Guild Wars 2

Eurogamer Expo 2013

“We were hoping originally it would take days/weeks for players to defeat Tequatl instead of 12 hours.”

My first attempt with organized group was successful.

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

Ha. Right. You got lucky.

I’ve defeated him 3 times out of 4. That one loss was because of random wave at less than 25%.

funny how at the same time some people are complaining that it is too hard xD

the game finally has 1 hard enemy and people complain lol

what do they lose??
nothing

if the enemy is that hard that noone can beat him then noone else will get the rewards too

and if an organized group manages to kill the boss then they deserve the rewards

i just dont see any reason why people would complain

if they want easy bosses then they should stick with shatterer, jormag and all the other world bosses
but that doesnt deserve to give good rewards then…

We’re not complaining about the boss being hard. The OP said he isn’t hard enough.

Like ALL PvE content, if it’s possible it eventually becomes easy.

Lol the 3 times I’ve attempted Tequalt all I hear is “can’t wait for them to nerf him”, “it’s about time for a nef now”, etc. LMAO.

Some people do find it hard.

Me too. But I think that, like dungeons, first no one knows what to do and they are hard, then someone figures it out (blackgate), someone posts a topic about how to do it, organized groups learn how to do it (TC), eventually everyone knows what to do and it becomes rote.

To me, this is the problem inherent in PvE content. That’s why whenever people ask for a challenge I direct them to check out PvP.

I think Teq was perfect content to add to the game. I have never completed it, I’ve only tried twice. But I know it can be done.

For another example, look at the Obsidian Sanctum, that was a pain the first time, now it’s easy.

TooBz.3065:

Me too. But I think that, like dungeons, first no one knows what to do and they are hard, then someone figures it out (blackgate), someone posts a topic about how to do it, organized groups learn how to do it (TC), eventually everyone knows what to do and it becomes rote.

To me, this is the problem inherent in PvE content. That’s why whenever people ask for a challenge I direct them to check out PvP.

I think Teq was perfect content to add to the game. I have never completed it, I’ve only tried twice. But I know it can be done.

For another example, look at the Obsidian Sanctum, that was a pain the first time, now it’s easy.

/Agreed, all content it like this.

The first time or two its hard, because of the learning curve. After that… it goes much more smoothly.

Ah fond memories…

Sadly, I will probably never defeat this boss because I refuse to get to the zone an hour early and sit there twiddling my thumbs waiting for him to spawn. If I go do other stuff while waiting and try to zone in when he starts attacking, I get dumped into overflow which is a sure failure.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Sadly, I will probably never defeat this boss because I refuse to get to the zone an hour early and sit there twiddling my thumbs waiting for him to spawn. If I go do other stuff while waiting and try to zone in when he starts attacking, I get dumped into overflow which is a sure failure.

Anvil rock is never full when I’m around, never an overflow in sight. I always map in 2-3 minutes after it starts, but then again…we’ve lost every time I’ve tried as well. (Then again, I never expected a handful of people to be able to do it either)

Once the newness dies down and they stop announcing to other maps when Teq goes active it will probably calm down and not spawn an overflow every time anymore.

That’s when ANet should begin to decide if he needs a nerf or a buff.

But if he needs a nerf it does not need to be back down to his old difficulty level.

i dont think the difficulty is around the fight itself, but more-so, just being at the right place at the right time.

The right place being a full server, and the right time being when enough people are on that know the fight.

Nick.6972:

Eurogamer Expo 2013

“We were hoping originally it would take days/weeks for players to defeat Tequatl instead of 12 hours.”

My first attempt with organized group was successful.

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

What bothered me most about that comment is that it show just how ignorant the Devs were of developments made throughout the past years in MMOs.

If ANet had any understanding of their player-base they’d know that a large portion of it has had years and years of experience doing various kinds of raid-encounters.

Raid encounters that are dozens of times more complex and demanding than anything ANet has created to date.

As it stands, it is simply not possible to create beatable content to today’s MMO players that is no beaten within a week (unless hidden behind artificial gating mechanics). If it’s killable, it will die within a week, period.

