Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Hamhead.4293

Hamhead.4293

really dropped the ball there

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Farzo.8410

Farzo.8410

There are only 2 worlds out, with a total of 4 zones. The difficulty will rise with the coming levels, and there will be a hard mode you can activate too. These updates will not come this month, or the month after, but somwhere in the near future.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: locoman.1974

locoman.1974

I could only imagine the amount of whining on the forums if it really was nintendo hard..

I can only imagine it… no continue coins… no accumulating baubles, all gone when you die… having to start every time from world 1, no world selecting at the beggining… no checkpoints, you die, you have to start from the beggining of the level again..

It’s a pile of Elonian protection magic, mixed with a little monk training,
wrapped up in some crazy ritualist hoo-ha from Cantha.
A real grab bag of ‘you can’t hurt me. They’re called Guardians.

(edited by locoman.1974)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Dasorine.1964

Dasorine.1964

it also depends entirely on which nintendo games your basing it off, some of the nintendo games where always ridiculously easy, most bosses only requiring 3 hits to defeat etc etc.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Danikat.8537

Danikat.8537

Didn’t “Nintendo Hard” specifically refer to Ninja Gaiden?

Having just spent a couple of hours getting all the baubles in Zone 3 I’m quite happy with how hard it is already.

Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).

“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Treeckoluv.3742

Treeckoluv.3742

Zone 3 is unforgiving as hell if you haven’t mastered the dodgejump yet. Unless you want those monkeys throwing exploding bombs, I think it’s good for the introductory world.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: toafarmer.8401

toafarmer.8401

Well, we only have world 1 complete. there are some challenges, not that hard, but hard enough for the 1st world.

The next worlds will be harder, that was already told by Josh. And even if they arent hard enough, there will be hard mode (if you are really prepared for “nintendo hardness” you certainly saw the rainny cloud above the infantile mode one).

I only hope that ping is considered during the tests of the new worlds and hard mode, since most players have a 150-250ms ping. Challenges are always welcome, but for jumping puzzles the ping is an important factor. So far it is working properly and it is the first time Im really having fun with GW2. This is so good that even helped me to enjoy other parts of the game, since I was really pised since launch (yeah, I expected a very different game, but lets deal with what we have and hope the new content brings GW2 to the same level of GW – which was WAY higher).

Overall, this is the BEST mini game ever in an MMO. Thanks for that, Josh. And thanks for being here and answering questions. This is what I expect from a staff member. You are doing great and imo you are one of the (very) few to do so. Im counting on you.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: StriderShinryu.6923

StriderShinryu.6923

I’m glad it’s not. Been there, done that. Nintendo hard is a relic of the old arcade mindset where you have to kill the player as many times as possible in as many unavoidable (on first experience, and often many after) such as to get them to sink as many quarters into the machine as possible. This carried over to the NES simply because it was the developer mindset at the time and because, Nintendo Hard removed, most of the games themselves would have lasted all of an hour at absolute most.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Relic.7148

Relic.7148

If you want to make it harder and more fun, play without the UI.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: No Walking.6349

No Walking.6349

Nintendo wasn’t hard, you were significantly younger.

/thread

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Josh Foreman

Josh Foreman

Environment Design Specialist

Next

Nintendo hard only appeals to a niche within a niche. The ping thing is certainly an issue that 8-bit games didn’t have to deal with, so I don’t think normal mode SAB will get Nintendo hard even in the last world because we want as many people as possible to be able to do it. (It’s going to be a tricky balance to not make it too easy in order to accommodate those with bad ping.) But future Worlds will be much much harder than World 1. And hard mode will be there for that niche within a niche who have good ping and want to punish themselves.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Azure Prower.8701

Azure Prower.8701

And hard mode will be there for that niche within a niche who have good ping and want to punish themselves.

Well puppy. Guess that means Aussies and other Oceanics can’t do hard mode.

(edited by Azure Prower.8701)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Crazylegsmurphy.6430

Crazylegsmurphy.6430

“Nintendo hard” means nothing.

