Guild Wars 2

Too many achievements are tied to marionette to only allow them if you win, especially since event win ratio is so ridiculously small.

I only spot 2 issues with the fight.

1st, It requires lots of players, 100 would be OK but given map limit is 125, some people can’t even make it in their respective maps unless they get a “taxi” which is lame. ANet should’ve boosted the limits of Bloodtide Coast and Lornar’s Pass for the duration of the live story.

2nd, The boss spawns way too often. I know, I know, we all enjoy taking the challenge every other hour but … if the train 2 hours ago makes it … none of those 100+ successful players will show up for the one taking place right now. So that further thins the numbers. I’ve been running 3 different lanes in a single path because of low numbers, it’s not all so pleasent.

Ah there is one more issue … if players take less than 3 minutes to actually teleport on the platforms that would be great!

And in the end its just another number’s game. That’s one of the reasons I don’t like World Bosses in this game. I don’t feel like my skill is adding to the success. Even my tight group of 4 more trusted friends … we go out guns blazing and we win or fail but the sense of achievement is not as it should be. I’m much more happy beating a mediocre guy as lupicus <o>

What do you name callers actually know about the people you single out and belittle? Most of the time you have never seen them before, and won’t again.

I’ve done 5 platforms, with a Ranger. 4 finished with little problem, including one with just two of us. Most I have had on a platform was 5.

The single fail was my last trip to this toxic mess. I took forever to load, loading in half dead to see the other two players downed. Skill lag on my rez spirit, calling it failed. Eventually downed and game over for everyone. Felt terrible.

Now, in spite of succeeding far more than failing. the ’better than thou" crowd took this opportunity to blast me with every stupid generalization about baddies, pve, rangers, blah blah blah. I was hit with the bitter backlash of small minded players looking for the “goat” to release vitriol upon, not knowing or even caring what my actual experience, knowledge or prior success had been. They saw a ranger die.. and so, I had to be what they assumed was the worst.

You know.. I don’t care what the content is. If I have to be around the toxicity that are these events now, I’ll go someplace else. There is no reward worth being around a toxic and small minded population casting blame and epithets.

Half of the posts here need infracted… unless I am unaware that namecalling is now “OK”

Mystic.5934:

2-player can only get champ to 50% health

2 players can get it down actually. I’m hardly a great player, but I managed to beat it together with another player. I wasn’t even wearing zerker.

Not saying it was easy, and we pulled it off when the timer was already at 0:00…but it can be done.

Ravenmoon.5318:

none of those 100+ successful players will show up for the one taking place right now.

I would actually. I like this fight, I’m doing it for fun rather than loot.

I just think it’s unfair that my platform kills the warden and the chain and we don’t get credit. I don’t mind group related achievements, but this is timed material. It’s not going to be around forever, and not getting achievements ultimately because other people makes people mad. Players all have different skill level. It’s not about the noobs. It’s about not getting credit for what we do. I should have 3/5 wardens killed and 3/5 dodging achievements. I’m stuck at 1/5 for both essentially because of other people. That’s not fair for content that is limited availability. I will have the meta shortly, but it’s just upsetting/annoying knowing I’ve done what I was supposed to do and won’t be getting credit for it. Those are AP I should have.

Yep, I’m in agreement with a lot of people here. These dodge achievements are bad. If you want me to get an achievement, give me a reason to go for it. Don’t add in a bunch of random factors that can sink me repeatedly.

It’ll only make me frustrated and not want to run the content.

Shufflepants.9785:

Shinzan.2908:

Sports teams are made up of people who know each other and learn to work together, and a good player in a bad team has the choice to look for a team that matches his skill level. GW2 matches you with randoms so the analogy doesn’t hold up.

That’s exactly what ANet has asked of its players and what people should be doing right now: learning to work together. Instead of asking for more individual rewards for group content, maybe people should be trying to coordinate better. Instead of telling players how bad they are and expecting to lose, how about encouraging them. Instead of telling people to just go look it up, maybe explain the fight and what people should do before and during the fight. My server, GoM just got our second marionette kill tonight with zero chain fails. It took us a few days, but more and more we’re getting there.

That doesn’t help though when people don’t listen. There’s always been at least one person in map chat explaining everything for every marionette I’ve done. Some people just can’t follow directions. We beat our mine warden and I look at the other platforms and nobody is kiting him to his mines. Attack the shield warden from behind we say, and at least one platform is doing nothing of the sort. Dodge out of the orange, yet people don’t budge and get hit every time by the marionette’s attack.

