Guild Wars 2

Champ trains rejoice, casual player survives, just barely.

Is the state of this game seriously still “okay” in regards to wealth distribution?

Either grind or spend money on gems is, apparently, the answer to amassing currency.

Most of everything is cosmetic, which is fair. Vanity items should be expensive. I suppose I just have an issue with champ boxes and champ trains, arguably the least skilled portion of this game, is where a majority of these items come from.

Choo choo!

Really now, John. Are champ trains somehow boosting the economy? The commraderie? Can we get a look into the drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?

I defer to your expertise in this issue, but as a player boy is it frustrating.

Why are you looking at one specific type of commodity and generalizing from it?

I can point out to the lower price of ecto and say the economy is doing just fine.

And that’s completely ignoring the fact that price increases aren’t necessarily a bad thing.

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

pswendel.8179:

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

Here is a post I did on 1499 heavy moldy bags….I have to assume all of these came from Orr but I bought them via the TP. You can see what dropped for tier 6 out of those bags to see what happens outside of boxed events. Even if this is a microcosmic look at the RNG universe, the number of bags opened should provide a decent expectation for this item. I am working on a medium loot bag evaluation as well, that post will be up soon.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Heavy-Moldy-Bags-1499-opened-Giant-Eyes/first#post3590992

pswendel.8179:

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

I dont think you can get an answer to this without an economic discussion because the t6 droprate outside of champ bags didnt change while their prices rose (significantly in the last months for all, excluding totems).

A good deal of t6 was created through promotion in the forge but if you check the prices for t5 fine mats, you will realize that their prices rose around 75% (even totems) within the last 3 weeks.

That leaves the question why t5 mats have been rising? My guess would be that they have been used to craft rare lvl 80 weapons to throw into the mf to get pre cursors.

The slight decrease of prices in precursors in the last month supports my theory and would also explain the raised demand in t6 mats.

T5 Mats are however only back to the price they where maybe 10 months ago.
T6 Blood has very often been on 35+ .. the only real difference is now that
Claws and Fangs are also so high. But i’m fine with that, since harvesting wood
and iron isn’t that good anymore since the ascended armor patch, i can at least
return to farm Arctodus in Frostgorge

Ah .. and now i remember that there was a post on reddit where somebody crafted masses of yellow swords with 8 accounts or whatever and made big money with selling them .. maybe thats the reason for the rise of t5 prices.

Why the rise? More demand. Period. Players have nothing to do with gold in the game so they are going for legendaries.

Wanze.8410:

pswendel.8179:

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

I dont think you can get an answer to this without an economic discussion because the t6 droprate outside of champ bags didnt change while their prices rose (significantly in the last months for all, excluding totems).

A good deal of t6 was created through promotion in the forge but if you check the prices for t5 fine mats, you will realize that their prices rose around 75% (even totems) within the last 3 weeks.

That leaves the question why t5 mats have been rising? My guess would be that they have been used to craft rare lvl 80 weapons to throw into the mf to get pre cursors.

The slight decrease of prices in precursors in the last month supports my theory and would also explain the raised demand in t6 mats.

Here is what happened to cause T5 prices to go up:

Mithril ore dropped several weeks back from around 50c to it’s current value of 30c. Why, I don’t know. But this directly impacted the market of T5 materials considering that the demand side for T5 materials is largely driven by players who craft their own rares for forging or selling.

Is it possible that T6 prices have gone up because of the rise in T5? Likely, though that would mean a large number of players would be promoting T5-T6, even though that is grossly inefficiently and not the best silver per skill point.

pswendel.8179:

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

You need to read over your original post. How this topic doesn’t involve economic discussion perplexes me, because it’s exactly what you want to talk about.

Or it could be in anticipation of the ole’ precursor crafting. I mean, it has to come some day, right? Should be sooner rather than later I guess.

Buttercup.5871:

Or it could be in anticipation of the ole’ precursor crafting. I mean, it has to come some day, right? Should be sooner rather than later I guess.

