Guild Wars 2

I just want to say, other then the 3 condition removal racial, I don’t ever use any of the other. They just arn’t ‘epic’ enough for me.

I love the asura racials are cool. Haven’t seen the charrzooka yet, but its name is awesome. I’ve tried some of the sylvari’s and some of them can be very useful and annoying in WvW. Haven’t played norn too much but i fought one in WvW where they went bear form. It was like me going lich form.. so i did just that and was able to over power them, but it would of been close had i not used lich form..

Just saying.. these racials that humans have don’t seem that.. epic enough for me to dish out the skill points for. Idk if others feel the same way.

Love your guild name lol! To the subject at hand I feel the same. Not worth the unlock IMO. Of course I’m an engineer that will be WvW focused so Mortar all the way! I hope its as epic as it sounds! Only level 42

the only racials i ever used with an engi was asura and i loved them. technobable and pain inverter work very well with a condition-heavy engineer. but.. these human.. god awful human racials… >.<

and ty about the guild name comment first comment about it outside guild members from gw1 lol

I kinda like Hounds of Balthazar. It’s a good addition to my mesmer build which uses phantasms as tank/bombs. Other than that, the other racials do not really fit my style… but I’m sure some people might like them. Since racials are bound to race and not class, it’s normal they won’t work with all builds or all classes.

yeah i understand that. like i said, the one with the 3 condition removal seems a little useful. not enough to keep it on my bar most of the time, but useful if i know im going to be up against a ton of conditions(that is until i realized how my fourth staff spell works lol)

Just the other races seem to have much cooler moves.

I use the Hounds of Balthazar on my Guardian. The constant burning and high damage work well with my burning-intensive greatsword build.

we need something similar to *spoiler**spoiler**spoiler* the avatar of balthazar from that story line in the priory story. that thing was fricken epic and a lesser version of that would be nothing if not awesome. cmon, its the only god were really missing.

i realized after i posted my last comment that all the gods are there.. idk.. i still think an avatar of balthazar would be better lol

ArtemusHunter.9521:

we need something similar to *spoiler**spoiler**spoiler* the avatar of balthazar from that story line in the priory story. that thing was fricken epic and a lesser version of that would be nothing if not awesome. cmon, its the only god were really missing.

Yes.
Please.

I honestly think an Avatar of every god would be amazing. I don’t use the utilities as a Guardian (much better options) and I’d like something amazing like an Avatar of Kormir where you get to lay down judgment to all (would fit with guardian really well). Just something more amazing like the Golems Asura get. It feels like they designed the racials for Human first, then later on races got more interesting racials and they forgot about Humans.

I do not like what they have done with the Melandru Avatar or Grenth for that matter. where is the Dervish class when you need it.

Having the ability to take the form of balthazar again would definitely be sweet, but I do think that the current racials are more than fine. The hounds let you increase your damage outpot with a press of a button, the reaper form lets you kite easily with chill and poison and melandru lets you clear conditions from yourself and allies and even heal those around you.

Max Level Elite Skill: Avatars of the Gods
A representative of each of the six gods are summoned and do an attack or ability related to their domain. Maybe just one avatar per summon but I like the idea of all six being summoned to do something.

“Z”

I was extremely underwhelmed by the Reaper of Grenth elite skill, I was expecting a transformation of some sort with accompanying skills, a’la the necromancer’s Plague elite. It’s especially pathetic when you look at the power and general “awesome” factor of other race’s elite skills.

Zason.2915:

Max Level Elite Skill: Avatars of the Gods
A representative of each of the six gods are summoned and do an attack or ability related to their domain. Maybe just one avatar per summon but I like the idea of all six being summoned to do something.

“Z”

Well this is where it get complicated from the last game the Gods left for good, so no more Avatars of them. why do the human even have Grenth, and Melandru Avatar.

Riot Inducer.8964:

I was extremely underwhelmed by the Reaper of Grenth elite skill, I was expecting a transformation of some sort with accompanying skills, a’la the necromancer’s Plague elite. It’s especially pathetic when you look at the power and general “awesome” factor of other race’s elite skills.

