Guild Wars 2

Gobble D Goop.4081:

As for the grind, it isnt that much. ill use the uber armchair for this example:

Uber Chair of Awesomeness- 50 Spiritwood Planks (intricate wooden chair), 500 Ancient Planks (uses more than one type of wood), 5 Deldrimor Ingots (screws/bolts/nails), 20 Bolts of Damask (soft cushion), 500 Gossamer Bolts (more softness for cushion), 200 Gold Ingots (gold plated), 20 of each type of Orb (its very shiny), 200k Karma (giant shiny chairs require lots of convincing to build), 50 gold coins (think of it as insurance for your many rare materials…)

The idea seems fine at first glance but adding a giant material sink into the game doesn’t seem like a great idea. Especially involving things like time gated materials.

Khisanth.2948:

Gobble D Goop.4081:

As for the grind, it isnt that much. ill use the uber armchair for this example:

Uber Chair of Awesomeness- 50 Spiritwood Planks (intricate wooden chair), 500 Ancient Planks (uses more than one type of wood), 5 Deldrimor Ingots (screws/bolts/nails), 20 Bolts of Damask (soft cushion), 500 Gossamer Bolts (more softness for cushion), 200 Gold Ingots (gold plated), 20 of each type of Orb (its very shiny), 200k Karma (giant shiny chairs require lots of convincing to build), 50 gold coins (think of it as insurance for your many rare materials…)

The idea seems fine at first glance but adding a giant material sink into the game doesn’t seem like a great idea. Especially involving things like time gated materials.

Usually, when one adds a material sink, it is to consume underused and undervalued materials like T5 leather. Not super-expensive time gated material.

If you want a perfect example of a material sink, look at maudrey. The only thing they messed up is the foxfire clusters which massively disrupted the market for wood.

However you had two time gated ingredients (one of the two being extremely cheap) and a sink for bloodstone dust and T5 leather. These helped me make money btw.

A similar system could be used for high end upgrades of the GH.

Khisanth.2948:

Gobble D Goop.4081:

As for the grind, it isnt that much. ill use the uber armchair for this example:

Uber Chair of Awesomeness- 50 Spiritwood Planks (intricate wooden chair), 500 Ancient Planks (uses more than one type of wood), 5 Deldrimor Ingots (screws/bolts/nails), 20 Bolts of Damask (soft cushion), 500 Gossamer Bolts (more softness for cushion), 200 Gold Ingots (gold plated), 20 of each type of Orb (its very shiny), 200k Karma (giant shiny chairs require lots of convincing to build), 50 gold coins (think of it as insurance for your many rare materials…)

The idea seems fine at first glance but adding a giant material sink into the game doesn’t seem like a great idea. Especially involving things like time gated materials.

Well, ATM there does need to be some giant material sink in the game to at least balance the supply and demand. Look at what happened during the past two zeph events. Many of the common and over saturated markets rose a bit.

Now granted, when its a permanent feature, more farmers would try to fill the market again, but if demand is high enough, that would take awhile.

I agree that time gated items such as ascended mats should either be left out, or for very minimum items that require very little amount of the one per day ascended mats.

Conski Deshan.2057:

munkiman.3068:

The more i think about decor and furnishings as a “progression mechanic”, the less i feel it’s as appropriate for halls. I’d much rather see something like that in personal instances.

Many of the ideas here including mine are probably at least somewhat co-opted from personal housing ideas. Unless they know personal housing is also coming people are going to try and get some of the recognition into guildhalls instead.

That said there’s not a lot of progression methods to choose from and you’re bound to upset one group or another. Furnishings/skins are the tried and true method.

If you make size the progression: I’d complain and decorating people would too.
If you make functionality the progression: small guilds will complain.
If you make location the progression: people who like one particular one will complain.
If you make NPC population the progression: most people won’t try.

The solution is to not have any progression at all.
If there is measurable overall progress then there is an end somewhere.
An ending would mean one of two things.
1) Stagnation
2) “The end is only the beginning.”, a giant gate in disguise. You think you are making progress but only after getting to the end can you really get started.

Things will take resources be it material, time, gold, influence, etc. or any combination there of but would just be for individual item.

People also seem hellbent on putting in unnecessary and arbitrary roadblocks. Why must _______ require 500 guild members? Why must _______ require a million gold?

How “great” a guild hall is should be limited by the creativity of its owners not the size of its roster.

Hi and Chris hope everything is well since you have been back.

I liked the way Guild Halls were implemented in GW1 and think it works as an instance. Have a button to get there from anywhere you are in the world and also though be able to get anywhere in the world from there. This allows groups to get organized better for the tougher missions especially. This also allows people to hang out for the special events Guilds want to run for other guildies and friends only.

Perhaps even an NPC there that allows the entire party to go together to wvw, dungeon, or guild mission if everyone has the waypoint.

Have an optional “open hall” mode that the leader can activate so if those events are open to anyone then any guild member can invite anyone to the hall for the time set by the leader to join in without becoming a member. A tab could be made with a list of guilds that have an “open hall” at an NPC in a major city with a short description of event if desired. People could then choose and visit that hall, meet new guilds and people. Leader could also designate certain other guilds as allies which would always allow those members also to visit anytime without being members.

Let the guild halls have the amenities like in GW1 with merchants and crafters, etc. and let them have different themes with some choices and then add more choices later.

If people are using home borderlands for merchants and shopping and such then halls will take people that want to shop and craft out of the queues for people who want to really wvw so that would help solve that problem.

Still it may empty out some of the capital cities but then if people are going to borderlands for services anyway then those people aren’t in the capital cities. Could still keep the trading post in the capital cities to keep them going there and there are the festivities in those cities to draw crowds.

Whatever the end result if there is a Guild Hall then I would definitely like to see it so that it can get used later (or sooner the better) for GvG.

Thanks

Khisanth.2948:

Conski Deshan.2057:

munkiman.3068:

The more i think about decor and furnishings as a “progression mechanic”, the less i feel it’s as appropriate for halls. I’d much rather see something like that in personal instances.

Many of the ideas here including mine are probably at least somewhat co-opted from personal housing ideas. Unless they know personal housing is also coming people are going to try and get some of the recognition into guildhalls instead.

That said there’s not a lot of progression methods to choose from and you’re bound to upset one group or another. Furnishings/skins are the tried and true method.

If you make size the progression: I’d complain and decorating people would too.
If you make functionality the progression: small guilds will complain.
If you make location the progression: people who like one particular one will complain.
If you make NPC population the progression: most people won’t try.

The solution is to not have any progression at all.
If there is measurable overall progress then there is an end somewhere.
An ending would mean one of two things.
1) Stagnation
2) “The end is only the beginning.”, a giant gate in disguise. You think you are making progress but only after getting to the end can you really get started.

Things will take resources be it material, time, gold, influence, etc. or any combination there of but would just be for individual item.

People also seem hellbent on putting in unnecessary and arbitrary roadblocks. Why must _______ require 500 guild members? Why must _______ require a million gold?

How “great” a guild hall is should be limited by the creativity of its owners not the size of its roster.

I’d be wary of no progression as ironically that could stagnate halls too. If everyone decorates their halls to their specs instantly, while the halls will still see use it won’t have meant anything to the players as they did’nt work towards it and you’re getting a very poor tradeoff for development time to content hours. Plus you’d tend to get an over-saturation of some items/designs as players would like some more than others. (predicting it would be something white or black that glows and has an additional function.)

Plus personally I like the competition. I’d hope to be able to say “My guild hall is filled with cool prestigious items you’d never hope to have, my guildies and I worked our butts off to get them”. It’s always a major draw for us(Think Mireille from .Hack who always hunted for rare items ).

I assume you’re aware that I’ve been vehemently against resource and gold grinds and it’s not how I’d implement. They are literally just play for 10 hours here’s your item, which just wastes everyone’s time. Putting them behind challenges is a different approach and makes it more are you and your guild good enough at this game to get that item.
I want to move away from a vending machine approach and go for a competition approach. A guild should not feel like they effectively have everything and just need to decide to do it. It should be a question of if not when.

That said guilds won’t base their decisions around solely that, for instance one of my guilds decided that we’d go with a waterfalls/waterworks and marble type guild hall if it was at all possible when it’s introduced, we’ll go for that if it’s the easiest unlock in the game or gated behind a challenge only 10 guilds have ever done. But after that the individual items for the hall we’ll want rare and prestigious decorations that show we’ve mastered this game, if a player or guild works smart , well and in a co-ordinated manner they should be rewarded for it above and beyond people messing about in the open world. Otherwise you’re dragging them down to the lowest level of play which I know from other MMO’s causes them to leave as they don’t feel their time is being valued.

