Guild Wars 2

It’s just a little something I put together, showing what some of the classes do (Guardian, Thief, and Mesmer) and how they affect a tPvP match.

I would suggest unbinding your s key for a while to train yourself to stop using it constantly. Try to remember to dodge sometimes when you’re being targetted. Don’t drop putrid mark before the fight starts against a mesmer. Maybe play around with some other utilities too, you might find something that turns out to be more effective in practice than it looks on paper. Make sure you summon your golem when it’s up. Also, I think 99% of us have died with a full life force bar, but when that happens to you, it doesn’t say anything about the class that killed you, it’s entirely on you. There are always things you could be doing better, and you might find those things make all the difference.

I agree that Moa is super powerful, and where most other classes have some alright elites, that one is just redonk in small scale fights. I like the skill (not a mesmer, just think its a nice ability) but I’d like to see it stay as powerful, perhaps a shorter duration. Cooldown isnt that crucial though, because you can only use most utilities or elites once per fight, so even if the cooldown was tripled, if you get Moa’d you’re still in trouble.

Thieves are a totally different animal. Their damage is pretty amazing and the risk is significantly lower due to a lack of stealth detection in GW2. I don’t feel like I’m outplayed when my warrior/guardian/elem is dropped by a 12k backstab + 8k heartseeker in 2 immediate button pushes, I feel like I happened to be the one that was standing in front of the bus. Not much you can do now though, but I think most people who are not thieves will agree that they are a bit out of touch with their burst, and how little they have to give up for it.

The guardian you showed didn’t survive a 1v3 with ‘no problem’ as you described, he/she held you guys off for 8 seconds, then was assisted by 2 team mates. I play a guardian and I can say that yes, the class’s mechanics allow me to comfortably 1v1 with any other class, but you’ll never find a bunker guardian (especially post retal nerfs) that can take a 1v3 and win unless the other 3 are not doing their jobs correctly.

Meditation heals are really strong though, I’m surprised at how strong they are atm, with no +heal gear I can med-med-med-heal for ~15k.

dont want to flame, but all things you’ve listed were your own fault.
e.g. first situation (starts at about 0:40) you’re showing. you’re wasting your putrid on a npc (and you dont even dodge him…) so you dont have it for the thief which is killing you from range while you backpaddel and do nothing.. placing your putrid mark on yourself would have given your teammates the chance to rezz you. (especially since there are 2 engis…)
next situation at about 1:48. do you really complain while there are 4 players vs 1 thief and all are standing afk looking on the point (no aoe or something). in this situation 3 players should have moved to another objective while one player keeps defending the point until the thief pops out again.
next thing i like to mention is your fight against the guardian. the guardian survives not long and you could have blinded him or used stability to stomp him.

the next time you make a vid complaining about other classes gimmicks you should learn to utilize your and your teams gimmicks.

Inee.5371:

dont want to flame, but all things you’ve listed were your own fault.
e.g. first situation (starts at about 0:40) you’re showing. you’re wasting your putrid on a npc (and you dont even dodge him…) so you dont have it for the thief which is killing you from range while you backpaddel and do nothing.. placing your putrid mark on yourself would have given your teammates the chance to rezz you. (especially since there are 2 engis…)
next situation at about 1:48. do you really complain while there are 4 players vs 1 thief and all are standing afk looking on the point (no aoe or something). in this situation 3 players should have moved to another objective while one player keeps defending the point until the thief pops out again.
next thing i like to mention is your fight against the guardian. the guardian survives not long and you could have blinded him or used stability to stomp him.

the next time you make a vid complaining about other classes gimmicks you should learn to utilize your and your teams gimmicks.

Yes, yes, theory crafting with random skills and shouldadonethatderp kitten out of thin air, but you obviously have missed the point of the video. And you are flaming.

It’s plain as day, to anybody that watches, just what is obviously wrong with the picture. And I spell it out for you. But no, you focus on “Use dodge/stability!”, like that kitten’s on call 24/7 and infinite.

Inee.5371:

placing your putrid mark on yourself would have given your teammates the chance to rezz you. (especially since there are 2 engis…)

I guess you mean ’Reaper’s Mark’ which was still on 3sec CD (estimated) when he was going down.

Inee.5371:

used stability to stomp him.

Except that the only stability necro can get is 3sec when entering DS, stomping takes 4sec and any experienced player waits with the interrupt until the last second.

Next time before you try to give tips maybe actually play the class for a while.

Reikou.7068:

Watch vid, notice rank, ignore.

L2P. That is really all I have to say.

The level of intelligence you just expressed with this comment kinda fits nicely with the fact that you play a mesmer AND thief.

just because he is low rank, dosent mean his opinion is not valid .
i agreed with prett much everything he said, with the exception of the one GLARING descrepancy… did a NECRO try to aoe down a guardian and say “this took too long” ???

necro is the one class that can devower a guardian in under 10 sec and you choose for the video to not only NOT use conditions or buff removal, but to use AOE attacks on him?

dont wait until u’r at 20% hp left to use heal, u never know when u can get bursted down suddenly and die
also, use the dodge button, lol
u pretty much leave heals and dodge only to when u’r almost dead, ._.

I’m just come out and say the Guardian you fought, did very little damage to you and vice versa. His/her role in that match is to keep you occupied so reinforcements can arrive which exactly what happened.

