t7 Materials Adjustment?

t7 Materials Adjustment?

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Posted by: jsduke.6537

jsduke.6537

I think we could use some re-balancing of the t7 mat items (Empyreal Fragments, Dragonite Ore, and Bloodstone Dust).

I don’t know how it works out for everyone else, but I’ve got WAY TOO MUCH Bloodstone Dust, and NOT NEARLY ENOUGH Empyreal Fragments.

Dragonite Ores seem to come out about right, as long as you hit up the World Bosses each day.

Bloodstone dust is extremely easy to get, especially since there are at least 2 champ farms going 24/7 on every server.

Empyreal Fragments, though, are skint. They drop from A TON of places, but only in very low quantities compared to time/effort of acquisition.

Look at it from a time/drop perspective:

(Estimated Numbers)

1hr of world bosses = 60-100 dragonite ores
1hr of champ farm = 400-500 bloodstone dust
1hr of dungeons/JPs = 40-60 empyreal frags

If you extrapolate that out based on crafting needs:

5 Dragonite Ingots = 5-8hrs
5 Empyreal Stars = 8-13hrs
5 Bloodstone Bricks = 1hr 15min

(/end Estimated Numbers)

Clearly some normalization is in order.

I’d LOVE to see all three mats drop from all current sources. That would let me “play how I want to” and still get the mats I need, rather than having to do “daily chores” to make sure I can craft the gear I want to craft.

Maybe not all three mats every time, but some of any one of the three each time. That way players don’t feel coerced into grinding content they don’t enjoy just to check an item off their shopping list.

Or just remove the X-bound so we can trade them on the market. Honestly, what’s the compelling reason for making them account-bound?

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Posted by: SuLor.2840

SuLor.2840

I agree, I have ridiculous amounts of bloodstone dust, and only just got enough emperial fragments to make an ascended weapon.

As for the reason why these materials are account bound, it’s just another artificial way to slow down the acquisition of them. They don’t want people to buy them to speed things up, with the market being across all servers there’s always supply of even “rare” things, so it’s just a way to make it so those with lots of gold already can’t just buy it and get their ascended weapon instantly.

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Posted by: Romek.4201

Romek.4201

dragonite and empyrial dropchance is fine and perfect balanced – i have always nearly same amount from both

only bloodstone drops way to much and need nerf in championchests by 50%

than everything is fine

and when you do championfarm only and not ALL the content than it should be normal you have not enough from one material

i do everyday atleast cof p1 2x +1x p2 + some wvw and worldevents and its fine

or cap amount bloodust in championchests after maby 15-20 champchests?

(edited by Romek.4201)

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Posted by: crosknight.3041

crosknight.3041

would like Bloodstone dust to be used more

like with artficiener: making more powerful potions then the top tier (top tier is -10% damage recived and 10% given to specific mob):
maybe something liek powful universal potion (
10% damage delt-10% damage recieved from every mob top) of a ascended lvl of potion (15% instead of 10 for specific mob), probably make it 100 dust per potion recipie made. same with higher tier maintance oils and sharpening stones for weaponsmith and huntsman

edit:
maybe even let us use it with the mystic forge to let us craft boosts (like 2k blood stone dust, and some other things per booster)

(edited by crosknight.3041)

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Posted by: Sir Erighan.9260

Sir Erighan.9260

You can get 80 emp frags in 45min running CoF 2x on 2 chars. Throw in a SE run and you’re at 100 in an hour.

Regardless, I do agree we need some normalization compared to bloodstone dust. I would like less dust and more of the other two.

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Posted by: Romek.4201

Romek.4201

with normal champion hunting blood would be no problem (when no scarlet invasions event)

only problem is this championfarming whats gives sooo much and i dont think it was intented to spawnfarm them like ppl do

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Posted by: Nike.2631

Nike.2631

I think we could use some re-balancing of the t7 mat items (Empyreal Fragments, Dragonite Ore, and Bloodstone Dust).

