Guild Wars 2

It’s been over a week and people still don’t grasp the concept of it it seems, even with a lot of people in each of the 5 lanes people still somehow manage to fail the event, it’s ridiculous, I can never seem to get my “achievements” because it relies too much on others, even if I complete it myself, it’s just a waste of time seeing as 99% of the time there’s always 1 platform who fails.

Getting tired of the same old same old :/ honestly its pushing me away from the game knowing most of the future achievements will most likely rely heavily on others (Temporary ones to make it worse)

Not enough people watching my guide I guess.

I think some of it is intentional.

Could be people trolling. It also could be a case of half the players actually being new to the event.

I have the same problem on my sever also. The problem is trying to force alot of people to group. It never works and always shuts the casuale players out. They need to make more small group content like 2 to 3 man group stuff and stop adding mechanics that require 100+ players to work together.

Its hard enough trying to coordinate 25 people in WoW raids.

Anet expects 80+ coordination? The arrogance.

Because staying alive is still hard.

It’s open world content. You don’t control your allies yet you rely heavily on them. It’s a recipe for frustration and failure. All we can do is try to help out and hope that in six months time the average player is more skilled than we are seeing now.

I do find it really bizarre that if ArenaNet is trying to teach players to become more skilled that the difficulty spike is so steep. Not only are the failure conditions sharp, the bosses do a lot of damage, they are on a timer and they require you to learn a unique mechanic to take them down. So we have people going from auto-attack the world boss jumping to all the skills required for marionette, of course the failure rate will be high.

If ArenaNet wants players to become more skilled, the difficulty curve needs to be less steep to allow the more casual players to keep up. Everyone loses when victory rests on the shoulders of people overwhelmed by the increased challenge.

A lot of players are trolling the event…

Its really, really easy to make those big group events fail than succeed.

The loots rubbish at them, so they are seeing it as a excellent chance to fail it on purpose and troll upto 100 other players.

A significant % of GW2 players see that as far more fun then trying to succeed the event.

There are a lot of casuals. I remember saying that we needed good dps from warden 3 onwards, and I got people asking me what dps was. The platform I ended up on had a staff camping guardian who evidently thought he had high dps.

70% of gw2 playerbase doesn’t know how to dodge.

This event relies too much on dodge and position, what do u expect from queensdale spammer’s #1 sheeps, u don’t need to dodge there.

DarcShriek.5829:

I think some of it is intentional.

From what i see, intentional trolling is not a visible problem, at least on my server. On the other hand, lot of people really are below the required skill level for that event. For many reasons – some fail at reading comprehension (or just have chat disabled), others have poor reaction times… or are just at the level (with corresponding gear) correct for this zone (35-45, iirc). And nothing can be done about it.
All future designs for such battles need to take that into consideration.

Some people just don’t read / listen. I don’t even know why they’re bothering to come to these events then. Some people have lousy builds. But they do show up. And take a place on the main from a better player. And fail the chains. And cause the event to fail for everyone else. But there’s nothing to be done yet cause we cannot choose who we play with and Anet hasn’t fixed the Overflow issues.

From 18 Marionette attempts (9 in overflows) 10 were successful (5 in overflows). I think that is a decent rate. While I, too, sometimes want to scream with frustration, all in all the Marionette fights go well enough. I don’t think that the problem is as big as you make it. Oh, and I have a fair share of 5 h am runsnin them which is anything but prime time for marionettes.

Sometimes it’s because of bad platform spawns (1 person solo’ing a champ), a terribad ranger. But more often than not I think it’s the casual players and people who do not know how to utilize strategy.

Casual players who have no idea of the champ mechanics and refuse to read the champ details or even read chat. Players who lack situational awareness and ignore the cues that they need to dodge or move right away.

Whenever I do Warden III I frequently have to save the kitten of whoever is on my platform because they fail to move. I see bombs right on their character and I have to activate my aegis. I can save them up to 3 times. After that I can’t do anything about their lack of gameplay.

