Guild Wars 2

Well, not really much to say, why I have to pay for selling my stuff? I read somewhere that the selling fee and listing fee are meant in wich sellers wont keep lowering the prices of an item because they have to pay for each listing. If those are the reasons why dont you fees on removing transictions, instead of placing them? so if you sell an item its all your gain, if you wanna sell it before someone who listed it at low price than your you pay for removing and listing it again. that will be waaaay better than the actual, nonsense, method imo.

It’s to avoid people from using the TP as a storage.

You could easily set a sell order at 9999g and no one would buy whatever it is that you’re selling.

And from a lore standpoint, you’re not paying for you selling your stuff. You’re paying for the army of accountants, couriers, shippers, marketers, and administrators to sell your stuff for you… with a bit left over for the shareholders.

I would personally prefer that the limit of items “for sale” just be set to 10 stacks, or something like that.

But I’m not super unhappy with the current system or anything.

It really does seem like they are trying to promote “not selling” anything. 15% fee to trade with other players where only the seller loses money. Tons of things being soulbound or account bound on aquire. Everything being soulbound on equip.

Makes me feel like everything I’m doing is throwing my ingame money away.

Sure people can make money off the trading post, but only because it’s a trading post. If people just traded with other people, you wouldn’t have so many people messing with the prices of items.

I don’t have any real solution to offer of course. Just generally noting that I’m not super happy with it, but I’ll continue to cope.

Let’s not forget gold sink.

LeX.8607:

Well, not really much to say, why I have to pay for selling my stuff? I read somewhere that the selling fee and listing fee are meant in wich sellers wont keep lowering the prices of an item because they have to pay for each listing. If those are the reasons why dont you fees on removing transictions, instead of placing them? so if you sell an item its all your gain, if you wanna sell it before someone who listed it at low price than your you pay for removing and listing it again. that will be waaaay better than the actual, nonsense, method imo.

The Black Lion Trading company is a company. Your use of the outpost is a use of their service. That’s why you are charged.

It’s no different in the real world using 3rd party sites like amazon or a consignment store.

Problem is, there’s no alternative option if you wish to trade outside the TP.

Mail doesn’t count as there is no protection there for the buyer or the seller.

Lack of a way to trade outside of the TP is a major flaw.

evo.8640:

Problem is, there’s no alternative option if you wish to trade outside the TP.

Mail doesn’t count as there is no protection there for the buyer or the seller.

Lack of a way to trade outside of the TP is a major flaw.

Why is it a major flaw?

The only useful thing that it disallows is selling items to people you know for cheaper than the TP. And honestly, considering that the result of not having player-to-player trading is the complete extinction of WTS/WTB spammage and scamming, it’s totally worth it.

You can’t scam with a trade window that requires acceptance from both parties before the trade is completed.

If Party A miss clicks the wrong item or hits “okay” before their intention than that is by their own fault. Much like purchasing the wrong item.

There was floods of wts/wtb in map chat when the game first came out but when people realized there was no protection set in place for either party it came to a sudden halt as everyone was getting scammed. Something much like WoW’s trade is more than acceptable and should be implemented.

I think players should realize they have far more to worry about with the current state of affairs regarding the TP, manipulation and market cornering, than if their map chat (which they can filter) gets filled up by spam.

evo.8640:

You can’t scam with a trade window that requires acceptance from both parties before the trade is completed.

Oh, there’s plenty of ways to do it. You could use items that have the same icon and swap the item with a good timing. Doesn’t seem like it would work, but it does. Used to be a pretty big complaint in Diablo 2 back in the day.

If Party A miss clicks the wrong item or hits “okay” before their intention than that is by their own fault. Much like purchasing the wrong item.

Doesn’t matter who’s fault it is, it’s still an existing and very serious problem. And the only way to combat it is to have every single item that is essentially different, to have different icons. And obviously this is not going to happen in GW2, as it would require every stat combination on one armor to have its own unique icon. Could probably be done by adding color tints to the icons, though.

I think players should realize they have far more to worry about with the current state of affairs regarding the TP, manipulation and market cornering, than if their map chat (which they can filter) gets filled up by spam.

