I’m sure it looked differently from the other side though, you don’t see how the champ destroys your team from the other side (been there done that) especially when they’re all unaware & trying to cap him like a normal claiming lord.
it was pretty embarrassing tbh not one of my finer moments (& I debated claiming it) but you win some you lose some; that was not a good night for meh.
Was this the same night you were late to Hills? If so, we wondered what the hell you were doing back there. We moved on and capped Lake instead.
CornChips | Sylvari Guardian |
Dvaita Vedanta | Human Mesmer|
The Fluttering Horde [TFH] | CD
sadly enough his tale is mostly accurate. the numbers are slightly off on our side we probably had maybe 10-12 but they all had a wild hair to kill siegerazer instead of trying to get into the tower (we wiped the group doing the breakout prior to these guys showing up, that bit was pretty fun). sometimes folks get distracted by the silliest of things… like big champ npcs that they’re not going to kill (and is responsible for 99% of our wipe not these guys though they did annoy us by spiking our remaining rezzers keeping us from moving when it became apparent that that objective was going to be impossible in present company) despite being told repeatedly that they’re not going to kill it and to come build these rams and take this tower :S
I’m pretty sure it was more than that, but admittedly I could have overestimated a bit.
I guess I didn’t convey it clearly enough, but I wasn’t trying to say I was great because we killed you guys. In fact I’ve said the opposite numerous times already. It was just one of those moments of complete bewilderment, where I couldn’t even begin to understand what was going on.
Edit: I’m about to start roaming, so if anyone wants to prove just how bad I am, feel free to come looking. I’ll probably be on AR or FC bl south of the water.
It’s not exclusive to FC. It happens with all servers. When people are getting killed by half their numbers or even their numbers most players will eventually seek out a zerg for protection. That, or hide in a tower.
I’m sure it looked differently from the other side though, you don’t see how the champ destroys your team from the other side (been there done that) especially when they’re all unaware & trying to cap him like a normal claiming lord.
it was pretty embarrassing tbh not one of my finer moments (& I debated claiming it) but you win some you lose some; that was not a good night for meh.
Was this the same night you were late to Hills? If so, we wondered what the hell you were doing back there. We moved on and capped Lake instead.
yea man… right after. string of defeating moments, had to try and log out right after felt a migraine coming on.
probably would have kept hitting the door at hills if y’all would have wp’d after taking it. thought one of our ppl glitched through the door when i saw you all on the other side, (didn’t even pull map over to see the circle for hills that it was blue. you guys are quiet with your super /s chatting). sigh, bad night all around.
Old Janx // [THG] Jade Quarry / Seafarer’s Rest
secessit viri bellatores
sadly enough his tale is mostly accurate. the numbers are slightly off on our side we probably had maybe 10-12 but they all had a wild hair to kill siegerazer instead of trying to get into the tower (we wiped the group doing the breakout prior to these guys showing up, that bit was pretty fun). sometimes folks get distracted by the silliest of things… like big champ npcs that they’re not going to kill (and is responsible for 99% of our wipe not these guys though they did annoy us by spiking our remaining rezzers keeping us from moving when it became apparent that that objective was going to be impossible in present company) despite being told repeatedly that they’re not going to kill it and to come build these rams and take this tower :S
I’m pretty sure it was more than that, but admittedly I could have overestimated a bit.
I guess I didn’t convey it clearly enough, but I wasn’t trying to say I was great because we killed you guys. In fact I’ve said the opposite numerous times already. It was just one of those moments of complete bewilderment, where I couldn’t even begin to understand what was going on.
Edit: I’m about to start roaming, so if anyone wants to prove just how bad I am, feel free to come looking. I’ll probably be on AR or FC bl south of the water.
we originally passed you by because i’d just gotten a message from someone in the middle saying they were dueling dr so i figured you & the others were just on your way there and i’m of the opinion that one dude against a zerg should be free to get taken by other roamers, if you turned back (to join the group we were about to hit—imo you were fair game & I think the rest of the group thought the same thing). unfortunately for us, our guys assumed siegerazerererererrrrr was some normal npc.
