Guild Wars 2

As far as commander gating goes I think it’s a bad idea. I think having your commander tag be account wide is a good idea. The solution to troll commanders is to simply provide more tools in quickly seeing what a particular commander is about. One way would be a sort of up voting system where somehow simply by looking at a tag people can tell the size of a squad and how many guildies of the commander are present. This would make trolls rather obvious.

I really like some the ideas I’ve read, although I’m not sure I agree that you should be able to mass invite players into your squad, unless the commander pin(s) are made to only be visible to those who join the squad.

I don’t believe that Guild Gating for commanders would be fair either and while seeing each squad member would be a nice addition, I don’t think it’s necessary if so many are in the Squad(s).
Separate PVE/wvw tags should have been done a long while time, now it’s just difficult to distinguish who’s a good commander, although I guess there’ll be more chance of seeing proper wvw commanders around now.

I’d like a way for us commanders to gain reputation, but at the same time I’d expect something like a Voting system would be easily manipulated at times, I feel that even if you were to implement a Rank system, that it would be fairly easy to gain ranks. (i.e Karma Trains)

A commanders job is hard work especially if you’re leading the Pugs, I’d like more tools at our disposal but at the same time I hope the UI doesn’t get too cluttered.

We commanders will still need to rely on TS or any other Voice Comms we choose to use, so I believe you have to be careful with what you add, you will need to make it so it’s Functional and Flexible enough for everyone.
I also hope that the assigned sub-commanders will have enough tools to support the commander, even during a Guild raid it’s hard to keep track of everything as Raid Leader.

I don’t believe we need anymore /chats either, most of the time I still can’t tell the difference with Map or Team chat!
Less chat suppression would also be much appreciated especially for us scouts, if we’re able to be assigned to these sub-roles in the future!

Regarding the Dev-posed questions:

1. This would be nice, currently, I have no idea if someone joins my squad. Also I don’t know if squads are kept when I change maps (if they don’t, they should).

2. I really like this idea, but how does it’s functionality translate to a PvE setting? How close do I have to be to start said event? who all can see my event?

3. No. Even small guilds can benefit from commanders for guild missions, and small guilds especially need visibility for things like rushes and challenges so people in the map can come participate.

Regarding WvW gating, maybe make WvW gating required to use your tag IN the WvW setting, but not other settings. Perhaps create a tab in the hero panel for commander progress to track these things.

Nadesh.7953:

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

1.) How important is it to see your squad members as a different color and always visible on your map like party?

Would be nice to see them in the screen.

I think the ability for everyone in the squad to know where everyone else is is vital as others have said it may be difficult with a lot together but maybe all within a certain radius could be aggregated into 1 indicator.

sounds good. but 100g is for wvw only players really much.
pls make it purchasable via badges and PvE commanders shouldn’t be able to turn their commander on in wvw. pls set a minimum wvwrank to turn on the icon thx…

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

…
1.) How important is it to see your squad members as a different color and always visible on your map like party?
…
2) I’ve always felt the best commander organization tool would be the ability to create events. Like drop a siege and the commander can set this is a build event then everyone gets Ui like build this flame ram 0/50 supply needed. Or Destroy this gate <show gate health bar>. Lets assume for this discussion there are no rewards to the events just a communication tool. Thoughts on commander created events?
…
3) A guild gating system would be clean but require all commanders to be in a fairly active guild is this a fair gating system?
…
4) What did I miss on this list

1. It would be nice to be able to tell where all ppl in the squad are, this would make it possible for others to see where a scout is and not only for the commander to know where he is.
Although the commander would be able to tell just how many of the ppl of his squad are afk or doing sth else. could make it easier for him to guess how many ppl are near him.

2. This sounds like a nice idea, but I’m having trouble to think how you could implement it, to not make the commander click all kinds of different things and such. Maybe make it possible for a commander to activate “event mode” and then if he throws a siege weapon it will automatically be an event, and if he marks a target it will also be an event. But you need to make sure that there aren’t to many up. for example if he throws several rams, it should be one event (build the siege weapons: Ram 25/40 AC 10/30 Cata 40/50) and a second event for him, being the attack event after he marked sth (Destroy the Gate/Attack the Target/) and add a timer for those events. for example 5min for the siege weapons, that there aren’t too many events up at once.

3. I’ll answer here the complete gating system.
I’m against a guild gating system, due to it being unfair for those who’re not in a big guild (I’m in a big guild). If you’re on a small server and you just want to do some smallscale or walk around with some friends (up to 15 or sth like that), having a commander would be great. But with a guild gating system sth like this would be very hard to accomplish.

There were some suggestions about adding the squads to the lfg tool and i had a nice idea. How about removing the gating system as it is now and making it possible for everyone to be a commander. But he would’ve to create a squad and unless 10 (or more, jsut an example) ppl join his squad he won’t be marked as a commander on the map. Like this you can limit the number of commander on a map, while at the same time not limiting the players to be commander.
edit1: Forgot to mention to set a timer for each squad after creation, if it doesn’t reach the threshold to be marked as a commander it will automatically terminated. And create a limit of how often someone can create a squad which is terminated (for example 10min after creation it will be removed, and he can create a squad a maximum nr of 3 times in an hour) edit1end.

4. I didn’t follow the whole discussion, but i think you forgot to mention being able to open/close a squad, making it possible for a commander to decide whether he wants to make a public raid or an intern raid, with a group of friends, his guild or an alliance between several guilds.
Next is adding a command to make it possible to tell which classes are in the squad (for example /sqclasses and it will tell you the nr of each class, then sqclassname to tell you the number of each class [add elementalist, short ele, for classname for example])

edit1: Please add a command to kick all players from the squad who’re not on the map. (and don’t make it work automatically, cause it would make switching maps with a squad impossible)
And at last sth else what wasn’t mentioned before (as far as i read the posts), making it possible for the commander to pass lead to someone else! If the commander system will be more frequently used, it will be such a drag to have to create a new squad, each time the commander leaves.

I really like the idea of commander-initiated events, especially what could be done with player-initiated events in pve someday, like guild leaders setting up a guild mission anywhere they want. I do think there should be a limit to how many events a commander can have active, so the screen doesn’t get crowded. So maybe only 2 active events at a time, with the option to cancel them. Or better yet, something like this:

Three commander utility skills:
1. Attack Objective. Creates an attack event on whatever hostile thing you are targeting. Click again to cancel the event.

