Guild Wars 2

Is it going to really work out? I thought this new Teq fight needed team work with defending cannons and ressing people and so on. Though atm, when you say that people should ress, your are told to Shut Up and that people can tp and run back. Though from my experience, ressing someone takes a few seconds while running back from the tp takes a lot longer.

What do you think?
Should people just tp and run, or should they be helped up by others?

Its not a malicious thing, but it can take a long time to rez due to knockbacks and posions and adds etc. Its quicker to run back..massively quicker.

If anyone is being malicious, then report/ignore them. Not worth the hassle

Yeah if you want to beat him ress the downed ASAP,but dead need to run so they dont slow the fight.

yup res downed people so long as it’s safe, defeated people need to run back. It’s anti community and is selfish and nasty but dead players can’t contribute, attract kind hearted others who then get killed in AoE or aren’t available to defend/repairs things also and so with the end result that the chances of success are reduced.

Don’t like saying it, and would much rather be helpful but with such a tight timer it forces that behavoir

5 people can rez you from fully dead in 15 seconds. it takes 1 minute to walk back. Until people learn to rez EVERYONE we probably won’t win the fight.

Then you have 6 people not fighting Teq on a time sensitive case, 1 person running back is far better than 6 people not doing anything for 15 seconds

Unfortunately, due to how long it takes to rez defeated players when you’re combat-locked, it’s just not viable to rez defeated players. You lose critical damage and risk dying yourself.

That is an unfortunate side-effect of the downed/defeated system. Downed = rez if at all possible. Defeated = don’t risk it. Until they change that system, that’s how it’ll be played.

That’s 5 people not defending a turret or DPS’ing per dead person. It soon mounts up alas.

Like I said. I really wish the mechanics didn’t drive it down this route but it seems to atm

ZudetGambeous.9573:

5 people can rez you from fully dead in 15 seconds. it takes 1 minute to walk back. Until people learn to rez EVERYONE we probably won’t win the fight.

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is 75 seconds.
1 person running back is 60 seconds.

?

Every person lying around dead and every person attempting to rez them is another person NOT doing damage. The window to kill Teq is only 15 minutes. And rezzing in the middle of a hard-hitting aoe drop zone means the would-be rezzer is likely to be the next in line needing a rez.

Rezzing the dead tends to cause a cascade of deaths; not good given the timer window of the event.

Also all those poeple laying around dead are scaling the event up and not doing anything to help. So yes, running back from the WP is the only viable option.

Every good WvW commander knows this rule: banner rez downed, leave defeated until fight is over. PvE is not an exclusion.

I really don’t understand Anet’s thinking on this one. Even if we could waypoint to the nearest waypoint, which is contested during the fight, we would still lose. So, to make that waypoint contested during the fight, now it’s near impossible.

And I don’t think Anet intended it this way, but I don’t revive people anymore because I fear that I will insta-die myself from the infinite poison clouds that they’re sitting in. I just let them die and they can run back themselves.

GSTim.8094:

Every good WvW commander knows this rule: banner rez downed, leave defeated until fight is over. PvE is not an exclusion.

Triage…harsh, but necessary.

IceBlink.4317:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

5 people can rez you from fully dead in 15 seconds. it takes 1 minute to walk back. Until people learn to rez EVERYONE we probably won’t win the fight.

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is 75 seconds.
1 person running back is 60 seconds.

?

I call bs, first of all i died multiple times and I ran back in 15 secs, how do i know?
because his timer was at 1 min and i got there just in time for the 30 sec mark or so , i was even stunned along the way and had tons of conditions on me, but people just need to WP and run back if they die, if u are downed , we can help you, if you are dead, please for the love of all, dont be there akitten the ground saying , help, help, wth guys im down….

Narsil.6579:

I call bs, first of all*i died multiple times* and I < le snip >

I think we’ve determined the problem here.

Seriously though, the math is correct.

wasting the active time of five people for 15s is indeed 75s of wasted dps/active time
Which is wasteful compared to just running back, without even considering the risk of the rezzers getting downed because of the AoE spam.

Brutal Arts.6307:

Res the downed, dead people need to run back.

This. It is not worth the risk. People are not being mean or elitist, it simply is the best strategy.

If you die, waypoint and run back. We need your DPS, but we can’t afford getting more people killed while trying to ress you.

IceBlink.4317:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

5 people can rez you from fully dead in 15 seconds. it takes 1 minute to walk back. Until people learn to rez EVERYONE we probably won’t win the fight.

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is 75 seconds.
1 person running back is 60 seconds.

?

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is…………15 seconds. Not 1m 15sec. You dont multiply the time by the number of people.

Doesnt even matter really anyhoo because teq will down everyone ressing in 5 seconds flat.