Khisanth.2948:

Conski Deshan.2057:

munkiman.3068:

The more i think about decor and furnishings as a “progression mechanic”, the less i feel it’s as appropriate for halls. I’d much rather see something like that in personal instances.

Many of the ideas here including mine are probably at least somewhat co-opted from personal housing ideas. Unless they know personal housing is also coming people are going to try and get some of the recognition into guildhalls instead.

That said there’s not a lot of progression methods to choose from and you’re bound to upset one group or another. Furnishings/skins are the tried and true method.

If you make size the progression: I’d complain and decorating people would too.
If you make functionality the progression: small guilds will complain.
If you make location the progression: people who like one particular one will complain.
If you make NPC population the progression: most people won’t try.

The solution is to not have any progression at all.

This idea is very very dangerous.

Let me explain why. By reading your post, one can see that you are a nice person. However, your idea will lead to a community backlash because it will remove the sense of accomplishment and challenge that the guild hall feature could bring to a community that is craving for challenge and involving content.

Nobody has ever found something that was given as granted rewarding. Nobody. Ever.

Your argument is valid and makes sense if you are playing minecraft or any good sandbox game. However GW2 is not minecraft (it’s a theme park MMO) and I doubt GH will have a flexibility remotely comparable to what players have in minecraft.

Thus we should lock the progression of the GH behind more or less challenging content, that is interesting for both large and smaller guilds to an extent.

I agree with Vodcom here.

Not having complaints shouldn’t be the end goal of adding things to the game, complaints are a source of information, feedback, but that doesn’t mean that anyone that can complain (and everyone can) is the holder of vision and truth of what should be in the game.

I for once, would like to see progression in every possible direction, anything that can be expanded onto, should have some sort of progression, be it for increasing the size, or getting new functions, or adding new stuff, etc.
The thing is, as long as progressing is a fun journey, we are good.

Admittedly, I think the discussion about progression is a bit off topic; but, I couldn’t fight the urge to blather on a bit about it anyway.

Arbitrary hierarchical systems in games do not make them more fun, they make them more tedious. For example, there is no weapon type progression in GW2; but, there is weapon skill progression (recently changed to make it more accessible). Weapon types need no progression because they serve as a foundation for game mechanics. Many of the features of guild halls should be akin to weapon types: foundations for game mechanics that do not require progression. Other features may require progression.

At this stage in the discussion (considering what guild halls should be) the question of whether or not specific aspects are part of specific progression schemes is a bit premature. Perhaps we would be better served by focusing on the specific types of features and functions we want included in guild halls and why we want them.

Retro.6831:

snip for space

Prestige
The manner in which Neighborhoods develop their common area and compete with each other is through “Prestige.” This is not a currency, but a value; each Guild Hall has an individual Prestige score, and the neighborhood’s score is simply the sum of all halls located there. Think of it as a rating of how awesome your Guild Hall is; the more cool stuff you throw in there, the higher your hall’s score.

The primary source of Prestige is the furnishings that players add to their guild halls. A hall with fine-quality [Wooden chairs] can’t compete with a hall full of exotic [Ascalonian Thrones]! There are other means to increase your prestige that I am still working on, but here’s how furnishings would work;

I had an idea over the weekend. The feature above could function like the Faction system from GW1 (Luxon/Kurzick). The stuff that is claimed would be open world spaces. The Guilds with the highest Prestige numbers would be assigned a spot in the open world that their guild hall would appear in. This would only be a copy of their GH and they would still have access to their instanced version, but they would also be able to access the open world location for free. This open world location would need to be upgraded at a time interval in order to compare other prestige values (guilds being overtaken) or to add upgrades/changes that the current owner makes to their instance.

*Benefits:
-The larger guilds would have something to compete for
-Open world plots for guild halls to show off their awesomeness

*Issues:
-Guild hall plots might not match the area (Sylvari tree GH in Orr, Norn Ice Lodge in Dry Top etc)
-Prestiege would need an upkeep to prevent older, larger guilds from having a time advantage on newer guilds
-would create a need to update zones on a time based system to accomidate any changes to the guild hall areas (maybe have a weekly GH update time for this?)
-There would be an oversaturation of merchants/crafting stations/BLTraders etc (maybe remove NPCs from open world GHs)

Thats my suggestion for open world halls with instanced halls piggybacked on Retro.6813’s post.

Gobble D Goop.4081:

Retro.6831:

snip for space

Prestige
The manner in which Neighborhoods develop their common area and compete with each other is through “Prestige.” This is not a currency, but a value; each Guild Hall has an individual Prestige score, and the neighborhood’s score is simply the sum of all halls located there. Think of it as a rating of how awesome your Guild Hall is; the more cool stuff you throw in there, the higher your hall’s score.

The primary source of Prestige is the furnishings that players add to their guild halls. A hall with fine-quality [Wooden chairs] can’t compete with a hall full of exotic [Ascalonian Thrones]! There are other means to increase your prestige that I am still working on, but here’s how furnishings would work;

I had an idea over the weekend. The feature above could function like the Faction system from GW1 (Luxon/Kurzick). The stuff that is claimed would be open world spaces. The Guilds with the highest Prestige numbers would be assigned a spot in the open world that their guild hall would appear in. This would only be a copy of their GH and they would still have access to their instanced version, but they would also be able to access the open world location for free. This open world location would need to be upgraded at a time interval in order to compare other prestige values (guilds being overtaken) or to add upgrades/changes that the current owner makes to their instance.

*Benefits:
-The larger guilds would have something to compete for
-Open world plots for guild halls to show off their awesomeness

*Issues:
-Guild hall plots might not match the area (Sylvari tree GH in Orr, Norn Ice Lodge in Dry Top etc)
-Prestiege would need an upkeep to prevent older, larger guilds from having a time advantage on newer guilds
-would create a need to update zones on a time based system to accomidate any changes to the guild hall areas (maybe have a weekly GH update time for this?)
-There would be an oversaturation of merchants/crafting stations/BLTraders etc (maybe remove NPCs from open world GHs)

Thats my suggestion for open world halls with instanced halls piggybacked on Retro.6813’s post.

This is a good idea.
It needs a bit of work in my opinion, but the basis is there.

I think this solves the problem of instanced vs open world.
If everyone can have a GH no matter how much space there is in the Open World, and at the same time you have a “chance” to show your GH to the world, it didn’t just solve the issue, but adds a layer of depth to the idea of prestige around GH.

If we come up with a good system for determining who gets to have his guild on this spots, and for how long, and how to compete for it, we can now have two layers of prestige around GH:

• Getting prestige things on your GH.
• Being able to show those prestige things on the Open World.

Btw, I don’t completely agree with Retro’s idea of prestige, to me it shouldn’t be quantified at all, but a concept that serves as a result of getting difficult things.

I suggest we add an optional upgrade called “The Giant Bloodstone Dust Pile” and guild members can keep making it bigger and bigger by throwing all their excess bloodstone dust on it.

Iason Evan.3806:

I suggest we add an optional upgrade called “The Giant Bloodstone Dust Pile” and guild members can keep making it bigger and bigger by throwing all their excess bloodstone dust on it.

Lol, what about empyreal fragments?

I think i answered the ‘who can have the spot’ question, but i can clarify a little bit (i tend to leave out details sometimes). In my post above, when i mentioned “Prestige,” i was using it as a way of measuring Guilds against one another (the quote from Retro.6831’s initial post). This number would be increased through various means (possibly in a similar way that influence is increased). Guilds with the highest prestige would get the plots. EG, if they made 15 plots, then the 15 guilds with the highest prestige would have their GHs displayed. There would need to be some form of ranking which spots were better than others (GW1 had them ranked as follows: Capitol-Missions and other unclaimable locations-Outposts on your side-Outposts on the opposing side (dont forget in GW1 there were 2 factions fighting, hence the opposing sides thing)).

As for increasing the prestige value, that could go up by doing things together as a guild (running dungeons, fighting bosses, WvW objectives, etc) Retro even listed some specific missions for obtaining furniture. This could also be used to gain prestige.

