Guild Wars 2

Just a warning to you guys, twice I’ve ran AC today and both times the dungeon bugged. Detha STILL sometimes refuses to set up the cannon traps and will just stand there, even after you kill her and clear any mobs around her. And Hodgins will sometimes not start the “find the scepter pieces” part of the dungeon. There was actually a new one I encountered today, and it was path 3 with Tzark. Getting to the lover’s room, one of the ghosts killed him yet he continued talking. The team I was in revived him and that’s where the progress had stopped.

So yeah, AC still isn’t fixed even though patch notes say they are. Just please make the NPC’s NOT enter combat whatsoever, as this is exactly what seems to be the problem

AC path 2 bugged out on me yesterday as well.

wow, ive run this dungeon more times than hot dinners and since the first 2 weeks or so ive never ever had one problem beating it... Strange... is this story mode then that is bugged? because i dont think explore is bugged at all... At least not since they fixed the hitboxes on the burrows..

I’ve been bugged before in paths 1 and 2, but we got it to work by letting the NPC die and ressing him/her. I would suggest to avoid skipping mobs because that may be the reason its bugging.

yes more than likely i Fear as I have never ever skipped any mobs and thus never ever had any bugs

yeah got ac p2 bugged too yesterday, detha at cannon repair part. ran in the room with gravelings on his butt, and ghost never popped up to talk to detha.

well i guess.. back to the usual method of deagroing detha before aproaching cannons to prevent bugging.

The only times I’ve seen a path bug out are when we skipped mobs. Usually the NPC gets hit by one of the skipped mobs when in a scripted phase and it bugs the script out. Problem is most groups insist on skipping mobs

I refuse to skip, if yur like me then add ,me illdo it with yopu anytime. i always warn when they join group, no skip or exploit.

I’ve seen Hodgins bug up once at the first scepter part (burrows) when a group tried to skip Spider Queen + the gravelings after. He died mid dialogue and the run had to be scrapped. No clue if Hodgins still bugs at the collection part, but it almost always happened when players aggroed the oozes (in which there is a very simple way to avoid them completely, but players don’t seem to realize that walking on the left path doesn’t cause them to spawn). Killing the mobs or getting Hodgins never seemed to fix him.

However, Detha tends to work again when getting her killed.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.
We try to find and fix scripts in those areas to decrease the chance of it happening though, so details about where and how the NPC broke, and what your group was doing (don’t fret about admitting to rushing or exploiting something) will help us in identifying and fixing the problem.

Robert, I will admit to rushing through and skipping mobs. The problem I see is that people don’t want to invest the time and effort it takes to clear an area for a few whites and a couple crafting mats. And there is only a slight exaggeration to that statement.

I know this has been said before but ANet should really consider taking out the NPC’s and the dungeon’s reliance on them. I, for one, am happy when an NPC dies; it means less of a chance for our plan to fail. For instance, in HotW, Honor Claw, when revived, will immediately go in to an area we have not yet attacked as a group. Rytlock does the same thing in AC Story.

I personally feel it’s somewhat of a high expection to think that players want to kill every single mob in an instance.

For Detha in path 2, it may be related to her getting in combat with the slimes when you first enter the room, if you run away from them.

Rob – for Path 2, one time, we all wiped at the spike chain bit.
We all died after we had fulfilled the graveling kill amount, but the big broodmother graveling was still up. When we teleported back, we hadn’t retriggered the event, but the broodmother was still standing there. Thinking we had to clear the room before trying again, we killed her with melee, and then the event changed and said we cleared it. I’m wondering if this is causing a problem.

RawkFist.1935:

I personally feel it’s somewhat of a high expection to think that players want to kill every single mob in an instance.

Have all the mobs have a 30-40% chance to drop a token from that dungeon. So instead of getting 60 Tears from AC path 1, I might end up with 90-100. Then every mob in the place is up for killing (at least by me)

A lot of people used to skip Kholer. Now he drops better loot (and tears) and most groups that I’ve been in kill him. He’s still a pain, but you get a little something out of it.

I did a Path 2 run last night and Detha bugged out in the cannon room.

Before that happened, we ran past the gravelings and oozes, a number of oozes followed us into the room, and the event didn’t progress any further. We ended up clearing the oozes then getting Detha killed by luring the champion graveling into the cannon room, this reset her.

