Guild Wars 2

Hi,

Do you usually take a quick sale to the person with the highest buy order, or do you post it above that price?

I always make a quick sale, and think maybe I’m doing it wrong.

Thanks.

My rule of thumb:

NEVER sell to a buy offer. Buy offers are for “suckers” who want quick coin and are willing to trade away profit for speed. At a minimum, match the lowest sell offer.

My other rule of thumb:

ALWAYS buy using offers. Sell listings are for “suckers” who want quick items and are willing to spend more for speed.

Those sound like good rules of thumb, especially the first, as I don’t buy anything off the TP anyway. I was indeed one of those ‘suckers’

Lankybrit.4598:

Those sound like good rules of thumb, especially the first, as I don’t buy anything off the TP anyway. I was indeed one of those ‘suckers’

Like any rule of thumb, they have exceptions, especially if a market is moving very fast and you need to get in or out NOW. For most of the time though, they work great.

For most items that i loot and sell, i even usually go a little over the lowest listing. Ectos are a good example because they fluctuate so much during the day. Usually you have a couple of silver between highest bid and lowest listing, for example 34s/37s. Then i would usually list at 39s and they still sell within an hour or day. I do the same with nearly every other crafting material. Most gear drops i get, i salvage/forge, so i dont sell them that much, not sure about their velocity. But in general, i would advice, if you sell something expensive, like an exotic weapon or a stack of materials from your collectible tab, rightclick it first and select buy more on TP, to check out how the various sell listings are situated. For example you might have a crafting mat that has a highest bid of 1s and lowest listing of 1.05s. But there are only 15 sell listings at 1.05s and after that there is a bunch at 2s. So i would list at 1.99s and expect it to sell pretty fast. Just by checking the sell listings, you would get nearly double the gold for your mats and it only takesa few seconds.
I know its a pain for some to do this but in the long run, you will get alot more value for your loot and besides that, will be much more familiar with prices in general, which is always an advantage.

It depends on what and why you are selling.

It isn’t wrong to sell at a buy order price. If you are trying to make money off of things you have to sell, then it can be beneficial because there is no risk: you don’t have to wait for your money and you aren’t going to be undercut.

I have made money on crafting items and selling at the lowest buy order. It is rare and difficult to find those markets, but there is no risk because you are filling a guaranteed order.

If you are trying to make the most money possible, then you have to accept some risk when selling at a price above the buy order. There are multiple ways to mitigate risk, like listing a sell order half way between the highest buy order and lowest sell order, but you won’t make the maximum amount of profit.

As Wanze pointed out, sometimes listing above the lowest sell order will result in quick sales at higher profit as well. Some highly volatile markets can see numerous spikes throughout the day and understanding the market makes it better to understand a reasonable price point, even if it is higher than another’s sell order. There are many markets that see daily fluctuations where supply increases or decreases throughout the day. There are also weekly fluctuations from weekend players where supply increases throughout the weekend and prices are more likely to be lower than towards the end of the week.

So, it really depends on the market, how much effort you think it is worth in understanding that market, and how much patience you can afford.

Let’s take an example. I am at least level 150 on my crafts, so I don’t need Tier 1 and 2 materials any more. So, if I get Iron Ore, I just sell on the TP. Currently, I get 1s 10c from the highest buy order. But the lowest sell is 1s 33c. So maybe I’ll try listing them at 1s 32c tonight and see what happens.

Lankybrit.4598:

Let’s take an example. I am at least level 150 on my crafts, so I don’t need Tier 1 and 2 materials any more. So, if I get Iron Ore, I just sell on the TP. Currently, I get 1s 10c from the highest buy order. But the lowest sell is 1s 33c. So maybe I’ll try listing them at 1s 32c tonight and see what happens.

It will definitely move at 1s 32c. Iron is a high velocity market thanks to its use in Ascended crafting.

Just an FYI, you may be level 150, but Tiers 2-6 are all used in large quantities in level 500 crafting so you may want to reconsider selling your Iron.

Tier 1 is currently left out, but that may change.

Lankybrit.4598:

Let’s take an example. I am at least level 150 on my crafts, so I don’t need Tier 1 and 2 materials any more. So, if I get Iron Ore, I just sell on the TP. Currently, I get 1s 10c from the highest buy order. But the lowest sell is 1s 33c. So maybe I’ll try listing them at 1s 32c tonight and see what happens.

Unless you are SURE you never want any Ascended items you might want to hold on to those T2 – T6 materials….. (Sell the T1s all day long).