Claudius.5381:

From 18 Marionette attempts (9 in overflows) 10 were successful (5 in overflows). I think that is a decent rate. While I, too, sometimes want to scream with frustration, all in all the Marionette fights go well enough. I don’t think that the problem is as big as you make it. Oh, and I have a fair share of 5 h am runsnin them which is anything but prime time for marionettes.

Well you must be getting lucky. I think only 1 overflow out of at least 10 that I’ve been on has been successful.

The most chains I ever got severed was 3. I genuinely don’t understand when people fail the second champion (the one with the mines) because it’s so simple. Yet, I see a lot of groups failing it and I often end up doing it even thought I’m usually in lane 4 or 5.

Also, too many people take lane 1 just to get the daily and after that they just stop caring.

Feels like the playerbase isn’t getting better at the event. It looks like they fail more and more. Just now got only to 1/5 chains. How?

And I learned my home server can’t do stuff like that. Guesting ftw!

The idea that Josh Foreman and ANet had here that the event would be difficult enough to teach people game mechanics – or make them WANT to learn game mechanics – is a noble one. But unfortunately it’s unrealistic. Most people don’t want to learn or have a capacity to learn. They will press buttons and go on their way, not caring either way.

Part of the problem is that the rewards are not consistent. Players staying in back are needed but get little reward due to the champs in front. Same with the barricade builders. Creating reward for activities that help succeed is a must in large scale events.
It can be a great event and rewarding but it can be “worked” for individual reward which contributes to event failure.

Most of the Guardians I see around. They of course wield exclusively staff.

Shift Focus.9083:

It’s been over a week and people still don’t grasp the concept of it it seems, even with a lot of people in each of the 5 lanes people still somehow manage to fail the event, it’s ridiculous, I can never seem to get my “achievements” because it relies too much on others, even if I complete it myself, it’s just a waste of time seeing as 99% of the time there’s always 1 platform who fails.

Getting tired of the same old same old :/ honestly its pushing me away from the game knowing most of the future achievements will most likely rely heavily on others (Temporary ones to make it worse)

lots of reasons really…

1) simply not knowing the mechanics of the platform fight.

2) a bad mix of players on a platform, since it randomly assigns people, 5 support builds are not going to down a champ anywhere near as fast as five glass cannons

however..

3) not being geared… since the platforms are champions 5 glass cannons can get whacked pretty fast especially if they’re low level / under-geared.

4) lag death

5) lane abandoment – saw that one the last time I went… in the middle of the fight to hold off the champions people just started leaving to go to the next lane in the hopes of getting the achievement for fighting the individual types of champions.

6) simply not having enough people in the event in the first place. Ideally you want about 25+ people per lane, I’ve seen the event start with lanes having as few as 10 – 15, needless to say it didn’t go well.

7) platform soloist, if the lane population is low, come time to cross through the portal some platforms will have less than 5 people on them, I’ve not personally seen it but I have heard of there being platforms with a single person, making it impossible to complete that chain. VERY few classes can down a champ alone and none can do it in a matter of minutes.

8) zone death, I’ve personally zoned in on the platform portion of the fight to see 2 people down and given I’m running a good machine with a solid state harddrive, they got hammered pretty darn fast. (we did go on to beat our champion though)

sure I missed a few… but those are the top reasons that come to mind.

While the skill level of hundreds of players is not something I feel comfortable theorizing about without statistics in front of me (and even then, it’s all about context), I will happily theorize that the achievements are partially responsible. Some platform achievements seem to be more difficult than others, so we have people stacking those lanes with more bodies and refusing to move because they need the achievement and this is limited-time content. So long as their chain breaks, they don’t care about the overall event success.

