Guild Wars 2

This one’s bugged me for a while now.
I find it strange that when crafting the best equipment in the game, you get no XP for it.
I propose that all level 400 recipes beyond refinement be assigned an XP reward value.
This ensures that while crafting will still reward the player with XP, it can’t be abused due to the prohibitive costs of tier 6 materials.

The price for T6 materials is community driven (even though the scarcity i handled by Anet). So it can change and basically you could get lots of xp for very few gold.

I think thakitten would be best that we got a very small amount of xp only when we discover new recipes.

Unless they made the XP gain significantly lower post 400, I would have to say I think this would be a very bad idea.

The xp gains that you get from crafting from 300-400 are pretty huge, and I don’t agree that the cost of tier 6 materials are prohibitive enough to stop people levelling one craft to 400 and then being able to hit 80 in a matter of minutes if they have collected (or have enough gold to buy) a decent stack of materials.

By the way, I have all professions at level 80, so I’m not suggesting this to make my life easier in regards to levelling characters. I think it would be nice for crafting post-400 to remain a source of skillpoints.

Also, why does everyone have such a problem with levelling being easier?
The last two characters I levelled, I did in less than a day each by levelling one trade to 400 then swapping to the next.
It’s already possible to level quickly through crafting, so complaining this makes it easier is kind of a non sequitur.

Levelling to top level SHOULD be quick and easy. It’s very hard to fully understand how a profession works before you’re top level in this game thanks to the broken implementation of traits. Handicapping a profession and the player behind it purely because you think people should have to work for top level strikes me as being quite petty.

I agree, it would be nice if there was some token XP gain post 400 to help gain skillpoints. But it should be nowhere near, barely a fraction of, what you currently get for making items near level 400.

It is easy to get a character to level 80 if you have the resources, money and inclination to train almost all of the crafts to level 400.

But I don’t think that is a valid justification to make it significantly easier to reach 80 by levelling up one craft to 400 then just bash out the same items for huge chunks of xp.

Have you seen how expensive tier 6 rare materials are?!
I would have thought that would be barrier enough to stop people “bashing out” items!
And if anything, people being able to gain XP post 400 would increase the price of these materials on the trading post, as they would be more in demand!
But again, there’s this underlying idea in your post that you should have to work for top level, something completely foreign to me as an original Guild Wars player.

Well the underlying message I get from your posts is a pretty defensive one. A couple of people didn’t think your suggestion was a good one and you seem to have concluded that we think you suggested it as a quick way for you to level your alts.

I have already said that I agree on some experience gain for crafting past 400 to supplement earning skillpoints, just not as much as you seem to think.

There are plenty of different ways to get to 80, and it is already easy allowing even the most casual of players to level by doing whatever they want.

If you think adding another ridiculously easy option to that list and letting players reach 80 by levelling one craft to 400, buying up a stockpile of resources then sitting back as they hit the craft button then that is up to you.

I never played Guild Wars. But then again I don’t see how that is relevant here. This is Guild Wars 2, of course there is some work involved in reaching level 80 but they have added plenty of avenues to reach that target without making it seem like work. If you are so set against having to put any effort into levelling, why not make a new thread suggesting they do away with level altogether.

My point being, it’s not ridiculously easy, as it would potentially be more expensive than the current method of levelling through crafting. Tier 6 materials cost a huge amount more than any other tier, up to ten times more. It would take just as long and be more expensive. It’s just another way of gaining XP, and if you have Master Crafter and all professions at 80, a welcome additional way of gaining skill points.

Mungrul, I repeat: T6 mats cost that much at the moment. If they ever go down (which they already did), your entire suggestion goes to a trap.

Sorry but I don’t think it would potentially be more expensive than the current method.

If you want to spend money getting all 8 crafts from 1-400 for levelling, a lot of that money goes on resources to make stuff that has very little resale value at the lower tiers.

Tier 6 materials do cost a huge amount more than any other tier , but the items you can make with tier 6 mats sell well and you don’t make a great deal of loss once you sell them on. Get lucky with your buy orders and you might even make a profit on what you make.

So I don’t think you’d need heaps of gold to use a system like this, and I still think it is open to abuse unless it is only a token amount of XP that is awarded.