As for how long, im not sure. The maps would have to be updated every time the spots were updated, so having a frequent update time would mean that people would be dropped for updates each time (frequently = bad). The best way to do this would probably be weekly at a time when not many people are on (4am or something like that). Even then the people that play then would be kicked out every time this was updated (this would include if a guild upgraded their hall any during the week since the basis of my proposal is that they upgrade their instance instead of the open world version of their GH).

Baltzenger.2467:

Iason Evan.3806:

I suggest we add an optional upgrade called “The Giant Bloodstone Dust Pile” and guild members can keep making it bigger and bigger by throwing all their excess bloodstone dust on it.

Lol, what about empyreal fragments?

That would be awesome. They could always make a bloodstone brick statue that everyone can make 100 of. Even at 50 bricks per statue… Ive been turning my dust into bricks and i think i have at least 70 in the bank

EDIT: Or for more awesome use, they could make a Bloodstone/Dragonite Statue encrusted with Empyreal Stars (50 of all 3)

Gobble D Goop.4081:

As for increasing the prestige value, that could go up by doing things together as a guild (running dungeons, fighting bosses, WvW objectives, etc) Retro even listed some specific missions for obtaining furniture. This could also be used to gain prestige.

Question on this how would you address quantity vs quality? how would a skilled 50 man guild compete with an unskilled 500 man guild? If I get you that it’s just an ever increasing number.

Gobble D Goop.4081:

As for how long, im not sure. The maps would have to be updated every time the spots were updated, so having a frequent update time would mean that people would be dropped for updates each time (frequently = bad). The best way to do this would probably be weekly at a time when not many people are on (4am or something like that). Even then the people that play then would be kicked out every time this was updated (this would include if a guild upgraded their hall any during the week since the basis of my proposal is that they upgrade their instance instead of the open world version of their GH).

A system already exists in the game to dynamically modify a map , they wouldn’t need to drop people out to update the map. Mabinogi has a system like this for individual players from a weekly fashion contest it displays a statue of the winner in whatever clothes they won in.

Baltzenger.2467:

Iason Evan.3806:

I suggest we add an optional upgrade called “The Giant Bloodstone Dust Pile” and guild members can keep making it bigger and bigger by throwing all their excess bloodstone dust on it.

Lol, what about empyreal fragments?

Yes! And that could go next to the Chocolate Bunny and Dragonite Easter Egg Statue!

Conski Deshan.2057:

snip for space

Question on this how would you address quantity vs quality? how would a skilled 50 man guild compete with an unskilled 500 man guild? If I get you that it’s just an ever increasing number.

I dont see this working without some form of upkeep (i think the GW1 system was 10% per week or something like that). A non upkeep system would probably not work for this system as it would very much discourage new guild creation after the initial release. (sorry for the lack of clarity on that point). The reward would be for active guilds (the larger guilds would still have the numbers advantage, but they would not be ever increasing beyond all hope of catching them) IMHO this is really the only way to do it because large guilds have invested time and energy into becoming large and remaining that way.

Bottom line: There should be some form of upkeep to not discourage new guild creation. Large guilds worked harder to become large and continue to work hard to stay that way (I oppose all forms of “scaling” for guilds)

lets build guild halls with insane amounts of bloodstone bricks that would have to be contributed by everyone

Gobble D Goop.4081:

Conski Deshan.2057:

snip for space

Question on this how would you address quantity vs quality? how would a skilled 50 man guild compete with an unskilled 500 man guild? If I get you that it’s just an ever increasing number.

I dont see this working without some form of upkeep (i think the GW1 system was 10% per week or something like that). A non upkeep system would probably not work for this system as it would very much discourage new guild creation after the initial release. (sorry for the lack of clarity on that point). The reward would be for active guilds (the larger guilds would still have the numbers advantage, but they would not be ever increasing beyond all hope of catching them) IMHO this is really the only way to do it because large guilds have invested time and energy into becoming large and remaining that way.

Bottom line: There should be some form of upkeep to not discourage new guild creation. Large guilds worked harder to become large and continue to work hard to stay that way (I oppose all forms of “scaling” for guilds)

A decay system, like the one we have on the pvp leaderboards, making “prestige” decrease overtime, so Guilds will need to continue earning prestige to keep their hard earned spots, and if they stop for a period of time they lose their spots.

I agree, scaling the requirements for Guild Hall progression is a horrible idea, it’s just a way to punish big guilds.

maddoctor.2738:

Gobble D Goop.4081:

Conski Deshan.2057:

snip for space

Question on this how would you address quantity vs quality? how would a skilled 50 man guild compete with an unskilled 500 man guild? If I get you that it’s just an ever increasing number.

I dont see this working without some form of upkeep (i think the GW1 system was 10% per week or something like that). A non upkeep system would probably not work for this system as it would very much discourage new guild creation after the initial release. (sorry for the lack of clarity on that point). The reward would be for active guilds (the larger guilds would still have the numbers advantage, but they would not be ever increasing beyond all hope of catching them) IMHO this is really the only way to do it because large guilds have invested time and energy into becoming large and remaining that way.

Bottom line: There should be some form of upkeep to not discourage new guild creation. Large guilds worked harder to become large and continue to work hard to stay that way (I oppose all forms of “scaling” for guilds)

A decay system, like the one we have on the pvp leaderboards, making “prestige” decrease overtime, so Guilds will need to continue earning prestige to keep their hard earned spots, and if they stop for a period of time they lose their spots.

I agree, scaling the requirements for Guild Hall progression is a horrible idea, it’s just a way to punish big guilds.

I may not have phrased my question properly, I’m not asking about a new guild vs an old guild what I mean is.
There is a medium sized guild (50 players) that is excellent in all areas of content and there is a large guild (500 players) that suck at every aspect of gameplay, how does the skilled guild complete with the sheer volume of content points the large guild can pump out just by numbers.
Thats what I meant by quantity vs quality.

Proposal Overview
Letting people chat with guild-members in the guild-hall even when they are not in the game by letting them log in on the site or using an API.
(Of course it would also be possible to let them chat in guild-chat)

Goal of Proposal
Allowing for more communication and bounding of guild-members by letting them also chat when they are not able to play the game.

Proposal Functionality
If there is a special guild-hall chat (else use the guild-chat) allow people to chat in there without being online in the game. This can be done on the official GW2 site but preferably it would also be made availible in the API so people can make a chat-function on there guild-site.

Associated Risks
Depending on implementation it could have security risk. For this reason I would suggest that in case of the API option it works with one password a guild can set and guild-members can log is using the that password and an alias. This prevents them having to use there own user-name and password on possible bad protected sites.

Conski Deshan.2057:

snip for space

There is a medium sized guild (50 players) that is excellent in all areas of content and there is a large guild (500 players) that suck at every aspect of gameplay, how does the skilled guild complete with the sheer volume of content points the large guild can pump out just by numbers.
Thats what I meant by quantity vs quality.

Medium size guilds would probably not be able to compete with larger guilds in that respect (although to be fair, 50 very skilled players could probably have a similar prestige as 500 terrible players due to sheer efficiency). It is unlikely that either of these guild halls would be displayed, however, due to the fact that a 300 size guild with 200 decent players and 100 focused players (good at only 1 or 2 things) would easily beat both in prestige. The only real way i can see 50 skilled players competing with a larger guild would be to recruit more people. There could be a tier system for placing GHs on the open world, but i could see this offending larger guilds or leading to greifing:

Guild A- 50 people, prestige: 500
Guild B- 300 people, prestige: 750
In the tier system, Guild A has an open world spot, but Guild B does not. Guild B kicks 250 of its members, now Guild B will get the spot. Guild A now takes Guild B’s old members in order to raise its prestige by 1000. Guild A kicks 250 members… etc

It might work if only the highest 3 from each lower tier makes it to the open world. for example, say there were 25 open world spots. 3 are for guilds with 2-30 members (prestige requires working with other guild members, therefore a guild of 1 cant earn it). 3 are for guilds with 31-60 members. 3 are for guilds with 61-100 members. the other 14 are for everyone (the top 14 among all guilds). The last category could have a guild with 90 members that plays nonstop all day just to get their guild on the map in a more prestigious location, but the other 9 spots are only for guilds in those categories. That way even the smallest of guilds would be able to display their hall if they got enough prestige.

EDIT: also keep in mind, that prestige might be earned in GvG

Gobble D Goop.4081:

I had an idea over the weekend. . .

