Here's a though: Dhuum should be released

Here's a though: Dhuum should be released

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Posted by: deltanium.7543

deltanium.7543

While planning a personal roleplaying campaign, I have been doing a bit of research on Dhuum. Here’s a summary of my discovery:
1. Dhuum is the former god of death.
2. He was deemed cruel and unjust, appearently due to a fervent intolerance of undeath and ressurection.
3. He was overthrown by Grenth and the seven reaper.
4. He was imprisonned in the hall of Judgement.
5. He broke free, but was subdued again in the events of Guild wars.
6. DHUUM USES ONLY UPPERCASES AND SPEAKS USING THE THIRD PERSON.

So here’s my point: Why is he the bad guy here?

As of yet, I guess he can be blamed for the mess in the underworld in Nightfall and did not win any popularity contest among humans or fellow gods. Furthermore, he has shady alliances with Abaddon… and that’s it?

I mean, one can argue that undeath isn’t necessarely evil, except when it is: The lich, Zaithan, the ascalon shennanigan and whatnot. But beside being a little extremist on the subject-matter, how was he unjust or cruel? Did he hunt his followers for fun or something? Death is an inevitability, so his moto is kind of an axiom rather than a threat. He was assaulted by Grenth and the reapers and was justified in trying to retaliate in the events of Nightfall. I cannot find a single wrongdoing or unjustified transgression about him.

So, if no one intends to take the mantle of prosecutor on this trial and bring counterpoints to the table, here’s my conclusion: let Dhuum out.

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Posted by: Advent.6193

Advent.6193

The problem is that Dhuum punishes even those (arguably few) cases of not-so-evil undeath. I could see a Necro going past a human lifespan, arguably to help protect Tyria from supernatural threats. Grenth, from what we see of him, would most likely let something like that go, unless said Necro abused the power.

As for Dhuum being justified, sure. But at the same time, we can argue Abbadon as also justified – since he got the ol’ Prometheus shafting.

Malegryne (Sylvari Mesmer), Lannka (Asura Thief) – Ferguson’s Crossing: [PRD/BRB/OMFG]
Other 80s: Any but Warrior

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Posted by: Alusian Fareluil.9254

Alusian Fareluil.9254

Dhuum also doesn’t allow resurrections. Therefore, you die, you’re done.

Not exactly what I would call understanding

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Posted by: silvermember.8941

silvermember.8941

Dhuum was supposedly a cruel and unjust god. So the whole mechanic of guild wars 1 or 2 of rezing would be out of business and perma death will be in. I don’t think a lot of players would enjoy perma death.

Anyways to support Dhuum death is absolute, Arenanet made the Avatar that bans players in game Dhuum.

As u know im pro. ~Tomonobu Itagaki

This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.

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Posted by: Plum Butter.4058

Plum Butter.4058

This should probably be in the lore thread but I could be wrong for the fact that he was a human god. Also, in GW2 you don’t actually die. I thought I had the correct blog post talking about this but I was wrong. Essentially since everyone can revive everyone, lore wise you are actually just in an unconscious state waiting to get some to rub you with smelling salts.

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Posted by: Riot Inducer.8964

Riot Inducer.8964

I get the feeling that his being labeled as “cruel and unjust” to the point that he was forcibly overthrown meant he was a lot more harsh than just punishing necromancers with good intentions and putting a ban on resurrections. I’d go out on a limb and say he was probably punishing healers for saving patients who were close to death and similar ways of pushing his influence in unkind ways.

You could even follow this to its logical extreme and say Dhuum was being a sort of “death glutton” and his ban on undeath and resurrection was all to horde as many souls in his realm as possible to increase his own power. In Nightfall you can see Abaddon doing this to build up the power to help him break out of his prison.

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Posted by: deltanium.7543

deltanium.7543

For the Soul-hoarding argument, I would have to ask whether or not resurrection implies the returning of the soul and whether or not the soul is a power-source. As seen by the Lich fight in Guild wars 1, souls can be used as extra 1ups, so the latter is probably true.

About the former, it seems pretty unlikely that Zaithan is returning souls to corpses or that flesh-golems have a soul to begin with or are given one as a result of the summoning. Unlikely, sure, but possible nonetheless.

As far as theories goes, it’s a pretty interesting one, but a theory nonetheless.

