Guild Wars 2

For those who don’t know, here’s what a satchel is. Each of the various crafting professions can make various sets of gear. By set, I mean armor that provides bonuses when equipping 2 or more from the same set. You can make a set 1 of 2ways: making each item of the set individually or making all of the items at once as a satchel (called a satchel because you literally take the items from a satchel, or bag, after creating them). However, for some odd reason, the cost of making a satchel seems to be significantly more expensive than making each piece of a set individuality. For instance, see a satchel of berserker’s exalted armor.

http://www.gw2db.com/recipes/11093-satchel-of-berserkers-exalted-armor

The ingredients are:
6X Cured Hardened Leather Squares
18 X Bolts of Gossamer
10X Spools of Gossamer Thread
11x Berserker’s Intricate Gossamer Insignia

For those who don’t know, the last component is the most expensive. It will cost ~3 gold just to make 1 of 11 berserker’s intricate gossamer insignia. And that’s to create a set containing 6 items. However, if you were to create the 6 items individually, it would only cost you 1 berserker’s intricate gossamer insignia per. That’s a difference of 5 insignias, or ~15 gold.

So why in hell would anyone make a satchel? Is it just that arenanet didn’t accurately predict how expensive insignias would become?

Right now the bag of armor is for those who don’t understand discovery. With discovery you can make all 6 pieces in the bag for far less than the bag.

I only see these being useful in the future for guilds to store sets of armor for members in the guild bank. There is no profit in crafting already, let alone while wasting all the extra mats to put the armor in a bag.

Fluffycalico.2715:

Right now the bag of armor is for those who don’t understand discovery. With discovery you can make all 6 pieces in the bag for far less than the bag.

Okay. But I suppose my question was more directed at the developers. Why the hell would they make the satchel more expensive? You’d think it’d be slightly cheaper to make all 6 items at once. That’s just common sense. Why would they make it more expensive? Did they just underestimate the costs of the components of insignia?

Globs of Ectoplasm average 18-20 silver per
Vials of Powerful Blood (and other components at that level) cost 20-21 silver per
The cloth to make the insignia costs about 1 gold.

That’s where I get the ~ 3g estimate.

ANet couldn’t predict the market, i think.
It’s understandable.

OMGScrump.7429:

I only see these being useful in the future for guilds to store sets of armor for members in the guild bank. There is no profit in crafting already, let alone while wasting all the extra mats to put the armor in a bag.

Isn’t the craftable gear generally better than the stuff the sets you can buy from Karma vendors in Orr?

Orange is orange is orange. All that changes is which stat combos they have.

Oh and some are ugly and require an xmute over the top of them

What Fluffy said. I crafted myself a set and transmuted the Whispers Rare armor onto it

Since the costs of the satchels generally outweigh making each piece individually, and that the recipe itself is expensive to obtain, there is currently no point in crafting satchels.

orci.5019:

Since the costs of the satchels generally outweigh making each piece individually, and that the recipe itself is expensive to obtain, there is currently no point in crafting satchels.

I guess my question was “why would the developers design the satchels to be significantly more expensive than crafting the pieces individually?” This seems like an unforgivable screw-up to me. I mean, really? How do you screw that up? What were they thinking making it that much more expensive?

I would think it would be more for people with alts. I was thinking of making one in the armorsmith for my second heavy character.

skullmount.1758:

I would think it would be more for people with alts. I was thinking of making one in the armorsmith for my second heavy character.

Why would that make a difference? You can still make the individual pieces for your alts.

I made a topic about exactly that in the game bugs forum category a few days ago.
I’ve actually got myself a satchel recipe before seeing the ingredients it takes,
that was quite the facepalm.

Satchels are always going to be pointless because they require more components
than all individual pieces combined, this has nothing to do with market prediction.

blink.4239:

skullmount.1758:

I would think it would be more for people with alts. I was thinking of making one in the armorsmith for my second heavy character.

Why would that make a difference? You can still make the individual pieces for your alts.

It doesn’t I guess. I haven’t taken the time to calculate the cost of all six items versus the satchel.

Also, I got a Box of Berserker’s Draconic Armor. The heavy armor equivalent and I was given Berserker’s Gladiator Armor.

Broke my heart.

