Guild Wars 2

I’m reposting this from http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/56949-trolls-end-jumping-puzzle-is-not-for-norns/
…because imo, the devs need to look into this issue. It’s not just the Troll’s End jumping puzzle, but throughout the game. It seems like the QA team didn’t test a good chunk of content with the larger races. Another place, off the top of my head, is the ship bridge in Lion’s Arch – entering the first ship requires Norn to walk to the northern entrance, while all other races (maybe not Char) can enter from either doorway.

From the link:
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Go and try to do this jumping puzzle in Lion’s Arch with a Norh, it’s nearly impossible:

A big Norn is just too big for the cave part of this jumping puzzle. It is a total mess, when you try to go through this with a Norn. The camera is often useless, it just stops sometimes if you are going towards a wall. I don’t know why ArenaNet changed this jumping puzzle, it was cool enough before release:

But now it’s unplayable with a Norn.
"

Actually I did the Troll’s end with a norn… I didn’t even know there was an achievement there I just jumped up. Sure, it wasn’t easy but it’s completely doable.

I’ve done Troll’s End on my norn (I assume a lot of people have), but it’s absolutely the case that it’s much more difficult. There’s dramatically more randomly flailing the camera around and spinning your character trying to get a view of basically anything useful than when I do the same puzzle on my Asura.

I also experienced the annoyance of the camera issues doing Troll’s End. Parts of Dark Reverie, the one past Morgan's Spiral, also had a number of camera issues, but Troll’s End was still the worst one yet.

I didn’t even choose the tallest option on the slider on my female norn. Male norn’s have a higher range, so it could be even worse for them.

I have the largest possible norn height, and was able to do this one with little problems. Yes the camera is a bit wonky in there, but I was still able to pull it off and get the achievement. I have been in there a second time to get the harvestables.

You know, I was doing Dark Reverie yesterday (on my norn) and it was very difficult.
I have a lvl 50 asura warrior, and well, they are so nimble… so small… It wasn’t until I made my norn that I realized how much easier certain jumping puzzles are! But I love norn lore, the way they look, their area… So I’m just going to do my best re: jumping puzzles. I eventually got Dark Reverie done, with help from other players doing it (all sorts were having trouble haha, it was good fun rezzing each other and what not) and once I got to the top it felt great.

The challenge may be harder, but the reward is sweeter.
Hang in their with your norn… I don’t think Anet will change anything unless it was really impossible to finish some jumping puzzles with norn – right now, it just seems more difficult but many people wouldn’t know unless they played norn and saw the camera issues, etc.

Challenge shouldn’t depend on camera functionality. A great many of the jumping puzzles and many areas in general are a problem for the camera that increases the frustration level beyond tolerable.
Yes, they can all be done but they should be enjoyable as well, and currently they’re not enjoyable when you can’t see what you’re doing, the camera hangs on an object, bounces uncontrollably, or just will not work in the area.

My male norn is the tallest possible. The entire jumping puzzle was spent with a friend coaching me on how many steps i had to take forward or where to jump, because the camera and screen were completely filled with my character. I literally could not see anything else. Anet needs to implement first person view asap.

Norns are harder to do jumping puzzles with, yes, but it’s not too hard. It gets a lot easier if you use Guardian’s 2-hand staff for a large move speed bonus.

It’s definitely tougher with a Norn, but I actually like the disparity. I mean, it sorta makes sense that their hugeness would have trouble fitting into tight spaces. If you want an easy race to complete jumping puzzles with, just create an Asura.

A couple parts of Troll’s End might have actually be easier because my girth forced the camera inside myself —and when I wasn’t distracted by looking at the inside of my eyeballs-- the nearly-first-person view made it easier to do some of the jumps.

Many people dont realize that shortly after the game went live, Trolls End was revamped, and made harder. The new changes make it nearly impossible to do. I know many people did it fine in beta, but it has changed. I challenge anyone to make a norn, especially a large one, and then do trolls end and post a youtube of you going through and actually completing it.

Well, I did this one about one week after launch. No idea if it was already revamped back then, but I had no problems completing it with my max height (though female) norn.

I did that yesterday as a norn. heck i did the hidden maw one yesterday too. It is quite difficult as a norn, more difficult than as an asura (the one in the grove I could not bring myself to finish as a norn, too much foliage and wild camera panning). But it is not impossible jsut, IMHO harder.

Troll’s end was pretty easy on a norn.

I just finished it last night with my slightly taller than averge female norn. The key is not to pan your camera so that you face where you are jumping, but rather, move and jump side way like you’re playing old school Mario Brothers. Some part would require you to guess your steps, but the game engine is good enough to capture your grip even if you were slightly off.

SammyIAm.1726:

It’s definitely tougher with a Norn, but I actually like the disparity. I mean, it sorta makes sense that their hugeness would have trouble fitting into tight spaces. If you want an easy race to complete jumping puzzles with, just create an Asura.

Ugh, no. My Norn does so much better with jumping puzzles than my short stubby-legged Asura. Drives me nuts.

Troll’s End was a nightmare on max-height Norn. I managed after the 10th try though.

Hmm…. lets see…. where do i jump next?

There’s a similar topic over on the charr forum:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/races/charr/Jumping-Puzzles-as-a-Charr/

In tight spots like this, the erratic camera-jerking can make me motion-sick and also makes it very hard to see where I’m going, especially on my norn and charr. I don’t even want to think about taking those two through Troll’s End after suffering through it on my sylvari last night, thank you very much.

