My brain is shagging under the weight of changes… having six characters was not a good idea!
(edited by Tinni.4351)
35 Rares in CoF...
Damage done = (weapon damage) * Power * (skill-specific coefficient) / (target’s Armor)
As per this page, yeah, just a bit of an impairment. A bit of quick searching suggests that would make their damage output weaker by ~1/3 with respect to weapon damage alone. That’s fine and well if his group is informed and ok with that, but he does himself no favors.
Damage done = (weapon damage) * Power * (skill-specific coefficient) / (target’s Armor)
As per this page, yeah, just a bit of an impairment. A bit of quick searching suggests that would make their damage output weaker by ~1/3 with respect to weapon damage alone. That’s fine and well if his group is informed and ok with that, but he does himself no favors.
That’s what I thought. Also it seems kind of pointless way to gimp yourself and your team. Even if you level using dungeons, surely you’ll get enough money/drops to gear yourself up and if you are leveling-up by clearing zones, just picking-up karma pieces from Renowned hearts would also do the trick. Even if you bought Tier 1 cultural armour and waiting until you can get Tier 2 cultural armour, surely you can just use transmute stones to keep the look while you upgrade the stats. Well that’s what I would do anyway.
My brain is shagging under the weight of changes… having six characters was not a good idea!
Perhaps he was low on transmutation stones and he wanted to keep a consistent look?
I know, on my 2nd 80, after I learned more of the ins and outs of the game, I wanted to keep my look the same but it was a pain on the ride up because of lack of transmutation stones. Now I have quite a few just waiting to be used on new alts…hmm, maybe that’s why they reward them so much. I’ve got enough to retransmute armor every five levels now…just waiting on that next new race/profession to pop up and get me to roll something.
i leveled to 80 in 35 rares in AC. i didn’t really notice a difference. i don’t think your stats decrease if you keep the same armor, so wouldn’t you be just as good in AC as an 80 in 35 rares than a 35 in 35 rares?
Bristleback can’t hit anything? Let’s fix the HP bug instead.
i leveled to 80 in 35 rares in AC. i didn’t really notice a difference. i don’t think your stats decrease if you keep the same armor, so wouldn’t you be just as good in AC as an 80 in 35 rares than a 35 in 35 rares?
Yeah but he wasn’t talking about AC. He said CoF and I am not sure scaling works that way. As in, I don’t think the scale cares what armour your wear but just scales down from your total stat numbers. But I never did figure out the scaling properly.
My brain is shagging under the weight of changes… having six characters was not a good idea!
Yeah but he wasn’t talking about AC. He said CoF and I am not sure scaling works that way. As in, I don’t think the scale cares what armour your wear but just scales down from your total stat numbers. But I never did figure out the scaling properly.
your stats decrease as your level increases, as the scaling is procentual, the stats on gear aren’t.
and yes, people still think they can run any dungeon with subpar equipment – they can, if they find a team dragging them through. implying they’re anything than a burden to a good team is just wishful thinking. in a bad team, a good lowlvl player might still pull more weight than an 80 though.
This is why an inspect feature needs to be added. People like those deserve to be kicked.
1st person worldwide to reach 35,000 achievement points.
This is why an inspect feature needs to be added. People like those deserve to be kicked.
+1, everyone can afford to wear useful gear.
also yellows are not necessary at lower levels. they are comparatively expensive and the additional benefit is negligible during leveling, it’s much better to wear greens/blues which are near your current level. even a blue of your current level is better than a yellow of more than 7 or 8 levels below yours.
That’s just being a leech and contributing less, making your teammates do more.
There’s no excuse to use gear that weak.
Anet make Rev great again.
So today I was playing on my level 25+ elementalist in Brisban Wildlands when I got into a chat conversation with a guy who said he was planning on using level 35 rares until level 60 and then get another set of rares. Now you can make rares last many levels but in my experience around about level 50 mark is when your level 35 rares start becoming inferior to even blues, let alone greens.