Those that already have the achievements have, at least in my guild, moved on to the wurms or are just avoiding the region because in addition to the usual increase of home-server players trying to get into the instance, we also have a line of guesters, some of whom make it a past time to verbally abuse our server in map chat. The last few days have been relatively easy to get into the main instance, which makes me think that many of our mvps/players with all Mari achieves have gone.

Traveller.7496:

The idea that Josh Foreman and ANet had here that the event would be difficult enough to teach people game mechanics – or make them WANT to learn game mechanics – is a noble one. But unfortunately it’s unrealistic. Most people don’t want to learn or have a capacity to learn. They will press buttons and go on their way, not caring either way.

After attempting this marionette on my home server over 20 times with no win, I’m certainly looking at other games and ways to pass the time.

I don’t expect to be carried, but I equally don’t expect to have to rely on other players for personal rewards/achievements either. I’d rather play a game that properly rewards my time and or skill.

At least SAB still has that right, even if the rest of the game is careening towards impossible-to-casuals group content and layers of RNG on RNG.

bravoart.5308:

Traveller.7496:

The idea that Josh Foreman and ANet had here that the event would be difficult enough to teach people game mechanics – or make them WANT to learn game mechanics – is a noble one. But unfortunately it’s unrealistic. Most people don’t want to learn or have a capacity to learn. They will press buttons and go on their way, not caring either way.

After attempting this marionette on my home server over 20 times with no win, I’m certainly looking at other games and ways to pass the time.

I don’t expect to be carried, but I equally don’t expect to have to rely on other players for personal rewards/achievements either. I’d rather play a game that properly rewards my time and or skill.

At least SAB still has that right, even if the rest of the game is careening towards impossible-to-casuals group content and layers of RNG on RNG.

I have to agree with you there, I finally got into an instance that won only 2 days ago and have only seen it succeed once. I quit counting the number of times in the marionette fight once I hit the double digits.

fail after fail after fail is extremely disheartening. Nobody wants things to be handed to them but by the same token when you’re standing on a platform… see all but 1 complete… the last has their champ down to a sliver and there’s 7 seconds left on the clock and you know there’s no way they will make it and no way to help… (yes I had that happen last night) It can wear on the desire to even bother.

While not denying the skill of the good players, there’s an element of luck that just has to be there too and more often than not, it’s just not there and you get little more for your efforts than a kill shot, the price of way pointing, and the price of repairs.

all I can tell you is to get to lornar’s early enough to get in the main and not an overflow and try to hit your server prime time, that certainly doesn’t guarantee anything but keep /general chat up and walk the lanes as people are setting up, if you see things pretty organized and the lane populations are good, there just MIGHT be a chance. Hope that element of luck is there today… and give it a go.

Cause stacking on the regulator together is such a hard thing to do. this works on most of the hard to kill boss.

Chris RJ.1843:

Most of the Guardians I see around. They of course wield exclusively staff.

UGH!! This bothers me as my main is a guardian, I carry every weapon for different things, pretty much only pull staff for temple runs (mega tagging for mega-loot) and to clear the poison bulbs in TA.

On this event, there really is no loot for tagging anything so staff makes no sense whatsoever…Ive informed a few guardians that when I see them running with staff on it, Greatsword / hammer / sword-focus are SO much better for taking down the champs and especially the wardens (I switch to scepter-focus for warden 3 and 4 before going in the portal).

sceptor only makes sense for #4

But I agree they shouldnt be bringing a staff into the portal

Charak.9761:

sceptor only makes sense for #4

But I agree they shouldnt be bringing a staff into the portal

it is great for might stacking before u enter. Also should be decent for 5th boss although hammer would be better

Moshari.8570:

Chris RJ.1843:

Most of the Guardians I see around. They of course wield exclusively staff.

UGH!! This bothers me as my main is a guardian, I carry every weapon for different things, pretty much only pull staff for temple runs (mega tagging for mega-loot) and to clear the poison bulbs in TA.

