Guild Wars 2

This is copied from a previous post of mine.

@DevilLordLazer " ..It’d be much more preferable (to me, at least), for ArenaNet to work on expanding Orr, perhaps fill it out into something of an endless WvW competition against the undead. Fight to hold ground, perhaps even to earn and retain WvW-like bonuses that apply only to players in the Orrian areas, thus giving them an incentive to hang around and contribute. Something active, with tangible and immediate benefits which are nonetheless not critical to one’s enjoyment of the game…"

You, sir, deserve all of the win. This would be a perfect step towards bolstering end-game content in GW2. Absolutely the right direction in my opinion. Add in some Orr-siege-only crafting mats for very cool Orr related gear (of similiar stats to already existing gear, it can just be aesthetically / ego pleasing) or Orr-siege-DE bosses that are summoned / released due to players pushing to certain strongholds, killing undead lietenants or sub-bosses, holding key areas for an hour or more (difficulty of undead waves would have to increase over that time in order to make failure possible), etc… These bosses could drop legendary fluff items (mini-pets, deployable fog for minor visual obstruction in PvP and atmosphere in RP, Risen form potions, that kind of thing) / aesthetically pleasing armour and weapons, etc…

I’d like to see non-fortress oriented objectives as well. Adding in ruins from some magically or spiritually impressive (evil or good, both have merit for an impressive sub-plot) marine civilization that had begun to colonize Orr when it was beneath the waves could be a great setting for a DE. While the undead have been trying to breach the ruins perimeter, darn those pesky wards, the players may also have to breach it themselves or defend it from the zombie horde. Alternatively, it could just be a necropolis of Orr which housed some honourable Paladin king/s or a magical, Sylvari grove they surreptitiously attempted to grow for the purpose of cleansing Orr (maybe just part of it in order to utilize the area as a place for the defenders of Tyria to use as a camp / fortress / magical experiment) . At the heart of this DE would be some terrible cursed object or a weapon enchanted with powerful arcane runes or the long suffering ghost of an enormously powerful god-king, valiant or otherwise, who can summon part of his ancient army (this last one would make for a really fun twist in a DE as it would add a transient third faction to help tip the scales or to add to the chaos). Maybe some risen or acolytes of Zhaitan could just be in some out-of-the-way corrupt ritual grounds. Generally raising hell, so to speak.

DEs which utilize multiple key locations at one time and multiple hostile attacks would force the players to strategize, to split up and to prioritize the map as well as their own forces. Having a giant roving horde, from which the hostile forces come from, existing and open to attack from players gives us options, such as defending or attempting to harry the horde or strike it head on in the hopes that we don’t get slaughtered. Maybe that horde is actually stationed behind an imposing, spiked wall with manned towers.

The element of choice is what makes an event really dynamic, not just the resulting consequences. So far I haven’t run into any DE that really takes advantage of this. There are far too many phases of DEs that just send the player zerg rush to another location with one objective. As much fun as it is to spill into a centaur village and instinctively break off into smaller groups to chase down enemies, slaughter their creatures (kitten you little chicken!) and race through their encampment in some blood lust twisted desire to explore, it isn’t challenging or at all tactical. Choice and challenging encounters are a must for these. If communication isn’t necessary than it’s too simple.

Cont…

Greed is a powerful driving force and previous MMOs have used their player’s greed shamelessly to cover up their lack of innovative, imaginative, quality content. It’s the same for our vanity. While I’ll be the first to admit that I adore seeing amazing armour and weapon designs, working for it and, ultimately, getting those pieces, it shouldn’t be the reason most of the group is even bothering with the content. Unfortunately, it often becomes the main reason players even log on to those MMOs. It becomes the game for them.

Raids are just large dance routines that everybody learns and repeats ad nauseum, while the person yelling commands over vent or mumbles gives you your cues. Learning those encounters is usually fun, but they get old really fast which forces developers to constantly push out more and more content. This trivializes what you’ve done (and to a degree the rest of the game) while making future content less and less original. The bosses you kill, the gear you get, it’s all dropped in a heart beat for something with more stats. The Elder God C’thun in AQ (WoW for the few that don’t know it) becomes Patchwerks kitten due to gear progression. Such a concept would be depressing and utterly ridiculous if the gear you were trying to get wasn’t so alluring.