Ezekeel.2837:

Inee.5371:

placing your putrid mark on yourself would have given your teammates the chance to rezz you. (especially since there are 2 engis…)

I guess you mean ’Reaper’s Mark’ which was still on 3sec CD (estimated) when he was going down.

yep, sorry my fault.

Inee.5371:

used stability to stomp him.

Ezekeel.2837:

Except that the only stability necro can get is 3sec when entering DS, stomping takes 4sec and any experienced player waits with the interrupt until the last second.

Next time before you try to give tips maybe actually play the class for a while.

as a matter of fact, necro was my main class.
i didnt say that he should have stability stomped him, i said his team should have done that or blind stomp.
i just got the impression that the Op was complaining about the guardians downed 2 ability- like noone is able to stomp the guardian until he used this ability. which isnt true.

This video dont show how class can affect pvp in this game. Only thing that you showed is how you can play awfull when you dont use brains while playing. I cant even count how many mistakes you are doing in countering classes. I am very sorry but all you need is to read few necro guides, few forums post in necro section, look few videos or streams with necro play if you cant get it yourself.

Merciless.5349:

Inee.5371:

dont want to flame, but all things you’ve listed were your own fault.
e.g. first situation (starts at about 0:40) you’re showing. you’re wasting your putrid on a npc (and you dont even dodge him…) so you dont have it for the thief which is killing you from range while you backpaddel and do nothing.. placing your putrid mark on yourself would have given your teammates the chance to rezz you. (especially since there are 2 engis…)
next situation at about 1:48. do you really complain while there are 4 players vs 1 thief and all are standing afk looking on the point (no aoe or something). in this situation 3 players should have moved to another objective while one player keeps defending the point until the thief pops out again.
next thing i like to mention is your fight against the guardian. the guardian survives not long and you could have blinded him or used stability to stomp him.

the next time you make a vid complaining about other classes gimmicks you should learn to utilize your and your teams gimmicks.

Yes, yes, theory crafting with random skills and shouldadonethatderp kitten out of thin air, but you obviously have missed the point of the video. And you are flaming.

It’s plain as day, to anybody that watches, just what is obviously wrong with the picture. And I spell it out for you. But no, you focus on “Use dodge/stability!”, like that kitten’s on call 24/7 and infinite.

well i think the point of the video was showing abilites which are, in your oppinion, too strong or which you cant counter.
i was just listing the things which you should have done to counter these abilites, and because there are things to counter them i disagree completly with your video.

it would be something else if you would have shown e.g. a quickness stomp, which is hard to counter in my oppinion.
and no i didnt flame ;-) flaimg would be something like l2p, noob etc.
i just listed tips :-P

Backpedaling. Bad Build. Dodges without thought (or not at all).

Your poor play is what they are taking advantage of, not any broken mechanics.

I think the point of the video is to show what happens when you don’t use your class mechanic, don’t use your elite, don’t dodge, and backpedal all day. If all you do is spam your weapon skills at random times, a lot of things look overpowered.

BishopX.6453:

just because he is low rank, dosent mean his opinion is not valid .
i agreed with prett much everything he said, with the exception of the one GLARING descrepancy… did a NECRO try to aoe down a guardian and say “this took too long” ???

necro is the one class that can devower a guardian in under 10 sec and you choose for the video to not only NOT use conditions or buff removal, but to use AOE attacks on him?

I admit that I have no guardian character but I fought guradians who a. were easily healing the slow damage the necro conditions did to them b. wiped a lot of the repeatedly off.

There were other fights going on in the vincinity so I cannot excluded that someone else was aoe cleansing.

Dont hate on backpedalling. I do it sometimes, because half my engi’s abilities bug and miss when i strafe! I’m such a noob right esport lol.

I looooved this video!! Not because of the skills of the maker of the video, but because, on kylo, in clocktower, the guardian was no less than starcraft forever… if this is the same starcraft zergling from gw1, u were up against one of the best halls player in there… iirc, he and leeloof were the first dragons in gw1,so dont be ashamed to lose to this guy, he is guuud…real guuud!
PS: plz, disable the S key,it takes less than one might think to get used to that, i learned it in,like, half an hour… (thanks taugrim, u showed me the way, a lot of time ago!!); also, this is even more important if we consider that stafing in this game puts you at half the speed of normal forward movement speed,with backpedaling puting you at less 75% speed or more.

You guys are missing the aim of the video. It isn’t a showcase of the author’s skills, it just wants to show what’s wrong with PvP and, in my opinion, he succeded.
Obviously there are the same people who says “you are bad”, “learn to dodge”, “your skill is awful” etc, who, statistically, are mostly thieves, guardians or mesmers.
Don’t try to attack the author’s ability but explain why in your opinion it is fair that thieves can pop 13k damage in half a second, why some professions can’t defend themselves from stealth stomp, why mesmers can wipe your skills out for 10 seconds and why guardians have ridiculous defensive capabilities compared to other professions.

Also: Starcraft Forever! :O

Sorrow: i havent actually attacked the OP skills, in fact i even advised him to disable the S key, wich is an advice he should consider,however,when u talk thief,see the vid again, watch that fight in the stairs leading to the keep in forest, where he fights a thief, when he dies, the death log shows +10k dmg from… trick shot!!this was only possible coz the thief saw him back pedal, after doing all this dmg, he jumped with heart seeker, wich hit him for +5K and killed him… hadnt he been back pedalling, the thief would never be able to pull this off. Also,those 10k from trick shot were on 13 hits, wich means that the thief was actually unlucky with his dice roll on crits, usually 13 hits from a glass cannon thief would do 13K dmg.