On this event, there really is no loot for tagging anything so staff makes no sense whatsoever…Ive informed a few guardians that when I see them running with staff on it, Greatsword / hammer / sword-focus are SO much better for taking down the champs and especially the wardens (I switch to scepter-focus for warden 3 and 4 before going in the portal).

Actually, there’s quite a few fragments to be gained by tagging. I usually get enough to make 1 or 2 keys, even after a loss.

DarcShriek.5829:

Moshari.8570:

Chris RJ.1843:

Most of the Guardians I see around. They of course wield exclusively staff.

UGH!! This bothers me as my main is a guardian, I carry every weapon for different things, pretty much only pull staff for temple runs (mega tagging for mega-loot) and to clear the poison bulbs in TA.

On this event, there really is no loot for tagging anything so staff makes no sense whatsoever…Ive informed a few guardians that when I see them running with staff on it, Greatsword / hammer / sword-focus are SO much better for taking down the champs and especially the wardens (I switch to scepter-focus for warden 3 and 4 before going in the portal).

Actually, there’s quite a few fragments to be gained by tagging. I usually get enough to make 1 or 2 keys, even after a loss.

I get that much from using Greatsword or hammer and standing at the chokepoint where everything runs through (every lane has this spot down near where they spawn)….and do 2x the damage of the person standing there with the staff spamming #1.

Moshari.8570:

DarcShriek.5829:

Moshari.8570:

Chris RJ.1843:

Most of the Guardians I see around. They of course wield exclusively staff.

UGH!! This bothers me as my main is a guardian, I carry every weapon for different things, pretty much only pull staff for temple runs (mega tagging for mega-loot) and to clear the poison bulbs in TA.

On this event, there really is no loot for tagging anything so staff makes no sense whatsoever…Ive informed a few guardians that when I see them running with staff on it, Greatsword / hammer / sword-focus are SO much better for taking down the champs and especially the wardens (I switch to scepter-focus for warden 3 and 4 before going in the portal).

Actually, there’s quite a few fragments to be gained by tagging. I usually get enough to make 1 or 2 keys, even after a loss.

I get that much from using Greatsword or hammer and standing at the chokepoint where everything runs through (every lane has this spot down near where they spawn)….and do 2x the damage of the person standing there with the staff spamming #1.

I clearly misunderstood your post. I thought you said there wasn’t loot worth tagging for.

They need to tweak warden 3 a bit. Its bombs explode when you touch it, but it also explodes after a while. The thing is, there’s no area indicator of the bomb’s range. Maybe Anet could tweak it a little so that the bombs will show a red circle around it indicating the explosion area.

Warden 3 is where most attempts fail, in my experience. The bombs AND the Warden’s leaps one-shot you (unless you have a very tanky build), so there’s very little margin for error. What’s worse is that the bombs don’t show an AoE radius, so you have no way of telling if you’re at a safe distance or not.

Finally, you sometimes get those unfortunate scenarios where 2 or 3 people zone up right into the Warden’s bombs/leaps. They get downed/killed, and you basically can’t recover from that without a lucky Warbanner.

win/loss ratio has increased greatly over the last few days….i think players are getting better (or bad players are playing less).

to add something different to the thread, i’ve seen many chain fails due to buggy things.
#1: the “can’t attack bug”… skills no longer work unless you waypoint (sometimes works), get downed, or re-log.
#2: the propensity for knockback skills to trap a warden in position where they can’t be damaged……this happens in various boss events in pve.

general rule………DO NOT USE KNOCKBACK SKILLS IN PVE LARGE GROUP CONTENT.
so many bad/ignorant longbow rangers and hammer/spear guardians knocking bosses out of AoE and/or trapping them in terrain.

also….don’t think the wardens need any tweaking…..they are all very doable if you know their gimmick. commanders almost always explain these mechanics before event begins.

1) The event takes place in a low level map, therefore you have low level people participating. They have no idea what to do. They may even not know how to play their class correctly.