Blizzard has made sure of that by creating such cutting edge raid-content that players developed this mentality.

It may not apply to the player base at large, but you only need a dedicated few to beat most content.

Dee Jay.2460:

Nick.6972:

Eurogamer Expo 2013

“We were hoping originally it would take days/weeks for players to defeat Tequatl instead of 12 hours.”

My first attempt with organized group was successful.

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

What bothered me most about that comment is that it show just how ignorant the Devs were of developments made throughout the past years in MMOs.

If ANet had any understanding of their player-base they’d know that a large portion of it has had years and years of experience doing various kinds of raid-encounters.

Raid encounters that are dozens of times more complex and demanding than anything ANet has created to date.

As it stands, it is simply not possible to create beatable content to today’s MMO players that is no beaten within a week (unless hidden behind artificial gating mechanics). If it’s killable, it will die within a week, period.

Blizzard has made sure of that by creating such cutting edge raid-content that players developed this mentality.

It may not apply to the player base at large, but you only need a dedicated few to beat most content.

my experience with WoW is that progression through a raid occurs by throwing your bodies at the raid until enough people get geared up in the process. Once you cross that stat threshhold you can start dropping more bosses. I haven’t played WoW in a while, so this may have changed…but gear is a much bigger factor for progress in WoW compared to GW2.

Nick.6972:

I’ve defeated him 3 times out of 4. That one loss was because of random wave at less than 25%.

Try being among the group of players that doesn’t sit in sparkfly with 99 other zergers to ensure you are in main. This is impossible with less than 100 people, I’ve never seen an overflow with more than 40.

Well, remember GW1? People played UW/FoW for years even though it almost never changed, and it was hardcore content. I don’t recall anyone ever complaining about it.

Personally, I think this game lacks decent hardcore team content with more than 5 players.

Nick.6972:

Well, remember GW1? People player UW/FoW for years even though it almost never changed, and it was hardcore content. I don’t recall anyone ever complaining about it.

Personally, I think this game lacks decent hardcore team content with more than 5 players.

They played it for years because they were the only places to obtain shards and ecto, which were necessary for FoW armor, and sold really well. The same could be said of DoA…people were after the gems to get the armbraces to get the weapons, all of which could be sold lucratively. The Deep and Urgoz were ‘elite’ content, but until the revamps, were essentially dead, and even after, still didn’t see the traffic the other 3 places did. Why? The rewards sold for little to nothing.

People weren’t necessarily doing it because it was hard content, or because they enjoyed it. They did it for the farming… which is why you found far more farmers than actual groups in the ToA. After the addition of the end chests, its why speed clears came into play. People didn’t want to ‘do’ the content, they just wanted to get the rewards as quickly as possible…

Dee Jay.2460:

Nick.6972:

Eurogamer Expo 2013

“We were hoping originally it would take days/weeks for players to defeat Tequatl instead of 12 hours.”

My first attempt with organized group was successful.

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

What bothered me most about that comment is that it show just how ignorant the Devs were of developments made throughout the past years in MMOs.

If ANet had any understanding of their player-base they’d know that a large portion of it has had years and years of experience doing various kinds of raid-encounters.

Raid encounters that are dozens of times more complex and demanding than anything ANet has created to date.

As it stands, it is simply not possible to create beatable content to today’s MMO players that is no beaten within a week (unless hidden behind artificial gating mechanics). If it’s killable, it will die within a week, period.

Blizzard has made sure of that by creating such cutting edge raid-content that players developed this mentality.

It may not apply to the player base at large, but you only need a dedicated few to beat most content.

You know arrogant players falls under this as well, it’s like I beat it, pfffft what’s wrong with the rest of you. It’s like the saying “kitten ed if you do and kitten ed if you don’t”.