Old Janx // [THG] Jade Quarry / Seafarer’s Rest
secessit viri bellatores
sadly enough his tale is mostly accurate. the numbers are slightly off on our side we probably had maybe 10-12 but they all had a wild hair to kill siegerazer instead of trying to get into the tower (we wiped the group doing the breakout prior to these guys showing up, that bit was pretty fun). sometimes folks get distracted by the silliest of things… like big champ npcs that they’re not going to kill (and is responsible for 99% of our wipe not these guys though they did annoy us by spiking our remaining rezzers keeping us from moving when it became apparent that that objective was going to be impossible in present company) despite being told repeatedly that they’re not going to kill it and to come build these rams and take this tower :S
I’m pretty sure it was more than that, but admittedly I could have overestimated a bit.
I guess I didn’t convey it clearly enough, but I wasn’t trying to say I was great because we killed you guys. In fact I’ve said the opposite numerous times already. It was just one of those moments of complete bewilderment, where I couldn’t even begin to understand what was going on.
Edit: I’m about to start roaming, so if anyone wants to prove just how bad I am, feel free to come looking. I’ll probably be on AR or FC bl south of the water.
we originally passed you by because i’d just gotten a message from someone in the middle saying they were dueling dr so i figured you & the others were just on your way there and i’m of the opinion that one dude against a zerg should be free to get taken by other roamers, if you turned back (to join the group we were about to hit—imo you were fair game & I think the rest of the group thought the same thing which I think you eventually did). unfortunately for us, our guys assumed siegerazerererererrrrr was some normal npc.
I remember you guys… you are those roamers who I always see in our border. maybe we got tired of it and finally wanted to kick you out? But of course if You run into a zerg it is mindless and will want to kill you, soooo… this only proves you ran into a zerg. Which was probably the zerg that came to flip back our border after DR zerged it.
I’m sure it looked differently from the other side though, you don’t see how the champ destroys your team from the other side (been there done that) especially when they’re all unaware & trying to cap him like a normal claiming lord.
it was pretty embarrassing tbh not one of my finer moments (& I debated claiming it) but you win some you lose some; that was not a good night for meh.
Was this the same night you were late to Hills? If so, we wondered what the hell you were doing back there. We moved on and capped Lake instead.
yea man… right after. string of defeating moments, had to try and log out right after felt a migraine coming on.
probably would have kept hitting the door at hills if y’all would have wp’d after taking it. thought one of our ppl glitched through the door when i saw you all on the other side, (didn’t even pull map over to see the circle for hills that it was blue. you guys are quiet with your super /s chatting). sigh, bad night all around.
s-chat? Pfft. g-chat is the new green
CornChips | Sylvari Guardian |
Dvaita Vedanta | Human Mesmer|
The Fluttering Horde [TFH] | CD
I’ve been away from the game a while thanks to work, and remember some great fun with FC and KA a few months ago. Was nice to match up with FC again this weekend.
I’ve seen some nice to-and-fro’ing between the three with evenly matched gangs of 3 or 4 groups, particularly on Saturday at the camp south of Hills in our (DR) Borderlands. Similar to the above post about a DR necro, there’s a right hard kitten in the AR ranks as well that took an astonishing amount of time to return to his roots.
If you see a bald ranger in red, white and blue (I still have no idea why I play on an NA server), duck :p
edit – d’oh. I was referring to the Union Flag, not the Stars’n’Stripes. I’m British :p
yea we just dont need people vaguely stating so-and-so is really bad. there’s a difference between competitive trash-talking and being an kittenhole.
this match i haven’t played a whole lot, and the solo/skirmish fights I had pretty much won them all…. EXCEPT not long after reset I was playing my warrior and came across a DR condi-necro somewhere near the SW tower in… I think our own BL. That kitten necro owned my face off harder than I have ever been owned. Before I died I did /cry /sit and he let me live. True I didn’t have a ranged weapon or the right skills equipped for the fight but still my build can usually make 10 players chase me across the entire map, but this little kitten necro….. holy jebsus you rocked my world.
Do you by any chance remember the race/ guild tag?
memory is fuzzy from gettin whooped so hard but maybe a short human male? the first time he kitten d me I used vengeance and ran to the tower so the NPCs could rez me. Then i ran back out and as I started melting again I did /cry /sit as the conditions downed me, and he stopped and ran off towards vale camp.
I remember you guys… you are those roamers who I always see in our border. maybe we got tired of it and finally wanted to kick you out? But of course if You run into a zerg it is mindless and will want to kill you, soooo… this only proves you ran into a zerg. Which was probably the zerg that came to flip back our border after DR zerged it.