I don’t get this video… he gets into terrible situations and then wants to say the game is not balanced…

I’m not flaming you, Merciless, and I don’t play necro, but the repeated banging-head-against-wall that was done at clocktower was pretty impressive. After the first time, it should have been clear that it wasn’t productive to assault clocktower alone. It just betrays a fundamental misunderstanding of how the game works.

The guardian is hard to kill — yes. It is not impossible, however. Given enough time, you could probably have killed that guardian. But you don’t seem to understand that the guardian is in voip with his team. All he has to say is “hey someone come clocktower and kill this necro”. A bunker’s purpose is to waste your time while he keeps the point capped for his team. A roamer’s duty is to be looking for easy kills. You don’t have enough damage to kill the guardian quickly. At 50% health with skills on cooldown, the thief comes and insta kills you. It’s not a mystery how this happened.

Eduardo.4675:

Sorrow: i havent actually attacked the OP skills, in fact i even advised him to disable the S key, wich is an advice he should consider,however,when u talk thief,see the vid again, watch that fight in the stairs leading to the keep in forest, where he fights a thief, when he dies, the death log shows +10k dmg from… trick shot!!this was only possible coz the thief saw him back pedal, after doing all this dmg, he jumped with heart seeker, wich hit him for +5K and killed him… hadnt he been back pedalling, the thief would never be able to pull this off. Also,those 10k from trick shot were on 13 hits, wich means that the thief was actually unlucky with his dice roll on crits, usually 13 hits from a glass cannon thief would do 13K dmg.

Again, the first part of the video isn’t to show the thieves’ killing capabilities, but the abusing of stealth stomping. Have you listened to what op said in the video?
Why the hell can some professions abuse of stability and/or stealth to have a sure stomp? Why some professions can counter stealth stomps while other ones can’t?

The incredible damage the thief do was shown when he was fighting with the guardian and the thief came, killing him in half a second with 14k damage only from 2 skills. This is far from every balance, considering that power builds on some professions can’t deal that damage also unloading all the skill bar in less than 15-20 seconds, Necros above all.
Did you see the damage the op was doing with the axe? Well, I guess he was running with at least 1800 power to deal that damage.

sorrow.2364:

You guys are missing the aim of the video. It isn’t a showcase of the author’s skills, it just wants to show what’s wrong with PvP and, in my opinion, he succeded.
Obviously there are the same people who says “you are bad”, “learn to dodge”, “your skill is awful” etc, who, statistically, are mostly thieves, guardians or mesmers.
Don’t try to attack the author’s ability but explain why in your opinion it is fair that thieves can pop 13k damage in half a second, why some professions can’t defend themselves from stealth stomp, why mesmers can wipe your skills out for 10 seconds and why guardians have ridiculous defensive capabilities compared to other professions.

Also: Starcraft Forever! :O

Actually, I’ve played more necro than anything else, and I’m confident I would have won or survived every example posted except possibly the first, and probably the last. I’m not very good either. A lot of the problems being showcased here are down to player ability.

You seem to be spending most of the time with less than 20% health in those fights, Use some of the debuff utilities instead of signets, and dodge more, backpeddling doesn’t do you any good.

The thief issue has been discussed many times, there’s even a stickied thread on thief in the sPVP section, the very last bit of the video showed what the thief did, you saw him for a very split second while fighting that guardian then suddenly take massive damage while still not seeing the thief until you’re down. kitten like that needs to be addressed.

Necromancer is underwhelming, but the gameplay in the video is more of the player than the class.

When you play like that, a lot of things will feel “OP”. Sorry man but your video isn’t evidence of very much other than you have a lot to learn still about the game.

Hint: If you are fighting a guardian that only has melee weapons on a point they already control, how about use range instead of fight on top of them and get exposed for playing poorly?

Mammoth.1975:

Actually, I’ve played more necro than anything else, and I’m confident I would have won or survived every example posted except possibly the first, and probably the last. I’m not very good either. A lot of the problems being showcased here are down to player ability.

No, these problem aren’t.

1. You can be the best player out of this world, but there is no way to counter a stealth stomp as a Necro. This is the most obvious unbalance shown in the video.
2. It is a fact that thieves can abuse stealth mechanic also when they are built as glass cannon, with very few points in defensive traits. I bet the thief who was popping in and out of stealth had berserker amulet with no more than 1000 toughness and 1200 vitality, so why he survived that long against 3 players? It is crazy. If any other profession (with some famous exceptions) are built with low toughness and low vitality would never last more than few seconds against 3 players.
3. I don’t want to comment the Moa, I think its opness is pretty obvious.
4. There was really few possibilities to counter the last 2 thief kills, you should know that. The op had no time to realize that there was a thief coming that he was dead. Balanced, uh?

Sorrow, he survived long against 3 players because the 3 players were horrible. Look at the video, it’s pretty apparent.

Moa is annoying, but getting hit by Moa in a 1 on 1 is just LOL. OP just stands there with full stamina and gets Moaed.

