Guild Wars 2

Perhaps i am the only one, maybe the majority will agree with me, i feel like Agony Resistance is unnecessarily complicated.

I still do not understand how the new Agony Resistant will work next patch, im not the smartest guy, i am a visual learner so perhaps i wont understand it until i see it work in game.

However, Agony Resistance in general feels incredibly unnecessarily complicated.

When Infusions were first announced this time last year i was lead to believe we would receive a number of new infusions over the year that would have us collect them in order to defend ourselves against whatever current enemy. Instead Agony remains the only threat we must defend ourselves against via Infusions, and Agony Resistance on gear feels clunky, poorly designed and unnecessary, particularly since the original concept for Infusions seems to have been abandon.

Make Agony Resistance work EXACTLY like the new Magic Find, however you can only acquire Agony Resist via Fractal Dungeons.

It will be account wide, no more grind for alts and that would fit perfectly with the new account fractal level. Its easier to manage, easier to stack (cap it at the appropriate amount).

Once level 500 Jeweler is released and we start making Ascended gems we can fill the slots with them instead of a boring mandatory complicated resistance stat that is only worthwhile in Fractals and no where else in game.

I believe this would be the best approach to Agony Resistance. I dont see a single negative and the positives are extremely good.

As for how agony resistance affects you, see http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Agony

As for how to attain agony resistance after the patch:

• Existing infusion slots will continue to allow for normal infusions that may or may not have +5 AR.
• Infused rings and back items will no longer have an inherent +5 AR, but rather an AR-only infusion slot that will start with a +5 AR-only infusion
• AR-only infusions can be combined with Thermocatalytic Reagent (TR) as follows:
  • (1 AR) + (1 AR) + TR = (2 AR)
  • (2 AR) + (2 AR) + TR = (3 AR)
  • (3 AR) + (3 AR) + TR = (4 AR)
  • etc

It just sounds complicated at the moment. Once you see the description coupled with a pretty user interface it will make more sense. I understand it now and I think its a cool idea. Ill probably never go far above level 40 fractals because they havnt done much to increase the rewards but for those that like to go super high, the agony changes will be good for them. I do find it funny that its not account wide. So even though all your characters will be on the same reward level they still wont be able to do high level cause they will not have the resistance thus almost nullifying the change they made.

Though I suppose if your high level you probably have a few spare rings lying around to give to your alts, especially since those genius game developers at anet still havnt found something else for us to do with the metric kitten ton of rings we have sitting in our banks.

The formula is: 2x(n-1)[AR] + TR = 1x N [AR] | N being Agony Resistance. TR being Thermocatalytic Reagent.

So say you want a +10AR infusions your N = 10 so it will look like this:

2x(10-1)[AR] + TR = 1x 10[AR]
2x 9[AR] + TR = 1x 10[AR]

So if you want a +10AR infusion you need to acquire two +9AR infusions to combine into one +10AR infusion. So you can just plug in the formula to see what you need. What we know now is that +1AR stuff drops from fractals. Nobody knows if there will be higher ones that drop from the chest like +2 or +5 or even higher. On top of that nobody knows if the current basic +5 can be used with the +1AR stuff that drops in Fractals to make +6.

Another example say you want +3 AR infusions.

2x(3-1)[AR] + TR = 1x 3[AR]
2x 2[AR] + TR = 1x 3[AR]

So you need to combine two +2AR to make a +3 AR. Hope that helps.

I want to play this game for fun, not do algebra

Maybe this will help you understand how it works. (It’s my understanding of it, so it could be pretty far off of how it actually works.) Sorry for my horrid art, but it’s all I can do with my low level of skill.

Another way to look at it is to see what the part list would be from scratch.
For a +N infusion, you’ll need 2^(N-1) +1 drops, and 2^(N-1)-1 Thermo Reagents.
So, for a +10, you’ll start with 512 +1’s, and 511 TR’s

512 +1’s & 256 TRs ==> 256 +2’s
256 +2’s & 128 TRs ==> 128 +3’s
128 +3’s & 64 TRs ==> 64 +4’s
64 +4’s & 32 TRs ==> 32 +5’s
32 +5’s & 16 TRs ==> 16 +6’s
16 +6’s & 8 TRs ==> 8 +7’s
8 +7’s & 4 TRs ==> 4 +8’s
4 +8’s & 2 TRs ==> 2 +9’s
2 +9’s & 1 TR ==> 1 +10

btw, you’re gonna spend 7g65s on TR’s to make that +10.

PS – People often call Polynomial growth (n^c) “Exponential”, but this is proper Expontential growth (c^n), which just gets downright scary.

Morsus.5106:

Maybe this will help you understand how it works. (It’s my understanding of it, so it could be pretty far off of how it actually works.) Sorry for my horrid art, but it’s all I can do with my low level of skill.

