Guild Wars 2

Amazingly enough, this is the first time I’ve ever written a complaint thread for an MMO — maybe I’m just complacent

Anyhoo…

I’m almost done playing through my personal story — wonderfully done, and I spent the entire night on Friday plowing through the last few missions so I could get to the incredibly-anticipated finale. Then I get there, the final words are spoken, and the mission appears: ‘Kill Zhaitan’.

But wait…I have to have a party to get to the Big Bad? And…wait, I have to run through a dungeon as well?? Seriously, guys — what gives???

The party aspect I could understand — Zhaitan is an Elder Dragon, after all — but the dungeon requirement really hurt the momentum of the story and killed the ‘epic hero’ feeling that had been building for the past few chapters.

Please, I beg — nay, I implore you — detach ‘Victory or Death’ from the dungeon. The player started his adventure on his own, and he needs to be able to finish it on his own — that’s kind of what a ‘personal story’ means.

I heard killing Zhaitan was not so epic.

domxnik.1453:

I heard killing Zhaitan was not so epic.

you’ve heard it right. it’s very anti-climatic

Have to agree. I suppose they wanted to both encourage group play and make the finale more epic. When I found out I now needed compose and run a dungeon at the end I was not happy. I don’t believe they should attach ‘personal story’ to dungeons, WvW, sPvP, or jumping puzzles. Let play out as it began…as your personal story.

So the whole goal and point of the second half of the personal story was to kill Zhaitan, and you want the actual “killing Zhaitan”-part not to be part of the story? What if an expansion releases and the NPCs talk about you having killed Zhaitan even though you never did, would that make sense?

They won’t move Zhaitan outside of the dungeon just for you to kill him either, not now when Arah is already done the way it is. They could make story mode dungeons soloable at some point in the future I guess. Barely anyone is repeating them anyway..

Map Completion introduces the player to WvW.
Personal Story introduces the player to Dungeons.
Crafting a Legendary introduces the player to everything except Fractals.
The current Monthly achievements can lead to Fractals and Jumping Puzzles.

Long story short, if you want the full GW2 experience you are expected to experience every gameplay element.

yeah i killed him as well loved player the story but “Victory or Death” was a bit of a let down and you should be able to do it solo i did the whole game solo but i took a couple of days to find player to do the dungeon with me it should not be part of a dungeon

I was a bit surprised by what this thread was complaining about… Who cares about the party requirements, when the battle itself was disappointing… Zhaitan was way too easy and he just stood still until he died. He could have at least struggled a bit? I felt sorry for him, just standing there taking the hits… I was expecting him to jump at the ship and bring it down or something. His minions are stronger than him. Those tails were cut off way too easily. C’mon, dragon scale is sturdier than that. I feel disappointed when there are giant monsters, but all they do is stand around as if they were too fat to move. Occasionally pawing at the ground, not even casting overpowered meteor storms or anything. Karka roll would OHKO Zhaitan.

so what your saying is that you want to kill a epic elder dragon that the strongest being in all the game all by your self? well i say hold on your neither hercules neither superman

also again cuz hes so huge and important you dont expect to just go and find him that easy right? NO its cuz hes the biggest meanest boss in the whole game that you have to go thru the whole thing to get to him you cant just go knock on zhaitans door expect him to say who is it and you to answer me iv come to kill you lol

Seeing as you can’t solo the Dragon Lieutenants, what makes you think you can solo the Elder Dragons themselves? That would just be silly.

I believe he meant he disliked the need for a party to help in the battle and thought it would be better if it was just your character and the NPCs throughout their story, more personalized.
I myself pictured before the release that the Elder Dragon fights would be on the same level as WvW, more like the Lost Shores event, however irrelevant this opinion might be from the actual topic.

Larkir.6502:

So the whole goal and point of the second half of the personal story was to kill Zhaitan, and you want the actual “killing Zhaitan”-part not to be part of the story? What if an expansion releases and the NPCs talk about you having killed Zhaitan even though you never did, would that make sense?

They won’t move Zhaitan outside of the dungeon just for you to kill him either, not now when Arah is already done the way it is. They could make story mode dungeons soloable at some point in the future I guess. Barely anyone is repeating them anyway..

