Guild Wars 2

4 silver is hardly a reward. I can farm Temple of Grenth and fail the event, and with magic find sets you can get about 3-4 rares per event chain or more, with other drops, valuable metal scraps that may give ori.

Salvage, get ectos, sell 20-24 silver for each ecto, sometimes rares can give up to 3. And if the event completes, I have a chance at a precursor.

The solution is not inflating prices of magic find, burdening dungeon groups by detracting stats from groups as magic find substitutes actual stats.

What’s worse, what people hate the most in this game, Mystic Forge gambling, is being put into dungeons as well. Why do you keep insisting on introducing RNG into the game when players already are telling you they detest it? Now your dungeon run MAY be profitable enough if you run with magic find, but it may still not, because it is still RNG.

Why are you not looking at lodestone drops from dungeon chests? Why do champions and bosses not have significantly higher chances at rares and exotics? And why do people need to be suited in magic find to even find the dungeon close to profitable?

A zerg DE with aoe spam should NEVER be more profitable than a dungeon run.

It has always been profitable doing dungeon runs. It was the fact that the loot was trash.
Running dungeons was just a means to get tokens and some money.
I’m not really sure what adding a bit more karma and silver does for it, though.

Maybe they added some nice loot to some of the tables, so you might get an occasional surprise. Hopefully.

Running a dungeon other than AC may get you about 2 gold on average( around 3-4 depending on core/lodestone drops from chests, which is rather rare) in about an hour to an hour and a half. I can make much more than that just doing a less than 30 min event.

You can’t just say dungeons are profitable. They don’t exist in a vacuum. And in a game where legendaries will run you about 600-700 gold (it may drop to 300-400g with the changes), people will gun for the more profitable ventures.

There is a reason why people are not doing Arah. It takes about 3 hours for all paths, and it gives about the same rewards or less than an AC run that takes 1 hour.

That is true, but some people do not enjoy farming events in Orr.

And, I can say dungeons are profitable, they just don’t happen to be as profitable as event farming.

And people who do not enjoy farming events in Orr shouldn’t be punished with inferior monetary rewards, especially if their preferred tasks are far more difficult and stringent in coordination.

General
New dungeon rewards have been added to all dungeons.

Each dungeon has a new set of unique items with new stat combinations, ranging in rarity from masterwork to exotic. These items have a chance to drop off of certain bosses in the explorable mode of each dungeon.

The drop rarity of Rare and Exotic weapons from certain places in the world (champions, veterans, and players in WvW) has been increased. Rares and Exotics should be much more likely to drop and every champion should be guaranteed to drop loot. This was to ensure that world loot drops were not a significantly worse way of acquiring rare and exotic items than crafting and running dungeons.

I’ve run TA exp almost every day now for a week, and have come out every time with atleast 1-2g profit every time, I’m not seeing where “dungeons are not profitable” comes into this at all. Maybe i’m just lucky, but it seems every group i’ve run with, everyone was “getting lucky” with drops. Also, no I do not use MF gear while doing dungeons, and still get a good amount of cores/lodestones.

Darknass.1903:

I’ve run TA exp almost every day now for a week, and have come out every time with atleast 1-2g profit every time, I’m not seeing where “dungeons are not profitable” comes into this at all. Maybe i’m just lucky, but it seems every group i’ve run with, everyone was “getting lucky” with drops. Also, no I do not use MF gear while doing dungeons, and still get a good amount of cores/lodestones.

Since cores/lodestones come out of chests, and mf doesn’t affect chests, it wouldn’t matter anyways.

Darknass.1903:

I’ve run TA exp almost every day now for a week, and have come out every time with atleast 1-2g profit every time, I’m not seeing where “dungeons are not profitable” comes into this at all. Maybe i’m just lucky, but it seems every group i’ve run with, everyone was “getting lucky” with drops. Also, no I do not use MF gear while doing dungeons, and still get a good amount of cores/lodestones.

1-2g for an hour or more is NOTHING. Do Orr farming to see what 20 minutes get you.

Zenith.7301:

1-2g for an hour or more is NOTHING. Do Orr farming to see what 20 minutes get you.

It’s plenty for me… I guess I’m just not that greedy. If your going to argue semantics that 2g isn’t enough for you then well, I highly doubt you will ever be satisfied with dungeon rewards.

Strifey.7215:

Since cores/lodestones come out of chests, and mf doesn’t affect chests, it wouldn’t matter anyways.