It is a team game and his team should be letting him know about enemy troop movements, but you can tell that him and his team is bad, as evidenced by a necro trying to 1 on 1 a guardian twice at clock tower, especially when you have this necro behind the controls.

This video and thread are great evidence that the people that complain the loudest often have the most to learn about game mechanics and strategy.

1. Or a stability stomp, or a multiple stomp. He was dead either way, his teammate was miles away getting his face redecorated. One fear wasn’t going to change anything. It was actually a waste of shadow refuge, but the thief wasn’t to know that his teammate would just ignore him being downed and keep tunnelling the water ele.
2. AoE. I often kill thieves without even targetting them.
3. If he had dodged even once instead of standing there using the worst autoattack in the game he wouldn’t have been on 5k health when he got morphed.
4. There was plenty of time to death shroud in the first thief kill, he died with 100% life force and endurance. I play with huge latency and I still would have survived that.

The last one is the only example where I’m pretty sure I would have died, but I might have made the same mistakes as he did in the first one and died there too. On the other hand, I probably wouldn’t have gotten that low as a necro vs a bunker guardian, so there’s a chance I would have survived even the last one.

Seether.7285:

Sorrow, he survived long against 3 players because the 3 players were horrible. Look at the video, it’s pretty apparent.

Moa is annoying, but getting hit by Moa in a 1 on 1 is just LOL. OP just stands there with full stamina and gets Moaed.

It is a team game and his team should be letting him know about enemy troop movements, but you can tell that him and his team is bad, as evidenced by a necro trying to 1 on 1 a guardian twice at clock tower, especially when you have this necro behind the controls.

This video and thread are great evidence that the people that complain the loudest often have the most to learn about game mechanics and strategy.

Without considering that you ignored some aspects shown in the video, you keep to not getting the point.

1. The 3 players he was fighting weren’t that bad. I can consider as a bad player only the guardian who is doing absolutely nothing. The thief just went away after he dealt some damage to the other thief, the only damage outcome was from the OP when he tried to randomly place his marks hoping to hit the thief, while the engineer was totally useless because he was running dual pistol, so most damaging skills required a target. Stealth is a pretty strong mechanic and he shouldn’t be this effective when not traited.

2. Consider that also the Mesmer was bad, he should have casted Moa while in Stealth, so there was absolutely no way to counter it. By the way, do you think that is fair that a skill can change a match this way?

3. So, if you see a Guardian controlling a point, it is better you don’t even try to catch it because you are sure you are going to lose. Balanced.

Mammoth.1975:

1. Or a stability stomp, or a multiple stomp. He was dead either way, his teammate was miles away getting his face redecorated. One fear wasn’t going to change anything.
2. AoE. I often kill thieves without even targetting them.
3. If he had dodged even once instead of standing there using the worst autoattack in the game he wouldn’t have been on 5k health when he got morphed.
4. There was plenty of time to death shroud in the first thief kill, he died with 100% life force and endurance. I play with huge latency and I still would have survived that.

The last one is the only example where I’m pretty sure I would have died, but I might have made the same mistakes as he did in the first one and died there too. On the other hand, I probably wouldn’t have gotten that low as a necro vs a bunker guardian, so there’s a chance I would have survived even the last one.

1. Please, don’t consider that situation but the broken mechanic itself. That fear could make a change, because a teammate could have come to ress him few seconds later.
2. He was spamming his AoE, in fact he was using the staff. You have seen what happened.
3. Sure, maybe he would have been on 10k hp, or 15k hp, but than, after morphed, he would always end to have no HP at all or 1k hp around. The mesmer took just 2-3 of the 10 seconds of Moa Morph to kill the op.
4. Maybe in the first case, but what about the others? The op showed 3 thief kills, not just one.

Sorrow:
I did not want to do this, but i have to: THEY WERE BAD. There. I said it. Ikittennow who starcraft forever is, u should AUTOMATICALLY realize that he was probably playing with some of his old friends from gw1, therefore, as milo pointed out, VOIP and good players; also, " the only dmg came from the OP when he tried to RANDOMLY…" the clue is in the word randomly…

WoW

1. Backpeddling….why?!?!..
2. For a thief to stealth down you, he is wasting a 48sec (traited) CD, just for you. Optimally, that stealth could be used for the entire team, annoying yes, OP? dont know, especially since other classes can down you with just as much cheese. Guardian block down, mesmer stealth down, ele mist form down, ranger quickness down, warrior stability down.
3. Four of you sat on a point, to try and fight a theif, while spamming skills where he was, instead of aoe’ing the point where he would be( rewatching you were spamming marks in the same place..why?). First of all FOUR OF YOU…Why in the nine hells were FOUR of you sitting on a point? it takes 2 at the most to kill one player (assuming the 2 a good and obviously your team wasnt).
4. The mesmer, while I agree that Moa is a bit much ( and before all the moa mesmers come out of the woods, I play one and I think it is a bit much). Your poor playing would have guaranteed he killed you anyway. You were at 5k health before he decided to use moa, the fact you didnt dodge or mark him during the entire fight speaks volumes of your inexperience. But I do agree, moa needs a tweak.
5. You started the fight, with a full deathshroud life bar..and you spam AoE’s?
What kills me is, its not a secret a guardian pushes people away. Why the kitten would all three of you run up to him at once to try and stomp him? It should be common sense, wait till he blows the push on 1 or 2 people, then run in for the stomp. No he didnt survive a 1v 3 because of his tankiness, he survived because his team was coordinated in sending the theif to basically finish off the squishiest target to rally, because 3 of you had kitten moment.
6. Boon heavy guardian and you didnt take any tools to deal with his boons, used an Axe, and didnt dodge, didnt ask for backup, and at 50% health decided to not go be useful at another point but stay their and basically cost your team 15 points.

