Guild Wars 2

This is simply stupid, while pve is about story and exploration – pvp and wvw certainly aren’t. Having to deal with being forced to set foot in wvw if I want world completion is completely stupid – it’s like I’m being forced to deal with pvp, something which frustrates me and sucks all the fun out of the game. There’s no way to flag yourself as “just there for the map” so that you don’t have to deal with mobs of pkers and worse yet, you’re preventing wvwers from your own server who actually want to play from being able to get in if the caps been reached by just being there.

I don’t WANT to wvw and I see NO reason why it’s a requirement. Wvw should be a separate part of the game for those who enjoy it, not forced on everyone if they want 100% of the map. Especially since it’s not even ON the regular map.

Please remove it.. or at least make it some special achievement on its own.

Why do you want map completion? For legendary? Anet obviously wants you to have to do some WvW to get it with the badge requirement and POIs/Vistas. Mastery of PvE(exploration), Crafting, and PvP(Badges).

The legendary is a symbol of mastery in all aspects of the game.

Remove anything PvE for my legendary. I don’t want to be forced to step into PvE.

Remove exploration of Tyria from map completion. I don’t WANT to pve and I see no reason why it’s a requirement.

As soon as they get rid of PVE required for legendary.

Adaneshade.2409:

…
The legendary is a symbol of mastery in all aspects of the game.

Since Legendaries (from whatever source) are not all account or soul-bound at acquisition, this is a demonstrable falsehood.

They can be bought, not earned.

Have you been to WvW lately? I can’t step foot out the waypoint without being mobbed by groups of 20 any time of the day. The way things are going it may be months before I can complete the map. The server I’m on doesn’t have the luxury of having the number of dedicated PVPers to help out. I’ll be happy to get the vistas I need and never go back to WvW. I don’t have the need to alienate my guild for a week to change servers to just get a title.

What do you need to do for the map exploration gold star?
1. Orr: Depending on your character class, you might need to get a buddy to help out, or at least time your exploration to sync up with temple control.
2. All the PvE zones that aren’t Orr: Very easy. At most, there are 1-3 difficult POIs/vistas per zone. My biggest obstacle to completing these is the absolute tedium of doing certain low-level zones.
3. WvW: the actually difficult part.
If you actually had some other challenging component in the achievement requirements, I wouldn’t mind not having WvW count. But, essentially, you don’t. So I feel like it cheapens the gold star significantly to remove WvW.

Same thing for the other legendary requirements, really. It’s not like you have to master high-level Fractals or solo Zhaitan or whatever to get a legendary; just grind something braindead like Shelter/Pen. So, yeah, the Badges of Honor should stay in.

Vistas locked up in garrisons are dependent on group success which may be almost never. The vistas themselves are not difficult. With many of the good WvW players jumping ship to be on more competitive servers that leaves less chance for success. So the exploration title is server dependent and not skill dependent. It also helps being online at the right time.

This has been brought up before. There was one instance where the original poster (OP) commented that they would not participate in WvW because they knew their presence kept someone else that wanted to fight from being there. Or, if they did participate in WvW, they would strive to avoid all conflict, going to extreme lengths to avoid combat. They’d rather die while running than inflict a single point of damage on another player.

My response? I made a new character, got all of the WvW completion done, and messaged him the results. WvW is roughly 8% of world completion. He figured he’d be done with world completion when he hit 92%, what he was comfortable with doing.

So the question is…what do you want? An achievement? A legendary? Or personal completion?

Adding world complete to WvW is a rather ineffective way to encourage players to join WvW, as it encourages you to go there for all the wrong reasons. PvE players will not contribute to the war effort, nor will they stick around once they finish. So it is a complete waste of time forcing them to go there. And at busy times, dedicated WvW players will have queue, while these PvE players complete their achievement.

If there was no limit on how many players could participate in WvW at any given time, I would not have a problem with it. But there is, and the game is encouraging players to waste these slots.

I am not a WvW player – my world is PvE and I don’t think I should have to join WvW battles in order to get world map completion. All it has done for me so far is cost me coins and frustrated me beyond belief. It’s just dumb!

2-3 hour queues, then have to be lucky to get the points you need….

Remove wvwvw from pve completion. Give pvp a separate reward

I am pro choice, as in make two separate achievements, one for Tyria, one for the Mists. Both would be required for Legendary and for the star and title.

Why? This harms no one. If implemented, the PvE only players and the Wv3 only players have something else to shoot for, and giving more people something to do in an MMO is never a bad thing.