2. Use Supply. Creates an event to build/repair whatever you are targeting. Click again to cancel the event.

3. Stack. Creates a ground circle for players to congregate in, visible on map, click again to cancel the event.

One of the good ideas will be that commander tags be only visible to squad members. An option can be provided to commanders to make their tag visible to all on the map or only his squad members. Also the commander should have the ability to remove people from the squad or add if needed. Other commanders on the map should be able to see each others tag to make any tactical moves if necessary. This could again come up as an option to the tag holder if they want to show their tags to all map, squad member or squad members + other tags. These proposals can bring a refreshing new use for guild raids which do not use tags for their guild only raids to avoid any unwanted attention from the map.

1. Customisable commander logo that shows in the map. Like the guild logo. Shows squad size when mouse overed in the map. This should be something cool tbh, like guild logos. Raiding under the guild banner!

2. Commanders can que up couple RTS style commands in the map that they will be doing. Commander (tag) is Briar → Shift + Mouse A (Attack, G gather, D Defend) pressed on Bay creates a attackish looking opaque tag of that commander with dotted line leading to it from the commander.

3. For everyone map has list of the commanders in zone. Can be in WvW tab aswell. And you simply choose there which of the public commanders you want to see on the map.

4. Commander can choose the publicity. Show: All (Public), Squad, Guild.
Tbh, it would be great if people could run Show All, but it wouldn’t shout ‘EVERYONE COME’. Show all but not public.

→ 5. Choosing publicity of the over head tag and map tag seperately. In general people want to show their general location in the map. But don’t want everyone to stack on them in combat.

Daniel.5463:

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

…
2) I’ve always felt the best commander organization tool would be the ability to create events. Like drop a siege and the commander can set this is a build event then everyone gets Ui like build this flame ram 0/50 supply needed. Or Destroy this gate <show gate health bar>. Lets assume for this discussion there are no rewards to the events just a communication tool. Thoughts on commander created events?

2. This sounds like a nice idea, but I’m having trouble to think how you could implement it, to not make the commander click all kinds of different things and such. Maybe make it possible for a commander to activate “event mode” and then if he throws a siege weapon it will automatically be an event, and if he marks a target it will also be an event. But you need to make sure that there aren’t to many up. for example if he throws several rams, it should be one event (build the siege weapons: Ram 25/40 AC 10/30 Cata 40/50) and a second event for him, being the attack event after he marked sth (Destroy the Gate/Attack the Target/) and add a timer for those events. for example 5min for the siege weapons, that there aren’t too many events up at once.

I like that idea. Reading this i think that the target thing could work well to create events without the need of a complex UI.

If the commander target an enemy object (wall, gate, siege weapon, player, npc, etc) the attack event is created, if the commander target a friendly object (wall, gate, siege weapon, player, npc, etc) an event to repair (will only appear over walls and gates that need to be repaired)/protect is created.

To build siege weapons, like @Daniel said, could be a key to turn on/off the event mode. This could also work with the sub-squad idea. For example, if there are 3 sub-squads (i dont think more than that is needed), could be 3 keys, one to turn on/off the sent orders to that particular team, and if the event mode is on, then the events would be created for that sub-squad. This way the commander can create events for each team. If the commander dont have any sub-squad “on” then all the players would see the event.

This sounds complex but could be solved with 4 keys. Could also be an UI with 4 buttons, or both.

Edited

I forgot about this.

If a player pass the mouse over the commander’s tag at the mini-map or the map, the player should be able to see how many friendly players are in x radius around the commander (this info could include the number of squad members). This way a player that is far away can know if the commander is leading a big or small team, or if nobody is following him/her. This would be useful in WvW but also in PvE (to know if there are people doing something there or if it is just a commander running around or afk).

Edited 2

About to be able to see the amount of players when pass the mouse over the commander tag in the map and mini-map. I was thinking a little more about this, and should be an option to turn it on/off in the game options, just in case someone dont want to give that info.

Thanks for the summary on page 12 Isaiah Cartwright, i just came across the topic so i missed it till now.

1 I would love to see squad members on the map in a different color. Seeing them over the whole map would be great but it would already be a big help if you can just see who from the allies around you (that now all show up as green dots on the map) are in your squad by making those dots yellow for example.

2 About your suggestion to have commander started events, great idea your suggestions also would be really helpfull and would prevent me from shouting a % of gate in the chat or we need X supply to build XX siege.

3 The gating problem is a difficult one. Not binding them to WvW things is good as it would hurt PvE commanders. Doing it through guilds would make it more exclusive again, but this would force you into an active guild just to be able to command in WvW/PVE. Raising the gold cost would not solve the problem as it would hurt new players a lot.

If there is a change the commander tag should become account bound so that commanders are not locked into playing with one character. Right now getting a 2nd one for 100g is not nice but do-able but getting a 2nd one though a guild would not be desirable.

4 Maybe this was brought up already but one of the things i missed in my WvW time was an easy way to use the /supplyinfo and /squadinfo commands, it would be really good if we can get a button or keybind to use these commands.

Also i would like it if squad members can still see other commanders on the map. With the idea for the different colors it should not be too hard to implement this. The reason for this is that a.t.m. specially with large PVE events i recommend members not to join squad due to this, so we can tell members with me to go and help one of the other commanders fast. With multi guild events (like temple of balthazar) this then forces us to use the map chat to communicate.

Thanks for the discussion and i look forward to see the improvements in the future

Vin Lady Venture, The Rising Falcons[RiFa], Fissure of Woe

Woooo hold that horse from bolting out of the stable.

I have only just returned back to this thread and find “commander gating” being discussed. It is really hard to watch this thread or potentially a wiping of commander existing tags or making harder for new commanders.

I am against a change to the gating to the commander system or putting massive restrictions on allowing PvE commanders being able to take up the reins in WvW.
There are plenty of dead hours when any commander is better than none in WvW (they all have to learn from somewhere).

100g is a significant amount of gold to invest. These players have already usually put a lot of effort in to get there tags (via farming or other efforts). I have three commander tags – this took a lot of effort to obtain. There are some players out there with more.

Wiping a commander tag because they are not In a guild is not a good idea or tagging it to active guilds – what about a commander who is setting up there own guild from scratch?

So many negatives to this idea.

