Guild Wars 2

I don’t mind PvP’ing. I’m horrid at it, but I’ll do my best and take my lumps if it’s required to earn something I want.

Because they did it wrong. They should have either not included it in in the first place or include it but reduce the number of achievements required for the wings.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

People whine that they have to do PvP achievements… Anet removes the PvP achievements from the meta… people whine that they are removed….

This why you should completely ignore everything on the forums and just develop the game how they see fit.

People whine because the removal came after they had sat through the unpleasantness and are envious of people who do not need to sit through the unpleasant experience like them.

Actually I’m just more annoyed they aren’t communicating the requirements so well. When I dropped into Dragon Ball I was fortunate enough not to be in many matches with many AFKers and I found it really fun (odd since I’m a non pvp person)! Got the 20 wins in 25 or so games but stuck around to get whooped a little bit more. There were just some people that I’d try to get and no matter what, I’m the one that died! At least both sides found it funny. :P

I know a few people who after seeing the update notes prior to the start of “Dragon Bash” and that upon seeing the achievement list in game after it started decided to concentrated on the “Dragon Ball” game to start with as they were already in Lion’s Arch.

Sure they may have had various different reasons for doing so. Be it wanting total completion despite the fact of only needing 10, preferring the PvP options over the PvE grind options, or insert random “free will player choice” of your choosing.

Now if you take into account that the Developers have stated that part of the reasons for needing only X of a total toward the final achievement reward was so that players could reach it through their own various play styles then yes those that did the PvP ones have a right to be at least a little upset.

So to be honest those who did decide to do “Dragon Ball” achievements deserve to be treated with respect too.

I follow the forum. I knew these were bugged. I still did them.

Am I bothered? No, because I knew before hand and still made the choice. However, I (as others who did them as well) expected that a proper fix would be allowing them to count as patch and event notes implied. Not taking all meaning away from them.

Am I mad? No, not really, because after 15+ years of online gaming you come to expect the worse when bugs happen and to never get your hopes up.

Am I annoyed? Yeah, a little bit, but its not important in the grand scheme of things.

With that said. Not everyone follows the forum. Not everyone knew they were bugged (prior to finishing the achievement).

For all of you here that want to harp on and belittle those who did (and with good reason are upset with the fix) just remember this could have been the other way around and two of the PvE achievements could have just as well not counted and been bugged.

In the end how would you have felt if you wasted your time doing 300 holograms and 150 piñatas?

What if the fix was the same, but now in your case you had no choice but to do at least one of the PvP ones?

They could have at least lowered it then and implemented a title fix for having finished both of the ‘Dragon Ball’ achievements, or at the very least the ‘Dragon Ball Boss’ achievement. Its not like ‘Crab Toss’ didn’t give a title.

Had this been due to the PvE achievement lines not counting and having been reduced then those play styles would be on here complaining and appearing to whine all the while being bagged on about it by any other play style.

Sad huh?

I think the sad part is how anyone regardless of play style or personal choice of how they get to the end goal is even being bagged on at all for something they did based on the developers actions and encouragement.

Most just miss the point.

It appears to me that those upset are not whining, but just upset that they invested personal time in something that was intended to be worth something only to find out that the fix made everything about what they had just done worthless with nothing to show for it in return.

Hmm, come to think of it there is no title at all for anything with “Dragon Bash” while every other achievement based event/story appears to have at least one.

Michael Fejervary.8576:

I think the sad part is how anyone regardless of play style or personal choice of how they get to the end goal is even being bagged on at all for something they did based on the developers actions and encouragement.

Most just miss the point.

It appears to me that those upset are not whining, but just upset that they invested personal time in something that was intended to be worth something only to find out that the fix made everything about what they had just done worthless with nothing to show for it in return.

Your entire post was eloquently written, and IMHO, spot on. Thank you for wording that so perfectly!

I snipped and quoted the above part just to highlight my sentiments on the issue. I am so bad at PvP, I mean baaaad. In UO, my first online gaming experience, I ran from reds. RAN. When Trammel was introduced, I left Felucca so fast.. and never returned until they made it worth my while to dungeon there (dungeon Shame..ahh, the pk’s!).

In WoW, I was that one player that could get stun-locked seemingly forever, on my hunter, priest, lock or pally! There were PvP achievements that had to be done for the Meta (Violet protodrake, anyone?) that I did (Children’s Week and AV, folks?) and never said boo about. I did it, painful or not because I wanted the reward at the end. I didn’t run to the forums and scream about “x-achievement isn’t fair because I have horrid reflexes, carpal tunnel or because deadly boss mods doesn’t warn me about players!” I did the required task, and I earned my rewards, and I was proud I did it, even if it took many dirt naps.

