Guild Wars 2

elderan.2638:

Still waiting for someone from Anet to answer my question about mystic forge stones. If I put in 3 level 80 rares or 3 level 80 exotics along with a mystic forge stone do I have a chance of getting a legendary precursor?

Probably not, a screenshot of a PM from a dev is floating around, where the dev confirms there are NO OTHER RECIPES that yield precursors, aside from the combining of 4 weapons.

Anet wants you to do this (45mins of 700+ tries, all failed):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Bu8iK7CUk4

Because they’re a bunch of hypocrites/liars that want to entice you into buying gems with dollars after getting shredded by their Korean RNG. Korean RNG is Korean. Anet is Korean. I guess we all should’ve seen this coming, fooled us, shame on us.

Slic.2406:

Korean RNG is Korean. Anet is Korean. I guess we all should’ve seen this coming, fooled us, shame on us.

Actually Anet isn’t Korean, they’re based in Seattle. NCSoft is Korean, but they’re not the actual game devs.

Hellkaiser.6025:

@above, the kitten and play argument, doesn’t work in a game wherein there is an economy and a player market where it can be manipulated and exploited.

Anyways, the so called “legendary” weapons are in fact “legen-dairy” as all they prove is you can farm, waste time and gold and of course grind repeatedly to play the RNG
They command little to no respect from other players because as someone claimed before, and rightly so. There is little or no aspects of skill involved in crafting a legendairy weapon

Did you poll the entire player base to come to the conclusion that people who make legendaries get little to no respect?

People said the same thing about CoF armor yet I get asked daily where I got my armor and weapons.

Please note I didn’t get them because I wanted the attention, it’s actually kind of annoying. I got them because I like them.

Harbinger.8637:

Just started trying shields and can’t complain so far. I’m going to keep trying these because the cheapest rare shield is only 15s and I haven’t seen The Chosen on the TP.

32 rares= 5 rares and 2 exotics.

This is confusing. Shouldn’t you have received 8 if you put 32 in?

I didn’t keep track of how many greatswords I threw in but I did both rares and exotics from the trading post and got 3x dusk and 2x dusk

from when I started keeping track

90 batches of 50 rare dagger (about 1450+ attempts by throwing resulting weapons back in) to get 2x spark

I’ve also been doing 1 batch of 16 exotic guns each day that I get from the trading for the past 5 days, have so far gotten 2x The Hunter I also got 2x super hyper beam alpha and 1x Charrzooka that I sold instead of throwing back in

Cerise.9045:

I didn’t keep track of how many greatswords I threw in but I did both rares and exotics from the trading post and got 3x dusk and 2x dusk

Any idea roughly which you used more of?

Also, that’s a lot of dusk. I wonder if that’s actually got a higher chance than dawn, or you were just lucky (or unlucky, whichever).

450 G worth of crafted rares – 1 Dawn (probably over 4000 rares, no dawns, exotics combined into a dusk).

omfg its anet third reich from the sun!
They really need a set formula…
everyone knows computer random gens even seeded are bumkis.

The above is a jest

I think my next medal will be 10k WvW kills, I’m at 7k right now

LameFox.6349:

Cerise.9045:

I didn’t keep track of how many greatswords I threw in but I did both rares and exotics from the trading post and got 3x dusk and 2x dusk

Any idea roughly which you used more of?

Also, that’s a lot of dusk. I wonder if that’s actually got a higher chance than dawn, or you were just lucky (or unlucky, whichever).

I just bought all the rares and exotics off the trading post that were available, then if I got more exotics from the rares I used them.

All 5 greatsword bases came from a combination of 4 exotics gotten from other exotics or rares. There is a chance to get a base weapon right away from 4 rares but it’s one in a gazillion and I’ve never had it happen to me personally.

I only throw in exotics trying to get the base weapons anymore.

This requires a large starting capital to absorb bad luck streaks, but it’s way more profitable in the end.

I value random exotics at 2g(on average you get a bit less from them but making a small loss is ok)
From my data I’m getting 1 exotic for every 9 tries on average, that’s 28 rares, means you need rares for around 7 silver if you want to break even on getting exotics unless you hit the jackpot.

