Guild Wars 2

Why is Thief only one proffesion without weapon range 1200?
All other profesion have at least 1 weapon with range 1200 or trait

thief have trait for bow making +5% damage, give this trait change bow range to 1200

Technically, Cluster Bomb has a range of 1200.

Thieves aren’t supposed to be able ranged combat really. Notice they dont get any long ranged weapons; (*short*bow, pistols, not rifles). Thieves are supposed to get up in peoples faces, do large amounts of damage and lay conditions.

and? warrior and guard too ,still they have it!

ZeRen.7265:

and? warrior and guard too ,still they have it!

Warriors have long ranged weapons *Long*bow and rifle. Therefore it makes sense. You’ll have to explain the guardian thing to me, as they have no long ranged weapon other than a sceptor. Like I said, thieves need to get close up and deal high and quick damage. Thats their role.

oh yes, warrior is close combat fighter(thats warrior mean) and long range weapon for him really make sence(yes its sarcasm)

and guard have sceptor, and staff 2-skill has recharge 3sec and range 1200, but thief has none! I just want what other profesions have and change the trait isn´t difficult and dont giving him advantage

you dont playing thief,are you?

Uhh Ze, you made his point with the guardian comment. Staff 2 has 1200 range. Cluster Bomb has a range of 1200. If you want to increase the range of the thief’s normal weapons, you also have to do the same for the Guardian. And let me ask you…do you REALLY want a Guardian to have more range?

warrior and guardian are much much better on melee.

Thief functions well on range as well as melee.

There’s a difference.

Thieves lack long range single target attacks. On WvW sieges, when they can’t go down and they are too high, they can only spam one skill, and nothing else, wile all the other professions can do plenty in range.

They need the rifle so they can take out single targets with sniping. Because one of the themes of the Thief is assassination with “Deadly Arts”, and in a world where there’s rifles, there’s few things that fit that better than a sniper rifle.

I suggested here and there possible versions of rifle skills for the thief, and to my surprise, a very similar set of skills was added:
- The Snowball Mayhem Scout.
These skills are too powerful, but they are a perfect starting point for a thief rifle skill set:

• One quick hip shot (1200 range).
• One very-low accuracy spray & pray attack (900). 4 initiative
• One evasive action (900). 5 initiative
• One sniping. (1500) Consume all initiative, and charged damage with 3 stages of charging, with values similar to warrior’s adrenaline stages in their adrenaline attach. Also, using it would make the thief revealed for 10 seconds. High risk->High reward.
• And one support skill (PBAoE) (This one I’d make it give Camouflage instead Stealth, so you can’t both hide and move)

ZeRen.7265:

oh yes, warrior is close combat fighter(thats warrior mean) and long range weapon for him really make sence(yes its sarcasm)

and guard have sceptor, and staff 2-skill has recharge 3sec and range 1200, but thief has none! I just want what other profesions have and change the trait isn´t difficult and dont giving him advantage

you dont playing thief,are you?

guardians/warrs are severly lacking gap closers/escape mechanisms when compared to thief.
thief can go stealth,shadowstep(hello infiltrators arrow/steal) or scorpion wire to mitigate the distance

warr has… gs (melee) as reliable gap closers, both their ranged options lack any mobility.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

ZeRen.7265:

oh yes, warrior is close combat fighter(thats warrior mean) and long range weapon for him really make sence(yes its sarcasm)

and guard have sceptor, and staff 2-skill has recharge 3sec and range 1200, but thief has none! I just want what other profesions have and change the trait isn´t difficult and dont giving him advantage

you dont playing thief,are you?

guardians/warrs are severly lacking gap closers/escape mechanisms when compared to thief.
thief can go stealth,shadowstep(hello infiltrators arrow/steal) or scorpion wire to mitigate the distance

warr has… gs (melee) as reliable gap closers, both their ranged options lack any mobility.

