Regarding the gem store
Not trying to get forum banned or anything but.. would you really feel like this if it was a pay to play game?
Example:
WoW. You farm one item in WoW for a year while you’re paying $15 a month and never get it.
i am also going to spread news of this heinous debacle. i would expect this of any other developer BUT not arenanet. so terribly disappointing.
It’s a gamble. Its the community’s own fault that they are pouring out their wallets to obtain a skin on an item… ANET gave us no monthly fees so if this makes them more $ so be it..More $ more content.
Not trying to get forum banned or anything but.. would you really feel like this if it was a pay to play game?
Example:
WoW. You farm one item in WoW for a year while you’re paying $15 a month and never get it.
Not a good comparison I’m afraid.
The WoW gift shop sells everything straight up. No chances, just pay and get it.
What items are or are not hard to get isn’t the issue here.
It’s the fact that people paid for the keys, and that those gave a lot less chance of winning something than was made clear.
WoW rares have nothing to do with this, and neither does sub fee or buy to play.
What? Talking about this page?
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/events/halloween-2012
Says clearly here: The Black Lion Chest is getting a spooky upgrade for Halloween. Between October 23 and November 5 each Black Lion Chest you open has a chance to give you one of six exclusive Halloween-themed weapon skins!
Isn’t this kind of thing common sense anyway? Don’t blame Arenanet if you fail to notice an extremely common business practice in MMOs.
Look, when you see a commercial saying “BUY X NOW FOR A CHANCE TO WIN XYZ!”. Did you honestly expect it to get it easily? No. This is common sense we are talking about, not some nefarious scam to take your money.
It’s a gamble. Its the community’s own fault that they are pouring out their wallets to obtain a skin on an item… ANET gave us no monthly fees so if this makes them more $ so be it..More $ more content.
You’re very correct on that one: it is a gamble, and this game is squeezing out all the money of the gem shop it can.
But more cash, more content is one thing.
Less happy customers, less sales in the future, less content… is also a thing to consider.
Not trying to get forum banned or anything but.. would you really feel like this if it was a pay to play game?
Example:
WoW. You farm one item in WoW for a year while you’re paying $15 a month and never get it.
The problem the OP is highlighting isn’t that it takes a lot of time or money or whatever to get the skins that people are hoping to get by opening the chests; it’s that it wasn’t made clear from the event update notes in the beginning that it was going to be very very rare. So people feel cheated because they thought they had a higher chance of getting a Halloween-themed item from the chests. The word ‘rare’ was only thrown in, almost as if it’s an afterthought, after everyone started QQing/ragequitting.
What? Talking about this page?
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/events/halloween-2012Says clearly here: The Black Lion Chest is getting a spooky upgrade for Halloween. Between October 23 and November 5 each Black Lion Chest you open has a chance to give you one of six exclusive Halloween-themed weapon skins!
Isn’t this kind of thing common sense anyway? Don’t blame Arenanet if you fail to notice an extremely common business practice in MMOs.
Look, when you see a commercial saying “BUY X NOW FOR A CHANCE TO WIN XYZ!”. Did you honestly expect it to get it easily? No. This is common sense we are talking about, not some nefarious scam to take your money.
The word exclusive means it’s just for Halloween.
The word ‘rare’ or ‘elusive’ would have been clearer.
Look, you have a point: every sales pitch sounds like that, thats what sales pitches are.
But if you think this game can afford falling to the standards of second hand cars salesmen’s salespitches… you’re wrong.
It’s extremely risky for an MMO to disapoint the majority of it’s players, especially when it concerns selling things for real money.
Thin ice, real thin ice…
@War
A company that talks highly of their community and of their business usually doesn’t do this. Being told this constantly gains trust. So no. It has to do with the company which is why companys like EA are looked down apon and others like Valve are treated highly. I guess I am too trusting. Also if you would read the post I mention the word “chance.” Chance doesn’t mean rare. Also none of the items in there would I even classify as being worth 100+ dollars or even 50. To not get one single thing is insane.
What? Talking about this page?