It is necessary I feel in some places to have a list of commanders who initiated the events rather than band-Waggoned into an event and try to attempt to take over. Often the commanders who initiated the event (Teq, Balt, WvW) should be the people who are being followed. Perhaps we need something that displays how long those commanders have been commanding in that zone or map? (Commanders pinned up in WvW map – EB for 3 hrs already are probably the ones that should be listened to than someone who has just pinned up for 10 mins. The same applies for commanders in TEQ – they have often been there for over 1.5 hrs sorting out the organisation of people).

This allows people to know who are actually organising the event rather than just trying to troll or take over the event for there own selfish end-goals. The initiators are often trying to ensure a certain purpose is achieved.

It can be difficult with multiple pins for players to know which commanders should be followed. These commanders would find it helpful to set a list of objectives that they are trying to achieve and why. Sometimes this means deliberately failing an event (to sync things better – eg three paths at temple of Balthazar or loosing a camp or tower so something bigger can be taken). no-one wants people to have another pin arrive and start ordering people to do XYZ that is different from the initiators where possible.

Imo, aside from tactical management tools for commanders, WvW desperately needs more variety and better gameplay to support strategic groups and roles. Blobbing and zerg trains cannot be the end to war-like/mass pvp. Hence, I’d do the following until WvW gets such improvements:

Change commander gold gating into reputation based gating. Every hour or so all players who participated in WvW may rate a commander on the same map on a five-star based system. 1 star is bad, 5 is excellent. Commander tag costs are reduced to a couple of WEXP points and badges of honor and made account bound, because otherwise commanders may dodge rating. Highest rated commanders may use tools like map-wide chat in different colors for announcements and communication and trackers like leaderboards are added to make them reknown on their and across servers. The higher the rating, the further the tag may be seen on a map. 5-Star commanders are seen across wvw maps.

" commanders are seen across wvw maps."
→ No. This enables spying of high priority targets for other servers to know where the Zerg is. Just place one second account in any of the maps From another work. Don’t like this idea at all.

TPMN.1483:

" commanders are seen across wvw maps."
-> No. This enables spying of high priority targets for other servers to know where the Zerg is. Just place one second account in any of the maps From another work. Don’t like this idea at all.

They can do this already by placing second accounts where it hurts (in the map that is most contested). I’d even prefer doing this than placing some toon on some irrelevant bl.

I think rather than try to refund existing tags, we just need more ways to acquire them.

Bought with 100g OR 1000 Badges of Honor OR 100 guild commendations. (numbers purely speculative)

All three paths open simultaneously.

That’s still thinking tags are on a per-character basis. Any form of account-tags is going to trigger some sort of refund for those who already have more than one tag on their account.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Commander Visibility

• Removal of buff display to enemies. As well as we should avoid doing skills/abilities

While I pretty much agree with everything else, I kind of disagree with this point! In my opinion having the commander tag visible for the enemy adds a tactical element into the fights, especially into big fights!

Because:

1. It should be the task of the Commander’s followers to protect their Commander with heals and Buffs etc. Therefore it’s just fair to give a chance for the enemy to clearly identify the Commander. It’s not that they see the big Commander icon above the hostile Commander’s head as you see on your own Commander!

2. There should be a possibility for well organised players to have a bit of a chance to stop or at least slow down big mindless acting enemy ‘blobs’ aka zergs, that are only relying on big numbers rather than a good organisation.
If a small group really manages to take out a Commander and in this way dismantle a huge zerg, it clearly shows that there is a lack of communication and/or skill in this group of players, and therefore they deserve it.

3. In well organised guild raids, it is quite common that the Commander Tags get swapped in the middle of the fight (of course only possible if there are multiple players which own the tag) – making it harder for the enemy to see the next move.
So again, another strategic element.

I strongly recommend to reconsider this point again, and maybe focus on the other points first.

If we are going to allow minimal suppression in chat for commanders, then gating is needed.

I’ve said before that maybe having players acquire gifts for the mystic forge, in order to gain a tradable item for the tag would be a good gate. As it requires people to actively participate in wvw and use the mystic forge.

1. Make it require gift of battle.
2. Add in a bloodstone shard so that you need 200 skill points.
3. Keep the commanders compendium in the mix but lower it to 50G.
4. Something extra. Maybe a new item, but something that means you actively did wvw.

Doing this gives you gift if the commander or whatever. Trade it in for your tag.

It needs a gate other than gold. That way it’s meaningful.

To address the idea of Commander Gating, the following addresses a potential overhaul of the current system:

I feel the commander system should be expanded from an individual basis, to that of a communal tool.

The commander tool could effectively be tied in not only with guilds, but the new and hopefully improved squad system we may get in the future. This would result in a number of criteria for a person to be given the commander icon and the power this presents.

Example criteria:

1) A guild must have at least 10/15/20 participants active within a borderland/EB (this number should be carefully considered, random examples), and then may nominate one member of their guild as their designated commander. A system that also nominates a secondary commander may be useful in those situations where the main commander is downed first. This could also be tied into the in-guild ranks.

The effect: This ensures the person in charge of the map comes from an organized force, most likely entirely eliminating the existence of troll commanders, or commanders who may not fully understand the potential negative effect their inexperienced presence may incur.

But Veld, sir, what about when there are no organized guilds on, or I want to command as a guildless entity? It’s unfair if you restrict it to active/bigger guilds! Well, this brings me to criteria #2.

2) When a squad is formed, a commander tag may be assigned to a member (or leader) of that squad when the squad reaches a set number of members. (10/15/20 etc) There are quite a number of reputable commanders who regularly lead without a guild force. This system allows them to still do so.

The effect: Again, this ensures that the person leading is coming from an organized force and gives them an understanding of who they are leading, and will make them more effective in doing so. Ideally, the future of squads would represent each members location some way or another (mini map, alternate name tag colour, etc.) ultimately improving the coordination of non-guilded forces.

Additionally, where I have spoken of ‘inexperience’ as being of potential detriment to a servers effort, this system allows new commanders to get involved. Where players may normally be hostile toward inexperienced commanders, as commanders are assigned upon the formation of a squad, this provides an increasingly personal ‘community’ in which players can offer feedback, help and suggestions within squad communication.

The after effect of this system:

- Would need to refund existing commander tags.

