Guild Wars 2

Easy way to solve WvWvW queue.

Anytime you die you get booted from WvWvW and you have a 5 minute penalty before you rejoin the queue.

This will allow the queue to refresh much faster, giving more players the opportunity to play WvWvW. Not every player has 1 hour just to wait to get into the action.

This will also prevent so much of the fool-hearted zerging and allow more strategy.

With hour-long queues, this will also prevent a player from ever risking anything in WvW. I don’t think that is a good idea. It will remove much of the dynamic, or suicide missions.

Also, you would rather stay in the zerg, since it is a much more safe place to hide.

~MRA

MRA.4758:

With hour-long queues, this will also prevent a player from ever risking anything in WvW. I don’t think that is a good idea. It will remove much of the dynamic, or suicide missions.

Also, you would rather stay in the zerg, since it is a much more safe place to hide.

~MRA

The idea is there will no longer be hour queue times.

If death boots you from WvWvW, there won’t hardly be any wait… There would just be the 5 minute rejoin penalty, then maybe just a few minutes of wait time.

There is no other way to solve the 1 hour queue times besides swapping users…

there are 3 options.

1) Kick players who are idle for longer than 2-5 minutes

2) Kick players who are dead

3) Kick players who are dead IF NOT rezzed in 2-5 minutes

I do not agree with this idea. I do not think it would rid WvW of zerging, assuming players will want as large a force as possible to do anything (minimize chance of risk) as well as many people around them to bring them up should they ever die.

This is also just an incredibly awkward punishment your bringing to a player looking to WvW. It would just be incredibly unsatisfying getting booted out for taking any sort of risk.

This would also prevent strategy, because if a member of your group dies, you will no longer be able to execute any long term strategy that was planned.

Rounder.6703:

There is no other way to solve the 1 hour queue times besides swapping users…

there are 3 options.

1) Kick players who are idle for longer than 2-5 minutes

2) Kick players who are dead

3) Kick players who are dead IF NOT rezzed in 2-5 minutes

1. Allow players to see their position in queue and estimated time
2. Allow players to queue for multiple zones, to go into the first one available
3. Allow players to see the WvW map outside of WvW to make informed decisions about where they want to zone in
4. fix the current issue where some people cut in queue line before others (this really screws up the time)
5. Increase zone player cap
6. Increase number of maps

While i can’t comment if any are feasible or will ever happen, all are things to help people ease into queues, and hopefully work to reduce them. Kicking people out and ‘ruining it’ for those that did wait is not the only way

Rounder.6703:

The idea is there will no longer be hour queue times.

If death boots you from WvWvW, there won’t hardly be any wait… There would just be the 5 minute rejoin penalty, then maybe just a few minutes of wait time.

However you implement it, if you have 800 WvW spots available, and 1600 people want to play it, then 800 are in and 800 are out.

With your suggestion the “flow of the game” would be: Play 20 minutes, die, wait 20 minutes, play again. This doesn’t sound like fun to me.

The only fix to the long queues are:

a) People loosing interest in WvW (decide for yourself how desireable that is), or
b) ANet releases more WvW maps, which I assume will happen before the end of the year.

~MRA

Addendum: One thing ANet could do immediate to take a little pressure away from WvW is to remove each and every “PvE content” from the maps: harvesting nodes, vistas, POIs, skill challenges, and all that stuff. The jumping puzzles could be relocated completely to, say, some new caves in LA. (Or do they have any WvW relevance I don’t know of?)

That way you could at least reduce the amount of “tourists” on the map that do not contribute anything to the battle. Last night I saw some guy grinding mobs in WvW, which drove me crazy.

Of course all this has also an impact on the current WvW economy, but maybe it is still worth a shot.

~MRA

So many things are wrong with this suggestion.

1) This is NOT how you remove ques, this system your suggesting is actually worse than waiting in a queue. You wait in a queue for a while then when your in you know you’ll be there till your done. But with your system, it’s quite possible to spend more time waiting in ques than actually playing.

2) Even if it were a “not rezzed” timer this would be absurd. In a PvP environment it’s much harder to pull aside and revive a fallen ally than in PvE, this results in most people releasing to way-point on death. However, there are times when it is most beneficial to the team to wait for a res, with a timer these moments would be a race against the clock that will ALWAYS fail.

3)Being forced back into a queue is bad enough, but your also suggesting imposing a wait timer before your even allowed to rejoin the queue. That is by far one of the most incompetently thought out suggestion i have seen to date.