For me, I was never able to pass Mega Man 1, Battletoads, Ninja Gaiden, and a bunch of others. However, my friend, while awesome at those games, found games like Zelda, and Dragon Warrior to be impossible.

SAB has, in my opinion found a near perfect balance between being difficult, and bing annoying. As I’ve mentioned above, aside from one or two places that push the game engine to its limit, making unnecessary difficulty, SAB has been one of the most pleasurable experiences in GW2.

The reason is that the players can choose how difficult to make the game. You can play through on infantile mode, or normal mode. You can choose to get all the baubles, or run straight for end bosses.

My concerns are the same as Pixelpumpkin above though when it comes to difficulty. In a video interview, Josh mentioned how because not everyone likes jumping puzzles, he added the “infantile Mode”. What Josh failed to mention are those players who love jumping puzzles, yet struggle with them on the best of days.

I hope the SAB continues to allow players off all levels to participate and not become another, “Clock Tower”.

Anyway, long story short….SAB is awesome!

(edited by Crazylegsmurphy.6430)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

For the record, the Clocktower was awesome because it was so hard.
But I understand entirely that that isn’t everybody’s cup of tea.

I’m glad the difficulty of SAB is somewhere in between. Because the Clocktower was short. I wouldn’t enjoy something as long as SAB being that hard. It would become a matter of trial and error, which I hate.

I’ve played a lot of old NES games that were deviously hard, but they were only hard to artificially increase the playing time. They usually were very short games. Megaman 1 is notoriously hard, especially when compared to the much easier sequels.

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Hamhead.4293

Hamhead.4293

Hey don’t forget that ‘frustrating challenge’ (which sab is not) Somewhat makes up for simplistic gameplay. Overcoming it is its own reward (and comes with somewhat meaningful bragging)

There was still merit to it,

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Danikat.8537

Danikat.8537

Also if you look at the map you can see hints of an underwater world and possibly a lava world. Which, as I’m sure you’ll know, is where any old school game really hit you.

Even relatively recent games actually. Just say the words “Water Temple” to anyone who’s played Ocarina of Time and watch the nervous twitching start.

Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).

“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Hamhead.4293

Hamhead.4293

I"m more interested in the lightning storm one

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: MagicSlurpees.4851

MagicSlurpees.4851

Also if you look at the map you can see hints of an underwater world and possibly a lava world. Which, as I’m sure you’ll know, is where any old school game really hit you.

Even relatively recent games actually. Just say the words “Water Temple” to anyone who’s played Ocarina of Time and watch the nervous twitching start.

Hard???? Nice joke there buddy, almost got me. But yeah, Lava temples in platformers = no good.

Anyways, OT, Mario first worlds were almost always easy, I remember schooling W1/2 within the first 30 mins of playing but try to get past W6, and all hell breaks loose. Still not sure if I’ve ever beat SMB3 w/o using whistles. Hated W7 w/ a passion.

I will enjoy me some hard modes when it comes out within (hopefully) a few months.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Preacher.9018

Preacher.9018

Speaking about maps, wheres this bonus level?

http://www.pevepe.net/ – Seafarers Rest Server community website

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Nihilus.3015

Nihilus.3015

Nintendo hard only appeals to a niche within a niche. The ping thing is certainly an issue that 8-bit games didn’t have to deal with, so I don’t think normal mode SAB will get Nintendo hard even in the last world because we want as many people as possible to be able to do it. (It’s going to be a tricky balance to not make it too easy in order to accommodate those with bad ping.) But future Worlds will be much much harder than World 1. And hard mode will be there for that niche within a niche who have good ping and want to punish themselves.

Hard modes going to be a breeze.

AmateurNet

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Also if you look at the map you can see hints of an underwater world and possibly a lava world. Which, as I’m sure you’ll know, is where any old school game really hit you.

That’s just a terrible stigma that underwater levels have received over the years.
I wonder why….?

Oh wait…. now it is all coming back to me… Merciful Grenth, the horror!

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Joseph Skyrim.2470

Joseph Skyrim.2470

Someone higher up mentioned zone 3 being unforgiving without dodgejump. I’ve never done dodgejump (and hope I don’t need to due to latency) but can clear zone 3 just fine?