People vanquished in Guild Wars 1 for the feeling of having done everything there is to do in PvE. Having the medal on the character selection screen for 100% is a good parallel to that I think. Agreed with the OP.

It would be much simpler if the colors were randomly chosen each week. Then not just PvE’ers but, all of us could grab map complete of the WvW area’s eventually. As it stands now, it’s very difficult to time when or if a keep might be taken.

I’ve completed the WvW map’s on two characters a while ago. It’s the PvE area’s, Ascalon especially, that I despise.

98% explored. This has been driving me nuts. I’ve spent almost as much time getting the 92% as I have to get the WvW stuff. At one point, it probably wasn’t that tough, but the past few times I’ve been on there, it’s all about efficiency. The POIs and Vistas that I still need are right next to the enemy bases. It doesn’t make sense for my server to make the effort when they can make a big sweep to the nearby bases, take them and get their points.

I like to see things completed. Forcing me to participate in WvW, where I usually just wander around solo and prevent people who actually want to play from getting in sucks. It’s sapped the fun out of the game for me.

Title says it all… YES YES YES YES YES! Get the PvEr’s going for their star or legendary OUT of WvWvW as they are only there for the map and keeping players who want to get in, out of WvWvW.
Doing so would have this effect: LOWER QUE TIMES!

Carnius Magius.8091:

With many of the good WvW players jumping ship to be on more competitive servers that leaves less chance for success. So the exploration title is server dependent and not skill dependent.

This is not true, to a degree allow me to explain
Point 1

• With many of the good WvW players jumping ship to be on more competitive servers that leaves less chance for success.

I will come back to this

Point 2

• So the exploration title is server dependent and not skill dependent.

If your server has no skill in command, or tactics to flush, fient, flank, construct at right times your server will never win I promise ( Now I am part of Blackgate server and skill does fall into it )

Point 1
Just because people jump ship to larger servers like

• Blackgate
• Jade Quarry
• Sanctum of rall
  doesn’t mean your server is never going to win. That just isn’t how the match ups work for Wv3. If your server sucks ( no offense ) then your teamed up with 2 other servers that suck, Another words if your server is in Tier 8 the rest of the servers are also in tier 8 aren’t that good. Just saying the rankings don’t allow for Tier 1 to fight Tier 8.

Now as frustrating as Wv3 is for people that want nothing to do with it, Wv3 and their PvE content are the two most hyped sections of the pre-release. They want people to at least experience it, and if you go into the Battleground with the attitude of this is going to be a waste of time and suck then it will. Although Wv3 players that leveled in Wv3 and have played there since start are forced into PvE to get gear and legendary weapons ( which are a joke at this time ). Everyone from all sections has to suck it up and try. Like one poster said having a legendary says two things

• You have a credit card
• you have mastered all aspects of the game

The wubwub shouldn’t count for world completion for the same reason the Mists and dungeons don’t, it’s not part of the actual world map.

Yeh, map completion should not require wvw. I play with my gf and she has 100% of the pve map, and it frustrates her to no end right now (and me by proxy now lol) that we can’t finish map completion because our server can’t cap points we need for map completion.

And we do not want to transfer servers, because that defeats the purpose and sense of accomplishment, not to mention it’s not guaranteed that we’d be able to get map completion even then!

It’s understandable that the brainstorming on this was, “how can we get our pve players to get a taste of wvw! Oh, let’s make them come here for map completion!” But really it just annoys everyone and completely turns them off from wvw because instead of testing the waters themselves you’re making them all oppositionally defiant by default because everyone is like “EFF THIS I’M NEVER COMING BACK WHEN I’M DONE THIS MAP!”

-_-

Heck, I’d even be Ok with them making you go to WvW, but have the POI and Vistas located in areas that you can get to without taking certain points. I think I have 13/16 POIs on each location and 7/10 Vistas. Making them be acquirable by walking up to the castles/towers would be much better.

Why, that means you’ll never come in and see us in WvW?! We luvs ju! D=

-Builds arrow cart in preparation for your arrival-

Whut? <.<

While I agree that wvw is a bit mean at times it shouldn’t be out of map completion that’s like sending troops to war and having them say NOPE my comfort is at home I don’t like it and throw a fit about it it took me 4 months to get 1 point. One. Single. Point. And I’m not an avid wvw player But it happened and it was a great feeling to finally have that gold star i just checked in daily at diferent times sometimes spent the whole day on wvw needed badges anyway sooooooo just suck it up it’s not going away. If you don’t want to do it then don’t let the people that really enjoy the game(in all aspects) be able to feel proud of themselves and sit back and watch the complainers whine about how it’s to harddddddd my enemys actually think for themselves now and how they can’t do it

Although I’m almost done with WvW exploration (just need a couple of more points which I’ll probably get when my server takes the camps near it), I agree with the OP. The battlegrounds is not a part of the PvE map, so it’s a bit illogical why it would count towards map completion. Second, not everyone has the luxury of being on a server which is at least moderately active in WvW.