I don’t know how it works out for everyone else, but I’ve got WAY TOO MUCH Bloodstone Dust, and NOT NEARLY ENOUGH Empyreal Fragments.

Dragonite Ores seem to come out about right, as long as you hit up the World Bosses each day.

Whereas I have PLENTY of Empyreal Fragments and claw and scratch to get Dragonite Ore. (I’m with you Bloodstone Dust is joke)

In any system that reaches across multiple play styles there are going to be people it works better for, and people it works less well for. The shift you propose would make the process faster for you but nearly intolerable for me.

There’s nothing wrong if they want to tweak drop rates after observing high-level metrics of materials acquisition across 100s of thousands of players, but don’t assume your playstyle sample size of one is going to happen to be right in the middle of the hump in the graph that they move to appease .

“You keep saying ‘its unfair.’
I wonder what your basis for comparison is…”
- Jareth, King of Goblins.

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Posted by: jsduke.6537

jsduke.6537

You can get 80 emp frags in 45min running CoF 2x on 2 chars. Throw in a SE run and you’re at 100 in an hour.

You’re right, I hadn’t thought of that. I will probably start farming the easier dungeon paths to make up the Frag deficit I’ve been working with. It’s a shame to have to do that, though. I doubt it was what devs intended when they were putting the recipe together.

Anyway, thanks for the tip!

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Posted by: jsduke.6537

jsduke.6537

Whereas I have PLENTY of Empyreal Fragments and claw and scratch to get Dragonite Ore… The shift you propose would make the process faster for you but nearly intolerable for me.

The shift I proposed was that the distribution of these materials be more evenly spread out amongst all the content from which it currently drops. It should mean a more even amount of materials for everyone, regardless of your play-style. I’m not sure how an “even distribution of all things from all sources” would make it easier for me and harder for you. Maybe I’m just not getting your point, here.

… don’t assume your playstyle sample size of one is going to happen to be right in the middle of the hump in the graph that they move to appease .

Didn’t. Wasn’t. Won’t.

I used estimated numbers based on how much effort it takes to get the different items. Obviously your play-style will effect how your drops are weighted, but your play-style has nothing to do with the availability of drops. It doesn’t matter how you play the game, bloodstone dust is still WAY easier and faster to get than the other two.

Empyreal Fragments are probably second easiest to get if you farm dungeons (which I don’t, and that’s why I have fewer Frags than you).

Dragonite is probably the hardest to get because they only drop from daily world bosses which can’t be farmed.

I’m gonna bring it back around one more time:

These items are needed in equal amounts, so they should be equally available regardless of play-style. If they drop in equal amounts, with equal regularity, from all the relevant content then you have normalization. I don’t have a deficit of Frags, and you don’t have a deficit of Dragonite, and we both get to pursue the content we enjoy without having to think twice about it.

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Posted by: Enigmus.3895

Enigmus.3895

You can get 80 emp frags in 45min running CoF 2x on 2 chars. Throw in a SE run and you’re at 100 in an hour.

You’re right, I hadn’t thought of that. I will probably start farming the easier dungeon paths to make up the Frag deficit I’ve been working with. It’s a shame to have to do that, though. I doubt it was what devs intended when they were putting the recipe together.

Anyway, thanks for the tip!

I think they envisioned people not rushing to do it in a ridiculously fast amount of time. They want you to earn it from playing multiple facets of the game. Knowing which JP to do is also important. There are 3 in caledon forest that give 7-9 each and really they don’t take long unless you are not very good at them. Add Pirate puzzle from LA and do it again on a second character and you are just about there. This shouldn’t take that long. There are also a couple puzzles that have extra world chests in them like the hexfoundry in sparkfly or the aether puzzle that you can grab two of them only doing the very first part of the puzzle.

In addition know where the world chests are can be useful as well for quick gathering over multiple characters. But I digress, my original argument stands that i don’t think they were looking to give you one quick way to gather these resources or not have a bottleneck of some sort to slow things down.