How so? In all likelihood, they’ll still be more expensive than the other tiers, therefore it would still be cheaper and take just as long to level through crafting by getting one craft to 400 then starting another!
I mean this is the core point you guys don’t seem to understand:
At the moment in Guild Wars 2, you can craft your way to 80 in less than a day using no tier 6 materials at all.
Crafting with tier 6 materials at the moment yields no XP.
If it did yield XP, it would, at the moment and probably in the future still cost more to gain levels through crafting exotics.

And Lodovicus:
Open to abuse? Really? If that’s the case, then are you saying the current method of levelling through crafting is an abuse of crafting?

Mungrul, I totally get what you mean. It’s just that prices aren’t guaranteed at all. You’re trying to not be hypothetical, but yet you are.

So you’re saying that in all likelihood, T6 materials WILL at some point in the future be less expensive than any other tier of material?
Because that’s what would need to happen for this suggestion to be exploitable.

I’m not saying it will. I’m saying it may.

And we had that in the past. We had Vial of Powerful Blood reaching less than 4s each. At some point the Ancient Bone was as low as 20 coppers each!

So should we just remove XP from crafting as a whole because the materials market may crash and people would be able to get to 80 quickly?
If not, then why shouldn’t we add XP as a reward for crafting level 400 recipes?

No Mungrul, of course not. But you’re extrapolating.

As I said in my first post, I’m not against gaining xp for crafting at 400+. I’m saying this should happen for discovering new recipes.

Mungrul.9358:

And Lodovicus:
Open to abuse? Really? If that’s the case, then are you saying the current method of levelling through crafting is an abuse of crafting?

No, that is not what I am saying, and I am a bit baffled as to how you arrived at that conclusion.

The crafting system as it is has a finite amount of XP that can be earnt through it, so cannot be abused.

If you introduced an element that allowed an infinite amount of XP to be earnt through crafting then yes that can be open to abuse unless (and I will put this in bold as I think this may be the third time I have said it, but you seem not to acknowledge it) the experience gains post 400 are singificantly lower than the XP you earnt crafting items in the 390-400 range.

Even if the experience gains were significantly lower, there is still the possibility for abuse if the cost of materials is ever equal to or less than the resale value of the items they can make. People could end up with multiple stacks of mats and just sit back whilst they queue up 250 after 250 of crafts and watch the skillpoints/levels rack up without losing any real money.

It sounds like you want to have your cake and eat~ it too with this suggestion. It seems to me you want crafting XP post-400 to supplement your collection of skillpoints, but only if the experience returns are the same as you see when you hit the final 300s of a craft. I personally think this is an unrealistic expectation.

Every time I craft something or discover a new recipe in a crafting discipline I’ve already mastered I wonder how bad all that lost experience is going to hurt if the level cap is ever increased beyond 400.

Sorry Lodovicus, but your argument against this idea makes no sense whatsoever.
At the moment, once you’ve got a Legendary, all professions at 80 and all crafting trades at 400, the scenario you outline is exactly what happens.
I do stack up materials, as I have nothing to spend them on.

And what is so abusive about gaining extra skill points anyway?

Explain to me how a surplus of skillpoints or experience can result in an abuse. I’m still confused at this point, as I’m having trouble working out how I can make thousands of gold out of skillpoints and experience.

Please, enlighten me.

I’ve proven that at the moment it’s entirely possible to level a character to level 80 in less than one day through the use of crafting alone. Where is the “Abuse” in being able to earn further skill points? Who is it harming? How is it breaking the economy? It certainly can’t make your character any more powerful than any other character, so there’s no abuse there.
I’m genuinely mystified.

And I’ll be buggered if I can figure out how you’re linking increased consumption of materials to a decrease in the price of those materials. If anything, increased demand for those materials would drive the price UP.

Look, if people get a skillpoint from crafting, they’ll be more inclined to do it. Demand for materials will go up and supply of exotic gear will increase. The market will ensure that the cost of the materials used to make an item will never exceed the final price of the crafted goods. How do I know that?
It’s what happens at the moment.
People don’t routinely sell gear they make for less than it cost to make it in the first place.

Mungrul.9358:

At the moment, once you’ve got a Legendary, all professions at 80 and all crafting trades at 400, the scenario you outline is exactly what happens.
I do stack up materials, as I have nothing to spend them on.

Strikes me that your reasons for making this suggestion are beginning to make no sense whatsoever.

I am against it because I think it would make it far too easy to level a character to 80 by levelling one craft to 400 then making exotics from buying materials and reselling the finished product at no significant loss.