Of course people are skipping mobs. That part of the content isn’t fun after you’ve done it a bunch of times. The fact that people want to skip something should be a warning sign about the quality of the content or rewards, no?

May I humbly recommend that something be done to make the trash mobs worthwhile/interesting? Or, reduce the number of trash mobs?

Then, a) people would enjoy the dungeons even more and b) you wouldn’t have to spend as much time trying to debug/spot fix scripts.

voidwater.2064

same here, but after rezzing her, it was still bugged.

Path 2 bugged out last night for me at the flooded temple. Dertha would not start the part at the traps. During the run we dragged the cave troll up to kholer I believe they were still fighting while we were in the flooded temple trying to get dertha to activate the next part… We skipped the spiders at the top of the stairs before going down into the flooded temple.

We also tried to get dertha in the flooded temple again after kholer was killed and we took the chest. Tried getting her killed etc nothing we had to leave the instance.

Just on a side note as mentioned above, I don’t mind trash mobs dungeons, what I don’t like is the boringly insain amount if time it takes to kill them, people will skip the trash mobs every chance they get cause you spend ages trying to kill something that drops nothing and really adds nothing either to the dungeon. Have trash mobs but drop the hp on them to a reasonable lvl. I’ve got no issues plugging away on a boss fight its meant to be hard.
And people like skipping kholer to as gain the reward for killing arguably the most difficult NPC in the dungeon is not worth the pain of fighting him nor the armor repair cost

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.
We try to find and fix scripts in those areas to decrease the chance of it happening though, so details about where and how the NPC broke, and what your group was doing (don’t fret about admitting to rushing or exploiting something) will help us in identifying and fixing the problem.

Path 1 – If you skip the mobs (Gravelings and Ooozes) after Kohler and before the part to find the missing scepter pieces, Hodgins will aggro on to them as you enter the room. He bugs IF the mob drops aggro momentarily, he runs to where he is supposed to start his dialogue but instead turns and runs back to the mobs to fight. At this point he will be bugged and will not start the dialogue.

Path 2 – If you skip the mobs heading in to the room where she repairs the cannons, Detha will aggro them on her way past. She bugs out in much the same way that Hodgins does. IF the mob drops aggro on her and she runs to where the ghost spawns, but then turns and runs after the mobs, she will bug out.

Basically the bug occurs when the NPC runs to where the event is supposed to happen but immediately turns and chases after a mob instead of starting the event. The event simply won’t happen afterwards.

It can be occasionally be fixed by either killing the mobs that the NPC aggro’d on to or by letting the NPC get killed and ressing them.

Having the npcs be necessary to progressing the dungeon is an absolutely TERRIBLE idea in the first place. Having them take part in combat and able to die is just kittening stupid and does absolutely nothing except WASTE ALL OUR TIME.

Hey that’s cool that you thought up this new idea for dungeons but guess what it sucks. I will repeat myself and say that all it does is waste the vast majority of dungeon groups time when it kittens up and we get stuck. Take it out of the god kitten game or make the npcs not take part in combat. I am sick and tired of a dungeon bugging out and wasting my kittening time.

Editing to include that not skipping doesn’t decrease the chance of it bugging in the least. Since the npcs are weak and utterly useless they die while you’re killing trash and it bugs anyways.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.
We try to find and fix scripts in those areas to decrease the chance of it happening though, so details about where and how the NPC broke, and what your group was doing (don’t fret about admitting to rushing or exploiting something) will help us in identifying and fixing the problem.

For path 2 with Detha, the only part I ever skip is when you’re heading up into the room where Detha sets up the cannons. I always skip the gravelings/oozes. That’s it. As everyone has stated, most of the people who run AC (or even dungeons in general) tend to skip trash mobs as they don’t drop anything worth the effort of killing them, and/or the repair bill starts to stack up.

For Path 1, Hodgins, the part where you have to look for the 5 scepter pieces, I ALWAYS tell people to head to the left just so the oozes won’t spawn. Of course, sometimes people won’t listen so the oozes spawn, we kill them, yet Hodgins will still not activate the event at times.

And as for Path 3, Tzark, that was a new one that has never happened to me. I always skip the ghosts that are in the hallway to get to the lover’s crypt. Once everyone has passed that, we all huddle up in a corner where we lose aggro of the ghosts and Tzark will start the event. However, because one person refused to listen and stood close to the ghost, Tzark kept fighting one of the ghosts then died. Tzark somehow still managed to speak, but when we revived him I guess the event just bugged and it never started.

