Guild Wars 2

So no matter what level I am or what armor or how much toughness, vitality or whatever, when an NPC hits me with poison (particularly the Risen) it takes me down fast. My Guardian, my Warrior, even my Necromancer who has condition removal. And why make it stack-able? There is no sense in being poisoned for 30+ seconds. And yes that has happened fighting the Risen especially when they re-spawn a half second after they die. Most re-spawn while you’re still fighting the original.

What I hate is when the enemy dies and the poison kills me afterwards. I’m out of fighting mode so I can’t heal myself. Causing me to have to use a waypoint even after winning the fight.

Some of the poison does last a bit too long. Wish it would be cured after winning a fight. Some professions just don’t have the correct condition removal to get it off in time. You’re then knocked down and the mob you just killed respawns and quickly gets revenge…

What about fire damage, has other people had issues with it? I’ve been up against flame elementals that just plow me down in seconds on my guardian(anything else takes some time to get me down, but flame elementals toast me). It almost seems like toughness has no effect vs fire or poison.

Onshidesigns.1069:

What I hate is when the enemy dies and the poison kills me afterwards. I’m out of fighting mode so I can’t heal myself. Causing me to have to use a waypoint even after winning the fight.

… Use your 4 skill after getting downed to get yourself up.

Xephier.1647:

It almost seems like toughness has no effect vs fire or poison.

That’s because it doesn’t. Armor doesn’t affect condition damage.

gimmethegepgun.1284:

Onshidesigns.1069:

What I hate is when the enemy dies and the poison kills me afterwards. I’m out of fighting mode so I can’t heal myself. Causing me to have to use a waypoint even after winning the fight.

“… Use your 4 skill after getting downed to get yourself up.”

Xephier.1647:

It almost seems like toughness has no effect vs fire or poison.

That’s because it doesn’t. Armor doesn’t affect condition damage.

The game doesn’t always give you that option if the fight is already over.

Xephier.1647:

It almost seems like toughness has no effect vs fire or poison.

Hahahaha…it doesn’t. Nor Bleeding. Conditions aren’t affected by toughness. That’s why it’s important to have some type of fallback when dealing with foes that use conditions.

Condition damage is not as effective as direct damage namely because of how easy it can be nullified by simply removing the affliction. This is for PvP and PvE too. It would just make the case of condition damage worse if it were affected by toughness.

Onshidesigns.1069:

gimmethegepgun.1284:

Onshidesigns.1069:

What I hate is when the enemy dies and the poison kills me afterwards. I’m out of fighting mode so I can’t heal myself. Causing me to have to use a waypoint even after winning the fight.

“… Use your 4 skill after getting downed to get yourself up.”

Xephier.1647:

It almost seems like toughness has no effect vs fire or poison.

That’s because it doesn’t. Armor doesn’t affect condition damage.

The game doesn’t always give you that option if the fight is already over.

The 4 option isn’t available right away, but it will become available (it starts out on a cooldown).

As for reducing the amount of stacks/time on condition damage from NPC’s, I agree. There are times when 15 seconds AFTER the enemy is dead, I’m downed. That’s insane.

I think it’s realistic.

This isn’t a problem with the enemy mobs. It’s a learning experience:

• Always having a way to cure or sustain yourself!

My Guardian has 2 curing passives and one my F2 virtue cures 3 on command.
My Thief has a spammable cure from Sword2, as well as the shadowstep utility skill.

It’s like real life. If you’re going on a trip, make sure to have antidotes for the local wildlife’s venomous creatures.

It pays to be adaptable and prepared.

DreamOfACure.4382:

I think it’s realistic.

This isn’t a problem with the enemy mobs. It’s a learning experience:

• Always having a way to cure or sustain yourself!

My Guardian has 2 curing passives and one active cure.
My Thief has a spammable cure from Sword2, as well as the shadowstep utility skill.

How can it be a learning experience if not all classes can remove conditions?

Retrospek.4583:

DreamOfACure.4382:

I think it’s realistic.