As stated, he was deemed cruel and unjust, not greedy. If he was a power-hungry god, it should have been the foremost of Grenth’s motive.

About the premature killing in terminal phase, again, nothing is mentioned if a God was springing around in the hospital or something. It’s unlikely that history would have forgotten about that.

As for the playerbanning, in his entry on the official wiki, it is explicite that Dhuum’s appearance as a part of the process is non-cannon.

About the perma-death argument, I doubt it is a “death” when you fail to rally. You are most likely unconscious and weakened and with your last moment of lucidity, teleport to the nearest asuran way-point when you fall out of combat when you are “considered as dead”. It’s the best shoe-horning I can manage in regard to the canon of the game mechanic. On the other hand, you have the “ressurection orb” which doesn’t leave much to interpretation, and in Guild wars 1, ressurection is the mechanic by which you return a player to an active state and the players were returned to a ressurection Shrine. However, in Guild wars 2, it is refered to as reviving which may be interpreted as ressurection, but may also refer to the return of consciousness (ressucitation, not ressurection). Furthermore, the point at which a player returns is a waypoint, not a ressurection shrine.

Furthermore, I would like to underline a little “thing” about that ban of necromancy: At the time of his reign, the gift of magic was not granted to the humans… so how could they perform necromancy?

From my research, they had a rudimentary understanding of magic, elementalism for the most part, when the humans were brought to Tyria. Could it be that, back then, Necromancy was so unrefined as to be dangerous? What I am trying to say is that the context might have been different back then and the necromancy of the pre-exodus might have not been the best type of magic to use. Speculative nonesense or clever foresight, I really can’t say…

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Posted by: Kenage Achalarus.4276

Kenage Achalarus.4276

To aid himself in his fight against Balthazar, Menzies has made an alliance with Abaddon and “Dhuum’s servants”. As part of this pact with the fallen gods, Menzies once sent three of his Darknesses to lead a force of “Dhuum’s followers and demons” in an attack on The Hall of Heroes through the portal from the Tomb of the Primeval Kings.

The latest movement of Menzies forces holds them in various places within the Realm of Torment. Menzies has also been known to have his forces staged in the endless plane of Ravenheart Gloom, it is unknown if Menzies himself is within this darkened land or not.

while yes it mostly talks about Menzies that fact that Dhumm is part of the allience with Abbadon and the fact that he hunted down all those who escaped death, having promised “death undeniable.” thats what makes him in the eyes of people a bad guy

Sorce:http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Dhumm
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Menzies

a Mesmer with a Greatsword [Confusion], your mind has been [Mind Wrack]

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Posted by: Rolin.7694

Rolin.7694

Dwayna (leader of the gods) didn’t like that Dhuum wouldn’t allow resurrection. Dhuum’s stance was that death should be permanent, but Dwayna, being the goddess of life, thought that sometimes people deserved a second chance.

So she had her son, Grenth, overthrow Dhuum. However, it seem that the gods don’t like to kill their own, as seen from them choosing to imprison Abaddon instead of just smiting him (though chronologically, Dhuum was imprisoned first, since Grenth was around when Abaddon was imprisoned…just using it as the most obvious example). So Grenth imprisons Dhuum in the Hall of Judgement for all of eternity. This gives Dhuum time to develop and foster his hatred for the other gods, which is why he sends his forces to aid Abaddon in breaking free from his prison in the Realm of Torment and aid Menzies in his war against his half-brother Balthazar.

Dhuum also has a hatred for living things, since they are what caused his imprisonment. The other gods’ love for the living is why they wouldn’t allow him to rule the dead the way he saw fit. This hatred just grows when Dhuum finally breaks free of his restraints, but due to his still weakened state, is re-imprisoned by mortals that Grenth’s servants enlisted for the job. So, releasing Dhuum isn’t a good idea, as he’ll try to destroy all life on Tyria.
Even worse, he may even be so bold as to try to aid the Elder Dragons. Though, I’m sure the dragons will simply eat him and absorb his power. It is said that their power rivals, or even surpasses, that of the human gods.

Rolin – Human Ranger – Sanctum of Rall

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Posted by: Twoflower.7031

Twoflower.7031

How do we know he’s not already released? The Underworld seems to be unstable – the portals continuously spew out shades and aataxes, and with the Exodus of the Gods keeping the Underworld closed to us, he could have been released with no one to stop him.