Honestly, all of those things are irrelevant to the regular player. Prices rising on certain items is only going to hurt you if you’re going for an MF exotic or a Legendary. And as you put it, going for those is the player’s choice, so they’re at fault, right?

And again, why is it a major flaw not to have player-to-player trading?

Think of ebay.. simples

Because else you would get rich to quick

Olba.5376:

Oh, there’s plenty of ways to do it. You could use items that have the same icon and swap the item with a good timing. Doesn’t seem like it would work, but it does. Used to be a pretty big complaint in Diablo 2 back in the day.

Doesn’t matter who’s fault it is, it’s still an existing and very serious problem. And the only way to combat it is to have every single item that is essentially different, to have different icons. And obviously this is not going to happen in GW2, as it would require every stat combination on one armor to have its own unique icon. Could probably be done by adding color tints to the icons, though.

Honestly, all of those things are irrelevant to the regular player. Prices rising on certain items is only going to hurt you if you’re going for an MF exotic or a Legendary. And as you put it, going for those is the player’s choice, so they’re at fault, right?

And again, why is it a major flaw not to have player-to-player trading?

If a player doesn’t hover an item they are trading for to see that it’s not the correct item, they deserve to be scammed. That’s no excuse at all and no defense on your part.

Why was it that scamming was extremely low / almost unheard of in private trades in WoW, Rift, Aion, SWToR, Tera, etc. using the dual party accept trade window? Could it be that both parties were identifying that they were going to receive the correct item instead of “I trust this bro kitten #8221; and hitting trade/okay before hovering over the item they are trading for? Referencing Diablo 2 is nice an all, but it didn’t have any protection put in place. The trade window was still activated even if an item was swapped out. Not so for the other games I listed above.

Market manipulation is far from irrelevant for the vast player base. Do you think precursors are some of the only manipulated items? Have you checked dye prices in the last two months? There’s no need to control or manipulate items that don’t have an acceptable demand currently. That will change with the games age. But most dyes (as an example) are something that universally everyone collects with devote intention or whimsically. And almost always their current colors come off the TP rather than that random dropped unidentified.

Of course since everything is based off of looks the always failed argument is -they don’t need it, they can use something else- but that doesn’t jive with everyone and certainly no demographic when there’s no way to validate such a claim that such things don’t effect everyone. If anything, I’d say most players do realize that manipulation has bigger implications than simply what they are going to buy now or later simply for no other reason than TP barons will eventually seek to control less niche parts of the market.

It’s a major flaw because there is only one sanctioned avenue for trade. That’s called a monopoly. And it forces a user to either use it or use nothing at all. For a game that touts having a “free market”, that one little detail takes a kitten all over that false nicety.

I think Evo is confusing what a monopoly is. A monopoly is a single seller of goods. The Trading Post is a structured tool that helps to facilitate trade between players. And by using this tool, there are fees involved. If you don’t like the fees, you are free to trade directly via the mail system, but at your own risk.

I can understand certain players’ frustrations. There is a lot of hatred and jealousy in this game when it comes to owning big shiny things, or the ability to do well in the economy. Smart people made a lot of money, and thus became that 1% so many others hate. But honestly, we shouldn’t be mad that these people are successful. I’m really jealous of people who were able to read market trends, and stockpile T6s mats before the prices skyrocketed. In an earlier post, I had laid out the reasons why prices started to increase, but at the same time, I failed to take advantage of the situation. The result, I only bought a few good stuff when I should have bought many.

One last thing. A “free market” isn’t where all things are free. It means that prices on goods in this economy are based on Supply and Demand, with free competition between sellers. And yes, if you know how to manipulate Supply, you can make money. That’s one of the downsides to having a free market that isn’t regulated by the government (or in this case, Anet).

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I think Evo is confusing what a monopoly is. A monopoly is a single seller of goods. The Trading Post is a structured tool that helps to facilitate trade between players. And by using this tool, there are fees involved. If you don’t like the fees, you are free to trade directly via the mail system, but at your own risk.