Also I wouldn’t mind seeing the Clock Tower in here, though it wouldn’t make much sense. That thing was awesome!

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Dasorine.1964

Dasorine.1964

the only jump I’ve had to use dodgejump for is in zone 1 with the 3 baubles over the gap, but even thats not needed if you take the long route and give up the 3 baubles (or sacrifice a life if your going for the chieves

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Joseph Skyrim.2470

Joseph Skyrim.2470

Strange, I cleared that jump the first time (with the 3 baubles over the gap in zone1) but haven’t managed to do it again so far. I definitely didn’t dodgejump, but I may have gotten combat speed boost just at the right time.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Dasorine.1964

Dasorine.1964

think it may be possible to clear with a good floating jump as well maybe

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: StriderShinryu.6923

StriderShinryu.6923

I cleared that gap without a dodge jump. In fact, at that time I didn’t even know that there was such a thing.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Josh Foreman

Previous

Josh Foreman

Environment Design Specialist

Strange, I cleared that jump the first time (with the 3 baubles over the gap in zone1) but haven’t managed to do it again so far. I definitely didn’t dodgejump, but I may have gotten combat speed boost just at the right time.

Isn’t that the craziest, most frustrating thing? That happens to me ALL THE TIME. I think last time I played Super Ghouls ’n Ghosts I breezed through the water level my first try, but died on the boss. Then took about 20 more lives just to get back to him again.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Relic.7148

Relic.7148

Think you meant to quote Mad Queen Malafide.7512 on water levels.

I’m looking forward to dodge roll jumps off mushrooms. There’s a place in zone 2 you can use it to make it up a branch faster. You can’t normally make it going forward since the mushroom cuts your momentum. It’s extremely inconsistent and failing plops you in the poison water.

If that doesn’t make it into the area where you fall into a bottomless pit if you fail, I will be morbidly depressed. The next level would be stacking two jump roll mushrooms in a row.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Joseph Skyrim.2470

Joseph Skyrim.2470

Hmm if this dodgejump thing is ping related and will in the future be a requirement (or strongly suggested) for hardcore mode then can I suggest placing the grumpy cloud (who I’m guessing is the gatekeeper of hardcore mode) in a place that requires a dodgejump to get to? That should be a clear indicator if someone should be using that mode or not.

Also I’m guessing hardcore mode will be like, 0 spare lives, no continue coins, no checkpoints and only 1 heart plus super aggressive – no leash monsters (machine gun snakes with limitless range that shoot on more than one plane), a rising floor of lava (complete with lava shark), and a creeping black wall “chasing” you from behind (insta death if you touch it). Don’t think I’d clear stage 1 with that. ;P

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Dan.8709

Dan.8709

I cleared that gap without a dodge jump. In fact, at that time I didn’t even know that there was such a thing.

LOL RIGHT? Same thing with me.
The first time I did it with guildies and me and another one got it on first try without even thinking, no dodge-jump (none of us knew about it), the three others died and we went like “what hahahaha”. Tbh I didn’t miss a jump the first time, was really well aware of the sizes from other jumping puzzles I guess.

But, for some reason, since I watched Josh’s stream and the QA guy did it, I never was able to do it again without dodge-jump.

Daniel Cousland – Darkhaven

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Zaxares.5419

Zaxares.5419

That jump with the 3 baubles can be cleared without dodge-jumping by simply jumping at the very last second (right before you’re about to fall off the edge). Still, I’m sure we all got caught by it the very first time we tried jumping the gap. My first time in SAB, I was just following the lead player. He jumped to get the baubles and fell into the pit, and me and another player who were following him dutifully jumped to our doom by jumping in the exact same spot he did. XD

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Bubi.7942

Bubi.7942

Isn’t that the craziest, most frustrating thing? That happens to me ALL THE TIME. I think last time I played Super Ghouls ’n Ghosts I breezed through the water level my first try, but died on the boss. Then took about 20 more lives just to get back to him again.

