Guild Wars 2

Hi, Arenanet.

I am here to talk with you about the kick system, the really bad experiences I am having with it and some ideas about how this can be improved.

In my particular case Im a 100% legit dungeon seller and I get kick in average 1 time every 4 runs. If that is not unfair enough, kickers can even resell the run without any kind of punish (no matter how many times we report these toxic players, they are still in the game). Arenanet, please, try to rethink and realize that players stealing your progress and your effort is like the worst experience a MMO can offer. I don’t really think this is a minor problem.

I understand that we, the dungeon sellers, are a minority. As I said, I was talking about my particular case as dungeon seller. But the truth is a lot of people are having troubles with this system, not only the dungeon sellers. Is just unfair how is planed and makes no really sense at least to me.

The current kick system allows all these scenarios:

1.-Players joining in a dungeon seller party, kick him and then resell.
2.-Three friends kick with no reason the last two players and then invite more friends or their guildmates (this can be experienced specially in Fractals).

I know that you said “the system is ok because the kickers are an insignificant minority” . Im sorry to tell you this, but your community is not as good as you believe. Im sorry but an average 1 kick every 4 runs from diferent players each time at dungeon selling looks pretty high to me. And I can not tell you how many times people are getting unfair kicks in other scenarios, but realize please that even if is only let’s say the 5% of your player base, I have to insist about this: allowing players to steal your progres is like the worst experience you can have in a MMO. And, you know? is an unnecesary bad experience because is so simply to fix it.

I will share just my own idea about how to fix it, but im pretty sure about you can think in a better design since development is your proffesion and not mine:

Allow us to create 2 diferente party modes: Democratic Party and Leader Party.
1.-Democratic Party: just like the thing we have right now.
2.-Leader Party: the leader of the party is the only one who have authority to kick. Also design a reputation system with a limit of negative votes you can give per week (to prevent abuses) and allowing to vote only once to a specific player in both cases, postive and negative. So players can watch how good or bad leader the guy is.

Some may say the leader system can be abusable, but the real truth is that I never had in my whole experience as a gamer the number of troubles that im having with the Guild Wars 2 with his kick system. At least in my eyes, the current system is the worst I ever had to deal with.

As I said, im 100% sure you can design a better idea. But please, just do something about it because minority or not, how fun do you think is telling to someone “hey, you just lost 45 mins of progresion in your game sesion, deal with it”?

Why should you tell that to people when the problem can be so easily fixed?
Please, rethink about it.

Thanks and good bye.

PD: This is not a threat about dungeon selling in particular but the flaws of the current kick system and how to improve it. So please, try to dont let this become a dungeon selling thread.

PD2: Sorry about my grammar errors, but english is not my mother tongue.

Oh, great. The thread was move from the “general discussion” subforum to the “things that we don’t care” subforum.

Well played.

Welcome to Anet’s “organization”(censorship) of the forums!

In any case, I think your ideas are pretty good. A basic thing that is missing from group kicking that I find very odd is the inability to say “No” to a kick. Instead the prompt just sits there annoyingly for a few minutes if you in fact do not want to kick the person. Sadly, dungeon/fractal experiences are not a very big priority for Anet as it seems like they have put most of their efforts into living story and new player experience “improvements”. People complained about dungeon ownership for an extremely long time and only a couple months ago was this problem fixed. If they make changes to group kicking expect not to see it for quite a while.

Moving the topic here = less players reading it = less people asking for this = problem solved

Im SICK about being kicked from my own runs in dungeon selling, seriously.
Please, can you give me any tips? Is there any method completely safe?
I can’t stop those kicker even with fillers. Some kickers are just like proffesional kickers or something. Is insane.
What really makes me mad is the fact that even if I report them they are still walking around Tyria.

I feel your pain, Yonarq, but the truth is that nothing will ever happen (imo).