Your health pool and traits well then make up for a slight difference in mobility. Not saying thieves need 1200, thats a bit much for us. But atleast 1000, that 100 range difference is huge in WvW. We got a single 1200 range weapon skill, which takes about 2 or so seconds to even reach that distance on a leveled field.It just doesn’t compare to the other professions with 1000-1200 base range. Plus going up front as thief isn’t very smart in WvW unless your survival built, have signet of malice, and use dagger storm.

And on a side note, why is SB on rangers the same range as longbow? Where is the thinking? I wana give LB some hope but SB has quick attacks, mobility, all 1200 range, and poison (-33% healing is quite helpful). SB on ranger should maybe have some 1200 range skills but should be more so 1000 range. Give some incentive towards LB other than barrage. Not suggesting change LB, but SB does need a range decrease for how much dmg it puts out.

NinjaEd.3946:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

ZeRen.7265:

oh yes, warrior is close combat fighter(thats warrior mean) and long range weapon for him really make sence(yes its sarcasm)

and guard have sceptor, and staff 2-skill has recharge 3sec and range 1200, but thief has none! I just want what other profesions have and change the trait isn´t difficult and dont giving him advantage

you dont playing thief,are you?

guardians/warrs are severly lacking gap closers/escape mechanisms when compared to thief.
thief can go stealth,shadowstep(hello infiltrators arrow/steal) or scorpion wire to mitigate the distance

warr has… gs (melee) as reliable gap closers, both their ranged options lack any mobility.

Your health pool and traits well then make up for a slight difference in mobility. Not saying thieves need 1200, thats a bit much for us. But atleast 1000, that 100 range difference is huge in WvW. We got a single 1200 range weapon skill, which takes about 2 or so seconds to even reach that distance on a leveled field.It just doesn’t compare to the other professions with 1000-1200 base range. Plus going up front as thief isn’t very smart in WvW unless your survival built, have signet of malice, and use dagger storm.

And on a side note, why is SB on rangers the same range as longbow? Where is the thinking? I wana give LB some hope but SB has quick attacks, mobility, all 1200 range, and poison (-33% healing is quite helpful). SB on ranger should maybe have some 1200 range skills but should be more so 1000 range. Give some incentive towards LB other than barrage. Not suggesting change LB, but SB does need a range decrease for how much dmg it puts out.

health pool and traits nowhere near make up for the difference in mobility, thieves can stealth and drop all the people targetting them and/or shadow step away including more access to dodges
thief shouldnt be going straight up against a zerg, no class should be able to do that (a warr or guardian who runs out front normally gets focused and killed (unless they have insane survivability; inwhich case they wont be doing much damage anyway) theif (imo) should be picking off players seperated from the herd then retreating to safety

- i agree with you about ranger shortbow (although most rangers with LB use the 1500 range trait), it could do with a range decrease

ZeRen.7265:

Why is Thief only one proffesion without weapon range 1200?
All other profesion have at least 1 weapon with range 1200 or trait

thief have trait for bow making +5% damage, give this trait change bow range to 1200

The thief is a profession that can easily close the distance between themselves and their target. Giving them a chance to use that speed to range kite people does not seem fair and balanced.

AwwGee.5628:

warrior and guardian are much much better on melee.

Thief functions well on range as well as melee.

There’s a difference.

Explain how thieves function well with range if the closest thing they have is a shortbow which can’t shoot far enough as it is. They were given close-range weaponry for a reason.

Taril.8619:

Technically, Cluster Bomb has a range of 1200.

To be even more technical, a properly detonated Cluster Bomb will go even farther.

-as I said Guardian has scepter, thief has none(and cluster bomb is too slow for long range fire-try it,you will see), Guardian dont need longer range, but trait for faster orbs on scepter…

guard and warr are effective at long range as thief ( but he cant fight long range) and about escaping to safety guard and warr have better armor,thief invisibility and he die faster

900 range is too low, mostly agains bosses! you have to keep distance ,with thief its harder becouse he is fragile

Thief have more access to dodge? intresting, my guard has vigor all time,my ele can has vigor even for 51sec, so where is the more access? Thief have nothing for pernament vigor like guard,ele, mesmer ,but he doing that another way

The point is that thieves are not a ranged class and therefore should not get extended range that you want. If they were meant to be standing at a distance, they would have been given a bow or a rifle. Thieves are supposed to stealth in, do a huge deal of damage, and then get out quickly since they’re defense is low. The shortbow they have is mainly for conditions, not far-ranged combat. I play a thief, so I’m not just speculating. The daggers, sword, and pistols they have are short-ranged/melee combat weapons as well. So theres really no purpose to give them extended range; they’re supposed to be up in your face.