This was just poor communication. Really poor, and it’s disappointing because my time is worth something even if it’s trivial to someone else.

*edit- I think they also punished those of us who did these achievements the honest way rather than punish all the AFK’ers that just glided through it, and that bites.

I fully understand (and support) not making it required for the wings, I find it baffling that it doesn’t count towards them. What’s the sense in that?

Shiren.9532:

I fully understand (and support) not making it required for the wings, I find it baffling that it doesn’t count towards them. What’s the sense in that?

There is no explanation. Zip, zero, nada.

Seems the botters ruined it for everyone else. Anet does not want to reward the AFK bots for cheating through those 2 achievements, so they removed them from potentially counting towards the reward. The craptacular part about this is, they PUNISHED those of us that earned the achievements honestly and the exploiting fools were likely getting their mani/pedi time in, so they could care less, as they weren’t working for them anyway.

I give to you this Masuka laugh compilation on behalf of the AFK’ers that no doubt tittered through this whole thing.

Quetz.4389:

Why?

The Crabtoss achievements counted for the Southsun Meta Event, and there’s no indication in the in game achievement window that the dragon ball achievements would be any different.

On top of that, the reward for wining dragon ball is already lacking…

FYI crab toss achievements were working poorly………….

I have only done that crap until late night to finish the kitten achievement. Why is it in the achievement list if it doesnt give you anything. 1! Dragon coffer for every 5-10 min is BS.

Punishing the whole correct playerbase and degrade their work to zero because of the AFK-ers. Worst solution ever.

I can’t believe all the whining about “wasted time” and being “punished”. If playing (any part of) the game feels like a chore, why do you keep playing? The only one who forces you to do anything you don’t like is yourself! Now go patch your game tonight, get the wings and enjoy them. And next time, don’t do 2 achievements you don’t like and don’t need anyway. Because you all DID know that there were more achievements available than 10 needed for the wings, and you DID know that you couldn’t get the wings before today anyway. You COULD have chosen to not do dragonball at all if you hated it so much and get your wings by doing the other achievements.

Paradox.5498:

I can’t believe all the whining about “wasted time” and being “punished”. If playing (any part of) the game feels like a chore, why do you keep playing? The only one who forces you to do anything you don’t like is yourself! Now go patch your game tonight, get the wings and enjoy them. And next time, don’t do 2 achievements you don’t like and don’t need anyway. Because you all DID know that there were more achievements available than 10 needed for the wings, and you DID know that you couldn’t get the wings before today anyway. You COULD have chosen to not do dragonball at all if you hated it so much and get your wings by doing the other achievements.

I would like to remind you that most of those who do achievements to get a reward for doing X/14 always want to make sure to do as many as they can in case they are forced to miss out on a few because of real life situations, which is basically why people “force” themselves to do certain hated or less liked achievement activities to secure a few points on the bar.

I, personally, got work to do this week and some times I arrive very late home, and since the communication and information on how long special achievements or events are going to last, you would want to not miss them in order to get the reward you have been trying to get.

And we were not notified that the DB achievements were bugged or intended to not count until we had actually done them, and if those who haven’t done them don’t care about the fix then it is more than fair to reward those who had previously done those two achievements prior to this supposed “fix, where those two no longer reward players when completed in order to get the wings”.

However, it is good to hear that they reduced the required achievements that needed to be done to get the wings, but those who did those two DB achievements still need to be rewarded in my opinion as they still counted by the time people had started doing them and those who had completed them fast, before it was recognized as a bug and then intended to not count.

Probably people have been choosing to do this over the pve story. Maybe they dont like either of them but want the wings so they decided to do this because IT WAS NOT COMMUNICATED it will not count.

Or maybe they were like in the belief like me that have 1 million things to do during the weekdays – yes even in the evening and night – and only wanted to spend an another 10 minute to get the last achievement.

I would have absolutely no problem if they were told us at the very beginning, hey idiots it wont count. Because i wouldnt go even close to that if i knew that.

Zenith.7301:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

People whine that they have to do PvP achievements… Anet removes the PvP achievements from the meta… people whine that they are removed….

This why you should completely ignore everything on the forums and just develop the game how they see fit.