Huh… I tought I was the only one returning to that game to punish myself time and time again…

That is one hard, unforgiving, frustrating game. Yet it still gives a sense of great achievment if anyone manages to complete it.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Isn’t that the craziest, most frustrating thing? That happens to me ALL THE TIME. I think last time I played Super Ghouls ’n Ghosts I breezed through the water level my first try, but died on the boss. Then took about 20 more lives just to get back to him again.

I think that is why water levels have just gained a terrible reputation. They often involve new mechanics that some how limit the player’s movement (mario bros), or a time limit/air limit (TMNT and Sonic), annoying enemies (mario bros), or just really frustrating obstacles (TMNT).

When ever a water level pops up in an 8-bit game, I think most people have an adverse reaction to it. Its immediately like: “Oh, no…. not this.” Because any game that is hard, is even harder underwater. That’s just a rule.

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: stof.9341

stof.9341

That jump with the 3 baubles can be cleared without dodge-jumping by simply jumping at the very last second (right before you’re about to fall off the edge). Still, I’m sure we all got caught by it the very first time we tried jumping the gap. My first time in SAB, I was just following the lead player. He jumped to get the baubles and fell into the pit, and me and another player who were following him dutifully jumped to our doom by jumping in the exact same spot he did. XD

Well, myself I pass that part y jumping AFTER the last second. The game is tolerant and let’s you jump a split second after you start falling it seems.

This is how one can do in the Eternal Battleground jumping puzzle. The part right after the boulder trap. You got two pillars covered in retractable spikes. It’s actually possible to make the jump from the second pillar down into the platform after without receiving fall damage that way. Since you jump a little after you started falling, your starting point is slightly closer to the ground, just enough to not get falling damage.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Danikat.8537

Danikat.8537

I had a similar problem trying to get all the baubles in Zone 3. I’d done the bit getting up to the secret shop about a week before to get Moto’s Breath and did it on my first or second try with absolutely no issues.

Doing it again to get the baubles I used up 4 continue coins and about 2 hours trying it over and over again!

Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).

“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Irena.1062

Irena.1062

Probably because Nintendo games were typically near impossible and attracted less of an audience because of it. Lets face it toning down the challenge so people don’t feel like the game is impossible to beat at the get go and slowly ramping up the challenge so that people’s skills improve along with it is the way to go.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: toafarmer.8401

toafarmer.8401

today must players (id say something around 80%) totally suck. players who like challenges are threated as a “niche”. and this game is certainly not marketed as a niche game, since it is probably the easier mmo ever made. game was designed for teens and this generation is not fond of challenges. they will cry if they dont get what they want immediatly. they will cry if they dont have the big glowing sword. they will cry if someone kill sthem in a pvp map even if they know they chose to be in a pvp map.

if you compare gw and gw2 you will see they designed a game that can be played by an 1 handed monkey (or a three-headed one if you know what i mean). gw = large pool of skills where you need to think and make a good build otherwise you fail. gw2 = 2 dozens of skills, while you can chose only 5 of them and you MUST have a healing skill amongst those 5. if you chose the worst possible combination, you will still be able to complete any content except for fractal’s high levels (unless you have some disability).

a good example is the “mad king says” event during halloween. in gw you had to figure out the game (well, it was pretty obvious, but some players had a hard time figuring it out). in gw2, each time (yeah, every time) it happens, he says “haha, i didnt say mad king says”. the funny thing is that people keep dying, but this is another story.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Joseph Skyrim.2470

Joseph Skyrim.2470

Guess I should just ask now, are future worlds in the SAB going to be like IWBTG (I wanna be the guy)? Because that took me a long (and mostly frustrating) time on normal mode to finish kitten that apple at the end). I’d hate to think where I’d be if I tried the most difficult mode with only the 1 save point. :P

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: derLoko.2185

derLoko.2185

And hard mode will be there for that niche within a niche who have good ping and want to punish themselves.

