Guild Wars 2

Love the game guys, you’ve done a great job with your world.
But this downleveling system is is taking it’s toll not only on me personally, but i’d say most of my guild are growing tired of it.

On one hand it’s a wonderful attempt at allowing one to go to any zone and still have relevance, but on the other hand, i never feel powerful.
I always feel as if im running for my life from mobs half my(true)level and this is not what i play mmo’s for.

I believe i’m not alone feeling like this system is flawed, and i long for my other mmo’s where i feel like my work and progression has earned me the right to feel powerful.
I don’t in GW2.

I don’t have the answers, but i think we would rather have a choice in the matter.
Not sure if Anet is flexible on this or not, but i fear i won’t be sticking around for the long haul id all i ever do when i log into this beautifully crafted world is constantly fight for my life. Not fun.

Thanks.

I’m DEFINITELY going to agree with you on this one, feeling powerful is kinda the point of mmos -_-

I still feel pretty strong in lower level areas. Almost too strong. Especially since we’re often down-leveled to be +1 or even +2 above mob levels, and that makes a significant difference in this game.

OurDelusions.2635:

I’m DEFINITELY going to agree with you on this one, feeling powerful is kinda the point of mmos -_-

I usually play to have fun and be challenged. One shotting everything in my path, no matter how ‘powerful’ my kitten feels, is not fun or challenging.

and it allows me to play with my low lvl friends without having to make an alt just to go help them out.

i can actually show up, with my character, and help.

Downscaling to the zone is exactly what they did right.

Having a choice to get downleveled would ruin the whole system.

Feeling powerful might be the point in almost every other MMO. But it is obviously not in this one. In GW2 it is more about having a challenge, no matter where you go and what level you are.
And as Vzur stated, you are still more powerful when going to lowerlvl areas, since you are always a few lvls above the moblvl. The most extreme case, I have seen was fighting lvl 20 mobs where I was downleveled to only 24.

Yes, there are people, who dislike the downleveling. But there are also many, who like/approve it. I am one of the latter. In case you want to ask now, where those many are, who like it:
On forums you tend to find the people, who are unsatisfied with a game and its content. The ones, who enjoy it, tend to play the game, rather than to look into the forums.

for me i do feel slightly powerful because of the traits, skills and whatnot, but i don’t feel like a god where nothing can touch me. being a god in lower level zone may be fun for some but kills the game for at-level players, especially when you one hit waves and mobs in dynamic events. kills the game for others.

I think the best solution is:

Boost Defensive Stats, Nerf Offensive Stats

at Downscaling. It becomes more harmless to other lowbies, and lessen your pain and frustration for being killed or chased by low level mobs. But only for PvE.

PvE and PvP needs to have some different mechanics, as always it should be.

OP must have a poor build or is a weak player because I feel much stronger in a down leveled area.

I will stress that I’m not a hardcore player, but I have spent much time working on my gear and build to optimize it.

BTW running with your back to the mob is the worse thing you can do. Circle strafe or side strafe, then you can still use skills while on the run.

If you dont like the downscale system, you can always leave for another mmo.

I think there are 6174779575849 other mmos that allows you to faceroll low level contents when you reach the cap.

O wait, what? You dont go to those areas in those mmos at max level because its too boring? Thats too bad.

NinjaKnight.1340:

BTW running with your back to the mob is the worse thing you can do.

Unless you’re an Engineer with a bomb kit. In which case it’s freakin’ hysterical.

I can’t agree at all. Becoming so powerful that you can just ignore enemies is one of the silliest trends RPGs ever had the misfortune of ending up saddled with. I was very disappointed when I heard GW2 didn’t use GW1’s system of reaching the level cap early in the game, until I found out about the scaling system (which is still not ideal, but pretends to satisfy levelholics so I can understand)

As it is, traits and 80 gear make me feel too powerful to play with 1-30 friends, and WvW is too skewed. I think the scaling needs to be stronger.

Hydrophidian.4319:

NinjaKnight.1340:

BTW running with your back to the mob is the worse thing you can do.