Now… onto the real issue with WvW queues. This is pure speculation since ANet won’t tell us yet how the system works. When queuing for WvW it’s a first come first serve basis, across ALL SERVERS so for the 3 servers involved it’s quite possible that Server A can fill 80% of the WvW population while Server B gets 15% and Server C gets only 5%. This is one of the biggest flaws in WvW, not only does it lead to mass imbalances in teams but it also adds to the queue Size for all servers involved. If the system were a population split guaranteeing each server 33% of the population space then the large queues would only exist on the high population servers that currently swarm to WvW at opening to ensure they have the most players, since they will hit their 33% cap sooner.

Another thing that can help with the queue timers, when Queueing for WvW auto que for all 4 WvW locations, this will reduce queue times quite a bit since many players will likly accept placement into any of the 4 zones. However… once actually inside WvW when using the gate que ONLY for the intended location.

Panda.1967:

This is pure speculation since ANet won’t tell us yet how the system works.

I acknowledge that, and part of my comment below is also speculation.

Panda.1967:

When queuing for WvW it’s a first come first serve basis, across ALL SERVERS so for the 3 servers involved it’s quite possible that Server A can fill 80% of the WvW population while Server B gets 15% and Server C gets only 5%.

I have heard this rumor for some time now and I fail to believe it. First of all, ANet spent years on designing and testing this game, and they are not stupid. I cannot believe that they would implement such a system, which would be imbalanced beyond kitten. And, second, I wish I could recall the interview I read to link it as source, but I am pretty sure that a dev has already stated at one point during development that it would be an equal number of players from each world (it was ~150 per world at that point).

~MRA

I would say kicking players who haven’t performed any PvP (or map objective, such as taking an unguarded supply camp) in the past 15 minutes gets the boot. 15 minutes is a reasonable amount of time for the players to spawn in and get into the action. That’ll get rid of the PvE and gathering players while allowing people actually participating to stay in and play.

Nighthorns.2569:

I would say kicking players who haven’t performed any PvP (or map objective, such as taking an unguarded supply camp) in the past 15 minutes gets the boot.

I am not a huge fan of automated kicking since, in a structured approach to WvW, you also need guildies guarding towers way behind the front line, or people scouting the enemy and doing nothing other for some time than reporting the enemy’s movements.

~MRA

Hey guys!

Want no que? Join Borlis pass.

Dead.7385:

Hey guys!

Want no que? Join Borlis pass.

NOT IN A MILLION YEARS!!! we have a large enough Queue on Borlis Pass already don’t add to it.

Damarus.5938:

Rounder.6703:

There is no other way to solve the 1 hour queue times besides swapping users…

there are 3 options.

1) Kick players who are idle for longer than 2-5 minutes

2) Kick players who are dead

3) Kick players who are dead IF NOT rezzed in 2-5 minutes

1. Allow players to see their position in queue and estimated time
2. Allow players to queue for multiple zones, to go into the first one available
3. Allow players to see the WvW map outside of WvW to make informed decisions about where they want to zone in
4. fix the current issue where some people cut in queue line before others (this really screws up the time)
5. Increase zone player cap
6. Increase number of maps

While i can’t comment if any are feasible or will ever happen, all are things to help people ease into queues, and hopefully work to reduce them. Kicking people out and ‘ruining it’ for those that did wait is not the only way

You have a few good ideas, but problems with others. Let me respond here.

1) This would definitely be somewhat beneficial but it wont prevent people from queueing. This is more of a cosmetic convinience. If people are going to play WvWvW they are going to queue up… They are not going to see “1 hour left” and then un-queue… So this suggestion does not positively (or negatively) influence the WvWvW queue time.

2) BAD IDEA. All this will do is have 1 person take up 4 queue spots. So instead of 500 people queued up, you essentially have 2000 people queued up.

3) I don’t see how being able to see the map is anything other than a cosmetic convinience. This will not change the fact that you must queue up for a WvWvW zone just like you do now.

4) Obviously if there is a queueing bug it needs to be fixed. I am talking about game mechanics here, not game bugs. This should not have been on your list.

5) Obviously they will increase the caps if their servers can handle it, but for now we have to assume that 500 per map is MAXIMUM. We need ideas to allieviate the problems we currently have.

6) The problem with adding more maps is it may lead to the opposite of our current problem. If you add too many maps you will just have too low of a map population which could cause sporadic engagements, empty towers/keeps, and less of the over feel of being in a warzone.

In conclusion i feel like you didn’t offer any real alternative solutions, just a bunch of fluff that won’t actually give any real results in the current game situation.

There has to be a game mechanism that boots players from WvWvW who are inactive or die. It is not fair to people who don’t have all day to wait in 1 hour queues.

Some people have work and families and would like to be able to jump in the action. My solution is the best one.