Whenever the dungeon bugs, I always encourage people to report it as a bug and take screenshots, though I’m not sure how much that has helped to be honest since I don’t think people put in as much detail as they possibly can.

She’s broken us a couple times.

Killing her fixes it every time for us.

Given my druthers, EVERY SINGE MOB in the dungeon would have a base chance of about 4% of dropping an Ascalonian Tear.

Murder everything, walk out with 1-2 extra Tears. Obsessive critter bypassing slightly reduced. Script stability enhanced.

Skipped oozes before the cannon event, she didn’t start the script. Killing her didn’t fix it.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.
We try to find and fix scripts in those areas to decrease the chance of it happening though, so details about where and how the NPC broke, and what your group was doing (don’t fret about admitting to rushing or exploiting something) will help us in identifying and fixing the problem.

Wow, I just lost confidence in this game ever working decently.

I mean, honestly? NPCs are scripted and if somehting, anything happens inside the dungeon that’s not in the script’s comfort-zone, the dungeon bugs out? There’s no NPC-AI, they’re just led around on a leash by a script and should the leash get entangled, the dungeon is broken?

Somehow, the explanation you gave leaves me with the nagging suspicion that no matter how much blood, sweat and tears you’re pouring into this implementation of NPCs in dungeons, you’ll never be able to get to the source of the issue – the framework you’re using.

People will skip as many mobs as possible, your scripts should assume this. Ifmyou can’t fix the scripts to deal with this, then make the rewards FAR better for dealing with all the trash.

The goal for most exp path dungeon groups is the 60 tokens and the silver payout at the end. That’s it. Everything that can be skipped, will,be skipped because even the small incremental reward update you did for the likes of Kohler, etc. are still kitten and not worth the time.

For AC Path 2 specifically, it’s common strategy for most groups to stop fighting in the spike trap room at the very moment that the big brood mother dies, and the entire group runs past the chest, up the ramp to the left (leashing all remaining gravelings), across the top of the center where Kholer is, and fight the small patrol at the north of Kohler.

Then the group runs past the gravelings, up the stairs, past the oozes, and tries to get the gravelings and oozes to leash and/or fight each other, staying to the left of the big room as they enter. After it’s clear that the oozes and gravelings will no longer be an issue, the group walks Detha towards the orange slice and hopes that she will start the turret stuff.

And she rarely does, unless you were able to kill the Breeder on the very first try in the spike trap room. If you have to try a second time, you’re kittened and Detha will probably not start the turrets.

BTW if you want to stop groups from skipping trash mobs/encounters, the answer is dirt simple: all mobs (not just the lieuts) should have a noticeably high chance to drop yellow items (level 70+) and to drop 5 dungeon tokens. Ectos and tokens—lots of them—are the only incentive that will work 100% across the board. If each member of te group has a chance to score on average 5 yellow weapons to salvage (or sell) and 20-30 extra dungeon tokens just by killing everything in sight, well, then and only then will you have groups actually choosing to kill everything in sight and not trying to clear their 60 guaranteed tokens and 26 silver as fast as possible so they can move on to the next exp path.

Simple solution, change the reward system. Make unique, rare drops drop from only trash mobs. Or give them a good chance to drop tears. Or make it so you HAVE to kill them (with also increasing rewards).

phooka.4295:

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.
We try to find and fix scripts in those areas to decrease the chance of it happening though, so details about where and how the NPC broke, and what your group was doing (don’t fret about admitting to rushing or exploiting something) will help us in identifying and fixing the problem.

Wow, I just lost confidence in this game ever working decently.

you lost confidence in the game because they use scripts?

shaktiboi.5194:

BTW if you want to stop groups from skipping trash mobs/encounters, the answer is dirt simple: all mobs (not just the lieuts) should have a noticeably high chance to drop yellow items (level 70+) and to drop 5 dungeon tokens. Ectos and tokens—lots of them—are the only incentive that will work 100% across the board. If each member of te group has a chance to score on average 5 yellow weapons to salvage (or sell) and 20-30 extra dungeon tokens just by killing everything in sight, well, then and only then will you have groups actually choosing to kill everything in sight and not trying to clear their 60 guaranteed tokens and 26 silver as fast as possible so they can move on to the next exp path.

agree 100%.