During this entire video, you have one valid point, and that was moa. The rest of the video was team error, player judgement error, or just a plain lack of common sense.
Most of these issues could be solved if you got better. I would start by reading necro guides, finding some streams of a tournament team with a necro and watching its reaction and movements, finding a better build and practicing.

Eduardo.4675:

Sorrow:
I did not want to do this, but i have to: THEY WERE BAD. There. I said it. Ikittennow who starcraft forever is, u should AUTOMATICALLY realize that he was probably playing with some of his old friends from gw1, therefore, as milo pointed out, VOIP and good players; also, " the only dmg came from the OP when he tried to RANDOMLY…" the clue is in the word randomly…

Oh, sure. Because you can actually know with precision where the thief is when it is stealthed. The only way to counter a stealthed thief is to use your AoE randomly in the direction you think the thief is. It what the op did.

Sorrow, I can’t argue against your point on 1 because agreeing “how bad” someone isn’t something that can be really accomplished at an objective level but they did not seem to use any of the counters which all 3 of them have available to them.

When that skill has a 180s cd, roots you in place and has a super obvious animation, yes, I think it is a fair skill. It is annoying to get moaed but your greatest defense against it should be avoiding it in the first place.

If you see a guardian controlling a point you should be bringing one of two things to the fight, a build that has ample knockback/cc to neutralize the point, or a build that can burst a guardian down effectively solo, such as a condi bomb/grenade engi.

Some necro builds can be effective against guardians, but this build in this players hands has no chance of killing any half decent guardian. The necro could have done the same damage he did without taking any himself or forcing the guardian off the point by attacking from the window. Yet he goes right up onto the point to fight the guardian in melee range.

If you play bad, you won’t be able to beat many classes, especially classes designed to win/prolong 1v1s.

U dont throw it randomly, i throw them in the likely whereabouts…

sorrow.2364:

Eduardo.4675:

Sorrow:
I did not want to do this, but i have to: THEY WERE BAD. There. I said it. Ikittennow who starcraft forever is, u should AUTOMATICALLY realize that he was probably playing with some of his old friends from gw1, therefore, as milo pointed out, VOIP and good players; also, " the only dmg came from the OP when he tried to RANDOMLY…" the clue is in the word randomly…

Oh, sure. Because you can actually know with precision where the thief is when it is stealthed. The only way to counter a stealthed thief is to use your AoE randomly in the direction you think the thief is. It what the op did.

No, the OP spammed his marks in the same location slightly north east on the point, instead of spamming them in different places on the point to get an accurate gauge on where the theif lands, he spams them in one location.

sorrow.2364:

Mammoth.1975:

1. Or a stability stomp, or a multiple stomp. He was dead either way, his teammate was miles away getting his face redecorated. One fear wasn’t going to change anything.
2. AoE. I often kill thieves without even targetting them.
3. If he had dodged even once instead of standing there using the worst autoattack in the game he wouldn’t have been on 5k health when he got morphed.
4. There was plenty of time to death shroud in the first thief kill, he died with 100% life force and endurance. I play with huge latency and I still would have survived that.

The last one is the only example where I’m pretty sure I would have died, but I might have made the same mistakes as he did in the first one and died there too. On the other hand, I probably wouldn’t have gotten that low as a necro vs a bunker guardian, so there’s a chance I would have survived even the last one.

1. Please, don’t consider that situation but the broken mechanic itself. That fear could make a change, because a teammate could have come to ress him few seconds later.
2. He was spamming his AoE, in fact he was using the staff. You have seen what happened.
3. Sure, maybe he would have been on 10k hp, or 15k hp, but than, after morphed, he would always end to have no HP at all or 1k hp around. The mesmer took just 2-3 of the 10 seconds of Moa Morph to kill the op.
4. Maybe in the first case, but what about the others? The op showed 3 thief kills, not just one.

1. The situation we’re discussing is the one posted, and the fear wouldn’t have made a difference. A downed necro can’t do anything about stability stomps either, where’s the complaining? Necro is actually one of the classes that is most effective at preventing stomps on teammates, with boon removals for stability and aoe fear for stealth.
2. Yes I saw what happened. He killed the thief. Despite throwing his marks under the npc and probably missing wildly.
3. From 25312 health until 6150 health, the only button he pressed was 4. You can’t just stand there taking 19k damage then complain that one of the skills used was overpowered. One dodge would have made it a fight.
4. He was down 12k health against a guardian. He should have been expecting the thief anyway.

I’m not a fan of the extremes you can get to in terms of toughness and damage dictating very inflexible roles on teams and pushing balanced builds into uselessness, but this is not a good example of that.

sorrow.2364:

Eduardo.4675:

Sorrow:
I did not want to do this, but i have to: THEY WERE BAD. There. I said it. Ikittennow who starcraft forever is, u should AUTOMATICALLY realize that he was probably playing with some of his old friends from gw1, therefore, as milo pointed out, VOIP and good players; also, " the only dmg came from the OP when he tried to RANDOMLY…" the clue is in the word randomly…

Oh, sure. Because you can actually know with precision where the thief is when it is stealthed. The only way to counter a stealthed thief is to use your AoE randomly in the direction you think the thief is. It what the op did.

