Guild Wars 2

Can armor repair please be removed from WvW (or at least heavily reduced)? I’m sick of concerns about profit affecting how I determine what action I have to take in a battle. It feels like I’m being punished for staying and fighting to the death while I’m rewarded if I run early and let the enemy take our tower with slightly less opposition. Taking risks that are more likely to result in death than success are a lot less fun with the knowledge that you will have to lose money from making the effort. Earlier today I tried to take a keep despite being extremely outnumbered by the enemy. After 15 minutes of my time, I got zero drops and no event (failed) reward, but I did get 1.64 silver in repair fees. I’m fine with not getting a reward for a failed effort, but must I really lose money? It’s very frustrating when you only make about 10 silver in an hour and lose over a third of it to armor repair fees.

When outnumbered and playing on the defensive against enemies with huge zergs you can already expect to get very few event rewards and even fewer kills, so why is it necessary to make our efforts even less profitable? I know the outmanned buff has been modified to remove armor repair, but that has almost never spared me armor repair. This is in part because it comes and goes seemingly at random (on Kaineng at least) which makes it completely unreliable (in the past it has disappeared literally right before my death). Furthermore, it’s possible to encounter battles where you are outnumbered 4 to 1 while never seeing the outmanned buff at all. People on worlds that outnumber those who are on their same tier, however, can expect to hardly notice armor repair fees because they will die less often against their disadvantaged foes who don’t have massive zergs.

Certain activities such as intercepting supply caravans and scouting don’t even seem worth it because if I run into a couple of enemy invaders and die the repair fees will be 3 times greater than the reward for killing a supply caravan.

I’m sure you want to give people incentive not to die, but WvW already has that. Whenever you die on one of the borderlands, you can expect a long, boring, and potentially dangerous walk back to your commander/battle (having to walk all the way back and pay money is just too much). On the Eternal Battlegrounds this isn’t necessarily the case, but if you really need another “stay alive” incentive I’d prefer a small respawn time that is somewhat scaled based off of how outnumbered your world is. Frankly this would improve game-play anyway by preventing zergs who wipe from running right back into the battle while allowing individual players to fight to the death with out being concerned about nullifying the entire “defend the tower” event reward.

I see people take elaborate measures to die from fall damage (while in battle) and hence avoid armor repair. Why should this have to be a part of WvW? It’s competitive game-play where death is likely and expected so why should armor repair fees be a concern? Fighting to the death should be fun, but losing money that you’ve already earned isn’t.

TL;DR: Remove armor repair from WvW. It makes playing while outnumbered and otherwise disadvantaged even less worth it and far more frustrating. Armor repair punishes those on outnumbered worlds who are losing horribly while having little affect on those with huge zergs.

That would ruin one of the core ideas behind WvW. It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

Florgknight.1589:

It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

I’m going to guess you don’t pay for many upgrades…

Mif.3471:

Florgknight.1589:

It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

I’m going to guess you don’t pay for many upgrades…

Tough when you only have 70s on you at any time because you drop 50 sup carts a week.

Florgknight.1589:

That would ruin one of the core ideas behind WvW. It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

I am under the impression that the moneysink is in the siege engines

Florgknight.1589:

That would ruin one of the core ideas behind WvW. It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

I agree with this. We also have the outmanned buff which at times is nice, I think if they do anything; they should increase the drop rates of WvW.

Florgknight.1589:

That would ruin one of the core ideas behind WvW. It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

WvW already has enough costs (siege, upgrades, etc.) and has a pathetic gold to time ratio even if you don’t spend a dime on it. This is in addition to if you want to fund your exotics through WvW exclusively, which ends up costing another half dozen gold.

Now, if they upgraded the rewards you could get from WvW or change the cost of things, like to costing karma, then that’s a different story.

Hey, there’s a thought. Let’s make armor repairs cost karma. WvW players have a crapton of that.

Lina.9640:

Hey, there’s a thought. Let’s make armor repairs cost karma. WvW players have a crapton of that.

Not if you roam, no. My guild regularly roams and you don’t get karma from roaming

I want better rewards/drops on WvW rather than remove the armor repairs. I was a PvE player and money is nothing in PvE, you can gain at least 5g of just playing dungeons while in WvW it’s a different story. I drop like tons of sieges and upgrade towers and after a days work I lose about 1g in WvW so I have to do World Bosses again to regain my lost.

yea , it’s the experience man.

putting cost repairs and whatnot limits the experience.

how many have charged into zergs? how many have soloed spawn points?

only someone as mad as me will do something like that

Game is soft enough as it is. How about the game is changed so you drop everything in your pack pack including any gold when you die so the bags you pick up are actually from the people you kill. That would make things more interesting.

You can grind 5 gold an hour in PVE and if you are dying that much in WvW then you need a time out anyway.

Raestloz.7134:

Florgknight.1589:

That would ruin one of the core ideas behind WvW. It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

I am under the impression that the moneysink is in the siege engines

Siege is free.