Just my two cents.

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Posted by: Aberrant.6749

Aberrant.6749

Emp frags have multiple sources… jp’s, chests laying around in the open world, from tower/camp bosses in WvW and at the end of dungeons. I like how we have options there.

Dragonite is far more limited in the source (but it’s push 1 and afk), same with bloodstone (spam 1 champ farming).

Tarnished Coast
Salvage 4 Profit + MF Guide – http://tinyurl.com/l8ff6pa

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Posted by: mjasa.5821

mjasa.5821

The sight of bloodstone dust makes me sick. I just delete and try not to look at it. The other materials are just fine.

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Posted by: Crysto.7089

Crysto.7089

I’m drowning in Empyreal fragments, ok on Bloodstone dust, and have something like 60 Dragonite from the smattering of WvW I’ve been playing.

I don’t really play anything that would get me Dragonite, just run dungeons and do jumping puzzles. I get some Bloodstone from champs in dungeons but Dragonite? I dunno how I’m supposed to get that kitten. Can’t really get it without a zerg and there just aren’t zergs when I play.

#1 Commander/Player NA: Promotions

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Posted by: jsduke.6537

jsduke.6537

I’m drowning in Empyreal fragments, ok on Bloodstone dust, and have something like 60 Dragonite from the smattering of WvW I’ve been playing.

I don’t really play anything that would get me Dragonite, just run dungeons and do jumping puzzles. I get some Bloodstone from champs in dungeons but Dragonite? I dunno how I’m supposed to get that kitten. Can’t really get it without a zerg and there just aren’t zergs when I play.

You’re not getting the Dragonite you need because you’re playing the game wrong. You’re not supposed to just do the content that you enjoy, you’re supposed to dedicate a portion of your play time to the things that ANet thinks you should be doing. It’s their game, man. Better do what they want.

Dragonite ore drops primarily from World Bosses like Tequatl, Shatterer, Jormag, and the “Lesser Bosses” like Shadow Behemoth and Fire Elemental. All of them are daily rewards, and completely unfarmable. It also drops from Temple events, and may be farmable there. In fact, if it is farmable at Temple events then that would be the best place to get it.

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Posted by: Chameleon Dude.1564

Chameleon Dude.1564

I’ll agree that bloodstone dust is just a joke… but if that’s how quickly you can get empyreal fragments, something’s wrong. Am I the only person who logs out their level 80s at a JP chest, so they can just open it the next day? The three puzzles in Lion’s Arch, the two easy chests in the Aetherblade one just north of it and the Queensdale puzzle on several characters are just such quick and easy fragments…

My problem is with dragonite to be honest, I don’t like having to use a website’s timers to waypoint next to an event; rushing to get the the boss before it dies instantly and start spamming 1 in a kittenstorm of lag and special effects… then going on to the next one. That isn’t how the game should be played… yet it’s all most people do.

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Posted by: Juunro.7082

Juunro.7082

I wish I could do something with the bloodstone dust too… I have a surplus of the bars from it rapidly reaching 70+

I think I’ll make an Igloo out of them or something.

Axe Murdering, Longbowing tiny Asura Mohawk’d Warrior

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Posted by: jsduke.6537

jsduke.6537

I bet the Crystal Desert is just FULL of Bloodstone Brick Igloos…

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Posted by: Noah.4756

Noah.4756

Also don’t forget about the Soft Wood Logs. You need 4 instead of 3 to create a Soft Wood Plank. Which adds up to a crazy amount if you realize you need 720 logs to make a staff.

Soft Wood Logs Bug

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Posted by: Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

Bloodstone dust is Anet’s way to tell players to go do something else. Farm the champions if you want, but you’re not going to get the mats you need for Ascended gear.

But you know, “play the game the way you want”.

My posts are facts as I know them, or my own opinion, and do not represent any guild.

