or two if the limiter wasn’t there. it doesn’t increase 9 minutes to 10 minutes. it increases 1 minute to 3. or 2 to 5. Try selling a stack of all fine materials (48 stacks) and tell me that it’s fun for that to take 4 minutes instead of 1 (7 sales every 30 seconds vs. 1 sale every 2 seconds). Now do the same for rare. and gems. and food. 16 minutes instead of 4. maybe half of them have two stacks. 24 minutes instead of 6. Myself included, some people just go through there collections every now and then and sell everything they don’t use. When I sell on the TP, more than half of my time is spent staring off into space.
your analogy is only true if there is a red light every 100 feet. if you’re only traveling less than 200 feet, you wouldn’t care. if you’re trying to commute 20 miles to work every morning, that would take you longer to get there than how long you would spend at work.

Posting 250 stacks should be punished harder then selling inventory green weapon singular drops. But the way it’s handled, selling 10*250 stack, is just as hard punished as, selling 10 green 1h sword. That should not be case. 10 differert named 1h sword, but with similar price (2 silver), should not engage this anti bot feature. 10*250 is way more likely to be a bot attempt, and I understand locking that, completely. (I recently sold stacks of candy corn, and tbh here i didn’t mind (although it’s still annoying), the anti bot feature.

But for straight weapon drops from mobs, that cannot be crafted, there should be no tp anti bot feature, or at least much less severe punishing then stack selling. At the moment it’s poorly implemented, (poor balance between mass sellers and single drop sellers).

How many people are affected by this? How many botters are slowed down by the current mechanic? And what other features or bugfixes get left out of future builds to work on tweaking this?

I am sure it’s very annoying to suffer this on a daily basis, but I don’t see anything posted so far that suggests it affects more than a tiny fraction of players. Plenty of others deal in multiple transactions over short periods and don’t seem to be slowed down.

I suspect that ANet is balancing the needs of the many vs the comforts of a few.

I still say their anti-bot reason is a smoke screen. It’s easy for players to accept than saying they didn’t want to stress the database handling the TP.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

How many people are affected by this? How many botters are slowed down by the current mechanic? And what other features or bugfixes get left out of future builds to work on tweaking this?

I am sure it’s very annoying to suffer this on a daily basis, but I don’t see anything posted so far that suggests it affects more than a tiny fraction of players. Plenty of others deal in multiple transactions over short periods and don’t seem to be slowed down.

I suspect that ANet is balancing the needs of the many vs the comforts of a few.

1) Based solely on forum responses to these posts, I estimate 1/3 see it all the time, 1/3 see it occasionally, and 1/3 never see it. But those responses are skewed by this topic (this topic attracts people who are more affected), so let’s adjust: 1/6 see it all the time, 1/3 see it occasionally, 1/2 never see it. I would also assume that the people who don’t post on these forums are more likely to not be power TP users, so I would say among all players: 1/12 see it all the time, 1/3 see it occasionally, 7/12 never see it. 1/12 of a million people is 83,333.
2) I have no idea how many bots are actually affected, but because of how easy it is for a bot to get around the limit, I would guess zero. (sell 6, wait, sell 6, wait, sell 6, wait, sell 6, wait).
bots aren’t some magical thing where they gather thousands of ori ore a minute. They are a regular character, controlled by a computer, to collect stuff for their owner. It’s just a computer that enters a series of keystrokes. They have the same harvesting rate that you do. All they have to do to completely get around the TP limit is, once a minute, sell 6 things. and it takes them less than a second. Then they continue gathering.
Or, if the owner of that bot was lazy and didn’t make one that can list things, they just spend 5 minutes a day manually selling everything from the 20 computers they are running, using only one keyboard, multiple accounts following the keystrokes. the limit is account-bound, and every bot has it’s own account, so it would be easy to sell 20 stacks in a couple minutes, multiplied by 20 computers.

World boss runs, if I don’t sell after each boss I can hit it quite quickly even if I’m selling for a price on some rather than just sell it fast and move on.

BTW, once you hit the limit, count to 20 and you’re good to go again.