Thanks to everyone here. I changed to sell at lowest seller price (can’t be bothered to type in my own undercut price) and am making more gold now. If there is only a minute difference between highest bid and lowest sell, I’ll do highest bid for a quick sell, but otherwise, the lowest sell is working. I do have 50 or so items regularly in my transaction list, but the money is trickling in all the time.

Lankybrit.4598:

Thanks to everyone here. I changed to sell at lowest seller price (can’t be bothered to type in my own undercut price) and am making more gold now. If there is only a minute difference between highest bid and lowest sell, I’ll do highest bid for a quick sell, but otherwise, the lowest sell is working. I do have 50 or so items regularly in my transaction list, but the money is trickling in all the time.

It would be nice to have an up/down arrow to adjust those bids with a click instead of having to type it in.

You don’t have to type it in. Just click on it an scroll your mouse wheel up or down.

Saint Scarlet.2906:

You don’t have to type it in. Just click on it an scroll your mouse wheel up or down.

wow! can’t believe i never knew that. thanks

I follow the items I am going to be selling for a long time, so neither the lowest seller nor the highest buyer are relevant to me. I know the price range of the items I am selling, so I manually price them such that they will sell eventually for a slightly higher than normal profit.

In response to a post in this thread, the Buy It Now isn’t always for suckers. Some items are just too close in price between highest buyer and lowest seller, like ectoplasms, so all I would be saving by making a listing is peanuts compared to the convenience of having the ectos and doing the crafting. Other crafting materials have a higher spread though, ectos and some foods are the only exceptions I can think of to your rule.

depends on what I’m selling and the difference between the buy and sell price of the item if it’s tiny I’ll just take the money and run

As others have implied, it’s all about the velocity of the market. With crafting materials there is no real issue unless you are really unlucky and list to sell just as the market hits its peak or as a rush on an item is coming to an end (iron ore and Unidentified dyes have both experienced this recently). However that rare level 47 bow you found might still be sitting on the TP after a month even though you undercut the lowest seller by ten percent.

Mtpelion has it mostly right. I’m sure if there’s a one or two copper difference between the buy and sell, then few of us would hesitate to buy from the sell orders. I look at the difference between the buy and sell orders, particularly for low budget items. If the difference is pretty small, usually within 3-4 copper, then I don’t really care about buying from sell orders. However, if I’m making or buying large quantities of something, or if the item has greater value, then I’ll watch that difference more closely and buy using buy orders.

It might be interesting to note here that the GW2 market has evolved a lot like the real securities markets of the world, especially the US. Market makers (also called specialists and a few other terms) exist that do nothing other than to buy and sell in a narrow gap, making a relatively small amount per transaction but with a huge number of transactions. These are heavily regulated, and then increasingly less regulated are the high frequency (“day”) traders followed by pure speculators.

If you ask someone in the finance industry what purpose these all serve they’ll usually answer “to create liquidity and mitigate risk.” And it’s arguably true in a lot of cases.

GW2 has evolved just like that. If you’re willing to sacrifice speed and safety a little you can increase your profits by avoiding some of those middle men, at least to an extent, and in the most active markets you take on the least risk. The only big differences are that there is no real regulation of either high frequency trading or market making in GW2 and there is a much higher transactional cost. This probably serves to give the middle men a bit more control in GW2, while also making it an even better idea to avoid them when the risk and lower liquidity is acceptable.

It would be interesting if the developers introduced some form of regulation of the high frequency and high volume traders. For example if they licensed them (by imposing limits to the non licensed), flagged their bids and offers as a different color, and put a limit on the maximum spread between their buy and sell offers in cases where they have both running.

I’m not suggesting it… but given the parallels to the real markets it’s an interesting thought.

It depends on the item. If it’s something that sells for -10c less to highest buyer as opposed to lowest seller, I go with highest buyer. This usually applies to the evercommon mats.
If something has a several silver difference between highest buy and lowest sell, such as t6 mats, then I tend to place near the lowest sell, with around 5c cheaper.
I don’t really dabble with high value items, been praying to the TP gods to buy that Wintersbark I put on sale over a month ago and it’s still there :/

Saint Scarlet.2906:

You don’t have to type it in. Just click on it an scroll your mouse wheel up or down.

After thousands of hours playing the tp, i never knew this as well. Great little tool to save some time.
I am left handed, so my right hand is on the num pad anyways when i play, which makes it far easier to punch in numbers compared to having your left hand at the other side of the keyboard.