So is the circle of of WvW life.
QFT but I look more on the circle as a downward spiral slowly killing wvw.
For the roamers there really is a limit on how many you can take on on a regular basis and come out on top. The way the game works (downed state, being able to rezz stomped players, ae limit, defensive siege) it really promotes numbers as the easiest and most comfortable solution to any wvw situation. I was hoping this game would evolve into more and more people looking for the small-man action but during this year it has moved to quite the opposite. My feeling is that small roaming groups is alot fewer and far between than a couple of months ago. Eventually and rather sooner than later there won’t be any, just solo duel-specd roamers and the zergs.
Now the biggest problem for the future of wvw isn’t that the zergs will destroy small-man roaming but eventually they will destroy this whole part (wvw) of the game. When the solution to any wvw problem is numbers, it will lead to bigger and bigger zergs and the servers with less people and coverage will slowly stop wvw:ing. Since server pride went out the window months ago (with free transfers) there’s nothing ( I dont see the minimal fee you have to pay for transferring as a hindrance) that will stop people moving to the greener and only grass. Then you’ll have a couple of powerhouse servers dishing it out with humongous zergs, queues to wvw etc and all that to gain nothing, since you don’t gain anything winning a match-up. A year from now wvw in zerg wars will be dead.
That’s my wvw judgement day sermon and I’m very bored at work.
What part of World vs World did you not get? this all depends on your definition of a small group and a zerg if you looking for 5vs5 action go PvP if you hate PvP go to GvG or fight clubs they have plenty small man action. I consider 10+ people a zerg WvW was never really meant for small action I mean sure it’s still very much there but I’ve seen small man groups take towers before even if you can’t take towers flip camps so the enemy has to stop what they are doing and re flip them WORLD vs WORLD is suppose to be big fights not small 5 man group vs other small 5 man group if you train your group hard enough I’m sure your 5-10 man group can take out 10-20 man group it’s not impossible numbers aren’t what wins WvW (but they sure help lol) coverage, coordination, tactics, and siege are what wins WvW this might not be all things but this is just off top of my head a well placed superior AC could easily wipe a 10 man zerg a supply trap could compeltly stop a zerg in it’s tracks due to lack of supply there is sooo much content and new content being releashed every week from traps to WvW abilities and much more WvW dieing is simply not possible.
What part of World vs World did you not get? this all depends on your definition of a small group and a zerg if you looking for 5vs5 action go PvP if you hate PvP go to GvG or fight clubs they have plenty small man action. I consider 10+ people a zerg WvW was never really meant for small action I mean sure it’s still very much there but I’ve seen small man groups take towers before even if you can’t take towers flip camps so the enemy has to stop what they are doing and re flip them WORLD vs WORLD is suppose to be big fights not small 5 man group vs other small 5 man group if you train your group hard enough I’m sure your 5-10 man group can take out 10-20 man group it’s not impossible numbers aren’t what wins WvW (but they sure help lol) coverage, coordination, tactics, and siege are what wins WvW this might not be all things but this is just off top of my head a well placed superior AC could easily wipe a 10 man zerg a supply trap could compeltly stop a zerg in it’s tracks due to lack of supply there is sooo much content and new content being releashed every week from traps to WvW abilities and much more WvW dieing is simply not possible.
What part of World vs World did you not get? this all depends on your definition of a small group and a zerg if you looking for 5vs5 action go PvP if you hate PvP go to GvG or fight clubs they have plenty small man action. I consider 10+ people a zerg WvW was never really meant for small action I mean sure it’s still very much there but I’ve seen small man groups take towers before even if you can’t take towers flip camps so the enemy has to stop what they are doing and re flip them WORLD vs WORLD is suppose to be big fights not small 5 man group vs other small 5 man group if you train your group hard enough I’m sure your 5-10 man group can take out 10-20 man group it’s not impossible numbers aren’t what wins WvW (but they sure help lol) coverage, coordination, tactics, and siege are what wins WvW this might not be all things but this is just off top of my head a well placed superior AC could easily wipe a 10 man zerg a supply trap could compeltly stop a zerg in it’s tracks due to lack of supply there is sooo much content and new content being releashed every week from traps to WvW abilities and much more WvW dieing is simply not possible.
hahahaha ^^
servers that dont win a match in many weeks will continue to die, starting with the lowest ranks and moving upwards. evolution scores don’t keep players around, winning does. PvE has more loot potential. If a server keeps out of 1st place long enough they will lose players plain and simple, and end up with a handful of queued servers where nobody really makes any difference because as soon as they log off someone takes their place.