No. There are not ‘ranged’ and ‘melee’ professions. All professions are both ranged and melee. So “Thieves not being a ranged class” is not a point.

When it comes to range, there’s only one professions that stands out: rangers are the long range specialists, and that’s why they can have so may longbow attacks with 1500 range, once traited.
For all other professions, except thieves, there’s 900 and 1200 range skills, some traited, some not.

Thieves may be more about jumping around in the battlefield and closing distances with shadowsteps. But that doesn’t mean they should be left from something all the other professions have.
In the same way elementalists were left out being the only ones without 50% fall damage, thieves are left out being the only ones without a weapon with single target attacks and 1200 range in the auto-attack.
Any other profession can pull an enemy from a group with a 1200 range attack. Thieves would need that enemy to be away from the rest enough to hit it with the border of an AoE.
That got fixed, so should this.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Feline_Grace
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vigorous_Recovery (10 seconds of vigor every 15 seconds with signet of malice/withdraw)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bountiful_Theft (15 seconds every 32-45 seconds)

also;
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Scorpion_Wire (1200 range)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Long_Reach (1200 gap closer)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infiltrator%27s_Arrow (900 range; more than offsets the 300 -600 if LB ranger- difference, it puts thieves at a disadvatage (less initiative) at the start of a battle sure; but the same can be said of any class who gets attacked out of the blue by a stealth thief) and can be followed up with http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infiltrator%27s_Strike / http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadow_Shot for gap closure

you could argue that other classes should have gap closers like these, and anet could give them to toher classes to make EVERY class the exact same, but that would be stupid and boring, thief is FINE with 900 range (ive played with thieves on bosses that they ‘needed’ the range for they were perfectly fine spamming clusterbomb for it)

Even though I think that Thieves are kittenly OP, they should have 1200 range option for PvE/WvW – even if it is as bad as the Guardian scepter. How about a trait that increases the range of Pistols and/or Bows to 1200, but reduces the damage by 25%?

It would be the laziest band-aid patch I could think of, but at least it could be implemented in a reasonable time and – most importantly – would not require to design a whole weapon set.

MithranArkanere.8957:

When it comes to range, there’s only one professions that stands out: rangers are the long range specialists, and that’s why they can have so may longbow attacks with 1500 range, once traited.
For all other professions, except thieves, there’s 900 and 1200 range skills, some traited, some not.

A bit off-topic, but there’s two long range classes. I love throwing my grenades 1500 feet far as an engineer

Linguistically Inept.6583:

[…]
you could argue that other classes should have gap closers like these, and anet could give them to toher classes to make EVERY class the exact same, but that would be stupid and boring, thief is FINE with 900 range (ive played with thieves on bosses that they ‘needed’ the range for they were perfectly fine spamming clusterbomb for it)

No, you could not, because it’s not 7 professions having gap closers and one not having them.
Actually, from Leap of Faith to Necrotic traversal, all professions have some form of gap closer.
There isn’t one that does not have a way to get closer to the target. Thieves just make it better.

But in the same way rangers have a ‘especialty’ in long range weapons archery (oh, well, and engineers long range AoEs), thieves have a especially in gap closers.

Not having a 1200 range weapon it’s not a specialty. It’s a deficiency.
Imagine if all the others had at least one way to deal stun, or some form of CC but one, or all had a way to deal contidions but one, or all had at least a weapon with direct damage and no damage over time conditions but one…
But that doesn’t happen, because there’s very few “all but one” things. There’s some “some but not all” like with Stealth or Invulnerability, but very few “all but one”.
There was the 50% fall damage one that left elementalists out, and that got fixed.
This will have to be fixed too sooner or later.