Well yes I meant I still get plenty of drops, I just didn’t word it that well…

Zenith.7301:

Darknass.1903:

I’ve run TA exp almost every day now for a week, and have come out every time with atleast 1-2g profit every time, I’m not seeing where “dungeons are not profitable” comes into this at all. Maybe i’m just lucky, but it seems every group i’ve run with, everyone was “getting lucky” with drops. Also, no I do not use MF gear while doing dungeons, and still get a good amount of cores/lodestones.

1-2g for an hour or more is NOTHING. Do Orr farming to see what 20 minutes get you.

Did the same for an hour, ran 3 events alternatively (while staying for mass mobs ones) for a full hour with full MF set + boost + food.
made what? 2.5g? what 3-4 rares are you talking about per run? I want to live in that dreamworld.

Not to mention that you need to wait between events now and then, killing time doing f—-all.

I just love those best scenario stories that some people write about their experiences.

Just finished 3 AC runs with a good group, we killed all the bosses every time and it took us about 1 hour.
These are my cash gains:
- 3 bosses drop about 14,80s each and a bag of gold (average 3s) = 17,80.
- Last boss always drops 22s (40% increase from omnomberry bar).
- Dungeon reward gives you 26s.
So one run gives about 80s in cash, after selling trash items from mobs and chests should be ~90s-1g per run. If you’re a bit lucky you should get a rare drop aswel which adds another ~20s.

So it is pretty good if you’re able to do 3 runs in an hour.

Ok so about these drops and bags. I ran all TA paths today with MF gear, I can say that the rewards weren’t as great as I thought, I only got 1 rare item and it wasn’t unique, I also got 1 green ring with some crappy stats, this was unique but worthless. Anyway after this experimentation I’ve come to the conclusion that it’s not even worth switching Magic Find gear for this UNLESS bosses don’t drop the loot bags sometimes so I guess I’ll experiment this tomorrow if it affects it.

The loot bags contain the same thing everytime, 3 tokens, a bag of silver that grants 3-4 silver, and a liquid karma which gives about 300 karma without boosts. All bosses dropped this loot bags.

So this is not that bad in my opinion, 9 extra tokens, 900 karma, and about 9-12 extra silver per path is the rewards you are looking at, which is much better than what we had, however I would’ve preferred improved chests.

Bag of Wondrous goods got me 3 tokens and like 2 silver.

Yep, this definitely fixes dungeon loot, and trying to make magic find more prominent in dungeons where it doesn’t belong is another great decision.

Seriously, what the hell are they thinking when they implement this kitten?

Negativity.5801:

Bag of Wondrous goods got me 3 tokens and like 2 silver.

Yep, this definitely fixes dungeon loot, and trying to make magic find more prominent in dungeons where it doesn’t belong is another great decision.

Seriously, what the hell are they thinking when they implement this kitten?

Are you sure they’re random drops? Because every time I’ve done a dungeon since the update, everyone got a bag from the same boss or chest, every time. We all come out with three bags.

3 tokens is an honest to god laugh. 3 tokens.

Never said it was a random drop. Just saying what the bags have in them is negligible. Everyone in my group got the bag off Mark-whatever golem in CoE right before we had to disband the group due to the newly broken Bjarl fight (Thanks Anet)

People have been complaining for weeks about poor dungeon loot and not receiving partial tokens if they’re only able to complete the dungeon and these bags don’t even scratch the surface.

Really don’t think anyone is gonna go, “Well we spent 40 minutes in a dungeon and couldn’t complete it, but at least I got 3 tokens from the bag.”

Just saying, I’m pretty sure it’s not affected by MF.

I never said anything about MF.

It’s closer to 9 tokens, which is paltry anyways since most costs go for around 210+ tokens. You would need to run a dungeon about 8 times full clear to get a focus or torch. You’d need to run it 12 times for a mainhand weapon extra.

People were expecting dungeons to stand out as rewarding experiences for coordinated play. Lodestone drops could have incentivized dungeon participation, since lodestone drops are abysmal everywhere.

At least people know it’s still better to farm ori nodes and play the trading post game. Legendaries are still about hoarding gold instead of playing different aspects of the game to craft it.

From all my sources, it’s 3 tokens from the bag. So it depends on the dungeon to what the total amount is “closer” to. Either way, it’s still garbage.

I might’ve agreed if it was like 10 per bag, but 3? Really?

Definitely still expecting the lodestone buff exclusive to dungeons.

Barring any additions to current dungeon vendors, the 9 tokens are negligible. Accumulate them over acquiring say a dozen pieces and you may be able to skip a run for the seventh.

Currently the only thing I see happening to them are being traded for the non-exotic gear to be salvaged for ecto’s, usually 40 a piece. If ANet still has plans to introduce tokens as a rare drop, then perhaps together the change would be worthwhile. Though to be honest, I’d rather not have tokens take up my loot finds because I actually want rares.