- Would probably need to differentiate commander tags in ‘PvE’ and ‘WvW’ where it may be harder/less intuitive to form squads in ‘PvE’. This could be done by creating a separate purchasable commander tag for ‘PvE’ only zones. I don’t think gating is as necessary in the PvE spectrum as it is in WvW.

I believe the positives of this system would vastly outweigh these two negatives, however as it is my idea I may be blind to some of the additional negatives of this system.

Thanks for your time.

1) Seeing squad members could be helpful to keep track of scouts and smaller groups sent to take camps and defenders left in keeps/towers. But people still need an incentive to join a squad for this to work with the overall group following the commander. Either the commander system needs to be obviously helpful to them taking objectives, or there needs to be a small buff when in squad. I think a lieutenant system would be slightly better, but we could use seeing squad members in similar ways.

For commander visibility: I can’t stress enough how important it is to keep track of the commander in open field fights. I’d like the tags to be much larger.

2) A door-killing event would be detrimental to taking a keep/tower. The group is there to build rams, kill cannons/oil and protect the rams. The rams do most of the work. The main group needs to be ready for incoming and keep the walls clear of defenders.

Being able to create events to take camps, take bloodlust or kill yaks would be awesome though. Events to build siege, or some kind of effect/glow on commander dropped siege would also be extremely helpful.

Account bound tags would be the single greatest improvement, I think. We’re already working within the current system. But when a commander asks for someone else to take over and other commanders on their alts can’t because of a queue, we don’t even have that.

3) Guild gating would work if it wasn’t the ONLY way to get a tag. I think guild tags should be available, as they help with guild missions and PvE content. But you shouldn’t be required to have guild support to command in WvW. There should be another option for that. There are great commanders from smaller guilds and there are WvW guilds that don’t do missions and other guild content.

4) I’d like to see some kind of text the commander can add to the tag to explain what they’re doing, something we can see when we hover over the tag on the minimap. Just a few words like “guarding keeps”, “yakslapping”, “defensive patrol”, “offensive east side”, “zerg busting”.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

1.) How important is it to see your squad members as a different color and always visible on your map like party?

This is a very useful feature, but I can’t argue it’s essential. If you have two squads that split up for example, being able to track them visually with color coding is super useful. Callout such as “Green” squad needs more Elementalists help red squad with DPS or Drop healing on Blue Squad. This allows a huge amount of information to be conveyed with fewer words and quicker more accurate responses. Just think how much easier it is to find your guild members in lions arch with their gold name text.

2) I’ve always felt the best commander organization tool would be the ability to create events. Like drop a siege and the commander can set this is a build event then everyone gets Ui like build this flame ram 0/50 supply needed. Or Destroy this gate <show gate health bar>. Lets assume for this discussion there are no rewards to the events just a communication tool. Thoughts on commander created events?

What if commanders gained a “spendable” XP pool when they complete events, (IE flipping keeps, capturing supply centers, killing enemies). This xp is scalable based on squad size (IE 10 Squad members 100xp for capturing tower, but 100 squad members 1,000xp for tower cap), then when Commanders create an event such as “build flame ram here”, they can assign XP to the completion that is paid out of their “spendable pool” earned from objectives. XP can be rewards from event completion could be divided up between participants based on contribution or shared evenly. This could even let you return XP rewards to things like killing dolyaks by taking it out of the command pool.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

3) A guild gating system would be clean but require all commanders to be in a fairly active guild is this a fair gating system?

I think you should really consider separate Commander tags for separate areas of the game. 1 for WvW (Honor tokens), 1 for PVE (Gold), 1 for Guilds (Guild points). Each tag is only visible to the group it is bought for, so If you have a guild tag only guild members can see it. If you bought a WvW tag, it could only be used in WvW areas and not PVE.
These tags could be visibility traits just like color, IE visable to WvW/PVE/Guild/Squad. Each has to be unlocked in a separate way. This way Rich PVE Merchants don’t walk into WVW flip on their Commander Tag without earning it.

4) What did I miss on this list

Having different tags for different areas of the game as I already mentioned in 3, other than that your list gets me pretty excited to see what you guys come up with.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Questions:
1.) How important is it to see your squad members as a different color and always visible on your map like party?

I’d prefer to see Squad members, in a different color on other parts of the map, not so much minimap(radar) range. Like strike teams all the way at x camp etc.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Twinny.9304:

Question
If there will be any change to the Commander Gating, does that mean everybody start from scratch? or current Commanders still get to keep their tags? Because I would hate to lose/get a refund on my tag. I saved hard for that when i had very little cash and would like to keep it.

I was just asking to get a sense of it really. : )

I did start my question with if

insanemaniac.2456:

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

1.) How important is it to see your squad members as a different color and always visible on your map like party?

2) I’ve always felt the best commander organization tool would be the ability to create events. Like drop a siege and the commander can set this is a build event then everyone gets Ui like build this flame ram 0/50 supply needed. Or Destroy this gate <show gate health bar>. Lets assume for this discussion there are no rewards to the events just a communication tool. Thoughts on commander created events?

3) A guild gating system would be clean but require all commanders to be in a fairly active guild is this a fair gating system?

1. in wvw, considering i can manage fine without it now and only see luxury benefits from it, i dont think its really necessary. for guild missions itd be truly useful and incomparable (especially because the only players visible on the map are party members and commanders).

2. i like it, but there is almost 0 use in open field battles. your attention must be anywhere but the top right corner of your screen. i think itd be great for training new players. would i use it? probably only if event creation were as simple as calling target on the ram site or door.

3. i think no. guild membership has even less bearing on game knowledge and leadership ability than amassing x amount of tradable currency. plus, people already complained a LOT about how they felt forced to join large guilds in order to take part in guild missions. giving guilds the ability to hand out commander tags wont do anything to discourage trolls or encourage leaders. in fact, we already have the unfortunate situation of guild sponsored commander tags that are just wasted donations, though its not prevalent.

All of this.

1. As a Guild/PvE commander seeing the squad as colored dots would be very beneficial.

2. I can see it being useful, but by no means necessary.

3. You shouldn’t have to belong to a guild to be a commander.

Monchichi.9301:

2) A door-killing event would be detrimental to taking a keep/tower. The group is there to build rams, kill cannons/oil and protect the rams. The rams do most of the work. The main group needs to be ready for incoming and keep the walls clear of defenders. (….)

Dont need to be like that. The door event could be build rams (instead of place each ram and create events to build them) and protect them and the players close to the door, or something like that.