The only downside to my proposal is that people who die often will end up waiting in queues longer….

BUT THAT IS GOOD THING. You don’t want people on your team who die often anyways!!!

Another thing is you should only have 2-5 minutes in the safe-zone before you get kicked…

too many people go AFK there just to hold onto their WvWvW spot

They already kick idle players out of the game. (Both WvW and non WvW). Taking PvE out of WvW is not the answer either as it is part of WvW. Kicking out on death is just not fun. It also would not really solve the problem.

anzenketh.3759:

They already kick idle players out of the game. (Both WvW and non WvW). Taking PvE out of WvW is not the answer either as it is part of WvW. Kicking out on death is just not fun. It also would not really solve the problem.

Explain to me how it would not solve the problem.

It would allow people to join WvW very easily.

It would only be a problem to someone who dies alot…. who aren’t helping you win anyways in WvW because they die a lot.

If you are a good player and don’t die alot you essentially won’t ever have to wait to play WvW

Rounder.6703:

anzenketh.3759:

They already kick idle players out of the game. (Both WvW and non WvW). Taking PvE out of WvW is not the answer either as it is part of WvW. Kicking out on death is just not fun. It also would not really solve the problem.

Explain to me how it would not solve the problem.

It would allow people to join WvW very easily.

It would only be a problem to someone who dies alot…. which who aren’t helping you anyways in WvW because they die a lot.

If you are a good player and don’t die alot you essentially won’t ever have to wait to play WvW

It would not solve the problem because it would not be fun especially towards those only Luke warm for PvP (What WvW was more designed for). Also pepole will immediately re-queue. So instead of queuing to get in and play till you are done. You queue to get back in. What will solve the problem is time or doing a server move to a lower pop server.(I believe they are still free)

Areanet wont notice that ? dont belive it every company say same thing and wont solve it

takaos.6409:

Areanet wont notice that ? dont belive it every company say same thing and wont solve it

Huh?

Does ArenaNet even look at this suggestion forum?

Hm… this suggestion could be mixed with those about removing or tweaking armor repair costs in WvW.

Intead getting your armor broken, you’ll get an effect that stacks with itself whenever you are defeated. It’ll go down every time you complete an event, repair structures, build siege weaponry, etc.
Get defeated too much without helping, and you get kicked out.

MithranArkanere.8957:

Hm… this suggestion could be mixed with those about removing or tweaking armor repair costs in WvW.

Intead getting your armor broken, you’ll get an effect that stacks with itself whenever you are defeated. It’ll go down every time you complete an event, repair structures, build siege weaponry, etc.
Get defeated too much without helping, and you get kicked out.

Thats a good idea. I like it.

- Remove repair costs.
- 5 deaths gets you booted for 5 minutes from WvW
- Go AFK for 5 minutes in the spawn area you get booted

Rounder.6703:

Does ArenaNet even look at this suggestion forum?

I dont think so ? played many games and they all have forums same think happens
guild wars even did beta test but didnt solve queue problem in world versus world

This is terrible. God no. Impossible to have any organized strategy in the game because people get kicked.

I LOVE LOVE LOVE this idea.

Death means literally nothing in this game, both in PvE and PvP, this solution would at least makes it mean something in PvP.

Vyniea.2054:

I LOVE LOVE LOVE this idea.

Death means literally nothing in this game, both in PvE and PvP, this solution would at least makes it mean something in PvP.

It would mean WvW would be full of people who stay away from combat while the productive ones wait on the queue.

Vyniea.2054:

I LOVE LOVE LOVE this idea.

Death means literally nothing in this game, both in PvE and PvP, this solution would at least makes it mean something in PvP.

In WvW you have a long run back and have to pay repair costs – that’s a lot more onerous than it is in many other games, where u’r back in action almost instantly – wot do want anyway? Permadeath or something?

Eochaidh.4106:

Vyniea.2054:

I LOVE LOVE LOVE this idea.

Death means literally nothing in this game, both in PvE and PvP, this solution would at least makes it mean something in PvP.

It would mean WvW would be full of people who stay away from combat while the productive ones wait on the queue.

Wrong.

It would mean better players would stay in WvW

Weaker players who die more often will be will have 5 minute penalty and be back in the action before they know it

Rounder.6703:

Eochaidh.4106:

Vyniea.2054:

I LOVE LOVE LOVE this idea.

Death means literally nothing in this game, both in PvE and PvP, this solution would at least makes it mean something in PvP.

It would mean WvW would be full of people who stay away from combat while the productive ones wait on the queue.

Wrong.