I got three bags from doing HotW Butcher path and Arah Jotun path back-to-back. I have yet to open them though thinking that I could dump them in the Mystic Forge (which I have yet to test since I’m too sleepy from that Arah run) or use it for crafting, and maybe something awesome might come out of it … think I should open them now or save them? I know I can’t stack them for some odd reason.

The OP is absolutely right, bags of wonderous goods will not fix dungeons, but is that what their intention is in the first place? The way I see it is this was put in for the people that are not fortunate enough to finish the dungeon so they don’t have to walk away with nothing but a terrible feeling. If you remember each boss used to drop 10 then 15 at the end for a total of 45. They switched it to just 60 at the end and nothing during. Now its 3+3+3+60 for 69 per full run or a lesser amount depending on how far you get. How is this a bad thing, they give you something for failure and they even give you a small cut of karma rewards for failure. For those of us who are not failures we just got more rewards.

Mycro.4786:

The OP is absolutely right, bags of wonderous goods will not fix dungeons, but is that what their intention is in the first place? The way I see it is this was put in for the people that are not fortunate enough to finish the dungeon so they don’t have to walk away with nothing but a terrible feeling. If you remember each boss used to drop 10 then 15 at the end for a total of 45. They switched it to just 60 at the end and nothing during. Now its 3+3+3+60 for 69 per full run or a lesser amount depending on how far you get. How is this a bad thing, they give you something for failure and they even give you a small cut of karma rewards for failure. For those of us who are not failures we just got more rewards.

Pretty much this.
I enjoyed dungeons before the change. This has only improved matters.
On top of that, there’s the “unique stat distribution” weapons, and remember that dungeons have a good number of Champion mobs – I’m assuming these will have the same loot table improvement as in the rest of the world

Pugs never liked dungeons.This change is good for coordinated groups.
I personally like the change

Heh. Lodestones. Could be the only thing preventing the dungeons from becoming obsolete after this patch… Hope Anet has a plan. Or… maybe not.

God, nobody can just be happy with something extra. The bags of wondrous loot (in Arah, at least, we did mursaat and forgotten last night) also dropped mini vials of karma, 3 tokens, and 3-4s in the bag of gold.

It’s not a ton, because then people would just farm a first boss over and over. But have you ever tight fisted your tokens because you were saving up for armor and weapons, and looked longingly at maybe getting the dungeon potions? This lets you get the dungeon potions without sacrificing your tally for the next weapon or armor piece. Or don’t buy any potions and save up to get something just a little bit faster. I happen to like the change, it was much appreciated.

So really. All I hear is whine whine whine. Y’all want some cheese with that?

I ran one Path in AC, TA, and CoF last night with some guildies, and we rather enjoyed the additional loot from bosses/chests. I myself didn’t get anything great from chests, but two of the other guys got two rares each from a single chest. Even though it didn’t happen to me, I’d say it was a significant buff from before. The added coin from the bosses plus a core or lodestone here and there has made dungeons more profitable, and I intend to run them more often now.

With Plinx occurring less frequently it will force players to disperse to other things more often which I think is a good thing. Dungeons are the perfect place to go.

Honestly, I’m quite happy with the update. You now get extra money, a little karma and 3 tokens in addition to everything else. 3 tokens may be few, maybe 5 would be better but anyway, it’s still good.
And what’s even more good is that there are new items looting, as I saw exotic jewels at TP with stats you cannot craft …
So, defintely a good update regarding dungeons

I love the bags, now that I’ve tested it. The only thing I don’t like is that bosses don’t always drop the bags. For all dungeons, you either get the bag (great drop) or you get worthless jewelry that cannot be put on the TP and isn’t worth the karma/silver/token loss of the bag. I haven’t tried it on Arah yet, but I imagine it’s the only dungeon with actually valuable jewelry worth more than the bag itself.

Proposed Solution: Always drop the bag from these bosses, but in addition you could get the jewelry if you’re lucky and have good MF.

I’m happy with the change too.Extra karma for dungeons is always welcome

Run a dungeon since the loot update for the first time today. Altogether happy: drop of liquid karma is a great idea particularly.

The tokens given, though, are too few: at the current rate of 3 per bag, there’s almost no chance of those bags meaning a player would have to run a dungeon any less. I need to run SE 10 more times to complete my armour set; I’d have to get 20 bags of wondrous goods to mean I’d have to run the dungeon just one less time.

I’d say somewhere between 5 and 10 would be reasonable.

Still, overall happy with the update

The bags are a pretty good start and have potential, but in their current state I find them very boring.