Yet FC and ET are still bright and active despite they haven’t had a win in lord only knows how long yet they still don’t give up or even DR until recently DR’s last first place win was back in January did server give up no. your trying to say that a server would simply stop WvWing and let 2 man groups take their keeps it’ll just be a repeat of kaineng some higher server guild will go there and dominate and basicly carry server to make entire server look up to them or some other guild already in server will do that people will never stop WvW simply no point easy exp, loot, karma, events, fun even if it’s only small groups a server won’t simply stop WvWing my point is as long as people play GW2 there will always be people in WvW because I HIGHLY doubt I’ll ever see a 2 man team take SM with 1 flame ram a gate.
My main point is can you possibly imagine an entire server just PvEing? allowing 5 man groups to run in their BL un opposed and flip their keeps with no resistance? someone will step up and take charge when others step down WvW guilds will form that zerg at certain times in WvW so that server can win simply because WvW is fun.
Just wanted to thank Yarr for playing clean on my duel with the sword dagger thief on their BL, it is a bit late so I have to log. It was a good battle that lasted way too long, and neither of us was going to win. Sorry those other two from our server decided to play hero, I tried to ask them to stop but it was too late. Thanks for not killing me in the melee that ensued, much respect. /bow /wave PS. sorry for tagging that mesmer that got a little too close early in the battle, thieves disappear quite often and you happened to be next closest target.
Qualm – Commander
Grievance [GVNC] – Our drunken WvW is the kitten
Devona’s Rest – Forever Outnumbered & Kittened upon by Anet
servers that dont win a match in many weeks will continue to die, starting with the lowest ranks and moving upwards. evolution scores don’t keep players around, winning does. PvE has more loot potential. If a server keeps out of 1st place long enough they will lose players plain and simple, and end up with a handful of queued servers where nobody really makes any difference because as soon as they log off someone takes their place.
Orbs or atleast a new form of them are making it back and Devon’s been saying they’re looking at rewards for match-up wins. I’m certain it will just speed up this process.
Great fights in FCBL! Had a lot of fun defending the SE tower against you guys tonight. +1 for your determination. Put up a hell of a fight for us to take it too.
Wipin zergs since 2012
Former Too Kitten [BÆST] leader/founder
[TBT] The Black Tides since ’14
How better to celebrate a 15 v 1 after an hour siege on a paper tower with 4 to 1 odds, than to /e spam. Keep it classy DR.
“Keep it classy DR”???? Not possible. As I type this they (about 20’ish) have set up siege at our EB spawn and 2 Legends and 1 Colonel P/D Thief are hopping around like little rabbits trying for easy kills. I call that out because these are the folks who really should be “leaders” on their server. LOL. Instead, for some odd reason, they keep turning into pink Moa birds and running away. Curios……
And before the “pro-tip” police show up, yes, we ALL know there are multiple ways out of the spawn area. That doesn’t excuse the behavior, and besides, I really enjoyed farming them. I had to keep going back to the merchants to sell my loot. Thanks!
Come to us, you foes, and bring your flock.
For we will crush your bones on the Anvil Rock!
On the topic of laughing… last night I encountered a DR thief and for once my dodging was spot on and I managed to inflict some rather serious damage without much in return. Needless to say the thief stealthed and reset the fight. All proud of my uber skills I typed the laugh emote. Round two ended with me on my rear end in a jiffy and the thief laughed in return… he who laughs last I suppose
FC – [SNKY]
Keep the Faith (and stay out of AC fire)
Hacks and Spamming those emotes! Dang, [Yarr] has it all! FC must be proud…
Admit those emotes were uncalled for, but they just wanted a fight, as for hacking?? O.o
Well, for what it’s worth, the [Yarr] I have encountered (some pictured above) have been pretty nice folks. You guys have a good group of players, for sure.