I can accept splatting myself when I misjudge a jump. I can also accept frustration when I fail to spot the proper route. But when the biggest obstacle is the camera, something is just wrong.

I cant do any serious jumping on my Norn and its my favorite character. It feels like her legs are weighted down. Now I do have the smallest size Norn so I wonder if what ever compensation there is for their leg length left my smaller Norn with lack luster jumping skills. It often leaves me very sad falling to death while everyone around me of other races sales by.

I managed to do evrything in LA with a Norn char, but specially the jump puzzles were a bigger challenge.
I would really really like a first person view.
In GW1 the last step of zooming in closer to yer character would get u first person view.
Its beyond me why that is not in GW2.

Jumping puzzles in general are a lot harder with a Norn. I have a Norn main and Asura as my 1st alt, I know its two ends of the spectrum but the jumping puzzles are so easy with the little guy I usually manage 1st time. But really struggle with the Norn even doing the same puzzle the next day, it shouldn’t be any harder bu it is.

I agree. I’ve been able to complete them, but its been extremely difficult by comparison to my Asura.

Yep, been saying this since beta. Glad to hear my fellow Norn are feeling the same way I do. As a large male Norn I can attest that the camera is our greatest enemy in any jumping puzzle, the second greatest enemy we have is not judging our jumps right. We just feel slower since we take 1 step to a Human’s 3(or an Asura’s 15) and as such we need to compensate without a movement speed boost. Yes, Sylvari and Asura are much easier to do jumping puzzles with due to better luck with a camera, but also due to an increased feeling of precision that isn’t there with Norn (even though we can be just as precise with our jumps.)

The problem is the camera not the Norn. If the camera would zoom in and spin around, I don’t think the character model size would be an issue.

i can’t imagine using a Charr either. since they seem to be a lot wider, whereas Norns are just massively tall. my Norn’s almost maxed height and i did have troubles with troll’s end or in small spaces in general. though i mainly feel it’s the camera “at fault”. and if we want to be realistic it only makes sense if it’s harder for a Norn to do jumping puzzles. : ))

don’t get me wrong, i do rage, without the quit, lol. but eventually i did TE jumping puzzle enough to sort of leap by faith. sometimes i’ll still messup and then have to start over… lol.

The 10/1 patch which adjusted the camera angle helped seeing, but I miss a bit more jumps in tight places than I used to.

I still do Troll’s End daily for the farm and the level 80ish scaled chest, it just sometimes takes a few tries where before, I could not see well but didn’t miss as many jumps.

I did it with my camera wedged in the wall back around release. It wasn’t that bad. just keep pressing jump.

I didn’t have any problems with my max height female Engineer, but I can imagine the broader shoulders of the males and Charr would get in the way.

The camera positioning and the need for 1st person perspective are apparent. Also, has anyone else notice it is harder to go from swimming on the surface of water under with a big norm character than an asuri? Its like the water tension is more pronounced.

So finally did this on a max height female guardian………..and I actually found it much, much easier and quicker to do then it was on my sylvari. Is this a male norn only problem?

Yeah, I had some trouble with this on my female Norn and (especially) my max-sized male Charr. I think this would be fairly easy for ANet to fix, though; they just need to allow us to go into first person view, then we can aim the camera at our feet when jumping in tight spaces.

Max height norn here, done Troll´s End puzzle with no troubles at all tbh..

I did it with my norn too, put it the mac height, doable… But the again, the camera is screwing up pretty badly in there. But to reiterate the point, troll’s end is completely doable, just that some races (Cough Asura Cough Shorties) have a much easier time

Tonics make you smaller, but some of them still allow you to jump – as far as you could jump in your normal form. Just saying.

its a hard one for tall fat norns, half the time my camera was tilted sideways through the jumping part of it

it’s doable but a lot harder than other races

this is why i want at least a basic first person view like they had in gw1, would stop a lot of the camera problems, just no idea why they left it out.

It is annoying but there are ways around it. People giggle when they see me transform into princess doll to do the jp. Problem solved. Grab a tonic that allows you to jump and it becomes easier.

Ever done this on a charr? Its 10x worse, not that norn is easy mind you. You pretty much have to just aim where you think you ought to go, jump and hope for the best. All you can do.

I do trolls end on my norn, however, it does take significantly longer than on my asura. Camera is useless, flailing around all over the place, just have to wait for it to calm down and give me a good look.

One of the last jumps in the cave is ridiculous. I think I’ve only managed to do it twice out of 30+ attemps (both with a relatively short sylvari). No chance on anything like a norn or charr (both male and max height admittedly). The character is basically touching the ceiling yet you need to jump on a higher platform.

If this is another of those “hehe this is surely gonna drive some players mad” then GJ.

it feels like im squeezing through a tube and I’m supposed to jump?? moving on to something else this is really frustrating.

Its annoyoing but not impossible. People saying they had no troubles at all are liars. One does not simply walk a max height norn through that JP and say easy unless they have done it a 100 times. Now just wait for max height norn with bear pet come in and claim they did it first time with no problems / l2p. There is nothing to be done. Just do it and don’t return. There are other JP.

Creates a max height character> complains about their character being too big

Cat tonic keeps a warm spot in my bag for JPs.

Never had too much trouble with that one on any of my characters, but have been doing that puzzle for a while.