Revive Daily, Aggroing Mobs into Players

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Posted by: Egon Vidar.9125

Egon Vidar.9125

I wasn’t sure where to post this, I suppose this is as good a place as any.

Yesterday while playing, I had many people talking to me on a messaging program, so I needed to switch back and forth between the game and another window. I parked my character at the heart Tengu that stands beside the Destroyer event area in Kessex Hills. There are no mobs whose AI carries them naturally to where I was standing, but there were warg in the vicinity – just not close enough to naturally aggro into me. Yesterday, one of the dailies was healer, where you get points toward the daily for reviving.

I was talking to a friend, and maximized the game to check in and see if any events were running near me, out of habit. I found myself downed with warg attacking me, and an Asura standing off to the side, watching. I died, and he ran over and began to revive. I used a WP, hopefully denying him of the revive point.

Later, I parked myself again at the same point. Again, later, I maximized the game and found myself being attacked by warg, but I wasn’t downed yet. A human female player character was, again, watching me and letting me get wailed on. I killed the warg and she ran away.

Even later still, I was in a completely different area on my level 80, Bloodcliff Quarry. I was checking something on the TP when I noticed myself taking damage. A charr PC had dragged dredge into me to beat on me. I killed them and, again, the player took off.

I wish I had gotten their names, but my vision is very poor and I was preoccupied in every instance with either keeping myself alive or killing mobs. But this is getting completely ridiculous. It’s really easy to find downed NPCs, or even go into a city map and ask in map chat for someone to suicide jump for you, but now people are intentionally killing other players for the dailies. I’m not sure if it’s maliciousness, laziness, or desperation.
Can something be done about this? I know aggroing mobs into players is against the TOS, but that doesn’t stop them. It might be a good idea to change the daily where only reviving NPCs counts.. but that has potential to mess things up even more. I’ve already seen multiple instances of players ragging on others for helping NPCs instead of letting them die.

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Posted by: eisberg.2379

eisberg.2379

Well, if you are just standing there afk, and you die, and then you get revived, it doesn’t cause any harm to you at all. I know I wouldn’t care in the least bit if someone did that to me. I am afk, just standing there, what do I care if I died and then revived while I was gone.

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Posted by: Emmiere.1058

Emmiere.1058

The problem is that not only is this incredibly rude, your armor still gets damaged because you’re considered in combat. So while someone is purposely killing you while you went off to get a drink or what have you, you’re paying for it in silver.

On top of that, yesterday while leveling in The Blood Fields with some guild mates, we were getting yelled at for killing the skelks that were attacking the NPCs. All we wanted was to complete our renown heart and we ended up being harassed by level 80 players.

I don’t mind this daily requirement. What I do mind is the attitude people are developing because of it. It’s seriously not that hard to go run fractals or a dungeon or two and complete that part of the daily.

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Posted by: eisberg.2379

eisberg.2379

The problem is that not only is this incredibly rude, your armor still gets damaged because you’re considered in combat. So while someone is purposely killing you while you went off to get a drink or what have you, you’re paying for it in silver.

On top of that, yesterday while leveling in The Blood Fields with some guild mates, we were getting yelled at for killing the skelks that were attacking the NPCs. All we wanted was to complete our renown heart and we ended up being harassed by level 80 players.

I don’t mind this daily requirement. What I do mind is the attitude people are developing because of it. It’s seriously not that hard to go run fractals or a dungeon or two and complete that part of the daily.

You armor only gets damaged if you rez at a way point. If you get rezed by a player, then you take no armor damage.

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Posted by: Emmiere.1058

Emmiere.1058

You armor only gets damaged if you rez at a way point. If you get rezed by a player, then you take no armor damage.

Your armor gets damaged each time you’re defeated. Yeah, if you’re only downed and get rezzed then it won’t get damaged. Really, though, that’s besides the point. The point is that this daily requirement leads people to some really rude behavior and it needs to be dealt with.