Yeah i was disappointed at the lack of Grenth look – although for a 2nd option, the black plague look is pretty sinister as well.

After reading this thread I’m really happy I am not the only one who feels our racials are a bit of a lackluster.

Now, while I’m not bothered by elite skills at all – quite on the contrary, I find them really nice regarding the “rule” that says that racials should be underwhelming compared to at least of the most of profession skills and are only there for personal preferrence/flavor. Also to add that ALL the other racial skills have at least few scenarios I’d be glad to use them in.

The real human racial skill problem I feel starts with our non-elite skills – Prayer to Kormir, Prayer to Dwayna and Prayer to Lyssa. I can’t think of any scenario where at least one of these three would be useful to take and I would love to see them get some attention, at least Prayer to Dwayna – all it does is heals you. Every profession has 3 healing skills that are better than this one. Sylvari racial Healing Seed, which heals, applies regen to allies and acts as an aggro breaker if times get a bit rough, is absolutely awesome compared to ours. Add a special effect to this existing skill or completely revamp it. Maybe calls down a spirit of dwayna that applies a minor health shield for to allies? (which would move it to utility skills from healing skills).

Kratic.8763:

Yeah i was disappointed at the lack of Grenth look – although for a 2nd option, the black plague look is pretty sinister as well.

I pretty much see that elite as a fake death shroud and lesser version of the necro elite: Plague; which is by better for kiting and applying conditions..though i guess that makes sense since the racial elites are supposed to be underwhelming in comparison to regular ones..

Acaelus Thorne.3862:

Well this is where it get complicated from the last game the Gods left for good, so no more Avatars of them. why do the human even have Grenth, and Melandru Avatar.

I did not think of that. In that case, I would want them to maybe change the names or change the skills.. Maybe ‘Shroud of Grenth’ and…..something for melandru.. lol

Razor.9132:

After reading this thread I’m really happy I am not the only one who feels our racials are a bit of a lackluster.

Now, while I’m not bothered by elite skills at all – quite on the contrary, I find them really nice regarding the “rule” that says that racials should be underwhelming compared to at least of the most of profession skills and are only there for personal preferrence/flavor. Also to add that ALL the other racial skills have at least few scenarios I’d be glad to use them in.

The real human racial skill problem I feel starts with our non-elite skills – Prayer to Kormir, Prayer to Dwayna and Prayer to Lyssa. I can’t think of any scenario where at least one of these three would be useful to take and I would love to see them get some attention, at least Prayer to Dwayna – all it does is heals you. Every profession has 3 healing skills that are better than this one. Sylvari racial Healing Seed, which heals, applies regen to allies and acts as an aggro breaker if times get a bit rough, is absolutely awesome compared to ours. Add a special effect to this existing skill or completely revamp it. Maybe calls down a spirit of dwayna that applies a minor health shield for to allies? (which would move it to utility skills from healing skills).

I remember trying that dwanya heal.. i think it does more at lower levels, but is no where worth using higher up.. for a necro i pretty much stick with well of blood since its healing is awesome and you can combo with it.

As for the ult racials, the only one I found useful was the one that removes conditions.. and that’s not even remotely useful anymore for me since I sorta work my way to getting conditions on me on purpose.. -.-

Hounds are amazing, dont know wht people are complaining about. Go into WvW with 20 humans all with Hounds on. Start a fight and see the stomp that follows.

@Mizorie: One skill does not make the rest of the racials appealing, though. They need work, especially to make people think about using them instead of regular abilities.

And another point I’d like to make: other races have the options of using these in their builds because they bring unique things to the table – however, the human racials are so bland and uninteresting that the majority of humans use only one. My Asura and Sylvari friends use theirs in place of others, it’s really annoying to look at my racials and not even want to buy them.

I propose these racials get revamped:

Prayer to Dwayna
(Just a heal at 30rc? Not very strong at that? At least give us or allies regeneration when used.)