It would be better if they had some items that could scale with the economy, like cores/lodestones or t6 mats. If we could get those items from the bags (randomly of course) it would go a long way to making these bags more interesting and exciting to get.

I couldn’t care less about some extra karma/silver/tokens. I need 59 more Charged Lodestones from CoE, and at the current drop rates, the tedium is sinking in. Really, fix the acquisition of cores/lodestones first. Maybe have them drop in the bags, too, at least.

I run dungeons because they’re fun and profitable for me. I dont always run then in MF, and this might be an incentive to run it more often in MF, but I tend to make decent money regardless. I can make 3g a day just doing 3 or 4 dungeon runs. Albeit one of those is HotW which is notorious for filling up your bags. I don’t enjoy farming Orr that much unless I go with my guildies, so to me dungeons are a great way to get money.

These bags are really nice to me. Sure, 3 is a strange number. I will now be left with stacks of 18 or some weird number that is just incredibly annoying to me, but hey. More tokens for doing what I have been doing. The karma is also nice, especially if you save it for a booster. Any karma is helpful. Any silver is helpful too.

I appreciate that they added something that they didn’t necessarily NEED to add. IMO dungeons weren’t that bad before, and now they are slightly better. Everyone is just complaining that they can’t make gold fast enough. I’d rather them focus on fixing the broken dungeons instead of making these bags even better.

I for one am pleased with the Bag.

However, what needs to be emphasized now is the fact mobs drop 10-15s (20+ with omnombar) AND the bag!

This means you could make possibly 25s per boss using an omnom bar.

It’s a great change in my opinion. I don’t understand why people don’t like this.

What I want is a way to save dungeon progress so it’ll give me an opportunity to get past that bugged last door or boss. A single non-completion means I need 20 bags of wondrous goods to get back what I lost, not exactly a nice thing to even attempt at farming.
So no, I don’t think these bags fix dungeons, but atleast they’re a step in the right direction.

Yeah, on the right path, also bosses drop a lot more silver now. But I can confirm NOT ALL CHAMPS DROP LOOT. Happened on numerous occasions already where some party members received nothing.

The real issue here:

Orr farming = more profit than dungeons.

Fix?: Put dungeons on par with the kinds of profits people make from Orr farming.

This way: Get people out of grinding the same event over and over and this gives them another option. I don’t want to farm Orr, I would much rather be in a dungeon, but because Orr makes me more money for my time, I’m unfortunately stuck there.

Auesis.7301:

I couldn’t care less about some extra karma/silver/tokens. I need 59 more Charged Lodestones from CoE, and at the current drop rates, the tedium is sinking in. Really, fix the acquisition of cores/lodestones first. Maybe have them drop in the bags, too, at least.

I have to agree with this, and provides the best potential “fix” for dungeons if what needs to be fixed is to get people to want to do them more than other things. I was actually going to make a topic in the suggestions forum about this if there wasnt one already. You already have different cores/lodestones attached to different dungeons and if you look at which ones are the most expensive, its the dungeons that no one typically goes to.

A great solution would be to make lodestones purchasable with dungeon tokens but the trick would be in setting the price right. It does no good to make them cheap, saturating the market and bottoming out the value as that would cheapen the items that use them.

A good way to look at it is to look at the exotic weapons/armor cost comparison. It costs on average 300 tokens for an item that typically goes for 2-3g for its crafted equivalent. I think if you set the price at 200 it would work out decently as that would mean one lodestone per full run of 3 now that we have the wonderous bags. That would still be a lot of runs for a weapon that takes say 100 charged lodestones. If you used that method alone you’re talking 300 individual paths. No one in their right mind would do that, however you do get silver per run and you get cores every now and again that can add to the mix.

I would add to that the idea that you take the cores out of the chests all together and make them an end of run reward. One core per path would make it so each set of 3 paths would give you 2.5 lodestones and 50silver plus w/e other stuff you get that could sell for silver or breakdown into mats. I mean even in this case you’d be looking at 30 days of all 3 paths being run on average to get 100 lodestones. That’s a lot of time to spend in one dungeon, now imagine how far off from that we are now it’s barely reasonable.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

one of the main reasons we put the tokens in the Wondrous bag, is because of people not always being able to reach the end of the path. We want partial rewards for players, but it has to be at an amount that won’t be abused by just killing the first boss over and over. We hope that 3 will be enough, and if we find it isn’t, we’ll balance it further.
I’ll look into our champion mobs not dropping lot. They certainly should.

I’ve killed three champions since patch (outside of dungeons) and none of them dropped loot. (The undead with lots of shades…Demensor? and the two plinx-related champions). I’ve also done a full run of TA F/F and got nothing (or occasionally grays) from every champion pull along the way.