Tbh, I don`t know what exactly reasons prevent a-net from solving this kicking issue.
Don`t they just seriously care about the people who experience this toxic behaviour and feel exploited/scammed? Yes, it might be only 1 of 40 cases that both people (pugs and sellers) get kicked at the very last map in fotm, or at the endboss in a dungeon so that the kickers can invite their friends or even worse resell a dungeon. Tho, it actually doesn`t matter wheter the seller loses his reward or the players in pug, since BOTH do loose time which they spent. It can be 15 min for an AC run, 40min for arah or even 1h+ for fotm.
Or does a-net just care about certain game modes in generally? There are 4 modes imo: PvP, WvW, PvE(which includes fotm and dungeons) and the living story. Taking care about a game mode doesn`t only mean to make it bigger, harder or whatever. But also to provide the people who take part in this certain mode a good experience. Every single gamer is a human, this should let us realisize that every single gamer wants to be rewarded in any way for what he is doing…. If he playes in WvW he wants to dominate the enemy, but as I`ve read many do struggle even there, in WvW, because of the hackers who exploit, get reported all the time but still are in the game…
If the gamer prefers PvE instead he goes for PvE events or Dungeons/Fotm, but being kicked at the end makes him loose what he should have gained as it actually is supposed to be, which means: He invests time/skill and should get rewarded! But instead someone else exploits this gamer; incredible!

And the third possble reason why a-net didn`t do anything about the kicking issue yet:
They might think that most people who get kicked are sellers (doesn`t matter legit or not), so why take care of them? These people who sell just ruin the gameplay; they offer another players a not supposed way how to gain tokens/lvl ups. Therefore “we pretend sellers to be part of the community and we won`t forbid selling, but in real we want to make them stop, that`s why we won`t protect them”-strategy.
If THIS is the reason, then there is nothing to say…..
Yes! I`m totally for perma banning people who sell exploited dungeons asap, but I`m also for punishing people who exploit others but stealing their dungeons. I`m also for giving these people a second chance, BUT if they get reported even after the first punishment and the report includes hard evidence then there should be an immediate perma ban!
_

Every time this happens you`d just like to take a gun and shoot these kittens with scat. Why so extreme? That´s easy answered: because these kittenes know that the provider won`t punish them at all so they can happily exploit this. But also you as the scammed one do know that there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that you can do to make these kittens feel your rage.
- Reports ingame? —> useless
- Blocking? --> absolutely useless….what`s the purpose of it anyway?
- make their behaviour and their names public here? —> YOU get punished
- Recording? --> yes, as a seller you do record, BUT —> useless
--> recording everytime you do run in a pug? Don`t make me lol hard, please!
_

REALLY? “Message Body lenght must be less than 5001”…NOOOOOH

I just realise that this is becoming a whining post by me once again. So let`s focus on the topic again:
The Party(Kicking)-System needs to be changed, so that people can actually run dungeons without fear to get kicked at the end or loose their solo`ed dungeon.

Creating both system as the OP suggested would end in only one of them being used in PUGS, that`s for sure: the one with the leader. People who don`t have a guild will create their own parties to be safe, which is their kitten right! Since they can`t do anything about being kicked at the end they should at least have the choice to be on the safe side. I don`t know much about programming, but let`s asume the idea about the “ranking the leader so that people know wheter he likes to kick or not before joining him” isn`t that easy to implement. Alright, don`t do that. But any solution which includes a leader is still ways better than what we`ve got now. The reason why the leader system got replaced by the current one is that the sometimes the leaders had to go or did loose connection and the entire party did loose all the progress. My suggestion is this:
We should keep the current system, which allows the party to go on if the “leader” goes off/dc, BUT the leader (=the person who went in the dungeon first and/or did speak first to the NPC) should be THE ONLY ONE who has the right to vote kick as this is “his” party. If he got to go then the leadership goes randomly to one of the 4 another players, of the leader himself gives the leadership to his favorite.
I`m pretty sure that`s not hard to do, and may require only 2-3 days to realise BUT it will solve most inappropriate kicks, tho, there still will be people who will launch a dungeon in order to be the leader and have the right to kick the 2 random guys at the end. Even so, these 2 kicked guys won`t join the next time but will launch their own dungeon in order to be the leader. At this point we can just speculate wheter people will start to launch their own dungeons and therefore stop join another parties or keep taking some risk and run with someone else who is the leader with the only kick vote right. Probably the first scenario.