They want 5 different, randomly selected groups of people to be able to coordinate and achieve something. Great on paper, but most people can tell you just getting ONE group of 5 random people to be able to coordinate can be hard enough. There are people who play this game who honestly have no idea what they’re doing in these events, explanation or not. And that one person can ruin the entire operation, and that’s what’s happening here. Nobody feels entitled to anything. We killed the warden and the regulator, we want the achievement. Having to hope 4 other platforms don’t fudge it up is too much to ask.

1) The conditions of the achievement should be laid out in-game on the mouseover. Having to come to the forums because you’re frustrated and think you’ve been bugged out of earning something is not ideal. Whether or not these achievements should be based on breaking the chain has been well debated here, but they should at least tell you so. At the very least, allow me to be rewarded for my singular platform’s success vs the platforms I have even less control over.

2) The “being downed takes away your achievement” thing annoys me. If someone is downed and still manages to avoid the marionette, I say bravo. I’m almost even more impressed. Isn’t your success being dependent on other platforms bad enough without this extra handicap?

3) It also annoys me that blocking the attack with a shield isn’t good enough. My ele is low on endurance so for something like this I tend to focus on shields to make up for it. The marionette’s first attack, Stomp, seems to have a shorter telegraph time before it lands, meaning that I frequently (2/3 tries last night) portal in to find myself in the middle of a giant red circle I have no way to avoid/am already in the middle of a flop. I can’t pop a shield or I lose the achievement, my dodge time is unresponsive due to lag/loading in or I dodged upon loading to ensure my safety only to then immediately find myself in the middle of a circle with less than full endurance (it takes two dodge rolls to get out of that aoe if you’re close to the center)… you’re trapped. And if your sole reason for engaging the marionette fight at that point is the achievement, you feel like you should just leave. In the first second you’ve already lost out.

I could stand there and watch the marionette go around the other platforms and look at her foot patterns (assuming I’m not unlucky platform #1, of course) but then I would be contributing far less to doing my job with the platform champ and helping to break the chain. So I feel like I’m torn between either being selfish and ignoring the champion in favor of studying the marionette mid-battle or doing my job and losing out on the achievement.

Basically: These last two problems (lose achieve on downed, short telegraph time of the stomp/no invulnerability upon portal/not allowed to use shields) are contributing equally to my dislike of the achievements for this LS. But all of them are especially problematic to me when they are not mentioned anywhere in the achievement description. I believe the description says “Avoid the marionette’s such and such attack”, which to me would mean just not taking damage from it. Isn’t a shield avoidance? -shrug-

Good luck to everyone still going for these, btw

It’s really ridiculous that the chain also has to succeed if I want to get the ‘Wardens slain’ achievement. I’ve killed EVERY warden champ around 3 times now but am still sitting on 2/5 because it’s also linked to the success of the chain.

I’m sitting at 2/5 achievements for dodging the Marionette’s attacks since last friday and did the event now over 30 (!!!) freaking times. I also learned that I’m not allowed to get downed for the achievement through this forum.

What the actual kitten. Anet please stop to hoax people and tell them REALLY what they need to do for the achievement or even better: Change it to something fair for the solo player. Right now it’s just a mess and more than disappointing, it’s annoying and discouraging.

Arena doesn’t care, they already know this. You should figure that out by the content they keep giving us, where this game is headed.

Nike.2631:

Nike.2631:

I think you’re being punished for being a crappy teacher.

Grimno.6172:

Edit – Just did the one at 7pm EST in an overflow server and my god.
Before the match started, I explained everything in simple detail, did what I could… and in the end.
A Perfect Run.
No fails in any lane… Lane 5 severed the 5th chain for a mission complete.
Was amazing, everyone was cheering and it felt good. When people listen, you can succeed!

Thank you for proving my point . And its not just ‘when people listen’, it’s ‘when a good teach inspires them to listen’. Or ‘when a good teacher makes sure the students comprehend’.

Akimbo.4835:

You can tell players the trick to defeating a boss all you want. It falls on deaf ears. You’ll have more success explaining it to a brick wall. Bad players are bad and will always be bad regardless of the advice people give them.