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/events/halloween-2012Says clearly here: The Black Lion Chest is getting a spooky upgrade for Halloween. Between October 23 and November 5 each Black Lion Chest you open has a chance to give you one of six exclusive Halloween-themed weapon skins!
Isn’t this kind of thing common sense anyway? Don’t blame Arenanet if you fail to notice an extremely common business practice in MMOs.
Look, when you see a commercial saying “BUY X NOW FOR A CHANCE TO WIN XYZ!”. Did you honestly expect it to get it easily? No. This is common sense we are talking about, not some nefarious scam to take your money.
The word exclusive means it’s just for Halloween.
The word ‘rare’ or ‘elusive’ would have been clearer.Look, you have a point: every sales pitch sounds like that, thats what sales pitches are.
But if you think this game can afford falling to the standards of second hand cars salesmen’s salespitches… you’re wrong.
It’s extremely risky for an MMO to disapoint the majority of it’s players, especially when it concerns selling things for real money.Thin ice, real thin ice…
I am sorry but if people honestly lack the common sense to believe that the skins from a random gamble box is going to be common because of the word “chance”. Then I honestly do not know what kind of world you live in.
The developers made a triple AAA MMORPG with 0 monthly fees and from the looks of it, quality AND frequent updates judging from their plans(Nov big release as well). But because they use the word chance in describing the rate of acquiring skins, now they are somehow trying to squeeze every last drop of your hard earned money.
You guys are killing me here.
@OP
I dislike posting in more than one place, talk on reddit.
@War
A company that talks highly of their community and of their business usually doesn’t do this. Being told this constantly gains trust. So no. It has to do with the company which is why companys like EA are looked down apon and others like Valve are treated highly. I guess I am too trusting. Also if you would read the post I mention the word “chance.” Chance doesn’t mean rare. Also none of the items in there would I even classify as being worth 100+ dollars or even 50. To not get one single thing is insane.
this is really the issue here. because of GW1 and their policies Arena net built up a very good reputation with their fans, much like valve has done.
We knew this was going to be RNG, we all knew we had a “chance” to get what we wanted or not. but because the PERCENTAGE was unknown, we guessed, and many of us who made the leap of faith are not new customers, but some of the older GW vets. We thought Arena nets policies would be at least similar to their old one. We where wrong, and got burned for it. Trust is a very important thing for an MMO, I waited years for even bits of information on GW2 based on that trust. and I will not make the same mistake again.
(edited by Rainasa.3471)
What smart business people do is this: give customers the feeling they win something, no matter how small.
Why do you think many scratch lottery tickets give small ammounts?
To make you feel good and buy more…
They should have stuffed every chest with silly halloween consumables.
Add a lot of temprorary fun items and gear that is exclusive but by no means rare.
And in the midst of all of that fun sillyness, throw in the rare pieces.
Outcries would have been a lot less.
What? Talking about this page?
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/events/halloween-2012Says clearly here: The Black Lion Chest is getting a spooky upgrade for Halloween. Between October 23 and November 5 each Black Lion Chest you open has a chance to give you one of six exclusive Halloween-themed weapon skins!
Isn’t this kind of thing common sense anyway? Don’t blame Arenanet if you fail to notice an extremely common business practice in MMOs.
Look, when you see a commercial saying “BUY X NOW FOR A CHANCE TO WIN XYZ!”. Did you honestly expect it to get it easily? No. This is common sense we are talking about, not some nefarious scam to take your money.
The word exclusive means it’s just for Halloween.
The word ‘rare’ or ‘elusive’ would have been clearer.Look, you have a point: every sales pitch sounds like that, thats what sales pitches are.
But if you think this game can afford falling to the standards of second hand cars salesmen’s salespitches… you’re wrong.
It’s extremely risky for an MMO to disapoint the majority of it’s players, especially when it concerns selling things for real money.Thin ice, real thin ice…
I think Kimbald has it right. Holiday-themed cosmetics are fun for the holiday and then you put them away for a year. They shouldn’t be that rare – what fun is a Halloween party if only one guy has a costume? In other MMOs I’ve played, the game makers were pretty generous with holiday cosmetics, and everyone had fun.