No, you put it where you think he is going. In this case, under the necro with 5k health remaining.

You guys are keep focusing on the specific situation without considering the whole balancing itself.

No matters how Moa is dodgeable, has a long cooldown and roots you in place for one second, no skill in the game is as destructive and game breaking as the Moa is. Take for instance any Necro skill.
Flash Golem is awful, it dies when you touch the water, you have no knockdown if the golem isn’t in the line of sight of the target (and you know how awful the mechanic is) and it only deals 800 damage every second. Just the Illusionary Duelist, a skill which is on a 16 cooldown when traited, is way better than Flash Golem.
Lich Form is just a way to tell everyone you want to die. You lose the access to you heal skill, you have no bonus to toughness and you became an incredibly big green thing, attracting everyone’s attention.
Plague Form is just decent as a damage mitigation skill, but it only makes you last a bit longer.
How can you say there is balance when just ONE Elite skill of the mesmer is way better than every Necro elite?

I want also ask you why guardians and engineers are the only professions used as point controller, just ask me why. The lack of profession variety in tPvP is a clear sign of not so good balance, expecially in a game who claims to not have the holy trinity.

The thief can deal an incredibly high damage in a so low time and without any efforts, while also having the most powerful defensive mechanic (stealth), which is still effective with no trait points in it. As a Necromancer, you either have to put loads of stat points on toughness or vitality or to fully trait Soul Reaping in order to get an effective survivability.

The game unbalancing is so clear, I don’t understand why some people keep saying that the game is fine.

sorrow.2364:

You guys are keep focusing on the specific situation without considering the whole balancing itself.

No matters how Moa is dodgeable, has a long cooldown and roots you in place for one second, no skill in the game is as destructive and game breaking as the Moa is. Take for instance any Necro skill.
Flash Golem is awful, it dies when you touch the water, you have no knockdown if the golem isn’t in the line of sight of the target (and you know how awful the mechanic is) and it only deals 800 damage every second. Just the Illusionary Duelist, a skill which is on a 16 cooldown when traited, is way better than Flash Golem.
Lich Form is just a way to tell everyone you want to die. You lose the access to you heal skill, you have no bonus to toughness and you became an incredibly big green thing, attracting everyone’s attention.
Plague Form is just decent as a damage mitigation skill, but it only makes you last a bit longer.
How can you say there is balance when just ONE Elite skill of the mesmer is way better than every Necro elite?

I want you guys also ask why guardians and engineers are the only professions used as point controller, just ask me why. The lack of profession variety in tPvP is a clear sign of not so good balance, expecially in a game who claims to not have the holy trinity.

The thief can deal an incredibly high damage in a so low time and without any efforts, while also having the most powerful defensive mechanic (stealth), which is still effective with no trait points in it.

The game unbalancing is so clear, I don’t understand why some people keep saying that the game is fine.

While thats a great rundown of some elites, their is still no excuse for poor playing.
Lich Form when used optimally can be a game changer ( have you ever seen a timewarped lich form?)
Flesh golem makes me vomit, so i agree with you their.
Plague form can actually be used to stack conditions and wait out for reinforcements or can be used as an escape method.
But none of those elites can be are nullified by a dodge, block, or clutch blind.
Again, I agree that moa needs to be tweaked, but saying its a problem when you were going to die anyway is.

Bunker builds for any class are going to take a while to deal with, the main reason people use guardians or engineers is because of their boon control, and CC. Those two factored in with good play make for excellent point defenders. Though last I read, Anet was aware of the uptime on bunker builds so I expect those to be changed in the future.

A thief does a high amount of damage at the cost of having one escape method. because if they miss with backstab, or you invul through his entire backstab combo, they run or die. Builds like that are good roamers, not optimal for fighting on points.

And again stealth isn’t bad when you anticipate where the thief is headed instead of where he was. In 1 v 1’s its obvious the theif is coming for you, in group fights, if you have 5k hp, again its obvious who the target is, if your standing on a point and backpeddling and not dodgeing, you deserve to get shanked out of principle.

A lot of you have seemed to miss the point of the video.

Anybody can watch the video and say, “Well, I would have done this/that”, “Why you no dodge?”, “Where is your stability?”, “Nothing wrong with Guardian/Thief/Mesmer, l2p”, etc.

The first 2 clips were showing Stealth stomps, which are IMPOSSIBLE to counter, which, in my opinion, and many others’, is an issue.

The 3rd clip, it was us 4 versus them 3 on that point, so that’s why all of us were there. If you watch closely, I finish 2 people myself. But the point of that clip was showing you how the Thief single handedly kept preventing us from capturing the point by popping in and out of stealth. Yes, my AOE’s missed, but honestly, that Thief was all over the place.

The 4th clip, referencing the Mesmers’ Moa skill, was just an example of Moa being used in a battle and how huge of an advantage it gives to the Mesmer. Yes, that Mesmer was owning me to begin with. Yes, I could have used a better clip; all I’d have to do is play tPvP for an hour and I’m sure I could get one.