The posts I linked to at the top of my post are describing exactly the same kind of mechanic you’ve outlined here, except that in place of the open world they are placed into plots in Lion’s Arch (I feel the Open World should be left open). Prestige is merely the metric on which guilds are ranked, both overall & by league, (more on that in a second or you can read my post way back on page one).

Baltzenger.2467:

If we come up with a good system for determining who gets to have his guild on this spots, and for how long, and how to compete for it, we can now have two layers of prestige around GH . . .

All addressed in my previous post;
Who gets to have their guild in the open world?
The neighborhood with the highest Prestige score in each League (leagues are set up so that no one is excluded purely for their size and activity level).

How long?
I gave a figure of one week, though that’s completely flexible.

How do we complete?

• Collect furnishings with high Prestige value.
• Work with your neighbors (remember, this is a community-driven contest, not just individual guilds).
• Spring for special events (See the “Floating Tangents” part of my post).
• Play together as a guild; “points can be awarded for successful completion of Guild Missions, WvW claims and successful dungeon / PVP matches done as a guild.”

Additionally, I also suggested some form of “Upvote” system, though I’m still working out the details on how that would work.

Baltzenger.2467:

Btw, I don’t completely agree with Retro’s idea of prestige, to me it shouldn’t be quantified at all, but a concept that serves as a result of getting difficult things.

Well, you have to quantify it because there needs to be a score; otherwise there’s no competition amongst guilds for those plots in the Open World. Besides, the Prestige mechanic I suggested is absolutely about getting difficult things. (See the section on Guild Commissions).

Gobble D Goop.4081:

This number would be increased through various means (possibly in a similar way that influence is increased).

Please see the discussion on the last page between Devata & I on why using an influence-like mechanic would be a bad idea for anything but the absolute basic features of Guild Halls (here’s my last post on the matter that would probably act as a sufficient summary; https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/CDI-Guilds-Guild-Halls/page/26#post4476633)

Gobble D Goop.4081:

As for increasing the prestige value, that could go up by doing things together as a guild (running dungeons, fighting bosses, WvW objectives, etc) Retro even listed some specific missions for obtaining furniture. This could also be used to gain prestige.

Prestige, as I envisioned it, represents the Guild Hall’s level of luxury & comfort. That’s why it’s based on the quality of the furnishings you unlock. You can generate extra Prestige each week by doing those kind of things you’ve listed, but the largest chunk needs to come from furnishings. The reason is simple; they’re permanent & guild-bound, so progression is always moving forward & never diminishes even if people stop playing. You also can’t compensate for a lack of furnishings by just running a bunch of stuff as a guild; that’s one way to get furnishings, but it’s not a replacement.

Conski Deshan.2057:

Question on this how would you address quantity vs quality? how would a skilled 50 man guild compete with an unskilled 500 man guild? If I get you that it’s just an ever increasing number.

Already addressed on page one when this proposal was first submitted; “Guilds would be grouped into “leagues” based on size, overall neighborhood quality, etc.” I’m not entirely sure that it needs to be based on guild size because that can rapidly change (small guilds recruit, large guilds splinter) or be misrepresented (large guilds with 500 members may only have 50-100 that could be called ‘active’). I suggested “neighborhood quality” (That is, Prestige, though I hadn’t given it that name yet) because even a small guild that is ultra-dedicated should be able to break out of the “Bronze League” & fight larger guilds who maybe aren’t as concerned with their Guild Hall.

Gobble D Goop.4081:

I dont see this working without some form of upkeep.

Upkeep was discussed to death a few pages back, you guys are reading this thread, right?

Upkeep is antithetical to the design & business model of Guild Wars 2 which allows players to play at their own pace, taking breaks for weeks or even years in some instances, without having to pay a subscription or constantly play to “Keep up with the Jonses” as they would in other MMOs with loot treadmills & such.

The way I see it, who gets the plot shouldn’t be based on this idea of prestige, that’s why I say it shouldn’t be quantified.
I would rather have a crossover system that linkes GH further with other mechanics of the game.

Some possible things that I would like to see:
- Winners of a sPvP tournament getting a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall.
- WvW related feats that allow you to have your Guild Hall on a certain tactical location.
- Raid like content that will allow a guild to have an specific plot in the world to put their GH.

All with decay systems, based on each type of feat required to conquer this plots.

I don’t see GH as an isolated system at all, therefore, I don’t agree with having it’s “endgame” be tied only to what this particular system offers.

Baltzenger.2467:

The way I see it, who gets the plot shouldn’t be based on this idea of prestige, that’s why I say it shouldn’t be quantified.
I would rather have a crossover system that linkes GH further with other mechanics of the game.

Some possible things that I would like to see:
- Winners of a sPvP tournament getting a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall.
- WvW related feats that allow you to have your Guild Hall on a certain tactical location.
- Raid like content that will allow a guild to have an specific plot in the world to put their GH.

All with decay systems, based on each type of feat required to conquer this plots.

I don’t see GH as an isolated system at all, therefore, I don’t agree with having it’s “endgame” be tied only to what this particular system offers.

Did you read any of the posts relevant to the suggestion you’re talking about? It kind of seems like you haven’t. Start here, then here (part 1 and part 2). All of these were not only linked right at the top of the post you guys are quoting, but I also summarized them as well.

Based on your post, the question of “who gets the plot” isn’t determined by who has the best guild hall at all. For example, you suggest that the “Winners of an sPVP tournament get a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall”, and that performance in WvW and “Raid-like content” similarly determines who gets specific plots for just those game types. You close by saying that you “don’t see GH as an isolated system.”

Your suggestion doesn’t factor the guild halls themselves into the equation at all. You’ve instead taken Guild Halls and turned them into a new tier of reward for pre-existing gameplay platforms. The “Heart of the Mists” plot is basically a giant sPVP trophy, for sPVP players only. Sure, you can make it look cool and you have the convenience of having whatever amenities guild halls feature available in that space, but how is it anything more than an elaborate banner that says “This guild is good at sPVP?”

The whole point of the Prestige concept is to pull threads from all of the various game modes (Dungeons, WvW, sPVP, PvE, Crafting, etc.) and weave them into a unified system (not isolated, as you describe) to create something that’s potentially more rewarding for guilds.

The answer to “who gets the Guild Hall plot?” should be “whoever has the best Guild Hall,” and the prestige suggestion is one approach towards that.

Guild Cartography System

Overview
Means to allow guilds to organize through use of maps

Goal
Establish new game mechanics to leverage current map in game to benefit guilds through the implementation of guild hall functions that address group dynamics and global mapping

Functionality
A “Guild Cartographer” NPC would be the core interface for this system. The NPC needs to be unlocked through the guild hall rewards track or purchased through guild influence. Once the Cartographer is placed in the guild hall by a guild leader anyone in the hall can interact with it to access cartography functions. A “Legendary Cartographer” would be a supplemental NPC that would be visible in major cities and WvW citadels only to players representing guilds that have Cartographers in their halls.

The cartography functions initially available would be as follows (these will be further detailed in a later post, due to space constraints):

View Guild Map
Purchase Cartographer’s Scroll
Submit Guild Chart
Publish Guild Chart
Collect Guild Chart
Use Guild Chart

Funds collected on authors’ behaves would be posted to the Black Lion Trading Company interface as coin from a sale. Players can be encouraged to author charts by providing an achievement track, with associated rewards, for publishing and selling successful charts (with audiences of 1200+ unique players or more).

It might be interesting to allow authors to include “passcode recipes” as prefaces to their charts. These recipes would require specific materials to be consumed by the chart, from the user’s inventory or stats, before the map could be viewed. The purpose of this would be to either limit access by available materials (rather than by number of views) or provide some form of role playable use tax. An example might be that you have to combine 30 apples with 5 charr carvings to read “Tibalt’s Great Pie Cabal” Chart or that you would have to sacrifice 75% of your health each time you opened a “Necromancer’s Vow” Chart.