It would mean better players would stay in WvW

Weaker players who die more often will be will have 5 minute penalty and be back in the action before they know it

And what is wrong with the less experienced players being in WvW? Plus there is the non-fun factor. I still see more problems then it solves.

anzenketh.3759:

Rounder.6703:

Eochaidh.4106:

Vyniea.2054:

I LOVE LOVE LOVE this idea.

Death means literally nothing in this game, both in PvE and PvP, this solution would at least makes it mean something in PvP.

It would mean WvW would be full of people who stay away from combat while the productive ones wait on the queue.

Wrong.

It would mean better players would stay in WvW

Weaker players who die more often will be will have 5 minute penalty and be back in the action before they know it

And what is wrong with the less experienced players being in WvW? Plus there is the non-fun factor. I still see more problems then it solves.

since when is dying fun?

why is it Anet’s responsibility to make everything fun… you even want dying to be fun?

seriously?

WE NEED TO SOLVE THE 1 HOUR QUEUE TIME.

I don’t care if someone gets their feelings hurt because they die and get booted from WvW.

We need to reduce the queue time, and my suggestion will do just that.

With my solution the queue time will be reduced to just a 2-3 minutes. With hundreds of people playing on a map the deaths are likely to happen quite often so the queue will be very short.

This would definently benefit the true level 80’s with level 80 weapons because they are less likely to die.

You may think this would be a bad thing, but really it will help keep GOOD players in WvW.

Lets face it: WvWvW wasn’t created just for the best of the best – it has something to offer for all players, regardless of their skill level and interests. If you like to zerk you can do that, if you like to do strategic work, fetch some likeminded people and do it, if you like to support you can do it there.

It never was intended to be a privilige for the elite. And I am quite sure ArenaNet will never let it happen that it turns into such a place.

Your idea would harm a lot of players in favour of a minority. Also: How can inexperienced players work on their skill when you constantly boot them from the battleground? They need the time and training if you really want to turn them into good soldiers for your realm.

The queues are long, because the game has just launched. After a while they will die down and in fact have done to some extent already on my world. Also, Arenanet have mentioned that they working on increasing the capacity. So there probably isn’t any real need for further “solutions”.

DruonGrawal.3596:

Lets face it: WvWvW wasn’t created just for the best of the best – it has something to offer for all players, regardless of their skill level and interests.

It never was intended to be a privilige for the elite. And I am quite sure ArenaNet will never let it happen that it turns into such a place.

Your idea would harm a lot of players in favour of a minority. Also: How can inexperienced players work on their skill when you constantly boot them from the battleground? They need the time and training if you really want to turn them into good soldiers for your realm.

Totally agree.

One of the things that sold me on this game was how they promoted the fact that WvW was playable by any level due to the up-leveling. Unfortunately that doesn’t really work since they still get lower stats.

But the real problem with the queues is the player limit. If there are 1000+ players that want to WvW they should just upgrade their servers to handle it. Anet is making enough money to afford the upgrades. The map is plenty big enough for that many.

Yesterday all my guild mates went enternal and 4 hours ? waited nothing happaned thanks areanet solve this problem…
They will read this ? hope

I think this is a brilliant idea.

You could add in itemisation in WvW that would allow groups to mark themselves in some fashion, to avoid the kick. This would allow players to form up in large groups to take on keeps and the like, but would make it more of a tactics and strategy game, rather than the blind zerg we have now.

It would also mean that we’d end up with a rotation of raids going on, and more small scale, skirmish-type PvP during off times. It would make WvW more of a dynamic experience, whereas right now it’s just a “who has the biggest zerg” game".

Love the idea!

You’re talking as this issue wouldn’t resolve itself after the MMO hoppers are gone.

I think the people who are saying that this isn’t a good idea and that they would spend more time waiting in a queue, haven’t spent 4.5 hours in the queue. It’s an aggravating wait. Personal experience tells me that a lot of suggestions besides OP are void. Now saying that the OP might be a little harsh. There has to be some middle ground somewhere. At this rate I’m never going to WvW.

I can’t believe you guys really posted in this thread and I can’t believe the OP really wrote that.

Maybe not an “die = booted”, but a life count. Starts at 3, lowers when you use an waypoint on death, and succeeding in an objective would reward in a life increase depending on the size (killing/defending a caravan would give you 1 life, but taking the keep would give 10).

This could even decrease the zergs, since the zergers would be slowly picked off while proper players following strategies would stay for as much as they want. Plus, this would lead to some real danger, therefore promoting strategic movements, and not just “attack until we get it”.