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Posted by: Egon Vidar.9125

Egon Vidar.9125

My armour was damaged the time they actually succeeded in killing me. Even if it wasn’t, it’s still a jerk move to pull on someone while they’re looking away for a moment. For one, if you’re a long ways away from a waypoint and need to get back, you could be looking at a several minute long walk.
It’s an inconvenience and it’s incredibly discourteous and selfish either way. And while you might not mind, I do, and I’m sure many other people would as well. My character standing still for a minute or two is not an invitation to kill me for your benefit and my detriment. It costs me to waypoint and repair my armour, after all.

Edit: Especially discourteous when they tried it on my level 80. His armour is partially exotic and the repair cost is staggering since I’m trying to save money.

(edited by Egon Vidar.9125)

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Posted by: MilitiaMasterV.7216

MilitiaMasterV.7216

Hmm. Haven’t seen that yet, but it wouldn’t surprise me. The easiest way to knock this daily down is just check the map for a ‘contested’ waypoint and go rez NPC’s there. (Usually an event going on too…so you can sometimes jump in for daily event count.)

One of the easiest places to get free corpses to rez is where the giant is beating on Nageling in Diessa Plateau, and since that’s basically just out the gate from Black Citadel…all it takes is a little running and avoiding the giant’s aggro radius. He’ll even promptly wipe them out again for you if he gets too close.

Amusingly, I died earlier today from a miscalculated jump and said exactly where my body was in map chat and not a soul showed up to rez me and I left it sitting there for awhile while I did stuff.

Sadly, the daily actually reset on me today while I was at 70% on the healer and 80% on daily event (almost finished). I was a tad perturbed. Wonder when they are making it so we only have to do a subset of them like they supposedly claimed they were.

I’ve had people who run around and purposely bring things to me before (Had a guy do it like 4 times in Gendarren Fields, so I told them ‘If you can’t kill it yourself, don’t lure it to other people.’…and his response was that it was a total accident and that he was under leveled and trying to finish the heart. Right. Like I believe that.)

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Posted by: Doomguard.5094

Doomguard.5094

Yeah this daily seems to be creating more trouble than fun, it simply has to go.

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Posted by: Giles Marchand.6970

Giles Marchand.6970

Do people not realize that reviving NPCs also works? There are plenty to go around.

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Posted by: Astral Projections.7320

Astral Projections.7320

Well this is a new and annoying development. Some people will actively look for ways to bend the rules to grief others. What I would recommend then, if you are alone and want to afk or just check the TP is to go to the Mists to do that. You will return to the same spot when you hit Leave The Mists. A bit of a bother but better than being griefed like that.

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Posted by: lunawisp.2378

lunawisp.2378

It’s a shame that people are doing this. On the other hand, the only safe place to go afk in the ‘world’ is in a major city. If you go afk anywhere else, you’re taking a risk on your character dying in your absence.

Found pottering around on Desolation (EU).
lunawisp was my peacebringer on City of Heroes – she lives on in memory as my gaming id.

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Posted by: Terrahero.9358

Terrahero.9358

Do people not realize that reviving NPCs also works? There are plenty to go around.

So, you get yelled at for killing mobs that are attacking NPCs. Also, rezzing the same NPC over and over doesnt work. Even for other people. Example, NPC got rezzed by player A, gets killed again and player B rezzes him and doesnt get the count.

There is an internal timer on how often an NPC can count, globally. So just a few NPCs in a busy area arent going to cut it. Not to mention the seemingly ludicrous contribution demands, asking for you to rez a large portion of the NPCs health before you get the credit anyway.

And this leads to nasty side effects. I was trying to play a new character and the area was littered with lv80s. Running around 1shotting mobs for Kill Event, and whacking down events very fast where it was very hard for my low-level to even get a hit on. To get their events daily.

It was not fun at all. Doing the Defend the Armory-event and getting just silver because the moment a wave became vulnerable it was Whirling Wrath and 100bladed down in under a second.
Or simply not having enough time to even get to an event, especially those who’s duration is based on killing X-amount.