This isn’t a problem with the enemy mobs. It’s a learning experience:

• Always having a way to cure or sustain yourself!

My Guardian has 2 curing passives and one active cure.
My Thief has a spammable cure from Sword2, as well as the shadowstep utility skill.

How can it be a learning experience if not all classes can remove conditions?

All classes can remove conditions with their #5 skill.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Food#Condition_Removal

And that’s just with that particular skill. Every class has something (some more than others) to remove conditions.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_removal#Skills_that_remove_conditions

The #5 skill is a weapon skill, and doesn’t remove conditions.

The #6 skill (healing skill) may remove conditions if you choose the healing skill which does so, but it’s not always the best skill to have in that slot.

And you’re suggesting that people who are out exploring zones who might become poisoned either keep a food buff up that might remove conditions or keep a utility skill (since we only get 3 of them) that can remove conditions rather than skills that can help burn the mobs down? Really?

And before you suggest that after the fight, you could switch out to the skill that will remove the conditions, let me rebuttal that now:

After fights, your skills are most likely on cooldowns. Even when they aren’t, condition effects can keep you in combat, and therefore you can’t swap skills out.

So in a nutshell, I’m not sure how this can be a learning experience. I would understand if we could use all of our skills (or at least more than we can currently), but as it stands we cannot.

Guardians and Thieves have innate abilities to remove the conditions, whereas other classes have to sacrifice useful skills to remove them. I realize this is a tradeoff to play other classes, but this has nothing to do with a learning experience. Once a mob is dead, stacks of conditions are insanely overpowered at times.

Retrospek.4583:

And you’re suggesting that people who are out exploring zones who might become poisoned either keep a food buff up that might remove conditions or keep a utility skill (since we only get 3 of them) that can remove conditions rather than skills that can help burn the mobs down? Really?

…

Guardians and Thieves have innate abilities to remove the conditions, whereas other classes have to sacrifice useful skills to remove them. I realize this is a tradeoff to play other classes, but this has nothing to do with a learning experience. Once a mob is dead, stacks of conditions are insanely overpowered at times.

lol? since that food buff or utility can keep you alive; i definitely would… if poison is killing you after a fight then ‘skills that can help burn the mobs down’ obviously arent working well enough
the only time i dont have condition removal is when i KNOW the enemy/enemies im fighting dont have conditions

guardians and theives only?
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magnetic_Wave
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phoenix
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cleansing_Wave
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Healing_Rain
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Deathly_Swarm
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Putrid_Mark
guardians, necros, thieves and eles, half of the professions; and thats just weapon skills… i could go into traits, heals and utilities… but that would take too long

- the only profession i accept as being hampered cleanse wise is ranger; which has only has limited trait removal (high tier/only certain conditions), only two skills have condition removal (one transfers it to your pet with a hefty cooldown; so you’re going some way towards killing part of your DPS and the other is a heal skill… which is so powerful its hard to justify using anything else)

Retrospek.4583:

The #5 skill is a weapon skill, and doesn’t remove conditions.

Woops, yeah I meant the #6 skill. I was typing late at night after I took my contacts out…it looked like a 6 when I squinted.

And you’re suggesting that people who are out exploring zones who might become poisoned either keep a food buff up that might remove conditions or keep a utility skill (since we only get 3 of them) that can remove conditions rather than skills that can help burn the mobs down? Really?

Yes.

And you don’t have to keep the food buff up. Just open your inventory when you realize you’re getting poisoned. You can eat foods while in combat.

If you die enough times to poison, eventually you’ll learn to save a utility skill for condition removal when you know the enemy uses them or start to dodge better to the attacks that cause poison.

Guardians and Thieves have innate abilities to remove the conditions, whereas other classes have to sacrifice useful skills to remove them. I realize this is a tradeoff to play other classes, but this has nothing to do with a learning experience. Once a mob is dead, stacks of conditions are insanely overpowered at times.

Then it’s not really a sacrifice if the utility skill saves your life. Condition removal skills are useful skills.

Leo G.4501:

Xephier.1647:

It almost seems like toughness has no effect vs fire or poison.