Now before you say “it’s a challenge, you need to earn your rewards”, I ask you this – do you think it’s fair for a person on a dominating server to get his WvW exploration in about an hour, while another person on a PvE oriented server always has to fish for WvW groups and spend hunderds of hours to get the SAME reward as person 1? Do you think getting the WvW explo is “challenging”? It’s not, you just have to pray to GOD your server does WvW regularly and that fact has absolutely NOTHING to do with the way YOU play, nor with how skillful YOU are.

So either make two different achievements for PvE and WvW explo, or remove WvW exploration completely, add new objectives to it and unique rewards and interested people will flock to the battlegrounds. What we have now is just another frustrating mess of an achievement.

Orc Slayer.2780:

Title says it all… YES YES YES YES YES! Get the PvEr’s going for their star or legendary OUT of WvWvW as they are only there for the map and keeping players who want to get in, out of WvWvW.
Doing so would have this effect: LOWER QUE TIMES!

yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss lower que

Hyper Cutter.9376:

The wubwub shouldn’t count for world completion for the same reason the Mists and dungeons don’t, it’s not part of the actual world map.

agreeee withhhh uuuu buuuttttt neeed 15 charactersss

I agree WvWvW should not be required for map completion. There is nothing fun or engaging about being massacred by a group of 500 people before you can even get to a waypoint. I have absolutely no interest in PvP aspects of the game, and forcing your playerbase to do it is very unfair. If you want players to partake in WvWvW, either fix the mechanics of it, or make it optional.

Wvw in map completion is technically easy over time. If you can avoid areas that would have heavy enemy support and also avoid battles with speed and such you can usually do an area that is needed pretty easily. If you get to a place you feel fairly safe to do a vista, and you see an enemy come up near you. You have to watch them they may be mapping also or they may be there to make sure that you do not make that vista. Either way that Is something that you need to figure out. The only major problem with wvw is the Eternal Battlegrounds that you have to do and it does not really change since all of the worlds try to control it. The other areas though are different they are based on the color your world is using. For example if your world is blue one wvw it may be green or red the next wvw. The colored areas stay the same the worlds move to them. So when you are mapping and you have patience (which everyone should have since the game is not going anywhere) make sure you map when the new wvw event starts in the area of your color very few will be there right away giving you time to do the forts and such. That is my advice on the subject thanks for reading.

People act like you dont need to get 500 badges for a legendary.
Remove WvWvW from map completion. I’ve already done the map, and that was the last thing I did. I waited till my server kicked butt and just ran around, avoided anything and everything that looked like death, and got the hell out!

One word: no. I worked my kitten off capturing keeps and organizing the kitten out of my old server to capture 100% of the map, and it was so satisfying to get that 100% in WvW, and really helps call out locations as a commander. I now have my Kudzu and I’ll be kitten if they make it easier to get a legendary. WvW map completion is a time sink, which is something that legendaries have a lot of. I found it really fun capturing keeps and such, and although it may have been easier being a respected commander on GoM, I still don’t think it should be removed. It would be completely unfair to those of us with legendaries.

ricefrisbeetreats.3964:

Heck, I’d even be Ok with them making you go to WvW, but have the POI and Vistas located in areas that you can get to without taking certain points. I think I have 13/16 POIs on each location and 7/10 Vistas. Making them be acquirable by walking up to the castles/towers would be much better.

I agree, having WvW as part of the map completion is just dumb and annoying. The map completion is a personal achievement, it’s not a pvp achievement or a WvW achievement, so having it require pvping in WvW to get the completion is illogical.

I enjoy WvW, but I can understand that a lot of players may not. I’d be fine with what the above poster suggested, making the POI & Vistas accessible without taking certain points, that would make them again being a personal achievement…albeit in a very hostile environment to those who enjoy strictly pve.

Tekietee.5037:

People act like you dont need to get 500 badges for a legendary.
Remove WvWvW from map completion. I’ve already done the map, and that was the last thing I did. I waited till my server kicked butt and just ran around, avoided anything and everything that looked like death, and got the hell out!