I can understand certain players’ frustrations. There is a lot of hatred and jealousy in this game when it comes to owning big shiny things, or the ability to do well in the economy. Smart people made a lot of money, and thus became that 1% so many others hate. But honestly, we shouldn’t be mad that these people are successful. I’m really jealous of people who were able to read market trends, and stockpile T6s mats before the prices skyrocketed. In an earlier post, I had laid out the reasons why prices started to increase, but at the same time, I failed to take advantage of the situation. The result, I only bought a few good stuff when I should have bought many.

One last thing. A “free market” isn’t where all things are free. It means that prices on goods in this economy are based on Supply and Demand, with free competition between sellers. And yes, if you know how to manipulate Supply, you can make money. That’s one of the downsides to having a free market that isn’t regulated by the government (or in this case, Anet).

A monopoly isn’t a term that is simply limited to define a business supplier’s control, lack of competition or ability to envelope or destroy competition. But to describe control held solely or by majority from a single entity.

In this case: Anet’s TP. What I was speaking for was being in favor of giving players more safe options than just one. When players have more options, every one wins.

Being forced with no other avenue but the TP to sell items is much like taking away the ability to conduct a private sale in real life and only limit a person to selling their items that they no longer want on say Amazon, with no other place or means to do so but Amazon. This is the span of control and thus makes their control over transactions a monopoly.

I’m perfectly fine with market manipulation and cornering. I wouldn’t be electronically financially sound and set to buy anything I like if such a “free market” didn’t allow it. And in real life, I’m not a OWS guy. Quite the opposite.

However, I still stand in the corner that’s for giving players more options than one narrow avenue to conduct safe trade.

evo.8640:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I think Evo is confusing what a monopoly is. A monopoly is a single seller of goods. The Trading Post is a structured tool that helps to facilitate trade between players. And by using this tool, there are fees involved. If you don’t like the fees, you are free to trade directly via the mail system, but at your own risk.

I can understand certain players’ frustrations. There is a lot of hatred and jealousy in this game when it comes to owning big shiny things, or the ability to do well in the economy. Smart people made a lot of money, and thus became that 1% so many others hate. But honestly, we shouldn’t be mad that these people are successful. I’m really jealous of people who were able to read market trends, and stockpile T6s mats before the prices skyrocketed. In an earlier post, I had laid out the reasons why prices started to increase, but at the same time, I failed to take advantage of the situation. The result, I only bought a few good stuff when I should have bought many.

One last thing. A “free market” isn’t where all things are free. It means that prices on goods in this economy are based on Supply and Demand, with free competition between sellers. And yes, if you know how to manipulate Supply, you can make money. That’s one of the downsides to having a free market that isn’t regulated by the government (or in this case, Anet).

A monopoly isn’t a term that is simply limited to define a business supplier’s control, lack of competition or ability to envelope or destroy competition. But to describe control held solely or by majority from a single entity.

In this case: Anet’s TP. What I was speaking for was being in favor of giving players more safe options than just one. When players have more options, every one wins.

Being forced with no other avenue but the TP to sell items is much like taking away the ability to conduct a private sale in real life and only limit a person to selling their items that they no longer want on say Amazon, with no other place or means to do so but Amazon. This is the span of control and thus makes their control over transactions a monopoly.

I’m perfectly fine with market manipulation and cornering. I wouldn’t be electronically financially sound and set to buy anything I like if such a “free market” didn’t allow it. And in real life, I’m not a OWS guy. Quite the opposite.

However, I still stand in the corner that’s for giving players more options than one narrow avenue to conduct safe trade.

Don’t use the term “monopoly” so loosely that it applies to the economy. With your thinking, Anet has a monopoly on Guild Wars players. You can’t play Guild Wars with any other game company’s client, thus they have sole control. It’s like saying the Ocean is blue, the Sky is blue, so the Ocean is the Sky.

No one is forced to use the TP. You can still make private transactions like in real life. And as with real life, you do so at your own risk. The tools on the TP make trades safer, quicker, and simpler. You want “Item A” for X coins? Do a search and find it. If it’s not a price you want, place a Buy Order and allow others to fill it. Sellers who want the convenience of this tool just pays fees from the listing of the item, and the final sale price.

Think of the TP like a Farmer’s Market, or Swap Meet. Sellers pay a fee to have access to the area, and Buyers roam around looking for deals.