The 5th clip, where it’s us 3 v 1 Guardian, I explicitly state that it takes way too long to down him as obviously the Guardians’ 4 other team mates can capture the other nodes AND come to help while he’s still surviving everything we’re throwing at him. I know the point of a Bunker Guardian, but that doesn’t make it less ridiculous. No, I was not complaining about the Guardians’ downed state #2, I was just explaining what was happening for those who wouldn’t know. But again, that obviously bought more time for his Thief friend to come in and help.

The last 2 clips are obviously showing what happens when a Thief comes from behind and how effective he is at turning the tide of a battle and ending it because of his high burst skills, which a lot of people are talking about. I could have been doing a 1 v 1 against any class, and the same kitten would happen from a Thief.

Other than that, I’d like to thank those who have offered tips on how to play better for my part. I can only get better from here. ^^

Oh, and it took some time and effort to get that bad boy up to 1080p quality. But it is eye candy once it gets there.

Well you can counter stealthstomp, just not with necro. Also most of the points you have made are not correct, because of your poor gameplay and/or teamplay – noone is covering you, you go solo against a bunker what do you think is going to happen? He calls for help, and help will be there in couple of seconds, droping marks in one place is not the way to see where the thief is, etc. You simply need more experiance in this game and most of the things you have mentioned will not be a problem anymore…

Lukin.4061:

Well you can counter stealthstomp, just not with necro.

When I’ve read this, I’ve stopped reading your post.
Do you really think what you said? Are you saying that the only counter to something is to… change profession?!? Well, looks like you have a clear idea of balancing.

Oh noes, someone stopped reading my post, now those 2 minutes that took me to write it are meaningless : o

He said there is no way to counter stealthstomp – there is, you need teamwork for that (for example guardian push, aoe fear from war/necro/thief, etc) OR you need to have a class that has an aoe 2 ability that necros do not have.

Stealthstomp can be equal to stability buff on enemy player, its basically the same thing. Also about the “Well, looks like you have a clear idea of balancing.” – in my opinion not everything should be countered by everyone: to explain this better we can take for example condition necro as a good counter against a thief, but as a poor counter against a bunker guardian that can purge conditions every few seconds and stun with hammers constantly. There is no universal build for professions, thus not everything should be countered.

Between quickness stomps, stability stomps, and stealth stomps – stealth stomps are the easiest to counter by a mile.

IMO most of the “problems” shown in the OP’s video are displays of poor team play rather than broken mechanics.

Edit: basically, if i could only say 1 thing it would be this: the objective of the game is not to win every fight — it’s to have the highest point total. if you lose sight of that you will waste time trying to kill players that are just trolling you.

Merciless.5349:

The first 2 clips were showing Stealth stomps, which are IMPOSSIBLE to counter, which, in my opinion, and many others’, is an issue.

Speaking from the perspective of your allies, it is not. If your allies are unprepared to deal with stealth stomps, you will always die to them. There are many other ways to “protect” stomps and also “break” these protections. It is a level of play you seem to be unaware of.

Merciless.5349:

The 3rd clip, it was us 4 versus them 3 on that point, so that’s why all of us were there. If you watch closely, I finish 2 people myself. But the point of that clip was showing you how the Thief single handedly kept preventing us from capturing the point by popping in and out of stealth. Yes, my AOE’s missed, but honestly, that Thief was all over the place.

OK. So what? Are all 4 of you going to stand there trying to find him while his team caps the other 2 points? Play to win, don’t get tunnel vision trying to kill something that’s taking too long to kill.

Merciless.5349:

The 4th clip, referencing the Mesmers’ Moa skill, was just an example of Moa being used in a battle and how huge of an advantage it gives to the Mesmer. Yes, that Mesmer was owning me to begin with. Yes, I could have used a better clip; all I’d have to do is play tPvP for an hour and I’m sure I could get one.

Yea, moa is vicious. I’ll give you a break on that.

Merciless.5349:

The 5th clip, where it’s us 3 v 1 Guardian, I explicitly state that it takes way too long to down him as obviously the Guardians’ 4 other team mates can capture the other nodes AND come to help while he’s still surviving everything we’re throwing at him. I know the point of a Bunker Guardian, but that doesn’t make it less ridiculous. No, I was not complaining about the Guardians’ downed state #2, I was just explaining what was happening for those who wouldn’t know. But again, that obviously bought more time for his Thief friend to come in and help.

You guys are outputting pretty low damage and no one has any useful cc to knock him off the point. His thief friend came back quickly (like he always does) and you guys are all low health (from a guardian…) and can’t muster a counter attack fast enough. From start to finish, it was a bad play by your team. You are simply crying here.

Merciless.5349:

The last 2 clips are obviously showing what happens when a Thief comes from behind and how effective he is at turning the tide of a battle and ending it because of his high burst skills, which a lot of people are talking about. I could have been doing a 1 v 1 against any class, and the same kitten would happen from a Thief.

You didn’t take my last reply to heart on this issue. If the three of you couldn’t kill the guardian fast enough before his ally came, what made you think it was a good idea to try it again solo?

1:Dude #1 (on video) you suck at pvp,wrong combination of weapons and skills and propably traits as i imagine.There are certain weapons/traits/utilities that work better when combined properly,but i m not posting a lesson so find it your self and u ll see its very fun.