The funny thing is, the 500 Badges of Honor annoy me just as much. Why is ANet punishing people who do not like a certain aspect of the game. Getting mobbed by zergs repeatedly is not my idea of a good time. The fact PvP is required to get a Legendary weapon, that will be used in PvE is completely silly.

kaioshade.7682:

Tekietee.5037:

People act like you dont need to get 500 badges for a legendary.
Remove WvWvW from map completion. I’ve already done the map, and that was the last thing I did. I waited till my server kicked butt and just ran around, avoided anything and everything that looked like death, and got the hell out!

The funny thing is, the 500 Badges of Honor annoy me just as much. Why is ANet punishing people who do not like a certain aspect of the game. Getting mobbed by zergs repeatedly is not my idea of a good time. The fact PvP is required to get a Legendary weapon, that will be used in PvE is completely silly.

Legendary weapons can be used in Wv3, 500 badges are not hard to get, I mean they already made it so you never have to do any Wv3 in order to get your legendary, it is called the TP. You don’t want to do this then you will have to do Map completion and 500 badges.

People have to realize there are people out there that only play Wv3, and are forced to do PvE content ( a lot more than PvE has to do Wv3 content) to get their legendary, yet they all just suck it up and do it. Is it annoying to have to do Map completion in Wv3? Yes. Is it Annoying for Wv3 people have to do 12 zones ( I believe ) to get Map completion when they would rather be Wv3ing? Yes

Then you complain about getting zerged, maybe stay with a large group. problem solved

kaioshade.7682:

The funny thing is, the 500 Badges of Honor annoy me just as much. Why is ANet punishing people who do not like a certain aspect of the game. Getting mobbed by zergs repeatedly is not my idea of a good time. The fact PvP is required to get a Legendary weapon, that will be used in PvE is completely silly.

People should be required to play all aspects of the game to get Legend Status or whatever. I don’t know where others are coming from, but my argument is there should either be a way for PvE players to get an achievement for exploring the entire normal map and the WvW players should get something for the WvW map.

for a game billed as “play as you want to play”, its ironic that Anet have taken the design choice to force players to play how THEY want you to play.

Kaimick.5109:

kaioshade.7682:

Tekietee.5037:

People act like you dont need to get 500 badges for a legendary.
Remove WvWvW from map completion. I’ve already done the map, and that was the last thing I did. I waited till my server kicked butt and just ran around, avoided anything and everything that looked like death, and got the hell out!

The funny thing is, the 500 Badges of Honor annoy me just as much. Why is ANet punishing people who do not like a certain aspect of the game. Getting mobbed by zergs repeatedly is not my idea of a good time. The fact PvP is required to get a Legendary weapon, that will be used in PvE is completely silly.

Legendary weapons can be used in Wv3, 500 badges are not hard to get, I mean they already made it so you never have to do any Wv3 in order to get your legendary, it is called the TP. You don’t want to do this then you will have to do Map completion and 500 badges.

People have to realize there are people out there that only play Wv3, and are forced to do PvE content ( a lot more than PvE has to do Wv3 content) to get their legendary, yet they all just suck it up and do it. Is it annoying to have to do Map completion in Wv3? Yes. Is it Annoying for Wv3 people have to do 12 zones ( I believe ) to get Map completion when they would rather be Wv3ing? Yes

Then you complain about getting zerged, maybe stay with a large group. problem solved

Trading Post? I really hope you were being sarcastic. Dropping upwards of 1000 Gold for a Legendary is NOT a reasonable option. If Legendaries were not so insane in the first place to obtain (but that is a whole different topic), maybe the TP would be an option.

Stay in large groups? Not everyone is blessed with a server that does WvWvW religiously every single second of the day. We have no way to recover. My server is DEAD LAST, with control of nothing. It is outright impossible to move more than 5 feet without getting destroyed in less than 5 seconds.

WvWvW would actually be enjoyable if the mechanics of it were not outright broken. And actually took strategy beyond “amass 600 people and steamroll everything in sight”

Kaimick.5109:

People have to realize there are people out there that only play Wv3, and are forced to do PvE content ( a lot more than PvE has to do Wv3 content) to get their legendary, yet they all just suck it up and do it. Is it annoying to have to do Map completion in Wv3? Yes. Is it Annoying for Wv3 people have to do 12 zones ( I believe ) to get Map completion when they would rather be Wv3ing? Yes

But nothing in PVE 100% requires you to wait in 2-3hour queues, or is reliant on getting a group of other people to zerg points so you can get the relevant points of interest and vistas.