Nick.6972:

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

Harder /= fun, which is what they made the Teq fight. I can finally get into Sparkfly in my home server to try the fight because everyone realized it was boring and a waste of time. Golem Mk2 should be the target they’re shooting for here: They made it harder AND more fun at the same time.

rizzo.1079:

Nick.6972:

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

Harder /= fun, which is what they made the Teq fight. I can finally get into Sparkfly in my home server to try the fight because everyone realized it was boring and a waste of time. Golem Mk2 should be the target they’re shooting for here: They made it harder AND more fun at the same time.

+1 to you good sir, I am of the camp that believes the other remakes of the bosses were the real reveal this time around. The electic fields around the mark II are deadly, but give you an out in that you must get out of them. The timer on the shatterer insures that there will be players on the mortars, and making there be no safe spots for the jormag fight means players have to pay attention. IMO teq is just an experiment in futility if you don’t have perfect conditions. DPS not high enough… not gonna happen, afk/untaught guy on the turret(s).. nope there too, overflow without any co-ordination forget it.

I could go on. As it sits now I look at someone with the title I am more likely to think he camped it for 3 days straight in the beginning of the week or got it with a dedicated guild in a pre-determined overflow. IMO for open world content I give it a C-.

Well what a lot of players do not understand, not every server has 80 players to fight him… Last night we only had about 20 people. Trying to defend 3 turrets + kill him in 15 mins is almost impossible. We didn’t even get him down to 75%.

~Henge of Denravi, Night Crew = Very low amount of people. Maybe I should Guest to do it :-/

rizzo.1079:

Nick.6972:

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

Harder /= fun, which is what they made the Teq fight. I can finally get into Sparkfly in my home server to try the fight because everyone realized it was boring and a waste of time. Golem Mk2 should be the target they’re shooting for here: They made it harder AND more fun at the same time.

The Golem is only slightly harder. You don’t have to do much kiting, since they shrunk the electric fields he spawns. The Fire Ele is much harder though. He spawns little embers on top of you, regardless of where you stand. And his multi fire rain thingy can easily down you, and then get killed by the roaming embers.

But I digress. Teq is a lot of fun, because it requires team work and coordination to complete. I would love to see it even harder.

Hmm come on guys what the hell,

The game is 1 year+ old, if they made TQ from day 1 it would took atleast 6 months to get him down.

We are just too skilled and too organized.

Also if there was no Guesting I think only 2-3 servers would have brought it down.

When tequati first come out she would bug and her timer would comply stop. You could call that a win but i do not know. Any way once you beat her now you must get the best time.

Nick.6972:

Eurogamer Expo 2013

“We were hoping originally it would take days/weeks for players to defeat Tequatl instead of 12 hours.”

My first attempt with organized group was successful.

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

wow, just wow, one organized group defeated him within 12 hours. There are many more people that haven’t been in a group that is able to defeat him. One can spend 8 hours (7-8 attempts) a day and still not succeed with the kill. That certainly does NOT make it easy content.

Nick.6972:

My first attempt with organized group was successful.

And how soon after the release was that?
Information like that is very relevant in this case.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Sadly, I will probably never defeat this boss because I refuse to get to the zone an hour early and sit there twiddling my thumbs waiting for him to spawn. If I go do other stuff while waiting and try to zone in when he starts attacking, I get dumped into overflow which is a sure failure.

This. I tried maybe 5 times in overflow and never even came close. I do not want to sit around for an hour either since that constitutes pretty much all my free game time in a day.

The primary obstacle to most players completing this fight is the access as they join disorganized overflows or find insufficient people in the home server zone. If the developer’s intent was to restrict completion of this event to well led guilds with the organization to control a zone (or overflow) then access should have been been primarily designed with that intent as well.

Tequatl’s difficulty comes for the wrong reasons. He requires more organisation than you can expect from a random group of players, but the only way to gather specific players is to camp out a server or overflow until only players that are worth having around are there.

That is to say, the hardest part of the fight is spending over an hour getting all the people in your organised run into the same place. Having beaten him 3 times myself, there isn’t much technical difficulty for individual players. Heal when necessary, walk out of circles and jump occasionally while doing the best DPS you can if you’re on the front line, and simply use skills via a priority list while on turrets. Turret defence is basically an ordinary wave defence event except people get angry if you do badly.

