Warrior Healing
I do play warrior and i will admit i do like it like that, but the bitter part is that my full cleric (over 1,6k healing power without sigil) healing symbol with Altruistic healing guardian dont heal as much as a warrior with healing signet and adrenal health.
Been checking on the wiki for both classes healing sources, the (value) is how it scales with healing power:
Guardian
healing symbol 4 pulses : 107 (0,075) -AoE, either every third attack or cast as skill
vitue of resolve 84 (0,06) – Passive, self but can become AoE
altruistic healing 69 (0,01) – Boons are AoE but the healing is self
healing meditations 1960 (0,4) 20 to 25 seconds cd – Self only
selfless daring : 129 (1.0) scales really well and this is the only extra healing source the guardian has over the war, if you find another to correct me let me know maybe i missed one.
Warrior
healing signet 392 (0,05)= 439/sec -Self, passive healing
adrenal health 360 (0,15) over 3 seconds= 120/sec – Self passive, scales with adrenaline level
regeneration from banners 130 (0.125) -Passive AoE
vigorous shouts 1192 (0,8) -AoE
Since the Warrior has more base hp ( a lot more) and sclaes better with healing power than Guardian i dont see the point anymore, i just hang around in the mad king maze and whenh facing the big bosses in there ( Horror, Lich, Viscount) my warrior level 64 with crappy gear ( healing signet and adrenal health) survive better than my fully cleric geared guardian spamming hammer. The thing is i love my guardian ( the class and the actual look of the character) and he was supposed to be my “tanky, support toons for dungeons” now i will simply redo him as a bunker Warrior since it better support, more passive healing, constant healing over the guard and hell has almost twice the same hp…
Either nerf the war, uber buff the guard and the other classes or shoot a consumable at the TP allowing PROFESSION CHANGE, the last one i would definitely buy!
(edited by Baclavaman.9054)
You know you can’t take vigorous shouts AND banners? And banners are just applying the regen boon.
Your guardian doesn’t run a 6 slot skill? lolwut
Also tanky support for dungeons? lolwut
(edited by Player Character.9467)
Not to mention other classes having access to protection and being able to give it to other party members (and guards having aegis and being able to give that to party members too).
Plus warriors do need to use their burst skills (depending on the build), in which case they lose adrenaline healing for X seconds, while building adrenaline back up.
I know, i just listed them not like if they were all equipped at once.
Guardian you can have Virtue of resolve, healing symbols and extra altruistic healing or healing meditations + healing dodge rolls.
With warrior you can have, adrenal health healing signet and either healing banner or shouts, the war has 1 less source to heal him but he regain much more than a guardian since his passive regeneration is plain ridiculous, i love it!
Thats why it upsets me because it juts killed my guardian has a tanky support toon… A Warrior full cleric build with either banner or shouts is virtually indestructible, support the others better since he has more AoE’s. My guardian should be like that not the uber DPS warrior.
Again, you’re comparing warrior’s traits+6 skill to guardian’s traits. Please learn to press 6 on your guardian.
Or just counter it with burst damage and/or poison.
While I don’t run a shout heal build, my tanky/condi build still goes down against heavy pressure. Sure the steady heal is there, but against burst damage it doesn’t do much. Plus investing that much into healing reduces your damage by a lot.
You dont have to use your bust skill, if you go full tank and you have crazy regeneration coming from it and you dont do much damage there is no point using your burst skill at all.
I am not ranting about nerfing the warrior here get me clear on that but why have other classes whe the warrior can do everything better than all the others? It can have more conditions effectiveness than a necro, have better ranged attacks than a ranger, heal and tank better than a guardian.
All classes should all have same hp, scaling, lower armor classes would regenerate dodge bar faster to compensate for light armor or have 3 or 4 dodges so the gears and how you would trait your character would truly make a difference.
I know its stretching it to the extreme but its called balance for a reason, right now its not really balanced at all.
You see Wallace that is my point, in my Cleric guardian i dont do damage, i just have a tad over 3k attack but thats it, my role is to tank and support.
A Zerk warrior with its crazy DPS might not have the toughness to resist long but if he has adrenal health and healing signet he has almost the same regen as my guard for 15 points in defense instead of 60 points into the defensive trait lines of the guardian and 1500 healing power.
(edited by Baclavaman.9054)
You see Wallace that is my point, in my Cleric guardian i do damage, i just have a tad over 3k attack but thats it, my role is to tank and support.
A Zerk warrior with its crazy DPS might not have the toughness to resist long but if he has adrenal health and healing signet he has almost the same regen as my guard for 15 points in defense instead of 60 points into the defensive trait lines of the guardian and 1500 healing power.
And in addition to that you have your 6 skill?… Seriously, why do you keep comparing healing signet to a list of traits? OMG MY BEAR PET DOES LESS AUTO ATTACK DAMAGE THAN YOUR THIEF BACKSTAB! Apples and oranges.