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

Actually i’m not sure that making the satchel’s component cost the same as all individual pieces’s component cost would make getting a satchel worth it either.

The cost of getting the satchel recipe is very significant, so much so that the only reason i’d ever want to get a satchel recipe is if crafting armor from it actually cost less, noticeably less, than crafting each individual piece.

Consider it a sort of “investment” that should reduce the cost of mass producing armor boxes of that specific type, that would make sense imho.

serpentu.4591:

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

Actually i’m not sure that making the satchel’s component cost the same as all individual pieces’s component cost would make getting a satchel worth it either.

The cost of getting the satchel recipe is very significant, so much so that the only reason i’d ever want to get a satchel recipe is if crafting armor from it actually cost less, noticeably less, than crafting each individual piece.

Consider it a sort of “investment” that should reduce the cost of mass producing armor boxes of that specific type, that would make sense imho.

Interestingly enough, the cost (or effort rather) of getting the recipe used to be significantly lower if the database sites recipes are to be believed. That being said, I’m still not sure the Satchel itself would be worthwhile with the ingredients being equal. Unless making the satchel offers more player XP. Enough that choosing to make Satchel ends up being better for the player in terms of gaining SP at a noticeably faster rate than making them individually.

Gaining XP (and thereby SP) at level 80 is rather trivial and definitely not a crafting related reward.
Cost reduction for producing the armor as a satchel on the other hand does sound like a nice deal.

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

Oh. So it was some kind of glitch? Okay. That’s definitely more understandable than a design flaw.

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

I rather you save 5-10% on mats rather than require the same amount of mats crafting it individually. Otherwise satchel recipes are not worth it.

Jest.9276:

serpentu.4591:

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

Actually i’m not sure that making the satchel’s component cost the same as all individual pieces’s component cost would make getting a satchel worth it either.

The cost of getting the satchel recipe is very significant, so much so that the only reason i’d ever want to get a satchel recipe is if crafting armor from it actually cost less, noticeably less, than crafting each individual piece.

Consider it a sort of “investment” that should reduce the cost of mass producing armor boxes of that specific type, that would make sense imho.

Interestingly enough, the cost (or effort rather) of getting the recipe used to be significantly lower if the database sites recipes are to be believed. That being said, I’m still not sure the Satchel itself would be worthwhile with the ingredients being equal. Unless making the satchel offers more player XP. Enough that choosing to make Satchel ends up being better for the player in terms of gaining SP at a noticeably faster rate than making them individually.

I view the satchels as a way to make a 1 slot item to house your armor set on the tp. I hit item cap on it all the time due to the massive amount of gear i sell on it. Would be nice to have 1 slot instead of 6 per armor type.

Does the satchel give you the same ammount of exp as discovery of other 6 items separately?

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

Interesting. I’d assumed that the higher cost was to offset the inventory space advantage of the satchels/boxes. Guess not.

Zosek.3658:

Does the satchel give you the same amount of exp as discovery of other 6 items separately?

you cannot discover the satchel receipt, you have to make the receipt in the forge.

Zosek.3658:

Does the satchel give you the same amount of exp as discovery of other 6 items separately?

Either way you still have to discover at least one piece of the equipment I believe, so hopefully you would get more.

Escapadia.2901:

Zosek.3658:

Does the satchel give you the same amount of exp as discovery of other 6 items separately?

you cannot discover the satchel receipt, you have to make the receipt in the forge.

I took it as creating a satchel instead of discovering it, but he may have meant discovering the recipe, which you can’t do.

LoneWolfie.1852:

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

I rather you save 5-10% on mats rather than require the same amount of mats crafting it individually. Otherwise satchel recipes are not worth it.

This, especially since you have to spend skill points just to get the receipe, as well as quite abit of gold/platinum.

If you want to sell/give away a whole armor set you can easily do it with this form. This is the benefit. If you want to get money for everything you should stop playing games like this and be a lawyer

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

That seems… a bit pointless.

Why bother, since getting the recipe from the mystic forge consumes a bunch of resources? It takes perhaps 30 seconds longer to simply build each component individually which any reasonable player is going to do.

Even a 5-10% material savings might make this worthwhile in the long-run.

OMGScrump.7429:

I only see these being useful in the future for guilds to store sets of armor for members in the guild bank. There is no profit in crafting already, let alone while wasting all the extra mats to put the armor in a bag.

