Guild Wars 2

The utility skill shadow return is the most overpower utility skill there is in GW2.

Lets see what this skill does:

1.- Shadow steps by 1200 units (gets away from attackers/misdirects the attackers) and becomes a shadow return.
2.- Breaks stuns
3.- Returns to starting position, hence misdirecting the attacker(es) again.
4.- break stuns AGAIN
5.- Cures 3 conditions.
6.- Cooldown on the skill is: drum rolls………………………………….) 50 seconds

Face palm.

Now lets compare it to some warrior utility skills.

Endure pain

1.- Immune to damage for 4 seconds (but still takes damage from conditions (Facepalm))
2.- Breaks stuns
3.- Cooldown of skill is: Drum Rolls……………………………… 60 seconds (THe kitten is this?)

Fear Me
1.- induces fear on enemies (misses if blinded)
2.- Cooldown is 60 seconds (THe kitten is this? it better be a programing error)

In general, any utility skill has only

1.- An X effect
2.- A Y effect

And that is why Shadow return needs a nerf!

“God does not play dice with the universe”

Albert Einstein.

Hitman.5829:

“God does not play dice with the universe”

Albert Einstein.

“He plays darts.”

Me.

Care to compare Signet of Shadows to Signet of Air?

Perhaps warrior needs better players?

Hitman, you clearly never have played a thief at all.
Thiefs are SUPPOSED to be hard to catch, very agile and swift.
This is one of the very few skills that allows for that and is still easily counterable for Condition Spammers with lots of CC’s like chill, cripple, knockdowns/launches.

Other classes like warriors, guardians, eles, the new necromancers, mesmers and a very specific engineer build are way more “extremly overpowered” to say it in your words, than the thief is, as those overpowered mechanics lead to easy instant kills and not just are about condition removal and movement that makes no wins alone…

Not to mention that thiefs are by far not the best class, when it comes down to condition removal and if you try to solve that lack a bit, then you will clearly miss on important stats for either power or precision or you will miss on your important survival skill shadow refuge that can alsos provide a bit of group support or you’ll miss on movement speed by not having the 25% increase..
You can’t have everything…

L2P vs thiefs that use this utility skill and play more of a survival build, because a thief that uses this skill, is purely made for better survival and will therefore lack either in two things of eiher power, precision, speed or an important self heal…

Most people will always use at least 1 signet to lose either not the power or the critical hit chance for doing more damage and if you fight against a true survival thief, then their second choice will always be for the refuge, as they will run 50% fasteer when it stealth and use otherwise for short sprints the swiftness on dodge roll trait together with the signet of agility/precision …

TL;DR

“OMG! THE HIGHEST COMBAT MOBILITY CLASS HAS THE HIGHEST COMBAT MOBILITY!! NERF IT ANET!!”

Hitman.5829:

“God does not play dice with the universe”

Albert Einstein.

“Stop telling God what to do!”
Niels Bohr

Thieves have already been nerfed the most I don’t believe they need anymore. As many already stated, it’s part of their gameplay to be elusive and evasive. Removing to much of that will give them no purpose.

I’m sure it’s very frustrating to have all that cc and this dps and yet some thieves elude you, but I’m pretty sure they are working as intended.

Better luck next time.

Orpheal.8263:

Hitman, you clearly never have played a thief at all.
Thiefs are SUPPOSED to be hard to catch, very agile and swift.
This is one of the very few skills that allows for that and is still easily counterable for Condition Spammers with lots of CC’s like chill, cripple, knockdowns/launches.

Other classes like warriors, guardians, eles, the new necromancers, mesmers and a very specific engineer build are way more “extremly overpowered” to say it in your words, than the thief is, as those overpowered mechanics lead to easy instant kills and not just are about condition removal and movement that makes no wins alone…

Not to mention that thiefs are by far not the best class, when it comes down to condition removal and if you try to solve that lack a bit, then you will clearly miss on important stats for either power or precision or you will miss on your important survival skill shadow refuge that can alsos provide a bit of group support or you’ll miss on movement speed by not having the 25% increase..
You can’t have everything…

L2P vs thiefs that use this utility skill and play more of a survival build, because a thief that uses this skill, is purely made for better survival and will therefore lack either in two things of eiher power, precision, speed or an important self heal…

Most people will always use at least 1 signet to lose either not the power or the critical hit chance for doing more damage and if you fight against a true survival thief, then their second choice will always be for the refuge, as they will run 50% fasteer when it stealth and use otherwise for short sprints the swiftness on dodge roll trait together with the signet of agility/precision …

The point here is that Shadow return is extremely over powered. Lets not change the conversation!