But we’re only rewarded for the 20 minutes the fight takes. Interest is already dwindling in my server after we’ve downed him 4 times with not one player getting a Sunless weapon. It’s just not worth the effort to many of us, and once you can’t gather the critical mass of players willing to coordinate to beat the encounter, it will stop succeeding.

Player interest is going to die off rapidly once the living story moves on, because nobody wants to wait for over an hour for a chance that they’ll get some greens and yellows and a tiny, tiny chance of something better – it’s just that that’s all we have to do right now in the living story.

What the fight needs is some way to properly organise it, like a researchable guild mission that creates a personal instance which is invite only, with the fight able to start on demand. So instead of waiting for up to 2 hours for the dragon to spawn, the players go to sparkfly, join the guild instance and just… fight him as soon as everybody’s ready.

It’s the first big boss they revamp and its perfectly fine the way it is. It showed people that they can no longer just press 1 and watch TV. Wait for the next bosses to come, I’m sure some will be harder, other easier but pretty much around this level. You don’t need an event that only 80 players max lvl max gear with voice chat can defeat… it will bring nothing but (justified) rage from the rest of the player base. If any, something like that should be closed for guild missions or raids.

Every MMO I have ever played, and that’s a lot, the PVE will always become “easy” given enough time. It all pretty much will end up being on “farm” status for most people….it’s inevitable. Why? Because PVE encounters are usually scripted events that just take time to figure out and/or a “gear check” element to them.

If you want dynamic challenges with an opponent who can act differently every time you face them and learns from your actions you need to PvP. It’s as simple as that. Maybe someday Dev’s will create bosses or encounters where the mobs react like players would be more prone to but that day is probably pretty far down the road. Though, I’m not sure a lot of hard core PVE’ers would really even want that since it seems the enjoyment they get from encounters is learning the scripted encounter in the first place.

Tequatl isn’t hard though, he just has a lot of health a 15 minute timer.

Literally the only hard part is having to organized 100+ randoms….. It’s a joke IMO.

Can we have real content now that doesn’t have to do with zergs?

Orangensaft.7139:

funny how at the same time some people are complaining that it ikittenoo hard xD

the game finally has 1 hard enemy and people complain lol

what do they lose??
nothing

if the enemy ikittenhat hard that noone can beat him then noone else will get the rewardkittenoo

and if an organized group managekitteno kill the bokittenhen they deserve the rewards

i jukitten dont see any reason why people would complain

if they want easy bossekittenhen they should kittenick with shatterer, jormag and all the other world bosses
but that doesnt deserve to give good rewardkittenhen…

Actually we did lose something. I’ll let you think real hard about what it is.

Nick.6972:

Eurogamer Expo 2013

“We were hoping originally it would take days/weeks for players to defeat Tequatl instead of 12 hours.”

My first attempt with organized group was successful.

With this, hopefully Arena Net realizes that they have to make even harder content.

HAHAHAHA…..
Well …. maybe…. if they had….. Oh I don’t know… ACTUALLY MADE IT “HARD”?
…as in require Creativity, individual skill, Diverse builds, real intelligence??

No…. why bother with any of that stuff when you can just copy-paste your DPS-Check formula loaded with insta-kill hazards into everything that’s supposed to pass as a challenge. …..It’s almost like Anet completely forgot who their core Playerbase was when they began this thing.

Their core playerbase ….. is the DPS specialist … has been ever since the first game.
To not know this, you’d had to have been completely ignoring the forums here where every single multi-page non-trolling topic about their content, turns into a solid spreadsheet of number crunchers building walls of DPS data to explain every single fight and then usually there’s a video of a Speed-clear supporting it.

Dungeon forums especially, it’s all they ever talk about. And Anet would have to be blind or just not ever reading it to……. wait what am I saying, of course they never read that place =P

.