Unless you’re an Engineer with a bomb kit. In which case it’s freakin’ hysterical.

Lol, I have a noob Asuran Engineer as an alt, have to try that.

To OP, I dunno which class you are, if you are squishy and not very fast on the controls, switch to a ranged and/or heavy armor char. You WILL be amazed at the difference in how each profession feels and plays, and also how your equipment selection makes a difference.

eg: if you are a glass cannon build but are terrible with evading and strafing, you should put more into Vit, toughness and Healing.

Draennon.8576:

Having a choice to get downleveled would ruin the whole system.

Feeling powerful might be the point in almost every other MMO. But it is obviously not in this one. In GW2 it is more about having a challenge, no matter where you go and what level you are.
And as Vzur stated, you are still more powerful when going to lowerlvl areas, since you are always a few lvls above the moblvl. The most extreme case, I have seen was fighting lvl 20 mobs where I was downleveled to only 24.

Yes, there are people, who dislike the downleveling. But there are also many, who like/approve it. I am one of the latter. In case you want to ask now, where those many are, who like it:
On forums you tend to find the people, who are unsatisfied with a game and its content. The ones, who enjoy it, tend to play the game, rather than to look into the forums.

Whether I like the current system or not………..I like choice. I have no problem with an option for people who dislike downleveling. If you like it toggle it on. If It’s not your thing toggle it off. I don’t need to play anyone’s game for them. I don’t want them to play mine either.

Simple.5796:

all i ever do when i log into this beautifully crafted world is constantly fight for my life. Not fun.

I agree. I did make a suggestion thread about increasing the power of our healing skill or adding healing potions but oddly its been deleted??? Very strange. I thought it was a reasonable suggestion. But anyway i agree totally.

what are you guys smoking? with all my exotic gear, fully runes / sigils I go to low level areas and I 1-2 shot everything. Everything dies to fast and I barely get scratched.

Maximilious.6054:

what are you guys smoking? with all my exotic gear, fully runes / sigils I go to low level areas and I 1-2 shot everything. Everything dies to fast and I barely get scratched.

Lol, unless you are being /sarcastic — another elitist, thinking they are being cool and people “admire them” for their virtual gear. NOT!

NinjaKnight.1340:

Maximilious.6054:

what are you guys smoking? with all my exotic gear, fully runes / sigils I go to low level areas and I 1-2 shot everything. Everything dies to fast and I barely get scratched.

Lol, unless you are being /sarcastic — another elitist, thinking they are being cool and people “admire them” for their virtual gear. NOT!

If you are fully geared 80 this is true for me for creatures under level 10. I’m not one or 2 shot killing beyond that.

Zale.9645:

Downscaling to the zone is exactly what they did right.

Agree 100%
There are dozens of things I love about GW2 because they are so different from past experiences.
In other games, the only time I’d see high levels in low level zones, was to ‘slayer deed’ (thank goodness I don’t have that grind here) If you like to spend your gaming time doing the roflstomp thing, well, maybe this one isn’t for you. I love never missing out on a zone because I outlevelled it. This way, I experience the entire game the way it was meant to be.
And as others have said, being, say, a level 40 in a 20ish zone is far easier than when you were 20. If you have to constantly fight for your life and are struggling, you’re doing something wrong (no offense).

I like the “rescaling” but i believe it should be improved.
I still kill them VERY EASY.
3 shoots at a low level is enough for me to kill any creature.
And i dont get NOTHING for doing it, Level Adjustment Drops is a lie. Never happened. Neither with Map Completation, farming, DE or Dungeons.
I believe u can maintain it but rewarding u for that as well or remove if its useless.

You’re forgetting if downleveling was removed, 80s would just wandering around completely destroying events and farming. Ruining that content for lower level characters.

They don’t want you coming in and doing all the work …for example

You are level 80 and you come into a level 10 area and do Dynamic events, oh but the level 10’s in the area don’t get nothing for doing the event cause you took it away from them killing the mob with a one shot.