2:Dudes #2~100+.Are you all serious?The guy just pointed something that’s bad in the game,not his skill!Why all you guys started tearing him apart instantly?Yes,thiefs continusly spamming stealth and do 15k atks are just bad design and poor game,and so on on other classes(dont agree on guardian,piece of cake for condition necros).

*Summarize : I m a hardcore pvper in everygame i ve played and most of my mmo time is spent there pvp arenas etc,but in this game no,i dislike pvp alot,cause its just zerg and more of like too many devastating skills.No fun if you die under than 3 seconds.One time it will be warrior,next will be thief,next ranger,next mesmer,nexe next next next……TOO MUCH BURST and unfair all around downed state things…Just poor.

Thanks for the video btw m8 and pls learn to play better.Cheers

• 1st Thief fight: You ran directly into two players, and then proceeded to stand on top of their AoE fields. Of curse you’re going down.
• 2nd Thief fight: Why aren’t you moving? You’re just standing in his face.
• 3rd Thief fight: Again, you are standing still too much, making you an easy target. The reason why he is surviving, is because you are waiting for him to be visible, before you act. You have to learn to predict his movement patterns, and then trow down AoE skills where you think he is going to be. You had a staff, yet you only casted one AoE skill? Use your skills to your advantage, don’t just spam them. When he’s out of stealth, lock him down with control skills.
• Mesmer fight: It’s becoming really obvious here that you are just not a very good PvP player. Sorry to say that. You start by placing down three AoE targets, that your opponent easily can run around, meaning they all miss. And then you just fire your 1 skill while you are standing still on the node. The Moa elite sucks, yes. Its duration time should be reduced to being 5-7 seconds. It also interrupted your healing skill, which was a lucky hit for your opponent I think.
• 1st Guardian fight: You start by spamming all of your skills on a node where no one is standing, and then you completely waste your Well of Corruption. That basically means you are dealing a minimum of damage to him after that. As for your comment about his survivability; you have no idea what kind of build he has. Maybe it took you that long to down him, because that’s all his build is meant to do. Matches are timed, so a build that can hold the attention of three players is a great build. Something a lot of teams use.
• 2nd Guardian fight: I’m sorry, but he was just a better player then you. You can see from the ticks of your condition damage, that you should have be able to take him down, but your damage was not consistent enough at all. And again, the point of his build is probably to stall time, until his friends arrive to kill you. It’s a pretty obvious tactic.
• 3rd Guardian fight: Okay, he’s still standing on the node, so obviously he’s build to outlast you. Now you just went into a fight that you know you’re going to lose, meaning that you are dragging down your team. It’s also obvious that he’s a good player who knows what he’s doing, because every time you get enough stacks on him to drain his life, he knocks you back and heals. You should have called for back up, or ran away to help your team on another node.

It’s nice to see someone who has the balls to show a gameplay video, though. A lot of people like to complain, but they aren’t brave enough to show a video of their gameplay. I hope you learn something from the comments =)

Kasama.8941:

It’s nice to see someone who has the balls to show a gameplay video, though. A lot of people like to complain, but they aren’t brave enough to show a video of their gameplay. I hope you learn something from the comments =)

his purpose was not to teach people how to play necro but to show , in his opinion, the op thing he don’t like. he should do a video in which he stand still till they kill him to explain better.
i respect his pov, but i dont agree.

Kasama.8941:

It’s nice to see someone who has the balls to show a gameplay video, though. A lot of people like to complain, but they aren’t brave enough to show a video of their gameplay. I hope you learn something from the comments =)

Yea I’m gonna have to agree there.
A parallel thought I have is, “this guy must not have any clue how bad he is to start recording with the idea to prove there’s something wrong with the game.”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1q8_702Cok

It’s just a little something I put together, showing what some of the classes do (Guardian, Thief, and Mesmer) and how they affect a tPvP match.

Looking at that video all that i see is WHINE.

A necro complaining about other classes OP skills….

just for the record i play 6 toons and all of them about equally in pvp exept for my warrior and i play the thief to a lesser extend since like the warrior i find it simply to easy to rake in kills with these 2 classes.

I have taken down guardians solo with any of these classes. He complains that he had a hard time taking down a guaridna with 3 people, in the vid there were 3 people hitting him for 2 seconds then it was 2 people for the rest of the fight and the guard went down in 10 seconds flat.

A bunker build takes longer to down …..you dont say ? A necro bunker build has the same effect -_-
A necro loaded up with a ton of toughness and any defense stat available and the second lifebar which allows you to regen you main life bar is different how ?

So why is this guy complaining about taking to long to down that guard with 2 …not 3 people in that vid since it only took 10 seconds?

He complains about MOA and conveniently did not show his necro use DS at any point in that video. I love playing my necro but complaining about a 10 second MOA as a necro with DS availlable is a good for a LOL or 2.

On my necro i can go into DS for a longer time,do dmg,Fear And regen my HP to full health. While the other players have taken dmg from me i come out restored but he complains about …moa….

He complains about the thief going into stealth while down and that he cant target him , smart move on that thiefs part but other classes have AOE’s that deal with that , his doesnt , tough luck.

Backstab, yes it needs a nerf, i dont think there should be 1 class that is able to one shot anyone.

Funny enough he does not complain when the thief backstabs him in the video but only becomes visible after he already died to the backstab …..???….

In short this video was nothing but a but..but my class is perfectly fine , nerf the rest videos and nothing is being said that “we all thought”.