The bug where Detha refuses to set up the cannons has happened to me four times in the last two days. In none of those cases did we skip anything. We killed each and every mob that was between us and the objectives. That being said, each time the event bugged out we had killed the oozes inside the room with the cannons instead of outside with the chains.

In two of those cases we ran to the door on the opposite side of the chamber and allowed Detha to be killed by the other group of oozes, after which we returned to the cannons. This caused her to respawn and start the event. The rest of the dungeon proceeded normally from that point onwards.

I’m not entirely sure what is causing this bug to crop up. It might be fighting in the room itself or it might be people Fing Detha while trying to pick up loot (pun intended). Either way, it’s very, very frustrating.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.
We try to find and fix scripts in those areas to decrease the chance of it happening though, so details about where and how the NPC broke, and what your group was doing (don’t fret about admitting to rushing or exploiting something) will help us in identifying and fixing the problem.

Well it’s a castle, full of doors. Just close doors until all adds are killed and the door keeper down, and guess, no need to rewrite npc scripts, the end of AC speedfarms.
Sorta of what we keep asking about arah. Am i wrong, Robert?

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.
We try to find and fix scripts in those areas to decrease the chance of it happening though, so details about where and how the NPC broke, and what your group was doing (don’t fret about admitting to rushing or exploiting something) will help us in identifying and fixing the problem.

Better rewards for the content and you’d see less skipping being done.

That said we actually had Path three Bug on us at the lovers / Asura Tzark area that turns us to ghosts, he died and the event kicked in, nothing we did fixed this, we had to reset the dungeon and waste an hours progress.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

The problem we are seeing a lot of that is causing this, is that people are skipping mobs and rushing through things, and it breaks their scripts when the players activate something while the NPC is stuck in combat.

Not sure what your definition of “skipping mobs” or “rushing through things” is, but I’ve seen both Detha and Hodgins bug in runs where we killed every single mob in the instance.

But anyway, where does it say that players can’t skip mobs (or bosses, or traps)? The event objective is “Go with Detha to the Hall of the Champions”, it’s not “kill every graveling and ooze in the catacombs”. The event should be triggered by Detha’s presence at the relevant map marker, regardless of the state of mobs which are unrelated to the event’s objectives.

shaktiboi.5194:

BTW if you want to stop groups from skipping trash mobs/encounters

I don’t think they do. In fact, considering the oozes will fight the gravelings & vice versa, I’m pretty sure that running through the former and pulling them into the latter is a strategy deliberately made possible by whoever designed the dungeon.

This “it’s because people are rushing” seems like some sort of excuse or attempt to blame players for what is clearly a bug in the game (specifically in the coding of these events). If the event is “Go with Detha to the Hall of Champions”, the next step should be triggered by Detha’s presence in the Hall of Champions (at the map marker), period.

Making mobs fight each other, running out of aggro range, using stealth to get past them unnoticed, portalling with a mesmer, etc., should all be perfectly valid strategies to accomplish the goal of the event.

i agree as well. there are many who hate the fact that peoepl skip mobs. at the same time, i wouldn’t consider that an “exploit”. there are plenty of other examples of exploits in the game, skipping mobs isn’t one of them.

everyone carries a different mindset upon entering a dungeon. you just need to find those like-minded to play with.

that being said, having mob skipping be part of why the “issues” surface i don’t believe should be.. well looked into perhaps. though i’ve heard people mention these bugs coming up, even with all mobs cleared. so i want to say it’s an entirely different issue.. also a scenario which is hard to replicate, thus making fixing the bug harder.

RawkFist.1935:

I personally feel it’s somewhat of a high expection to think that players want to kill every single mob in an instance.

Why? If you have a bad group, then you want to clear them out so that people zombie-rushing actully get back to the fight, and if you have a good group, it takes about 10 seconds to clear the trash out. The only problem is if you have a bad group that thinks it’s a good group, but that’s a whole different issue.

Obvious exceptions for things like the gravelings in the scepter pieces room and infinite spawns.

Illiander.8049:

RawkFist.1935:

I personally feel it’s somewhat of a high expection to think that players want to kill every single mob in an instance.