Great simple graph to help the OP. And yes that is how it works except you just have to add in Thermocatalytic Reagent for the left side since you need that as a material to upgrade to higher AR infusions.

rodadams.5963:

Another way to look at it is to see what the part list would be from scratch.
For a +N infusion, you’ll need 2^(N-1) +1 drops, and 2^(N-1)-1 Thermo Reagents.
So, for a +10, you’ll start with 512 +1’s, and 511 TR’s

512 +1’s & 256 TRs ==> 256 +2’s
256 +2’s & 128 TRs ==> 128 +3’s
128 +3’s & 64 TRs ==> 64 +4’s
64 +4’s & 32 TRs ==> 32 +5’s
32 +5’s & 16 TRs ==> 16 +6’s
16 +6’s & 8 TRs ==> 8 +7’s
8 +7’s & 4 TRs ==> 4 +8’s
4 +8’s & 2 TRs ==> 2 +9’s
2 +9’s & 1 TR ==> 1 +10

btw, you’re gonna spend 7g65s on TR’s to make that +10.

PS – People often call Polynomial growth (n^c) “Exponential”, but this is proper Expontential growth (c^n), which just gets downright scary.

Image the cost of +20s :X

Do the gem store item splitters remove the infusions too? If so this seems like another cheeky way of anet pushing more crap from their gem store because people will be forever needing to remove the infusion to upgrade it to the next level… Or am i missing something here?

CuRtoKy.8576:

rodadams.5963:

Another way to look at it is to see what the part list would be from scratch.
For a +N infusion, you’ll need 2^(N-1) +1 drops, and 2^(N-1)-1 Thermo Reagents.
So, for a +10, you’ll start with 512 +1’s, and 511 TR’s

512 +1’s & 256 TRs ==> 256 +2’s
256 +2’s & 128 TRs ==> 128 +3’s
128 +3’s & 64 TRs ==> 64 +4’s
64 +4’s & 32 TRs ==> 32 +5’s
32 +5’s & 16 TRs ==> 16 +6’s
16 +6’s & 8 TRs ==> 8 +7’s
8 +7’s & 4 TRs ==> 4 +8’s
4 +8’s & 2 TRs ==> 2 +9’s
2 +9’s & 1 TR ==> 1 +10

btw, you’re gonna spend 7g65s on TR’s to make that +10.

PS – People often call Polynomial growth (n^c) “Exponential”, but this is proper Expontential growth (c^n), which just gets downright scary.

Image the cost of +20s :X

+20AR:
524,288 +1’s, and 7843g33s worth of TR’s.

Assuming you could somehow store all that in one go (it’s ~27x more than 8×20 slot bags), and crafting speed levels out to around 2/s after the first few, you’d be standing in front of the artificing station watching them go by for around 3 days.

Edit: messed up a decimal on gold cost.

Here are the calculations:

AR 1 – 10 graph

AR 11 – 20 Graph

Yeah… if that’s really how it works and if higher than +1 infusions will never drop at higher levels, I won’t be playing this dungeon or any other part of the game again.

Good luck getting past +10, also the above is true if you hold on to all your infusions. If you use any of your infusions, you will have to most likely start from scratch unless maybe the auction house splitter works on this. oops maybe i gave them an evil idea, sorry folks =/

CuRtoKy.8576:

Morsus.5106:

Maybe this will help you understand how it works. (It’s my understanding of it, so it could be pretty far off of how it actually works.) Sorry for my horrid art, but it’s all I can do with my low level of skill.

Great simple graph to help the OP. And yes that is how it works except you just have to add in Thermocatalytic Reagent for the left side since you need that as a material to upgrade to higher AR infusions.

Lol, I didn’t realize I forgot about the Thermocatalytic Reagent until after I’d made it. Here’s the updated version that includes it.

ZilentNight.5089:

Good luck getting past +10, also the above is true if you hold on to all your infusions. If you use any of your infusions, you will have to most likely start from scratch unless maybe the auction house splitter works on this. oops maybe i gave them an evil idea, sorry folks =/

Can’t you simply just replace the infusion like how they work now?

This is more serious stuff than cals!

The only way this whole process is going to work without costing us a fortune is if the Thermocatalytic Reagent becomes a common drop in fractals. Which is wont…

This thread looks like the blackboard from my sophomore statistics class.

Make it stop.

CuRtoKy.8576:

ZilentNight.5089:

Good luck getting past +10, also the above is true if you hold on to all your infusions. If you use any of your infusions, you will have to most likely start from scratch unless maybe the auction house splitter works on this. oops maybe i gave them an evil idea, sorry folks =/

Can’t you simply just replace the infusion like how they work now?

Yeah, but you’re potentially losing hundreds of +1s by overriding a high-ranked AR infusion. Using the upgrade remover will save you a lot of time and effort. I don’t think I like that. Personally, I think it would be simpler to understand and more user-friendly if it operated similarly to MF, and the Infusion upgrade is either removed, or left as-is.

As ZilentNight has very kindly plotted the graphs to show us the ridiculous amounts of gold we have to spend if all we rely on is +1 infusions, due to the exponential behaviours of the formula, I really think the devs have some alternatives to that. It’s really hard to miss out on that kind of information and I have faith in the developers that they definitely have seen that and made plans for it.