Risks
It is possible that a robust cartography system in the game could bog the server down with excess traffic, especially during peak times such as living story episode launches. Nefarious players might use the annotation features of charts to distribute hate speech, slander or other unethical material within the game. The currency system, as outlined here, may have unknown effects on the economy of the game. Guilds with popular bloggers or social media personalities might be able to flood the market with charts, making it hard for others to compete. There will be a great deal of duplication of information, especially in the early days of the feature’s introduction, which may strain servers. This can be mitigated my keeping a centralized chart library that will automatically reject submissions that are too similar to previously archived charts (increasing the value of annotations above other forms of map editing). Role players may seize on the concept as a means of publishing their personal exploits in game (which might be a good thing for fostering play in that niche). Inventory slots filled with Cartographer’s Scrolls and Master Charts and Guild Charts won’t be available for other items (possibly pushing a tiny percentage of players to buy more storage space). Failing to include a searchable interface for all charts in the game could hamper distribution and trade of charts unnecessarily, making the system seem underwhelming. Guild Maps would have to be handled delicately so that player privacy could be maintained: invisible and offline players should not appear on guild maps. Some confusion might arise from the visibility of Guild Cartographers being tied to currently represented guild, though a bit of trust in the intelligence of the audience should mitigate concerns there.

Overview
Detail functionality of previously posted cartography system

Goal
Detail functionality of Guild Cartographer, Guild Maps, Cartographer’s Scrolls and Master Charts

Functionality
View Guild Map
This will bring up a window that is about 40% the size of the current game window which can be moved and sized to the player’s preference. Within this window a special version of the world map will be shown that shows a yellow dot for each guild member currently playing the game. When opened in pve the map shows the entire Tyria world. When opened in wvw it displays only the wvw portion of the mists (possibly with guild hall maps appended). This map has a display bar at the top that indicates active guild members, total guild members, number of guild parties in the world, guild leaders in the game at the moment, guild events at the moment and number of charts currently available. View zooming controls also appear. Guild leader dots appear larger than all other member dots so that they can be easily identified (perhaps taking the form of the icon chosen in the guild window). Guild events will be indicated on this map by special icons in standard event orange. It would be nice if guild members in parties were displayed with white lines linking each member in a circuit pattern (though this might prove an unnecessary drain on server resources). Guild road markers will appear on this map with their current icon. This map is windowed so that it can remain visible while traveling, like the minimap; but, also while looking at the standard world map, for comparison purposes). The guild map will exist as an amalgam of all player maps within the guild, in terms of the fog of war. Thus, once a single guild member attains world map completion all guild maps will have no fogged areas. New guilds made up of new players will have to complete their guild map either together or by having a single player undertake the task. This will give new players something to work together on if they choose.

Purchase Cartographer’s Scroll
A Cartographer’s Scroll is an inventory item purchased with gold, karma or skill points from a Guild Cartographer. The currency accepted would be converted to guild influence upon acceptance at a rate equivalent to the current coin to influence rate in the game. The availability of this scroll would be controlled according to the guild leader’s preference. This allows scrolls to be guild exclusive, open to guests or limited to guild leaders only, according to guild policies. Scrolls are not bound to accounts, characters or servers; but, they are bound to guilds in so much that any trading of scrolls pays a royalty to the originating guild. Any player that has a scroll can double click it to begin editing a version of the world map. Editing options are limited to 250 character annotations (displayed as icons), event markers, road markers, directional arrows, reward markers and prioritized targets. Zoom level can be set and locked by players. The server saves 3 versions of each scroll: the blank default state, the current edited state and a backup state of the edited version before the most recent edits. Once a player begins editing a scroll it changes into an account bound Master Chart, requiring players to assign a chart name, identification number and author (character name) to the chart. Players can use Master Charts for their own devices or publish them as Guild Charts for credit and profit. Master charts are always editable by the players who created them. Ownership of a Master Chart always remains, ultimately, with the account of the player who created the chart and is guild independent. Cartographer’s Scrolls appear in inventory as stackable items.

Risks
Same as previously stated in earlier post, which see.

Overview
Detail functionality of previously posted cartography system

Goal
Detail functionality of Guild Chart: Submission, Publication, Collection and Use

Functionality
Submit Guild Chart
Players who have purchased Cartographer’s Scrolls and used them to create Master Charts can submit their completed Master Charts to guild leaders for approval. Once a guild leader reviews and accepts a Master Chart an approved copy becomes available from the Guild Cartographer in the form of a Guild Chart. This is an unlock of sorts, placing guild specific indicia on the guild version of the chart and preparing it for publication. Guild leaders can opt to accept, reject or block submissions. The interface allows any player to submit a chart, whether they belong to a guild or not, in order to maximize the number of charts available and give leaders the choice of whether or not to include non-guild member work.

Publish Guild Chart
Once a Master Chart has been submitted and approved it becomes available within a guild as a Guild Chart. Authors can then opt to publish their Guild Charts. Publishing gives authors control over the number of copies of a chart are available. It also gives authors first priority in designating whether a chart they create should be available to guild members only, friends only, alliance members only, guild guests or all players. Guild leaders can decrease availability of any Guild Chart as they see fit; but, they can not increase availability beyond that set by the author. Authors also can set the base price for their charts at each level of availability. Guild leaders can set a flat transaction fee for each chart they publish, expressed as a percentage of retail price. Again, the coin traded to purchase Guild Charts is routed to guilds via a conversion algorithm in the form of influence. Guild Charts appear in inventory as stackable items that can be double clicked to open. They can be annotated; but, they can not be edited in any other way. Player annotations will be displayed in a green text/icon scheme to differentiate them from original author annotations. When publishing a Guild Chart, the author set the number of uses the chart will be available for before it wears out. The base number of uses should be reasonable, such as 15 or 25, with incrementally greater options available up to the “unlimited use” option.

Collect Guild Chart
To purchase a Guild Chart created by another player you must give the Guild Cartographer an amount of gold, karma or skill points (calculated as a combination of author retail price plus publishing guild fees plus Arenanet transaction fees (if applicable). Purchased Guild Charts appear in inventory and can be used at will, anywhere in the game, for the number of uses designated by the publishing author. This built in obsolescence keeps Guild Charts viable in the game as a commodity. Guild Charts are not soul or account bound. They can be freely traded in the Black Lion Trading Company and all other modes of trade in the game. Once a player has collected a Guild Chart and used it to depletion he/she can order more simply by double clicking the icon of the depleted chart. Again, Guild Charts that share the same name and identification information stack. Double clicking a Guild Chart that is not depleted will consume 1 of that item’s uses and display the standard Cartographer’s Scroll window, modified to only display data useful when not editing a map.

Use Guild Chart
This is a redundant interface option that will display a dialog box that allows players to select a Guild Chart to use from a list of all Guild Charts the current character has in inventory. It duplicates the functionality of double clicking a Guild Chart so that players can always access their charts intuitively.

Risks
Same as previously stated in earlier post, which see.

There goes 2 hours I’m never getting back

Forgive my loquaciousness: couldn’t communicate clearly with less blather.

Retro.6831:

Baltzenger.2467:

The way I see it, who gets the plot shouldn’t be based on this idea of prestige, that’s why I say it shouldn’t be quantified.
I would rather have a crossover system that linkes GH further with other mechanics of the game.

Some possible things that I would like to see:
- Winners of a sPvP tournament getting a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall.
- WvW related feats that allow you to have your Guild Hall on a certain tactical location.
- Raid like content that will allow a guild to have an specific plot in the world to put their GH.

All with decay systems, based on each type of feat required to conquer this plots.

I don’t see GH as an isolated system at all, therefore, I don’t agree with having it’s “endgame” be tied only to what this particular system offers.

Did you read any of the posts relevant to the suggestion you’re talking about? It kind of seems like you haven’t. Start here, then here (part 1 and part 2). All of these were not only linked right at the top of the post you guys are quoting, but I also summarized them as well.

Based on your post, the question of “who gets the plot” isn’t determined by who has the best guild hall at all. For example, you suggest that the “Winners of an sPVP tournament get a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall”, and that performance in WvW and “Raid-like content” similarly determines who gets specific plots for just those game types. You close by saying that you “don’t see GH as an isolated system.”

Your suggestion doesn’t factor the guild halls themselves into the equation at all. You’ve instead taken Guild Halls and turned them into a new tier of reward for pre-existing gameplay platforms. The “Heart of the Mists” plot is basically a giant sPVP trophy, for sPVP players only. Sure, you can make it look cool and you have the convenience of having whatever amenities guild halls feature available in that space, but how is it anything more than an elaborate banner that says “This guild is good at sPVP?”

The whole point of the Prestige concept is to pull threads from all of the various game modes (Dungeons, WvW, sPVP, PvE, Crafting, etc.) and weave them into a unified system (not isolated, as you describe) to create something that’s potentially more rewarding for guilds.

The answer to “who gets the Guild Hall plot?” should be “whoever has the best Guild Hall,” and the prestige suggestion is one approach towards that.