Danuta.3219:

so what your saying is that you want to kill a epic elder dragon that the strongest being in all the game all by your self? well i say hold on your neither hercules neither superman

also again cuz hes so huge and important you dont expect to just go and find him that easy right? NO its cuz hes the biggest meanest boss in the whole game that you have to go thru the whole thing to get to him you cant just go knock on zhaitans door expect him to say who is it and you to answer me iv come to kill you lol

Ahem

I never said that I had a problem with being in a party, I didn’t say I wanted to tackle Zhaitain single-handedly, I didn’t say that Zhaitain should be removed from the equation, and I’m certainly not saying to Zhaitan should be easy to get to.

What I’m saying is that the mission text says ‘Kill Zhaitan’, not ‘Run through this dungeon, then kill Zhaitan’. It’s like winning a car on a gameshow, and then having to climb Mt. Everest to get the keys — totally out-of-proportion for the reward being offered.

Am I making any kind of sense?

-Sigh….i think they should put Zhaitan and Trahearne in 1 room and enable you to equip flamethrower (without being engi) and BUUUUUURRRRRNNNNN them both…..jeez they ruined story for me lame carrot and fat useless dragon <.<

There’s no reason the Zhaitan fight couldn’t have been done the exact same way as all the personal story quests leading up to it: with Trahearne & The Pact backing you. You wouldn’t be soloing the dragon, you’d just technically be alone with a bunch of NPCs in an instance.

I’m also ‘stuck’ on the kill Zhaitan part. I really don’t want to have to find 4 other people and do a whole dungeon to complete my “personal” story quest.

So, what I am getting here is, you want the end story to be in the story (which is your own private instance), with your friends with you, killing Zhaitan…that’s um…that’s a dungeon my friend. Unless you don’t want your friends with you. I don’t see Zhaitan being defeated with just you, I mean, I for one expect other players to be needed to take him down. What is the difference between a private instance and a private instance that happens to be a dungeon?

-Or they could make small instanced version of Zhaitan fight that have nothing to do with Arah since it is my personal story i want to see me in cut scene and not some random player that i am grouped with…..it’s enough that carrot takes away the feel that im doing my story but now random person in my cut scene talking to Destiny Edge member of what should they do <.<

Disig.7169:

So, what I am getting here is, you want the end story to be in the story (which is your own private instance), with your friends with you, killing Zhaitan…that’s um…that’s a dungeon my friend. Unless you don’t want your friends with you. I don’t see Zhaitan being defeated with just you, I mean, I for one expect other players to be needed to take him down. What is the difference between a private instance and a private instance that happens to be a dungeon?

Sighs

Okay…

To me, the difference is that every other boss-hunting instance in the Personal Story could be done with the help of the NPCs. I did it with Two-Blade Pete, I did it at Claw Island, I even did it with the Sovereign Eye of Zhaitan.

I didn’t have to run Caudecus’ Manor to kill Two-Blade, I didn’t have to go to the Ascalonian Catacombs to defeat the dragon at Claw Island, and I didn’t have to go into the Crucible of Eternity to squish the Sovereign Eye.

So, why, all of a sudden, do I have to run through a dungeon before I’m allowed to face Zhaitan?

Galrenmar.7025:

Disig.7169:

So, what I am getting here is, you want the end story to be in the story (which is your own private instance), with your friends with you, killing Zhaitan…that’s um…that’s a dungeon my friend. Unless you don’t want your friends with you. I don’t see Zhaitan being defeated with just you, I mean, I for one expect other players to be needed to take him down. What is the difference between a private instance and a private instance that happens to be a dungeon?

Sighs

Okay…

To me, the difference is that every other boss-hunting instance in the Personal Story could be done with the help of the NPCs. I did it with Two-Blade Pete, I did it at Claw Island, I even did it with the Sovereign Eye of Zhaitan.

I didn’t have to run Caudecus’ Manor to kill Two-Blade, I didn’t have to go to the Ascalonian Catacombs to defeat the dragon at Claw Island, and I didn’t have to go into the Crucible of Eternity to squish the Sovereign Eye.