I’m pretty sure T6 prices would have gone up along with the precursor crafting announcement, but this is too far from that release. If T6 prices had remained the same at the start of March, I would have invested.

But at this time, there is not enough powerful demand to sustain a high T6 price merely due to speculation from precursor crafting.

Right now the price is sustained due to the components required to promote.

Vol.7601:

Wanze.8410:

pswendel.8179:

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

I dont think you can get an answer to this without an economic discussion because the t6 droprate outside of champ bags didnt change while their prices rose (significantly in the last months for all, excluding totems).

A good deal of t6 was created through promotion in the forge but if you check the prices for t5 fine mats, you will realize that their prices rose around 75% (even totems) within the last 3 weeks.

That leaves the question why t5 mats have been rising? My guess would be that they have been used to craft rare lvl 80 weapons to throw into the mf to get pre cursors.

The slight decrease of prices in precursors in the last month supports my theory and would also explain the raised demand in t6 mats.

Here is what happened to cause T5 prices to go up:

Mithril ore dropped several weeks back from around 50c to it’s current value of 30c. Why, I don’t know. But this directly impacted the market of T5 materials considering that the demand side for T5 materials is largely driven by players who craft their own rares for forging or selling.

Is it possible that T6 prices have gone up because of the rise in T5? Likely, though that would mean a large number of players would be promoting T5-T6, even though that is grossly inefficiently and not the best silver per skill point.

Most people have no idea about ROI per skillpoint anyways and settle for 10 silver.

And on average, t5 common mats only account for ~25% of the crafting cost of rare weapons, t5 fine mats are the other 75%, so i dont think that the mithril price had much of an impact on it.

Wanze.8410:

Vol.7601:

Wanze.8410:

pswendel.8179:

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

I dont think you can get an answer to this without an economic discussion because the t6 droprate outside of champ bags didnt change while their prices rose (significantly in the last months for all, excluding totems).

A good deal of t6 was created through promotion in the forge but if you check the prices for t5 fine mats, you will realize that their prices rose around 75% (even totems) within the last 3 weeks.

That leaves the question why t5 mats have been rising? My guess would be that they have been used to craft rare lvl 80 weapons to throw into the mf to get pre cursors.

The slight decrease of prices in precursors in the last month supports my theory and would also explain the raised demand in t6 mats.

Here is what happened to cause T5 prices to go up:

Mithril ore dropped several weeks back from around 50c to it’s current value of 30c. Why, I don’t know. But this directly impacted the market of T5 materials considering that the demand side for T5 materials is largely driven by players who craft their own rares for forging or selling.

Is it possible that T6 prices have gone up because of the rise in T5? Likely, though that would mean a large number of players would be promoting T5-T6, even though that is grossly inefficiently and not the best silver per skill point.

Most people have no idea about ROI per skillpoint anyways and settle for 10 silver.

And on average, t5 common mats only account for ~25% of the crafting cost of rare weapons, t5 fine mats are the other 75%, so i dont think that the mithril price had much of an impact on it.

A lower mithril ore price makes the initial buyers buy up lots of T5 mats to take advantage of the savings. Overtime, these savings made up through the lower price of ore get cancelled out by the higher price of T5 mats.

It’s not coincidental that the fall of ore happens at the same time as the rise in T5 price.

Ore starts dropping Jan. 20
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/19700

Intricate totem rises Jan. 20
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24299

Potent Venom
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24282

Potent Blood
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24294

Of course, something else could have happened, but the timing and the fact that mithril ore/t5 are paired components for a market that is demand-heavy tells me it’s all linked.

Vol.7601:

Wanze.8410:

Vol.7601:

Wanze.8410:

pswendel.8179:

Here let me help you. I’m not invoking an economy discussion. I’m asking for a T6 evaluation.

“Can we get a look into the [T6] drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?”

I dont think you can get an answer to this without an economic discussion because the t6 droprate outside of champ bags didnt change while their prices rose (significantly in the last months for all, excluding totems).