Hahahaha…it doesn’t. Nor Bleeding. Conditions aren’t affected by toughness. That’s why it’s important to have some type of fallback when dealing with foes that use conditions.

Condition damage is not as effective as direct damage namely because of how easy it can be nullified by simply removing the affliction. This is for PvP and PvE too. It would just make the case of condition damage worse if it were affected by toughness.

I understand the ability to cure conditions, you try curing conditions when you got even 3 enemys on you spaming them and your manual condition cures have at least 45 second reuse timers.

Imo either increase the mobs condition reuse timers to 45 seconds to be more on par with the average manual condition cures, or give us something to mitigate condition damage.

It’s not just poison that needs nerfed. All conditions at higher levels last much longer than they should.

With my banner support warrior (30 toughness/30 Vit) who has almost permanent regen on his banners + adrenaline heals + signet that heals…I still got knocked down by poison that wouldn’t wear off while doing a risen event. So basically x3 regen stack and poison still overpowered it and slowly but effectively killed me. (Lucky for me, I was helping a mesmer and I told them I was about to go down before it hit…so they were able to pop some moves to come in and get me up.)

Edit : Forgot to mention that he had healing banner up too, which boosts heal power.

NPC poison in the most part is fine, if annoying (Most of the time it’s short duration stuff, unless you’ve got multiples stacking it in which case the easiest answer is to not pull as many)

The issue mostly comes from the Risen Hyleks whom with one ability can generate 45+ seconds of poison (It’s their burst fire attack, not completely dodgable but most of it can)

This is a stupid length for a condition provided by a single common enemy (Get multiple Risen Hyleks on you and I wouldn’t be surprised if you ended up with something stupid like 5 min duration) especially since they are risen and have a habit of making 2-3 mobs spawn before you’ve killed the first one (Even if it only takes 3.25 seconds to kill them… Sigh)

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

It’s not just poison that needs nerfed. All conditions at higher levels last much longer than they should.

With my banner support warrior (30 toughness/30 Vit) who has almost permanent regen on his banners + adrenaline heals + signet that heals...I still got knocked down by poison that wouldn’t wear off while doing a risen event. So basically x3 regen stack and poison still overpowered it and slowly but effectively killed me. (Lucky for me, I was helping a mesmer and I told them I was about to go down before it hit...so they were able to pop some moves to come in and get me up.)

Edit : Forgot to mention that he had healing banner up too, which boosts heal power.

i was running a 10/0/30/30/0 build on my warr through orr, i dont see what your issue is? unless you built a defensive/supportive character without any condition removal? which seems like a pretty big blunder considering warr has great access to condition removal... shake it off is an amazing skill that would serve as a stun break and cleanser on a 25 sec cooldown (one banner on its own is capable of providing perma regen)

’So basically x3 regen stack and poison still overpowered it’
3 Bar of Adrenaline - 360 health every 3s
regen - 5 + (1.5625 *80) + (0.125 *300) = 167.5 health every sec (assuming you have 300 healing power and are lvl 80)
healing signet (btw; in orr any warr should have either shake it off or mending imo) = 200 + (300 * 0.033) = 209.9 health each sec

im not sure how rounding is calculated... so im going to assume its rounded down
(209*3)+(167*3)+167 = 1295 health every three secs

poison (assuming a mob has 2k condition damage, is lvl 80 and is subject to the same formula) 4 + 80 + (0.1 * 2000) = 284
284*3 = 852 damage every three secs

1295*0.66 (heal reduction from poison) = 854.7

again for simplicity ill assume its rounded down... 854-852 =2
so assuming you had the buffs you claim to have had, the mob had 2k (or mobs are subject to different equations) then you’d’ve been outhealing poison damage by 2 every 3 seconds

... though some of this is speculative (mainly the mob equation/stats) and is relying on forumlas from the wiki...

As for Burning and Poison, they only stack in duration. The more poison (and burn) you have thrown at you, the longer it will last. The best solution is to bring multiple condition removals (there’s more than just utility skills, weapon skills, combo fields, sigils, runes…there are many ways to remove conditions but the more you use, the more sacrifice you make to remove conditions) or to simply assess the situation calmly.