And thank you for perfectly demonstrating what a bad teacher looks like.
There’s three million people who bought this game, and somehow our most elite players know the exact composition of the 110 they’re playing with this time, next time, and on all possible occasions because they’re just too good to even try. Better to decide in advance ‘oh, it won’t help!’

I’m not saying teaching is an easy activity or a common skill. I’m just saying it’s the skill being tested by the event, far more than any individual’s ability to dodge or kite in circles. If you want to improve your odds of succeeding, that’s the skill you need to polish.

You sound like someone who has never been a commander in WvW. To so blindly believe that if you tell people what to do, they will do it. I’ve seen very experienced guild leaders of big guilds try to coral the cats to do guild missions and they have to resort to kicking people out of the guild if they don’t listen. Any number of things could go wrong and once that happens, people start to fail.

I’ve seen commanders that command like it’s a full time job, who have the respect of their entire server, these commanders will have trouble getting people to drop water fields or turn left or run through an enemy zerg. When players are under pressure they do random things.

Now I am not saying it’s not in your best interests to help organise the numbers in the lanes and ensure that people know what to do during the platform fights, but I’m not going to go and blame failure on whether or not someone was a great teacher. It sounds all cuddly and nice but the reality is, sometimes people kitten up whether you tried to teach them or not. People are going to fail at the mechanics, people are going to miss a dodge, some people are simply not going to do enough DPS.

You know what, almost none of this has to do with the OP talking about how he doesn’t want his individual achievement tied to something completely out of his control. The five platform achievements are skill based, not completion based. It shouldn’t matter whether or not someone’s a great teacher, failure to break a chain shouldn’t stop a perfect performance on a platform from getting the achievement.

Shiren.9532:

snip
The five platform achievements are skill based, not completion based. It shouldn’t matter whether or not someone’s a great teacher, failure to break a chain shouldn’t stop a perfect performance on a platform from getting the achievement.

These are my feelings on the matter exactly. There is already an achievement (actually 2) for having good organisation and “teaching” newer players (or forcing an overflow with your big guild) and beating the marionette.

It seems completely arbitrary that the dodger and deregulator achievements are tied to full success. I feel that this is more because it was harder to code the end criterion for the achievements to be the destruction of the regulator on your platform rather than the end of the phase 2 event.

I have given up on getting all of these dodging achievements since I do not have the time to do 20 more attempts, and it is just getting frustrating to yet again make it but see that one or two other platforms will not. Likewise, I have my fail moments and I do not want those to hinder 20 other players, who can not help me at all, more than I have to.

For those who have had a 50% success rate on Marionette allowing them to easily get all achieves, congratulations on being able to camp main servers or being outright lucky, no hard feelings there. But do not tell others they should lead better, because your success was mostly through luck (level and distribution of player skill on platforms, presence of organised guilds, language barriers etc). Had you seen what I have seen, you would be speaking differently.

Shufflepants.9785:

Shinzan.2908:

Sports teams are made up of people who know each other and learn to work together, and a good player in a bad team has the choice to look for a team that matches his skill level. GW2 matches you with randoms so the analogy doesn’t hold up.

That’s exactly what ANet has asked of its players and what people should be doing right now: learning to work together. Instead of asking for more individual rewards for group content, maybe people should be trying to coordinate better. Instead of telling players how bad they are and expecting to lose, how about encouraging them. Instead of telling people to just go look it up, maybe explain the fight and what people should do before and during the fight. My server, GoM just got our second marionette kill tonight with zero chain fails. It took us a few days, but more and more we’re getting there.

Professional sports teams have control over their roster and regularly trim under performers from the roster.

That’s the big thing; due to it being a public zone event you have a complete lack of control over whom you are participating with and thus no matter how helpful and informative you are, there’s a large chance of someone still screwing it up for everyone else, and you have no recourse since you can’t perform better to compensate for them, and you can’t boot them.

If they didn’t listen or self educate before the event; and aren’t sharp enough to catch on during the event, it is unlikely they will change in any meaningful way after the event, because the penalty just a group penalty applied to largely anonymous individuals. And since their is no real individual penalty past that; there is no incentive to learn or improve.

Collectivism at its finest folks. It’s like being stuck in a group project with no say in your membership, and the weakest link will not listen or exert themselves to not drag the group down. Except here, you can’t compensate due to how the event is structured.

Outside of that, the event is actually pretty awesome.