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Posted by: Lord Kuru.3685

Lord Kuru.3685

My problem is with dragonite to be honest, I don’t like having to use a website’s timers to waypoint next to an event; rushing to get the the boss before it dies instantly and start spamming 1 in a kittenstorm of lag and special effects… then going on to the next one. That isn’t how the game should be played… yet it’s all most people do.

This. It’s a truly horrible experience.

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Posted by: Nike.2631

Nike.2631

I just ground out the last 150 Dragonite I needed for my first ascended weapon. I just keep dropping in on the Temple of Zephyrs/Dwayna, when it was under enemy control, found the scholar each time, and announced in map chap that I was starting the event, come get your Dragonite. Not only did we flip it casually each time, but most times the resulting horde then strolled over to Lyssa and flipped that too. Checking back in a few hours later with a different 80th level character lead to a second round verbatim – 120 Dragonite in a day. Far less annoying that chasing dragon lieutenants or the dribble of ore you get from the Maw, SB, or Fire Elemental.

(having 5-6 80s parked at the end of the pirate treasure jump puzzle still means I get ~40 Empyreal shards just for logging in after the daily reset… Pretty casual on that front.)

“You keep saying ‘its unfair.’
I wonder what your basis for comparison is…”
- Jareth, King of Goblins.

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Posted by: laokoko.7403

laokoko.7403

Don’t give Anet ideas. Instead of making it easier to get other material, they’ll probalby make champ drop only 1 bloodstone brick.

Just remember what they did to karma. Instead of buffing reward for fotm, they just nerfed karma everywhere else so it is more rewarding to do fotm.

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Posted by: Zaxares.5419

Zaxares.5419

I agree that something needs to be done about Bloodstone Dust. Personally, I’d give Miyani an option where she can convert excess stacks of Bloodstone Dust to karma, seeing as how options for accumulating karma took a big hit in the recent patch.

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Posted by: OmniPotentes.4817

OmniPotentes.4817

They should have applied the same system like they did with the wintersday crafting materials from the Tix Dungeon. Allow the player to choose which type of mat he wants and voila problem solved. Still gated but not frustrating.

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Posted by: Lord Kuru.3685

Lord Kuru.3685

They should have applied the same system like they did with the wintersday crafting materials from the Tix Dungeon. Allow the player to choose which type of mat he wants and voila problem solved. Still gated but not frustrating.

It would solve the problem, but I believe Anet wants to force you to play different parts of the game in order to get these materials and your idea would spoil that.

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Posted by: Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

It would solve the problem, but I believe Anet wants to force you to play different parts of the game in order to get these materials…

Yup, they’ve been going this way for a while now. More and more, we’re playing the game the way Anet wants it played. This will backfire hard with the next great thing, and it can’t come soon enough for me.

My posts are facts as I know them, or my own opinion, and do not represent any guild.

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Posted by: Romo.3709

Romo.3709

(Estimated Numbers)
1hr of world bosses = 60-100 dragonite ores

If you extrapolate that out based on crafting needs:
5 Dragonite Ingots = 5-8hrs

Your numbers are utterly and completely flawed. Each MAJOR meta fight is roughly 15 minutes long which gives you between 15-25 Dragonite ores. And that’s only for Jormag (30 minutes), Golem, Tequatl (20-25 minutes), Shatterer and Champion Drakin Cinderspire. Those spawn every 3 hours or so (excluding Teq atm).

SO you’re looking at about 50 maybe 60 dragonite ore for an hour of work tops, IF you’re lucky and happen to have them spawn one after another. At that point smaller bosses like Wurm or Maw give you 3-5 Ores… Which is just pitiful as you look at the time needed to complete these. One viable way to get the most amount is by doing tamples. Those give you 30 ores each time, BUT average time to complete a tample is about 30 minutes… 60 Ores an hour.

Empyreal Stars you get from EVERY chest in the world, every dungeon you do, every fractals you run. If you’re low on it, you can literally park all your alts at the end of a jumping puzzle and open them daily just getting more and more of these.

