Guild Wars 2

Title says it- I believe WvW maps should not count toward World Completion.

- Having these in the requirement is an artificial, dull extension: Want to get the Red borderlands done? Better hope your server is either owning the match-up, zerging around like mad, or red team! Need the bottom left corner of the Eternal Battlegrounds? Same applies. If your server is inconsistent in its performance or simply lacks performance, good luck ever getting the maps done. Waiting for weeks to have a chance at being the team you need to have a favorable chance at places to complete is NOT fun.

- The requirement degrades the WvW experience: As there are only so many players allowed per server team on at any given time, having that quota filled with uninterested PvE players hampers any sense of coordination from more dedicated groups, trying to encourage these players to fit in with their strategies and hopefully win. I frequently see anti-PvE player jeering in the map and team chats – it’s quite apparent to me that PvE players aren’t wanted, but have to come.

- The requirement can put WvW in a negative light for potential new players : I can see a line of thought where this requirement would encourage WvW participation in concept, but in reality solo / small groups of PvE players are just ganked by the hordes or an unlucky run-in with enemies, all too frequently, and very frustratingly. This frustration discourages participating in WvW by painting it in the light of “good luck not getting ganked, lol”.

- The WvW maps are not part of the ‘World’ : Lore-wise, the maps are located in the Mists, NOT in Tyria, as the bulk of the game is. Tyria is the world we are tasked with completing, with the mists as a mysterious afterlife / alternate dimension. Part of the universe, but NOT part of the world. Mechanically, the WvW zones and ‘main’ zones are not on the same map, either.

Why you think i check on wvw often on my lowbies so i can get what ever points i need in wvw so by the time im lvl 80 ill have all or almost all the stuff in wvw and i know many who do that.

Remove the PvE maps from World Completion

Not fair to WvW players

Player Character.9467:

Remove the PvE maps from World Completion

Not fair to WvW players

False equivalency – PvE is by far the core of the world completion concept. Not only that, but it doesn’t require dealing with the variables I listed (and you conveniently ignored)

Also, how exactly is this not fair to WvW players? From what I’ve seen they don’t care about it in the slightest.

HardRider.2980:

Why you think i check on wvw often on my lowbies so i can get what ever points i need in wvw so by the time im lvl 80 ill have all or almost all the stuff in wvw and i know many who do that.

A good technique that I should have learned, sure, but should this inconvenience really be necessary?

Oh jeez, might as well just start everyone with every weapon skin and armor skin in the game so that there are no inconveniences!

Esplen.3940:

Oh jeez, might as well just start everyone with every weapon skin and armor skin in the game so that there are no inconveniences!

Hasty generalization of my argument. Most ‘inconveniences’ in the game are justified – you must work to get rewards. What I am saying is that the WvW-related problems are needless.

ChaosCrazed.6415:

Most ‘inconveniences’ in the game are justified – you must work to get rewards.

Work with your world to capture places.

Esplen.3940:

ChaosCrazed.6415:

Most ‘inconveniences’ in the game are justified – you must work to get rewards.

Work with your world to capture places.

And if my world doesn’t have the numbers to do so? From the OP:

If your server is inconsistent in its performance or simply lacks performance, good luck ever getting the maps done.

ChaosCrazed.6415:

Esplen.3940:

ChaosCrazed.6415:

Most ‘inconveniences’ in the game are justified – you must work to get rewards.

Work with your world to capture places.

And if my world doesn’t have the numbers to do so? From the OP:

If your server is inconsistent in its performance or simply lacks performance, good luck ever getting the maps done.

Change the server or wait until the next week. You will most likely switch points at reset. Also, you might get an easier opponent, thus taking over their stuff. Have some patience, World exploration isn’t something you do in a day anyway, neither is making a legendary(if you need the gifts).

The Heart of the Mists doesn’t count towards map completion, so wubwub maps shouldn’t either (and Southsun should).

PvE maps should be removed from completion.

You people that don’t want to do WvW maps do not deserve any kind of completion because you don’t want to actually earn it. Instead, you all come here and complain because it is easier to do that than actually earn something.

Quit complaining about it and go take the stuff you need.

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

PvE maps should be removed from completion.

You people that don’t want to do WvW maps do not deserve any kind of completion because you don’t want to actually earn it. Instead, you all come here and complain because it is easier to do that than actually earn something.

Quit complaining about it and go take the stuff you need.

Ha – mere elitism. We earn the completion by doing / finding everything in the world. Given the time commitment required for the sheer volume of locations, that’s certainly a fair value.

kozeljko.8201:

Change the server or wait until the next week. You will most likely switch points at reset. Also, you might get an easier opponent, thus taking over their stuff. Have some patience, World exploration isn’t something you do in a day anyway, neither is making a legendary(if you need the gifts).