So, why, all of a sudden, do I have to run through a dungeon before I’m allowed to face Zhaitan?

Ok, so…you want the options of being able to run it with JUST NPC’s?

I enjoyed killing zaithan with other people – i felt like i can share this event with someone – be surprised along with others…

The issue isn’t party requirement – it’s the lack of people playing this dungeon.

btw – i like to do missions with other people/NPCs, running around alone seems pretty boring…IMO…

Disig.7169:

What is the difference between a private instance and a private instance that happens to be a dungeon?

How much trash and how many bosses are before the actual Zhaitan encounter? (This, again, in addition to having to find 4 other people, most likely strangers, to do said dungeon as opposed to an individual instance.)

It’s all completely unnecessary for the personal story. All they had to do is the Zhaitan only part with you and the NPCs. Done.

All of this WOULD be solved if killing a Zhaitan was split into I dunno… 10 parts ? That u’re fighting and fighting and… fighting him for so long. That u’ve crippled him at first – then u pushed him even more – suddenly u’re the one being pushed back and things start to look really bad – every of your current companions looses faith but not you – you would push forward despite the odds. each of those encounters would end up in crippling the dragon somewhat – but each time he would prove too resilient to take down (yet). At the same time he would yield to you in the final battle similar more to the Shattered one where u have cannons at your disposal and have to defend those with special shields against dragon’s breath and against waves of undead with your sword/magic.
I know – I’m dreaming – but hey ! Maybe they’ll (not) make the Jormag’s battle this wayin the future?

Lane.3410:

How much trash and how many bosses are before the actual Zhaitan encounter? (This, again, in addition to having to find 4 other people, most likely strangers, to do said dungeon as opposed to an individual instance.)
It’s all completely unnecessary for the personal story. All they had to do is the Zhaitan only part with you and the NPCs. Done.

Really? Why would you expect Zhaitan to be easy to get to? Did you expect to just open a door and see Zhaitan standing there ready to be killed? No, instead we fly an airship to him, get attacked along the way and kill his dragon minions, then kill Zhaitan. It’s the way to Zhaitan that makes Arah epic, not the actual fight against him.

I can kind of see what you people mean; it would have made more sense to keep dungeons and personal story separate. But as I said earlier, ArenaNet has already implemented Arah and released GW2 and they wouldn’t move Zhaitan out of there now.

What I’m getting from the OP is either that he/she simply wants Arah to remain the exact same way it is but not be classified as a dungeon or just simply doesn’t want it to be a challenge. Don’t you expect and want getting to and fighting an elder dragon to be challenging? Would be really weird if it wasn’t.

100% agree with the OP, I played solo for 80 levels i did not expect or want that to change.

On further note the story feels like a 10 year old wrote it,

If arenanet is planning on releasing an expansion each year with an elder dragon as the finally dont expect anymore of my money. I will expect far more original ideas before parting with another 60 dollars to this company

Are you people being intentionally obtuse? Is this really hard to understand? I mean, you did actually do the whole story right? When exactly, during the entirety of your story were you alone?
“Well I did it solo, so the whole thing…”

No, you have never been alone. Every step of the way you had at least one NPC partner backing you up. Once you get to Claw Island you start having whole garrisons and squads backing you up. By the time you get to the Eye you have an army of old friends who you spent the whole story meeting and fighting along side.

So why is it so difficult to conceave of the final fight of your story being a solo instance with the entirety of the Pact army following you, just like you had the original of the Pact following you onto Claw Island?

You, not Destiny’s Edge fought your way through Orr. You, not Destiny’s Edge, killed the Mouth (possibly) and the Eye. So why, in the final moments should Destiny’s Edge get any place in the fight? What have they been doing this whole time? A whole lot of nothing useful and mostly being jerks to eachother. You are the Commander of the Pact, and it is you Trahern and the Pact that should be finishing the job.

I agree entirely with the OP. There is no Personal Achievement in Forced Grouping. The Personal Storyline endgame should be very, very difficult, but never in a dungeon that requires grouping. I enjoy fighting in groups but that’s not what a PERSONAL storyline is about. I feel cheated and see little reason to continue playing. This ruined the whole game for me.