2) If you go to the map too late you end up in overflow, sometimes with not enough people per lane.

3) Some people just don’t read what we tell them.

4) Some people get disconnected while loading the wardens. Leaving some platforms almost empty.

5) The “can’t attack bug” or “can’t switch weapon” bug may occur. I got both several times.

6) Some commanders don’t communicate at all. They’re here just for their tags and that’s it. They stay silent the whole time.

My server was doing decent Wednesday-Friday of last week, with most evening (5pm-1am EST) events succeeding. But since the weekend, that completely fell apart. I’m fairly certain that there were no successful runs from Saturday till Tuesday. By that time I was bored of farming pieces for keys, and just annoying at every attempt ending in 2/5 chains being broken. I’m not sure if there have been any wins since Tuesday, but from the few primetime attempts of I’ve seen since then, my guess is most likely no.

As bad as it is to see, I don’t care much myself because I already have all of the Mari-related achievements. But for anyone that didn’t get them during that 2-3 day period of good runs, guesting is the only option to even see a fight with champs 4 and 5.

I understand the desire to increase the overall skill level of players, but face it, some people have no interest (or capability in some cases) in being any better. You can’t prevent them from participating in an open world event, so it’s really best to keep challenging content in an environment where you have control over who you play with.

Relshdan.6854:

general rule………DO NOT USE KNOCKBACK SKILLS IN PVE LARGE GROUP CONTENT.
so many bad/ignorant longbow rangers and hammer/spear guardians knocking bosses out of AoE and/or trapping them in terrain.

Hammer guardians do exist? That was new to me, I only see ones that use either the GS (but usually with an otherwise useless build) or directly the terribad staff. I thought kittened knockbacks were an exclusive tool for rangers and no-damage-GS mesmers.

Because of players.

Let’s just take a look at the following sreenshots and analyze them.

• Here’s a ranger and his bear. The ranger is downed and then dead. What is the evident reason of getting downed? Not kiting, not dodging just shooting the bow.
• Here’s a guardian. With a staff. Woosh, woosh, woosh because all these volatile blossoms really get in the way.
• Here’s a staff mesmer. Not the best choice for PvE content, and not a choice at all for crushing buildings. By the way, where’s chaos storm and chaos armor?
• Here’s an ele wielding an ice bow. Nice and DPSy, but what about the other ice bow? Nobody’s using it! What about the regulator phase, where ice bow 4 could’ve saved the battle even when wielded by a condi class? Even the ele herself could’ve used it since the first bow had already melted.
• There’s also a necro and someone wielding dual pistols (thief?) but there’s nothing I can say about them. There’s also a dead body, so it gives us 7 players on a platform and a failed 4/5 attempt.
• At the last moment, an altruistic Polar Bear from the 1st screenshot made it into the platform; alert to you, devs;)

CptAurellian.9537:

Relshdan.6854:

general rule………DO NOT USE KNOCKBACK SKILLS IN PVE LARGE GROUP CONTENT.
so many bad/ignorant longbow rangers and hammer/spear guardians knocking bosses out of AoE and/or trapping them in terrain.

Hammer guardians do exist?

Well, truthfully the hammer is worse choice than GS for most wardens except 1 (and even then only when you are facetanking him so others can attack from behind). I ditched my hammer after first look at the bosses, and didn’t regret it at all.
So true on knockback skills, though – i see lot of those used, especially in champ 5(!) fights.

A lot of the more dedicated players don’t realize what “average” skill level means, and how half the players are below that. If you’re discussing tactical positioning, DPS optimisation and trait / weapon interactions you are not anywhere close to being an average player.

“How do people fail” is simply chest-beating or an even poorer grasp of the issue.

Relshdan.6854:

general rule………DO NOT USE KNOCKBACK SKILLS IN PVE LARGE GROUP CONTENT.
so many bad/ignorant longbow rangers and hammer/spear guardians knocking bosses out of AoE and/or trapping them in terrain.