(edited by Terrahero.9358)

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Posted by: Dondarrion.2748

Dondarrion.2748

If you stand around AFK in PvE lands, don’t be surprised if you’re suddenly downed/defeated. Why didn’t you just open PvP menu and enter heart of the mists? You can return to your exact same spot in 2 clicks when you’re done being AFK.

As for getting NPCs to revive, just do some personal story if you have it available still. Lots of NPCs and they always die if you don’t bother helping them against the mobs. Or find some zone with lots of NPCs out and about in the battlefield, more or less any zone will do.

Lord Sazed / Hasla the Huntress / Seaguard Hala
Seamarshal Belit / Initiate Xun Tsu / Mistwarden Roshone
Seafarer’s Rest | Northerner @ Dragon Season

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Posted by: SilverWF.4789

SilverWF.4789

If they’ll remove Dayly healer point - ppls will just aggro mobs to the any AFKer and run away without res.

Just not going to AFK in the areas where mobs can reach you and there no any NPC-guards around.

#SAVEDONBASS from Ukraine!
Seafarer’s Rest (EU): Liicher (Engi), Lii Cher (Warrior), Swf (Elem),
Licharr (Guard), Lich Eir (Ranger), Alt Fh (Thief). Lii Cherr (Mesm), S Wf (Necr)

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Posted by: Salt.4621

Salt.4621

If you alt tab out of the game just log out, logging in and out in this game is incredibly fast in comparison to other MMOs.

“Your face is funny. All squished and weird.”

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Posted by: Udolpho.1209

Udolpho.1209

I feel bad enough when I do this to NPCs. Just standing there, watching as some unnamed villager gets wailed on by wolves or centaur, waiting for them to get downed so I can rez them. But I’d never do that to another player. People need to think before they do that to someone, because it’s not cool. But I can completely see it happening in game. There have been times when it is impossible to find a downed NPC and I’ve been running around the map trying to find one. Along with two dozen other people trying to get the same daily.

It’s even gotten to the point where I’ve considered asking in chat if someone would like to team up for a suicide club. We’d run around and purposely make each other die so the other could rez. Nuts!

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Posted by: Leo G.4501

Leo G.4501

What? Are you all stuck in Queensdale or something? There’s dozens of other areas with hundreds upon hundreds of dead NPCs littering the ground. If you find it hard to find dead NPCs, go to an area you haven’t/don’t often go(ne) to and explore the map.

Or if you’re level 80, go to Orr. What others do to rez people is their business. Alternatively, you can run some dungeons and put your rez utility on. That works for me.

PS: I haven’t gotten in a situation where someone tries to kill me for this but then I’m either in Orr (where there’s too many dead NPCs) or a dungeon. If it’s really this bad, I’m curious what the popular opinion on this is. As is, this is the easiest daily outside of the crafting one. Would people want it replaced/made less easy (because PCs don’t count?)?

(edited by Leo G.4501)

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Posted by: Cable.2850

Cable.2850

It’s PvE live with it, you were standing in the middle of nowhere basically abusing the reaction area of a mob. Ok the people doing it were kitten too, but if you’d just gone to any camp or waypoint you’d have been fine.

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Posted by: Calcifire.1864

Calcifire.1864

if you go to that pirate cave in lion’s arch, you can buy a portal stone to the hall of monuments for free from a charr, if you use it, you get taken to a private instance of the HoM, and when you use the stone again or use the asura gate there you’re taken back to the exact point you used the stone first.

I use it all the time if I’m going to be AFK for a while and I’m far away from anything that could be considered safe

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Posted by: Orion Templar.4589

Orion Templar.4589

One option they could implement to help prevent the daily healer achievement from becoming a source of grief like this is to have the game damage your armor as usual when you go down the first time, however if you are rezzed and your keyboard and mouse haven’t been touched and you go down again, armor isn’t damaged. No special approvals, popups, or tags are needed that way. If you rez someone you don’t have to worry about whether they are AFK or not, since if they are you aren’t doing them a disservice since their armor won’t break past the first time.