Dragonite ore is the only one that’s VERY restricted to the way you play. I agree with you that they should be balanced or added more possible ways to obtain these. But Dragonite ore is just ridiculus…

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Posted by: Mystic.5934

Mystic.5934

you forgot the part where you get as much bloodstone dust as the other 2 when you are farming the other 2.
So if you do 1 hour of dungeons and get 40 empyreal, you also get 40 bloodstone.

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Posted by: anabasis.7346

anabasis.7346

(Estimated Numbers)
1hr of world bosses = 60-100 dragonite ores

If you extrapolate that out based on crafting needs:
5 Dragonite Ingots = 5-8hrs

Your numbers are utterly and completely flawed. Each MAJOR meta fight is roughly 15 minutes long which gives you between 15-25 Dragonite ores. And that’s only for Jormag (30 minutes), Golem, Tequatl (20-25 minutes), Shatterer and Champion Drakin Cinderspire. Those spawn every 3 hours or so (excluding Teq atm).

SO you’re looking at about 50 maybe 60 dragonite ore for an hour of work tops, IF you’re lucky and happen to have them spawn one after another. At that point smaller bosses like Wurm or Maw give you 3-5 Ores… Which is just pitiful as you look at the time needed to complete these. One viable way to get the most amount is by doing tamples. Those give you 30 ores each time, BUT average time to complete a tample is about 30 minutes… 60 Ores an hour.

Empyreal Stars you get from EVERY chest in the world, every dungeon you do, every fractals you run. If you’re low on it, you can literally park all your alts at the end of a jumping puzzle and open them daily just getting more and more of these.

Dragonite ore is the only one that’s VERY restricted to the way you play. I agree with you that they should be balanced or added more possible ways to obtain these. But Dragonite ore is just ridiculus…

You can get more dragonite ore via guesting if you time it correctly and complete one event in one server while there are more events going on in 2 other servers at the same time.

(edited by anabasis.7346)

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Posted by: jsduke.6537

jsduke.6537

(Estimated Numbers)
1hr of world bosses = 60-100 dragonite ores

If you extrapolate that out based on crafting needs:
5 Dragonite Ingots = 5-8hrs

Your numbers are utterly and completely flawed. Each MAJOR meta fight is roughly 15 minutes long which gives you between 15-25 Dragonite ores. And that’s only for Jormag (30 minutes), Golem, Tequatl (20-25 minutes), Shatterer and Champion Drakin Cinderspire. Those spawn every 3 hours or so (excluding Teq atm).

I think it’s a pretty accurate estimate, at least on some servers. I’m only counting the amount of time actually doing the content, though. On my server, I’m able to hit up all the world bosses over the course of 2hrs typically, and I spend an average of 10 minutes on each one, so I get all of them in about a 1-1.5hrs. I don’t count the time in between bosses, because I’m doing something else then.

You’re right about the ore, though. As several of us have said on this thread, it is the hardest to get because all the sources are daily.

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Posted by: Brother Grimm.5176

Brother Grimm.5176

Need a Mystic Flusher recipe that uses bloodstone dust, yellow transmutation stones and some other useless items filling up my storage…

We go out in the world and take our chances
Fate is just the weight of circumstances
That’s the way that lady luck dances

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Posted by: Morgoth Bauglyr.9726

Morgoth Bauglyr.9726

I’m with the op on this. Limiting drops to a small number of sources is a bad thing for player choice of activity.

Also with the limited resources and time constraints ascended gear is pretty much the end of build experimentation for most people as sadly stats are bound to items. Effectively i like having about 3-4 sets of weapons and armor per character to switch around playstyles.

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Posted by: Gnat.9405

Gnat.9405

Bloodstone Bricks should = 250 dust.

I do tons of dungeons so Emp isn’t a personal problem, but before I got heavily into dungeon running it was. Dragonite is the problem, I don’t like participating in zerg fests for it but what ya gonna do.