So I commented that I hope he wasn’t planning on doing dungeons. But he then commented that he had a thief who was using level 35 rares in CoF and insisted he wasn’t dragging down his group because he was dying less then the others and that he knew how to make it work with his builds and stuff… Now I firmly believe skill + build > gear but isn’t this a bit much? I mean, surely a level appropriate blues and green would be better then level 35 rares in CoF!
Am I missing something? What do you guys think?
This is because people usually lvl so quickly that they very quickly out lvl their current gear and it wouldn’t be efficient to always craft/buy gear for your current lvl.
This is another reason why most people don’t like having lower lvls in their pug team because regardless of their “skill” level their raw numbers usually can’t compete even assuming other things being equal.
This is why an inspect feature needs to be added. People like those deserve to be kicked.
I fully agree, cannot understand why this feature was not build into the game.
I ran my very first dungeon at lvl 80 after I had a basic full set of exotics. I only later got much more expensive armour/runes and weapons from dungeon runs.
Anyone with less then basic lvl 80 exotics deserve to be kicked.
Anyone with less then basic lvl 80 exotics deserve to be kicked.
I’d rather take someone in rares who knows what to do and contributes just 11.5% less than someone who tries to tank and does 66% less damage.
Anyone with less then basic lvl 80 exotics deserve to be kicked.
That’s a bit over the top.
If it’s your first character then unless you max relevant crafting and have enough coin saved to craft your exotics there’s no other feasible way to get lvl 80 exotics aside from doing the dungeon, which you would exclude them from.
When I ran my first dungeon I had full exotics on too since I maxed crafting prior but it’s too much to expect everyone to do that.
Not everyone wants to do crafting in this game, and for those people they need the dungeon runs to get their exotics.
I’d rather PUG with a low level guy, under geared, who can pretty much carry his weight and contribute even if it is not 100% effective as the ‘elitist’ level 80 full exotic geared guy.
The under geared/lower level people tend to be a little more fun to play with in my experience. Though, I’m not just grinding dungeons for gold and loot and trying to get in and out as fast as possible.
If that is your playstyle, then I understand why you would want a level 80 zerker warrior. And I don’t knock you for it, I just rather play with people who want to have fun like me.
This is because people usually lvl so quickly that they very quickly out lvl their current gear and it wouldn’t be efficient to always craft/buy gear for your current lvl.
This is another reason why most people don’t like having lower lvls in their pug team because regardless of their “skill” level their raw numbers usually can’t compete even assuming other things being equal.
You are speaking as if I never had to level a character. My main and first character levelled on a shoestring same as most people who aren’t super good at making in-game gold. She also wasn’t a armour-smith and so crafting was off the table totally. But there are so many ways to get level appropriate gear! Drops, TP (where blues and greens are not very expensive) and Karma purchases from zones… it just seems ridiculous! Especially since one COF run alone would more then pay for a good set of level appropriate gear.
But I suppose it could be worse. I know I have encountered enough level 80s in LA who did not bother to buy either the master or grandmaster trait books. So they were running a 10/10/10/10/10 build (well hopefully they actually remembered to spend the traits) and had 20 traits sitting gathering dust at level 80!
I’d rather PUG with a low level guy, under geared, who can pretty much carry his weight and contribute even if it is not 100% effective as the ‘elitist’ level 80 full exotic geared guy.
The under geared/lower level people tend to be a little more fun to play with in my experience. Though, I’m not just grinding dungeons for gold and loot and trying to get in and out as fast as possible.
If that is your playstyle, then I understand why you would want a level 80 zerker warrior. And I don’t knock you for it, I just rather play with people who want to have fun like me.
Both are extremes and a under-geared player who insists “he knows how to make it work” is just as tiresome as an “zerker exotic only” player. I rather not group with either extreme to be honest. Extremes are not fun!
My brain is shagging under the weight of changes… having six characters was not a good idea!