Lexandro.1456:

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is…………15 seconds. Not 1m 15sec. You dont multiply the time by the number of people.

Doesnt even matter really anyhoo because teq will down everyone ressing in 5 seconds flat.

If you’re trying to determine how much DPS you’re losing, yes you do. All 5 players are spending their 15 seconds not attacking. That is a total of 1 minute 15 seconds of DPS lost.

Helicity.3416:

Narsil.6579:

I call bs, first of all*i died multiple times* and I < le snip >

I think we’ve determined the problem here.

Tbh I was in the canons then i was in front lines, dodging, etc, I even gave up at one point as to how so many were dead and i went for the jump achievement in the waves (awesome), and the dodge the tail attack. Meanwhile people were pestering about me ressing them, I tried but i got down to 90% myself because everyone else was either dead, on their way to death, or whining, or those cond puddles and fingers… I just gave up and went for the achievements..

Lexandro.1456:

IceBlink.4317:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

5 people can rez you from fully dead in 15 seconds. it takes 1 minute to walk back. Until people learn to rez EVERYONE we probably won’t win the fight.

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is 75 seconds.
1 person running back is 60 seconds.

?

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is…………15 seconds. Not 1m 15sec. You dont multiply the time by the number of people.

Doesnt even matter really anyhoo because teq will down everyone ressing in 5 seconds flat.

You absolutely DO multiply the time.

Narsil.6579:

Helicity.3416:

Narsil.6579:

I call bs, first of all*i died multiple times* and I < le snip >

I think we’ve determined the problem here.

Tbh I was in the canons then i was in front lines, dodging, etc, I even gave up at one point as to how so many were dead and i went for the jump achievement in the waves (awesome), and the dodge the tail attack. Meanwhile people were pestering about me ressing them, I tried but i got down to 90% myself because everyone else was either dead, on their way to death, or whining, or those cond puddles and fingers… I just gave up and went for the achievements..

I was making a joke, I’m glad you took it well

Let’s not even discuss the wonderful sequence of events that is this:

1) break bonewall
2) can’t see kitten because of bonewall dust
3) get hit by wave which you could not see in dust
4) wave bounces you through 3 poison fields

Yeah… great fun this encounter.

For those wonderiing which wp is fastest to use to get back into the action , go for [Brooloonu Waypoint] quick swim nothing more.

People downed need to stop being lazy and run back. Rezzing them will only make the event fail. They have to waste time rezzing, they aren’t doing damage plus the way the AOE just randomly shows up and can’t even be seen, you run the risk of just getting yourself killed at the expense of someone that isn’t currently contributing.

Rez those that are downed, but if you’re defeated, you need to get off your kitten and run back.

SynfulChaot.3169:

Lexandro.1456:

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is…………15 seconds. Not 1m 15sec. You dont multiply the time by the number of people.

Doesnt even matter really anyhoo because teq will down everyone ressing in 5 seconds flat.

If you’re trying to determine how much DPS you’re losing, yes you do. All 5 players are spending their 15 seconds not attacking. That is a total of 1 minute 15 seconds of DPS lost.

15 seconds is 15 seconds. You do not multiply time by participants. Its a total of 15 seconds of DPS lost per person, it is not 1m 15 of lost DPS. Its FIFTEEN SECONDS, precisely because that is the time lost. There is a destinction between the two.

That is if 5 people decide to rez that 1 person? what if they all die in the process, so many freaking variables, the way a zerg or group works is not by just counting everyone as a whole, rather smaller sub units working on their own behalf but working together in unison to achieve a goal, that one person may be dead but what baout the others trying to stay alive as well??

Lexandro.1456:

SynfulChaot.3169:

Lexandro.1456:

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is…………15 seconds. Not 1m 15sec. You dont multiply the time by the number of people.

Doesnt even matter really anyhoo because teq will down everyone ressing in 5 seconds flat.

If you’re trying to determine how much DPS you’re losing, yes you do. All 5 players are spending their 15 seconds not attacking. That is a total of 1 minute 15 seconds of DPS lost.

15 seconds is 15 seconds. You do not multiply time by participants. Its a total of 15 seconds of DPS lost per person, it is not 1m 15 of lost DPS. Its FIFTEEN SECONDS, precisely because that is the time lost. DPS is relative, it is totally different between players.

You cannot make 15 seconds lost per person become 1min+ because it is physically impossible.

I don’t know how to tell you this but… you’re dead wrong.

let’s say each player does 1000 dps

you can have 1 player spend 60s running back, that means you lose 60*1000 = 60000 damage

-or-

you can have 5 players spend 15s rezzing, that means you lose 15*1000 damage per player, times 5 players = 75000 damage

nothing is happening to the time something is happening to the amount of time the players are contributing effectively.