A utility skill is overpowered if it has more than 3 uses, lets see what Shadow Return does:

• 2 stun breakers
• 3 condition removals
• 1200 units range evasion
• 1200 units range evasion AGAIN
  *50 Second cooldown

In total it has 6 uses. THAT IS: on average, this utility skill is equivalent to 3 normal utility skills.

And that is why it needs a nerf.

Imagine the rage it would cause if the warrior Endure Pain utility had these:

• 2 stun breakers
• Remove 3 conditions
• Immune to damage
  AND 50 second cooldown.

Lady Minuit.3186:

Thieves have already been nerfed the most

Someone hasn’t been looking at Mesmer since launch. Phantasms will just be weaker clones at this rate.

The reason Shadowstep/return has such abilities w/50 second cooldown is cause unlike endure pain Ensures no damage, shadow return can get you in trouble is used at the wrong time, both can be outwitted, and both have their times of need.

as for fear, it controls other players, sending them walking away from it’s user. controlling a player is considered very powerfull, thus the cooldown.

Flissy.4093:

Lady Minuit.3186:

Thieves have already been nerfed the most

Someone hasn’t been looking at Mesmer since launch. Phantasms will just be weaker clones at this rate.

Someone hasn’t been paying attention to thief patches.

Yeah Thiefs can be annoying, but if your a gaurdian or a warrior with high toughness you really dont need to worry too much about their damage. their damage output(for most thiefs) are backstab, kite them out of stealth, dont sit still and you wont have much of a problem.

Oh noes! Hitman is complaining about another skill someone used to beat him with. Will wonders never cease? Cause I’d really like it if they would…

Hitman.5829:

The point here is that Shadow return is extremely over powered. Lets not change the conversation!

A utility skill is overpowered if it has more than 3 uses, lets see what Shadow Return does:

• 2 stun breakers
• 3 condition removals
• 1200 units range evasion
• 1200 units range evasion AGAIN
  *50 Second cooldown

In total it has 6 uses. THAT IS: on average, this utility skill is equivalent to 3 normal utility skills.

And that is why it needs a nerf.

-snip-

I’m sorry, I can’t seem to follow your math. How does 3(maybe 4) = 6? or is the cd a use? Is the range a use? I can see MAYBE 5…but 6? You also need to use both abilities within 10 seconds of each other…and if people are smart, they can camp his spawn point guaranteeing that you won’t use the second ability. Please stop posting about every ability your class does not have…unless you want to play a game where everyone can do everything?

the 50 second cooldown is actually pretty long, sure it’s a great escape but if the theif returns back he no longer has a way to break the next stun and is for the most part dead meat.

It’s actually not a 50 second cooldown. Because the power lasts for 10 seconds it’s a 50-60 second cooldown depending on IF he uses the return. If he doesn’t use the return he waited 10 seconds with nothing and then has 50 seconds added on top of that. So it’s the same.

It doesn’t drop conditions as a matter of course, so you can’t cite that as a basic function of the power. It is a stun break, but lots of things are stun breaks. Looking at my guardian I’ve got two stun breaks out by default, both of which have no activate time and give me a bunch of boons in the process.

It only actually does one thing. It teleports you, and then potentially teleports you back. Unlike leap powers, though, it can only teleport you along the ground without any gaps or ledges involved. So that’s its limiting factor.

So, based on your own criteria it isn’t OP because it only does two things. It moves your character and it breaks stuns. Glad we cleared that up.

Comparing skills/traits between different professions is pointless. It’s apples to oranges. Every skill/trait has to be taken from the perspective of the whole profession. One profession’s evade may be incredible compared to another, while it lacks any vigor generation or stability access that another profession has.