So you’re dying from multiple stacks of conditions and the poisoner is about to use more attacks on you. Don’t panic and pop your only condition remover. Let them use their next attack, dodge it while running away then use your condition remover. The only condition that is time sensitive is bleeding and confusion. You have to consider how fast bleeds are stacking on you and for how long. If they’re coming in big chunks it’s best to remove them before they take their toll, but if they’re small and steady, there’s not much you can do, removing some bleed stacks will quickly be replace…but then small stacks of bleed don’t do much damage. When a spike of confuse stacks hit you, you either do nothing (literally nothing) until they disappear or remove them with your next skill otherwise you’ll be eating a lot of damage. A few stacks of confuse will do some hard damage though, just don’t spam out a whole bunch of abilities and you should be fine until it leaves.

Poison isn’t that bad. It’s burning you have to worry about. It does more damage and can keep ticking away at you as long as poison. When facing mobs or enemies with lots of conditions, you need to counter them or have the HP to survive long enough to outlast the condition. Regen helps but it’s effectiveness is cut by poison’s -heal effect.

Basically, you just need to be more considerate of the situation. Conditions are meant to be deadly, you know. They just aren’t as deadly as being hit by a killer OHKO attack.

There is where the actual problem lies with the outside world when it comes to mobs that use conditions. You often times run into mobs if exploring (zone map completion for example) that use conditions, but not all mobs do on a map.

In a dungeon fight, you know the static spawns, and have time to prep for the fights, changing out the skills. If you know you’ll be hunting in a specific area, again, you can prep for the fights. It’s when you’re out exploring that having a condition removing skill all the time when you only have 3 skills to choose from, it’s a pain.

Also, I agree with the food item, you can use that in battle, and for that, I’d really like to have a few extra quick slots that we can place potions, food, harvesting items, etc. in, but that’s a whole other suggestion there.

And I was playing my Mesmer today, and skill #6 doesn’t have any way to remove conditions on him, so it’s not all classes/races that can.

burn and bleed rarely last as long as some of the mob applied poisons. And as long as the poison is running you are stuck in combat, meaning lower movement speed, no automatic healing, and overall a annoyance when you know the poison do not do enough damage to kill you before it runs out. Problem is that if you just stand around and wait it out you may well find yourself facing the exact same mob that applied it in the first place, because the respawn timer is that short. The annoyance is second only to the buggy tether code (especially under water)…

Retrospek.4583:

And I was playing my Mesmer today, and skill #6 doesn’t have any way to remove conditions on him, so it’s not all classes/races that can.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Power_Cleanse (i run this in open world PvE)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Null_Field (i run this in dungeons)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Disenchanter (although it sucks…)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Arcane_Thievery (i run this in wvw)

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cleansing_Conflagration
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mender%27s_Purity
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shattered_Conditions (although its a grandmaster major)

Retrospek.4583:

And you’re suggesting that people who are out exploring zones who might become poisoned either keep a food buff up that might remove conditions or keep a utility skill (since we only get 3 of them) that can remove conditions rather than skills that can help burn the mobs down? Really?

The fact you think having more damage (playing glass cannon, eh?) is better is why this discussion exists.

If you want to have more damage, you gotta be top-notch at avoiding damage or accept that you’ll be receiving more damage – Which is what’s happening with the Poison.

The open world is designed so you will die often if you do that -That’s part of how they make it feel remotely challenging and dynamic- and it is expected you learn from those deaths.
It’s designed so that if you lack skill, you can compensate by applying experience and adapting.

This thread is simply a product of the refusal to adapt.

Retrospek.4583:

And I was playing my Mesmer today, and skill #6 doesn’t have any way to remove conditions on him, so it’s not all classes/races that can.

When I said that, I was talking about in conjunction with condition removal food. The #6 skill is the one that triggers ‘on heal’ procs like in the linked food. And I believe with mantra of recovery, it can trigger off the 2 charges too.