Prayer to Kormir (Kormir was the new human god of Justice. this should be some sort of Smiting spell instead of a condition removal.)

Prayer to Lyssa (This one is decent, 12rc with random conditions and boons. The only problem I have is that it’s kind of weak – the boon and condition disappears right after use. Perhaps have a dual nature to it? Press once for three boons on yourself, Press twice to swap your boons to conditions on a target? It would fit the nature of Lyssa very well.)

Ashodin.7604:

@Mizorie: One skill does not make the rest of the racials appealing, though. They need work, especially to make people think about using them instead of regular abilities.

And another point I’d like to make: other races have the options of using these in their builds because they bring unique things to the table – however, the human racials are so bland and uninteresting that the majority of humans use only one. My Asura and Sylvari friends use theirs in place of others, it’s really annoying to look at my racials and not even want to buy them.

I propose these racials get revamped:

Prayer to Dwayna
(Just a heal at 30rc? Not very strong at that? At least give us or allies regeneration when used.)

Prayer to Kormir (Kormir was the new human god of Justice. this should be some sort of Smiting spell instead of a condition removal.)

Prayer to Lyssa (This one is decent, 12rc with random conditions and boons. The only problem I have is that it’s kind of weak – the boon and condition disappears right after use. Perhaps have a dual nature to it? Press once for three boons on yourself, Press twice to swap your boons to conditions on a target? It would fit the nature of Lyssa very well.)

That prayer of lyssa idea sounds really awesome. Before I read it I had an idea as to have it be like a signet of lyssa or something. But what you described actually sounds like the better half of plague signet, so chances are that wont happen because then everyone that’s a necro human that uses plague signet in their build would swap to that, and these skills are supposed to be less strong then the normal skills.. hmm..

Thanks man. I think the state of the racials for Humans is really abysmal. I would like in general racials to be stronger overall – comparable and unique to other skills, but not overpowered. I mean, why not? They can only be used in 1/3 of the game anyway, why not make them unique and awesome? I understand the Elites are cool, but they are on a huge recharge.

Ashodin.7604:

Thanks man. I think the state of the racials for Humans is really abysmal. I would like in general racials to be stronger overall – comparable and unique to other skills, but not overpowered. I mean, why not? They can only be used in 1/3 of the game anyway, why not make them unique and awesome? I understand the Elites are cool, but they are on a huge recharge.

racials can be used in WvW and PvE, which I believe is 2/3’s

But yeah, I completely agree with you there.

Acaelus Thorne.3862:

I do not like what they have done with the Melandru Avatar or Grenth for that matter. where is the Dervish class when you need it.

Oh god no. Don’t have fond memories of Grenth Dervs tanking with Monk support. /shutters

I actually unlocked the avatar of Grenth on my necromancer, and after using it once (literally) I never used it again. Maybe it was my mistake that instead of checking how this particular skill works I decided to unlock it straight away. I hoped it will be something more like the avatars from GW, and boy was I upset when it actually turned out to be less powerful combo of Plague and Death Shroud.
I really feel I wasted those 10 skill points. It would be nice if the avatar at least looked cool…

zao.2710:

I actually unlocked the avatar of Grenth on my necromancer, and after using it once (literally) I never used it again. Maybe it was my mistake that instead of checking how this particular skill works I decided to unlock it straight away. I hoped it will be something more like the avatars from GW, and boy was I upset when it actually turned out to be less powerful combo of Plague and Death Shroud.
I really feel I wasted those 10 skill points. It would be nice if the avatar at least looked cool…

exact same reaction I got when I grabbed that skill in the beta. =[ haven’t grabbed it since.

I dont know, prayer to Lyssa is actually pretty cool. It has a very short cool down of 12s and acts as a two-for-one (boon and condition). I actually placed it as my default attack, so when I circle strafe I dont even need to hit the button it just casts when the timer is up unless I am keyboard smashing. It may not seem like much but it saves my hide every day. Nothing like being close to downed and getting off a chill/regen or something or other which helps you escape.