The problem here is “might”. The point I’m trying to make is whether having the various semi-random match selections control whether anyone can make progress is fair.

Also, I should not be forced to pay to transfer servers to get completion. I paid for the game, and that is all that should be required on that front.

Agree x1000…. I’ve also made posts about this. It’s not necessary.

If Anet wants to include WvW as map completion, have 2 or 3 different stars. Like bronze for just WvW, silver for the world, and gold for everything, or something. But as far as the Gifts of Exploration go, it should just be the world map.

ChaosCrazed.6415:

Esplen.3940:

ChaosCrazed.6415:

Most ‘inconveniences’ in the game are justified – you must work to get rewards.

Work with your world to capture places.

And if my world doesn’t have the numbers to do so? From the OP:

If your server is inconsistent in its performance or simply lacks performance, good luck ever getting the maps done.

You change colours in WvW. You don’t have to actually cap anything but stonemist.

Player Character.9467:

You change colours in WvW. You don’t have to actually cap anything but stonemist.

That is, IF the servers decide to give you the color you need.

ChaosCrazed.6415:

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

PvE maps should be removed from completion.

You people that don’t want to do WvW maps do not deserve any kind of completion because you don’t want to actually earn it. Instead, you all come here and complain because it is easier to do that than actually earn something.

Quit complaining about it and go take the stuff you need.

Ha – mere elitism. We earn the completion by doing / finding everything in the world. Given the time commitment required for the sheer volume of locations, that’s certainly a fair value.

Ha – mere elitism. PvE people always spouting entitlement.

You don’t really earn anything unless you PvP. Everything else is handed to you.

Everyone is undeserving of completion if you are not willing to gasp PvP.

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

Ha – mere elitism. PvE people always spouting entitlement.

You don’t really earn anything unless you PvP. Everything else is handed to you.

Everyone is undeserving of completion if you are not willing to gasp PvP.

It looks to me as if you’re throwing back what I said, trying to ‘catch me out’., instead coming off as a child.

Anyhow, where is the entitlement? I’ve mentioned in earlier posts that going through the content itself is the work needed to be placed in to earn the achievement. I am not the type to want everything handed to me on a silver platter, and am OK with working for it, long as it is fair.

“You don’t really earn anything unless you PvP” … Funnily enough, SPvP doesn’t give anything for PvE use, so it’s both ways. It seems to me that Anet wants the two sides to be seperate. Which, should that be the case, it then makes even more sense to remove completion requirements from WvW so that the separation is more concrete.

In addition, your refusal to acknowledge PvE as a valid way to play makes you the elitist who demands everyone play the things you do or else (“Everyone is undeserving of completion if you are not willing to gasp PvP.”)

ChaosCrazed.6415:

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

Ha – mere elitism. PvE people always spouting entitlement.

You don’t really earn anything unless you PvP. Everything else is handed to you.

Everyone is undeserving of completion if you are not willing to gasp PvP.

It looks to me as if you’re throwing back what I said, trying to ‘catch me out’., instead coming off as a child.

Anyhow, where is the entitlement? I’ve mentioned in earlier posts that going through the content itself is the work needed to be placed in to earn the achievement. I am not the type to want everything handed to me on a silver platter, and am OK with working for it, long as it is fair.

“You don’t really earn anything unless you PvP” … Funnily enough, SPvP doesn’t give anything for PvE use, so it’s both ways. It seems to me that Anet wants the two sides to be seperate. Which, should that be the case, it then makes even more sense to remove completion requirements from WvW so that the separation is more concrete.

In addition, your refusal to acknowledge PvE as a valid way to play makes you the elitist who demands everyone play the things you do or else (“Everyone is undeserving of completion if you are not willing to gasp PvP.”)

I didn’t say PvE wasn’t valid. You just don’t deserve any rewards or respect for having that legendary. You don’t really want to earn it. You instead want to come to the forums and advocate the removal from something that you dislike.

I dislike having to do the PvE maps.

You are the one being elitist hear since we are using your logic, you are saying WvW isn’t a valid form of play. You are being elitist since you want to shun the completion from WvW and trying to place my form of play as a second class player.

Earn it or quit complaining because your arguments are just as poor as any other argument to remove it from WvW.

Well as far as I remember around 98% of the map completion is in PvE (waypoints are automatically added once you join a border from anywhere). Now tell me what do you think who is having a harder time to get the 100%, PvE players who just need to “endure” those 2% or WvWvW players who need to go through 98% of content which they don’t particularly like? And don’t think for one second that people who play WvWvW don’t want their legendary weapons because they do.

