Guild Wars 2

Does anyone know the average amount of materials you get back from material promotion in the Mystic Forge?

Based on the wiki, I think it’s something like:
Common
T1->T2 40-200 = 120
T5->T6 10-40 = 25
Fine
T1->T2 7-40 = 23.5
T5->T6 5-12 = 8.5
Dust
T1->T2 40-200 = 120
T5->T6 6-40 = 23

are these correct? or does it weigh it so you’re more likely to get on the lower end?

As far as i know and experienced it myself, it doesnt work like that. You are more likely on the lower end.

I have done hundreds, if not thousands of kitten promotions and the average is far from 120, actually. However, since the feature patch average returns seem to have increased for me.

I also seriously doubt that the average T1→T2 average yield is 120. It’s more like 80 in my experience. I have not done thousands of promotions, only tens, so maybe I am a victim of RNG.

indeed, it’s weighted. how do you even weigh RNG??? well, I guess I could think of a way: make an array with the values 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 4, 5. now pick a random array key.

anyways, I tried several common materials T1 – T4 -> T2-T5:
34 attempts
resulted in a total of 2700 materials
= 79.41 promoted material per 250 starting material

Based on that, I would guess that the actual average is about 2/3 of the real average:
Common
T1->T2 40-200 = 80
T5->T6 10-40 = 17
Fine
T1->T2 7-40 = 15.66
T5->T6 5-12 = 5.66
Dust
T1->T2 40-200 = 80
T5->T6 6-40 = 15.33

edit: it kittened “T1 – T4” without spaces? O.o

Mystic.5934:

indeed, it’s weighted. how do you even weigh RNG??? well, I guess I could think of a way: make an array with the values 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 4, 5. now pick a random array key.

anyways, I tried several common materials kitten -> T2-T5:
34 attempts
resulted in a total of 2700 materials
= 79.41 promoted material per 250 starting material

Based on that, I would guess that the actual average is about 2/3 of the real average:
Common
T1->T2 40-200 = 80
T5->T6 10-40 = 17
Fine
T1->T2 7-40 = 15.66
T5->T6 5-12 = 5.66
Dust
T1->T2 40-200 = 80
T5->T6 6-40 = 15.33

edit: it kittened “T1 – T4” without spaces? O.o

~80 for t1→t2 is close to my average as well. However, when promoting, you should also consider the ROI per skillpoint. While it takes 1 skillpoint to promote 1 stack of t5, you can actually promote 5 stacks of t1 with 1 skillpoint.

And even different mats of the same tier behave quite differently depending on their value. Leather for example has a higher profit margin because its cheap, while cloth might not have the same profit margin, the ROI per skillpoint is way higher because its more valuable.

So if you promote 10g worth of leather, you might get 14g back but you used 10 skillpoints for it and 10g worth of cloth might only give you 13g back but you only used 3 skillpoints.

I hear and agree with what you are saying regarding SP – I’m taking those into consideration when I craft.
But maybe there is something wrong with my math or something? basically, it looks like there are almost no profitable material promotions.
with leather, the least loss is from rawhide → thin: (250×8c+22c+9c=20s31c in materials gives you 80×22c=17s60c in thin leather section
you mentioned copper→silver→gold in another post:
first, silver is less than copper. even if you got 1:1 (instead of 250:80) it would still be a loss
250×24c+60c+26c=60s86c in materials gives 80×60c=48s0c in gold ore
refined is just about exactly double all the numbers – which is still a loss.
there seems to be only one common material promotion that is profitable, and it’s about 30s/SP. Fine materials have about a dozen profitable ones, but none above 40s/SP. Rare is basically just most of the core→lodestone, and those aren’t even 20s/SP
I’m just wondering where these multi-gold-per-SP mystic forgings I’ve heard of are. It seems the only place they exist is when making legendaries (1.5-3.5g/SP)
or maybe this isn’t something we want everyone on the forums knowing about? :P

Mystic.5934:

I hear and agree with what you are saying regarding SP – I’m taking those into consideration when I craft.
But maybe there is something wrong with my math or something? basically, it looks like there are almost no profitable material promotions.
with leather, the least loss is from rawhide -> thin: (250×8c+22c+9c=20s31c in materials gives you 80×22c=17s60c in thin leather section
you mentioned copper->silver->gold in another post:
first, silver is less than copper. even if you got 1:1 (instead of 250:80) it would still be a loss
250×24c+60c+26c=60s86c in materials gives 80×60c=48s0c in gold ore
refined is just about exactly double all the numbers – which is still a loss.
there seems to be only one common material promotion that is profitable, and it’s about 30s/SP. Fine materials have about a dozen profitable ones, but none above 40s/SP. Rare is basically just most of the core->lodestone, and those aren’t even 20s/SP
I’m just wondering where these multi-gold-per-SP mystic forgings I’ve heard of are. It seems the only place they exist is when making legendaries (1.5-3.5g/SP)
or maybe this isn’t something we want everyone on the forums knowing about? :P

My post about promoting silver to gold was a troll post, as the OP asked how to make gold. The high ROI per skillpoint for legendaries is just so high, if you dont put any value towards the other account bound mats, like map completion, karma, dungeon tokens, etc.

I also dont know why you think it would be a good idea to promote mats in their unrefined state, as it doubles or triples the cost of dust per promotion.

If you would have bothered to check rawhide leather squares, you would have noticed that their buy order prices are as low as as rawhide sections (6c), while the thin leather square costs 5.8 times more (lowest listing) than the thin leather section.

It also takes 1 less unrefined t1 wood/ore to refine it compared to t2 wood/ore, which is another reason why refined usually yields the better profits.

now I get that joke! yay me!
looks like there are a few problems with my math

Mystic.5934:

now I get that joke! yay me!
looks like there are a few problems with my math

Considering that even you have a hard time figuring out what is most profitable to promote, i am not surprised that the ROI per SP is as high as it is on some promotions.

I think the main reason is that returns are kept secret. If it was exactly 250 copper ore = 100 iron ore, then everyone would do it. as it is, you have to be a master just to not lose big time.