Duh, now it`s time for bed to me, but I may have a better idea, duh:
An interesing idea might be also the following:
Each party member has the right for a vote kick, but the vote of the leader is weighted ddouble, so..:
if…
…5/5 —> “leader vote” + 2 another votes needed to kick someone (="2"+2=4/5)
…4/5 --> “leader vote” + 1 another vote (="2"+1=3/4)
…3/5 —> “leader vote” + 1 another vote (="2"+1=3/3 hehe)
which means: in any cases the leader needs to accept the voting, if he does not, the voted player will stay in the party. Since, if…
…(5/5): 3 non leader decide to kick the 4th non leader --> only 3/5
…(4/5): 2 non leader decide to kick the 3rd non leader —> only 2/4
True, 3 guildies who launched will still have the power to kick the 2 poor guys at the end, but I`m sure the amount of unfair kicks will decrease alot.

The leader himself would be actually kickable, too
So if…
…5/5: 4 of the party members need to vote agains him
…4/5: 3 of the them
…3/5: let`s not do that because of the griever who steal dungeons from people who don`t have fillers

Meh, pretty sure my ideas are pretty much naive but I can`t even keep my eyes open properly, I`m sorry if you jsut did read all the scrap until this point….
gn8

Ah no wait actually: If you, dear a-net staff, don`t wont to think about a new/better party system then PLEASE take care about the reports, punish people who exploit in any way (no matter wheter bugs or another people who also do have feelings you know). I can understand if there is a guy who got reported only once for griefing via a support ticket without hard evidence, and you don`t want to spend hours to find out what exactly happened. BUT if there are reports with kitten hard evidence like video footage, screenshots etc. then punish the convicts (make them fear a little bit…).
It`s just hilarious if we get told that these guys with bad behaviour are being punished, but the community do see them playing happily as if nothing ever happened.

So, I`m off..

It’s a rock-and-hard-space issue. If it’s too hard to kick, people can harass groups and it’s hard to remove afk’ers. If it’s too easy to kick you get group-stealing.

It can be annoying (although I’m still not sure where people keep finding these awful groups), but there’s just no easy solution.

Honestly, I think is a simple common sense concept: “My group, my rules”

You don’t like it? leave and never join again in his party.
You got a bad experience from his party? never join again.
You got an unfair kick? block that guy and never join in his group again.

Im all for the leader system if that means he is the only one who can vote kick. Some people may say leader system can become abusive…but as I said, I never got these much problems with any leader system from other MMOs. A leader system provides more control for both, leaders and party members, because you can always just write someone in your blacklist and never play with him again if he leads.

the actual semi-democratic thing is just terrible, unfair, lame, and can gets you mad so easily in some scenarios.

I’m really missing the common sense factor in the current kick system. People kicking a guy from his own run is the most stupid situation I have ever seen in any MMO.

The only thing in this entire thread that I thought was worthwhile was the concept of a reputation system. I agree with this wholeheartedly. This would be the perfect thing in this game venue to solve unnecessary kicks. I think this should be implemented to actually show an icon or some type of indicator on players in both parties and the lfg tool, who reach either a positive or a negative threshold regarding kicks and secondary votes to kicks. Obviously the indicators would be visibly different for positive versus negative thresholds. This would accomplish several worthwhile things:

1. Provide a warning about kick happy groups/individuals to avoid wasting your time.
2. Provide a penalty for excessive kicks by way of a negative stigma in groups.
3. Provide a reward for positive grouping behavior.
4. Provide an incentive for negative players to change their behavior.

I would limit the display of this indicator to only show up visible to others in the lfg and instance/fractal grouped venues. Essentially only in places where kicking has a negative impact on progress.

I actually love the fact that anyone can be kicked now, so don’t take my input the wrong way. The only thing I hate more than an unjust kick, is being held hostage by a baddie in a fractal/dungeon…just to avoid losing progress. I also have little sympathy for a run seller getting kicked…as I think that selling runs is a shady tactic in games like this anyway. I do agree that kicking anyone unjustly is bad though…which is why I am 100% in favor of a reputation system to deal with unjust kicks in general.

I think the fact that this game hides relative group contribution from individuals makes it hard to kick the right person sometimes though. No real way to ferret out those nomads in the group causing you to hit boss enrage timers or get overwhelmed by mobs dying too slowly…without having to resort to gear pings. An indicator for overall stat trends would be extremely helpful in this regards.

I also have little sympathy for a run seller getting kicked…as I think that selling runs is a shady tactic in games like this anyway. I do agree that kicking anyone unjustly is bad though…which is why I am 100% in favor of a reputation system to deal with unjust kicks in general.

