Guild Wars 2

I like the idea behind Legendary items, and I’m happy to see that the majority of ingredients don’t really require people to grind, just to play the game normally (or grind if you want them RIGHT NOW). However, there is one thing that annoys me: Legendaries give an incentive for people to play mostly one character, instead of playing equally between multiple characters.

I think that something that takes as much effort to be done with multiple characters as to be done with a single character should give the same reward for both playstyles. Currently, some of the ingredients required for Legendaries don’t follow this idea. For example:

• Obsidian Shards are soulbound. A Legendary requires 250 of them, and they only available by being bought with Karma, at 2.100 for each. In other words, this ingredient requires someone to earn 525.000 Karma with a single character. Since it’s not really easier to get Karma by playing with multiple characters, as opposed to playing with a single character, players who use multiple characters are punished here – they would need to play a lot with a single character to get the Karma for the Shards. ArenaNet could have fixed this by making the Obsidian Shards account bound instead of soulbound, but for some reason they chose to not do so.
• Dungeon tokens are soulbound, not account bound. Since Legendaries usually require 500 of a given dungeon token, this means they require someone to play with the same character multiple times through the same dungeon. Someone who plays with multiple characters is going to end at a loss, even if it’s as hard to do a dungeon’s explorable mode multiple times with a single character as opposed to with multiple characters.
• Map completition is linked to a single character, as well. I have explored the Charr lands with my Charr, the Norn lands with my Norn, and etc. This is as hard as exploring those areas with the same character, yet 100% map completition with a single character rewards two Gifts of Exploration, required for Legendaries; meanwhile, doing the same thing – exploring the entire world – with multiple characters doesn’t give that kind of reward.

Is someone else bothered by this, or am I alone in this concern?

You can earn a lot of karma via World vs. World, fairly fast too. Personally I don’t mind that it’s soulbound. I’m only going to go for a weapon that my profession can use so there is no need for me to use other characters, unless I made, say 2 Warriors.

Karma would be better if it was account wide but I don’t think it’s necessary.

All in all, I think it makes the legendary weapons even more legendary because they are harder to get.

Legendaries aren’t supposed to be easier to get. Forcing all these things to be done on one character means that the resulting legendary is something earned and achieved by that character alone. The legendaries aren’t account bound, so why should the components be.

But Crake, I may be fairly useful with my ranger but be completely dire with my mesmer. I am the same player but using a different character that suits my style of play. Why should I be punished for wanting to outfit my alts that I don’t play as often? I am still doing the work but on a character I am much more effective with. Account bound stops me selling items which is fine but Soulbound is unfair to players, the armor and weapons and armor are already level based so you can’t exactly farm high level gear for your characters.

None of the above suggestions actually make it any easier. They simply allow the same tasks to be completed across a variety of characters, thereby making the player’s gaming experience more varied. I’m very much for this when it comes to the dungeons and obby shards.

I think map completion should still be tied to one character, though I don’t really have a reason that counters the logic of my previous statement >_> <_< This was very much the same in Guild Wars, eventually if you were chasing the GWAMM title you would have to pick one toon on which to do all the Cartography and Vanquisher titles (exploration).

I don’t see exploration on only one toon as “dull” as repeating a dungeon 30 times. Many people seem to like having one character that gets 100%-max-level-all-achievements-epicness-uber-leetsauce and then have a bunch of alts that they’re not too fussed about beyond variation in play-style and what they can use them for to fuel their uber-leetsauce toon.

The developers have to provide something worthwhile for you to “chase” with a single character. Different games handle this differently, but without certain difficult-to-achieve goals towards the end of the game, playing alts becomes all there is to do.

You may not agree with the design, and your arguments that it could be implemented in such a way that it works across multiple characters hold merit, but it is common to have activities in the endgame that encourage investment in a single character.

Bear in mind that the legendary system is completely optional.

I understand where you’re coming from but I feel that the soulbound Obsidian Shards required to make Legendary items should remain so. It adds to the difficulty and makes Legendaries worth that much more. However they could ease the grind by allowing multiple ways to get these Obsidian Shards. For example instead of just karma they could allow you the option to buy them with skill points at a suitable price.