OMG this! THIS!!!! You have NO idea how many people spam an ability just cause it’s not on a cooldown meter…. JUST STOP WITH THE KB’s!!!!

you see someone with almost no HP left about to get wailed on.. yeah… drop a knockback… using it just cause it’s there cause you’re playing a piano concerto on your hot-keys…. please don’t!

A large % of people doing the marionette are completely new to it and get no direction from anyone experienced. I mean honestly, I’ve done the encounter twice since it was released and each time I have no idea what I’m supposed to do and when I asked in /map, I would get answers like “go to 5!” or “lead champ 2 through mines”. That means absolutely nothing to someone who has never done the event.

I had to look up the encounter on dulfy.net (which I’m sure most people won’t actually do ahead of time, but rather after they fail it a few times and are still effing confused)

Not only that, someone else asked how the lane numbers worked and there were literally two answers, one person responded “they go counter clock-wise” another said “south to north”. Two different answers, no one chimed in to clarify. Just left it like that. I’m sure that person was like WTF.

I know those who have done it to death get frustrated for constantly failing, but if you assume everyone in your lane/OF knows the fight then you will continue to fail.

You need to explain exactly how the lanes work, explain what the whole point of the lanes are (i.e. not to let monsters leak to the very back). No one had ever explained that to anyone. You need to explain that there are two phases that go in lane order that splits your lane into 5 groups to kill a champion WARDEN in a certain amount of time. Don’t say “champ 1”or “champ 2”, there are champions constantly in the lanes, people who are new honestly assume you are referring to them and not the bosses.

It’s also useful to make sure everyone knows they will need a ranged weapon for some of the bosses. For example Warden III, someone had the foresight to yell to everyone to avoid the obvious AoE circles, to the point of calling everyone idiots if you got hit by them. Ok, sure that’s fair I suppose, most people avoid them automatically at this point anyway. At no point did anyone mention the basically 1shot kill AoE stomp the boss does. No one. And then when groups wipe, people complain wondering how the heck us idiots can’t avoid simple red circles on the ground. Gee, I dunno, had anyone mentioned that other skill he does, maybe it would have ended differently.

If you truly want to succeed regularly, you need to regularly educate the OF/map you’re on. After two fails and still not understanding the fight I decided to look it up.

Assume many of the people are at least on their first, second, or even third attempt and are still clueless because no one takes the time to explain. Rather they just yell and complain.

The thing about Marionette is that is has a very small margin of error. Even with players who know what they’re doing sometimes you just get back luck. Distribution of players across the platforms is a shuffle, and sometimes a platform for Warden 3 will get all squishies. 3 in particular is the most punishing Warden; there’s just a lot of death on that platform. Even with vigor I’m burning through my endurance and cantrips faster than I can use them. It helps if you wait until everyone loads on the platform before you attack; this is the only warden that waits until you hit him.

Warden 2 is also tricky. Let’s say all five people on the platform know how to kite him properly. Except that everyone is loose on the platform, and the boss doesn’t always go in the direction you’re expecting. The techniques for hitting him differ from player to player and moment to moment; sometimes I can dodge into him and he’ll drop one on himself turning around, and sometimes he’ll keep going and we have to lead him manually. A couple of unlucky passes and suddenly the platform is full of mines and Mari is attacking you and by the time you recover and kill him you’re out of time.

Listening to WoodenPotato’s video about the wurm kill, it sounds like there’s a bit of randomness in that event as well. Even with a full map of players who’ve got it down, you don’t succeed every time. Same with Mari. On FA we had two perfect runs in a row Wednesday night. Last night we failed. It’s not a big deal. We pick up and we keep at it.

Steel Fenrir.2791:

They need to tweak warden 3 a bit. Its bombs explode when you touch it, but it also explodes after a while. The thing is, there’s no area indicator of the bomb’s range. Maybe Anet could tweak it a little so that the bombs will show a red circle around it indicating the explosion area.