As for exotics the odds to get the base weapons seems to vary a lot per weapon type but as a rough estimate I would say about on in 25-30 attempts nets a base weapon so the average money spent on cheap exotics to before a base weapon is about 50 gold. I made a list of exotics that I can consistently get buy orders filled on so I have some good attempts at a base weapon each day.

Slic.2406:

Probably not, a screenshot of a PM from a dev is floating around, where the dev confirms there are NO OTHER RECIPES that yield precursors, aside from the combining of 4 weapons.

I’ve gotten level 80 named exotics of many varieties using forge stones, it seems strange they would single out precursors as something you couldn’t get.

Because they’re a bunch of hypocrites/liars that want to entice you into buying gems with dollars after getting shredded by their Korean RNG. Korean RNG is Korean. Anet is Korean. I guess we all should’ve seen this coming, fooled us, shame on us.

Mystic forge stones are bought from the gem store, so I’m not sure I get your meaning.

On another note, anyone know if precursors can come from 4 random weapons? Or does it have to be, say, 4 daggers to have a chance at the dagger precursor?

@Cerise
The problem is what works for you doesn’t work for everyone else – such is the problem with RNG. My fiancée has put over 200 exotics in and got no base out so far which is 100% more than your estimate and still climbing.

Ouch, that really hurts.

As far as money making go, this is very effective, the odds are in your favor. But it’s still gambling. And you never gamble with money you can’t afford to lose.

Rainshine.5493:

Slic.2406:

Korean RNG is Korean. Anet is Korean. I guess we all should’ve seen this coming, fooled us, shame on us.

Actually Anet isn’t Korean, they’re based in Seattle. NCSoft is Korean, but they’re not the actual game devs.

Yeah, I know. Could’ve fooled me. It’s like NCSoft 2.0. Which is why I said teh apple doesn’t fall far from the tree…

elderan.2638:

Mystic forge stones are bought from the gem store, so I’m not sure I get your meaning.

On another note, anyone know if precursors can come from 4 random weapons? Or does it have to be, say, 4 daggers to have a chance at the dagger precursor?

It has to be 4 of the same weapon type, for that precursor type. And, I repeat for the millionth time, it seems to be about a 0.1% probability or lower, when I count dozens of players that have spend over 500 tries (4 weapons each try) and gotten nothing.

200 exotics is “40 attempts”, I’d like to point out.

Actually, 200 exotics gets you around 66 attempts.

@LameFox

Yeah I messed up in my post, but this thread won’t let me edit so I didn’t fix it.

Now 40 rares= 7 rares and 3 exotic.

Colbear.6425:

200 exotics is “40 attempts”, I’d like to point out.

Your math is bad – 200 /4 = 50 plus you get another 50 weapons from those attempts which is a further 12 (with 2 left over) which gives you in turn another 3 attempts (with 3 left over plus the previous 2 left over gives you 1 more attempt).

In total 66 attempts.

Mystic Forge Attempts for Pre-Legendary
Lvl 80 GS : Rare: 8; Exotic: 0 – Dusk: 1 | Dawn: 0

Yes, if you want a dawn/dusk, you better put in 4 rare/exotic greatswords. If you use the mystic forge stone you can still get a precursor, however since the stone acts as a substitute, the item you get back will be random in type.

Just my 2 cents.. but:

I just wish legendaries had that GW1 feel to achieving them.
When I say that, I mean, think about your hall of monuments.
You had the opportunity to get a full 50/50 HoM if you wanted it and worked hard for it.
A 50/50 HoM was one of the ultimate things to have in the game.
There was no RNG about it.
You put in the effort, you were rewarded for your time.
Not your prowess on the trade broker.
Not your RNG luck.
Not your ability to make youtube videos or get guildies and/or fans to hold ‘farming events’ for you.
Not your IRL money situation.

Would it not be better if legendaries were achievable in a way that was the same amount of effort for everyone?

Make them hard, for sure.

But why should one person get their precursor on the 1st try of the mystic forge and another get it on the 90th try?

Why should one person need put in hundreds of hours while another may only put in 50?

Perhaps getting a legendary should be focused more on the effort and time of the player and less on their luck.

I do not have a solution, only I do not agree with the random number generation part of this weapon achievement. When I see someone with a legendary I don’t really think ‘wow they must be a really dedicated player.’
I think more along the lines of ‘They must have been really lucky, and/or got in on buying the precursors early on the trade broker.’