You see Wallace that is my point, in my Cleric guardian i do damage, i just have a tad over 3k attack but thats it, my role is to tank and support.
A Zerk warrior with its crazy DPS might not have the toughness to resist long but if he has adrenal health and healing signet he has almost the same regen as my guard for 15 points in defense instead of 60 points into the defensive trait lines of the guardian and 1500 healing power.
And in addition to that you have your 6 skill?…
I made a mistake in my post i said that i was doing doing damage but it was typo, “i dont do damage*” was what i was supposed to put on.
And well my 6 skill is available on every class but on a guardian it doesn’t grant passive regeneration, if the warrior didn’t have that passive regeneration we wouldn’t have that discussion in the first place. I wouldn’t mind if it was on my guardian instead it would help support the tank role better :P
You see Wallace that is my point, in my Cleric guardian i do damage, i just have a tad over 3k attack but thats it, my role is to tank and support.
A Zerk warrior with its crazy DPS might not have the toughness to resist long but if he has adrenal health and healing signet he has almost the same regen as my guard for 15 points in defense instead of 60 points into the defensive trait lines of the guardian and 1500 healing power.
And in addition to that you have your 6 skill?… Seriously, why do you keep comparing healing signet to a list of traits? OMG MY BEAR PET DOES LESS AUTO ATTACK DAMAGE THAN YOUR THIEF BACKSTAB! Apples and oranges.
You really dont get my point here, so i will explain better.
Warrior, with 1 skill he dont have to trigger and 1 trait that only cost 15 points heal almost as much as a guardian with 66 point invested in both defense lines and a full cleric gear spamming all the skill that could heal him and he has less hp to begin with.
Fair?
P.S. Oh and to take back your example for apples and oranges, they are both fruits so yeah i could compare them if i wanted to :P
do we rly discuss about what does a guard against what does a warrior? if you watch that stream you will see how that guy is simply sitting while some random dude 100b him and he didnt drop below 95% health. Thats by no means fair . Skill becomes useless against a guy who just sucks up ALL dmg he sees and laughs about anyone. Healing is way to strong right now on warri. And everyone who wont admit it is simply beeing sad that his “Warrior” is not hard to play AND extremly op at the moment. So if they nerf this LOT of people cant even play pvp anymore. Because they would be so bad as if they would first time in pvp.
Actually in pvp anything is highly imbalanced. While necro and warriors can do as many mistakes as they want and still have a high chance to win. Other classes have to struggle with these monsters and need to play nearly perfect. ( DONT even try to say yeah S/D thief or Spirit Rangers can do some mistakes to. ) yeah they can but they dont crush ur face so fast with literally no drawbacks to defence.
do we rly discuss about what does a guard against what does a warrior? if you watch that stream you will see how that guy is simply sitting while some random dude 100b him and he didnt drop below 95% health. Thats by no means fair . Skill becomes useless against a guy who just sucks up ALL dmg he sees and laughs about anyone. Healing is way to strong right now on warri. And everyone who wont admit it is simply beeing sad that his “Warrior” is not hard to play AND extremly op at the moment. So if they nerf this LOT of people cant even play pvp anymore. Because they would be so bad as if they would first time in pvp.
Actually in pvp anything is highly imbalanced. While necro and warriors can do as many mistakes as they want and still have a high chance to win. Other classes have to struggle with these monsters and need to play nearly perfect. ( DONT even try to say yeah S/D thief or Spirit Rangers can do some mistakes to. ) yeah they can but they dont crush ur face so fast with literally no drawbacks to defence.
That is my point, a guardian with same gear and similar traits ( healing mediation or altruistic healing) could suck up that hundred blades but he would take damage, a lot of damage. As a guard the only way i think you would get the same 5% loss of hp against a HB would be while in a healing symbol with AH and protection on, thats the only way i see it and that guard wouldn’t be sitting down.
You see Wallace that is my point, in my Cleric guardian i do damage, i just have a tad over 3k attack but thats it, my role is to tank and support.
A Zerk warrior with its crazy DPS might not have the toughness to resist long but if he has adrenal health and healing signet he has almost the same regen as my guard for 15 points in defense instead of 60 points into the defensive trait lines of the guardian and 1500 healing power.
And in addition to that you have your 6 skill?… Seriously, why do you keep comparing healing signet to a list of traits? OMG MY BEAR PET DOES LESS AUTO ATTACK DAMAGE THAN YOUR THIEF BACKSTAB! Apples and oranges.
You really dont get my point here, so i will explain better.
Warrior, with 1 skill he dont have to trigger and 1 trait that only cost 15 points heal almost as much as a guardian with 66 point invested in both defense lines and a full cleric gear spamming all the skill that could heal him and he has less hp to begin with.