People whine because the removal came after they had sat through the unpleasantness and are envious of people who do not need to sit through the unpleasant experience like them.

I think he reason people are complaining about them no longer counting is because they did them when they were supposed to count. I couldn’t care any less if you did not complete them as it is your personal choice to not do them or ignore the achievement reward or whatever you have planned, but I did them, and I am sure that those who did them during the time they counted should get the rewarded bar count for those achievements.

It doesn’t really matters to me if they count or not since i intended to do all of them anyway. My issue is that Anet handled the problem wrongly.

Sheesh. I wasted 2-3 hours getting the Dragonball achievements. Getting 20 wins while having AFKers on my team WAS NOT FUN.

I WOULD NOT HAVE DONE IT IF I KNEW IT WAS NOT GOING TO COUNT TOWARDS THE WINGS ACHIEVEMENT.

-unhappy consumer

Hmm so dragonball doesn’t count for achievements, no title rewarded, people Akitten teams, regen campers…. why was i doing it again?

AFK_in_teams ** for some reason that wont edit x.x

Curo.2483:

To add my own opinion: I think it’s very important that “participate in X pvp event” achievements do NOT exist, as they encourage people to ‘away from keyboard’ in pvp, which ruins it for people that want to play a balanced game.

The easy fix would be to make PvP competitions that simply cannot be akitten through. Participation means participation, and should not reward inactivity.

Also, was this really a result of a though-out decision, or just a sideeffect of being unable to fix the bug in time?

Thanks for this thread, I was about to start one asking how to get nine achievements, when all I could managed was six so far; not counting the Moa race as it was too costly for players like me who can’t really afford to gamble that much.

And I hope GW2 is not going downward spiral, don’t really enjoy much of it these days. Feels like a struggle to reach an achievement instead of having fun reaching it. It seems like this game is only catered to populated guilds and if I am not interested in the politics of taking any sides, I can’t simply enjoy achieving something at my own pace. It feels like a struggle and almost impossible effort with politics dictating something supposedly enjoyable. The kicking, the ostracizing, the whole ego parade, and donkeys leading donkeys affair. Guess people like it and that is why its encouraged to be practiced.

At least GW2 made a difference initially, unlike D3- Facepalm.

Do you have any idea how much time I spent getting those achievements? Do you know how many achievement farmers that I had to put up with, while I played fair and square? If something isn’t going to count, don’t put it on the panel with the rest that do please.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

People whine that they have to do PvP achievements… Anet removes the PvP achievements from the meta… people whine that they are removed….

This why you should completely ignore everything on the forums and just develop the game how they see fit.

Agreed, this has got to be one of the most whiny game related forums I’ve seen.
Do people really don’t have anything better to do? Or is complaining about an achievement counting or not counting when you have a month to get the other ones that important for everyone?

The core issue here is that there are two different groups of people who are complaining.

Group 1: The folks who didn’t want to do the achievements for the wings and who came onto the forums to complain and eventually got what they wanted regardless of the devs initial message regarding the achievements.

Group 2: The folks who, regardless of if they wanted to or not, did the achievements for the sole purpose of getting the achievements in order to earn the wings, and then when said achievements were declared pointless came onto the forums to complain about wasted time and bad messaging on the part of the devs.

The issue here is that it appears as though the dev team listened to group 1, changed the achievements, and then failed to recognize group 2 at all. Not only that but they changed the balance of rewards in the scale of achievements and then failed to re-balance it in any way. By doing this the devs are actively breeding contempt among the player base. This whole event seems to be doing just that, breeding contempt. The holograms that people had to compete over at the start, the “away-from-keyboard” players in the Dragon Ball, and now the removal of both the Moa racing and the Dragon Ball achievements completely from the roster of Dragon Bash achievements.

The annoying thing is, these issues could easily be fixed. At the outset of the event simply state clearly:
A: The reward that can be earned for participating in the event.
B: Exactly what the player needs to do in order to achieve said reward.
C: DON’T CHANGE THE REQUIREMENTS. No matter how many people complain.

Then:

D: Put a simple program in place that would kick any “away-from-keyboard” players from the Dragon Ball game.
E: Put an effort into testing the Holograms out and for general balance.

And I think most importantly, have a sort of “mission statement” at the beginning of these events that states, not necessarily to your player base, but rather to the dev team what the final goal of the event is. What do you want your player base to get out of this event? Are you properly rewarding the players for what they have accomplished?