There are four people in my guild with legendaries. All four bought their precursor from the TP for under 100g before the nerf.

Slic.2406:

It has to be 4 of the same weapon type, for that precursor type. And, I repeat for the millionth time, it seems to be about a 0.1% probability or lower, when I count dozens of players that have spend over 500 tries (4 weapons each try) and gotten nothing.

Celestea.4105:

Yes, if you want a dawn/dusk, you better put in 4 rare/exotic greatswords. If you use the mystic forge stone you can still get a precursor, however since the stone acts as a substitute, the item you get back will be random in type.

There seems to be differing opinions on whether or not it’s possible. Keep in mind I’m not talking about getting a specific precursor, when using 4 random weapons or 3 random weapons and a forge stone I know it’s going to spit out a random weapon. The question is can it spit out a random precursor?

Yes elderan, I have a guild member who put 3 exotic warhorns+ a mystic forge stone and got “The Legend”.

Shawashirya.6825:

Mystic Forge Attempts for Pre-Legendary
Lvl 80 GS : Rare: 8; Exotic: 0 – Dusk: 1 | Dawn: 0

wow nice dude at what time did u get it?

Just going to say aside from all the hatred in this thread,

I love legendaries how they are, in fact I wish they’d remove 100% map completion from them and up how much gold they cost. I hate having to do things that are ungodly frustrating (like vistas -_-) to get an item. However I don’t mind having to pay ungodly amounts of gold.

You did a really good job bringing back the old MMORPG feel where things take forever to achieve and actually acquiring them is an accomplishment. Thank you for finally giving old MMORPG players a game that is more like old school MMORPGs than new-age WoW where everyone can get the same items with just hours of work.

How are vistas frustrating? Its way easier to get 100% map completion than 50-100g.

Yesterday around 10:00 pm server time

LOST 100 gold/ Its all what im have from realezr…… BB gw2. and your casual no grind system. 490 hours of farm for NOTHING.

Anhellbro.7213

LOST 100 gold/ Its all what im have from realezr…… BB gw2. and your casual no grind system. 490 hours of farm for NOTHING.

i know that feel

Anhellbro.7213:

LOST 100 gold/ Its all what im have from realezr…… BB gw2. and your casual no grind system. 490 hours of farm for NOTHING.

I wish you luck in w/e you do next.

I hope you’re paying attention to this anet. This is but one of the countless. The exodus is only going to accelerate at an exponential rate, unless you remove your stupid Korean RNG mechanics from the game.

I’d prefer a skill/talent-based approach to a precursor, but you can just as easily and acceptably make precursors soulbound and cost 300g+ at an npc. That would be the quickest/easiest thing to program in at this point.

Are you guys seriously telling me in a thread asking how many items you put into the forge you’re not counting all the items you put in when you report them?

If you do this:

Your math is bad – 200 /4 = 50 plus you get another 50 weapons from those attempts which is a further 12 (with 2 left over) which gives you in turn another 3 attempts (with 3 left over plus the previous 2 left over gives you 1 more attempt).

In total 66 attempts.

Then you’re putting in MORE than 200 exotics into the forge (and not selling any of them because none of them are profitable, I suppose, so you never get a named exotic worth 5g?)

Then again, if I say Forge Attempts: 100, no one knows if I mean I tried 100 times to get it (meaning 300-400 rares, depending on whether or not I count putting the result back in) or I put 100 rares in, which is only 25-30ish attempts. So I guess it’s too late to care about that.

TL;DR – You won’t ever get your precursor, but out of the 100,000 players next to you, 1 person will get it in the 1st 10 tries. Korean RNG system is insulting and is now making players quit the game (usually permanently). Believe it or not, this is likely to have a noticeable influence on Anet’s future income.

Do you have evidence to back up your claim that bad luck is making players quit the game permanently? In any kind of significant numbers?

Sure, but I’m lazy, so if you want proof. Find it yourself, like I have.

Search youtube, hear their commentary, see the soul-crushing results of Korean RNG. Search other forums, read the results, see the mood and ask them if they still log in to actually play. Ask in-game players that have used over 200g on just the precursor, if they log in, ask them if they will continue to log in.

Don’t take MY word for it, go and see it all for yourself. While some continue to play, others do not.