Commander Gating
There are too many existing commanders to make changes to the cost or method of getting the tag at this stage. Why should new commanders work harder/pay more for something that thousands of other players already have.

Instead, how about a new, higher ranking tag. Call it General, Admiral or Grand Pooba. This is the hard to get tag and requires getting the commander tag first. Make it expensive. In addition to the 100 gold for commander make it at least 300 gold and 300k karma and time gated. Make this tag the same color/shape as karma or something. Since I do very little PvE, the PvEers can expound on that time gate. For WvW the time gate is based on a rank differential starting at 300. A rank 1 commander would need to gain 300 ranks to become a general. With the current system it takes more wxp to get the next rank so the rank differential should shrink accordingly. Using boosters would increase the rank differential discouraging players from trying to speed boost their way to it. This way the time gate will be roughly the same for a rank 2000 or higher commander as it is for a rank 1 commander.

I’m not in favor of adding buffs to any tag, but if an In the Presence of a General (not commander) ability line is added it should be very expensive. More expensive than the supply capacity ability line. Maybe 2 or 3 times (or more) expensive. These buffs should not grant more than a total maximum of 5% to anything.

A commander tutorial could be added but should be optional and repeatable.

Public, Private, Guild, Strike Team Tags
Three check boxes could be added to the party window, Private, Guild and Strike. When Private is selected only squad members and other commanders can see the tag. Selecting Guild makes private tags visible to guild members whether or not they are in the commanders squad. Selecting Strike changes the tag to a skull or something and limits squad size to 10 or 15. There is no need for separate guild and strike team tags. All commanders should be visible to all commanders all the time. At least in the same map.

Account Bound or Soul Bound
The consensus seems to favor account bound. If it is made account bound then accounts with multiple tags really should be reimbursed for the extra tags.

Account bound or soul bound, as another poster suggested, give the account a commander name. This can be one of their character names or what ever their heart desires. When not tagged up the name tag displays the character name. When tagged up the name tag displays: Commander commander name (character name in parentheses). This allows for character/commander name association. Whenever a commander tags up and does not have a commander name they a prompted to set a name and cannot tag up until a name is set. A Commander Name Change Contract could be added to the gem store to allow for a commander name change, but make it so there is some time period to prevent players from changing names too often.

Tag Colors/Shapes
There are players that may not be able to distinguish between certain colors or shades so tag colors would have to be limited. Likewise for shapes. With the size of the map/mini map tag it can be hard to distinguish between some shapes. Making the tag bigger could result in a blot out the sun effect. Not everybody has 20/20 vision or can see all colors. So I have to say no to colors and shapes unless it is a player option that only the player sees without affecting any other player.

A dropdown list could be added to the party window which displays public commanders. Guild members would see thier guild commanders even when set to private. Add a join squad button with a cool down between clicks so players cannot spam commanders with join requests if the commander does not accept or denies the request. Maybe give commanders the ability to block players. Once a commander is selected, the player can choose the color of the tag and/or shape which only that player sees. This can be stored on the client until the player logs off or gets reset at login. In this way it does not use server resources. The server gives position, the client gives color/shape and every body sees what they want/can see. If players can select the color of their commander there is no need to make all other commanders invisible when joining squad.

Tag auto-sizing can be a player option.

Commander tools for sub roles and party grouping
Commanders may give a player a sub role but the commander cannot force the player into it. Same with parties. Jack and Jill is in a party because that’s what they want. The commander puts them in separate parties because that’s what he wants. Jack and Jill goes up the hill to leave the squad and reforms their party because that’s what they want. This could turn out to be a waste of time and resources for a complicated UI which is dependent on commander/player cooperation.

Let’s look at parties. When a player starts a party (inviting a player) they become the party leader. The party leader’s dot gets a circle around it or soemthing and only the party leader becomes visible to commanders. The leader can disignate another party member to be the leader. There would have to be a cool down to it so a party does not get into a never ending game of tag your it. If the leader leaves the party the next member in line becomes the leader. Only the party leader can invite players or accept/reject invites to the party. This is similiar to what some games use, Defiance and Final Fantasy (I think) comes to mind.

Commanders and party leaders should be able to invite players as well as kick players from their squad/party.

Commander Events
These should be limited and limited to tagged commanders only. For siege events a third skill could be added to the siege skills to start the event. While your at it how about making the first skill the same as the siege to be dropped. I have seen many players/commanders (including myself) accidentally drop the wrong siege. Having the first skill look like the siege would lessen this.

I would like to say that this could have been much more a discussion by discussing commander functionality point by point, focussing on certain desired goals. Instead it seems to be a collection of posters repeating the same things and simply summing up what they think is needed. This is still very interesting for the developers but not so much for me to read, which means I am not as involved in the whole discussion.

On to the relevant stuff. For me it would not be necessary to make the squad a different colour because in wvw your fighting alongside all your allies and not just your squad. If there were more than one commander and moving in different paterns then it would be usefull to see where my squad is (so i wont get lost and get myself done in). In any case I would very much like to be able to see who is still alive, because the green dots of defeated players confuse everytime making it impossible for me to run away in time.

I absolutely love the idea of making events. It could clearly convey what the commander is planning to do to everyone in the area without having to rely on voice chat. To distinguish it from normal events I think it should be of a different colour so as to not confuse players. If it could be bound to something like the targeting system but just for the commander it would be very easy to use.

I agree on gold not being the best gating system. You however dont have to limit yourself to just one system. For one I would distinguish between wvw and pve. Pve can just maintain the current system and may even get the guild system added on top without much problems. I also think it can be a cool added bonus for guild leaders to get this icon, they would in that case be able to use it if the guild is a decent size and only if theyre representing. For wvw I would make the previous icons invisible except for the guild that the commander is in. Getting the commander icon in wvw will have to mean a bit more so that people will also feel comfortable following the commander. I am kind of lost as to what to do here since there is no real way of measuring the skill of a commander. The only system in place is the wvw exp system that measure the time spent in wvw. Using this as a gate may be the best option but could turn it into a “I have to grind enough exp and then I will be a commander” even though it would come naturally by playing. The system you are thinking about would not really be bound to wvw but does mean that they can get a group together and tackle events(if you have it cost guild merits) this would mean they have either good leadership or cooperation abilities. Would it not be possible to make the system a bit more complicated and have the commander gain a form of wvw experience aside from the wvw experience system. Like the commander will need to have ? wvw exp or gain ? commander wvw exp after unlocking comander to be able to even turn the icon on in wvw.

