Guild Wars 2

http://www.twitch.tv/helsethgw2/b/448269164
I can agree with every. single. word.

Helseth’s relation with Arenanet isn’t really flawless, but I hope they at least watch his videos when he is speaking the total truth. He deserves that much. He speaks what’s in the mind of hte 99% of players.

And we deserve that much that devs will watch the rant of the week series. Because he speaks the truth

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier. Is the argument that everyone deserved good prizes? “Participation Gems”? No, there is no argument, he never backs anything up, just says it and expects you to agree. And you do. GGWP Helseth.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

Mammoth.1975:

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

If you stopped after 30 secs then you are ignorant and aren’t able to contibute to the topic. And catching a half sentence and attacking that isn’t real reason.

Mammoth.1975:

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

The small amount of hyperbole doesn’t really detract from the main points of the videos I’ve seen from him so far.

Leuca.5732:

Mammoth.1975:

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

The small amount of hyperbole doesn’t really detract from the main points of the videos I’ve seen from him so far.

I spend a lot of time on this forum, ‘a small amount of hyperbole’ I can accept. Yet I can’t make it through these videos. Think about it.

If I wanted to hear a series of completely erroneous statements presented as ‘facts’, I’d go to a political rally.

Mammoth.1975:

Leuca.5732:

Mammoth.1975:

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

The small amount of hyperbole doesn’t really detract from the main points of the videos I’ve seen from him so far.

I spend a lot of time on this forum, ‘a small amount of hyperbole’ I can accept. Yet I can’t make it through these videos. Think about it. If I wanted to hear a series of completely erroneous statements presented as ‘facts’, I’d go to a political rally.

That’s alot to pull from only 30 seconds into the video…

Pyriall.5027:

Mammoth.1975:

Leuca.5732:

Mammoth.1975:

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

The small amount of hyperbole doesn’t really detract from the main points of the videos I’ve seen from him so far.

I spend a lot of time on this forum, ‘a small amount of hyperbole’ I can accept. Yet I can’t make it through these videos. Think about it. If I wanted to hear a series of completely erroneous statements presented as ‘facts’, I’d go to a political rally.

That’s alot to pull from only 30 seconds into the video…

Isn’t it just?

Mammoth.1975:

Pyriall.5027:

Mammoth.1975:

Leuca.5732:

Mammoth.1975:

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

The small amount of hyperbole doesn’t really detract from the main points of the videos I’ve seen from him so far.

I spend a lot of time on this forum, ‘a small amount of hyperbole’ I can accept. Yet I can’t make it through these videos. Think about it. If I wanted to hear a series of completely erroneous statements presented as ‘facts’, I’d go to a political rally.

That’s alot to pull from only 30 seconds into the video…

Isn’t it just?

Just what?

A lot to pull from only 30 seconds into the video.

Mammoth.1975:

Pyriall.5027:

Mammoth.1975:

Leuca.5732:

Mammoth.1975:

Stopped watching at about 30s in. Just like I do with every one of these when he makes some unsupported unsupportable claim almost immediately.

The priority was only in paid tournaments? The only difference between paid and free was better prizes and a higher entry barrier.

When he stops making obviously absurd statements I may make it through an entire one.

The small amount of hyperbole doesn’t really detract from the main points of the videos I’ve seen from him so far.

I spend a lot of time on this forum, ‘a small amount of hyperbole’ I can accept. Yet I can’t make it through these videos. Think about it. If I wanted to hear a series of completely erroneous statements presented as ‘facts’, I’d go to a political rally.

That’s alot to pull from only 30 seconds into the video…

Isn’t it just?

It’s clearly personal hate, newbieship, or problems with understanding points. You are incapable of discussing things, I don’t want to further this topic in this direction.

Leave or watch the full video and came back after you did. Thank you.

Or if you stay, what’s your pvp rank?

Mammoth.1975:

A lot to pull from only 30 seconds into the video.

Yes, given that in the first 30 seconds he hasn’t made any claims. So I’m guessing you watched more than 30 seconds.

Watched 30 seconds of bullkitten, turned it off, shared my opinion. Don’t post it if you can’t handle opinions on it. Circle jerk privately.

Mammoth.1975:

I spend a lot of time on this forum, ‘a small amount of hyperbole’ I can accept. Yet I can’t make it through these videos. Think about it.