They want you to be able to group with a friend that just started a new toon or a friend that just started …for example

In other MMO’s you kill everything for the friend and he levels fast, so fast he doesn’t know how to play his toon right, later he gets in a dungeon and everyone ridicules him for his lack of performance, later at night, he cries into his pillow.

I like the system, But to me, I do like the idea of feeling more powerful too.

What about a compromise: Lets say if you are 20 levels higher, the mobs are afraid of you and don’t attack you outright, unless its a dynamic event or some other thing that needs participation instead of a slaying. Of course you can initiate a attack on any mob in the area and you will still be downscaled to the area , but you can pick the fights you want to have .

Of course even though I make the suggestion, I can see fault with it…for example

People are running around and nothing is attacking them and the level 10’s of the area are struggling with an attack of more mobs than he can handle and you come though and say “oh well” and keep on going instead of helping. Or a person is downed and you say “oh shinny ore” and step over his corpse and don’t bother helping him up cause that might cause aggro.

Xhaiden.3891:

You’re forgetting if downleveling was removed, 80s would just wandering around completely destroying events and farming. Ruining that content for lower level characters.

But that’s never happened in any other MMO…

Oh wait.

You guys should read the OP post. He/she is saying that downleveling makes her feel underpowered. You should be suggesting how the OP can fix her problem.

SHM.7628:

Draennon.8576:

Having a choice to get downleveled would ruin the whole system.

Feeling powerful might be the point in almost every other MMO. But it is obviously not in this one. In GW2 it is more about having a challenge, no matter where you go and what level you are.
And as Vzur stated, you are still more powerful when going to lowerlvl areas, since you are always a few lvls above the moblvl. The most extreme case, I have seen was fighting lvl 20 mobs where I was downleveled to only 24.

Yes, there are people, who dislike the downleveling. But there are also many, who like/approve it. I am one of the latter. In case you want to ask now, where those many are, who like it:
On forums you tend to find the people, who are unsatisfied with a game and its content. The ones, who enjoy it, tend to play the game, rather than to look into the forums.

Whether I like the current system or not………..I like choice. I have no problem with an option for people who dislike downleveling. If you like it toggle it on. If It’s not your thing toggle it off. I don’t need to play anyone’s game for them. I don’t want them to play mine either.

You mustn’t forget that it would ruin the experience for others, as stated above. Dynamic Events wouldn’t be any challenge at all anymore if a lvl 80 is in the lowlvl zone, onehitting everything. The others would just stand around, nothing to do and wont even get a reward, since they just CAN’T hit anything, because everything dies instantly.
That’s not what anet has in mind. Giving you an option to get downleveled or not is no option. The downleveling is just one of the best mechanics they got into this game in my oppinion. And as you can see, I am not the only one who thinks that.
You just can’t have a choice here, since that would ruin the experience for many others.

What? If anything you are downscaled way too little. When I went for the 100% map completion, and had to do the low level zones, I actually felt ackward and embarassed to “ruin” events for on-level people, I was wiping entire mob waves before they had a chance to even get to them. You can one shot many mobs. It goes better on higher levels but still.

Vzur.7123:

I still feel pretty strong in lower level areas. Almost too strong. Especially since we’re often down-leveled to be +1 or even +2 above mob levels, and that makes a significant difference in this game.

Odd cause almost every time i get downleveled i am 2-3 under the mob levels and on rare occasion the same level. But once i started making sure i had gear that was my level rather then a 5 or more levels below i had a much easier time when being downleveled.

Maximilious.6054:

what are you guys smoking? with all my exotic gear, fully runes / sigils I go to low level areas and I 1-2 shot everything. Everything dies to fast and I barely get scratched.

If everyone was level 80 with exotic gear im sure it wouldn’t be a problem, but sadly life isn’t so kind to us casual players. It takes time to level up and an even longer time to get good gear. And i think im correct in saying that for most casual players by the time they reach level 80 its pretty much end game for them. I prefer the journey not the end game content. And the journey in GW2 is a frustrating one.

Anyway, i do like the level adjustment but it does seem a bit extreme. As a suggestion for being slightly more powerful in low level areas, perhaps the toughness and vitality stats should remain unchanged, or reduced slightly, to allow players to take more of a beating.