Oh yes, punish us, Josh! -

Apparently, hard mode is totally niche these days, and normal mode is just a slightly bigger niche. Unfortunately, regular GW2 doesn’t handle this any different. Even if something happens to be difficult, speed-running some easy-mode content instead is usually more rewarding. What happened to good old “skill > time spent?”. Both should be at least equal imo.

So, yeah.. Give us hard mode, make it hard, but also make sure that punishing ourselves feels rewarding enough. You know, most of us aren’t THAT masochistic, either…

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Tuck.4095

Tuck.4095

To my knowledge most (not all) “Nintendo hard” games were difficult due to crummy control/programming.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

To my knowledge most (not all) “Nintendo hard” games were difficult due to crummy control/programming.

Not that I know of, and I ’m looking at a pretty big pile of Nintendo cartridges right here. Castlevania is one of the few that was hard due to bad controls (and only just the jumping really). But most of the other Nintendo games that are notorious for being hard, had pretty decent controls. Especially games like Megaman. Even TMNT had good controls, they just made it really unforgivingly hard.

A lot of 3d games have been struggling to achieve the same smooth controls, but it is just a different story when doing it in 3D, with a more complex game engine.

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Irena.1062

Irena.1062

Yeah, Magician had good controls and was super hard due to food and water shortages.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Tuck.4095

Tuck.4095

Awesome…parents must have had the bargain bin games. Guess I will use Google for a bit to see the good but hard games I missed out on.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Mzr.7589

Mzr.7589

Nintendo wasn’t hard, you were significantly younger.

/thread

I used to play Super Probotector with a friend and we were able to beat it on hardmode. For old times sake we played it again a couple of weeks ago and we got destroyed so hard, its was just ridiculous. If anything, being young is an advantage because you learn so insanely fast.

SAB is perfect as it is. Just keep em coming ArenaNet!

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Eternis.1746

Eternis.1746

For the jump, run until you begin to see your character stepping “down” (like they’re about to fall off) THEN jump, and you’ll make it every time.

Edit: Dodge jum kitten iously the most difficult thing ever to do on my erganomic keyboard, for the love of god don’t require it later/ever, it’s sketchy at best even with low ping.
Edit edit:
Of course I now say that and manage to do it three times in a row just for fun.

(edited by Eternis.1746)

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Celestina.2894

Celestina.2894

Zone 3 is unforgiving as hell if you haven’t mastered the dodgejump yet. Unless you want those monkeys throwing exploding bombs, I think it’s good for the introductory world.

I’ve never even tried the dodge jump and I find 3 easy as hell.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Irena.1062

Irena.1062

Indeed, monkeys use line of sight to throw and once they get it they don’t adjust if you move. Very simple and good for a first monster to encounter.

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: JungleNin.8379

JungleNin.8379

Nintendo hard only appeals to a niche within a niche. The ping thing is certainly an issue that 8-bit games didn’t have to deal with, so I don’t think normal mode SAB will get Nintendo hard even in the last world because we want as many people as possible to be able to do it. (It’s going to be a tricky balance to not make it too easy in order to accommodate those with bad ping.) But future Worlds will be much much harder than World 1. And hard mode will be there for that niche within a niche who have good ping and want to punish themselves.

raises hand

Wait, why are the dungeons Nintendo Hard? Are you saying that you want only a limited number of people playing dungeons, compared to the rest of the game?

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Curo.2483

Curo.2483

Just my 2 cents on what makes a jumping puzzle hard: there are 2 factors, jumps and timing. I have little problem with hard/long/awkward jumps (most times), but I find if I’m rushed due to a timer or enemies chasing me, every jump becomes hard. Clock Tower’s actual jumps were pretty easy, however the rush factor is what made that puzzle completely impossible for me. So remember when you are judging how “hard” a puzzle is, different people find different things hard.

Curo Lunesque – “Concerned Citizen and Community Builder”
NSP – northernshiverpeaks.org

Why isn't SAB 'Nintendo Hard'

in Super Adventure Box

Posted by: Irena.1062

Irena.1062

Oh lol JungleNin just get a group for the dungeon, they are not meant for you to solo. GW2lfg is a good site, although it’s not the same as having an in-game lfg panel.