You are correct here:
Based on your post, the question of “who gets the plot” isn’t determined by who has the best guild hall at all.
That is my approach.

Then here:
Your suggestion doesn’t factor the guild halls themselves into the equation at all.
But it does, it just doesn’t do it in the way you suggested it, in other words, the “plot” is a reward, an addition to the Guild Hall, not the main goal of the system.

The answer to “who gets the Guild Hall plot?” should be “whoever has the best Guild Hall”
I disagree.

I see a LOT of suggestions tying Guild Halls to WvW, PvP, GvG and guild events. Small guilds will not be able to do these things as well as a large guild. Also, what about guilds that do not do WvW or PvP? Arena Net needs to be very careful how they implement Guild Halls, or they leave a section of the player base out in the cold. Large guilds saying “well recruit and grow larger if you want to come in from out in the cold”. That makes as much sense as a small guild telling a large guild “well if you want to have an easier time getting Guild Hall content, break up your guild”. I want to see Guild Halls, would love to see them implemented where they need to be built by guild members from already in game harvestable resources. Crafters spending hours making the required components to build and upgrade your Guild Hall. Non crafters getting credit for donating resources for the crafters to work with. Now that would give a sense of accomplishment knowing you build that particular part of the Guild Hall. Would love to see PvE content associated with Guild Halls. Say, the guild leader unlocks a Risen attack against your Guild Hall or other such things. I have zero desire to have WvW or PvP associated with my Guild Hall. Just my .5 cent opinion.

Cirran

Cirran.1429:

I see a LOT of suggestions tying Guild Halls to WvW, PvP, GvG and guild events. Small guilds will not be able to do these things as well as a large guild. Also, what about guilds that do not do WvW or PvP? Arena Net needs to be very careful how they implement Guild Halls, or they leave a section of the player base out in the cold. Large guilds saying “well recruit and grow larger if you want to come in from out in the cold”. That makes as much sense as a small guild telling a large guild “well if you want to have an easier time getting Guild Hall content, break up your guild”. I want to see Guild Halls, would love to see them implemented where they need to be built by guild members from already in game harvestable resources. Crafters spending hours making the required components to build and upgrade your Guild Hall. Non crafters getting credit for donating resources for the crafters to work with. Now that would give a sense of accomplishment knowing you build that particular part of the Guild Hall. Would love to see PvE content associated with Guild Halls. Say, the guild leader unlocks a Risen attack against your Guild Hall or other such things. I have zero desire to have WvW or PvP associated with my Guild Hall. Just my .5 cent opinion.

Cirran

How is using already existing resources going to help small guilds over large guilds? Large guilds will have way more karma, gold, materials of all kinds, merits, influence, dungeon tokens etc than a small guild and the capability to get even more, a lot quicker.

What about those who either hate crafting, or hate going out gathering materials but instead they like killing other players, playing WvW or PvP mostly? You don’t like it, but do you really want to leave that section of the playerbase out?

Retro.6831:

Baltzenger.2467:

The way I see it, who gets the plot shouldn’t be based on this idea of prestige, that’s why I say it shouldn’t be quantified.
I would rather have a crossover system that linkes GH further with other mechanics of the game.

Some possible things that I would like to see:
- Winners of a sPvP tournament getting a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall.
- WvW related feats that allow you to have your Guild Hall on a certain tactical location.
- Raid like content that will allow a guild to have an specific plot in the world to put their GH.

All with decay systems, based on each type of feat required to conquer this plots.

I don’t see GH as an isolated system at all, therefore, I don’t agree with having it’s “endgame” be tied only to what this particular system offers.

The whole point of the Prestige concept is to pull threads from all of the various game modes (Dungeons, WvW, sPVP, PvE, Crafting, etc.) and weave them into a unified system (not isolated, as you describe) to create something that’s potentially more rewarding for guilds.

The answer to “who gets the Guild Hall plot?” should be “whoever has the best Guild Hall,” and the prestige suggestion is one approach towards that.

His idea does have some merits though. I had forgotten to factor this in earlier but how do we prevent farming guilds from getting their guildhall into a top spot?
I’m talking about
-EOTM Karma train
-Any champion train/event chain
-PvP win trading
These activities should not allow a guild into the top spots. So if you added his requirements on top of the prestige system it could act as a good gate to knock out farmers from the running.

Cirran.1429:

I see a LOT of suggestions tying Guild Halls to WvW, PvP, GvG and guild events. Small guilds will not be able to do these things as well as a large guild. Also, what about guilds that do not do WvW or PvP? Arena Net needs to be very careful how they implement Guild Halls, or they leave a section of the player base out in the cold. Large guilds saying “well recruit and grow larger if you want to come in from out in the cold”. That makes as much sense as a small guild telling a large guild “well if you want to have an easier time getting Guild Hall content, break up your guild”. I want to see Guild Halls, would love to see them implemented where they need to be built by guild members from already in game harvestable resources. Crafters spending hours making the required components to build and upgrade your Guild Hall. Non crafters getting credit for donating resources for the crafters to work with. Now that would give a sense of accomplishment knowing you build that particular part of the Guild Hall. Would love to see PvE content associated with Guild Halls. Say, the guild leader unlocks a Risen attack against your Guild Hall or other such things. I have zero desire to have WvW or PvP associated with my Guild Hall. Just my .5 cent opinion.

Cirran

Your idea would actually put small guilds in a far worse position, Large guilds have more crafters and resources than you’d ever hope to compete with. Putting it behind content allows a good small guild to easily beat a poor quality large guild, while not trivializing a good large guilds contribution.

Most talk was about different rewards for each type of gameplay, so if you don’t do WvW or PvP you’d have access to the PvE ,Dungeon and fractal rewards.

Conski Deshan.2057:

Retro.6831:

Baltzenger.2467:

The way I see it, who gets the plot shouldn’t be based on this idea of prestige, that’s why I say it shouldn’t be quantified.
I would rather have a crossover system that linkes GH further with other mechanics of the game.

Some possible things that I would like to see:
- Winners of a sPvP tournament getting a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall.
- WvW related feats that allow you to have your Guild Hall on a certain tactical location.
- Raid like content that will allow a guild to have an specific plot in the world to put their GH.

All with decay systems, based on each type of feat required to conquer this plots.

I don’t see GH as an isolated system at all, therefore, I don’t agree with having it’s “endgame” be tied only to what this particular system offers.

The whole point of the Prestige concept is to pull threads from all of the various game modes (Dungeons, WvW, sPVP, PvE, Crafting, etc.) and weave them into a unified system (not isolated, as you describe) to create something that’s potentially more rewarding for guilds.

The answer to “who gets the Guild Hall plot?” should be “whoever has the best Guild Hall,” and the prestige suggestion is one approach towards that.

His idea does have some merits though. I had forgotten to factor this in earlier but how do we prevent farming guilds from getting their guildhall into a top spot?
I’m talking about
-EOTM Karma train
-Any champion train/event chain
-PvP win trading
These activities should not allow a guild into the top spots. So if you added his requirements on top of the prestige system it could act as a good gate to knock out farmers from the running.

There was a suggestion earlier in the thread to use “blueprints” to get items/upgrades for the Guild Hall. By not putting Blueprints in EotM or Champion lootbags we avoid part of this problem, make Blueprints available from certain types of content only (that isn’t as easily farmed) or at least SOME of the Blueprints, not all of them.

PvP win trading isn’t hard to solve either, only tournament wins should count so “fixing” it will be hard. Also, there is the possibility to tie PVP Prestige to the actual PVP rank (on the leaderboards)

maddoctor.2738:

Conski Deshan.2057:

Retro.6831:

Baltzenger.2467:

The way I see it, who gets the plot shouldn’t be based on this idea of prestige, that’s why I say it shouldn’t be quantified.
I would rather have a crossover system that linkes GH further with other mechanics of the game.

Some possible things that I would like to see:
- Winners of a sPvP tournament getting a plot on the heart of the mists to put their Guild Hall.
- WvW related feats that allow you to have your Guild Hall on a certain tactical location.
- Raid like content that will allow a guild to have an specific plot in the world to put their GH.

All with decay systems, based on each type of feat required to conquer this plots.

I don’t see GH as an isolated system at all, therefore, I don’t agree with having it’s “endgame” be tied only to what this particular system offers.