End game content should be iconic, it should be inspiring, it should stir up some emotions and leave players with some epic memories. Without the ungodly trinity we are no longer so kitten focused on step, step, spin, step, step, stay out of fire, dip. Nailing those rotations, taunts, 30% CD blowing, dance routines is no longer the source of so much of our attention. This means we need alternative goals in end game content. Our memories of epic moments will have to be due to far more organic actions, encounters and group cooperation. Creating organic content to match these new aspects of end-game is the direction Anet will have to explore.

I don’t envy them this extremely difficult undertaking. They have so few sources to rip off, which is a perfectly valid and time honoured tradition in humanity’s creative pursuits. However, I am thoroughly looking forward to seeing what the future has in store for GW2. The possibilities are absolutely phenomenal!

TL:DR You just missed out, lazy bugger.

Making an unending campaign through dynamic equilibrium could be achieved by the starting Tyrian position being nearly unassailable, while the starting Undead position is equally unassailable. By contrast the no-man’s-land in the middle would be balanced, and there would be a continuum of balance between the two sides. The task of the players to defend the Tyrian side would get progressively easier the farther back they are pushed, while the task of the players to defeat the undead would likewise become progressively harder the further into the undead territory they were able to penetrate.

The simplest arrangement would be a mountain range, foothills, a plain, more foothills, and another mountain range. The mountain ranges would be really tough to attack, the foothills less so, and the plain is wide open. But any arrangement with similar properties would work as well. It would create a natural ebb and flow as the number of players in the game changed during the day and week, even without events. Yet at the same time, the area would never be unplayable simply because there were not enough players—the front line would just move back til they reached an equilibrium that the players could maintain. Then the events could mix this up further to keep things interesting.

Periods of very low concurrency can be really frustrating when there are not enough players on a map to complete group events because the players are spread out too much to take on challenges like champions supported by adds. Making the map roughly trianglular would help. Then as the players were pushed back by the undead they would be concentrated in a smaller map area with a narrower front where they could work together more effectively. Similarly, the triangular shape would help with large numbers of players because those players would then have more room and be less concentrated when more of the map was conquered.

Conversely, if the strength of the undead side was a final line of mutually supporting fortresses arrayed in depth, this would mean that storming the fortresses would require a very large number of very powerful and motivated players since they would not be able to defeat the defensive line piecemeal, and any temporary successes would be dislodged by counterattacks supported by the remaining fortresses if less than total victory was achieved. Eventually the players would presumably get strong enough and organized enough to overcome the final position. Of course, surely there would be another challenge waiting beyond!

Conquering undead strongpoints might require not just attacking the surface fortifications but also completing underground instances. If these were procedurally generated tunnel complexes (cuz you know, they keep getting destroyed by the war and rebuilt…) that would be awesome. Nevertheless, since these would only be available while the players were in control of the surface fortification (the game could give a couple of hours grace period before a counter-attack was staged so it wouldn’t be necessary to leave players on the surface), we wouldn’t be repetitively playing them over and over anyway. The instances for the harder to conquer fortifications could be a real treat to finally explore. Once the area was finally conquered then we could do the repetitive instance running ad nausium.

Perhaps the complexes for the smaller fortresses in the no-man’s land could be procedurally generated while those for major fortresses in the enemy’s main defensive line could be more elaborate permenant instances. The latter could have much more impressive loot and because players would have fewer opportunities to run these, the rewards wouldn’t have to be as random. Also the offensives that would have the opportunity to conquer these could be planned events that would be that much more of a draw because of the relatively rare opportunity to access these instances. Once the map was conquered the instances would revert to normal level of loot since players would be able to run them over and over again.

You’ve made some excellent suggestions I would adore taking part in this nigh-unending sub-zone warfare! The idea of fighting over no man’s land, complete with enemy counter attacks, is exactly the kind of PvE content this game is in a unique position to make the most of.

Taking dilapidated tors from undead champions / sub-bosses, defending them from the Risen as they attempt to retake it, all the while having multiple player groups holding the line or sending in assault teams to hit weakened enemy positions…this would be glorious I think giving the undead a set, though large, number of units, siege weapons / defenses and champions would be for the best. That way there will be a definite sense of progress.

After an arduous campaign, the players can be rewarded by entering into a small instance with an epic boss or an open world castle / crypt / dungeon where they can face a boss who scales stat wise (not just health) or, maybe adds a mechanic or two, depending on the number of players. Nothing says anticlimactic like an awesome boss with far too much health who WILL be killed by the zerg no matter how much health he has. Upon defeat it all resets. If he is not defeated within an hour or two of his location being breached or him becoming activated via battle, then the whole thing can reset once again. Having it reset on a set timer is just begging for everything to reset before players can finish the event and get their rewards.