(edited by Tinni.4351)
On my sub-80’s, I use L35 rares up to L60, at which point I upgrade to L60 rares. I then use these L60 rares all the way up to L80, at which point I get exotics in appropriate stats. The reason I do this is to buy and use cultural armor, as it looks sweet and makes my alt feel less lame (and I don’t want to ruin the cultural armor with transmutation stones). During my leveling process, I always equip green rarity weapons at my current level bought off the TP.
I’ve done AC at level 59 using L35 rares, and let me tell you just how much more terrible your character is compared to a properly geared one. It’s pretty staggering. This is why I typically only bring in my alts for dungeon runs at the very end so I don’t have to weigh down the team where it really counts.
[VZ] Valor Zeal – Stormbluff Isle – Looking for steady, casual-friendly NA raiders!
Anyone with less then basic lvl 80 exotics deserve to be kicked.
I’d rather take someone in rares who knows what to do and contributes just 11.5% less than someone who tries to tank and does 66% less damage.
Hahahahaha you would REALLY hate this guy in question then I think. Because when I encountered him in Brisban Wildlands he was on his guardian and his level 35 rares (he linked them in chat) were all +toughness and +vitality. He said his trait spread was 0/0/12/10/10 – > so pretty tanky too and he was rather proud of the fact he was a tank. Couple of us tried to explain that maybe he was being too defensive but he told us he had logged X hours in the game and knew was he was doing. So we left him at it and went back to killing bandits!
My brain is shagging under the weight of changes… having six characters was not a good idea!
Are you guys going to kill me when i ping my level 5 “Aqua Breather” in level 10 underwater fractal
Are you guys going to kill me when i ping my level 5 “Aqua Breather” in level 10 underwater fractal
Given that higher level Aqua Breather can only come from renowned heart, if you level using crafting and/or dungeons, good chance you won’t have it. But it does pay to upgrade your Aqua Breather if only for the rune. The rune you put on your Aqua Breather gives you a persistent stat upgrade whether you are underwater on not. So it’s worth going out of your way to visit Orr and get the level 80 aqua breather. Of course it would be nicer if you could get an exotic aqua breather using fractal tokens or something. shrug
My brain is shagging under the weight of changes… having six characters was not a good idea!
I think the question is, are 35 rares worth the same amount of armor/bonus stats as a blue 70/75 item? If so, I probably wouldn’t mind. If not, at least get the blues. They’re dirt cheap :|
Don’t disturb me, I have a cat in me at the moment.
I think the question is, are 35 rares worth the same amount of armor/bonus stats as a blue 70/75 item? If so, I probably wouldn’t mind. If not, at least get the blues. They’re dirt cheap :|
I quickly logged on to my Asura, to look this up since she’s currently in Rata Sum and is a armourer. I got her to look-up the Asura Cultural Tier 1 (level 35 rare) and for simplicities sake we’ll just compare the chest piece.
Level 35 heavy chest piece has 117 armour and gives two stat bonuses, in this case +17 vitality and +29 condition damage.
A level 70 blue heavy chest that she can craft has 227 armour and gives three stats bonuses. For example, the carrion chest piece gives +44 power, +44 vitality and +62 condition damage.
A level 75 blue crafted heavy chest has 250 armour and again gives three stats depending on the insignia.
The cheapest heavy blue armour (between 70 and 75) on the TP costs 91 copper and was for level 72 and gave 236 armour and again three stats (in this case it was also a carrion chest piece).
Let’s say you don’t care about the armour because you are a master dodger and so never get hit, that’s still a lot of stats to sacrifice because of… whatever.
My brain is shagging under the weight of changes… having six characters was not a good idea!
bah, then he’s just lazy or too cheap. kick him =/
Don’t disturb me, I have a cat in me at the moment.