Slic.2406:

I hope you’re paying attention to this anet. This is but one of the countless. The exodus is only going to accelerate at an exponential rate, unless you remove your stupid Korean RNG mechanics from the game.

Look, you really don’t have to be so dramatic about it… You used “korean” as a negative adjective so many times now you could be classified as a racist.

Unlike us, Arena Net has to put a lot more thought into their actions and statements. They wouldn’t make an official response and then just ignore the whole issue. All things considered, a few days isn’t that long of a wait at all. The legendaries aren’t going anywhere.

I’m sure Anet will talk to us again about this when they’re ready to give us some solid new info.

Archer.6485:

Slic.2406:

I hope you’re paying attention to this anet. This is but one of the countless. The exodus is only going to accelerate at an exponential rate, unless you remove your stupid Korean RNG mechanics from the game.

Look, you really don’t have to be so dramatic about it… You used “korean” as a negative adjective so many times now you could be classified as a racist.

Unlike us, Arena Net has to put a lot more thought into their actions and statements. They wouldn’t make an official response and then just ignore the whole issue. All things considered, a few days isn’t that long of a wait at all. The legendaries aren’t going anywhere.

I’m sure Anet will talk to us again about this when they’re ready to give us some solid new info.

Sorry, this is a no-brainer and easy to code. This system should not exist as part of an economy. Legendary implies that it’s not something whose main component you’re supposed to find on the market.

One of their Jr Developers can spend 1-2hrs and add some random NPC that sells precursors of your choosing for 100-500g, and make w/e the NPC sells account/soul bound, problem solved. Nothing gets harmed, and lots of players get to keep their sanity and satisfaction with the game. As a bonus, the godskull exploiters, etc. that have been profiting by selling precursors at 200-400g are also thwarted.

And yes I DO have to be dramatic, because it IS dramatic. Players are leaving because of this, players are unhappy because of this, and the more players reach 80 and get their exotic gear squared away, the more players become discontent.

This game is just like SWTOR. No end game, so it must have huge grind factors, like korean RNG.

Why spend so much effort building a gigantic world where people have nothing to do but an alt after 2 months of game? Or, ofc, the insane grind for cosmetics. And why not mention the huge time spent waiting on WvWvW queue, so you can fight invisible people and lose castles to exploiters? Or the destroyed economy by people who found, in alpha, ways to make huge money, like the lvl 65 rares way.

Do you have anyone looking to this stuff A.net? Are you kitten there?

Anecdotes can’t cover the “significant numbers” part of my question, since with a couple million players, even hundreds would only be about 0.01%, which isn’t what I’d generally consider “significant”. (Nor, I suspect, would a problem that led some hundredths of a percent of players to quit be enough to move an issue right to the top of ANet’s priority list.)

It’s nothing racist, Korean mmo’s are infamous for their RNG and heavy grinding. I’ve played more than a few of them, and what really strikes me as odd is that the grind in those games actually made some sense because the gear really was better but in this game its not. It just makes no logical sense to call something legendary if it has the same stats as an exotic.

elderan.2638:

It’s nothing racist, Korean mmo’s are infamous for their RNG and heavy grinding. I’ve played more than a few of them, and what really strikes me as odd is that the grind in those games actually made some sense because the gear really was better but in this game its not. It just makes no logical sense to call something legendary if it has the same stats as an exotic.

^ This. That’s a great point to add to my Korean RNG tirade. For a purely cosmetic weapon (you’re not going to be killing anything faster just because you have a legendary), the method of acquiring it is a little too.. frustrating? unjust? unfair? not fun? The list goes on..

This thread says “official response” and yet i see no response from dev or “officials”.. How much longer do we have to wait??

SierraLink.4790:

This thread says “official response” and yet i see no response from dev or “officials”.. How much longer do we have to wait??

The response was several days ago, on the 1st page. No response since then, even with the mounting evidence and an (now turning-significant) exodus of players.

The number/percentage of players that turn their sights on legendaries is growing (I’ve used this word a lot now) exponentially. Makes sense, what else is there to do PvE-wise, aside from buggy/frustrating dungeons that are more of a test of patience than skill.

Go ahead and check that as well, but you don’t need to be a math major or speak to every person in the game to deduce what I just typed.