Hope this was usefull ^^

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Twinny.9304:

Question
If there will be any change to the Commander Gating, does that mean everybody start from scratch? or current Commanders still get to keep their tags? Because I would hate to lose/get a refund on my tag. I saved hard for that when i had very little cash and would like to keep it.

I was just asking to get a sense of it really. : )

While I wouldn’t mind the commander system being gated better and the possibility starting everyone from scratch , I feel it would have some significant issues:

- Anyone currently with a tag would want their money back. Maybe hundreds of thousands of gold would need to be refunded. Of course I would want mine back too! But I am not sure the economy would really like that.

- If the current ‘goldsilverbronze’ event rewards are not re-imagined, and this new gate will likely be tied to wxp and therefore likely tied to how much zerging around you do. It wouldn’t allow for any real defensive commanders

Commander Visibility & Tools

The primary issue I have with the current squad system is that I’m simply not in the habit of making use of it. I’m not sure how common this is, but perhaps one way to encourage it is to provide a very clear visual indicator to a player once they join a commander’s squad (i.e. making the tag appear larger and a different colour).

If joining a squad becomes a much more widespread habit among WvW players, then you can start thinking about features like on-screen text (e.g. an automatic one when the commander waypoints), commander events (maybe have some light rewards like an achievement meter), reduced chat suppression, etc.

Commander Gating

I’m of the opinion that any extended or elaborate gating systems simply aren’t necessary. Commanders need time to develop, there’s often times when there aren’t enough commanders, and most commanders will have some off days.

That said, you could introduce mechanisms for commanders to distinguish themselves, whether with tag colours, commander ranks, or simply a public achievement tracker that lets the player see what a commander has done. None of this I believe to be high priority, though.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Commander Visibility

• Ability to limit visibility to a sub group, party, guild, ect..

First sorry if i say something that have already been said, i just read this post, i missed the fixed top posts of the forum, my mistake.

I am more interested(if there is something more you can say about this) about the visibility of the tag and if you could customize it to only be seen for your guild and other commander tags or if you could only limit it to your guild for example.

In my case for example i’m on one server where normally we have a public commander with the tag on, and a few guilds raiding along the map with the typical mark of CTRL+T to not attract the no-guild raiding players, but sometimes this method have some problems to know where are the other guilds or the public commander to know where are all the guilds raiding, so we end at the same spot to take supplies for example or sieging the same build at different spots(yes, I know it sound absurd).

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Questions:
1.) How important is it to see your squad members as a different color and always visible on your map like party?

For the commanders that place scouts at builds, i think this is very important to know what builds have someone and what builds not, to know with who he really can count on battles,… But for some people who fight with a eye on the minimap I think it can be too annoying.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

2) I’ve always felt the best commander organization tool would be the ability to create events. Like drop a siege and the commander can set this is a build event then everyone gets Ui like build this flame ram 0/50 supply needed. Or Destroy this gate <show gate health bar>. Lets assume for this discussion there are no rewards to the events just a communication tool. Thoughts on commander created events?

wow, I really like this, but i think that if the way of fixing a events is too tricky at the end nobody woud use it. It would be more easy to write “build that siege” or “attack X gate” or say it with the voice program if you have one than create the correct event.

If you can create some event like “take X supply camp” on the wvw map for ppl like roamers, while you can siege a tower but you need this camp to take away the entry of supplies for example, I think can be more helpful and this way you have more control on the map.

The problem with making tags invisible unless in a squad is that currently guilds run tagless anyway as a makeshift way of achieving this.
Which means that you’ll have the “if not in my guild gtfo” problem. Lots of new players etc login to wvw and ask “wheres the commander? no players on the map?” and get greeted with silence because theres two guild teams currently in there doing stuff and don’t want any other players (or as they call them “rallybots”).
Making guilds able to have a tag only seeable by their guildmates/squaddies will simply make wvw a gvg only area as no-one will bother tagging up for the newbies to follow which will in turn just force them to logout.
Which already happens a lot due to the guilds running tagless.
You jump in a queue, wait 30 mins and then arrive into a borderland that seems empty with no commander and no answer in map/teamchat.
Then you either wander around hoping to fluke across a group or mapout.

Some problems which could be caused by guild commanders/leaders who don’t enjoy WvW, and some people who command are part of a large PvX guild with a small portion of them into WvW.

Now what if the leaders/officers in this guild find no interest in WvW on a guild majority vote and decide that influence or guild currencies would be better spent else where rather than on a guild commander tag for the minority of his large guild?

Also if guild commander tag is limited to individuals/certain ranks within the guild i.e leaders/officers, instead of 1 time tag purchased for guild for anyone in roster to use, I think this would cause major issues too, too many people assume that raid leader/commander would be of a certain rank in guild when as most know this is by far untrue.

My 2 cents into the commander tag popularity thing. Make tags different for PvE commanders and WvW commanders. Everyone who is purchasing a tag have a choice to buy it for PvE or WvW and each is not visible in the other aspect of the game. It will be easy to differentiate then. For people who already have tags can be given an option to choose for what purpose they wanna retain their tag for, PvE or WvW and be switched to that. Tag gating is not a feasible option and the basis people are providing to do that like wvw guild, higher ranked individuals in a guild are too far fetched. People should realize that each and every individual that bought this game should have rights and power to do anything that others ingame can. This is equality for the end users and consumers. What makes anyone believe they have the right to the tag over anyone else, because they have a big wvw oriented guild? and does it not matter if they are any good at it as well or not.

Yes, I agree with the voting system on the commander tag which still has its down sides like personal enimosity etc. But as far as the rating goes it should be just for the viewing of the people to decide and nothing like the visibility of tag etc should be attached to it. Also, if we are going to vote all tags be refreshed after a particular time of their rating so new rating again be assigned and tags dont get perma low rated even if the tag holders have become better at what they do.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Questions:
1.) How important is it to see your squad members as a different color and always visible on your map like party?

It’s very needed.

Twinny.9304:

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Commander gating

• Current 100g gate isn’t the cleanest gate. (Whole goal behind a gate is to limit the number of commanders out there.
• Gating using WvW abilities seems to have some debate to it, but seems like something we should avoid.
• Account bound commander tags vs character bound.