Silalus.8760:

It might be interesting to note here that the GW2 market has evolved a lot like the real securities markets of the world, especially the US. Market makers (also called specialists and a few other terms) exist that do nothing other than to buy and sell in a narrow gap, making a relatively small amount per transaction but with a huge number of transactions. These are heavily regulated, and then increasingly less regulated are the high frequency (“day”) traders followed by pure speculators.

If you ask someone in the finance industry what purpose these all serve they’ll usually answer “to create liquidity and mitigate risk.” And it’s arguably true in a lot of cases.

GW2 has evolved just like that. If you’re willing to sacrifice speed and safety a little you can increase your profits by avoiding some of those middle men, at least to an extent, and in the most active markets you take on the least risk. The only big differences are that there is no real regulation of either high frequency trading or market making in GW2 and there is a much higher transactional cost. This probably serves to give the middle men a bit more control in GW2, while also making it an even better idea to avoid them when the risk and lower liquidity is acceptable.

It would be interesting if the developers introduced some form of regulation of the high frequency and high volume traders. For example if they licensed them (by imposing limits to the non licensed), flagged their bids and offers as a different color, and put a limit on the maximum spread between their buy and sell offers in cases where they have both running.

I’m not suggesting it… but given the parallels to the real markets it’s an interesting thought.

There is no HFT syle activity going on in this game and there is also no real market making in the sense of “specialists”. So adding in regularization seems a bit pointless.

The pure flippers in the game are pretty much just plain old intraday spread scalpers using limit orders.

Cormac.3871:

As others have implied, it’s all about the velocity of the market. With crafting materials there is no real issue unless you are really unlucky and list to sell just as the market hits its peak or as a rush on an item is coming to an end (iron ore and Unidentified dyes have both experienced this recently). However that rare level 47 bow you found might still be sitting on the TP after a month even though you undercut the lowest seller by ten percent.

Yeah, that’s what I’m finding. I actually got an exotic drop, and the highest buy was about 6g, with lowest sell about 7g. I got greedy and went for 7g. But after many days, I gave up, removed it and took the highest buy. I still have about 40 (mostly gear) auctions up.

Lankybrit.4598:

Cormac.3871:

As others have implied, it’s all about the velocity of the market. With crafting materials there is no real issue unless you are really unlucky and list to sell just as the market hits its peak or as a rush on an item is coming to an end (iron ore and Unidentified dyes have both experienced this recently). However that rare level 47 bow you found might still be sitting on the TP after a month even though you undercut the lowest seller by ten percent.

Yeah, that’s what I’m finding. I actually got an exotic drop, and the highest buy was about 6g, with lowest sell about 7g. I got greedy and went for 7g. But after many days, I gave up, removed it and took the highest buy. I still have about 40 (mostly gear) auctions up.

If you have exotic gear in that range, always check the value of the attached sigil/rune. IF you have spare BLSKs, its most of the time more profitable to salvage the exotic. Apart from a couple of ectos and dark matter, you get a 100% chance to recover the upgrade and if it has stats from non crafted inscriptions/insignias (dire, soldier, shaman, magi, sentinel, rabid etc.) you have about a 60% chance to salvage an insignia/inscription as well, which sells for a couple of gold.
And if the item has a skin that you have not unlocked, it will unlock upon salvaging.

Fenrir.3609:

There is no HFT syle activity going on in this game and there is also no real market making in the sense of “specialists”. So adding in regularization seems a bit pointless.

The pure flippers in the game are pretty much just plain old intraday spread scalpers using limit orders.

Fair point on the HFT – that’s the algorithmic and computer controlled stuff. I utterly misused the term. I was thinking of the regulated status anyone can end up hitting, pattern day trader. I hadn’t had my coffee yet…

I do think there is some market making going on though. It’s not formalized, but even in real markets without official market makers there are liquidity providers that serve the same function. Maybe I’m being charitable though.

Anyway, not a real suggestion. I just get fascinated by how virtual markets evolve, and particularly in how rules and systems change them- or don’t.

I’m also only assuming that some of the really huge bid and offer numbers in GW2 represent traders that take both sides simultaneously. For all I know that might not be what’s happening at all.

Silalus.8760:

Fair point on the HFT – that’s the algorithmic and computer controlled stuff. I utterly misused the term. I was thinking of the regulated status anyone can end up hitting, pattern day trader. I hadn’t had my coffee yet…

I do think there is some market making going on though. It’s not formalized, but even in real markets without official market makers there are liquidity providers that serve the same function. Maybe I’m being charitable though.