But yeah, like the post above says, memser is probably the last class that can complain about condition removal.

Leo G.4501:

Retrospek.4583:

And I was playing my Mesmer today, and skill #6 doesn’t have any way to remove conditions on him, so it’s not all classes/races that can.

When I said that, I was talking about in conjunction with condition removal food. The #6 skill is the one that triggers ‘on heal’ procs like in the linked food. And I believe with mantra of recovery, it can trigger off the 2 charges too.

But yeah, like the post above says, memser is probably the last class that can complain about condition removal.

Ah, okay, wasn’t complaining about not having condition removing skills, I realize that the utility skills can remove them quite easily, I misunderstood your post about the combination with food.

I don’t have a problem with adapting to the environment at all, but yes, I do prefer playing glass cannon type builds, and do accept the deaths. I just find some of the duration of conditions from regular mobs to be insane at times, no matter what toon I’m playing (I’m an altaholic, so I play quite a few builds).

Honestly, for my playstyle, the being stuck in combat is more of what I hate then being downed or even killed.

Retrospek.4583:

Honestly, for my playstyle, the being stuck in combat is more of what I hate then being downed or even killed.

Holding a player in combat in WvW or sPvP with long-ranged conditions, so they can’t heal up is a very common tactic for turning the tide of a fight.

This is simply a part of the game’s design, no valid justification for change here. It’s simply the weakness of your build, and something you have to accept if you don’t want to counter it.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

It’s not just poison that needs nerfed. All conditions at higher levels last much longer than they should.

With my banner support warrior (30 toughness/30 Vit) who has almost permanent regen on his banners + adrenaline heals + signet that heals…I still got knocked down by poison that wouldn’t wear off while doing a risen event. So basically x3 regen stack and poison still overpowered it and slowly but effectively killed me. (Lucky for me, I was helping a mesmer and I told them I was about to go down before it hit…so they were able to pop some moves to come in and get me up.)

Edit : Forgot to mention that he had healing banner up too, which boosts heal power.

i was running a 10/0/30/30/0 build on my warr through orr, i dont see what your issue is? unless you built a defensive/supportive character without any condition removal? which seems like a pretty big blunder considering warr has great access to condition removal… shake it off is an amazing skill that would serve as a stun break and cleanser on a 25 sec cooldown (one banner on its own is capable of providing perma regen)

‘So basically x3 regen stack and poison still overpowered it’
3 Bar of Adrenaline – 360 health every 3s
regen – 5 + (1.5625 *80) + (0.125 *300) = 167.5 health every sec (assuming you have 300 healing power and are lvl 80)
healing signet (btw; in orr any warr should have either shake it off or mending imo) = 200 + (300 * 0.033) = 209.9 health each sec

im not sure how rounding is calculated… so im going to assume its rounded down
(209*3)(167*3)167 = 1295 health every three secs

poison (assuming a mob has 2k condition damage, is lvl 80 and is subject to the same formula) 4 + 80 + (0.1 * 2000) = 284
284*3 = 852 damage every three secs

1295*0.66 (heal reduction from poison) = 854.7

again for simplicity ill assume its rounded down… 854-852 =2
so assuming you had the buffs you claim to have had, the mob had 2k (or mobs are subject to different equations) then you’d’ve been outhealing poison damage by 2 every 3 seconds

… though some of this is speculative (mainly the mob equation/stats) and is relying on forumlas from the wiki…

It was one of those ‘8 waves’ quests with the Risen Hyleks, the plague bearer guys that explode (have to dodge), plus thralls and brutes included. We made it through 5-6 waves before the poison finally dropped me. It wouldn’t drop off me between the waves. I run with all banners except strength/condition banner (Which is covered by Empower Allies) to boost parties I run across randomly in PvE.

Someone else told me ‘run with shake it off trait’…but you can’t do empower + regen banners + banner CD trait AND do that.

‘But you could do without one of those banners’ – But what’s the point in running a banner support if you can’t use banners and have to trait a utility to condition remove?