IMO, Anet should have just sold the skins straight up in the shop for the week and everyone would have been happy.
p.s. I’d be happy if they removed BLTC chests from the game. Locked they are virtually worthless, unlocked, they are worth less than the key. They give chests everywhere a bad name.
Oh, you guys are correct then. I haven’t bought any keys. That’s pretty lame if they changed their mind after people spent IRL money on keys.
@War A pistol has a chance to hit a target at several yards away. A rocket launcher fired at the same target has a chance to hit the target. You see a problem here with the lack of specifics. Man, it almost sounds like they are equal. Now let me help you out. A Pistol has a low chance to hit a target 100 yards away. A rocket launcher has a great chance to hit the target 100 yards away. You see the meaning? I bet you don’t.
(edited by IomegadriveOne.5291)
What? Talking about this page?
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/events/halloween-2012Says clearly here: The Black Lion Chest is getting a spooky upgrade for Halloween. Between October 23 and November 5 each Black Lion Chest you open has a chance to give you one of six exclusive Halloween-themed weapon skins!
Isn’t this kind of thing common sense anyway? Don’t blame Arenanet if you fail to notice an extremely common business practice in MMOs.
Look, when you see a commercial saying “BUY X NOW FOR A CHANCE TO WIN XYZ!”. Did you honestly expect it to get it easily? No. This is common sense we are talking about, not some nefarious scam to take your money.
The word exclusive means it’s just for Halloween.
The word ‘rare’ or ‘elusive’ would have been clearer.Look, you have a point: every sales pitch sounds like that, thats what sales pitches are.
But if you think this game can afford falling to the standards of second hand cars salesmen’s salespitches… you’re wrong.
It’s extremely risky for an MMO to disapoint the majority of it’s players, especially when it concerns selling things for real money.Thin ice, real thin ice…
I am sorry but if people honestly lack the common sense to believe that the skins from a random gamble box is going to be common because of the word “chance”. Then I honestly do not know what kind of world you live in.
The developers made a triple AAA MMORPG with 0 monthly fees and from the looks of it, quality AND frequent updates judging from their plans(Nov big release as well). But because they use the word chance in describing the rate of acquiring skins, now they are somehow trying to squeeze every last drop of your hard earned money.
You guys are killing me here.
@OP
I dislike posting in more than one place, talk on reddit.
Could you stop the argument about ‘no sub fee’ please.
This always makes it sound as if the dev’s are doing us a favour by doing all this.
They aren’t, they’re making money. It’s their job to keep the game running, or they will never sell another game again. or an expansion box for that matter.
You call us naive for believing they would give decent droprates on event items, yet you somehow think that a no sub fee game isn’t about making money?
The moment they have to throw in money to keep the game running, they will pull the plug. Sub fee free or not.
yes they did a great job on many fronts, and no it’s not perfect on all fronts.
But end of the matter is that they are selling a product, not giving us their charity.
I’ll add an example, to show how the ‘sub free’ part really works:
if they pulled this of in GW1, they would never have sold many gems or keys in GW2…
(edited by Kimbald.2697)
What? Talking about this page?
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/events/halloween-2012Says clearly here: The Black Lion Chest is getting a spooky upgrade for Halloween. Between October 23 and November 5 each Black Lion Chest you open has a chance to give you one of six exclusive Halloween-themed weapon skins!
Isn’t this kind of thing common sense anyway? Don’t blame Arenanet if you fail to notice an extremely common business practice in MMOs.
Look, when you see a commercial saying “BUY X NOW FOR A CHANCE TO WIN XYZ!”. Did you honestly expect it to get it easily? No. This is common sense we are talking about, not some nefarious scam to take your money.
The word exclusive means it’s just for Halloween.
The word ‘rare’ or ‘elusive’ would have been clearer.Look, you have a point: every sales pitch sounds like that, thats what sales pitches are.
But if you think this game can afford falling to the standards of second hand cars salesmen’s salespitches… you’re wrong.
It’s extremely risky for an MMO to disapoint the majority of it’s players, especially when it concerns selling things for real money.Thin ice, real thin ice…
I am sorry but if people honestly lack the common sense to believe that the skins from a random gamble box is going to be common because of the word “chance”. Then I honestly do not know what kind of world you live in.