In the end, that is one of the strongest draws of the MMO genre. A proper reward for the time spent doing the objectives. Guild Wars 2 may be able to hide it better than any other MMO on the market, but it still is one big grind just like all other MMOs out there. Sure it may have a nice story in place with voice acting, and dynamic events that help break up the repetition, but at the end of the day the game still boils down to actions done by the player in an attempt to get a reward for said actions. When you tip the scales, even in the slightest amount, it throws the balance of the reward system out of place and alienates portions of the player base.

The ironic thing is, no matter what the dev team does it will still alienate one of the groups I stated above. If they listen to group 1, then group 2 will be left out. And if they stay true to their initial word, then group 1 is of course going to feel alienated. This is why it is important to have balance in the achievements from the outset and then not change anything at all. If you want a happy player base you need to consider the fact that you can’t keep all groups happy at the same time. From this point forwards, you must ask yourself: Which group should we strive to please in the end?

Dantanian: Moa racing achievement still counts toward the meta.

Instead of blaming Anet, perhaps you should start blaming your fellow players for trying to cheat the system. It is hard to have an achievement carry any weight when players are trying to bypass the system by being AFK, switching to the winning team during the match or dropping out to go to a better match.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

People whine that they have to do PvP achievements… Anet removes the PvP achievements from the meta… people whine that they are removed….

This why you should completely ignore everything on the forums and just develop the game how they see fit.

I wish I could plus 1000 this statement. It is unbelievable from event to event how much I see this very scenario play out. If you were someone on the fence about buying this game, and you came to the forums to find out if this game was for you, you would walk away with the impression that the community absolutely hates this game.

FateOmega.9601:

It doesn’t really matters to me if they count or not since i intended to do all of them anyway. My issue is that Anet handled the problem wrongly.

This is pretty much my sentiment. When I realized that Dragon Ball would be relatively easy for me despite having no PvP skill I went ahead and did them for the achievement points. I’m not upset they don’t count anymore. I even think lowering the number of achievements needed for the wings due to Dev booboos is fair.

BUT, I do think this situation has been handled poorly. Dragon Ball has been hopelessly bugged since its release. And half the frustrations have yet to be dealt with. There’s still no way to prevent AFK leechers ruining the game for those that enjoy it and want to play it because of that enjoyment.

Yes, clearer communication on the part of the devs as to what the bug was and what the intended fix was would have been nice. But what would have been even nicer would have been addressing the issues with Dragon Ball so that people could do what they’re supposed to do with it – enjoy it.

I know there’s going to be bumps along the way for any game constantly releasing content, but the sheer number of bugs in releases lately has my mind spinning. I don’t remember GW1 ever being quite this bad when it came to new releases, even if fixes were slow to come.

Paradox.5498:

I can’t believe all the whining about “wasted time” and being “punished”. If playing (any part of) the game feels like a chore, why do you keep playing? The only one who forces you to do anything you don’t like is yourself! Now go patch your game tonight, get the wings and enjoy them. And next time, don’t do 2 achievements you don’t like and don’t need anyway. Because you all DID know that there were more achievements available than 10 needed for the wings, and you DID know that you couldn’t get the wings before today anyway. You COULD have chosen to not do dragonball at all if you hated it so much and get your wings by doing the other achievements.

I, along with many other in this thread have listed various reasons why we feel the way we do about how this whole thing was handled.

Consistently ignoring those reasons and labeling them as a “whine” is ridiculous.
Allow me to point out just a few posts that detail the issues:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/first#post2225003

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/first#post2229844

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/first#post2230201

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/first#post2230305

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/first#post2230561

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/page/2#post2231091

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/page/2#post2231546

and the best post I’ve seen written on the issue:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/dragonbash/Achievements-9-done-only-counts-as-7/page/2#post2231687

Just a few reasons for you.

*edit: There are more good reasons after your post as well.

Hahaha, my god, those fanboys are really funny.
Complaining about people complaining asking if they don’t have nothing better to do yet, they do exactly the same. Way to go!

Now that we still need 10 achievements despite what they said, do I have a reason to complain now?

I just don’t understand why some of you here feel so strongly about this subject… When I read the Ele forums after the Mist form and RTL nerfs, I understood, because it was a huge change to a core mechanic that many D/D eles used. It made it less fun, and harder to be successful as a D/D ele in game.

But its two achievements? It may have taken you a collective few hours to complete them. If they came back and said they weren’t going to count the holograms, I could care less…. just like with dailies, when there is stuff to do in game, often I feel compelled to do it, reguardless of the reward.