It’d be a waste of Anets time to try to work on any racials, seeing as Charrzooka is the best, hands down. I mean, why even play anything besides the master race when that ability exists? Who even does that?

But, seriously, any work done to make the racials prevalent is good in my book. Even making news ones, too. Avatar of Dwayna, anyone?

Gotta agree. The humans got royally screwed over on racial skills. Prayer to Dwayna is actually my WEAKEST healing skill, the Avatar of So-and-Sos seem pretty useless, and while Hounds of Balthazar is pretty awesome, the recharge time is obscenely high for how briefly they last. They either need to last longer or recharge faster for them to be worth using, I’ve found.

It makes me wish I’d chosen almost any other race for my Ranger, but I’m too far in now to turn around.

It doesn’t bother me that the racials are pretty weak. I do wish they were more interesting, however. The elites and Prayer to Lyssa are fine, but Prayer to Dwayna and Prayer to Kormir are just incredibly dull skills that aren’t fun to use. Compare those to the heal and utilities of other races. Summons, positional skills, party buffs, Charr and Asura even get combo abilities.

The point of racial skills doesn’t seem to be power, but flavor. What these abilities say is that norn are the wilderness race, asura are the technology race, sylvari are the plant race, charr are the military race, and humans are the Ned Flanders race.

Gods and plain vanilla.

Johnny Whoa.8126:

Gotta agree. The humans got royally screwed over on racial skills. Prayer to Dwayna is actually my WEAKEST healing skill, the Avatar of So-and-Sos seem pretty useless, and while Hounds of Balthazar is pretty awesome, the recharge time is obscenely high for how briefly they last. They either need to last longer or recharge faster for them to be worth using, I’ve found.

It makes me wish I’d chosen almost any other race for my Ranger, but I’m too far in now to turn around.

yeah I’m usually torn between lich form for epic reasons(scared off a norn that used a racial elite on me once in WvW with just lich form lol) and flesh golem mainly for the fact that it last’s SOO long due to the regen it has after battle, and the cd feeling like nothing because of that.

I just bought hounds last night, yet to try it, bought it for the sheer fact of not having to buy it later.. -.-

Zahmahkibo.6375:

It doesn’t bother me that the racials are pretty weak. I do wish they were more interesting, however. The elites and Prayer to Lyssa are fine, but Prayer to Dwayna and Prayer to Kormir are just incredibly dull skills that aren’t fun to use. Compare those to the heal and utilities of other races. Summons, positional skills, party buffs, Charr and Asura even get combo abilities.

The point of racial skills doesn’t seem to be power, but flavor. What these abilities say is that norn are the wilderness race, asura are the technology race, sylvari are the plant race, charr are the military race, and humans are the Ned Flanders race.

Gods and plain vanilla.

I seriously lol’d at the Ned Flanders bit xD then I sighed because it’s so fricken true..

ArtemusHunter.9521:

Zahmahkibo.6375:

The point of racial skills doesn’t seem to be power, but flavor. What these abilities say is that norn are the wilderness race, asura are the technology race, sylvari are the plant race, charr are the military race, and humans are the Ned Flanders race.

Gods and plain vanilla.

I seriously lol’d at the Ned Flanders bit xD then I sighed because it’s so fricken true..

Quoted for truth.

zao.2710:

I actually unlocked the avatar of Grenth on my necromancer, and after using it once (literally) I never used it again. Maybe it was my mistake that instead of checking how this particular skill works I decided to unlock it straight away. I hoped it will be something more like the avatars from GW, and boy was I upset when it actually turned out to be less powerful combo of Plague and Death Shroud.
I really feel I wasted those 10 skill points. It would be nice if the avatar at least looked cool…

I’m a Human Necromancer and seeing as the other options I have as a Nec are much better, I pretty much never use this skill. I know that they have balanced the racials to not be overpowered so that there’s not a significant racial advantage for any one race, and in light of that, I at least was hoping for something visually flashy.