I’m absolutely 100% for downscaling.

This is possibly my favorite feature of this game. I can never out level my friends, my family, my guild mates; I can play with anyone, any time, any level. That feature by far out weighs this ‘over power feeling.’ Also, none of the zones become worthless. Anytime I feel I’m under level I can pop over to a zone I didn’t do while I was leveling up, and catch up on XP. All of the dungeons (when they balance the reward system) are viable for any level.

Thanks ANet for this great feature.

I already feel pretty powerful when downscaled. It’s not extremely powerful (and I hope it won’t be), but it’s enough to notice a difference.

I am not hardcore player, I work from mon to fri just like everybody else. I get up at 5:30 in the morning and get back at around 4:30 / 5:00 after I am done taking a shower / eating / etc I have about 3-4 hours of Guild Wars 2 to play, in which as a level 80 I usually get 1-2G per hour. Me, a casual player has fully exotic gear…

Please don’t go around making excuses, thank you.

Maximilious.6054:

I am not hardcore player, I work from mon to fri just like everybody else. I get up at 5:30 in the morning and get back at around 4:30 / 5:00 after I am done taking a shower / eating / etc I have about 3-4 hours of Guild Wars 2 to play, in which as a level 80 I usually get 1-2G per hour. Me, a casual player has fully exotic gear…

Please don’t go around making excuses, thank you.

3-4 hours a day!? Sounds hard core to me but then maybe my life is more busy than yours.

Maybe, maybe not. Point is that at level 80 gold should be coming quick through farming, crafting, or running dungeons. I ran 4 AC explorer modes and they all gave me like 50 silver each, path 2 which takes like 20-30 minutes to complete.

down scaling is working as intended.

nothing is wrong there.

no need to change anything.

dun fix what is not broken.

we need more choices of craft-able insignias / prefixes though.

There are plenty of places I feel Very powerful with this system, meanwhile other places have very poor scaling. You should not be scaled down to level 63 to fight level 71 mobs for example. And water combat omg. Could underwater abilities do any less damage? Because you know, I love dying all the time underwater to mobs who on land wouldn’t be any harder than any other mob. There doesn’t need to be any burden underwater that isn’t native simply by virtue of the confusion of depth perception and the z axis. Otherwise, I like the scaling system. I think it’s vital to preventing griefing and ensuring that all players in an area are able to participate, as it is there are zones I feel like I’m OP enough that I hurt the lower level players ability to participate in events.

Draennon.8576:

SHM.7628:

Draennon.8576:

Having a choice to get downleveled would ruin the whole system.

Feeling powerful might be the point in almost every other MMO. But it is obviously not in this one. In GW2 it is more about having a challenge, no matter where you go and what level you are.
And as Vzur stated, you are still more powerful when going to lowerlvl areas, since you are always a few lvls above the moblvl. The most extreme case, I have seen was fighting lvl 20 mobs where I was downleveled to only 24.

Yes, there are people, who dislike the downleveling. But there are also many, who like/approve it. I am one of the latter. In case you want to ask now, where those many are, who like it:
On forums you tend to find the people, who are unsatisfied with a game and its content. The ones, who enjoy it, tend to play the game, rather than to look into the forums.

Whether I like the current system or not………..I like choice. I have no problem with an option for people who dislike downleveling. If you like it toggle it on. If It’s not your thing toggle it off. I don’t need to play anyone’s game for them. I don’t want them to play mine either.

You mustn’t forget that it would ruin the experience for others, as stated above. Dynamic Events wouldn’t be any challenge at all anymore if a lvl 80 is in the lowlvl zone, onehitting everything. The others would just stand around, nothing to do and wont even get a reward, since they just CAN’T hit anything, because everything dies instantly.
That’s not what anet has in mind. Giving you an option to get downleveled or not is no option. The downleveling is just one of the best mechanics they got into this game in my oppinion. And as you can see, I am not the only one who thinks that.
You just can’t have a choice here, since that would ruin the experience for many others.