Giving them the option for a rifle would not take anything from them or the other professions. Done right, it would only add to the game.
Thieves are also the profession with less weapon combinations after elementalists and engineers, but they have kits and attunements, and thieves don’t even have 4 slots to store 4 different stolen skills. They are the best candidate to be the first one to get a new weapon .

And well, sooner or later new weapons will have to be given, or things may start getting stagnant.
It may take a year or 5 or 10, but I’m sure it’ll eventually happen.

i find it simply astonishing that i can play my thief, lvl 80 tyvm, at her “short range” JUST fine. i find it even more astonishing that her range and/or lack thereof felt “natural” and “right” and “correct” to me.

i find it laughable that the cry for “it’s not fffaaaaaiiiiiirrrrrrrrr!!!” is, in this case, applied to an in-your-face-and-dance-away profession, rather than the usual “balance” complaints one generally sees.

thanks for the new twist and added humor!

MithranArkanere.8957:

No. There are not ‘ranged’ and ‘melee’ professions. All professions are both ranged and melee. So “Thieves not being a ranged class” is not a point.

When it comes to range, there’s only one professions that stands out: rangers are the long range specialists, and that’s why they can have so may longbow attacks with 1500 range, once traited.
For all other professions, except thieves, there’s 900 and 1200 range skills, some traited, some not.

Thieves may be more about jumping around in the battlefield and closing distances with shadowsteps. But that doesn’t mean they should be left from something all the other professions have.
In the same way elementalists were left out being the only ones without 50% fall damage, thieves are left out being the only ones without a weapon with single target attacks and 1200 range in the auto-attack.
Any other profession can pull an enemy from a group with a 1200 range attack. Thieves would need that enemy to be away from the rest enough to hit it with the border of an AoE.
That got fixed, so should this.

Basically, what you are saying is that because other classes have 1200 range, thieves should get it as well? I find that similar to someone saying Guardians, Waariors, and Mesmers don’t get that 25% movement increase; but the other classes have it, so we should give it to them.

Thieves have high dps output; they’re not supposed to be out that far from their enemies doing a ton of damage. Having the dps output they have must be compensated in something; which is their defense. However, if you have that damage at a further distance, plus stealthing and shadowstepping, the low defense becomes negligible; you couldn’t even hit them at that rate. That would give melee users a huge disadvantage in confrontations. Thats just how I see it. Many people can play a thief the way it is now perfectley fine; there is nothing wrong with their range, and should not be adjusted.

xCrusadentx.2784:

Thieves have high dps output; they’re not supposed to be out that far from their enemies doing a ton of damage. Having the dps output they have must be compensated in something; which is their defense. However, if you have that damage at a further distance, plus stealthing and shadowstepping, the low defense becomes negligible; you couldn’t even hit them at that rate. That would give melee users a huge disadvantage in confrontations. Thats just how I see it. Many people can play a thief the way it is now perfectley fine; there is nothing wrong with their range, and should not be adjusted.

well of that would truely be a probelm the solution is VERY simple… give whatever weapon with the 1200 range less dmg than the others (whihc generally is the case already for the other professions anyway. I really do wonder if those ppl saying thiefs dont need 1200 range weapons have ever tried to do any real keep sieges in wvw? 900 range as attacker will get you killed in a few seconds, as a defenders you simply wont hit anything but those that stand almost at the base of your walls

Thieves do not need 1200 range, and I only play a thief. Twin pistols is all the range I need.

GummiBear.2756:

xCrusadentx.2784:

Thieves have high dps output; they’re not supposed to be out that far from their enemies doing a ton of damage. Having the dps output they have must be compensated in something; which is their defense. However, if you have that damage at a further distance, plus stealthing and shadowstepping, the low defense becomes negligible; you couldn’t even hit them at that rate. That would give melee users a huge disadvantage in confrontations. Thats just how I see it. Many people can play a thief the way it is now perfectley fine; there is nothing wrong with their range, and should not be adjusted.