You missed April fools by quite a long way.

A couple of silver really influences your decisions that much?

Zackie.8923:

yea , it’s the experience man.

putting cost repairs and whatnot limits the experience.

how many have charged into zergs? how many have soloed spawn points?

only someone as mad as me will do something like that

Fo’ sho. As far as I’m concerned it’s to the death or go home. I’ll defend that tower lord’s room long after the enemy zerg starts to trickle in and everyone begins bailing off the sides of the walls. Usually end up getting one or two of them before I’m swarmed. For another thing, tower steps are one of the best choke points in the game.

Could just let people choose between spending coin or karma or maybe even lose exp from current bar?

I am bugged more by the fact that I need to run around and pick up bags.

They can remove the armor repair cost IF they also remove the ability to get money in WvW. Otherwise it would unbalance the economy quite a bit.

As for people saying Sieges is a big gold-sink: You can buy sieges with badges, and people that play WvW regularly have way too many badges lying around that they can use for siege, so no money involved.

Jade Sea/ Vizu Square will throw massive amounts of bodies at you whenever you try to get a supply camp near respawn. They die mindlessly and come back like zombies until you drown in the masses of dead bodies. If you remove repair costs you reward a playstyle like that…
No respawn timer is sad enough.

Ruin.3461:

A couple of silver really influences your decisions that much?

When I die after defending a tower for 10 minutes and end up losing more than I earned it’s frustrating.

Ahri.8204:

Jade Sea/ Vizu Square will throw massive amounts of bodies at you whenever you try to get a supply camp near respawn. They die mindlessly and come back like zombies until you drown in the masses of dead bodies. If you remove repair costs you reward a playstyle like that…
No respawn timer is sad enough.

I’m all for a respawn timer.

Gilburt.9146:

When I die after defending a tower for 10 minutes and end up losing more than I earned it’s frustrating.

Then you are doing something wrong.
For 10 minutes defending you get more than enough silver to pay for one piece of damaged gear.

Too be honest I never had money problems in WvW at all. I have half full exotic equipt and the payment for repair gets weight out very well by the money I get from events.

Well I guess it’s because I don’t walk alone but with the zerg..

lordkrall.7241:

Gilburt.9146:

When I die after defending a tower for 10 minutes and end up losing more than I earned it’s frustrating.

Then you are doing something wrong.
For 10 minutes defending you get more than enough silver to pay for one piece of damaged gear.

When you’re outnumbered 4 to 1 and your enemies have any kind of coordination it’s almost impossible to get kills from a tower. Especially if you’re playing as a guardian, which has practically no ranged attacks.

GreenNekoHaunt.8527:

Well I guess it’s because I don’t walk alone but with the zerg..

Pretty much. :P

Gilburt.9146

When you’re outnumbered 4 to 1 and your enemies have any kind of coordination it’s almost impossible to get kills from a tower. Especially if you’re playing as a guardian, which has practically no ranged attacks.

Why do you even fight an outnumbered battle if you know you’re not gonna win?
If you’re guardian, outnumbered and have to defend a tower I would simply teleport away and let them take the tower, or ask for recruitment.

I’m not trying to be mean or anything. I’m just saying it was a mistake in your tactic which cost you money but it’s basically your fault and you should be more careful or use a different strategy next time.

sostronk.8167:

Raestloz.7134:

Florgknight.1589:

That would ruin one of the core ideas behind WvW. It no longer becomes a moneysink if you remove those. Waypoints are already free.

I am under the impression that the moneysink is in the siege engines

Siege is free.

Last time I check, you have to buy them. Granted, it was quite some time ago

GreenNekoHaunt.8527:

Why do you even fight an outnumbered battle if you know you’re not gonna win?
If you’re guardian, outnumbered and have to defend a tower I would simply teleport away and let them take the tower, or ask for recruitment.

I’m not trying to be mean or anything. I’m just saying it was a mistake in your tactic which cost you money but it’s basically your fault and you should be more careful or use a different strategy next time.

Agreed, I can easily avoid repair fees most of the time as long as I WP, but why should running away be incentivized over staying and defending (which is more fun/interesting for both sides, imo)?

Gilburt.9146:

GreenNekoHaunt.8527:

Why do you even fight an outnumbered battle if you know you’re not gonna win?
If you’re guardian, outnumbered and have to defend a tower I would simply teleport away and let them take the tower, or ask for recruitment.

I’m not trying to be mean or anything. I’m just saying it was a mistake in your tactic which cost you money but it’s basically your fault and you should be more careful or use a different strategy next time.

Agreed, I can easily avoid repair fees most of the time as long as I WP, but why should running away be incentivized over staying and defending (which is more fun/interesting for both sides, imo)?

WvW is not about fun only. It is about creating strategies dividing the amount of people online in good portions so you can easily defend, protect, help and attack zergs, groups, or buildings.