I don’t buy this argument. The only way that people are going to spend significant time one hit killing things is if there is an exploit. (like faster loot or XP farming) That can be easilly handled by scaling rewards if you far outlevel a monster/mob.

I honestly think people are split on this one. Some like it others don’t. I’m not even 100% sure what side of this I am on. While I like some aspects of down leveling, I dislike others. I like that there are scaled rewards (although not scaled nearly enough)

On the other hand, I feel like I am going through areas with my higher levels and killing the new experience for my lower levels. I’m playing with my 80 and already feeling “been there, done that” from the betas. It’s making the content stale faster. I’d be more apt to leave stuff alone if it weren’t a benefit to my progression.

i see downleveling as a way to say, you may be strong but you are still a human…..char…. asura… whatever you are. you are not a god, sure you get stronger and get better things but inside you are still just a …whatever you are and

Maximilious.6054:

Maybe, maybe not. Point is that at level 80 gold should be coming quick through farming, crafting, or running dungeons. I ran 4 AC explorer modes and they all gave me like 50 silver each, path 2 which takes like 20-30 minutes to complete.

Dude, you play 4 hours on working days., You’re hardcore, end of discussion.

Down-leveling is one of the most kitteny awesome idea Anet could have implemented. I would kiss whoever came up with that idea (I hope it’s a cute girl!! but I doubt it…).

Regarding the “feeling” of power, I do feel more powerful. When I go to a low-level event and summon my hounds of balthazar while buffing everyone with multiple shout skills while everyone else is just shooting a rifle, then I do feel quite more powerful.

A geared lvl 80 can kill mobs very easily and even solo champions without much effort on the lowest level areas.

Removing downscaling would also spoil the fun and the rewards for everyone else in DEs. Get 5 burst dps on a big boss like shadow behemoth and see it going down in seconds, or all enemy waves getting killed by burn AOEs, before anyone else can even touch the enemies.

It would be a lot of harm by opening a lot of ways for griefing to make some guys feel powerful for a few minutes.

Feeling powerful is for stroking egos. Sorry, I like the down scaling.

I love the down-leveling. I’m only at level 18, but I had to go back to the level 1-5 area. At first I thought, “No way these little level 2 guys are going to attack me,” because that’s how it was in GW1. But then they started coming at me… And I thought, “No way this is going to be hard!” Well, it wasn’t hard, but it did take a couple of shots. And when I reached a level 4 group and I was downscaled to level 6, it actually did feel like a challenge, and I really love it! I knew I was going to win, so that was my “power” mindset, but I also knew that it wasn’t going to happen in 1 or 2 hits.

Having a choice is great, but when that choice is going to affect everyone else as well, you have to look at the majority. The majority of people would like the option to return to lower levels to help friends or Guild members.

I agree with other posters in this thread that going back to lower level zones should make you feel a bit more powerful than it currently does.

I really don’t like the idea of running around attempting to gather crafting materials in a zone that is 60 levels below me and still getting attacked and it being a challenge to quickly and decisively deal with said enemies.

It’s one of those features that sounds cool initially but once you see it in action it kinda blows.

I can tell you why this mechanic exists and it’s not the fluffy reason we’ve all been sold on. It’s to prevent power leveling. Since you get full credit for hitting a mob and loot they didn’t want some level 80 character plowing around a low level zone and having a bunch of low level characters gaining experience and loot for the higher level characters loot.

That mechanic exists because it’s what they had to do to make events work properly. So that players get credit, but sadly even now on world bosses not everyone is getting credit.

No, the reason for the mechanic is not to prevent power leveling. Is to make all content challenging and viable. So going to a lower level zone for copper and getting challenge from the mobs there is expected, and it is a good thing.

The mechanic sounded cool initially, and once I played with it, it is even better than advertised. It is an awesome mechanic. You may not like it, but the alternative of not having the mechanic, and one-shotting everything would bring more problems to the low level players playing in the area. They would not experience the game as they should.

So a little “inconvenience” to the high level players (which I do not even consider an inconvenience) in order to provide a good gaming experience to the correct level players in the zone is a good mechanic.