I don’t know how to explain it to you any simpler than this.

Lexandro.1456:

SynfulChaot.3169:

If you’re trying to determine how much DPS you’re losing, yes you do. All 5 players are spending their 15 seconds not attacking. That is a total of 1 minute 15 seconds of DPS lost.

15 seconds is 15 seconds. You do not multiply time by participants. Its a total of 15 seconds of DPS lost per person, it is not 1m 15 of lost DPS. Its FIFTEEN SECONDS, precisely because that is the time lost. There is a destinction between the two.

Helicity just explained the error in your logic. If you can’t understand why Helicity and myself are correct here, then you may want to look into basic logic and math.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

5 people can rez you from fully dead in 15 seconds. it takes 1 minute to walk back. Until people learn to rez EVERYONE we probably won’t win the fight.

5 people sitting there for 15 seconds are a bigger waste than 1 person running back for 1 minute.

Downed get rezed, defeated need to stop being lazy and get the kitten on with running back. Wish Teq’s acid caused dead player’s gear to break over time so they’d stop whining and get a move on.

SynfulChaot.3169:

Lexandro.1456:

SynfulChaot.3169:

If you’re trying to determine how much DPS you’re losing, yes you do. All 5 players are spending their 15 seconds not attacking. That is a total of 1 minute 15 seconds of DPS lost.

15 seconds is 15 seconds. You do not multiply time by participants. Its a total of 15 seconds of DPS lost per person, it is not 1m 15 of lost DPS. Its FIFTEEN SECONDS, precisely because that is the time lost. There is a destinction between the two.

Helicity just explained the error in your logic. If you can’t understand why Helicity and myself are correct here, then you may want to look into basic logic and math.

Logic yes, but you have a bunch of unorganized people doing 1 event together and here is why the logic of 5 people stopping to rez 1 guy fails:

That is if 5 people decide to rez that 1 person? what if they all die in the process, so many freaking variables, the way a zerg or group works is not by just counting everyone as a whole, rather smaller sub units working on their own behalf but working together in unison to achieve a goal, that one person may be dead but what baout the others trying to stay alive as well??

Short version: Everyone is out to stay alive, everyone is trying to do damage or defend, everyone is also looking out for themselves, and if they are hurt, or just as well as dead, they wont stop to get 1 guy up, unless you want a chain of dead bodies to pile up from everyone trying to res one another.

Helicity.3416:

Lexandro.1456:

SynfulChaot.3169:

Lexandro.1456:

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is…………15 seconds. Not 1m 15sec. You dont multiply the time by the number of people.

Doesnt even matter really anyhoo because teq will down everyone ressing in 5 seconds flat.

If you’re trying to determine how much DPS you’re losing, yes you do. All 5 players are spending their 15 seconds not attacking. That is a total of 1 minute 15 seconds of DPS lost.

15 seconds is 15 seconds. You do not multiply time by participants. Its a total of 15 seconds of DPS lost per person, it is not 1m 15 of lost DPS. Its FIFTEEN SECONDS, precisely because that is the time lost. DPS is relative, it is totally different between players.

You cannot make 15 seconds lost per person become 1min+ because it is physically impossible.

I don’t know how to tell you this but… you’re dead wrong.

let’s say each player does 1000 dps

you can have 1 player spend 60s running back, that means you lose 60*1000 = 60000 damage

-or-

you can have 5 players spend 15s rezzing, that means you lose 15*1000 damage per player, times 5 players = 75000 damage

nothing is happening to the time something is happening to the amount of time the players are contributing effectively.

I don’t know how to explain it to you any simpler than this.

That is exactly what I was referring to. The damage is what is multiplied not the actual time. The time is constant and unchanging. It is 15 seconds, no more no less. Which is what I said specifically there is a destinction between the two.

Far to many people no longer use the term DPS correctly anymore. Infact one chap earlier claimed he did 50k DPS. Not spike damage, or burst, but 50k DPS.

If you’re downed and not on a hot spot I’ll try to res as I’m sure plenty of others try as well, I see it all the time. Now if you’re dead, just run back, you won’t get rezzed and don’t expect to be, period.

Lexandro.1456:

Helicity.3416:

Lexandro.1456:

SynfulChaot.3169:

Lexandro.1456:

5 people not attacking in 15 seconds is…………15 seconds. Not 1m 15sec. You dont multiply the time by the number of people.

Doesnt even matter really anyhoo because teq will down everyone ressing in 5 seconds flat.

If you’re trying to determine how much DPS you’re losing, yes you do. All 5 players are spending their 15 seconds not attacking. That is a total of 1 minute 15 seconds of DPS lost.