There is profit in crafting, you just need to make the right items. I’m making 50s per item(as long as it sells obviously) after the 15% cut from the trading post. I’ve made 5g so far from buying raw mats, crafting then selling.

How did you even get the recipe for that ?

- I obviously thought you might be able to make those through the discovery system, but then found out that you can’t put all the items into the discovery slots.

ZoiN.4280:

How did you even get the recipe for that ?

- I obviously thought you might be able to make those through the discovery system, but then found out that you can’t put all the items into the discovery slots.

I didn’t get it yet.

Mystic forge. Along with generous amounts of skill points. Very disappointed with anet in the crafting section. I don’t pvp and wvw.

I meant the XP from Making it vs. The XP from from making the individual pieces. Discovery was never what I was referring to.

Also, you do need to Discover or Buy the Chest Piece for any given set to get the Recipe.

And to get the Recipe, the exact amount of materials required changes depending on the level of the set you’re creating.. but generally it’s Chest Piece from the Set, Elonian Wine, Mystic Coins, and a forth reagent that costs SP (name escapes me at the moment). Put the right amount into the Mystic Forge and it produces the Recipe for the Satchel.

Wasted 50 mystic coins, gold etc on making a satchel recipe. Only to find it was hugely cheaper to make the items individualy after you take into account the required resources + the cost of the recipe.
Also, I didn’t really understand that you would end up with a recipe rather than an actual satchel.

Anet (Andrew McLeod) have said they will look at this, but it’s a bit late for the ones that have already wasted the resources on the recipes for satchels and then made the items individualy due the the higher costs using the satchel recipe.

Cathgar.7581:

Wasted 50 mystic coins, gold etc on making a satchel recipe. Only to find it was hugely cheaper to make the items individualy after you take into account the required resources + the cost of the recipe.
Also, I didn’t really understand that you would end up with a recipe rather than an actual satchel.

Anet (Andrew McLeod) have said they will look at this, but it’s a bit late for the ones that have already wasted the resources on the recipes for satchels and then made the items individualy due the the higher costs using the satchel recipe.

TBF, you probably should have researched it first. But you have my sympathies.

blink.4239:

Cathgar.7581:

Wasted 50 mystic coins, gold etc on making a satchel recipe. Only to find it was hugely cheaper to make the items individualy after you take into account the required resources + the cost of the recipe.
Also, I didn’t really understand that you would end up with a recipe rather than an actual satchel.

Anet (Andrew McLeod) have said they will look at this, but it’s a bit late for the ones that have already wasted the resources on the recipes for satchels and then made the items individualy due the the higher costs using the satchel recipe.

TBF, you probably should have researched it first. But you have my sympathies.

Should that be the attitude we take for the whole game? Try nothing, explore nothing, never experiment, always consult a wiki, walk-through, or even watch it done on youtube before attempting anything?

Funny, there was a time when that was generally considered cheating. Now it’s expected. Kinda sad.

CTzar.8542:

blink.4239:

Cathgar.7581:

Wasted 50 mystic coins, gold etc on making a satchel recipe. Only to find it was hugely cheaper to make the items individualy after you take into account the required resources + the cost of the recipe.
Also, I didn’t really understand that you would end up with a recipe rather than an actual satchel.

Anet (Andrew McLeod) have said they will look at this, but it’s a bit late for the ones that have already wasted the resources on the recipes for satchels and then made the items individualy due the the higher costs using the satchel recipe.

TBF, you probably should have researched it first. But you have my sympathies.

Should that be the attitude we take for the whole game? Try nothing, explore nothing, never experiment, always consult a wiki, walk-through, or even watch it done on youtube before attempting anything?

Funny, there was a time when that was generally considered cheating. Now it’s expected. Kinda sad.

There’s a difference between trying an instance for the first time without researching it and blowing 33 gold worth of resources on a craftable item.

blink.4239:

There’s a difference between trying an instance for the first time without researching it and blowing 33 gold worth of resources on a craftable item.

A) Doesn’t negate the point. Some people want to explore/experiment on their own; following someone else’s guide cheapens the experience.