Now, maybe if I had superior runes of the dolyak and had the extra regen tick from that (assuming it stacks with the others) it might have gone differently.

My biggest issue is that banner build basically makes you a huge tank but you can’t do much damage. A slight tweak to ‘summoned banners cause damage’ trait which gave banners a small/slow tick of AoE dmg instead of ‘when summoned’ would enhance the build, but that’s for another thread.

I run with Sword/Warhorn.

1stly, if this is a problem for you, thent he solution is to carry condition remal utility skills. If that makes youw hine about takign longer to kill things…guess what? It take you FAR longer to kill things when you keep dying or nearly dying due to conditions. This is about efficiency. Use proper utilities that are DEFENSIVE in nature to keep down time to a minimum and you will be surprised how much FASTER you kill things. Thus, efficiency.

Also, MilitiaMasterV…I run with shake it off utility slotted, banner cd, empower allies, banner regen, and just keep a single banner around (if you drop the banner every time it is off cd you only don’t have the banner up for 4 seconds) thus the primary buff you give out is the constant heal that is stronger than healing turret. You can run with 2 banners and offset their uses by 30 seconds if you are determined to keep the heal up 24/7 though. No real need for 3 banners, it’s like being a buffer in any other game, switch out your banner skills to fit the party or the fight, if you use nothign but buffs you end up hampering yourself in a significant way.

I’ve never seen a war build without shake it off slotted on the utility bar that didn’t have a weakness against conditions.

DreamOfACure.4382:

Retrospek.4583:

Honestly, for my playstyle, the being stuck in combat is more of what I hate then being downed or even killed.

Holding a player in combat in WvW or sPvP with long-ranged conditions, so they can’t heal up is a very common tactic for turning the tide of a fight.

This is simply a part of the game’s design, no valid justification for change here. It’s simply the weakness of your build, and something you have to accept if you don’t want to counter it.

After re-reading this thread, I don’t think anyone mentioned this as being a problem in WvW or sPvP. We were referring to mobs. More specifically, random normal mobs, not even champions or legendaries.

I never once disputed the reasoning for doing it in PvP/WvW. When I play in WvW, I change the build around to suit that playstyle.

That being said, I fail to see the validity of your argument.

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

It was one of those ‘8 waves’ quests with the Risen Hyleks, the plague bearer guys that explode (have to dodge), plus thralls and brutes included. We made it through 5-6 waves before the poison finally dropped me. It wouldn’t drop off me between the waves. I run with all banners except strength/condition banner (Which is covered by Empower Allies) to boost parties I run across randomly in PvE.

Someone else told me ‘run with shake it off trait’…but you can’t do empower + regen banners + banner CD trait AND do that.

‘But you could do without one of those banners’ – But what’s the point in running a banner support if you can’t use banners and have to trait a utility to condition remove?

Now, maybe if I had superior runes of the dolyak and had the extra regen tick from that (assuming it stacks with the others) it might have gone differently.

My biggest issue is that banner build basically makes you a huge tank but you can’t do much damage. A slight tweak to ‘summoned banners cause damage’ trait which gave banners a small/slow tick of AoE dmg instead of ‘when summoned’ would enhance the build, but that’s for another thread.

I run with Sword/Warhorn.

Traits are there to swap. A ‘build’ also encapsulates the traits you have available to swap to between battles and since you’ve got tactics, in that situation, you swap out the Empowered Allies trait for Quick Breathing so your Warhorn converts Poison to Regeneration (and other conditions to boons). The Warhorn skills then recharge every 16 seconds and Charge can remove additional conditions (cripple, chill and immobilize) while granting swiftness.