A good deal of t6 was created through promotion in the forge but if you check the prices for t5 fine mats, you will realize that their prices rose around 75% (even totems) within the last 3 weeks.

That leaves the question why t5 mats have been rising? My guess would be that they have been used to craft rare lvl 80 weapons to throw into the mf to get pre cursors.

The slight decrease of prices in precursors in the last month supports my theory and would also explain the raised demand in t6 mats.

Here is what happened to cause T5 prices to go up:

Mithril ore dropped several weeks back from around 50c to it’s current value of 30c. Why, I don’t know. But this directly impacted the market of T5 materials considering that the demand side for T5 materials is largely driven by players who craft their own rares for forging or selling.

Is it possible that T6 prices have gone up because of the rise in T5? Likely, though that would mean a large number of players would be promoting T5-T6, even though that is grossly inefficiently and not the best silver per skill point.

Most people have no idea about ROI per skillpoint anyways and settle for 10 silver.

And on average, t5 common mats only account for ~25% of the crafting cost of rare weapons, t5 fine mats are the other 75%, so i dont think that the mithril price had much of an impact on it.

A lower mithril ore price makes the initial buyers buy up lots of T5 mats to take advantage of the savings. Overtime, these savings made up through the lower price of ore get cancelled out by the higher price of T5 mats.

It’s not coincidental that the fall of ore happens at the same time as the rise in T5 price.

Ore starts dropping Jan. 20
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/19700

Intricate totem rises Jan. 20
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24299

Potent Venom
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24282

Potent Blood
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24294

Of course, something else could have happened, but the timing and the fact that mithril ore/t5 are paired components for a market that is demand-heavy tells me it’s all linked.

As was mentioned earlier, the guy multiboxing and crafting greatswords to sell, could have been an initiator as well. Iirc, it was posted around Jan. 20th.

Just checked the video, it was listed on Jan. 7, which is still two weeks before the spike on 20/21st.

Then again, 21st was Marionette patch day, but I do not recall any significant content changes that would have caused the T5 spike.

Vol.7601:

Just checked the video, it was listed on Jan. 7, which is still two weeks before the spike on 20/21st.

Then again, 21st was Marionette patch day, but I do not recall any significant content changes that would have caused the T5 spike.

If you check the timeframe between the 7th and the 20th, you will see that most t5 mats had more supply than demand and around Jan. 20th, equilibrium was reached, subsequently rising prices.

I dont think Marionette content itself has much to do with this as well, except that maybe alot of people have been running the champ train between christmas and marionette to gather gold for ascended armor because there was no other content coming out anyways. When Marionette went live, alot of people stayed afk 1 hour before the event, so they dont get into overflow. So across servers, this could mean that the train lost alot of population since then, subsequently lowering the supply in t5 and 6 mats along the way that usually gets generated by it.

yes marionette content has a lot to do with this and you can see this on other products too

when this content startet alot people stopped what they nomally do and just sit there on mainmap all day to trie the boss – wurm too

= lower supply at same demand = price go up

Wanze.8410:

So across servers, this could mean that the train lost alot of population since then, subsequently lowering the supply in t5 and 6 mats along the way that usually gets generated by it.

Yepp .. there are not that much people running the train these days on my server. Since i farm Arcodus around the troll and kill Troll now and then when i see the train, i’ve noticed that indeed.

Beldin.5498:

Wanze.8410:

So across servers, this could mean that the train lost alot of population since then, subsequently lowering the supply in t5 and 6 mats along the way that usually gets generated by it.

Yepp .. there are not that much people running the train these days on my server. Since i farm Arcodus around the troll and kill Troll now and then when i see the train, i’ve noticed that indeed.

Are you also farming grawl by the thousands, by any chance? Because those elaborate totems just don’t seem to rise in price. Ever. I mean, every t6 price rises, even the t5 totems doubled in price, yet the t6 totems remain at the same price. It was odd the last time round (when someone created a thread on the continious low price of t6 totems), but now it just doesn’t add up anymore.

pswendel.8179:

Champ trains rejoice, casual player survives, just barely.