Aesthetically, I can barely tell the difference between it and Death Shroud. :/

I’d like something amazing like an Avatar of Kormir where you get to lay down judgment to all (would fit with guardian really well).

Would make an awesome skill, except for Grenth is actually the god of judgment.

I really loved the idea of all of the human racial skills being centered around the six gods, and was very excited to actually use them, but once I saw them and compared them to my profession skills and other racial skills, I was very disappointed. Playing a necromancer, I found several flaws with human racial skills, and would propose a few changes:
Prayer to Dwayna – only slightly stronger than Consume Conditions, but lacks the additional effect of removing conditions to apply extra healing. As an added fault, the recharge on Prayer to Dwayna is longer, making it solidly worse. I would suggest (as others have above) adding boons to this skill. Not necessarily regeneration, retaliation would be an interesting boon to mix things up.
Prayer to Kormir – I saw this skill as the largest disappointment. As I am a necromancer, skills such as Consume Conditions, Well of Power or Plague Signet are all better choices. I admit, this type of condition specialization is not available to all professions, but even so, Prayer to Kormir lacks much creativity. I would propose looking more into what Kormir is: Blind Truth. Why not do something like apply blindness to the user in return for converting all conditions into boons? That at least sounds worth the utility slot to me.
Prayer to Lyssa – This is actually one of my favourite human racials, with its short recharge it is very usable and can be very interesting.
Reaper of Grenth – Extremely disappointing skill. I spent a long time comparing it the Plague, and still decided Plague was simply better. Yes, Reaper of Grenth allows you to still cast weapon and utility skills, but the conditions it applies do not stack with intensity, and the only damage it deals is from Poison, making it deal very little total damage at all. With regards to the appearance, I just look like I am in death shroud, which (like everyone else in this thread) I found extremely disappointing. At the very least, I would add a base damage per second to this skill, though I think life steal would be amazing. Of course, would love to see a new appearance.
Avatar of Melandru – Not bad, a decent area buff skill. However (it might just be me) I didn’t like the form was large enough. I think of oakhearts as huge and impressive, and I did not feel like that translated at all.
Hounds of Balthazar – Doesn’t need anything.

I liked how the 3 non-elite skills make your character say something, and would enjoy that being carried into the elites. Throughout writing this, I have consistently thought back to the Norn Bear; the human gods have been a huge part of Tyrian history, and it is sad to see them so out shined by the spirits of the wild.

Seconded. Human Avatars bug the crap out of me.

They were epic in GW1.

In GW2, Eles have whirlwind form, necros have reaper form, Asura have golems, Norn turn into animal forms, and humans…

Well, one form surrounds them in insects and another surrounds them in a black cloud as if they hadn’t bathed in years.

I wouldn’t be bothered quite as much if avatars weren’t so kitten epic in GW1, I have a hard time fathoming how anyone thought what’s currently there is sufficient.

While I’m not wild about all of the Human racial skills, I think that most of them have some kind of usefulness (depending on your class). For example, my poison focused Thief loves using Reaper of Grenth since my trait choices apply a short stack of Weakness whenever I apply a stack of Poison. Since the Grenth aura constantly applies stacks to anything around you, my Thief can chain Weakness someone while also getting access to Chill (which we almost never have access to).

The only thing that I have an issue with is the condition removal utility power. While it’s good for classes who have poor condition removal, the recast timer isn’t particularly impressive and I’ve have a hard time justifying a utility slot for that power.

Hounds of Balthazar is pretty useful if you are a solo player. As a guardian with a buffer/dps build, i find that having a couple of allies i can buff is pretty useful. they also deal way more damage then any other guardian alite, and also more then the mistfire wolf (that i also have and i think it’s quite powerful if you can’t use the hounds)

Kidel.2057:

Hounds of Balthazar is pretty useful if you are a solo player. As a guardian with a buffer/dps build, i find that having a couple of allies i can buff is pretty useful. they also deal way more damage then any other guardian alite, and also more then the mistfire wolf (that i also have and i think it’s quite powerful if you can’t use the hounds)

Yeah but as a necro, and only as a necro, I find myself not ever using any racial. I have wells or staff spells that can do most of what the other skills can do. Condition transference is a breeze with putrid mark, and i actually have a great area weakness combo with that spell, so the condition racials are obsolete. The healing racial has nothing on well of blood, and the elites get over shined by lich form and even flesh golem. If i really needed to buff my team, I’d out my spectral grasp to well of power or something, but never a racial.