Please explain it just for me how legit run selling is shady? Do sellers exploit any bugs or use any third party programms? Do they force you to buy a run? Do they exploit any other player? Srsly, I just don`t get it why some people are against something they don`t like.
Serious sellers don`t scam the customers. It`s also up to you, as a customer, wheter to pay and get your product or not to.
Why shouldn`t it be allowed to take advantage of your skill/spent time?
Instead you say: “little sympathy for a run seller getting kicked”, ahahaha, so you wouldn`t care if you wrote a song but another guy came across and did steal it in order to get all the credit? It take you talent/skill and time to achieve the result, but noone cares about it….True, after tons of runs it becomes really easy for you to solo anyhting, but still skill is needed, since 90%(?) of the players can`t solo anything.

So don`t tell me that everyone needs to be protected in this game except the kitten sellers, who “ruin” the game. Just because you like to run yourself, it doesn`t mean that everyone has fun/time to run certain dungeons in order to get the tokens for their skins/legendaries! Or after having lvl`ed up 5+ chars and having explored the map at least once people might also want to lvl up faster this time by buying ac/cm.

I know that my post is pretty irrelevant, but as seller who gets harassed
( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Qy36RHgelw ) and kicked regularly – and knowing that these people won`t get any punish at all – I can`t stay calm when sellers are being represented as the bad guys without rights.

Ciao.

Wollowitz.9174:

I also have little sympathy for a run seller getting kicked…as I think that selling runs is a shady tactic in games like this anyway. I do agree that kicking anyone unjustly is bad though…which is why I am 100% in favor of a reputation system to deal with unjust kicks in general.

Please explain it just for me how legit run selling is shady? Do sellers exploit any bugs or use any third party programms? Do they force you to buy a run? Do they exploit any other player? Srsly, I just don`t get it why some people are against something they don`t like.
Serious sellers don`t scam the customers. It`s also up to you, as a customer, wheter to pay and get your product or not to.
Why shouldn`t it be allowed to take advantage of your skill/spent time?
Instead you say: “little sympathy for a run seller getting kicked”, ahahaha, so you wouldn`t care if you wrote a song but another guy came across and did steal it in order to get all the credit? It take you talent/skill and time to achieve the result, but noone cares about it….True, after tons of runs it becomes really easy for you to solo anyhting, but still skill is needed, since 90%(?) of the players can`t solo anything.

So don`t tell me that everyone needs to be protected in this game except the kitten sellers, who “ruin” the game. Just because you like to run yourself, it doesn`t mean that everyone has fun/time to run certain dungeons in order to get the tokens for their skins/legendaries! Or after having lvl`ed up 5+ chars and having explored the map at least once people might also want to lvl up faster this time by buying ac/cm.

I know that my post is pretty irrelevant, but as seller who gets harassed
( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Qy36RHgelw ) and kicked regularly – and knowing that these people won`t get any punish at all – I can`t stay calm when sellers are being represented as the bad guys without rights.

Ciao.

Re-read the above. I specifically said that I don’t support anyone being kicked unjustly. I’m not going to cry a river over a seller getting kicked, as I think they are putting themselves in a questionable situation by trying to impose this run selling structure into a system that has no frame work to enforce it. I think run selling is just exploiting noobs. Of course some noobs are going to go the easiest path…especially if they have been failing in attempts at learning to play on their own. There is no rule against it, and I could really care less about it…as it does not impact me at all, but I still think its kind of predatory to squeeze the noobs for gold…to complete content that is actually free. I personally could never see myself paying someone else to either teach me how to play or to play the game for me…that just seems pretty pathetic to me…invalidates the whole challenge of playing the game. I don’t think your example about being a song writer is a one to one comparison either. The song writer has an original product to sell. A product that is not available for free anywhere…unless the artist chooses to make it available for free. Dungeons are free to begin with and are not created by the run seller. A more valid example would be one of those cart puller guys in a third world country….selling rides to lazy rich kittens that think they are too good to walk on their own around a city.

Again, I think its its bad form to kick anyone unjustly (not being rude, dragging down the party, not meeting requirements, etc.). To be clear, I am not saying that I support kicking run sellers. The agreement to join the sold run, invalidates any right they have to gripe about the selling process. I do reserve the right to have my opinion on the act of run selling though. I again, don’t care if it continues or not…I just think its a shady practice.