well of that would truely be a probelm the solution is VERY simple… give whatever weapon with the 1200 range less dmg than the others (whihc generally is the case already for the other professions anyway. I really do wonder if those ppl saying thiefs dont need 1200 range weapons have ever tried to do any real keep sieges in wvw? 900 range as attacker will get you killed in a few seconds, as a defenders you simply wont hit anything but those that stand almost at the base of your walls

Thats not really the answer to the issue at hand. Thieves are meant to have high dps. Take that away and give them more range? Thats pretty much taking away from what the thief is supposed to be. The high dps is a feature of the class, and should not be touched either.
You have to consider things other than WvWvW and taking down doors. PvE confrontations, pvp in WvWvW, etc. The thief’s range is perfectely acceptable to that dps that is guaranteed from playing the class. I like my thief the way he is now, I really don’t wish to see this implemented.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

NinjaEd.3946:

Linguistically Inept.6583:

ZeRen.7265:

oh yes, warrior is close combat fighter(thats warrior mean) and long range weapon for him really make sence(yes its sarcasm)

and guard have sceptor, and staff 2-skill has recharge 3sec and range 1200, but thief has none! I just want what other profesions have and change the trait isn´t difficult and dont giving him advantage

you dont playing thief,are you?

guardians/warrs are severly lacking gap closers/escape mechanisms when compared to thief.
thief can go stealth,shadowstep(hello infiltrators arrow/steal) or scorpion wire to mitigate the distance

warr has… gs (melee) as reliable gap closers, both their ranged options lack any mobility.

Your health pool and traits well then make up for a slight difference in mobility. Not saying thieves need 1200, thats a bit much for us. But atleast 1000, that 100 range difference is huge in WvW. We got a single 1200 range weapon skill, which takes about 2 or so seconds to even reach that distance on a leveled field.It just doesn’t compare to the other professions with 1000-1200 base range. Plus going up front as thief isn’t very smart in WvW unless your survival built, have signet of malice, and use dagger storm.

And on a side note, why is SB on rangers the same range as longbow? Where is the thinking? I wana give LB some hope but SB has quick attacks, mobility, all 1200 range, and poison (-33% healing is quite helpful). SB on ranger should maybe have some 1200 range skills but should be more so 1000 range. Give some incentive towards LB other than barrage. Not suggesting change LB, but SB does need a range decrease for how much dmg it puts out.

(a warr or guardian who runs out front normally gets focused and killed (unless they have insane survivability; inwhich case they wont be doing much damage anyway) theif (imo) should be picking off players seperated from the herd then retreating to safety

Exactly, If I had a silver for every time I’ve watched a Guardian or Warrior run into the heart of a zerg, grab all the attention (smart move, lets their team move up a little) and walk away without dieing or lasting for an unnecessary amount of time I’d buy a Legendary by now. Now they can either run up and be ridiculous surival, or stay back with 1000-1200 range and still be insnae survival. Thief may have some good damage vs. a survival build, but survival builds also outlast most thieves dmg if they good regardless of the thief’s dmg. They just take soo much, and wiggle power/precision/crit builds to the ground and win. Again, I don’t think 1200 range is necessary for thief as making all professions have access to this range is kinda blan and boring… no real diversity there. But ATLEAST 1000 range base. 1200 range cluster bomb is fine, but maybe make the sb the long range weapon for thieves and leave pistol at 900 due to its high dps. Remember, the SB on thief has horrible dps at range, no matter if they increased it to 1000 or 1200, but atleast being able to tickle people with it from afar is necessary. (Poison only works good on cond build, dodge shot puts more distance between you so…., and basic attack is puny in dmg no matter if you’re power or not, and cluster bomb takes its long intrepid time to get to that 1200 mark which most likely by then the enemy will see and just move to the side

xCrusadentx.2784:

[…]

Four professions not having one thing is not the same as ONE not having it.
The “thing” in your example is ‘constant speed boost’. 4 professions have constant speed boosts in signets. There’s also other constant speed boosts in traits, but they are negligible or affect professions that already have a signet, or work only during combat.
All professions have quite some speed boosts in one form or another. All have swiftness.