I’d love to use them, but they just suck for me T-T

i have a 80 warrior and find balthazar’s hound to kinda rubbish, all human elites for that matter.
don’t get me wrong i love these chubby little cuties, however they get killed all the time.
seriously, it’s an elite skills with four minutes cd and they get killed before they can even get one attack off.
avatar of grenth would be ok if it wouldn’t last only 15 sec.
avatar of melandru is just plain bad.

having said that, i as a warrior am stuck with either
juggernaut, which sucks,
battle standard, which has an outrageous cooldown or
signet of rage, which is as bland as it is, is by far the best of my elites, especially in conjunction with the signet loadout.

now that i for some reason turned this into a warrior’s elite rant; i have to conclude in saying, that i find it to be good that racials are not that big of a deal most of the time.

prayer to kormir is by far the strongest racial we have and i’m glad i have it.

as i find humans to be the aesthetically most pleasing race, i find it good that i don’t have to play a certain race, if i want to play the most efficient way.

excuse me if that comes a bit jumbled, i post this on 3 am.

I agree that Prayer of Kormir is probably the best, and I personally thought Rampage for warriors was hella fun xD I remember jumping into sPvP with the default build and trying it out. Had a blast with it though Idk if I’ll be using it on my warrior or not. You might want to try the grenth one out just for the fact that it chills and poisons(i believe), and chill being the main reason to use it(increasing the enemies cd, slowing their attacks/movement, probably a good way to get some more kills in). I, as a necro, don’t really need that, so i never saw it as useful until a thief earlier posted the idea.

Just a thought dunno if you have tried it out like that or not.

It’s disappointing to see how much they toned down elite skills from GW1. Only Avatar of Melandru out of 5 avatars made it in (no Balthazar really?) and its lackluster at best. So many elite stances and hammer skills didn’t make it in either. Guess they aren’t really supposed to be game changing in GW2.

Human war elites do not go well at all. Severely disappointed with how fast hounds of balth die. Reaper would be ok if it actually lasted any amount time However it doesnt last long enough.

I actually send a bug report about the reaper of grenth because I thought it as bugged.
I thought it would be something similar to the necromancer lich skill or Avatar of Melandru.

Nope! Instead its an incredibly unimpressive black shroud around you with an effect that isn’t even noticable if aren’t hugging your enemies. It’s also over before you can blink. “This counts as an elite skill?” Is all that crossed my mind.

Honestly, I like Prayer to Lyssa the best. It’s great as a low lvl necro, allowing short CD condition and boon spamming. And it’s only 1 SP so getting it early is easy.

Personally, I really love Reaper of Grenth, I use it all the time on my engineer. Then again, I’m pretty much an in-your-face-flamethrowering-all-the-things-engie, so I can utilize the conditions pretty well. Avatar of Melandru is pretty decent for some jumping puzzles, too (suck on that, Goemm’s Lab).

Full Citadel of Flame Armor for Guardian…
Burning build.
Hounds of Balthazar.

Can’t be topped.

Thief, Avatar of Grenth, Caltrops, any of the poison skills, Death Blossom twice.
Its really pretty to watch, and the damage numbers sprayed on the screen are lovely. =)

Yeah, racials are kinda dissapointing.
They look really out of place on my engi.
I mean, he’s supposed to kill foes with technology and gadgets, not by praying to some godly forces. It’s not a priest for kittens sake. I want to use the power of steel and steam, not divine intervention.
And besides the condition removal there’s nothing really interesting anyways.