Basically… if they want “hard challenges” for people… then they need to actually spend the money to HIRE SOME AI PROGRAMMERS. ….if you want your mobs to present a real challenge, they have to be smarter than a chalkboard
(we’ve also been saying ^this^ for a solid year now in the dungeon forum too)

Mesket.5728:

It’kittenhe firkitten big bokittenhey revamp and its perfectly fine the way it is. It showed people that they can no longer jukitten press 1 and watch TV.

Well no it’s not perfectly fine it’s in no way fun at all.

If you were ‘press 1 akitteng’ before then you were one of the people who I’d have to res after the old Teq fight because you were jukitten kittenanding in poison pools and dying. Thanks!

Edit: Ha ha ha broken word filter ‘kitten kitten kitten’

Well, even organised group doesn’t succeed 100%. Sometimes, not enough dps is not enough dps.

Afya.5842:

Well, even organised group doesn’t succeed 100%. Sometimes, not enough dps is not enough dps.

Not enough DPS, is because there’s too many people there using Condition builds and not nearly enough with Ascended weapons. A full PVT Armor set with melee weaps is ideal, but Valk’s and Zerks can get it done too so long as there isn’t too many scrub rangers standing there with 60% of the damage of a real class

The fight is only hard because you have to depend on random players and afk’ers and because it is impossible on low population servers. If this was an instanced raid, it would be faceroll easy.

rizzo.1079:

Mesket.5728:

It’kittenhe firkitten big bokittenhey revamp and its perfectly fine the way it is. It showed people that they can no longer jukitten press 1 and watch TV.

Well no it’s not perfectly fine it’s in no way fun at all.

If you were ‘press 1 akitteng’ before then you were one of the people who I’d have to res after the old Teq fight because you were just standing in poison pools and dying. Thanks!

Edit: Ha ha ha broken word filter ‘kitten kitten kitten’

Teq is not the only world boss.

No I don’t just press 1. I’m talking for the usual mass of blue names behind at range on dragons.

I like this Teql and like or not, its staying as it is for another year.

Kittens… kittens everywhere!

I’m rather more puzzled that they putted in such lackluster rewards for something that, according to them, should have required days or weeks.

I sometimes think that posters like the OP get a charge out of posting that they don’t find supposedly hard content to be hard — stroking the ego, as it were. Other times I think that those with superlative twitch reflexes will never find _*PvE*_content hard after they learn the mechanics of the game and encounter. That makes me wonder why they are looking for challenge in PvE, instead of looking where it can actually be found, in PvP.

great, you are awesome, or very good at piking. The lesser creatures of the player base tremble in awe. Here, have a rng cookie.

Mesket.5728:

rizzo.1079:

Mesket.5728:

It’kittenhe firkitten big bokittenhey revamp and its perfectly fine the way it is. It showed people that they can no longer jukitten press 1 and watch TV.

Well no it’s not perfectly fine it’s in no way fun at all.

If you were ‘press 1 akitteng’ before then you were one of the people who I’d have to res after the old Teq fight because you were just standing in poison pools and dying. Thanks!

Edit: Ha ha ha broken word filter ‘kitten kitten kitten’

Teq is not the only world boss.

No I don’t just press 1. I’m talking for the usual mass of blue names behind at range on dragons.

I like this Teql and like or not, its staying as it is for another year.

Kittens… kittens everywhere!

No it’s not, but it’s a world boss that won’t get killed on most servers right now and therefore it’s mostly wasted content.
I hear a lot about this mythical ‘press 1 afk’ beast, but I’ve been doing boss battles since before you were even likely to get a rare from them and I’ve never actually met one.

If they keep taking away fun encounters and replacing them with frustrating, unrewarding content, the new Teq will be here next year but a lot of players won’t.

IndigoSundown.5419:

I sometimes think that posters like the OP get a charge out of posting that they don’t find supposedly hard content to be hard — stroking the ego, as it were. Other times I think that those with superlative twitch reflexes will never find _*PvE*_content hard after they learn the mechanics of the game and encounter. That makes me wonder why they are looking for challenge in PvE, instead of looking where it can actually be found, in PvP.