I buy paths to level alts. However, i’m more experienced than you and better than you in dungeons. Your logic is flawed.

oxtred.7658:

I buy paths to level alts. However, i’m more experienced than you and better than you in dungeons. Your logic is flawed.

I’m assuming that is directed at me lol. kitten much? That’s all I can assume from what looks like a personal jab at me with your unsubstantiated claims of somehow knowing you are better at dungeons than me…and your self asserted (no evidence) claim that my logic is flawed. One, you have no idea what dungeons I do or how well/often I do them. You have no idea if I do regular dungeons at all. You can’t even tell the last time I logged into the game lol. Your assertions of someone’s skill or logic have no value unless you have some type of logic or proof of your own to back those assertions up.

At the end of the day, how does doing it for alts make a difference in noob status? If you have max level characters, then it would make sense normally for you to be experienced enough to not have to pay someone to do the run for you? Where are your friends from your leveling experience on your other characters? Where is your guild? Its like someone that can’t get a girl without paying…who claims pimp status.

I’ve 14 80 characters, and I’m sometimes tired of leveling. I can solo the dungeon, or I can help a guy who solo’d it himself, make him happy, get xp, for a low price. People who despise dungeon sellings are mostly jealous casuals who can’t even 5 man it and want to leech parties without drawback. I wouldn’t be surprised if you were one of them. If you could do it yourself then there’s no reason to have a problem with selling, as it doesn’t affect you in any way. If you can’t, then you’re a bad player.

might want to relax, friend.

oxtred.7658:

I’ve 14 80 characters, and I’m sometimes tired of leveling. I can solo the dungeon, or I can help a guy who solo’d it himself, make him happy, get xp, for a low price. People who despise dungeon sellings are mostly jealous casuals who can’t even 5 man it and want to leech parties without drawback. I wouldn’t be surprised if you were one of them. If you could do it yourself then there’s no reason to have a problem with selling, as it doesn’t affect you in any way. If you can’t, then you’re a bad player.

You seriously are kitten about your precious sold runs aren’t you. I’d also venture to say you need to actually get a life….14 80 characters? I wasn’t too far off the mark about the getting laid comment I see. I think you need to also learn to read for comprehension and see that at no point did I say that I “despised” dungeon selling. The only sentiment I relayed is that I think its a shady practice and don’t shed any tears if they get negative repercussions for putting themselves in that position to begin with. Sounds like you have some serious personal issues with the way you think calling people “jealous casuals” has any type of value or meaning…especially in this game with no real rewards or status in pve. This game is all about skins and appearances….nobody really cares about your 14 80s or anything else. I think its funny and pretty pathetic that the most you can do is to make up things to assume about me…and then try to assert those things as justification for something? You just seem to have really got your undies in a bunch over an opinion that I am entitled to have if I feel like it about the practice of selling runs. Just a word of advice…you probably want to take a deep breath before your nerd rage gives you a heart attack or something.

I’m not raging at all. I’m just explaining to you why your opinion has absolutely no value. Again, your logic is flawed. You’re accusing me off ad hominems, and then do exactly the exact same thing. You’re the one getting mad because you asked for a proof of my in game knowledge, and I gave you one. Now that you got it, you’re saying it’s worth nothing. I assumed you were a jealous casual. You’re looking down on in game achievements, you’re then a casual. You’re also looking down on me, you’re jealous.

Did Mike the Beloved get a new account?

oxtred.7658:

I’m not raging at all. I’m just explaining to you why your opinion has absolutely no value. Again, your logic is flawed. You’re accusing me off ad hominems, and then do exactly the exact same thing. You’re the one getting mad because you asked for a proof of my in game knowledge, and I gave you one. Now that you got it, you’re saying it’s worth nothing. I assumed you were a jealous casual. You’re looking down on in game achievements, you’re then a casual. You’re also looking down on me, you’re jealous.