To be ‘left out’ a profession would have to be the only one not able to do that. For example, if all professions got a 25% speed signet… but engineers, since they don’t have signets.
Then you’ll have to make something like a trait that gives them 25% while having a gadget equipped, or giving gadgets passive effects and putting 25% speed the rocket boots, or giving them a new type of skill that has a passive effect instead an tool belt skill, and stuff like that.

And what counts is the result. Not the way to do it.
If all professions but one where able to stun, that doesn’t mean all should have stun, because stun is a type of CC. The result of a CC is interruptions and crowd control. So if that other profession had other forms of CC like daze, fear push, pulls, etc, then they won’t be left out.

Coming up with examples of that is hard, because there’s very few things that left out a single profession.

I come back to the 50% fall damage example. Only elementalists were left out, now they are not. Why? Because that was something only one profession couldn’t replicate in any form. There was only one way to reduce fall damage, and elementalists didn’t have it. Where all other professions could jump down, elementalists could not.

All other professions can walk to a high hill, and use a single-target long range attack, and pull one enemy at that range, or stand in the tall walls of a WvW Keep and properly attack at enemies all the way down there.
Thieves can only use a single AoE in those cases, and nothing else.
If you increased the range of the shortbow that won’t do, as the thief’s shortbow is more for dealing degen, weakness and moving around in the battlefield, and its main attack is multi-target.
Neither with pistols, as they are designed to be that range. Increased their range would break the pistol’s design, and then you’ll need to replace the pistol.
If you can’t touch the range of any of the existing weapons too much, and they still lack a 1200 range single-target weapon attack compared to the rest, all that’s left is designing a new weapon.

Oh, and I always forget. Thieves DO have 1200 range weapon skills.
Underwater.
Underwater they may less choices for cloaking, but they can still use stealth underwater with traits and skills.
If restricted stealth allows for more range, then you just make a longer range ground weapon restrict stealth too, like adding longer Revealed to some of its skills, and making a snipe skill reveal you when you start to use it. The hard thing is coming up with a way, but all you have to do is think.

In GW2 you don’t stick to a definite theme. You keep an overall theme. Thieves are more about damage, criticals, conditions, survivability and stealth, but that doesn’t mean all weapons have to follow all of that, in the same way necromancers are more about damage through conditions with damage over time, but if you go dagger/axe + warhorn/focus, you’ll have no condition damage over time in your weapons at all.

Professions have themes. But it’s the weapon itself what’s melee or ranged, high-dps or low-dps, direct damage or damage over time, not the profession.
Then the rest of the build fine-tunes the weapon choice.

With thieves, pistols and short bows are short range. They are fine with that short range.
Thieves are fine with pistols and short bows.
But they are still left out missing that 1200 range, and for that, rifles would do perfectly.

All the reasons I’m seeing around against thieves getting rifles are from outmoded MMO mindset points of view. They are not assassins, or rogues or whatnots. They are GW2 thieves.
To see what fits GW2, first you switch to GW2 mentality. And then you see what’s missing. That works for both GW1, and for any other game for that matter.

My explanation does make some sense when you think of it in your terms; The thief as it stands is not a damage dealer from a distance; its given weapons that were purposely given a shorter range. The conclusion we then draw from that is that they are meant to be up close in a fight. If a thief were given a rifle, then they could have an option of range, as that is a long-range weapon; but because it doesn’t have it, you can’t expect a thief’s (player’s) self-determined role to be anything but close up attacks. Giving increased range isn’t the solution, as you said, pistols and shortbows are not weapons for distance. Give the thief a rifle with 1200 range, I won’t have too much of an issue.

Thief has to many skills anyways, and he can reach you in no time using hide, so that would be just insane, poke, run poke, run poke run…. it would be annoying … no way to get 1200 for thief because of Thief skills and mechanics. Thief need nerf, not buff..

Firelysm.4967:

Thief has to many skills anyways, and he can reach you in no time using hide, so that would be just insane, poke, run poke, run poke run…. it would be annoying … no way to get 1200 for thief because of Thief skills and mechanics. Thief need nerf, not buff..