As for the dungeon tokens, I’m totally for it. Again, allowing multiple characters to earn tokens across the entire account allows players a more diverse experience in each dungeon and may encourage players to take on more of the structured PvE content. I mean, I could be farming Twilight Arbor Explorable all day and being able to hop between two of my characters would most definitely be more interesting than just one (TA because that Nightmare set looks awesome!). In the end I’m still putting in the same amount of work, just with two different characters. I would still need to earn 390 tokens for both characters if I plan to get more than one Nightmare Greatsword or Staff, I would just be having more fun. Fingers crossed.

Thats like asking for raiding with your main character, and getting gear for your alts.

I’m not bothered at all
Everything should be soulbound
Especially dungeon tokens
I mean I run AC on my main and my alt can get full gear? I can’t agree with that

You aren’t punished. You are making a choice. You can choice to play multiple characters and then yes it will take you longer obviously.

You can choose to play multiple characters
You can choose not to get a legendary

Either way you arent being punished you are making the choice

Every single thing earned by one toon should remain on that toon period. I understand ingrediants and mats and the like cause you can just trade them anyway

Crake.5827:

Legendaries aren’t supposed to be easier to get. Forcing all these things to be done on one character means that the resulting legendary is something earned and achieved by that character alone. The legendaries aren’t account bound, so why should the components be.

All the legendary components apart from what the OP listed ARE account bound. These are the exceptions to the rule which need to be fixed.

mangarrage.1062:

I’m not bothered at all
Everything should be soulbound
Especially dungeon tokens
I mean I run AC on my main and my alt can get full gear? I can’t agree with that

why? just explain me why. I still need to grind those tokens the same amount of time.

Chumsy.5714:

Thats like asking for raiding with your main character, and getting gear for your alts.

What would be wrong with that?

Only thing I remotely agree with from the OP is the karma, as I think you need more than just 525k. Even then it would kinda go against what legendary weapons represent.

We’re only talking legendary weapons here, and they are appearance only. A status symbol that show how much time and effort you’ve put into one character (the character holding it). While I see the concern of equal effort to achieve those things regardless of character used and technically the under geared alt those things are harder. It’s not fitting with what’s been put to the test in order to acquire a legendary weapon.

Hitting low level starter zones with a scaled down geared level 80 also takes about an hour or less to get to 100% if you’re already familiar with it and don’t get side tracked by jumping puzzles. Knowledge and familiarity gained on an alt still benefit your main when it comes to this. Granted I was 100% map completion before I started letting myself play alts.

Also if map exploration was account bound it means you get a maximum possibility of 2 legendary weapons ever. If I’m still playing in a year and playing a lot, I don’t know about you but I’d like to have an awesome array of weapons to bling up on my main, or a legendary for a few characters if I get really attached to some alts and want to go through it all a few times between now and when I stop playing.

Dungeon tokens afaik are getting made account bound anyway, but are probably one of the easiest requirements. Granted some explorables are faster to clear than others. I think the main reason for this change is more to give high level players something to do with the tokens when that character doesn’t want anything offered. Not sure if making them account bound vs some sort of converter or mystic forge fun and games is the right option, but still it will just make alts easier to gear/look good, won’t make us good at playing that class. Not like stats are better than crafted.

Every component represents an investment into an aspect of the game, the legendary then shows you’ve done it all, on that character.

I do hope gifts are/remain account bound, but if I need to drop huntsman/leatherworker and max out armoursmith and jeweller (despite having them on alts) to get Twilight, then it’s just another thing I need to do.

Right now clovers (and as a result karma) and lodestones are the main bottleneck I see.

I’m mostly concerned that this means you will only be able to unlock two or so legendaries per account. As opposed to potentially being able to craft all of them. Also I kind of feel like they should be account bound, especially if you can only get up to 1 or 2 per alt (if that many??) This system does seem designed to punish players who are playing more than one character. It should be ‘punishment’ enough to have to grind up all the mats for however many of the weapons you’re wanting to craft. I mean, the list of requirements isn’t exactly meager.

>Kira

Did you even read the post right before yours? The one from a Dev?