The whole point of the Prestige concept is to pull threads from all of the various game modes (Dungeons, WvW, sPVP, PvE, Crafting, etc.) and weave them into a unified system (not isolated, as you describe) to create something that’s potentially more rewarding for guilds.

The answer to “who gets the Guild Hall plot?” should be “whoever has the best Guild Hall,” and the prestige suggestion is one approach towards that.

His idea does have some merits though. I had forgotten to factor this in earlier but how do we prevent farming guilds from getting their guildhall into a top spot?
I’m talking about
-EOTM Karma train
-Any champion train/event chain
-PvP win trading
These activities should not allow a guild into the top spots. So if you added his requirements on top of the prestige system it could act as a good gate to knock out farmers from the running.

There was a suggestion earlier in the thread to use “blueprints” to get items/upgrades for the Guild Hall. By not putting Blueprints in EotM or Champion lootbags we avoid part of this problem, make Blueprints available from certain types of content only (that isn’t as easily farmed) or at least SOME of the Blueprints, not all of them.

PvP win trading isn’t hard to solve either, only tournament wins should count so “fixing” it will be hard. Also, there is the possibility to tie PVP Prestige to the actual PVP rank (on the leaderboards)

Yeah that was the original idea about blue-prints all along. Or at least that most blue-prints work as unlocks that you unlock by completing specific content.

Now in some cases it might be useful as drop and that it unlocks when you loot it (much like you unlock a skin as soon as you buy it from a karma vendor) but then it would also be based on the content. So in EotM only EotM themed stuff would drop. And you would only do that with the more common things where you have many different skins of. So best stuff unlocks with specific content.

But lets say there are 40 blue-prints for EotM themed walls (or decoration) that are all basically the same just another skin or another texture. Only then you would do it as a drop (and still based the drop on the content, not word drops).

That would prevent the grinding rnadom content for blue-prints while still allowing for some blue-print nice drops.

VodCom.6924:

Khisanth.2948:

Conski Deshan.2057:

munkiman.3068:

The more i think about decor and furnishings as a “progression mechanic”, the less i feel it’s as appropriate for halls. I’d much rather see something like that in personal instances.

Many of the ideas here including mine are probably at least somewhat co-opted from personal housing ideas. Unless they know personal housing is also coming people are going to try and get some of the recognition into guildhalls instead.

That said there’s not a lot of progression methods to choose from and you’re bound to upset one group or another. Furnishings/skins are the tried and true method.

If you make size the progression: I’d complain and decorating people would too.
If you make functionality the progression: small guilds will complain.
If you make location the progression: people who like one particular one will complain.
If you make NPC population the progression: most people won’t try.

The solution is to not have any progression at all.

This idea is very very bad.

It’s not bad because you have bad intensions. By reading your post, one can see that you are a nice person. Your idea is awful because it will remove the sense of accomplishment and challenge that the guild hall feature could bring to a community that is craving for challenge and involving content.

Nobody has ever found something that was given as granted rewarding. Nobody. Ever.

Your argument is valid and makes sense if you are playing minecraft or any good sandbox game. However GW2 is not minecraft (it’s a theme park MMO) and I doubt GH will have a flexibility remotely comparable to what players have in minecraft.

Thus we should lock the progression of the GH behind more or less challenging content, that is interesting for both large and smaller guilds to an extent.

You can lock things behind challenges without a pointless layer of progression.
You and the previous person both make the same mistake of assuming that no progression means getting everything without doing anything.

If you are already putting things behind actual challenges then there is no need for the extra layer.

Complete challenge to unlock X.

vs.

Progress to lv 5 of whatever then complete the same challenge to unlock X.

Example of existing pointless progression:
You must progress to Art of War lv5 before you can even try to unlock Guild Bounty.

Progression is just a cheap way to stretch out content.

Proposal Overview
Boss spawn at Guild hall’s yard

Goal of Proposal
Small random events in the area of guild hall, to encourage players to visit the hall occasionally.

Proposal Functionality
This is one of the function a guild hall has in other game that I had played. They simply allow bosses to spawn in their yard.

In guild wars 2 context, perhaps, by killing the bosses, you will get bonus chest per day. As for the rewards, maybe guild related stuffs or rares or chances of ascended chest. Also, the usual champ box for killing boss.

Associated Risks
Players might start creating a chain of guilds purely for the purpose of killing bosses. However, limiting the bonus chest to once per day will reduce that risk.

There might be complains from small guilds on not able to kill the bosses and having to import mercenaries to do so.

PS: Teehee, finally posted this, was busy with my own things.

Can we consider the addition of new crafting disciplines to help expand the system towards building Guild Halls?

I’ve been thinking that I really like time-gated crafting recipes, because they reward having the crafting discipline over having the gold.

Khisanth.2948:

VodCom.6924:

Khisanth.2948:

Conski Deshan.2057:

munkiman.3068:

The more i think about decor and furnishings as a “progression mechanic”, the less i feel it’s as appropriate for halls. I’d much rather see something like that in personal instances.

Many of the ideas here including mine are probably at least somewhat co-opted from personal housing ideas. Unless they know personal housing is also coming people are going to try and get some of the recognition into guildhalls instead.

That said there’s not a lot of progression methods to choose from and you’re bound to upset one group or another. Furnishings/skins are the tried and true method.

If you make size the progression: I’d complain and decorating people would too.
If you make functionality the progression: small guilds will complain.
If you make location the progression: people who like one particular one will complain.
If you make NPC population the progression: most people won’t try.

The solution is to not have any progression at all.

This idea is very very bad.

It’s not bad because you have bad intensions. By reading your post, one can see that you are a nice person. Your idea is awful because it will remove the sense of accomplishment and challenge that the guild hall feature could bring to a community that is craving for challenge and involving content.

Nobody has ever found something that was given as granted rewarding. Nobody. Ever.

Your argument is valid and makes sense if you are playing minecraft or any good sandbox game. However GW2 is not minecraft (it’s a theme park MMO) and I doubt GH will have a flexibility remotely comparable to what players have in minecraft.

Thus we should lock the progression of the GH behind more or less challenging content, that is interesting for both large and smaller guilds to an extent.

You can lock things behind challenges without a pointless layer of progression.
You and the previous person both make the same mistake of assuming that no progression means getting everything without doing anything.

If you are already putting things behind actual challenges then there is no need for the extra layer.

Complete challenge to unlock X.

vs.

Progress to lv 5 of whatever then complete the same challenge to unlock X.

Example of existing pointless progression:
You must progress to Art of War lv5 before you can even try to unlock Guild Bounty.

Progression is just a cheap way to stretch out content.

I think you have a misconception of what progression means.
You just described “progression vs progression”.
(going from not having anything to have something is a way of progression)

The problem of Complete challenge to unlock X is that, after you unlock X, what else is there to do in that line? what about if you have unlocked X, then complete challenge to expand X, and you have more layers of progression.

We are not asking for “meaningless progression”, but when we ask for many layers, is because right now, no matter how “challenging” the content, it will be beaten in a short amount of time, and then what? At least I don’t want Guild Halls to be Legendary Items 2.0.

Carpentry for wooden furniture and stone masonry for statues/other rock stuff. I guess the Insignia/Inscription type item could be a blueprint (if the blueprint idea many have suggested is used)

EDIT: and metalworking for metal stuff

further EDIT: i guess all this could be lumped into 1 large category called “Architecture”

This CDI has been amazing. I am ready for the next one though.

I don’t have the time to read through this whole thread to see if anyone posted this idea or not, but I had an idea for the “Instanced” vs “World Space” debate:

Why not do BOTH?

Any guild of any size can obtain an Instanced Guild Hall – the entrance method/location for this would be the same for every guild (a teleporter, or location in the zone/city that the guild purchased the hall for, etc). This keeps your world space uncluttered and allows all Guilds access to the amenities/features that a Guild Hall provides.

Then you take it to the next level: LIMITED “public” guild halls, in fixed locations throughout Tyria, that guilds compete for and have to actively maintain “ownership” of.

If the average server has, say, 1000 guilds – you put in a grand total of 50 “public” guild halls (per server) with the acquisition and retention methods for those differing (otherwise these just become a public “top 50” list – by varying the methods of obtaining/owning these spaces you force a Guild to decide on where they want to specialize which has the side effect of helping new players seeking recruitment into a guild more easily determine what a particular Guild is best at!