The developers made a triple AAA MMORPG with 0 monthly fees and from the looks of it, quality AND frequent updates judging from their plans(Nov big release as well). But because they use the word chance in describing the rate of acquiring skins, now they are somehow trying to squeeze every last drop of your hard earned money.
You guys are killing me here.
@OP
I dislike posting in more than one place, talk on reddit.
Could you stop the argument about ‘no sub fee’ please.
This always makes it sound as if the dev’s are doing us a favour by doing all this.
They aren’t, they’re making money. It’s their job to keep the game running, or they will never sell another game again. or an expansion box for that matter.
You call us naive for believing they would give decent droprates on event items, yet you somehow think that a no sub fee game isn’t about making money?The moment they have to throw in money to keep the game running, they will pull the plug. Sub fee free or not.
yes they did a great job on many fronts, and no it’s not perfect on all fronts.
But end of the matter is that they are selling a product, not giving us their charity.
and my point is simple. You believe they are somehow deviously scamming players out of their money due to greed. They chose to make the game entirely free when they could have easily charged 15 bucks a month just like every other MMO and people would have paid for it. Now because they used the word CHANCE, the company is now suddenly EA level while obviously great companies like Valve, the maker of games like Dota2 and hat-for, I meant Team Fortress 2 would NEVER do something like this right? Face it, this is common sense, the literal definition of the word chance is unpredictable. It seems common sense is something that people seems to be lacking at the moment, probably due to how late it is.
You cannot talk about how greedy they are when everything they have done have been in the complete opposite direction, this include from game design to business practice.
I don’t know what’s the issue here. Personally, I opened maybe 25-30 chests, and got nothing. But, that’s something I accept as “tough luck”. Sure, I feel disappointed, but then I see that people are getting skins on their first or hundredth try, so it’s no different from any other rng in game.
Remember that the price of the Black lion keys hasn’t changed. It was the same before the event. Anet just added an incentive for people who wouldn’t normally buy them, to gamble for a cool reward. I remember there was a video of someone opening 500 chests or so, to try and get the permanent banker/tp, but he didn’t. Did he go about blaming Anet, and acting as if it’s Anet’s fault that RNG didn’t favour him?
You are acting quite immature OP, if you believe that you are entitled to a reward JUST because you spent some money on an item that has a chance for an EXTRA reward, along with the normal rewards.
Raichi – Sylvari Mesmer (Strike Force)
Stormbluff Isle
@Mouse Another “entitled” post. No I feel like I was mislead on how rare the items actually were. I would not spend that much money on BLC’s. If I wanted boosters I would buy boosters. If I wanted repair canisters I would buy repair canisters. That is a fundamental flaw with BLC’s in general. They offer nothing I couldn’t go ahead and buy if I wanted to. Except. Surprise surprise. Halloween skins.
I would just like to point out that for that much money you could probably buy all of the skins from the trading post..
@sam Yep that seems messed up as well. At least then I could get SOMETHING.
Anet is a business, they’re trying to make money.
Too bad the greedy lottery chests will turn off a ton of people and cause them to not spend a dime later on.
Player trust > Quick Cash In.
They should change the Halloween event name to “Trick or Trick”
Ignicity – 80 Necromancer
Unreal Aussies [uA] – Isle of Janthir
Now can anyone explain why I’m feeling dissapointed that there aren’t any bow skins when I’d already decided I wasn’t going to get the weapon skins anyway?
I guess even after the fact having the decision taken out of my hands feels dissapointing. Especially with the general “pay to play” theme of the Halloween event leaving a bad taste in my mouth. (Or that might be the burnt toast I was eating while I was reading about it.)
“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”
Anet is laughing all the way to the bank with this…
It’s crazy how much money people are spending for basically nothing in return. Even if you’re using gold to gems you’re crazy with the current conversion rate. I suspect most people are paying the cash straight in to Anets pocket though.
…It’s sad, whatever happened to the days where you could earn everything in game?
