Guild Wars 2

So I went to Divinity’s Reach to follow on the dragon story and the cut scene had Logan who wanted to hire a woman because X had been murdered. And then it hit me: how can someone be murdered and die in a universe where anybody even pets can be revived?

So… how does someone die exactly since…nobody can die?
My brain hurts!

Revivable NPC’s are considered to be in a downed state (because stuff like Battle Standard rezzes them but not dead lalies). There are some NPCs that die. Also, Charr are giant cats that can wear extremely heavy armor and swim under water, trying to use too much logic in a fantasy world is almost pointless =)

Grok Krog.9581:

Revivable NPC’s are considered to be in a downed state (because stuff like Battle Standard rezzes them but not dead lalies). There are some NPCs that die. Also, Charr are giant cats that can wear extremely heavy armor and swim under water, trying to use too much logic in a fantasy world is almost pointless =)

Also Magic… lots and lots of Magic. At least with Asura it’s explainable through the use of technological aid (even if it’s “hidden”, yes that’s the explanation for Asura wearing greatswords and the like).

actually all npcs can revive other npcs you see that all the time in quests and in the world in general

Another creepy interpenetration a la star trek or stargate. When you wp you are just using a transporter/stargate: you are “killed”, broken down into basic matter, converted into energy, transported X distance, that energy is converted back into basic matter, and it is rearranged back into you.

Just think when you revive back at a wp that a new clone of yourself is made. That NPC was just not lucky enough to be stored “in buffer.”

Wallace MacBix.2089:

Another creepy interpenetration a la star trek or stargate. When you wp you are just using a transporter/stargate: you are “killed”, broken down into basic matter, converted into energy, transported X distance, that energy is converted back into basic matter, and it is rearranged back into you.

Just think when you revive back at a wp that a new clone of yourself is made. That NPC was just not lucky enough to be stored “in buffer.”

Sorry but when a frog revives a dead frog they are not being rematerialized at a waypoint…they are just revived. No cloning just plain healed from death as if death was a simple virus. So again…how can people die?

My point was that Logan was investigating a murder…why isn t the person who was killed able to be revived? What Lore explains this?

There are multiple forms of death in the Guild Wars universe: There is the “downed” state where one is simply wounded, the “spirit” state where one transcends to the mists (such as the Hall of Heroes and Underworld) , and finally there is a state where even the spirit is gone.

omg lets have permanent death then for your characters so the death logic can make sense and see how that pans out.

its a game, entertainment is first and foremost, you have to allow it some leeway.

I frown at this thread.

I thought the average gamer just accepted the invisible wall dividing game mechanics and story telling.

You want perma death in an RPG? Go play Fire Emblem. It was released into the states some time ago.

Characters die all the time in the story, but I guess I always saw the downed players and NPCs as being more knocked out than anything else.

On that note, I think a really funny April Fool’s joke the game could put in next year would be to change the revive animation from the player rubbing an arm or something to be the player repeatedly smacking the knocked out player across the face going, “WAKE UP WAKE UP” lol xD That would be pretty great

Monsoon.2589:

Thobek.1730:

omg lets have permanent death then for your characters so the death logic can make sense and see how that pans out.

its a game, entertainment is first and foremost, you have to allow it some leeway.

Fine with me I was the first permadeath in wow so max level without death is easy.

I think you need to eat more fibers in your diet, there is no need to be aggressive. This is a talk about Lore and how suspension of disbelief works sometimes and sometimes it doesn t.

fiber in my diet? if you think that post was aggressive then you are a wee bit sensitive, which surprises me considering you come from WoW which has a very toxic community.

perhaps the strange electrical discharge from the effigy causes permanent death. There you go, solved it.

If your character or some NPCs “die”, they actually just get “defeated”, not dead. If someone actually dies, he can’t be brought back.

Hmmmm maybe there is a difference between people who can become Risen and those that die permanently. That means everyone who can be revived will be a Risen under the right circumstances. And that means you. So next time you are in Orr, say hello to your future friends and neighbors.

Astral Projections.7320:

Hmmmm maybe there is a difference between people who can become Risen and those that die permanently. That means everyone who can be revived will be a Risen under the right circumstances. And that means you. So next time you are in Orr, say hello to your future friends and neighbors.

Also, Risen defy logic. How would something that has been dead for hundreds, if not thousands of years come back to life with FLESH AND MUSCLES.

See: Giganticus Lupicus. Yes, he’s a small GL (as stated by lore/reference to the GL’s of GW1) AND HE HAS FLESH/MUSCLES. That means that either he was alive all this time and for some reason was still guarding Arah while Zhaitan slowly accrued his minion army, or Risen gain flesh/muscle upon being revived.

Suspension of disbelief, anyone?

I remember devs saying bwfore the game was released that downed health is called consciousness. So im assuming that defeated is simply unconsious.
As for some npcs not being reviveable… I like to think people who learnt to use magic to revive, can also use it on themselves to keep themselves alive when they shouldve died, aka defeated.
I guess some people’s revival skill is just higher, so theyre not immediatally defeated, but get downed first. They can also heal themselves when downed, but like lesser skilled people need a waypoint or someone else’s help to recover from defeated.
Makes sense :o?

Indeed, most times in this game the NPCs don’t actually die.
They get defeated, which would be more like unconscious than actually dead.

OP: I think you are smart enough to know the answer, you just wanted a point of contention because you like conflict.

And in case you really are confused: the game world is one thing, a story is another. NPC’s, players, and enemies revive and respawn because if they didn’t, the game would end pretty fast for most players. Resurrection is a necessary mechanic for this genre of game. A story however is something taken out of the game world and given it’s own world of existence. The Guild Wars story has been going on through multiple games (in the form of missions, personal story, living story, etc) and books, and lives inside that. The game itself is set in the same world, but is not part of the actual story.

What you are asking is akin to “you killed my queen last game, so how can my queen be back for this game of chess?” Well, it’s a game, just that. Whereas Dumbledore cannot come back to life, because in his story, he died. Life is not a game…well, that’s a different issue entirely

And why didn’t Cloud used a Phoenix Down when Sephito killed Aeris? Only that in this game there is an explanation.

During development they gave the answer to this:

Unlike GW1 where there was even lore to death and resurrection, in GW2 you NEVER die. You enter into a “DEFEATED” state, that means you’re unconscious or incapacitated to fight, but you never die. Players ressing you are trying to awake you and make you recover your physical strength.

Revivable NPCs are in that state too, and it’s when the story says they must die that they die.

Even some named enemies enter this state, like IIRC the trial by duel against minister Zamon and his bodyguard where Zamon could be revived by the big guy, and once you won the fight you will kill him.

No-one is ever dead. They’re just faking it.

All you need to do is to get down and tickle them for a time until they can’t take it anymore.

At least, this is what you’d think after seeing the ‘revive’ animation.

If a fantasy game focuses too much on logic I can guarantee you that your character wont be the only thing dead and there will be no way that game will ever make it back from the underworld.

The problem is not in the absence of death in GW2, the problem is that writers decided to use murder (out of all things) as a center of plot, ignoring the revive-fest of their own game.
It’s stupid and kinda lame.

Isslair.4908:

The problem is not in the absence of death in GW2, the problem is that writers decided to use murder (out of all things) as a center of plot, ignoring the revive-fest of their own game.
It’s stupid and kinda lame.

Hmm?
There are at least 2 people that permanently die in the Personal story.
And as has been stated several times in this very thread revivable people = unconscious while dead people = dead.