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Posted by: Dasorine.1964

Dasorine.1964

or just cause agro to remain on the initial target ignoring anyone they move past that take no action against them until they return to their initial point

so if some one tries to pull something onto an afk player it will ignore the afk and stay on griefer until their leash kicks in and returns them to thier initial point before agroing anyone not taking action.

to prevent some abuse taking an action against them also flags your team as doing so

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Posted by: Blueshield.6291

Blueshield.6291

This part of a bigger problem with the Daily Healer category, which is that it encourages poor gameplay in general. As you point out, this rewards us for watching players die rather than stepping in and saving them.

The same is true of NPCs – its now more sensible to wait around until a friendly dies, than stepping in and getting merely a kill. The reactions to this are amusing on Tarnished Coast, when a roleplayer encounters you watching some poor kitten get murdered.

On the issue of NPC resuscitation, the achievement creates unnecessary conflict when players “save” friendly NPCs from being killed. The players “saving” the NPCs get called trolled, the players trying to get rezzes get called leeches and/or farmers… it’s unpleasant.

Even the one socially positive aspect of the achievement is not without problem. Many guilds (and charitable, helpful players) have resorted to tossing themselves off of cliffs to help others with the achievement. This is seemingly in line with what ANet’s objectives were (getting players back into unpopulated zones, facilitating community gameplay, etc) because it is unquestionably an example of using teamwork to accomplish one’s goals. However, it was labeled as farming and an exploit, and ANet implemented a cooldown to prevent this from being used (it has failed in that regard, but the point is that ANet tried to shoot down the single positive result of Daily Healer).

I simply cannot believe that ANet fully considered the negative social impacts of the Daily Healer category when they implemented it. I hope that they address this in the future.

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Posted by: Frotee.2634

Frotee.2634

Easiest way ever to complete the healing daily is by visiting the reactor in Metrica Province and rezzing the NPC there…just sayin’.

Luring mobs into unsuspecting afk players is just rude and harmful. Also, it takes ages.

Polka will never die

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Posted by: rozcinana.7249

rozcinana.7249

It’s a shame that people are doing this. On the other hand, the only safe place to go afk in the ‘world’ is in a major city. If you go afk anywhere else, you’re taking a risk on your character dying in your absence.

Basically what lunawisp said. It’s unfortunate but you shouldn’t afk for too long outside of a city.

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Posted by: Blueshield.6291

Blueshield.6291

It’s a shame that people are doing this. On the other hand, the only safe place to go afk in the ‘world’ is in a major city. If you go afk anywhere else, you’re taking a risk on your character dying in your absence.

Basically what lunawisp said. It’s unfortunate but you shouldn’t afk for too long outside of a city.

That’s a fair point, but the real problem (and purpose of this thread, I believe) is not that the potential to grief exists in the game, but that the Daily Healer encourages griefing behavior by rewarding it.

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Posted by: Katz.5143

Katz.5143

That’s too bad. I haven’t seen that happening, but I have seen people getting into fights over NPC’s not being let die.

Also, the dodging can get a bit annoying. I will aggro a mob and attempt to dodge and someone, being helpful, kills the mob. Obviously I’m in distress because I’m dodging and not really doing the mob damage. :P I don’t fuss because they are being nice and helping me out with a mob. It just really delays me finishing dodging for the daily.

In both of these cases, I never complain because there is really nothing to complain about. People are just playing the game. I have seen fights break out in say and map chat though.

It’s a kitten conspiracy. Kittens gonna be kittens. All is vain!

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Posted by: Calcifire.1864

Calcifire.1864

The reactions to this are amusing on Tarnished Coast, when a roleplayer encounters you watching some poor kitten get murdered.

I remember saying when the prelude started that luring a worm to kill a refugee over and over again is probably the most twisted “act of kindness” I’ve ever seen :P

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Posted by: Phaxey.1578

Phaxey.1578

I think this daily achievement is doing the opposite of what it was meant to do.. It was meant to make people want to aid each other, not trying to get them killed.. I think the feature that helping with kills gives loot and exp to all, and that ressing gives exp is already enough..