I feel I should say thank you to the charr ele from [Yarr] for dancing with me in doll form and dropping a banner for my guildies to enjoy. That was super nice. You will definitely be seeing me soon. :P
What part of World vs World did you not get? this all depends on your definition of a small group and a zerg if you looking for 5vs5 action go PvP if you hate PvP go to GvG or fight clubs they have plenty small man action. I consider 10+ people a zerg WvW was never really meant for small action I mean sure it’s still very much there but I’ve seen small man groups take towers before even if you can’t take towers flip camps so the enemy has to stop what they are doing and re flip them WORLD vs WORLD is suppose to be big fights not small 5 man group vs other small 5 man group if you train your group hard enough I’m sure your 5-10 man group can take out 10-20 man group it’s not impossible numbers aren’t what wins WvW (but they sure help lol) coverage, coordination, tactics, and siege are what wins WvW this might not be all things but this is just off top of my head a well placed superior AC could easily wipe a 10 man zerg a supply trap could compeltly stop a zerg in it’s tracks due to lack of supply there is sooo much content and new content being releashed every week from traps to WvW abilities and much more WvW dieing is simply not possible.
I don’t know what’s funnier, you trying to lecture Etna on how to wipe numbers or the fact you are actually trying to say there has been sooooo much new content being released for WvW.
[LARP]
Tiglie Wiglie – Oh Bahmaz
Iz U Potato – Absentee Father
And……the thing people have been saying till they are blue in the face but you 1 spam commanders will never get is. The game is waaaay more enjoyable when you have interesting and challenging fights. The game just promotes and encourages zerging so much that other than the few remaining groups of small mans that spilled over from previous games, no new groups are forming and learning because there is no incentive to get beat and better when they can just go back to spamming in the zerg. You cannot begin to tell me that spamming aoes, sitting on siege, and ball stacking is fun or skillful. You just get a large turnover of try it for a few weeks at spurt.
I could give 2 kittens about the zerg running around, its going to happen. It’s just annoying when there are 1. no challenging groups to fight 2. extending nameless numbers of unorganized zerg groups until you finally cant overcome the rez rate.
[LARP]
Tiglie Wiglie – Oh Bahmaz
Iz U Potato – Absentee Father
QFT but I look more on the circle as a downward spiral slowly killing wvw.
For the roamers there really is a limit on how many you can take on on a regular basis and come out on top. The way the game works (downed state, being able to rezz stomped players, ae limit, defensive siege) it really promotes numbers as the easiest and most comfortable solution to any wvw situation. I was hoping this game would evolve into more and more people looking for the small-man action but during this year it has moved to quite the opposite. My feeling is that small roaming groups is alot fewer and far between than a couple of months ago. Eventually and rather sooner than later there won’t be any, just solo duel-specd roamers and the zergs.
Now the biggest problem for the future of wvw isn’t that the zergs will destroy small-man roaming but eventually they will destroy this whole part (wvw) of the game. When the solution to any wvw problem is numbers, it will lead to bigger and bigger zergs and the servers with less people and coverage will slowly stop wvw:ing. Since server pride went out the window months ago (with free transfers) there’s nothing ( I dont see the minimal fee you have to pay for transferring as a hindrance) that will stop people moving to the greener and only grass. Then you’ll have a couple of powerhouse servers dishing it out with humongous zergs, queues to wvw etc and all that to gain nothing, since you don’t gain anything winning a match-up. A year from now wvw in zerg wars will be dead.
That’s my wvw judgement day sermon and I’m very bored at work.
Wanted to give a shout-out to the Ferguson’s Crossing on FCBL last night, server time! Great fights were to be had. My guild, [BÆST], was determined to conquer your superior numbers and arrow carts in SE Tower. You took us out a few times, but eventually the tower was ours. Even after we took it, you kept on the offense for a few more hours. Kept us on our toes. It was great fun! Hope you got some good loot too!
At the end of the day, we were a bit tired.
Note: No, we’re not sitting on anyone. Just regular sitting.