F2P happened
Ignicity – 80 Necromancer
Unreal Aussies [uA] – Isle of Janthir
I agree I was very disappointed when I saw the skins where in black lion boxes. They contain mostly crap, and I would rather just buy the skins for gems straight up. I will not be buying any keys, I am not a gambler. I will buy a costume and that is it. If they decide to put the skins in the gem store, I will buy one of them also. I thought Anet was better then this though really.
from what i see in the forum and what ive spend on the game unlocking chests. its just been really poorly executed. game is not F2P its a B2P game first off (one annoying thing there was people who spent extra money getting the upgraded edition for perks that expired but so be it, then they made a normal copy upgradable with gems, which at the time ended making it cheapers to upgrade then spend real money, terrible business decision that.
now with the chance chests as they are, it seems more people are annoyed then not and more ppl feel ripped off, so instead of running with chance and pissing off 90% of the players, it would have been better to increase the odds or add different yet themed content into the chests so it doesnt just feel like its bugged.
since the effect of this is more likely to encourage players who spend money to not spend anymore, gambling is one thing, but keeping paying players happy is also another.
all in all i think was poorly thought out and executed by ANet which is a pity i thought they were doing some good work deserving of lots of people spending money on the game. unfortunately my opinion is being swayed now towards spending my gaming money each month on something else.
First off to the clueless spouting the game is free, it is not.
Second, anytime a game mechanic is wrapped into a microtransaction store like Anet has done with the legendaries and WVWvW they will fail in time, people WILL stop using the gemstore as they find they receive nothing in return. Those watching the rich buy what they want because they can simply smile and state it is my money i will do what i want with it, and Anet will court them, and hold their hands and wallets never looking back at the rest of us, all the while making insane content requirements that mesh with their gemstore. This isnt an afterthought, it is carefully planned.
A monthly sub doesnt sound bad compared to the continued alternative.
Do not forget the families that are overdrawn on CC cards and addicted to MMO’s, that is something i guarantee Anet has discussed and has targeted, players with low willpower. I have seen this to often as a business mechanic, one reason i will never give a dime to their gemstore.
Kudos for the good, but there is simply too much glaring bad to keep this game popular for the long haul with its current RL money mechanic sink.
200$? why not buy gold instead, the priciest skin is only what… 75g?
www.Spectre-guild.com
It way “chance” is being interpreted is the main problem.
“When you open a chest you have a chance to get one these items”
Person A: “Oh goody, whenever I open a chest i’ll get one of these items and if I’m lucky I’ll get the one i want. If not, ah well I can trade for the one I want.”
Person B: “Oh deary, only a chance to get a weapon? And then it’s still random which one I’ll get? Maybe I should hold off on this…”
Person A’s line of thought is not far fetched. The chests are stocked with Halloween items, and you get a chance at these 6. I can easily understand this reasoning. Personally I was of the same idea. That still wouldn’t mean that e.g. the chainsaw is as common as the other items.
Clearly all the Person B’s are the winners here.
In GW1 when buying something from the store, a ‘chance’ to win something meant something completely different.
It was a reasonable chance while still involving some luck.
Fair trade of, it made Anet look good.
That’s what they used now, except not mentioning that ‘chance’ had changed meaning over time in GW2…
I feel for those who feel they’ve been cheated and I can understand where others would just blow off their misfortune as foolish optimism… But there is one thing you can do instead of complain, suggest that the BLCs be removed from the game. If no one wants to use them, the keys don’t sell and the community asks that they be removed, perhaps they will be and all purchases through the gem store will be guaranteed things… like the costumes, a lot of the threads talking about the costumes have a completely opposite vibe than this thread, saying how “worth it” it was.. It would be nice to see that be the overall feeling of all purchases in the Gem Store.
Not trying to get forum banned or anything but.. would you really feel like this if it was a pay to play game?
Example:
WoW. You farm one item in WoW for a year while you’re paying $15 a month and never get it.
No, I would rather spend a known and relatively small amount month to month for a known chance than an unknown amount for an unknown chance. BTW…there was nothing in WoW that was worth farming for a year.
I supported EQ2 for 5 years, I stopped the day they brought in thier cash shop. I seriously hate that the cash shop is the only way I have to support this game. Give me a subscription option please that automaticly includes all the crap being sold there.