Warriors have a lot of skills. Engineers have a lot of skills, even elementalists have a ton of skills. Thief simply does not. They don’t have too little skills, but they arn’t exceling over any profession in skill count. Rifle isn’t really stealthy or fitting to a thief tbh, plus if they added more weapon options I think most thieves would agree a melee would be the choice (DUAL SWORDS >< COMON ALREADY). SB is great aoe dmg, pistols have great single target skills with high dps. But out of those 10 weapon skills only 1 is above 900 range and its pathetic for thieves in wvw. Sure we can run in try living, but lets face it unless we use [Shadow Step] in and out with signet of malice and tons of dodges/evades we are targeted and will die fairly quick (fyi, thats only 1 real option for “ranged”) We can teleport farther than we can fire a bow. Ranger’s if traited can throw axes/daggers/torches farther than a thief can fire a bow or pistol, its not right. Anyone with knowledge of a thief can say single target dps, the SB is aweful so it makes the perfect canidate for the 1000 benchmark it deserves. The dmg is weak, but atleast we can lightly slap our target back while they continue to hit us. 1200 range isn’t necessary but 1000 for a slow, weak single target weapon.. I see nothing unbalanced at all about that.

If ¹, ³, and ⁴ were at 1000 range that would be more than enough. Teleport is fine, shouldn’t be able to teleport 1200 units 3 times anyways and cluster bomb is fine where its at although it is slow traveling.

xCrusadentx.2784:

GummiBear.2756:

xCrusadentx.2784:

Thieves have high dps output; they’re not supposed to be out that far from their enemies doing a ton of damage. Having the dps output they have must be compensated in something; which is their defense. However, if you have that damage at a further distance, plus stealthing and shadowstepping, the low defense becomes negligible; you couldn’t even hit them at that rate. That would give melee users a huge disadvantage in confrontations. Thats just how I see it. Many people can play a thief the way it is now perfectley fine; there is nothing wrong with their range, and should not be adjusted.

well of that would truely be a probelm the solution is VERY simple… give whatever weapon with the 1200 range less dmg than the others (whihc generally is the case already for the other professions anyway. I really do wonder if those ppl saying thiefs dont need 1200 range weapons have ever tried to do any real keep sieges in wvw? 900 range as attacker will get you killed in a few seconds, as a defenders you simply wont hit anything but those that stand almost at the base of your walls

Thats not really the answer to the issue at hand. Thieves are meant to have high dps. Take that away and give them more range? Thats pretty much taking away from what the thief is supposed to be. The high dps is a feature of the class, and should not be touched either.
You have to consider things other than WvWvW and taking down doors. PvE confrontations, pvp in WvWvW, etc. The thief’s range is perfectely acceptable to that dps that is guaranteed from playing the class. I like my thief the way he is now, I really don’t wish to see this implemented.

most likely it would have to be a new weapon added, like rifle or longbow, so your thief wouldn’t really change at all, you would only get ANOTHER OPTION, that would be a weapon with longer range but less base dmg ON THAT WEAPON, meaning the dps on all your other weapons are still as high as always.

And i certainly consider other aspect too yes… im am in fact mainly a PvE guy that does do a fair share of WvW, and well the lack of a proper siege weapon was in fact the main reason i swapped away from thief and made mesmer my main instead

OMG… if thief isn’t OP enough, you want Range too???? No freaking way! And, Scorpion wire should be reduce to 600, not 1200!

The most OP class in the game, having thread after thread of complaining it is, and still asking for even more…. oy!

DeWolfe.2174:

OMG… if thief isn’t OP enough, you want Range too???? No freaking way! And, Scorpion wire should be reduce to 600, not 1200!

The most OP class in the game, having thread after thread of complaining it is, and still asking for even more…. oy!

Can hardly understand the grammer of that last sentence… but on a familiar note thieves arn’t OP, you just cry when they out perform you. Learn a profession before you call it out as “OP”. Thieves have no weapon at par in range with the other seven professions. [Cluster Bomb] simply does not cut, it is slow and unless you can time each small explosion to hit the same target it isn’t going to leave a scratch on anyone from a distance.