B) 33 gold!? If you spent 33g on a satchel recipe you are doing it very VERY wrong. Unless you mean that’s the cost of actually making the satchel, but that’s a different matter. Once you have the recipe you can see for yourself that it takes nearly twice the mats to make a set so if you still make one at that point I’d say the extra cost is an idiot/lazy tax. Doesn’t sound like that’s what Cathgar did.

CTzar.8542:

blink.4239:

There’s a difference between trying an instance for the first time without researching it and blowing 33 gold worth of resources on a craftable item.

A) Doesn’t negate the point. Some people want to explore/experiment on their own; following someone else’s guide cheapens the experience.

And my point was that researching expensive parts of the game isn’t the same as researching every part of the game.

B) 33 gold!? If you spent 33g on a satchel recipe you are doing it very VERY wrong. Unless you mean that’s the cost of actually making the satchel, but that’s a different matter. Once you have the recipe you can see for yourself that it takes nearly twice the mats to make a set so if you still make one at that point I’d say the extra cost is an idiot/lazy tax.

1. 33 gold is the actual cost. That was conveyed in the OP. However, market prices for the mats have gone down a bit since the OP. I’d say it’s close to 30g now.
2. Yes. If you spend 33 gold you are doing it very wrong because your instincts should have told you to research first.
3. People probably thought that it’d have some bonus to it. That’s why I created this thread to ask why anyone would make a satchel. As arenanet has answered, it was a glitch.

At no point were you and I discussing the OP. You responded to a reply; I responded to that. You’ll get no argument out of me that actually making the satchel would be foolhardy as you can clearly see the material requirements AFTER you’ve bought the recipe, but that’s not what he was talking about.

Experimenting with recipes at the forge is fun; it’s part of the game. How would we even have the the information that people are supposed to research if nobody is willing to try anything?

Since I do not have the recipe yet myself has this already been updated or is it something we can expect in a future patch?

CTzar.8542:

At no point were you and I discussing the OP. You responded to a reply; I responded to that. You’ll get no argument out of me that actually making the satchel would be foolhardy as you can clearly see the material requirements AFTER you’ve bought the recipe, but that’s not what he was talking about.

Experimenting with recipes at the forge is fun; it’s part of the game. How would we even have the the information that people are supposed to research if nobody is willing to try anything?

1. You don’t have to experiment to discover the satchel. It’s a recipe.
2. Not all experiments cost 33 gold.

blink.4239:

1. You don’t have to experiment to discover the satchel. It’s a recipe.
2. Not all experiments cost 33 gold.

1. You DO have to experiment (or look up in a guide) to discover the recipe itself. The recipe is created at the mystic forge; you don’t just automatically get it and no vendor sells it (that I know of).

2. That’s right. And the one we were talking about is one of those that doesn’t require 33g. It may cost that much to make the satchel, but not to discover the recipe itself, which is what Cathgar was talking about.

CTzar.8542:

blink.4239:

1. You don’t have to experiment to discover the satchel. It’s a recipe.
2. Not all experiments cost 33 gold.

1. You DO have to experiment (or look up in a guide) to discover the recipe itself. The recipe is created at the mystic forge; you don’t just automatically get it and no vendor sells it (that I know of).

2. That’s right. And the one we were talking about is one of those that doesn’t require 33g. It may cost that much to make the satchel, but not to discover the recipe itself, which is what Cathgar was talking about.

I wouldn’t waste 50 coins without researching either.

There is one advantage to having a satchel over having 6 pieces of armor: inventory space for storage. You can make one for an alt and it doesn’t take up as much space.

Glad to know that ANet is finally calling this a bug after weeks of people questioning it!

blink.4239:

I wouldn’t waste 50 coins without researching either.

I wouldn’t ask you to, but honestly those things are cheap.

I was just looking at this and the Box of Berserker’s Barbaric Armor is the same thing. It takes 10 insignias to craft when if you made all the pieces separately it would take 6 insigias.

Needs to be fixed!

Any update on this Andrew?? 9/14/12 patch just hit and this didn’t get fixed

Also this is a problem somewhat related to this.

AndrewMcLeod.3857:

The intent was for the satchels to require the same amount of materials as crafting the individual pieces. I’m not sure where this got broken for these, but I’ll take a look at it.

Does that mean the cost of individual pieces are going up to match satchels or that the cost of satchels are going down to match individual pieces?