If I wanted to hear a series of completely erroneous statements presented as ‘facts’, I’d go to a political rally.

He’s not presenting them as facts so much as commonly shared observations, and he’s very much correct in that sense. The fact that he takes the time to explain his concepts should make it self-evident that he doesn’t think they’re irrefutable and don’t need proper dialogue.

Mammoth.1975:

Watched 30 seconds of bullkitten, turned it off, shared my opinion. Don’t post it if you can’t handle opinions on it. Circle jerk privately.

So…in the first 30 seconds he says greetings and thanks Ron Pierce. I don’t see any outlandish claims or erroneous statements.

Someone telling someone to not post if they can’t handle opinions…very funny.

This time around (being the one who posted his last rant) I don’t fully agree with everything.
Even though Deathmatch would have been fun to play for giggles, it would not have changed the progression of the competitive scene.
It might have brought more players, but I don’t think we would have seen a huge difference.
Also, Fun should not always be prioritized, since every single successful competitive game is always balanced around pro-teams and the competitive scene, rather than just trying to make “fun” patches. (I don’t know the full story behind Super Smash Bro’s so it might be an exception, but tbh I didn’t even know it had a scene).
There have been examples of such, where the developers quickly realized that it was a bad move.

Regarding his last comment about excellent players dropping because of the small gap between skill-floor and skill-ceiling – Spot on.
The ability for average players to be in awe because something insane has happened is not there. I might have seen it once, where I was actually thinking to myself “Pretty nice move, I might not have thought of that”. Else I just keep thinking “Well. He didnt really do anything amazing, he basically spammed his skills and was lucky they hit”.
This is very different from CS:GO where something fascinating happens almost every single round, which is basically what the spectators want to see, and what drives a competitive scene.
Until that is changed, the scene won’t change either.

Mammoth.1975:

Circle jerk privately.

That’s exactly what I’m asking you to do.

I could handle opinions, if you had one, But you can’t have opinion on something you didn’t watch – only opinion on Helseth.

So you are satisfied with the meta, lack of variety, e-sport madness and other things. I see.

If you want to keep arguing, PM me. Thanks.

Pyriall.5027:

Mammoth.1975:

Watched 30 seconds of bullkitten, turned it off, shared my opinion. Don’t post it if you can’t handle opinions on it. Circle jerk privately.

So…in the first 30 seconds he says greetings and thanks Ron Pierce. I don’t see any outlandish claims or erroneous statements.

Sorry, time flies when you’re having fun I guess. From 00:58 until 1:40 he talks a load of crap, piling crap on crap as ‘support’ for the original crap. That’s when I turned off. Same thing every week. Starts on whatever forum bullkitten is popular with the baddies this week, fails to use any basic logic when presenting his case, I turn off.

Easy twitch views for him though, more power to him.

Don’t know what that guy’s talking about, Helseth hit the nail one the head with this rant. If Arenanet ignores this and the fact that many people agree with him, they should be ashamed of themselves. What I want to see now is a personal response from one of the devs to see what they’re doing to address this, since there’s no transparency at the moment.

I’m not holding my breath.

I would like to point out to Helseth that L-Cancelling was intentionally programmed into Melee and that the devs were well aware of it.

Nitpicking aside, he makes some excellent points, this whole E-sports thing runs on spectators, and spectators need something to be in complete awe of, things that seperate the pros from the casual players, preferably in spectacular fashion.

KrisHQ.4719:

Regarding his last comment about excellent players dropping because of the small gap between skill-floor and skill-ceiling – Spot on.

Dunno, this statement stands out to me as rather suspect but let’s look deeper.

KrisHQ.4719:

The ability for average players to be in awe because something insane has happened is not there. I might have seen it once, where I was actually thinking to myself “Pretty nice move, I might not have thought of that”. Else I just keep thinking “Well. He didnt really do anything amazing, he basically spammed his skills and was lucky they hit”.

If the reality was as simple as this, really, do you think (for example) that Teldo’s streams/plays would be as popular as they are? Part of their appeal is to see him pull off amazing plays or win against stacked odds. I doubt, by a very extremely large margin, than any random “average” player would ever be able to pull off many of his plays. (Like his 1v2 win in the qualifiers, did he and his opponents just spam their keybinds?)

Second, I’m almost certain that any random who runs in and just smashes his face into the keyboard, will lose. Some builds certainly allow for it within some degrees, but you’re just not going to win. Take a guardian. If they just spam their skills, what exactly do they accomplish aside from being DoA?