Question
3) A guild gating system would be clean but require all commanders to be in a fairly active guild is this a fair gating system?

Question
If there will be any change to the Commander Gating, does that mean everybody start from scratch? or current Commanders still get to keep their tags? Because I would hate to lose/get a refund on my tag. I saved hard for that when i had very little cash and would like to keep it.

Agreed +1

A Squad System should be half way between a Guild System and a Party System.

The Guild System as it currently stands is individual guild members can not see each other dots on any of the maps. In the Party System each member can see each other’s blue dot on all the maps. I think squad members should be able to see each others’ gold/green dots on all relevant maps similar to the blue party member’s dots.

Maximum guild members for any guild can go over a thousand. Maximum party members is 5. The Squad System should have a maximum of 40+.

The Guild System does not show member icons and info in UI on normal play. The Party System shows members’ icons and members’ information in UI on normal play. This take up significant screen space and can cause visual blockage. The Squad System should not show members’ icon and info as this would be none playable as the whole screen could be blocked. The Squad System should have a similar menu to the guild menu where members details could be shown at a click of a icon tap.

As in guild chat and party chat, only squad members can see squad chat and Squad Commander Icon.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

• Account bound commander tags vs character bound.

If commander can have chosen once name on becoming commander and that name replaces character name as long as tag is on it would help VERY MUCH.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

3) A guild gating system would be clean but require all commanders to be in a fairly active guild is this a fair gating system?

All active guilds can buy commanders for people. 100 people rush 1 CoF and we have 1 commander a day. If guild is smaller go for HoTW or do it in 2 days.
So I would say please don’t go that direction.

Regarding the whole question of commander gating, put yourself back at launch and evaluate some of the ideas that have come up:

Gating based on WvW rank … well, possibly it could work in order to limit for a bit longer than the 100g gating because you had guilds/groups pooling gold in order to finance a commander tag. With this new system, your designated commander would need to do the whole job of getting to the desired rank.

Then – imagine WvW at game launch – how long would all maps be without commanders at all under this mechanism? What WvW rank would you require of a commander? And wouldn’t everyone playing a lot of WvW hit the same rank roughly the same time anyway, and essentially there’d be no gating??

Regarding a rating system based on evaluation of commander you’ve followed on map – nope, too prone to trolling and sabotage.

Guild gating based on activity – how will that work for commanders who are part of several guilds? They’re just commander in sufficiently active guilds? Take the case of some servers/worlds where you’ve had new guilds formed just for the WvW leagues drawing the best of several existing guilds. It would be a fresh guild, would they not be able to have a commander straight away?

Whereas gating could make sense, I feel the 100g cost that is already in place should suffice and then having extra features to commander tag visibility added instead, you’ll get a system that prevents over-use/abuse in maps – whether WvW or even PvE. If you’ve afforded the tag, let it be up to that player to use that tag and then people will either follow or “block” the name of that player if he/she is either not a good commander or simply trolling with the tag.

Just one request please:

1. Please allow me to toggle ON/OFF the Commander Icon in PvE

The option to turn off the Commander Icon(s) in Map/Mini-Map so that I see them ONLY when I feel there is a need, would make me very happy!

This would be a weird and very hard-to-implement feature, but I’d like to hear some thoughts.

Commander-Exclusive Utilities

When you pop a commander tag, everything right of the heal skill is gone, replaced by commander-specific abilities. These abilities would give a buff to everyone within a given area. These buffs would give utility to an entire zerg, like an extra tick in Supply Mastery, or Guard Slayer, or +50% Movement Speed instead of the usual +33%. The elite would be the big in-the-fight buff. For 20s, the entire zerg gets the Stat equivalent of an Ascended Chestpiece. The skill used determines the stat block (berserker, knight, celestial, rabid, etc.)

In order to keep a lot of people popping tag and spamming these utilities, there should be a debuf after the buff has worn off that prevents the player from receiving another of these buffs until the original skill is off cooldown.

These utilities would be bought with skillpoints, as usual.

I would like to see the ability for the Commander of the map to act as a Server Moderator where the Commander has the ability to do a couple functions:

/mute [player name] – Makes it so a player cannot communicate in Map chat for 30 minutes. (Used to keep players from taking their drama in Map Chat or spamming nonsense in map chat).

/remove [player name] – Removes player from Borderland and sends them to overflow borderland, unable to return for 30 minutes (used to remove griefing players who are purposely harming WvW by draining supply, killing Golums off cliffs, etc. Limit of 1 per 15 min to eliminate abuse)

/Mapcount – Provides a total count of active players on the specific borderland.

/Borderland – Command used to populate command messages across the middle of the screen similar to the yellow messages letting us know something is happening on another map. (Used to ensure everyone see’s the message from the Commander so it doesn’t get lost in /map chat)

/spawntimer – Allows Commander to see the spawn timer at all locations that have a waypoint on the map.

/Command – Chat that only Commanders actively tagged up can see and communicate with each other. Similar to party chat, but without having to be in the same party with one another.

/supplycount – works as it currently does, because the ability to see “who” still has supplies is beneficial. The need for auto total still needs to be implemented, but I hope this command is not lost in the process though.

/mapcontrol – Command that Commanders can use that opens the map like normal, but instead of just showing the map, it shows all of the timers on everything (camps, towers, keeps, etc) This aids Commanders from having to use an outside website to do this.

Treebeard The Swift.9620:

The problem with making tags invisible unless in a squad is that currently guilds run tagless anyway as a makeshift way of achieving this. Which means that you’ll have the “if not in my guild gtfo” problem.

I agree in principle. Guilds have certain play styles and will always run the way that they enjoy. I would prefer a “private” squad over a “guild only” squad. You could then create a closed squad and use it for guild only, guild and friends, or flag it public when your server needs you. It’s simply more flexible.

I would like commanders to always see other commander pins regardless if they are in guild, public or private commanders. People in a squad could only see their commanders pin.

Treebeard The Swift.9620:

Making guilds able to have a tag only seeable by their guildmates/squaddies will simply make wvw a gvg only area as no-one will bother tagging up for the newbies to follow which will in turn just force them to logout. Which already happens a lot due to the guilds running tagless.

I have to disagree. In other MMO’s such as DOAC and Warhammer where a server needed to coordinate large number of players…. we almost always had a public leader for pugs. Someone always usually stepped up.