Totally agree!!!

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

I didn’t say PvE wasn’t valid. You just don’t deserve any rewards or respect for having that legendary. You don’t really want to earn it. You instead want to come to the forums and advocate the removal from something that you dislike.

So basically, PvE is supposedly invalid for earning any respect. I don’t really want to earn it? What about having to run the dungeons involved in making the kitten legendaries? Hell, I’m only looking for completion, I personally am not sure I even want a legendary.

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

You are the one being elitist hear since we are using your logic, you are saying WvW isn’t a valid form of play. You are being elitist since you want to shun the completion from WvW and trying to place my form of play as a second class player.

And where did I say WvW isn’t valid? It just isn’t part of the world of Tyria. Second class? BS. You have your own sets of armor, skins, weapons, category of achievements, titles, and on and on. You even get your own rank system.

holodoc.5748:

Well as far as I remember around 98% of the map completion is in PvE (waypoints are automatically added once you join a border from anywhere). Now tell me what do you think who is having a harder time to get the 100%, PvE players who just need to “endure” those 2% or WvWvW players who need to go through 98% of content which they don’t particularly like? And don’t think for one second that people who play WvWvW don’t want their legendary weapons because they do.

My main arguments do not center around legendaries. As I mentioned above, I’m not even certain I want to even bother with one. However, your points bring up a possibility – perhaps ANet should add an alternative material / gift with comparable needed effort for WvW’ers?

The Eternal Grace.3157:

If Anet wants to include WvW as map completion, have 2 or 3 different stars. Like bronze for just WvW, silver for the world, and gold for everything, or something. But as far as the Gifts of Exploration go, it should just be the world map.

This is also an interesting idea. Tiered achievements are hardly a rare thing.

ChaosCrazed.6415:

My main arguments do not center around legendaries. As I mentioned above, I’m not even certain I want to even bother with one. However, your points bring up a possibility – perhaps ANet should add an alternative material / gift with comparable needed effort for WvW’ers?

What for do you need 100% completion then?

holodoc.5748:

ChaosCrazed.6415:

My main arguments do not center around legendaries. As I mentioned above, I’m not even certain I want to even bother with one. However, your points bring up a possibility – perhaps ANet should add an alternative material / gift with comparable needed effort for WvW’ers?

What for do you need 100% completion then?

The achievement points, the title, etc. Just wanted to try my best at it.

I would argue that having the WvW maps as a requirement increases the competition. I am almost exclusively a PvE player, but I think it’s healthy to have completion spread to WvW.

It adds another reason to go their and play. If you don’t want to get those particular points, then don’t bother with completion.

Gnat.9405:

I would argue that having the WvW maps as a requirement increases the competition. I am almost exclusively a PvE player, but I think it’s healthy to have completion spread to WvW.

It adds another reason to go there and play. If you don’t want to get those particular points, then don’t bother with completion.

How exactly does it increase the competition from a quality standpoint? PvE players are looked down upon by many WvW players – I don’t think PvE players are wanted there (unless it’s a server known to hardly have anyone on, then they take what they get).

Also, is that reason a sensible one? Why would it make sense to make a PvE achievement require going into a PvP-centric mode?

Since getting world completion currently gives 2 gifts of completion why can’t anet just make the WvW maps their own completion separate from the PvE maps and have both completions give 1 gift each?

Because then PvE’ers would complain that WvW only requires you to complete 4 maps instead of completing 32 zones (not including Chantry of Secrets).

ChaosCrazed.6415:

Gnat.9405:

I would argue that having the WvW maps as a requirement increases the competition. I am almost exclusively a PvE player, but I think it’s healthy to have completion spread to WvW.

It adds another reason to go there and play. If you don’t want to get those particular points, then don’t bother with completion.

How exactly does it increase the competition from a quality standpoint? PvE players are looked down upon by many WvW players – I don’t think PvE players are wanted there (unless it’s a server known to hardly have anyone on, then they take what they get).

Also, is that reason a sensible one? Why would it make sense to make a PvE achievement require going into a PvP-centric mode?

You have a point but I still think it’s a way to get players to at least acknowledge other areas of the game. Whether or not it’s a good way is a different question. Players that Are 100% exclusive to PvE are forced into an area that otherwise they would probably never bother to invest.

The fact that these players are not wanted there by the community is something that can’t really be helped – it’s in the game and most likely not going to change. All I’m saying is that the current method is at best a way to rouse interest for players that are unfamiliar with the content. At worst it created longer queue times for players dedicated to the format. The trade off was worth it to ANet, obviously.

I’m sure adding primarily PvP content to this achievement was something that wasn’t implemented without discussion.