Fair?
P.S. Oh and to take back your example for apples and oranges, they are both fruits so yeah i could compare them if i wanted to :P
But that’s his point… A warrior using the active of healing signet, heals less than passive. And even with adrenal healing just about all of the burst skills are useful (maybe not the gs) so people will be bursting, which does cut into adrenal healing.
Also when you compare healing skills, you really should be comparing ALL healing abilities on both sides. Eles have access to a passive healing skill too, does that mean that eles can heal more too because their Signet of Restoration counts but your active healing skill doesn’t?
Plus, again you are forgetting guardians access to protection and aegis. Guards have the ability to block any telegraphic attack and to take 33% less damage. That is why their health is lower than warriors.
Also again, comparing the classes. The best a warrior can do for “team healing” is shout healing or banners, that’s it, and both are 30 points. Ele’s can lay down water fields, and group protection, while guards can give group aegis, protection, and group healing. Both do this with 0-5 trait points.
You see Wallace that is my point, in my Cleric guardian i do damage, i just have a tad over 3k attack but thats it, my role is to tank and support.
A Zerk warrior with its crazy DPS might not have the toughness to resist long but if he has adrenal health and healing signet he has almost the same regen as my guard for 15 points in defense instead of 60 points into the defensive trait lines of the guardian and 1500 healing power.
And in addition to that you have your 6 skill?… Seriously, why do you keep comparing healing signet to a list of traits? OMG MY BEAR PET DOES LESS AUTO ATTACK DAMAGE THAN YOUR THIEF BACKSTAB! Apples and oranges.
You really dont get my point here, so i will explain better.
Warrior, with 1 skill he dont have to trigger and 1 trait that only cost 15 points heal almost as much as a guardian with 66 point invested in both defense lines and a full cleric gear spamming all the skill that could heal him and he has less hp to begin with.
Fair?
P.S. Oh and to take back your example for apples and oranges, they are both fruits so yeah i could compare them if i wanted to :P
But that’s his point… A warrior using the active of healing signet, heals less than passive. And even with adrenal healing just about all of the burst skills are useful (maybe not the gs) so people will be bursting, which does cut into adrenal healing.
Also when you compare healing skills, you really should be comparing ALL healing abilities on both sides. Eles have access to a passive healing skill too, does that mean that eles can heal more too because their Signet of Restoration counts but your active healing skill doesn’t?
Plus, again you are forgetting guardians access to protection and aegis. Guards have the ability to block any telegraphic attack and to take 33% less damage. That is why their health is lower than warriors.
Also again, comparing the classes. The best a warrior can do for “team healing” is shout healing or banners, that’s it, and both are 30 points. Ele’s can lay down water fields, and group protection, while guards can give group aegis, protection, and group healing. Both do this with 0-5 trait points.
Solid point there and i kind of agree with you but there is always a but.
Ele signet of restoration is doesnt scale well with healing power and its upon casting, i do have a bit of healing power on mine since i use Celstial set and i heat for about 180 per cast if i m correct. Even then i have to smash the auto attack button to heal up while the war natural and passively heal for 419 while sitting down. Yes elementalist can be support and heal himself and the others, but to be fully effective you need healing power gear and such cut your DPS, also elementalist naturally is the squishiest call of the game ( not bunker build of course). Thief signet of malice is a goond one, the scaling with healing power is good and can trigger on AoE which is awesome but yeat again there is a condition to it, you need to hit someone while the warrior healing signet dont have that “requirement”. I could also compare traits, leeching venoms for example do leech life on hit but it requires the traits, the venom skill and the target to work plus the long cooldown. While adrenal health you just dont pop your busrt.
So Guardian’s heal doesn’t go into your calculations because it’s also a sustained block which can by itself do more than any other heal? Yeah there’s no bias in your analysis at all.
So Guardian’s heal doesn’t go into your calculations because it’s also a sustained block which can by itself do more than any other heal? Yeah there’s no bias in your analysis at all.
If your talking about virtue of resolve you have the number on top of the thread and its a HUGE 86 + scaling, and the block yes its nice but its not always and it doesnt work against conditions either. Protection is nice by reducing the incoming damage but 33% that again doesnt apply to conditions cant replace the extra hp the warrior has.
Warrior is my main btw, i m even build a second warrior has we speak because of how Op it is, my guardian will gather dust until they balance that whole story, it is the sad truth.
And since you dont believe me why don you go test it in pvp against the NPC or the chieftain, you might have a blast.
1. zerk builds are glass, and way better off with surge, than signet. They can be bursted down in 8 seconds easy, and thats WITH 4 seconds of endure pain. In 8 seconds, heal sig is worth 3k health. Woohoo. I’d much rather a 9k surge burst heal.
2. How is this a suggestion? Seems like a complaint.