1. Never accused you of any ad hominems.
2. The insults started with you…so yes…you are raging.
3. I have only responded to obvious jabs you have directed back at me with remarks regarding factual things (things you typed yourself).
4. Yes, I would be considered a casual, and I have no problem with that. I actually have a life…in fact, I’ll be leaving home in a few minutes to go live it now that my people have just come back home with my property.
5. Yes, I am looking down on you, but that has nothing to do with me being jealous…in fact I feel sorry for you that this issue is so important to you and you felt the need to lash out at me for expressing an opinion without even referencing you specifically in the beginning. I feel sorry for you that your entire life and self esteem apparently revolves around this mediocre game.
6. I never asked you for your in game knowledge…I just assumed you were a noob…so yes…apparently I was wrong about that. You are in fact much worse than a noob…you are obsessed with pixels instead.
7. I was also wrong about no one caring about your in game achievements…i’m sure there are others equally obsessed as you are with that…so I guess someone does care.
8. What I said had no value was your completely assumed information about my experience in dungeons etc. I guess it escapes your mental grasp, that at some point, I did play this game in more than a true casual sense, and have since lost the majority of my interest. This should make logical sense as this game has been out for a while and the dungeon/fractal content is pretty stale at this point.

Oh well, rage on, I’m personally about to go interact with some non-pixels.

The lovely “ohh yeah, well you have no life” argument. Forums never change.

Jerus.4350:

The lovely “ohh yeah, well you have no life” argument. Forums never change.

It fits in with the “Arrgh how dare you not give me my deserved props?!”

I think this is the sound of a thread dying.

That’s the point. As you don’t care about this game, your opinion doesn’t matter. Not gonna answer your ad hominem; my life is fine. Still, you should educate yourself about that game you’re not even interested in before posting about its content.

Meh.

The ones who talk about their lives outside the game are usually the ones who have the crappiest ones outside the game.

Especially the ones who think anyone better than they are in a video game must spend their whole life playing it.

I did read your post OBD
This will be my last post in this thread, I hope, since we are offtopic right now.

My problem about your posts concerns your first statement (“little sympathy for a run seller getting kicked”) and a newer one (“I think they are putting themselves in a questionable situation by trying to impose this run selling structure into a system that has no frame work to enforce it”).

A-Net doesn`t support dungeon selling because it wasn`t intended; that`s the only reasonable reason. This leads you to the conclusion that it`s a “shady tactic in game”. It`s your opinion and I`m totally OK with it!
But the problem I see here is that some people start to think the same way, actually even more cheeckier. Like: “A-Net doesn`t support the selling, this is why sellers are worth less than us so we can exploit them, harass them, ahaha, we are so smart…..A-Net doesn`t care about them, since we (kickers/grievers/stalker) don`t get banned if doing this to a seller…” .
That`s what I`m trying to say.
There are many things that were not intended in this (and another) game(s), but it can`t be true that people who play the UNintended way have to suffer more than those who play the intended one. Serious sellers don`t exploit anything or anyone. Noobs? Noone forces them to choose the easy/expensive way to play. To the contrary, I use to give 1 of 4 slots away to a noob (less than 1k ap) if he joins me and also answeres to my question wheter it´s his first account or not….
Sellers are players like any other, too, they also have fun doing what they do, they also have an aim, e.g. legandaries, skins…YES, some people don`t care about these at all, they can`t understand how soloing can be entertaining. But for some people it IS! Therefore everyone should be able to play what they prefer to without fearing to get scammed, exploited or harassed.

Seller don`t try to “impose this run selling structure” as you mentioned, they just feel misunderstood because there is no support for them as a free player, even though it was promised by certain staff to “let the kickers and grievers know that their behavior isn`t nice if they get caught with hard evidence”.

So in the end all I want to say is that everyone – no matter wheter a pug player or a seller – should have the SAME right for justice (punishment agains bad guys with evidence) or safety (better blocking system).

As you see, dear ODB, I wasn`t critisizing you, but the maturity of some people who abuse the current problem. This would stop pretty fast if reports were taken seriously and at least warning punishment taken.
To punish someone who kicked someone at the end of a dungeon only once or twice is not a solution. There might be some people who like to kick frequently at the end, but I`m sure it might be not that easy for a-net to reproduce wheter these reported guys do abuse the kick system with method or not. Tho, there are party logs, but it`s probably a “hard” and boring work to check all the reports cencerning these few guys.
Therefore a better block system would be more helpfull imho, as exploited people will never again meet these exploiters and also the sellers will stop whinig

Guys there was never the question about any of your lives. I doubt that anyone is interested in them either.