You have already said that you didn’t make this suggestion so that you could level alts quicker. You have also outlined how easy you think it is to get a character to 80 in one day from the current crafting system. So this suggestion is apparently redundant on a levelling front.

I am also against the suggestion as it could potentially be used and abused to farm thousands of skill points on a character and remove any effort whatsoever in collecting the skillpoints necessary to buy items like Bloodstone Shards for Legendaries.

You say there is little value to skill points once you have all of your utilities unlocked and Legendaries on all characters, and you’re probably right. But I don’t see how removing all of the effort prior to achieving these things is a good thing, and skill points are worthless to those that already have their utilities/Legendaries. So for those people, again this suggestion is redundant.

I don’t think it’s easy, I KNOW it’s easy. I’ve done it on 2 characters. That’s what I mean by the word “proven”. It’s not theory. It’s fact.

And how does it remove any effort whatsoever? You still need to make the money to afford to buy the materials you need to craft.

By the way, I don’t know if you realise, but getting a Legendary requires map completion. By the time you’ve done that, you’ll have more than enough skillpoints for a Bloodstone. They already ARE trivial.

You are approaching this from a standpoint that it removes all effort necessary to gain skillpoints, which is simply false. It just opens up another method of gaining them, which still requires an investment on the player’s part, and in all likelihood will also serve to act as another gold sink.

Good for you, I’ve also wasted money on a side project levelling a character 1-80 purely from crafting.

You don’t think that your suggestion would make levelling through crafting even easier, then this suggestion is redundant?

As you say skillpoints are abundant enough that you will get everything you need for a Legendary and more from map completion, then this suggestion is redundant?

I don’t think this discussion is going anywhere, but I predict neither is this suggestion.

Lodovicus.1562:

Good for you, I’ve also wasted money on a side project levelling a character 1-80 purely from crafting.

You don’t think that your suggestion would make levelling through crafting even easier, then this suggestion is redundant?

As you say skillpoints are abundant enough that you will get everything you need for a Legendary and more from map completion, then this suggestion is redundant?

I don’t think this discussion is going anywhere, but I predict neither is this suggestion.

Ok, reading this thread from start to finish. I personaly didn’t have a stand point either way on this until I read your posts, Lodovicus. I’m going to have to agree with the OP on this.

Reasons:

Lets use what you said in the post I just quoted shall we?

“You don’t think that your suggestion would make levelling through crafting even easier, then this suggestion is redundant?”

• Suggestion is NOT redundant, the argument is redundant. If the suggestion doesn’t make leveling through crafting any easier then it causes no harm. It has been pointed out a few times even that it won’t and explained as to why.
• The market supply & demand will neutralize any profit margins on T6 crafted items. If more people are crafting them then more people are buying materials, thus materials cost increases. Consiquintly more people are selling T6 crafted items which results in the cost of such items to drop. When profits on T6 gear drops more people switch to farming mats to make up their profit losses and mat prices may in turn drop from a increased supply for a short term, profit margins restored people return to crafting… it’s an endless cycle. There will be very small and brief pockets of profitable crafting times.

“As you say skillpoints are abundant enough that you will get everything you need for a Legendary and more from map completion, then this suggestion is redundant?”

• Just like the previous comment, it’s not the suggestion that is made redundant, but the argument.
• This creates alternative avenues for skillpoint acquisition. Even though map completion will still be required, some people may be after multiple legendaries on a single character, as such alternative methods of gaining skillpoints are desirable.

This suggestion causes no harm to the game in it’s current form. It also has zero, i repeat ZERO potential for abuse.

• “To easy to level to 80” – Crafting to 80 is already possible and the odds are T6 crafting to 80 would cost 10x more than the current methods to craft to 80. The first few people may benefit from large profits but after the first few days the market will be over saturated and prices on T6 crafted gear will plummet below material costs.

• “To easy to gain skillpoints” – is this really a bad thing? Additionaly, you’d be spending a fortune to buy the mats for those skillpoints. Honestly, I’d hardly call that “easy gain” with how much the mats for T6 crafted items cost.

• “To profitable” – really… adding an incentive to make these items makes them to profitable? The market research has already been done and proven, if XP gain is added these items will in-fact cease to be profitable…

The only negative argument I can see in this whole situation is this:

• “T6 crafting won’t profit any more” – An actual true and legitimate argument.