What part of World vs World did you not get? this all depends on your definition of a small group and a zerg if you looking for 5vs5 action go PvP if you hate PvP go to GvG or fight clubs they have plenty small man action. I consider 10+ people a zerg WvW was never really meant for small action I mean sure it’s still very much there but I’ve seen small man groups take towers before even if you can’t take towers flip camps so the enemy has to stop what they are doing and re flip them WORLD vs WORLD is suppose to be big fights not small 5 man group vs other small 5 man group if you train your group hard enough I’m sure your 5-10 man group can take out 10-20 man group it’s not impossible numbers aren’t what wins WvW (but they sure help lol) coverage, coordination, tactics, and siege are what wins WvW this might not be all things but this is just off top of my head a well placed superior AC could easily wipe a 10 man zerg a supply trap could compeltly stop a zerg in it’s tracks due to lack of supply there is sooo much content and new content being releashed every week from traps to WvW abilities and much more WvW dieing is simply not possible.
Its actually suppose to cater to all forms of play, as stated by Anet when it was still being made. Why people come here and try and insist that WvW is ONLY suppose to be about large group warfare just shows how ignorant you are. Each and every play style has a place in WvW and each and every play style contributes to WvW. Just because YOU think its suppose to be about large group warfare does not make it true.
I’m pretty sure he wasn’t asking for only 5vs5 fights and for all the zergs to just go away, it would be nice to see Anet reward players for more then just blobbing up and mashing 1.
Don’t take it the wrong way, I’m not an anti zerg hate machine, I think if people enjoy that then all the power to them, but suggesting WvW is suppose to be about Zerg vs. Zerg only is just wrong.
Hey guys hows my pals from dr doing? Heres my newest vid 5 of solo outnumber slaying, tyvm for the fight dr hope to fight you guys again in the future! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hq_cPMty2DY
Wanted to give a shout-out to the Ferguson’s Crossing on FCBL last night, server time! Great fights were to be had. My guild, [BÆST], was determined to conquer your superior numbers and arrow carts in SE Tower. You took us out a few times, but eventually the tower was ours. Even after we took it, you kept on the offense for a few more hours. Kept us on our toes. It was great fun! Hope you got some good loot too!
At the end of the day, we were a bit tired.
Note: No, we’re not sitting on anyone. Just regular sitting.
numbers were even or in your favor o.o
we didnt outnumber you
we did have the arrow cart advantage though
JQ: Rikkity
head here to discuss wvw without fear of infractions
numbers were even or in your favor o.o
we didnt outnumber you
we did have the arrow cart advantage though
We had, at most, 15. I believe we spent most of the night around 12. I won’t claim you outnumbered us 3 to our 1 or something silly/grandiose, but I /believe/ you did have a numbers edge.
Mostly irrelevant number claims aside, it was some fantastic fights. We’re still talking about the fun we had. Good test of skill.
Hey guys hows my pals from dr doing? Heres my newest vid 5 of solo outnumber slaying, tyvm for the fight dr hope to fight you guys again in the future! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hq_cPMty2DY
Always a pleasure watching your videos, Joe! And I hope we’re matched up again soon.
Lilliàna – Mesmer
Leader of Nameless Accord [NA]
Maguuma
wow ok it’s not my style but I have to brag a little bit about this one
DR just ran in behind us when we were recapping Klovan from AR. We flipped it right before they got to lords room, but their group of about 15 wiped us…. except me. I stayed and fought alongside the lord for a good 4-5 minutes wiping DR one by one in the lord’s room and on the bridge, with my fallen allies cheering me on, until the tower was clear. Couldn’t have done it without the help of guards but still…. it was like 1v15 and it was such an intense fight (for me) that I had to take a break to calm down (which is what I’m doing posting now).
Who says d/d ele is outdated??
Anyway, they came back with 20+ and no RI so I just died in the lord’s room all alone
wow ok it’s not my style but I have to brag a little bit about this one
DR just ran in behind us when we were recapping Klovan from AR. We flipped it right before they got to lords room, but their group of about 15 wiped us…. except me. I stayed and fought alongside the lord for a good 4-5 minutes wiping DR one by one in the lord’s room and on the bridge, with my fallen allies cheering me on, until the tower was clear. Couldn’t have done it without the help of guards but still…. it was like 1v15 and it was such an intense fight (for me) that I had to take a break to calm down (which is what I’m doing posting now).
Who says d/d ele is outdated??
Anyway, they came back with 20+ and no RI so I just died in the lord’s room all alone
I think you owe that buffed keep lord a drink
CornChips | Sylvari Guardian |
Dvaita Vedanta | Human Mesmer|
The Fluttering Horde [TFH] | CD
), duck :p