If doing the work is so horrible, just don’t? I tend to enjoy most achievements, if they count towards the super end game event item, (like gloves, or wings, or a hat) it doesn’t really matter, but its a nice bonus.

You are all going to get your wings, you are all going to have extra achievement points, whats the big deal?

Thank goodness none of you were in that boat of players who had salvaged 10s of thousands of items and had the vast majority of their achievement points ripped away from them. I would imagine if that was any of you, you would scream and cry on the forums till you were blue in the face.

There are far worse things to get worked up about, than this.

The big deal is that when something is promised (be it from a friend, business, neighbor, etc), you need to come through on that promise. Yea people make mistakes, but when promise after promise is broken, it gets old and tiring. In the case of a business trying to make money, they can easily lose customers…yes even over something as small as this.

Lauranda.1342:

The big deal is that when something is promised (be it from a friend, business, neighbor, etc), you need to come through on that promise. Yea people make mistakes, but when promise after promise is broken, it gets old and tiring. In the case of a business trying to make money, they can easily lose customers…yes even over something as small as this.

I would say something smart and well spoken, but I am from the necro forums, and we are routinely dis-satisfied with promises to improve the class. I can much easier understand dis-satisfaction with changes to the game, classes, items, mobs, drops, skin diversity, difficulty, anything else…

Just seems like there are bigger fish out there to be frying before this one.

Anet will come through on the promise. Eventually. Probably quite quickly actually. Patience really is a lost virtue…

Yeah, I get it, they screwed up and its irritating and disappointing. Doubly so because this is far from the first time it has happened. But there really is nothing else to do but wait until they fix it and the constant whining is almost as dispiriting as the original screw up.

Webba.3071:

Anet will come through on the promise. Eventually. Probably quite quickly actually. Patience really is a lost virtue…

Yeah, I get it, they screwed up and its irritating and disappointing. Doubly so because this is far from the first time it has happened. But there really is nothing else to do but wait until they fix it and the constant whining is almost as dispiriting as the original screw up.

Sadly, indeed it is a lost virtue.

Just completed the Dragonball Achievements despite the AFKers. It was great really, newbie friendly and fun. Hope we have many such events in future. Just wishing we had some kind of a reward/title for it.

Demanding reasons is not whining… please dont tell OP how to behave on forums, that is moderator’s headache

cheers ^^

Sythus.2396:

Webba.3071:

Anet will come through on the promise. Eventually. Probably quite quickly actually. Patience really is a lost virtue…

Yeah, I get it, they screwed up and its irritating and disappointing. Doubly so because this is far from the first time it has happened. But there really is nothing else to do but wait until they fix it and the constant whining is almost as dispiriting as the original screw up.

Sadly, indeed it is a lost virtue.

It isn’t so much patience. When they literally say that they have added or changed something, and it isn’t changed in the slightest, that is not a matter of patience. It’s a matter of being annoyed that they don’t even seem to test what they implement. It seems downright disrespectful to their customers.

I now have 8 Dragon Bash achievements, with no Dragon ball ones, but the bar appears to still show that I need 10. I think there is a bug.

Paradox.5498:

I can’t believe all the whining about “wasted time” and being “punished”. If playing (any part of) the game feels like a chore, why do you keep playing? The only one who forces you to do anything you don’t like is yourself! Now go patch your game tonight, get the wings and enjoy them. And next time, don’t do 2 achievements you don’t like and don’t need anyway. Because you all DID know that there were more achievements available than 10 needed for the wings, and you DID know that you couldn’t get the wings before today anyway. You COULD have chosen to not do dragonball at all if you hated it so much and get your wings by doing the other achievements.

We just want the wings. And theres not much choice even if there were more achievements then the 10 needed since the majority of them are ridiculously boring. Lets see what we have…

Wait around for fireworks.
Use 100 fireworks.
Eat 250 candies.
Light 50 effigies.
Smash 150 pinatas.

And then we have achievements like the Moa’s racing thing for rich people.
You tell me if these achievements are reasonable.

Then they tell us the dragonball achievements don’t count. Then we find out the achievements are bugged. Do I need to go on? Well done Anet, excellent job once again!

William Fairfield.1428:

During my live stream on Friday I confirmed that the Dragon Ball achievements would not count towards the overall. We are sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused you.

Why are those achievements even in there if they dont count towards the reward?

The better question is why is it so hard to alter a file and make them count?

OR why is it so hard to change a 10 to an 8?