In the event you mentioned, you’d be better able to support your allies and NPCs by removing their conditions so they can exit combat and regenerate before the next wave.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

unless you built a defensive/supportive character without any condition removal? which seems like a pretty big blunder

Leo G.4501:

you’d be better able to support your allies and NPCs by removing their conditions

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

Someone else told me ‘run with shake it off trait’…but you can’t do empower + regen banners + banner CD trait AND do that.

by ‘shake it off trait’ i assume you/they mean/t http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shrug_It_Off ? which last i was aware was bugged/didnt work well (activated condition removal is much much much better imo)

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

‘But you could do without one of those banners’ – But what’s the point in running a banner support if you can’t use banners and have to trait a utility to condition remove?

you dont HAVE to use a utility to cleanse; warhorn can cleanse…

considering warr has great access to condition removal…

or you can suck it up; die a load of times from conditions; and not complain?

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

My biggest issue is that banner build basically makes you a huge tank but you can’t do much damage

(caps) how can you say that? why not build for more damage? (/caps)

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

I run with Sword/Warhorn.

…

Warhorn

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Quick_Breathing

OK, I joined this thread to point out that durations on conditions for NPC’s are too long at higher levels.

Not to have people attack my build or play-style.

‘If you can’t say something nice, then say nothing at all.’

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

OK, I joined this thread to point out that durations on conditions for NPC’s are too long at higher levels.

Not to have people attack my build or play-style.

‘If you can’t say something nice, then say nothing at all.’

but your build is the source of the ‘problem’ that you are complaining about?

(the only LONG duration conditions i notice lingering after battle are cripple and poison… both dont need immediately cleansing – i actually dont bother cleansing poison unless the thing inflicting it is dead, im about to heal (poison = heal reduction) or it was cleansed instead of the condition i intended to cleanse)

-also; ive always found that saying ambiguous… what if someone has multiple things to say; some neutral, some ‘bad’ and some ‘nice’ then (going by the saying) theyd be able to voice themselves regardless (choosing whether or not to omit the ‘nice’ stuff) meaning it would only serve as a restriction if a person only has ‘bad’ or neutral things to say (which i find hard to comprehend)

duration really isnt an issue really, infact if they are too short they are pointless as they would never do enough damage to be noticably threatening, and of course no single hit will apply a condition for that long, its multiple huts that cause it.

so it really comes down to avoidance and cleansing.

the far bigger issue is cc effects that npc’s can hit you with, being knocked down for 4-6 seconds totally unable to do anything against it while the mob kills you is just terrible. there are some times where your character is almost permenately removed from your control, sometimes its unavoidable too (had claw fear back to back for 10 seconds)

Cripple (Hyenas usually…)
Weakness (Fight ogres at high levels and see how long this lasts on your characters. It’s not blockable/avoidable and multiple ogres seem to stack it for extreme durations on you. I’ve had to just stand there for about 30 seconds after a fight to get it to wear off, just to heal up.)
Poison (Most undead.)
Burning (Flame Legion turrets stack it high…example Iron Marches area. Literally killed my thief 6 times just trying to get a vista with the turrets which can’t be killed very fast because they haven’t fixed the objects yet.)

Honestly, bleeds are the only one that seem ‘OK’ from NPC’s, except when you get Branded Devourers proc’ing multiples on you. Then it’s ridiculous.

There aren’t a lot of NPC’s that use Confuse…but that one’s kind of easy to avoid..since you’re just hitting yourself. So stop attacking.

I have 5 80’s, a 75, and a 64 (Will have 7 80’s if I don’t just give up on this game which I’m getting closer and closer to approaching.)

I’ve been able to see a lot of the content, but no maps 65+.

I’m just giving my opinion, and from what I’ve seen, condition durations are almost double or triple what we players can dish out.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

Leo G.4501:

you’d be better able to support your allies and NPCs by removing their conditions

by ‘shake it off trait’ i assume you/they mean/t http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shrug_It_Off ? which last i was aware was bugged/didnt work well (activated condition removal is much much much better imo)

Not sure if you’re talking to me. I was talking about Quick Breathing. He already uses a warhorn so naturally that is better than Shrug it off. Also, Shrug it off has a longer internal cooldown than either of the traited Warhorn skills and QB doesn’t just remove conditions, it converts them into boons making it far superior in this situation except for the extra stun breaker part…

MilitiaMasterV.7216:

OK, I joined this thread to point out that durations on conditions for NPC’s are too long at higher levels.