Is the state of this game seriously still “okay” in regards to wealth distribution?

The champ train community:
http://ragefaces.s3.amazonaws.com/5041e101ae7c704e28000007/success.png

pswendel.8179:

Really now, John. Are champ trains somehow boosting the economy? The commraderie? Can we get a look into the drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?

The champ train creates supply, which you demand. If the champ train didn’t run, the price of EVERYTHING would skyrocket. They work tirelessly to keep prices low.
For you.

Supply and demand.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-yWKgZv9JY

Recalibar.6482:

pswendel.8179:

Champ trains rejoice, casual player survives, just barely.

Is the state of this game seriously still “okay” in regards to wealth distribution?

The champ train community:
http://ragefaces.s3.amazonaws.com/5041e101ae7c704e28000007/success.png

pswendel.8179:

Really now, John. Are champ trains somehow boosting the economy? The commraderie? Can we get a look into the drops of these mats outside of champ boxes and estimate where it could be vs where it is?

The champ train creates supply, which you demand. If the champ train didn’t run, the price of EVERYTHING would skyrocket. They work tirelessly to keep prices low.
For you.

Supply and demand.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-yWKgZv9JY

Nice spin.

Except my point is the material market should not depend on champ trains.

pswendel.8179:

Nice spin.

Except my point is the material market should not depend on champ trains.

With the addition of Magic Find being account wide, perhaps that might be a possibility when more people constantly run 200-300% and loot fat stacks of T6 from dungeon/fractal runs. Higher level fractals would also be nice too, and as would higher magic find loot chances from trash mobs dependent on reward level.

But as of right now, nerfing champ trains alone would hurt everyone.

Recalibar.6482:

pswendel.8179:

Nice spin.

Except my point is the material market should not depend on champ trains.

With the addition of Magic Find being account wide, perhaps that might be a possibility when more people constantly run 200-300% and loot fat stacks of T6 from dungeon/fractal runs. Higher level fractals would also be nice too, and as would higher magic find loot chances from trash mobs dependent on reward level.

But as of right now, nerfing champ trains alone would hurt everyone.

Why is a nerf to champ trains coming up?
All I’ve mentioned is that the dependency on the trains is undesirable.
Edit: in my original post I merely asked to take a look at how the drops are handled OUTSIDE of champ boxes.

Actually, if you got a good karma train and a commander who can win a zerg fight in EotM, loot and gold per hour is far better than frostgorge. Maybe its just the crowd of people (more wvwler) running in EotM that keeps their t5/6 for themselves instead of selling them like the people in frostgorge/queensdale.

Wanze.8410:

Actually, if you got a good karma train and a commander who can win a zerg fight in EotM, loot and gold per hour is far better than frostgorge. Maybe its just the crowd of people (more wvwler) running in EotM that keeps their t5/6 for themselves instead of selling them like the people in frostgorge/queensdale.

That’s possible. I’m fairly biased as a PVE player that I have to admit- I don’t even know how good or bad WvW loot can be.

Buttercup.5871:

Beldin.5498:

Wanze.8410:

So across servers, this could mean that the train lost alot of population since then, subsequently lowering the supply in t5 and 6 mats along the way that usually gets generated by it.

Yepp .. there are not that much people running the train these days on my server. Since i farm Arcodus around the troll and kill Troll now and then when i see the train, i’ve noticed that indeed.

Are you also farming grawl by the thousands, by any chance? Because those elaborate totems just don’t seem to rise in price. Ever. I mean, every t6 price rises, even the t5 totems doubled in price, yet the t6 totems remain at the same price. It was odd the last time round (when someone created a thread on the continious low price of t6 totems), but now it just doesn’t add up anymore.

Nope .. i avoid the grawls since they seldom drop anything at all. I know that there were often running bots farming the grawls in the past, but haven’t seen any bot in the last weeks .. so not sure why the totems are that low. Maybe demand is simply not that high ..