Yeah but he wasn’t talking about AC. He said CoF and I am not sure scaling works that way. As in, I don’t think the scale cares what armour your wear but just scales down from your total stat numbers. But I never did figure out the scaling properly.
your stats decrease as your level increases, as the scaling is procentual, the stats on gear aren’t.
and yes, people still think they can run any dungeon with subpar equipment – they can, if they find a team dragging them through. implying they’re anything than a burden to a good team is just wishful thinking. in a bad team, a good lowlvl player might still pull more weight than an 80 though.
i died the least in most of my AC parties. i may have been in low level gear, but the trick to dungeons is knowing the fights. an 80 in exotics that doesn’t know to dodge kohler’s pull is far more of a burden than an 80 in 35 rares that doesn’t go down on every pull.
Bristleback can’t hit anything? Let’s fix the HP bug instead.
i leveled to 80 in 35 rares in AC. i didn’t really notice a difference. i don’t think your stats decrease if you keep the same armor, so wouldn’t you be just as good in AC as an 80 in 35 rares than a 35 in 35 rares?
Unless your whole party doing AC did the same as you, you got carried.
I don’t believe armour (for the most part, condition duration is the exception) will influence some of the most important parts of dungeons – control. When I play staff ele, while my AoE damage is a huge help during fights, my combo fields (AoE might/healing/frost armour etc), AoE condition removal, snares (chilled from water 4, cripple from earth 4, stun from air 5) are what I feel like I bring the most to my groups. My DPS is secondary to that, not unimportant but I help most with the other things I could do – even if I was naked. You can complete AC with no armour at all. On my guardian, my ability to give stability or aegis during the Kholer fight is enough to carry an otherwise fail team through it (I can completely negate his pull attack for the entire party 100% of the time), the ability to group up mobs so they don’t run around hitting the squishies and so all DPS hits as many of them as possible using guardian greatsword 5 is just as effective at lvl 35 with no armour as it is at lvl 80 with BiS gear.
Having said all of that, I can run a tanky support warrior (with little to no power) during path 3 and have my party fail on the graveling event in the library because we can’t DPS the burrows fast enough and I’m too tanky to contribute the DPS the class is known for. Alternatively I could be full glass cannon (or just full power) and destroy them very quickly and carry my group through.
There are plenty of players who do more than their share of the work in a dungeon group in order to succeed or be as efficient as possible. Not all classes are balanced equally (or even close). That doesn’t mean it’s OK for one person in the party to be seriously undergeared and take advantage of the fact that others will optimise their characters, builds and play styles to succeed in an efficient manner. I’m not talking about cookie cutter glass cannon warriors with Time Warp mesmers, but getting the most (or as much) out of your class as you can with the resources easily avaialable to you (no-one over level 55 should be using sub 55 gear for dungeons – you get three stats on armour at 55, that’s a huge difference from level 50 rare gear, let alone any level 35 gear).
There is a certain amount of good faith most dungeon runners put into parties, hoping that even if you don’t run a cookie cutter build, even if you don’t have the most optimum build for your class, group play or even the dungeon, even if you don’t have all BiS (best in slot) gear, you are putting a reasonable amount of effort into your class to contribute to the group and its success. If you are building for lots of stealth, all range weapons, lots of tanky traits and armour, chances are your DPS is below par for what it should be for the dungeon and you are offering very little to your party in return. There are two sides to the situation, if your dead of course you can’t help with anything, but just because you’re alive doesn’t mean you are contributing enough to your group to justify taking that 5th party slot over someone else. Even with full DPS stats, in a lvl 75 dungeon with lvl 35 gear, you are not contributing enough considering a full upgrade to lvl 75 blue gear would cost less than what a single boss would reward you with. Don’t be selfish, pull your weight. A group succeeding does not mean the individuals contributed equally or even close to that. The fact that someone in level 80 gear could be worse than you doesn’t change that you aren’t your fair share of the load with awful gear.
(edited by Shiren.9532)
AC is the cheapest of the dungeons, you can skip hard content and because the highest level scaling of all dungeons it will not make so drastic changes using a low level gear or exotic gear. So stop comparing your kitten geared AC runner with high top runners in COF, COE or Arah.