You can get 100% pve entirely solo on your own time.

Its the pvp bit I object to (though it is stupid to require that), its the fact that wvwvw is not accessible to many people at any one time (about 100 people per server per map) and is reliant on factors beyond your control.

Cameirus.8407:

Kaimick.5109:

People have to realize there are people out there that only play Wv3, and are forced to do PvE content ( a lot more than PvE has to do Wv3 content) to get their legendary, yet they all just suck it up and do it. Is it annoying to have to do Map completion in Wv3? Yes. Is it Annoying for Wv3 people have to do 12 zones ( I believe ) to get Map completion when they would rather be Wv3ing? Yes

But nothing in PVE 100% requires you to wait in 2-3hour queues, or is reliant on getting a group of other people to zerg points so you can get the relevant points of interest and vistas.

You can get 100% pve entirely solo on your own time.

Its the pvp bit I object to (though it is stupid to require that), its the fact that wvwvw is not accessible to many people at any one time (about 100 people per server per map) and is reliant on factors beyond your control.

I am on Blackgate the second top server in the world for Wv3 and I have not experienced que times in over 4 months minus the day of the patch.

It doesn’t matter how easy it is to do PvE content, Wv3 players are still forced to do something they may not want to do. Also if a Wv3 player wants gear that looks like Arah gear they have to run Arah, yet again another force to play PvE situation.

Bottom line is Legendary offer no real advantage stat wise in the game they are just for the skin, if you want it you may have to do things you do not normally do, when then Legendary actually have stats that are worth something maybe it will be a different story.

kaioshade.7682:

Kaimick.5109:

kaioshade.7682:

Tekietee.5037:

People act like you dont need to get 500 badges for a legendary.
Remove WvWvW from map completion. I’ve already done the map, and that was the last thing I did. I waited till my server kicked butt and just ran around, avoided anything and everything that looked like death, and got the hell out!

The funny thing is, the 500 Badges of Honor annoy me just as much. Why is ANet punishing people who do not like a certain aspect of the game. Getting mobbed by zergs repeatedly is not my idea of a good time. The fact PvP is required to get a Legendary weapon, that will be used in PvE is completely silly.

Legendary weapons can be used in Wv3, 500 badges are not hard to get, I mean they already made it so you never have to do any Wv3 in order to get your legendary, it is called the TP. You don’t want to do this then you will have to do Map completion and 500 badges.

People have to realize there are people out there that only play Wv3, and are forced to do PvE content ( a lot more than PvE has to do Wv3 content) to get their legendary, yet they all just suck it up and do it. Is it annoying to have to do Map completion in Wv3? Yes. Is it Annoying for Wv3 people have to do 12 zones ( I believe ) to get Map completion when they would rather be Wv3ing? Yes

Then you complain about getting zerged, maybe stay with a large group. problem solved

Trading Post? I really hope you were being sarcastic. Dropping upwards of 1000 Gold for a Legendary is NOT a reasonable option. If Legendaries were not so insane in the first place to obtain (but that is a whole different topic), maybe the TP would be an option.

Stay in large groups? Not everyone is blessed with a server that does WvWvW religiously every single second of the day. We have no way to recover. My server is DEAD LAST, with control of nothing. It is outright impossible to move more than 5 feet without getting destroyed in less than 5 seconds.

WvWvW would actually be enjoyable if the mechanics of it were not outright broken. And actually took strategy beyond “amass 600 people and steamroll everything in sight”

No it wasn’t sarcastic, and just because it is not a realistic option doesn’t mean it isn’t an option.

Because your server doesn’t do Wv3 that makes the system unfair? That sounds like it is a server issue not arena Nets fault.

Kaimick.5109:

Because your server doesn’t do Wv3 that makes the system unfair? That sounds like it is a server issue not arena Nets fault.

That is my entire point. Why must i be punished for the entirety of my server?

kaioshade.7682:

Kaimick.5109:

Because your server doesn’t do Wv3 that makes the system unfair? That sounds like it is a server issue not arena Nets fault.

That is my entire point. Why must i be punished for the entirety of my server?

How are you being punished? Because you can’t get a cool looking skin on your weapon that does nothing for you. having a legendary is not something that everyone is entitled to. Arena Net job isn’t to give you a Legendary, if you want it you will work for it, if your server is crap then transfer to a medium server you still have 3 days left of it being free. If you don’t want to take advantage of that then that is your choice and ergo your fault not arena Nets