They should remove this daily.

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Posted by: Egon Vidar.9125

Egon Vidar.9125

To answer several questions at once: the reason why I don’t WP to the Mists or HoM is because my client crashes over fifty percent of the time I hit a load screen for some god forsaken reason, and I was both checking for events and going back and forth between the game and an IM window. I wasn’t sitting there with the game minimized for long stretches of time (I play windowed so I can switch back and forth frequently) I just needed to park my butt for a few in a spot that (normally) had no mobs. That, and I was enjoying looking at the Dominion of Winds wall.

Plus, idling for a few in a spot that’s usually safe is not something that makes me think that my character could potentially die. I was not expecting players to pull mobs into me, it never happened before. Call me optimistic, but from this community, I don’t usually expect the worst of people. This is a community that I’m usually proud of. The dailies are beginning to change that, though.

I should not have to fret about players pulling crap into me for their benefit when I’m standing somewhere safe, in a spot where mobs have to be deliberately aggroed in. It is not on me to shield myself from their horrendous behavior. It’s on them not to act so shamefully.

(edited by Egon Vidar.9125)

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Posted by: Erebus.7568

Erebus.7568

its griefing/exploiting and should be punished by bans..

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Posted by: Linguistically Inept.6583

Linguistically Inept.6583

ive never encountered anyone doing it on players; but once or twice ive purposefully left an ‘escort’ NPC alone to die just so i can res them… and i get people running up to me ressing a dead player in a dungeon (ash legion spy kit – so invisible), pulling a mob over and it killing me (though ‘cleave’ attacks) or them, just so they can get their daily

it seems kind of counter intuitive…

Desolation: 80 ranger [Nightwither], 80 necro [Dusk Grimsoul]
80 warr [Blaze Steelsoul], 80 ele [Blaze Nightstrike], 80 mesmer [Grim Shatterwhirl]
80 guard [Dusk Grimlight], 80 engi [Flintgear]

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Posted by: One Prarie Outpost.4860

One Prarie Outpost.4860

The problem is that not only is this incredibly rude, your armor still gets damaged because you’re considered in combat. So while someone is purposely killing you while you went off to get a drink or what have you, you’re paying for it in silver.

On top of that, yesterday while leveling in The Blood Fields with some guild mates, we were getting yelled at for killing the skelks that were attacking the NPCs. All we wanted was to complete our renown heart and we ended up being harassed by level 80 players.

I don’t mind this daily requirement. What I do mind is the attitude people are developing because of it. It’s seriously not that hard to go run fractals or a dungeon or two and complete that part of the daily.

1.) If you don’t want to be attacked my a griefing player pulling mobs into you, then you should then you shouldn’t leave your toon unattended.

2.) Exactly how do you get yelled at in a game without vocal communication? It’s not like you have to pay attention to those idiots.

3.) As for getting my daily done in Fractals or a dungeon… I don’t tell you how to play, don’t tell me how to play. I have neither the time or desire to spend hours finding, coordinating and completing one or two dungeons per day – especially after working all day, dealing with family needs, fixing dinner and children issues. I want to chill out and relax with a game.

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Posted by: EliteZ.1682

EliteZ.1682

The problem is that not only is this incredibly rude, your armor still gets damaged because you’re considered in combat. So while someone is purposely killing you while you went off to get a drink or what have you, you’re paying for it in silver.

On top of that, yesterday while leveling in The Blood Fields with some guild mates, we were getting yelled at for killing the skelks that were attacking the NPCs. All we wanted was to complete our renown heart and we ended up being harassed by level 80 players.

I don’t mind this daily requirement. What I do mind is the attitude people are developing because of it. It’s seriously not that hard to go run fractals or a dungeon or two and complete that part of the daily.

1.) If you don’t want to be attacked my a griefing player pulling mobs into you, then you should then you shouldn’t leave your toon unattended.

2.) Exactly how do you get yelled at in a game without vocal communication? It’s not like you have to pay attention to those idiots.