Sure it’s fun to protect a tower but you must learn the consequences of fighting four enemies alone and all. If your armor wouldn’t need to repaired people would walk around too care free. WvW wouldn’t be WvW anymore. It would turn more into a PvP. Single people would go on a rampage not caring anymore whether or not they die. It would sink in chaos. I know how care free people can be. I often saw and did myself walk during the no-armor-breaking-buff not caring about enemies anymore attacking several points. Still you might think different of it so I’ll leave you your opinion.

GreenNekoHaunt.8527:

WvW is not about fun only. It is about creating strategies dividing the amount of people online in good portions so you can easily defend, protect, help and attack zergs, groups, or buildings.

Sure it’s fun to protect a tower but you must learn the consequences of fighting four enemies alone and all. If your armor wouldn’t need to repaired people would walk around too care free. WvW wouldn’t be WvW anymore. It would turn more into a PvP. Single people would go on a rampage not caring anymore whether or not they die. It would sink in chaos. I know how care free people can be. I often saw and did myself walk during the no-armor-breaking-buff not caring about enemies anymore attacking several points. Still you might think different of it so I’ll leave you your opinion.

Perhaps, though I personally haven’t noticed much of a change during the out-manned buff. A single player isn’t effective at much more than intercepting Dolyaks and frankly people should be more concerned about defending them anyway (they definitely need to re-implement a reward for guarding them). I just enjoy WvW a lot more when I don’t have to worry about a random stealth thief giving me 1.64 silver in repair fees so he/she can get the much coveted 16 copper spike in my loot bag.

That’s more a problem of general class balance than WvW itself.

So this wasn’t a joke? People are genuinely upset that they have to pay a repair bill of a couple of silver? You do realise you could make that money back by mining the numerous mithril ores you probably pass whilst moving around the WvW maps? Not to mention that more often than not, if you die in WvW it is through your own fault.

Do you want repairs to be removed from PvE as well because I don’t really see the difference? You’d have to remove all loot and rewards (coin, karma) from WvW events for this to actually happen. Don’t think you’ve really thought this through properly because it’s a ridiculous idea.

scanz.4536:

You’d have to remove all loot and rewards (coin, karma) from WvW events for this to actually happen.

That makes absolutely no sense. There are plenty of games that don’t make you pay “respawn fees” that still give rewards.

Gilburt.9146:

scanz.4536:

You’d have to remove all loot and rewards (coin, karma) from WvW events for this to actually happen.

That makes absolutely no sense. There are plenty of games that don’t make you pay “respawn fees” that still give rewards.

It’s not a respawn fee though, is it? It’s a repair bill for your armour which has become damaged by you being beaten and killed. Who’s fault is that? We’re talking about a couple of silver, not gold. You should be making more than enough to cover any repair bills through the events, loot bags and materials.

Gilburt.9146:

That makes absolutely no sense. There are plenty of games that don’t make you pay “respawn fees” that still give rewards.

And I am sure that the economy in those games are awesome unless they have other big money-sinks.

scanz.4536:

It’s not a respawn fee though, is it? It’s a repair bill for your armour which has become damaged by you being beaten and killed.

That’s splitting hairs. You inevitably have to pay the repair fees to keep playing.

scanz.4536:

Who’s fault is that? We’re talking about a couple of silver, not gold.

It’s possible for an individual player to do everything right in WvW and still get killed. Battles are not always fair and evenly matched.

scanz.4536:

You should be making more than enough to cover any repair bills through the events, loot bags and materials.

Not during the slow times of the day. You get very few rewards/kills and a disproportionate amount of deaths simply because you’re outnumbered. It can still be fun, but having armor repair cut into my already meager profits detracts from that for me.

Gilburt.9146:

That’s splitting hairs. You inevitably have to pay the repair fees to keep playing.

You do not need to repair every time you spawn and even if you are doing so, it’s not going to be more than 2 silver each time.

Gilburt.9146:

It’s possible for an individual player to do everything right in WvW and still get killed. Battles are not always fair and evenly matched.

So then you retreat. Ultimately if you die in WvW it’s because you’ve made a mistake, i.e. engaged with the enemy when the wiser option would have been to retreat or wait/call for help. You shouldn’t be going solo in WvW anyway, it’s not designed for that.

Gilburt.9146:

Not during the slow times of the day. You get very few rewards/kills and a disproportionate amount of deaths simply because you’re outnumbered. It can still be fun, but having armor repair cut into my already meager profits detracts from that for me.

Sorry, but this is rubbish. You get rewarded for simply standing in a tower ‘defending’ it. Whilst doing so you could escort the nearest dolyak, gather the nearby materials, take out any hostile NPCs in the area and so on. You are constantly rewarded in WvW through events, loot bags and gathering, which all provide you with more than enough coin to cover your repair bills. If you’re dying so often then I think you need to have a think about why that is the case.

Repair bills are nothing. Even when you multi suicide run because you lack supply for counter siege to take out enemy trebs, repair costs are negligible.