Legendary precursors are rapidly going to become a hot topic of contention, unless anet responds quickly and correctly right NOW. Not later, NOW.

elderan.2638:

It’s nothing racist, Korean mmo’s are infamous for their RNG and heavy grinding. I’ve played more than a few of them, and what really strikes me as odd is that the grind in those games actually made some sense because the gear really was better but in this game its not. It just makes no logical sense to call something legendary if it has the same stats as an exotic.

That was a joke. I know what Korean mmos are like, I was just commenting on how he keeps using the phrase over and over and over.

@Slic
Ok you do your thing. Though you’re really not contributing to the conversation anymore. In my opinion Arena Net should carefully think through every single change they make. Even if it seems like a no brainer to you there could be all sorts of consequences. Not to mention they might be deciding on how exactly to change the way of obtaining a precursor. Throwing items into the Mystic Forge for a rng isn’t legendary, but neither is getting it from a vendor.

Hippocampus.8470:

Anecdotes can’t cover the “significant numbers” part of my question, since with a couple million players, even hundreds would only be about 0.01%, which isn’t what I’d generally consider “significant”. (Nor, I suspect, would a problem that led some hundredths of a percent of players to quit be enough to move an issue right to the top of ANet’s priority list.)

After you get the data for a few thousand attempts you can get a pretty good estimate for what the chance to get a base weapon per attempt is.

The problem is all data is biased unless you record several thousand attempts at a time. Because if I do 500 attempts and get 1 base weapon and them submit the data, then do another 500 attempts and get 0 base weapon and don’t submit the data, it makes it look like 1 in 500 instead of 1 in 1000

Personally I feel pretty fed up, I have no idea how people are making tons of gold. I’ve had to buy mine off the TP with gems. To date I’ve spent over $250.00 on gems converted to gold. After all of this and reflecting on the fact that the risk versus reward is significantly unbalanced. Now how do I bring that in balance? The option include;

Cutting out Anet on my gold purchases and getting TWICE as much gold for HALF the price, and continue to contribute to the problem. This is the clear choice if I were staying in the game, simple economics.

Holding out until Lindsey gets her act together to raise the drop rate in the forge.

Pray, Lindsey or Isaiah decide to implement a way to procure a precursor that isn’t complete RNG.

Lastly, and probably the most favored right now. Cut my losses and Quit.

The outlook on all of these option looks pretty dismal and grey. I know that Anet is a company under NCSoft, but as far as NCsoft is concerned…

Fool me once (Aion) shame on you, fool me twice (GW2) shame on me…. “Fool me can’t get fooled again” -George Bush

You paid $250 for a chance at a prettier weapon skin in a computer game? Wow, I just can’t comprehend that.

Kahlamite.5029:

Personally I feel pretty fed up, I have no idea how people are making tons of gold. I’ve had to buy mine off the TP with gems. To date I’ve spent over $250.00 on gems converted to gold. After all of this and reflecting on the fact that the risk versus reward is significantly unbalanced. Now how do I bring that in balance? The option include;

Cutting out Anet on my gold purchases and getting TWICE as much gold for HALF the price, and continue to contribute to the problem. This is the clear choice if I were staying in the game, simple economics.

Holding out until Lindsey gets her act together to raise the drop rate in the forge.

Pray, Lindsey or Isaiah decide to implement a way to procure a precursor that isn’t complete RNG.

Lastly, and probably the most favored right now. Cut my losses and Quit.

The outlook on all of these option looks pretty dismal and grey. I know that Anet is a company under NCSoft, but as far as NCsoft is concerned…

Fool me once (Aion) shame on you, fool me twice (GW2) shame on me…. “Fool me can’t get fooled again” -George Bush

Wait, so you spent 250 dollars, you got your precursor off the TP and NOW you want to leave? Why not just go for your legendary now?

In any case, it’s not just Linsey who’s making the decisions, Anet needs to decide what to do as a team. I’m sure they’ll talk about this again sooner or later. Even if it’s not in the next week’s patch there’s no reason to panic.

I want changes to the precursors being made as much as all of you but I also know these kind of changes won’t be done rashly. Anet has already made a lot of changes that benefited the players (daily tokens in dungeons, alleviating the DR)
None of those changes happened instantly but they did happen.