This one’s my favorite because I think it has the most “potential” so I’m putting it up top:

Example 1: The “politics” guild – every month guilds bid/auction for limited spots on a “ballot” that every player (or every player above level X, to prevent voter fraud) can vote on. Winner of the ballot gets the hall. Existing owner of the hall is automatically added to the next ballot, so it’s not a matter of them just getting “outbid” next month.

The catch? You can’t vote if you have a player on your account that’s a member of the currently “elected” guild(s). Therefore you give the elected guild a reason to continue making the common player like them! Guilds could organize guided dungeon runs for new players, walk around doing random acts of kindness for the average player – heck maybe Anet could take the reigns off and even allow outright vote buying – this is politics after all! The point being that a guild needs to somehow earn the love and respect of the majority of the (voting) GW2 playerbase. So yeah buying votes might be easy, but it could get expensive to keep that up every month against a Guild that’s got a small number of players who ensure that no player on the server ever lacks for a friendly PUG when they want to do a quick dungeon run! Seriously – the possibilities here make me giddy

Leave this up to the players – don’t put a ton of rules and regulations here and don’t worry about Anet being heavily involved. This is about Guilds (and players) finding ways on their own to make other players LIKE THEM, without Anet’s help/interference. The only thing Anet has to do here is set up the ability for players to vote every month and count the results.

Example 2: The “Money” Guild – big giant opulent “mansion” style guild hall in the “rich” section of town (DR?) – costs 1000g/month to rent. Guild stops paying the rent? They get evicted and it goes up for auction, highest bid Guild at the end of the week are the new tenants, first month’s rent included in auction.

Make the hall appropriately themed – this is a guild who wants to display financial success, so make the hall very rich looking – expensive statues (of the guild leaders? think of the possibilities!), busts, everything gold/jeweled, etc.

Now, adjust the rent periodically (you guys DO have an economist on staff, after all) to make sure that continuing to occupy the guild hall remains a financial burden even for a large, well organized, guild. Be reasonable, just make sure that paying hurts enough that staying in this hall means work – the goal here is to encourage occasional turnover to prevent one or two guilds renting them in perpetuity. Maybe even put maximum leases in place?

Example 3: The “Membership” Guild. Pretty simple – this can be rented for more modest prices, but put requirements on guild membership and activity levels. A guild needs to have a large roster of active players in order rent this hall. If that roster no longer falls within, say, the top 10% guild sizes on that server, the guild gets a notice that they need to boost their ranks within a week or get evicted.

Same as before: this is a guild who is using their membership numbers to obtain this hall, so make it a social place like a mead hall or army base, to emphasize the “huge roster” aspect of this guild.

I could go on and on but I think you get the point

Anyway, thanks for reading through this long – I hope you liked this idea, I think it would be an amazing thing to see real live Guilds have spaces in Tyria, as well as adding dynamism to the game world by encouraging competition for these spaces!

Hello everyone.
I just wanted to propose and idea that I think would be nice in a Guild Hall. It doesn’t work towards the function of the Guild Hall itself, So i apologize if I going off track.

Proposal Overview
Being able to see your other Characters as NPC in the Guild Hall.

Goal of Proposal
One of the things that I enjoyed from Gw1 was the ability to have Characters from your account become a henchman. It made the game appear more lively and I felt more connected to it. It was amazing to be able to see more than one of my characters fight alongside one another.

Proposal Functionality
I thought that it would be nice to be able to see characters from your account walking around the Guild Hall and socializing with each other. They don’t need to have dialogue, but it would at least make the Guild Hall appear busy. They could be sitting along a hillside, walking down a road, maybe even work in the fields or build houses (or at least appear to do so). I guess it is just a way for small Guilds like my own to feel more alive. Of course, for large Guilds, this probably won’t even be necessary.

Associated Risks
The only problem I can think of is if the Guild is too big to have NPC walking around. Or if people confuse the NPC’s as actual players. Of course, I am not asking for all my characters to appear in the Guild Hall. But instead, I am hoping for an option to do so.
I apologize if this idea seems ridiculous. I personally feel that tiny functions like these helps the game feel more alive. Please do comment.

Xeyron.5267:

Quote Edited for Space

Proposal Overview
Being able to see your other Characters as NPC in the Guild Hall.

I think this is a brilliant idea, especially if the guild hall is to be populated in the same way a city or town is. Having player characters appear as NPCs when they are are not actually being played, with NPC style text, could add a nice, personal dimension to the space.

“Your idea would actually put small guilds in a far worse position, Large guilds have more crafters and resources than you’d ever hope to compete with. Putting it behind content allows a good small guild to easily beat a poor quality large guild, while not trivializing a good large guilds contribution.”

Worse position? Why does there need to be a competition? There is zero need for kitten contests. If you want an kitten contest you could always have the hyper competitive guilds build on the WvW maps. Not my cup of tea but there are those that love that kind of thing. With your line of thinking even if you lock things behind content, due to numbers large guilds still will come out on top. More people equals, more chances for that “rare” drop that is locked behind content. Lock it behind a dungeon run, World Boss, jumping puzzle box, living story box, or just about any other content and the truth remains the same. Large guilds will have an advantage. Who should ANet listen to, large or small guilds? Who should get better content? Because this is what most of the ideas in this thread boil down to. Large guilds should get the best stuff, and little guilds should get left overs. There are already way too many things a small guild can not do reliably that large guilds do as an after thought, bounties ect. The only way I can personally see as a way to make GHs “fair” is to scale the cost of it to the size of the guild making it. I know I know, that is not fair to large guilds, or is it? As stated above, they have the number, resources, and income.
My personal bottom line is no PvP, GvG, WvW or any kind of competition in relation to GHs. I would love to see GH as a staging area for my guild to work together and as I stated in my original post have PvE content based there.
LOL, frankly bottom line ANet will roll out GHs in a manner that makes them the most amount of money. They will listen to what is posted on the forum and then decided what ever method works the best for them. Then of course the forums will be over run with folks saying stuff like “this will kill GW2”, “horrible developers”, “this sucks I quit”, Ect……

Cirran

Cirran.1429:

The only way I can personally see as a way to make GHs “fair” is to scale the cost of it to the size of the guild making it. I know I know, that is not fair to large guilds, or is it? As stated above, they have the number, resources, and income.

That’s exactly what I said is a horrible idea. So you want a guild with 200 players and 50 active to get their GH far slower than a guild with 10 people and 8 active? Since the 50 players will have to “pay” the 200-member cost, while the 8 people will have to “pay” for 10-member cost.
Then imagine a family guild of 8 people, with only 2 or 3 active members, the others are family logging occasionally, you really want to force them to kick their inactive relatives so their GH costs will go down?
Scaling GH costs to the size of Guilds is one of the worst ideas posted on this thread.

Cirran.1429:

Worse position? Why does there need to be a competition? There is zero need for kitten contests. If you want an kitten contest you could always have the hyper competitive guilds build on the WvW maps. Not my cup of tea but there are those that love that kind of thing.

I hate to break it to you but the whole game is in a manner of speaking a competition for the best items and rarest rewards. People seem to forget PvE is competitive too. I’ll say what I say to any person who doesn’t want to compete/only like to mess around. I’m glad you enjoy the lower end content but don’t expect access to all the rewards by it.

Cirran.1429:

With your line of thinking even if you lock things behind content, due to numbers large guilds still will come out on top. More people equals, more chances for that “rare” drop that is locked behind content. Lock it behind a dungeon run, World Boss, jumping puzzle box, living story box, or just about any other content and the truth remains the same. Large guilds will have an advantage.

If you’ve read my other posts most of the items in my proposal are 100% unlocks like achievement rewards, the guild successfully complete it and are guaranteed the item. Which does work out better for small guilds, if you have an 8 man dungeon group guild you’ll easily unlock all the dungeon rewards while a 50 man WvW guild may struggle to do the same.

Cirran.1429:

The only way I can personally see as a way to make GHs “fair” is to scale the cost of it to the size of the guild making it. I know I know, that is not fair to large guilds, or is it? As stated above, they have the number, resources, and income.

As others stated above that is a bad idea and punishes larger guilds for both being large and having inactive players.

Cirran.1429:

My personal bottom line is no PvP, GvG, WvW or any kind of competition in relation to GHs. I would love to see GH as a staging area for my guild to work together and as I stated in my original post have PvE content based there.
Cirran

So you want to exclude three other game modes completely from guildhalls just to suit you? You do know they have guilds too that would equally like to have a staging area for their types of content too.