LinseyMurdock.4165:

Obsidian Shards and dungeon tokens are both Account Bound now. (We are fixing the issue with existing items not being converted to Account Bound)

Thanks Linsey, this is a very big help :-)

Smooth Penguin.5294:

>Kira

Did you even read the post right before yours? The one from a Dev?

Yes, I did, and that doesn’t refer to the thing I was worried about. Which, admittedly I didn’t clarify well. I’m referring to the world explorer thing, from what it sounded like you can only get the reward from that once?? If I misunderstood that I am super-thrilled. Also are the legendaries, when crafted and equipped, soul bound or account bound, because that’s also a worry.

Currently they are soulbound. Account bound would be much better imo.

I feel like the game system is designed to encourage alts.

Okay, here’s my view. Alts are a choice that allow you to vary your experience in the game and have fun in more ways than you could with one character. I don’t believe that the Legendary crafting system ever punished alts. It’s not punishing to make you work on a character to get difficult to obtain end game gear, that’s the point of the gear. Working on two characters makes it easier, but making you do it with only one is not punishing to people who play alts, it just means that it will take longer which it should because you are not attempting to work towards the goal of Legendary Weapon on your main character as often as people with only one.

I have alts, but my main is much higher level than my alts. I don’t have a Legendary yet, but I’m okay with that. It’s my fault that I don’t yet have one. I could have had one if I had focused my main and not created a Guardian so early in my playing experience, it was a choice I made. I gave up having a Legendary right now and playing other characters later for playing other characters now and having a Legendary later. This is a viable tradeoff and should not be seen as punishing. If you want a Legendary you should have to work for it which is exactly what they were doing before.

I don’t mind the changes made, they make it easier to obtain a Legendary, but I don’t think that it was a change that HAD to be made to balance anything or make anything more fair. This is all my opinion and is in no way meant to bash or flame anyone, I’m sorry if you do not agree but I just wanted to share my thoughts.

Honestly, the more systems and content added to incentivize playing a single character the better.

There’s nothing wrong with playing alts, but something that has stuck in my craw for a really long time in MMOs is the concept of “expansion” content often resulting in a larger proportion of “roll a new character!” than “Here’s stuff to do with your current one!”

Alts should always be a player choice. If I want to play something else I should have the option to do so. However, our characters in MMOs are supposed to exist in living breathing worlds. When those characters are forced in to a more limited “shelf life” in order to expand the breadth of content for new characters I find it’s a very sad thing.

GW1 did a great job with expanding content through the multiclassing system. Every campaign gave you not the only ability to roll a few new classes, but gave you a huge amount of profitable ground to discover on characters you’d already played, as well as unlocking two new secondary classes with literally hundreds of skills.

GW2 does a great job with its level adjustment system, which has the effect of making every area of the game somewhat fun and useful for existing characters, while providing an extremely variant experience for alts.

The recent changes to a lot of soulbound stuff was a good move for alts, but the concept that anything should be easier (or just as easy) to achieve via rolling more characters than playing a single character is a harmful one.

Alts should be a choice a player makes because he enjoys playing alts, not a choice he makes because he feels it is a systemic imperative in order to get things done (especially things that will ultimately benefit only one character)

Thus I view any post with “this is unfair to players who play a lot of characters” with a lot of skepticism. I don’t want to see a game in which players feel compelled by necessity to roll characters they may not actually want or like to play in order to efficiently get things for the characters they do like to play.

If you’re playing alts on a fairly equal schedule, why are you worried about legendary crafting at all? its a long term goal that can only benefit a single character and as such its perfectly reasonable that it must be achieved by a single character. If you play that many alts that equally, why are you doing it? I’d guess you’re doing it because you enjoy playing different characters. You made that choice and you’re not complaining that it takes longer to level all of them up to 80, or that it costs more to equip all of them with nice exotics are you?

Asking for legendaries to become a sort of “all my characters” achievement is like asking for experience to apply to all characters on your account no matter who earns it. Its not a currency, its a single item usable by a single character, and its intended as a long term goal for a single character. If you prefer to use alts to help that goal along that’s fine, but realize that at least part of any “legendary” or “epic” achievement by nature needs to reflect intense effort by its holder alone.