I tried PvP here b/c in Shooters & every other genre that supports it, it’s all I ever do….
But I found it to be even more disappointing than Gw1’s PvP which I couldn’t stand in larger doses either. (it’s still all gimmicks and terrible matchups until you got into the the t100 HA/GvG ranks). But FYI…. there actually WERE some genuine PvE challenges and better AI in that game than we’re seeing here so far….

rizzo.1079:

Mesket.5728:

rizzo.1079:

Mesket.5728:

It’kittenhe firkitten big bokittenhey revamp and its perfectly fine the way it is. It showed people that they can no longer jukitten press 1 and watch TV.

Well no it’s not perfectly fine it’s in no way fun at all.

If you were ‘press 1 akitteng’ before then you were one of the people who I’d have to res after the old Teq fight because you were just standing in poison pools and dying. Thanks!

Edit: Ha ha ha broken word filter ‘kitten kitten kitten’

Teq is not the only world boss.

No I don’t just press 1. I’m talking for the usual mass of blue names behind at range on dragons.

I like this Teql and like or not, its staying as it is for another year.

Kittens… kittens everywhere!

No it’s not, but it’s a world boss that won’t get killed on most servers right now and therefore it’s mostly wasted content.
I hear a lot about this mythical ‘press 1 afk’ beast, but I’ve been doing boss battles since before you were even likely to get a rare from them and I’ve never actually met one.

If they keep taking away fun encounters and replacing them with frustrating, unrewarding content, the new Teq will be here next year but a lot of players won’t.

I don’t understand your point.

If you find it fun before, then it is pretty much the same now. Only difference is that it won’t die so easily and it has a couple more melee skills.

the way it was before you can stand at the left of his right hand (below his mouth) and just AFK auto attack. If a pool landed there (rare because that spot is a safe spot since day 1) you can always step 2 meters to the back of his hand and keep auto-attacking.

The fight it’s exactly the same as before, only a bit harder; but no rocket science.

Now,… if what bugs you is that you can’t kill him every time you go there… well.. you either stop going for a while or give the player base some time until they figure it out.

rizzo.1079:

I hear a lot about this mythical ‘press 1 afk’ beast, but I’ve been doing boss battles since before you were even likely to get a rare from them and I’ve never actually met one.

The Shatterer (aka The Beast) would like to have a word with you.

No, now it’s at the mercy of people who grief or don’t know how to use the turrets. It’s at the mercy of only 20 people being there in prime time. Having to guest to a different server, download software and get on voice chat with people I don’t know just to have a chance at possibly killing him for no more reward than previously is not fun, it’s cumbersome and frustrating.

If you’re afk how are you going to step back 2 meters? What happens when he fears you and you run away and you’re afk, how do you get back?

It’s not actually any harder…in fact the dragon himself is slightly easier because the roar only has one application of fear now so it’s really easy to dodge.

No, what bugs me is that I have to jump through procedural hoops to have any hope of killing him. It’s never seeing him even get to 90% health, never mind the first reward tier at 75%. It’s not fun nor is it challenging, it’s frustrating and annoying.

I’m not even going to bring up the overflow problem which only goes away once a server abandons the fight…

IddQd (SR) New time

I have no problem with it being hard, what i have a problem with is how it relies too much on the turrets when every server i have tried teq on has people who have no idea what to do jumping on them and not getting off or doing what they need to do. I have tried him about a dozen times so far since he came out and have yet to be in a group to get him below 75% percent because of morons on the turrets. Not to mention the fact i now have to guest on other servers to even attempt him because on my server there is absolutely no one there.

I hope in the future they they don’t make the fight rely so heavily on a couple people on turrets to do their job without some way to get them off so people who know how to do it can. They can make it as hard as they want and i will be fine with it, just come up with better ways to make it hard.

This boss was NOT made for only guilds! Anet is not going to take content away from everyone and giving it towards large guilds. As some new guild mission or raid.