Anyway, not a real suggestion. I just get fascinated by how virtual markets evolve, and particularly in how rules and systems change them- or don’t.

I’m also only assuming that some of the really huge bid and offer numbers in GW2 represent traders that take both sides simultaneously. For all I know that might not be what’s happening at all.

Yeah I understand what you are saying, sorry for being a bit pedantic before.

Fenrir.3609:

Yeah I understand what you are saying, sorry for being a bit pedantic before.

Nah, no worries. It’s important to be precise about this stuff – financial markets can be a heated subJect. Heck from what I’ve seen around here even more so in game than out…

Wanze.8410:

Saint Scarlet.2906:

You don’t have to type it in. Just click on it an scroll your mouse wheel up or down.

After thousands of hours playing the tp, i never knew this as well. Great little tool to save some time.
I am left handed, so my right hand is on the num pad anyways when i play, which makes it far easier to punch in numbers compared to having your left hand at the other side of the keyboard.

This works for all the number fields on the TP, such as quantity, too [it behaves the same as putting the cursor in the field and pressing the Up or Down arrows].

It even does smart wrapping. If you have a price of 0g 0s 99c, and bump the copper field up by one, it goes to 0g 1s 0c, and then down goes back to 0g 0s 99c.

Wanze.8410:

Lankybrit.4598:

Cormac.3871:

As others have implied, it’s all about the velocity of the market. With crafting materials there is no real issue unless you are really unlucky and list to sell just as the market hits its peak or as a rush on an item is coming to an end (iron ore and Unidentified dyes have both experienced this recently). However that rare level 47 bow you found might still be sitting on the TP after a month even though you undercut the lowest seller by ten percent.

Yeah, that’s what I’m finding. I actually got an exotic drop, and the highest buy was about 6g, with lowest sell about 7g. I got greedy and went for 7g. But after many days, I gave up, removed it and took the highest buy. I still have about 40 (mostly gear) auctions up.

If you have exotic gear in that range, always check the value of the attached sigil/rune. IF you have spare BLSKs, its most of the time more profitable to salvage the exotic. Apart from a couple of ectos and dark matter, you get a 100% chance to recover the upgrade and if it has stats from non crafted inscriptions/insignias (dire, soldier, shaman, magi, sentinel, rabid etc.) you have about a 60% chance to salvage an insignia/inscription as well, which sells for a couple of gold.
And if the item has a skin that you have not unlocked, it will unlock upon salvaging.

Wow. Still re-learning the game. Thanks.

Lankybrit.4598:

Wanze.8410:

Lankybrit.4598:

Cormac.3871:

As others have implied, it’s all about the velocity of the market. With crafting materials there is no real issue unless you are really unlucky and list to sell just as the market hits its peak or as a rush on an item is coming to an end (iron ore and Unidentified dyes have both experienced this recently). However that rare level 47 bow you found might still be sitting on the TP after a month even though you undercut the lowest seller by ten percent.

Yeah, that’s what I’m finding. I actually got an exotic drop, and the highest buy was about 6g, with lowest sell about 7g. I got greedy and went for 7g. But after many days, I gave up, removed it and took the highest buy. I still have about 40 (mostly gear) auctions up.

If you have exotic gear in that range, always check the value of the attached sigil/rune. IF you have spare BLSKs, its most of the time more profitable to salvage the exotic. Apart from a couple of ectos and dark matter, you get a 100% chance to recover the upgrade and if it has stats from non crafted inscriptions/insignias (dire, soldier, shaman, magi, sentinel, rabid etc.) you have about a 60% chance to salvage an insignia/inscription as well, which sells for a couple of gold.
And if the item has a skin that you have not unlocked, it will unlock upon salvaging.

Wow. Still re-learning the game. Thanks.

Being able and being receptive to learning is one of the most important ingredients to success on the tp. That also makes this ballpark my favourite to operate in. Of course, i amke more profit on the tp than the average player, and lots of it. Its because i spent thousands of hours in front of it.
In all honesty, the difference between a player that doesnt make much gold on the tp and someone that does, is the ability and patience of listing sell listings and buy orders at a value that dont represent the average player base. However, if you chose to list your loot at a value outside of those values, you are inclined to state them.
As a TP trader (merchant, manipulator, whatever you call me) this is a big help and cuts into my “gambling time” quite alot.

Personally, not for me, because im lefthanded and had the num pad at my disposal for a while. Its still faster than clicking the right field and adjust üer mouthwheel.