3.) As for getting my daily done in Fractals or a dungeon… I don’t tell you how to play, don’t tell me how to play. I have neither the time or desire to spend hours finding, coordinating and completing one or two dungeons per day – especially after working all day, dealing with family needs, fixing dinner and children issues. I want to chill out and relax with a game.

Your number 1 is don’t go afk, but you should be able to go AFK in a zone for 1-3 mins without being killed. All they are saying is that the daily encourages this kind of behaviour instead of preventing it in a game that anet try and make their players work together. Players should be able to feel safe to go afk for a few seconds in areas that mobs are not able to aggro onto you unless pulled to you, just becaue a player is afk does not give another player the right to get them killed just so they can res them. I could leave my house door open, yes it would be my own fault, but would that give somone the right to enter the house and take my items?

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Posted by: Emmiere.1058

Emmiere.1058

1.) If you don’t want to be attacked my a griefing player pulling mobs into you, then you should then you shouldn’t leave your toon unattended.

2.) Exactly how do you get yelled at in a game without vocal communication? It’s not like you have to pay attention to those idiots.

3.) As for getting my daily done in Fractals or a dungeon… I don’t tell you how to play, don’t tell me how to play. I have neither the time or desire to spend hours finding, coordinating and completing one or two dungeons per day – especially after working all day, dealing with family needs, fixing dinner and children issues. I want to chill out and relax with a game.

Goodness, I wasn’t telling you how to play the game. It was merely one suggestion. You don’t need to take offense to every little post on these forums.

1. You should be able to leave your character next to a karma vendor or really anywhere that you know where monsters don’t spawn and be safe. I’m not saying leave it there for a half an hour, just long enough to go grab yourself a drink or something.

2. Forgive me for using a term that you object to. I may not have to pay attention to them, but it’s typically really hard to miss those /say bubbles when they’re in the middle of your screen and full of angry words.

3. I wasn’t telling anyone how to play this game. Climb down off your high horse for five minutes, please. I get that you work hard and want to unwind with a game after a long day. I’m not saying everyone should go and run fractals/dungeons to do this daily, merely that most of the people who complete this daily by going to lower level zones on their 80 toon just to find that mass of dead NPCs to rez have other options. Mostly because those people play for hours a day anyway.

I don’t give a kitten how you play your game. There’s just no need to be an kitten and purposely kill other players for your own selfish reasons. There’s no justification for that sort of behavior.

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Posted by: Gestankfaust.4216

Gestankfaust.4216

1.) If you don’t want to be attacked my a griefing player pulling mobs into you, then you should then you shouldn’t leave your toon unattended.

2.) Exactly how do you get yelled at in a game without vocal communication? It’s not like you have to pay attention to those idiots.

3.) As for getting my daily done in Fractals or a dungeon… I don’t tell you how to play, don’t tell me how to play. I have neither the time or desire to spend hours finding, coordinating and completing one or two dungeons per day – especially after working all day, dealing with family needs, fixing dinner and children issues. I want to chill out and relax with a game.

Goodness, I wasn’t telling you how to play the game. It was merely one suggestion. You don’t need to take offense to every little post on these forums.

1. You should be able to leave your character next to a karma vendor or really anywhere that you know where monsters don’t spawn and be safe. I’m not saying leave it there for a half an hour, just long enough to go grab yourself a drink or something.

2. Forgive me for using a term that you object to. I may not have to pay attention to them, but it’s typically really hard to miss those /say bubbles when they’re in the middle of your screen and full of angry words.

3. I wasn’t telling anyone how to play this game. Climb down off your high horse for five minutes, please. I get that you work hard and want to unwind with a game after a long day. I’m not saying everyone should go and run fractals/dungeons to do this daily, merely that most of the people who complete this daily by going to lower level zones on their 80 toon just to find that mass of dead NPCs to rez have other options. Mostly because those people play for hours a day anyway.

I don’t give a kitten how you play your game. There’s just no need to be an kitten and purposely kill other players for your own selfish reasons. There’s no justification for that sort of behavior.

^This

I can see your argument…but now I don’t care.