That 100 range may seem small but in WvW shooting at enemies on walls is very annoying to do, especially considering how squishy most thieves are. We deserve atleast 1000 range with a few weapon skills for one of the ranged weapons, or atleast a trait to allow this.

If they were to add 1200 range, do it to both weapons then, pistol and shortbow…or you are going to have the pistol users to claim injustice if only shortbow gets 1200 or viseversa, and no we dont need more weapons, theres plenty

JemL.3501:

If they were to add 1200 range, do it to both weapons then, pistol and shortbow…or you are going to have the pistol users to claim injustice if only shortbow gets 1200 or viseversa, and no we dont need more weapons, theres plenty

Go backand read Mithran’s post. You shouldn’t make shortbow and pistol 1200 range.

NinjaEd, they are OP based on the overwhelming number of thread’s and post from the player base saying it is. Of course, with the name NinjaEd, I have little doubt you play a thief don’t you? Thus, of course you want more ability for yourself.

A thief should not be on par with any other class at range. For no other class is equal to them in close range. If you want 1200 range, then remove stealth completely. How’s that? Oh… you don’t like it?? Tough!!!

no they should not have 1200 range, they are already one of the most powerful classes in teh game, and can pretty much completely avoid death if they want to.

NinjaEd.3946:

DeWolfe.2174:

OMG… if thief isn’t OP enough, you want Range too???? No freaking way! And, Scorpion wire should be reduce to 600, not 1200!

The most OP class in the game, having thread after thread of complaining it is, and still asking for even more…. oy!

Can hardly understand the grammer of that last sentence… but on a familiar note thieves arn’t OP, you just cry when they out perform you. Learn a profession before you call it out as “OP”. Thieves have no weapon at par in range with the other seven professions. [Cluster Bomb] simply does not cut, it is slow and unless you can time each small explosion to hit the same target it isn’t going to leave a scratch on anyone from a distance.

That 100 range may seem small but in WvW shooting at enemies on walls is very annoying to do, especially considering how squishy most thieves are. We deserve atleast 1000 range with a few weapon skills for one of the ranged weapons, or atleast a trait to allow this.

no they dont deserve any skills with 1000 range, they can already invis, run up to target and get 2-3 attacks in before the invis drops(due to culling or w/e), and since you cant target them when they are invis you are helpless against it. the fact that they can invis in the middle of combat so everyone loses target on them is over the top. it also seems like aoe’s dont hit them when they are invis either.

DeWolfe.2174:

NinjaEd, they are OP based on the overwhelming number of thread’s and post from the player base saying it is. Of course, with the name NinjaEd, I have little doubt you play a thief don’t you? Thus, of course you want more ability for yourself.

A thief should not be on par with any other class at range. For no other class is equal to them in close range. If you want 1200 range, then remove stealth completely. How’s that? Oh… you don’t like it?? Tough!!!

There are that many posts crying about thieves because people don’t like to adapt apparently. I fight thieves with my thief, I talk to friends/guildies who’ve fought thieves in pvp. It takes learning, maybe more than other professions but you can’t walk in expecting to just wing it, it takes practice. Thieves are not OP, they are different. Many people in the forums seem to cry thieves are OP, in the game I see more shouts against Warrior being OP however. Warriors can live through a ton, throw tons of damage or even crit for 13k with their GS combo (Bulls Charge+ Frenzy + Hundred Blades.. if they don’t have a stun break they are most likely dead).Mesmer can send nearly infinity clones, necro can just annoy you and never die with their Life force spam (or w/e the term for it would be), elementalists can run in, burst ppl down, run out. Nooooo, only thief OP, but leave my profession out of this, its completely fair….

It’s been posted before, every playerbase will complain about the burst class till the day it gets nerfed to the ground and no one plays it anymore.
Asking for 100 range is OP? Its fair, we still don’t get the 1200 range most professions get which is already an advantage. Try bursting someone down with a sb from afar, it doesn’t work unless the enemy is completely blind and running into a wall. We don’t need 1200 range on all skills, and we don’t need all ranged weapons with 1000 range. But atleast 1 with 1000 range is necessary.