I’m not saying the skill depth is deep or otherwise, but your statement is rather shallow, no? I think more of the problem comes about in the hurried, spammy nature of combat at the moment more than anything. Too many fire and forget spells that are effective create an illusion (and at this time, an affect) of being “good”.

Guess, some people forgot that there is a better video service out there for something like this, so let me give you a link:
www.youtube.com

I Agree with what I believe is the general intent.
Conquest doesn’t have a mass appeal, they’re focusing on a narrow demographic and upsetting quite a few as a result.

They need to figure out how to make Conquest vastly more appealing or come up with something else that is. While striving for a better balance so they don’t lose players due to that either.

The message kinda got lost in there for me. I generally got “Everyone hates the meta just because” and “Everybody hates conquest just because”. He’s got some potentially interesting points but he needs to lay out his argument. Just stating it in different ways isn’t presenting an argument, it’s preaching to the choir.

Good points in the video, I agree and approve.

deathmatch can work in this game up to 3v3. my hunch is anet doesn’t view that as a “real” competitive format because of such small team size. but, as video says, it’s not about being “real competitive” it’s about giving fun and not focusing on this non-existant esport.

i’d say even more important than more mode is as he said in video that this game is not fun to play or watch. it is a clusterkitten. there needs to be a thorough look at all skills and traits and toning down the damage across the board. bring specs closer to the middle (both burst and bunker and especially condi). slow things down, create alternate effects for all spells that are much simpler on the eye, and do something about npcs everywhere.

as I wrote that last paragraph, especially when talking about the npc spam, i’m reminded that nothing of the sort will happen because this game is pve through and through. all of their money comes from pvers. all of it. and i would imagine there to be strong resistance to altering pve player experience.

Even if you disagree with anything he says, he does care about the game and about making it better.

+1 for making this game more about fun than esports

Ironically, on the hand Helseth promotes deathmatch, on the other he complains about skill effects cluttering his screen. How is a teamfight at mid point different from deathmatch? Both is as terrible to watch. At least conquest forces players to spread out over the map, so your screen isn’t cluttered with spirits and skills effects for the entire match.

Teamplay in GuildWars2 is limited to Combo fields and rezzing. In contrast, in the first GuildWars everyone in the team had a specific task. Coordinating a spike required everyone to fulfill his role to make it work: the monk removed blind from the axe warrior, the mesmer shattered boons from the target and the hammer warrior shut down the monk with infusion. In GuildWars2 teammates play next to each other, not with each other. Conquest gives the game at least a bit of depth, because splitting across three points and a second objective requires teams to coordinate.

In conclusion, conquest is bad, but deathmatch is worse.

In conclusion, conquest is bad, but deathmatch is worse.

But that doesn’t even matter. Some people will like it and will have fun in it. I know I would.

Also, your conclusion is based on the facts about the current state of the game, such as too much spam, too much clutter and not enough teamplay. Now, these are all things that should be fixed anyway.

FirstBlood.7359:

Ironically, on the hand Helseth promotes deathmatch, on the other he complains about skill effects cluttering his screen. How is a teamfight at mid point different from deathmatch?

They are not the same thing, please look at them separately. deathmatch is like midpoint fight, and capture points spread players all over the map which is difficult for the shoutcasters (not good for casual players, lowering playerbase). and skill effects cluttering is just another thing, they can just adjust the effect to make it more watchable and enjoyable,
CONCLUDE, the animation effect doesnt change the fact NOR has anything to do with deathmatch will be more enjoyable to watch(for casual players) then players all over the place and you can only see a few of them and miss out the big play. (which is tolerable, theres alot of esport games(old, big ones) had this difficulty)
AGAIN, he’s just talking about making the game fun for more people, and that competitiveness will born itself in a huge player base and not by force. look at warcraft 3 and dota, CS, cod4 and cod4 promod, heck maybe even SC(which i dont play).

Generally when I watch these sort of video’s i end up switching it off and thinking “what a load of crap”. However the guy makes very good points and its hard to fault any of them.
When people are having fun the competition makes itself.

helseth has guns
helseth has rifles
helseth has bombs
helseth has laserz
helseth has weapons of mass destruction

ban him for all next upcoming tournaments :’D

helseth talks the truth.

what i wan:
i wan a higher playerbase.