Why? If you have a bad group, then you want to clear them out so that people zombie-rushing actully get back to the fight, and if you have a good group, it takes about 10 seconds to clear the trash out. The only problem is if you have a bad group that thinks it’s a good group, but that’s a whole different issue.

Obvious exceptions for things like the gravelings in the scepter pieces room and infinite spawns.

Or you have a speed run group that runs all 3 paths in approximately 30 minutes by skipping trash and nuking bosses.

AC path 2 Detha not activating the final event. We didn’t skip mobs. The only things I noticed that was different in this run was that a team member stopped to resurrect Detha right before “the ooze on top of the stairs” before the final room (Detha was killed by a stalker’s knockdown) and one person was slow to enter the final room (10-15 seconds), Detha was following the last person.

Things I do and have never bugged.

1. Never res the NPC if the game will do it.
2. Stay with the group.

It was an annoying party and experience, first time it’s ever bugged on this path for me.

Detha bugged out on the final phase for us.

We ran through the last 2 groups of gravelings/ooze adjacent to the final room, and Detha died on the steps just outside. We killed the gravelings/ooze and rezed Detha. She followed us into the room, and stood in the middle, but failed to begin working on the traps.

We tried bringing in the ooze at the other door, but even solo, Detha managed to kill them all. Afterward, she just reset at the centre of the room. After 20 minutes of trying to pull in gravelings without them resetting, we finally pulled in one Graveling Scavenger. Unfortunately Detha, after 8 minutes, killed that solo. It took a Graveling Stalker to do the job ><

Thankfully when we rezzed her after she was kiled by the graveling, she immediately progressed the event, and we successfully finished the dungeon)

Caprila.4951:

Detha bugged out on the final phase for us.

We ran through the last 2 groups of gravelings/ooze adjacent to the final room, and Detha died on the steps just outside. We killed the gravelings/ooze and rezed Detha. She followed us into the room, and stood in the middle, but failed to begin working on the traps.

We tried bringing in the ooze at the other door, but even solo, Detha managed to kill them all. Afterward, she just reset at the centre of the room. After 20 minutes of trying to pull in gravelings without them resetting, we finally pulled in one Graveling Scavenger. Unfortunately Detha, after 8 minutes, killed that solo. It took a Graveling Stalker to do the job ><

Thankfully when we rezzed her after she was kiled by the graveling, she immediately progressed the event, and we successfully finished the dungeon)

Tried all these, weren’t sucessful in progressing the event and had to start over =( Thurs 12/13 @ 5:25 EST

There is also the fact that ranged attacks still have a hard time hitting the burrows, unless you use aoe attacks or stand in the exact right spot else you simply get obstructed.

I would start by looking at the way the cutscene is actually triggered (it seems to be triggered by Detha’s own script, when it should probably triggered by a proximity check running on the map marker entity itself – that would match the event objective much better and make it much simpler to track).

I also suspect a proximity check is being made on one of the players (i.e., the player Detha is currently following), and not on Detha herself.

The result of this is that things can get messed up whenever Detha decides to switch the player she’s following, or when that player dies (ex., during the previous event, at the Flooded Temple). For example, if four players are fighting the oozes and one enters the Hall of Champions and approaches the marker, how does Detha react if she’s following one of the four fighters, and how does she react if she’s following the one who ran to the marker? And how does her own combat status (or conditions, such as immobilize) affect that?

If, instead of being based on these three things (Detha’s internal script, player being followed, and a proximity check based on one of those two), there was a separate script, running on the map marker itself, that simply checked for Detha’s presence – or the presence of any player – near the marker, and forced the cutscene to start (regardless of the position of other players or Detha’s own combat status), then things would be less likely to fail and much easier to debug.

Hodgins bugged yesterday at path 1 just before the collect the scepter part which is odd since we killed everything and didnt pull any mobs/bosses away from thier point.

JackSlate.8450:

Hodgins bugged yesterday at path 1 just before the collect the scepter part which is odd since we killed everything and didnt pull any mobs/bosses away from thier point.

Do you remember if anyone ran to the marker (the red spark thingy on the map) while Hodgins and the other players were fighting the oozes?

I can’t be 100% sure, but I think the bug tends to happen mainly when the NPCs engage the oozes (perhaps something related to the immobilize condition). I have never seen Hodgins bug when the whole group runs in and turns left (which prevents the oozes from spawning in the first place). Could be just a coincidence, though.