But as things go..
… Well i think there should be a note for the player at least, why he should be kicked. It usally takes some 20 to 30 seconds for for some one to get kicked. He should at least get a note for who is kicking hin. Without a doubt there should be the posibillty added for other players to decline the kicking request of the person kicking him.
e.g. A time limit – 1 min or so, and the posibillity of a vote should be added either. So the majority decides if the player should be kicked or not.

Well i see some great problems coming with a “leader”-setup, abusing his/her role will become even easier.

Also I’d like to add some things. There is usually a reason for a person to be kicked out of a party. If the LFG-Sytsem clearly says what its looking for there are still some players who don’t bother to read – therfore a kick out of the party is in my eyes well..justified..If you aren’t willing to read, you have to live with the consequences.

Dungeon selling. It’s really some bug issue in this game and i totally support and can absolutely agree with every dungeonseller’s opinion who got kicked out of his/her party. That shouldn’t be possible, and is, as I would say something which should be also considered thinking about – with the chnages of kicking any player.

It would be great for people to get the posibillity to go over a player’s name and select his/her options. There should be written things like, got kicked, kicked other players – this statistic could be renewed every week or every month.
So joing a party out of which you will be kicked later, leaving you with grief and dissapointment won’t be given that way.

Just my opinion.

lol @ODB accusing oxtred of raging, whilst making angry walls of text.

3/10.

dlonie.6547:

lol @ODB accusing oxtred of raging, whilst making angry walls of text.

3/10.

Think of it like him being trolled (except I think ODB was seriously raging). Dude flipped out and insulted him, so then he flipped out too and came back at the guy.

At worst he blew his chance to be the adult.

Meh, I actually didn’t insult it. I just bluntly put what was wrong in his reasoning. I’d say I blew my chance to be polite and nice. And honestly I don’t care.

OP is 100% right.

+1 to the Leader system. Being kicked from your own party is the stupidest thing in existence, and I can’t think of other mmo’s that have this type of system. I’ve only been kicked once, but it made me think about how crappy the current system is.

The group I made was for experienced only, yet clearly not all were experienced. It was obvious after one guy completely botched a pull. I suggested a way it could be done better and he told me to get lost, he “did this dungeon all the time”, and was “sick of people telling him how to play”. I thought, “whoa, someone has some authority issues” since I merely offered suggestions for next time. Yet he keeps talking up how big he is, how many AP he has, all the fancy skins, so much that he doesn’t even take part in the next fight. He claims that he’s “oh, just clearing my inv”. In the middle of a fight… I vote to kick this kitten-bag since he’s just deadweight at this point, and then I get kicked… Couldn’t facepalm hard enough.

The system needs to change, but Anet is pretty sloppy on this kind of thing. I get the feeling that the big changes this game really needs to become great won’t happen because the money just isn’t available. Dungeons need a revamp, certain classes need a rework, crafted precursors, etc It’ll never happen. I’m hoping the money is going into a really great xpac or GW3 or something, because Anet has been sitting on their hands for too long.

there is usually a reason why someone is kicked from a party ?

Ofc there is, here we go:

- Just before last boss in dungeon / fractal, lets invite friends from our guild.
- lets log in with our other account and claim gold for ourselves if last boss is easy duo-able.
- lets sell dungeon to random players on lfg.
- lets kick someone for fun as a joke, if he isnt from popular guild or have tons of achievement points, it doesnt matter. its not like we will ever need him.
- Lets join almost finished dungeon on LFG, since we are lucky enough to find someone who needs help, and lets kick him ! so that we can invite our own friends.

The best part of all this, is that NO ONE WILL EVE KNOW. There is no world chat, so other guy cant complain about it to preatty much anyone. He will tell in his guild ? lol who cares, there is like godzilla amount of guilds left to scam.

Graduated kick system, first half only the Leader can kick works well for PUGS that asks for certain build or professions, third quarter kick with 3 or more players consent, last quarter dissolve the party everyone loses takes at least 4 players to instigate gives at least some protection to solo Dungeon runners and stops players from kicking to help their friends or guildies. I’ve never understood the logic of 2 players being able to kick it just doesn’t make sense, of course I could be wrong but is it just a suggestion.