Imo Forest of nifhel, legacy of foefire, battle of khylo and temple map (just change water!)are great designed pvp maps!

how do u achieve a bigger playerbase, well thats pretty simple implement new battlegroundmodes
which makes a lot of fun and are easy to understand for the community. (skyhammer frustrates me , it favours stability and cc-classes, instantdeath by falling) take as an example the different ! scenarios/battlegrounds from warhammer online age of reckoning they were so much fun! http://warhammeronline.wikia.com/wiki/Scenario
domination (conquest)-mode, we have already, real capture the flag misses! spirit watch is a cross of domination and capture the flag (too complicated for community!) what about single flag ctf, two flag ctf, bombing run, escort, deathmatch ( team a starts south , team b starts north and in the middle is only a big node which u must conquer! this battleground gave me orgasms cause of constant fighting, defending the node or trying to conquer it, this mode is easy to understand for everyone!) is missing
or hutball from star wars the old republic…. and i am a pvehater i loved the fact that u could play alltime pvp in warhammer and rise ur level by only doing battlegrounds. in battlegrounds enemy dropped nice gear. and i wan to choose in

soloqueue /teamqueue what maps i wan to play and what not!!! ranked games should only be for balanced maps ( no skyhammer, spiritwatch)

and why do i have so much glory points ? i wan legendaries, cool pvpclothes only the best can achieve, titles, special finishers, badges of honours… i wan to achieve something in pvp! gold, gems, special things..
i dont wan to open those chests i get from the pvp…
PVP MISSES REWARDS ! PVP MISSES REWARDS!

and i wan a page like http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/browse
in which u search for example for a certain role : support, tank, roamer and u will find some nice builds

the spectator mode u should be able to see how far a node is capped …and maybe show the pointincoming from nodes .. so u can see how much points gave node a ! kills/assists/into downstate /rezzes and stomps should also be shown somewhere.. better userinterface for spectators = more utility, short and easy to see

my opinion is based on my experience from different mmorpg/games : star wars, tera, aion, wow, warhammer online,rohan online, battlefield franchise and many more…

I have 3 gw2 accounts so if anybody will say i hate this game i gonna destroy him…
i can see the potential of gw2.

Couldn`t agree more with him.
Whilst I watch Mist League, Blu & the odd one or two others & they do great with what they can, the game isn`t remotely close to being esport material.
Hell, even basics of spectating someone fighting, you can`t even see who they are targetting as no name plate/icon or wtk is visible.& that is just for starters.

Absolutely spot on, re:setting esport balance for top 1% & not putting fun into the game in general is really bad.
Played 4+ years of (dun dun dun, I said another mmos name ;p) warcraft, despite arena, rbgs etc not having a spectator mode other then watching streams, it was much easier to understand for even the rookies.

Oddly, the only decent map this game even had pvp wise, was the mad kings one where you attacked three towers & fought stealthed in the fields

Vena.8436:

KrisHQ.4719:

Regarding his last comment about excellent players dropping because of the small gap between skill-floor and skill-ceiling – Spot on.

Dunno, this statement stands out to me as rather suspect but let’s look deeper.

KrisHQ.4719:

The ability for average players to be in awe because something insane has happened is not there. I might have seen it once, where I was actually thinking to myself “Pretty nice move, I might not have thought of that”. Else I just keep thinking “Well. He didnt really do anything amazing, he basically spammed his skills and was lucky they hit”.

If the reality was as simple as this, really, do you think (for example) that Teldo’s streams/plays would be as popular as they are? Part of their appeal is to see him pull off amazing plays or win against stacked odds. I doubt, by a very extremely large margin, than any random “average” player would ever be able to pull off many of his plays. (Like his 1v2 win in the qualifiers, did he and his opponents just spam their keybinds?)

I was pretty hyped because people kept talking about Teldo doing a great 1v2.
However, I didn’t really find anything that he did extraordinary.
He might not have been “spamming” his skills literally. But in GW2 there is no action-reaction, so had he saved cooldowns/endurance trying to play intelligently there is no way he would have ever pulled a 1v2 off. This to me is the same as spamming your skills.

Another thread being silenced by moving it to linksvile. Well played Arenanet well played.

I saw that… they really should be ashamed of themselves.

“SPvP sucks because Asuras are short” wat

I agree, SPvP can’t be Esports with the current maps. They need to do a dota-style map.