There is nothing epic about Zhaitan’s death. I deeply regret doing it.

I heard spamming the 2 button is the way you make MMO’s fun…..must be otherwise Arena Net wouldn’t have put it in this revolutionary new MMO that’s build all around the player having fun in a new way………..lol

i ran Arah Story 3 times on he same charater Kenage Achalarus my mesmer. here is what i felt

1time: holey kitten the mobs on the ship and broken armor led to my team quitting because all or armor was broken this was way back in augest before the revamp

2time: wow this is easy ship wasnt bad got to zitan humm ok he is planning something (just stood there and took it like he was stoned) even my good friend rasmi hadesaid “I dont beleave he is dead ill go check” he jumped off the ship to see if he died

3time: was the same as the second time except for zitan used these chreatures that hade a portrate and health but no name and they behaved like worms. they downed me. but thats is nothing special

i dont know what to say think of it this way its an elder dragon bent on detroying everything leading an army of the dead. so why is he a push over? why is he not really attacking us. he blew up the cannon in a cut scene comeon he couldof jumped on the ship or knock it out of the sky. but i guess i felt like a hero by killing a draon that didnt really fight back.

Yeap in the time it took me to form a party to “kill Zhaitan” which ended up falling through I gave up and leveled to 80 on a different toon and left it off at the same spot -.-

Ain’t nobody got time fo dat!

Well, albeit I know the game was subject to change. But when Anet anounced the personal story-way back. They specificaly said “It is soloable. If you want to find i group you can, but everything is otherwise possible to do without a full group”~and then you get to the near end of your story and it tells you “You have to form a party-or youll never complete your story”.

Dungeons are ment to be optional, and i understand that this is an mmo. In the orignal gw though, I did not have to advertise for 10 hours trying to find someone to beat my story with. I had either hero’s or henchies for those missions~and they were soloable if you were smart.

I tried to solo Arah story, and You can not even get past the first part becuase it requires 2 PLAYERS! to open the gate. SO how about that-they purposly made the dungeon so there is no feasable way to solo it-in a million kitten years. SO you have to have the boreing search for enough people to get into the dungeons(which has terrible loot-and takes forever-so no one does anymore).

End rant. I agree if they say soloable story-it should all be soloable.

I agree with the OP. The entire storyline is soloable . . . until the end. And don’t give me that group-excuse. You have those legendary people with you.

There’s your group.

I heard the rewards are… well… lets just say “mediocre” doesn’t quite cut it.

The final Zhaitan battle is pretty underwhelming. I mean, some cool stuff happens, in theory — but when you play through it there aren’t really any interesting mechanics and the actual battle ends up being so boring that it’s awkward just to be there.

Yeah, I agree that the final chapter of the Personal Story shouldn’t require a 5-player dungeon to complete when the entire thing is designed to be solo-able up to that point. And it’s a real cop-out that — due to it being a standard dungeon — nothing that happens in there is determined according to your past choices. It’s the same dungeon for everyone, every time — just like any other story mode dungeon. The fact that it caps off your personal story is almost irrelevant.

I don’t think it’s a worthwhile point to argue that Zhaitan is an elder dragon, and therefore too powerful for a single person to take down. Just because we’re asking for the story chapter to be solo-able, it doesn’t mean we’re asking for a standard one-on-one fight where we just punch Zhaitan in the face and he falls over. After all, it’s not like when you go do the dungeon you can say that a party of only five people killed Zhaitan. There are other factors going on, obviously. Things happen — I won’t say what — but you deliver the killing blow in a significant way, without it being a “you and only you killed him” fight. There’s no reason that chapter couldn’t have been designed as a solo affair.

As soon as I heard about this I decided to not finish my personal story. I love lore in games, but my experience with dungeons and teaming up with others for them is way too bad for me to be able to do this one. I don’t want my hero to have to invite 4 complete strangers to be able to clear what she has done perfectly by herself and with her allies (npcs who have actually been properly introduced to the story) up until the last mission. That is not the epic end I thought it would be, only 4 poor players having to put up with my horrible combat skills…