15 seconds is 15 seconds. You do not multiply time by participants. Its a total of 15 seconds of DPS lost per person, it is not 1m 15 of lost DPS. Its FIFTEEN SECONDS, precisely because that is the time lost. DPS is relative, it is totally different between players.

You cannot make 15 seconds lost per person become 1min+ because it is physically impossible.

I don’t know how to tell you this but… you’re dead wrong.

let’s say each player does 1000 dps

you can have 1 player spend 60s running back, that means you lose 60*1000 = 60000 damage

-or-

you can have 5 players spend 15s rezzing, that means you lose 15*1000 damage per player, times 5 players = 75000 damage

nothing is happening to the time something is happening to the amount of time the players are contributing effectively.

I don’t know how to explain it to you any simpler than this.

That is exactly what I was referring to. The damage is what is multiplied not the actual time. The time is constant and unchanging. It is 15 seconds, no more no less. Which is what I said specifically there is a destinction between the two.

Far to many people no longer use the term DPS correctly anymore. Infact one chap earlier claimed he did 50k DPS. Not spike damage, or burst, but 50k DPS.

You’re nitpicking and arguing semantics. The point remains that rezzing your dead behind is wasteful and risky, and nobody should do it. Walk the kitten back.

Or better yet, stop dying.

Helicity.3416:

You’re nitpicking and arguing semantics. The point remains that rezzing your dead behind is wasteful and risky, and nobody should do it. Walk the kitten back.

Or better yet, stop dying.

As I said already Im not the one dying and demading a rez. Infact I am often the one pinging the two nearest WP for people to rez at.

And Im sorry you feel I am arguing semantics or nitpicking but to me there is a clear destinction between the two, which everyone ignored.

In my experience a group rez of a dead person takes only a few seconds. I feel that it is selfish for large groups not rez. And I feel bad when I’m playing with a lot of people behaving that way. If someone goes down near me I’ll try and rez. And I really don’t care if I’m the only one.

Anne Bathory.8150:

In my experience a group rez of a dead person takes only a few seconds. I feel that it is selfish for large groups not rez. And I feel bad when I’m playing with a lot of people behaving that way. If someone goes down near me I’ll try and rez. And I really don’t care if I’m the only one.

If someone doesn’t run back and waits for rez, they’re taking out more dps/heals/support than if you just ran back. It’s selfish of the person not to run back.

There’s a difference between downed and dead. No one is saying not to help downed.

Lexandro.1456:

That is exactly what I was referring to. The damage is what is multiplied not the actual time. The time is constant and unchanging. It is 15 seconds, no more no less. Which is what I said specifically there is a destinction between the two.

There is a distinction between the two figures you are comparing, neither of which gives you the figure that the other posters are discussing, which requires all three units to be multiplied in some expression. Expressing the final figure as a product of man-hours is no less correct than the intermediate units you are using.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

5 people can rez you from fully dead in 15 seconds. it takes 1 minute to walk back. Until people learn to rez EVERYONE we probably won’t win the fight.

^^100% this

The Temple of Grenth has taught players a bunch of bad habits.

Ressing people that are actually dead (not downed, revive downed if at all possible) is costing more then you gain when you consider that the person could res and return within a minute. The various reasons are in the posts above.

Leablo.2651:

Lexandro.1456:

That is exactly what I was referring to. The damage is what is multiplied not the actual time. The time is constant and unchanging. It is 15 seconds, no more no less. Which is what I said specifically there is a destinction between the two.

There is a distinction between the two figures you are comparing, neither of which gives you the figure that the other posters are discussing, which requires all three units to be multiplied in some expression. Expressing the final figure as a product of man-hours is no less correct than the intermediate units you are using.

Here is my problem with reviving the dead players however. If they are dead in a place that CLEARLY they can not be safely revived, such as in melee range of tequatl, then it is not worth it for me to try to revive them, as it will result in my death as well. Now if they are in a semi-safe zone and not surrounded by poison clouds and risen, I will definitely revive them.
The expectation that you will pay no waypoint fees for an event of this high difficulty, its just silly. You pay waypoint fees all the time. If your wallet is really that worried about it, do a frostgorge sound champ hunt run, or a CoF path 1 run, and poof, all your waypoint fees are covered.

Just an addition to math-n-logic posts.
Its not 5*15 dps, its 6*15 dps. Dead man is still dead man till he’s rezzed
Which makes WP strat 50% more efficient.
Banner rez downed, defeated should teleport WP and come back.

PS: BTW i’m always back there in 20 sec, idk what route do you take. LA transit, maybe?

Some people spawn at the caer? I didnt test both but I found swimming from the quaggan village is better because there are hardly any mobs slowing you down.