Also, it would give an edge to the defense. Currently, the attackers can just use attrition to eventually remove all supply and kill off most people defending from walls, as long as their number is enough. Defenders aren’t able to get back to their base due to the number of enemies on the gate, while attackers can just respawn and return to attack with little penalty (a bit of advantage, even, since they can bring extra siege and suppy).

I think it’s a terrific idea, because the lack of strategic impact from attrition excessively favors fool’s courage, but it shouldn’t be implemented until a consistent strategic layer settles in WvW, whether that be having adequate alliance presence in WvW on most servers most of the time or a system where even without alliance organization there is a semblance of command and objective oriented gameplay.

Kicking people for dying (which part of the games mechanics) or standing guard on a tower for 2-5 minutes are stupid ideas. I don’t know why people, who have reached level 80 or who more skilled at PvP so they don’t die often, feel they are entitled to special treatment. The people you asking to be kick from WvW or have lower priority to get into WvW paid the same $60.00 as you did.

I think standing guard on a tower is perfectly reasonable, permitted you moved around regularly. I don’t see how standing in one spot looking in one direction all the time does anything for your side. As for skill level, I agree that non-PvPers should also be able to try WvW without too much hassle; however, if you die all the time without contributing significantly to the war effort, you are are dead weight to your server. Some like burei already suggested a more wholistic approach to measuring contribution. Maybe you’re a scout whose role isn’t easily tracked by the server, a mechanism (maybe player based) should be added to recognize that. You don’t have to rely solely on k:d ratio to stay in, but you have to do something. The game, although accessible to all, should reward competence. GW2, like life, should have equity, but not equality.

what does the morning crew think?

I like the idea of starting with 3 “lives”.

If you do a WvW Dynamic Event (such as defending a keep) and you earn a GOLD Medal… you also earn +1 “lives”

So the more active people get more “lives”.

I think this is a good compromise.

The only people that will get booted is players who don’t help and just keep dying over and over…

Praytell.8164:

I think the people who are saying that this isn’t a good idea and that they would spend more time waiting in a queue, haven’t spent 4.5 hours in the queue. It’s an aggravating wait

(my answer is not exactly aimed at you, I just hijacked your quote)

Then, please people, do the math.

With the OP’s idea, you (the average player) would NOT spend less time in the queue, since there still would be the same amount of spots left on the WvW maps. If the demand stays the same, people will (in total) spent exactly the same time in queues, only that the waiting time will now be stretched over play-wait-play-wait-etc intervals.

The only “benefit” this approach would have is that it could potentially alienate a number of people who would no longer queue up for WvW after beeing kicked for the n-th time. This isn’t exactly what I would call good game design.

I still claim: The only solutions to full queues would be additional maps to raise the number of open WvW slots (with all the possible problems of such a move). But this isn’t something ANet will simple implement over a weekend.

So get used to it, or switch to a server with empty queues.

~MRA

MRA.4758:

Praytell.8164:

I think the people who are saying that this isn’t a good idea and that they would spend more time waiting in a queue, haven’t spent 4.5 hours in the queue. It’s an aggravating wait

(my answer is not exactly aimed at you, I just hijacked your quote)

Then, please people, do the math.

With the OP’s idea, you (the average player) would NOT spend less time in the queue, since there still would be the same amount of spots left on the WvW maps. If the demand stays the same, people will (in total) spent exactly the same time in queues, only that the waiting time will now be stretched over play-wait-play-wait-etc intervals.

The only “benefit” this approach would have is that it could potentially alienate a number of people who would no longer queue up for WvW after beeing kicked for the n-th time. This isn’t exactly what I would call good game design.

I still claim: The only solutions to full queues would be additional maps to raise the number of open WvW slots (with all the possible problems of such a move). But this isn’t something ANet will simple implement over a weekend.

So get used to it, or switch to a server with empty queues.

~MRA

What do you think about the new compromise proposale of staring with 3 “lives” and being able to aquire more “Lives” for participating in WvW dynamic events.

This will prevent the alienation of players that CONTRIBUTE to WvW.

The only players who will be alienated with this proposal are players who don’t contribute and who constantly die.

I really like the idea of a boot + 5 minute rejoin penalty for someone who dies 3x and does not contribute in WvW.

Rounder.6703:

What do you think about the new compromise proposale of staring with 3 “lives” and being able to aquire more “Lives” for participating in WvW dynamic events.

None of that fixes the problem that the “supply” doesn’t match the “demand”.

Rounder.6703:

The only players who will be alienated with this proposal are players who don’t contribute and who constantly die.

Which, most likely, hits “non-pro-below-average players” hard. Whether one likes it or not, crappy players have a right to play WvW, too. And no, they are not “hurting” their team, since the other wolds have (on average) just as much crappy players.

~MRA