I’ll agree with this. Recently I’ve been having frame rate and culling issues, which I’ve mostly fixed, but these bombs were just not rendering. On the other wardens I at least had circles to avoid when my frame rate dropped and culling kicked in randomly during this fight.

It is just hard to avoid something you can’t see.

I tend to think that a lot of Guardians with staves aren’t using them because they think its actually a good DPS weapon, but because its one of the best mob-tagging weapons in the game.

I think due to how much the event fails, people are coming with the mentality that even if they play well, being 1 in 100, it won’t have any swing on the outcome of the event (ie, it fails anyways), so they’ll just tag as many mobs as they can and grab as much loot as possible before it fails.

Xae Isareth.1364:

I tend to think that a lot of Guardians with staves aren’t using them because they think its actually a good DPS weapon, but because its one of the best mob-tagging weapons in the game.

I think due to how much the event fails, people are coming with the mentality that even if they play well, being 1 in 100, it won’t have any swing on the outcome of the event (ie, it fails anyways), so they’ll just tag as many mobs as they can and grab as much loot as possible before it fails.

I use staff 80% of the time I play guardian, but in marionette, I only use it in defending lanes.

There is no point using it against a single champ. Hammer/GS/Sceptre is much more reliable.

I think the average guardian just uses staff and forgets everything else.

Xae Isareth.1364:

I tend to think that a lot of Guardians with staves aren’t using them because they think its actually a good DPS weapon, but because its one of the best mob-tagging weapons in the game.

I think due to how much the event fails, people are coming with the mentality that even if they play well, being 1 in 100, it won’t have any swing on the outcome of the event (ie, it fails anyways), so they’ll just tag as many mobs as they can and grab as much loot as possible before it fails.

This is exactly the problem. I had an argument with a guardian in my guild who was doing this. I play a guardian main and I had to show him during one fight that not only was I doing far more damage than him (I was using GS and S-F), I was actually getting just as many Tokens to turn into keys….he switched to GS for the next time we did it together and was FAR more effective when it came time to do Wardens (the first time, his group failed warden, second time his group actually won).

I have used this event as a teaching moment for a lot of different things which is why I actually like the Marrionette…I’ve taught guild members about switching skills, switching weapons, dodging, kiting and when not to kite…putting pets on passive…to me it has been good and I think that my guild skill level has increased because of it.

Kalarchis.8635:

The thing about Marionette is that is has a very small margin of error. Even with players who know what they’re doing sometimes you just get back luck. Distribution of players across the platforms is a shuffle, and sometimes a platform for Warden 3 will get all squishies. 3 in particular is the most punishing Warden; there’s just a lot of death on that platform. Even with vigor I’m burning through my endurance and cantrips faster than I can use them. It helps if you wait until everyone loads on the platform before you attack; this is the only warden that waits until you hit him.

Warden 2 is also tricky. Let’s say all five people on the platform know how to kite him properly. Except that everyone is loose on the platform, and the boss doesn’t always go in the direction you’re expecting. The techniques for hitting him differ from player to player and moment to moment; sometimes I can dodge into him and he’ll drop one on himself turning around, and sometimes he’ll keep going and we have to lead him manually. A couple of unlucky passes and suddenly the platform is full of mines and Mari is attacking you and by the time you recover and kill him you’re out of time.

Listening to WoodenPotato’s video about the wurm kill, it sounds like there’s a bit of randomness in that event as well. Even with a full map of players who’ve got it down, you don’t succeed every time. Same with Mari. On FA we had two perfect runs in a row Wednesday night. Last night we failed. It’s not a big deal. We pick up and we keep at it.

For Marionette there is a very large margin for error you are allowed to fail 4 times. that means that 80% of the map has to fail on one of the chains. finally all the champs have key strategies in which you can kill them without any significant problem. The only exception is probably the 3rd champ which has a lot of one hit kills.