Ebisun.9682:

In my case for example i’m on one server where normally we have a public commander with the tag on, and a few guilds raiding along the map with the typical mark of CTRL+T to not attract the no-guild raiding players. Sometimes this method have some problems to know where are the other guilds or the public commander to know where are all the guilds raiding, so we end at the same spot to take supplies for example or sieging the same build at different spots(yes, I know it sound absurd).

I have the same issue. Commanders should ALWAYS know where other commanders are… it’s also one of the reasons people don’t join squads. When players currently join a squad they can’t see any other commander pins.

People like being informed. Knowing where your ally commander is fighting so you can take your smaller squad to ninja a tower/camp on the opposite side of the map is huge. If they implement colors and unique shapes to commander pins…. I’d also like to see changes made to show ALL commander pins while in a squad. Or at the very least make all commanders see all pins, both guild/private and public.

Havidos.9328:

I would like to see the ability for the Commander of the map to act as a Server Moderator where the Commander has the ability to do a couple functions:

/mute [player name] – Makes it so a player cannot communicate in Map chat for 30 minutes. (Used to keep players from taking their drama in Map Chat or spamming nonsense in map chat).

/remove [player name] – Removes player from Borderland and sends them to overflow borderland, unable to return for 30 minutes (used to remove griefing players who are purposely harming WvW by draining supply, killing Golums off cliffs, etc. Limit of 1 per 15 min to eliminate abuse)

No, the commander tag should not be a God mode. We certainly don’t need players with the ability to disrupt the play of others. If someone is that bad use the /Report feature.

Ahmrill.7512:

Ebisun.9682:

In my case for example i’m on one server where normally we have a public commander with the tag on, and a few guilds raiding along the map with the typical mark of CTRL+T to not attract the no-guild raiding players. Sometimes this method have some problems to know where are the other guilds or the public commander to know where are all the guilds raiding, so we end at the same spot to take supplies for example or sieging the same build at different spots(yes, I know it sound absurd).

I have the same issue. Commanders should ALWAYS know where other commanders are… it’s also one of the reasons people don’t join squads. When players currently join a squad they can’t see any other commander pins.

People like being informed. Knowing where your ally commander is fighting so you can take your smaller squad to ninja a tower/camp on the opposite side of the map is huge. If they implement colors and unique shapes to commander pins…. I’d also like to see changes made to show ALL commander pins while in a squad. Or at the very least make all commanders see all pins, both guild/private and public.

This functionality is very important. We need to be able to see all commanders on a map whether we are in a squad or not.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Commander Visibility
… (insert all items here) …

I would say you have it down accurately, and all of this looks like very positive improvements.

Question 1 (Squad member colors): I would call this very important. We Commanders need to know who’s actively following as part of the Squad, and who’s just wandered up temporarily.

• More detailed supply info that’s always up. (Increased radius)
• Ability to create sub roles within a squad.
• Current squad tools are rarely used.
• Seems to be some debates on buffs to followers, but there is a lot of good examples of ways to do that.
• Squad size needs to be increased.
• Ability to group up parties or other commanders to form different squad organization.
• Improved chat suppression for commanders
• Commander announcements (yellow text across the screen)

These are all very good. I have bolded the ones that are critical.

Question 2 (Commander Events):
This is an excellent idea, especially if they can be very short-term objectives. This could even apply to “battles” where “orange swords” show up for enemies, it becomes a full blown map event for allies.

Idea: Commander in an “Orange Swords” fight would get the orange shield NPC icon floating over their head. This means in a big fight, the Commander would be far more visible than normal, yet keeps the non-obtrusive and scaleable commander icon we have now. Best of both worlds?

Idea: Control-Clicking (targetting) could then be used as the mechanic for the Commander to issue Event Objectives as orders. Stacking, Building, attacking, defending, moving to a location, etc, are just some of these.

Note: Other potential tactical orders are needed if such a system is implemented. Players need ways to VISUALLY tell where to go, with commanders being able to deploy them instantly, even while fighting (like ground-targetable skills throwing down a “Rally Banner”, for instance). This is the key to success of such a system, or any kind of commander-triggered event.

Commander Gating
I personally found the gate to be enough to make me gain experience, before I bought the tag. I had to earn the Gold, and I did not take donations to do so. Even in today’s GW2 economy, 100G is NOT a small sum of money. Sure someone might be able to have people give them money… but that means they have a network of supporters anyway – sounds Commander-worthy to me. If they earned the money themselves, then that should be enough of a gate to keep those not dedicated to the idea of being a commander from buying it.

However, you could add additional ways of getting the tag. Badges of Honor comes to mind. Laurels as well. Since almost all of the currency/wxp/etc that could be used for gating are going to be Account Bound, it only makes sense that Commander Tag also be account bound…. otherwise what’s the point of the Gate in the first place?

Re: Guild Gating for commanders: I personally think the benefit does not outweigh the risk, better to have the above gates adjusted for balance, but on the whole leave it alone. The only -real- gate for commander numbers that will every be truly effective, is community support. A commander will either gain respect and a following, or they will not. No need to add artificial means beyond ensuring a basic level of dedication to the idea of being a leader. In this context, the 100G is just a token ‘cost’ for the ‘privilege’ (ie: burden) of being a Commander. Besides, Commanders often sink tons of their own resources and money into their day-to-day activities anyway. No need to burden them further.

Keeping it ‘selfless’, where they only ‘reward’ for commanding is the server/group’s benefit, is in my opinion the best Gate to commander limits you can have.

Question
4) What did I miss on this list

I think that’s pretty much it, I’ve included my additions above. I think you’ve got a very good grasp on what the players are looking for – so I would think this CDI has been largely productive and useful.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

3) A guild gating system would be clean but require all commanders to be in a fairly active guild is this a fair gating system?

If the main purpose of the gating is to limit the amount of commanders alone (and not be any indication of the commanders ability, which is something that has been mentioned) then gating it through guilds would also make it impossible for some who may be in several smaller guilds instead of one big one, not just for people who are not active guild members.

Also, currently all guild upgrades and benefits are serverbound, would that mean commander tags would be also?

The commander gating should be tied to a metric of its own in my opinion, one possibility would be a commander based achievement track, but that could be very clunky (also considering the track record with WvW achievements from launch, maybe the worst possible example).