Downscaling is fine in 99% of areas, but there are a few places where it downscales you to , say, 40 but the mobs around are 43.

Should it be scaling you lower than nearby mobs? I’m not sure if this was designed on purpose or if it’s a bug. It’s not a huge problem, but it seems like a bug to me.

Lily Miranda.5407:

Downscaling is fine in 99% of areas, but there are a few places where it downscales you to , say, 40 but the mobs around are 43.

Should it be scaling you lower than nearby mobs? I’m not sure if this was designed on purpose or if it’s a bug. It’s not a huge problem, but it seems like a bug to me.

I think there are small pockets in areas where this happens and it’s not intended. I’ve experienced this effect, and it appears to be quite rare. It’s probably an oversight and should be reported.

Just to add my own two cents to this thread, when I am downscaled in to +2 levels, I still completely destroy monsters in the area because of the superior gear set I built up at level 80. This becomes very apparent when you play with someone just starting out in that particular level range.

Sonickat.6893:

I can tell you why this mechanic exists and it’s not the fluffy reason we’ve all been sold on. It’s to prevent power leveling. Since you get full credit for hitting a mob and loot they didn’t want some level 80 character plowing around a low level zone and having a bunch of low level characters gaining experience and loot for the higher level characters loot.

You don’t get credit or exp from any kills you don’t participate in. . . If that lowbie friend didn’t tag it, they don’t get any exp or loot. Admittedly, if they hit it, they get loot and exp equal to their contribution to the fight. Which if their OP level 80 friend was all but one-shot-ing the mobs, wouldn’t be very much. So in all honestly the down-scaling works perfectly by allowing higher level characters to help their friends without blowing away the mobs before their lower level friends can get credit, while still being able to more effectively back them up and survive enough better to pull them through situations the lowbie friend might not survive on their own. It’s really only when the down-scaling takes effect to ridiculous levels, like bringing you down to level 66 to fight level 70 mobs, then it’s like wtf, not cool. xD

Down scaling is brilliant. If anything I currently feel too powerful in lowbie zones. I saw a post earlier that suggested being able to handicap you’re self even lower to get better magic find. I think that is a great idea, as it would make getting tiny scales fun again.

TL;DR: No. L2P

I personally like the system a whole lot, see, in all honesty there is no leveling in any world. A bear is a bear is a bear, no matter where… and there is no way in pretty much any world where you can mysteriously get more blood (aka more HP). So arguably leveling is just some silly concept that is likely originally used to give people access to more skills. There isn’t so much a lvl that makes you strong, no, the level indicates that you have a certain skillset. (if you check most traditional (judo, karate,etc) fighting sports that actually work on a belt-color-level system, it’s not your strength or height or age that determains your belt-lvl. It is the skillset you posses, and proven to have during an exam.

Now in GW2 (and partially in GW1 aswell, though there we just had a very low top-lvl, and the strength wasn’t even in the level, it was in the attribute points) we essentially see the same thing, even though you progressed in lvl, in regards to the skills you have and the tricks you know, you don’t all of a sudden become stronger against some arbitrairy bear, that is going to be a bear no matter where, and only has this arbitrairy level, because it still has to fight you at any level…

Also, your scaledown level is actually the top level for the zone you fight in, so you should never be to weak, and given you are lvl80 now (but this goes for almost all zones 1-30) you also have way more skills and tricks to fight with, that should give you a clear advantage when comparing your first experience going through it, and the moments you revisit this same location at a much higher level. And you still get some sort of fun out of it, in regards to it being some challenge…

Then again, you may have been a kid that liked pulling the limbs of spiders, the wings of flies, and stamp on ant, and found a way to keep continuing that feeling in MMOs. In that case, there are more MMO’s in excistance that run on this kind of system than you can likely play in a day…

As far as sticking to GW2, well i would advice you (if you don’t like scaling back) to just make a new character, pick a different race a different (or even the same) profession, pick a different order. And have a whole new story line to work through, you be seeing low level areas from the race’s own perspective (instead of visiting there, likely scaled back), and enjoy the game for what you enjoy in it…