Not to have people attack my build or play-style.

‘If you can’t say something nice, then say nothing at all.’

I wasn’t attacking your build, just trying to offer advice. The reason NPC conditions ‘last so long’ is usually because they can stack them to last longer and this is because multiple of the same NPC can use the same conditioning attack which will last longer on you. They also tend to be somewhat potent because NPCs attack less (usually once every 1-2 seconds) vs the speed of player attacks.

Also, just saying, but pretty much EVERYONE will have a back-up when conditions rear their head. You don’t want to be caught with your pants down, low on health and 25+seconds of poison on you. It’s a noobish way to die that can easily be avoided in most cases.

Leo G.4501:

I wasn’t attacking your build, just trying to offer advice. The reason NPC conditions ‘last so long’ is usually because they can stack them to last longer and this is because multiple of the same NPC can use the same conditioning attack which will last longer on you. They also tend to be somewhat potent because NPCs attack less (usually once every 1-2 seconds) vs the speed of player attacks.

Also, just saying, but pretty much EVERYONE will have a back-up when conditions rear their head. You don’t want to be caught with your pants down, low on health and 25+seconds of poison on you. It’s a noobish way to die that can easily be avoided in most cases.

My build almost never dies and I generally solo champions. It was just a certain instance with this poison issue ‘over the long term’ because durations are so long and they stack up more.

Any idea whether you can swap trait plaques in combat or does it lock them in? That would’ve been the only way to change to quick breathing…as I was running around solo map completing and just happened upon the mesmer doing the event so I decided I’d help them out…but then I was stuck in combat the whole event and couldn’t change anything.

No, you can’t switch traits while in combat.

But then you have to think, you’re dealing with Risen…they’re likely to have poison.

And you say your build can solo champions…what about champions that cast burn, bleed and poison on you? :P

Dot damage from mobs is just generally ludicrous. You cannot avoid the application of it and once its on there is no guarantee you are going to get it off or even have time to do so before dying. If I’m at really low health I can generally dodge/run around to avoid damage until my heal is up and be fine. However with a poison I can’t avoid the application no matter how I move around the field and if I’m on low health and everything is on cooldown (consdering how few skills we have available at any given time and the ridiculously long cooldowns some of them have this is highly likely) then I have no choice but to die even though I in any other situation I could have exercised proper care to avoid taking damage until I had some type of heal up. And saying that we should be required to take condition removal really doesn’t seem fair considering that we are restricted to only being able to choose what skill goes into 5 slots, of which at least 1 of those slots will not have a skill available that can remove conditions and probably would have a 240 second cooldown even if it did.

Thankfully Guardians can passively remove 1 condition every 10 seconds.

Leo G.4501:

No, you can’t switch traits while in combat.

But then you have to think, you’re dealing with Risen…they’re likely to have poison.

And you say your build can solo champions…what about champions that cast burn, bleed and poison on you? :P

Well, I was running down through an area with such a range of monsters it wouldn’t have mattered. The area I was in wasn’t mainly risen. It just changed to that in the bottom corner of the map where that event was going. I’d been fighting grawl before that.

You’re assuming they can hit me half the time. I’m one of those people that knows how to get them in kite range and hit with the sword’s reach but not get hit much myself..so I can stack bleed and keep them crippled or just out of reach. I’m not one of those people that stands still and just absorbs everything…even with multiple regen stack and crazy armor/vitality. For those times they actually get one of the conditions on me, the regen usually takes care of it or I cripple them and get just out of range for it to heal up again.

Edit to add : People usually yell at me because I’m moving so much and they can’t hit the target because it’s chasing me.

Leo G.4501:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

Leo G.4501:

you’d be better able to support your allies and NPCs by removing their conditions

by ‘shake it off trait’ i assume you/they mean/t http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shrug_It_Off ? which last i was aware was bugged/didnt work well (activated condition removal is much much much better imo)

Not sure if you’re talking to me. .

no; i was using your post to clarify on why building a defensive/support character without condition removal is a ‘blunder’