Best way to start raiding?
1. Pick a class. Your best bet is one of the commonly used classes that are seen in 5-5 mirror setups: [Ranger, Mes, War, and 2 DPS slots] . The DPS slots are usually eles, but also often guards and thieves.
2. Gear picked class and buy a bunch of relevant food and utility. The guild qT (quantify) has a pretty nice site for builds… can prob find it by googling “qT builds elementalist”
3. Learn your class. Go to Aerodrome special forces arena (requires commander tag in squad set to raid mode). Practice your class rotation until you’re fairly close to video (note that they usually give themselves all buffs and golems all conditions). Your dps numbers might be a bit low as theyre running with food, you dont really need food for it, just try to more or less line up the cooldowns. Twitch a bit during practice if eventually you’ll be using seaweed salad to get used to the constant movement (+10% dmg while moving)
4. Watch boss training vids for the boss(es) you want to do. Might want to look for people killing said boss with your chosen class (usually marked as someth like “Ele POV”)
5. Find a raid, ideally a training raid to start, and possibly a guild that accepts new people. Let them know how confident you are in golem rotation and that you did your boss homework by watching vids.
Good luck, have fun.
icy`
Join 1 or 2 guilds that do raid training and have static teams to clear them weekly. My 2 guilds [YAK] and [Fuzzy] work pretty well for that, and there are many more.
Join raiding guilds, you will never get into raids otherwise.
Hi all, what is the best way to get started with Raiding? Mostly have ascended gear armor/trinkets but no asc weapons yet. Am really into Fractals and up to about 50 now (climbed from 20 this week). and was looking into the next progression, which seems to be raids as dungeons and now ezpz. Not really sure Raid strats, but am good at following directions though, so would be looking for an informational team…
It’s curious that u have ascended armor and not weps.. this seems like a common misconception that’s probably going to only get more misconstrued with the advent or release of legendary armor esp with the overblown hype surrounding it and whatnot. So probably worthwhile to disabuse u of the implicit notion while it still remains in its nascent stage.. but the long and short of it is that statwise weps > trinkets > armor (iirc).
Anyway as to getting your feet wet with raids.. I’d probably advise a swan dive approach into it, though I know I risk getting shot down by others here on the forums for doing so. So funny side story here, I joined a 100 cm group today when still it’s inception or somthin with 2 others in grp, one of them insta-left (I would call it an insta-ragequit, funnily enough) simply upon seeing a war was on board in the grp. I pm’d him and we had a few back and forths and managed to keep it civil, basically me asking why he dislikes wars and him countering that 100 cm is ‘un-meleeable’ in his words, me stating all bosses in t4 are meleeable and interspersing it with helpful L2p quips, him getting angry and pinging me full stacks of LI for some reason, me brushing it off and offering to ping more than max allowed amt of it in one stack, him childishly blocking me and then hate-mailing me vials of salt or some such afterward when he knew I could not hit ‘return to sender’ on him.. u know, funny and trivial everyday stuff that happens with pugs for some reason.
Basically point here is, LI is meaningless as illustrated in this scenario. Dude had no clue what to expect, missed out on a good grp that got done maybe half hour and one wipe across the bosses (on the orbs on last one). Now apply this to raids where LI is actually used.. knowing that some1 ran raids x times over the span of many months is infeasible to determine skill imo. How many x times you’ve got kill on a boss (or almost kill) is more important indicator at least for ‘hands on’ exp imo, however that’s not rly possible to get a measure of either. So LI, the more imperfect standard, is prevalently used instead.
Being relatively newcomer to raids (easily more then 6 months late in getting hot myself) I can relate.. tho I suppose I am slowly becoming as jaded as most others who ask for 200 li and stuff, that’s just cos no one bothers to read lfg posts (a common widespread problem that started waaay before even hot). So yeah lie to get ur 1st kill if u have to, that’s what I did. I use the term ‘lie’ here half-jokingly as it’s not necessarily as such. I mean just read guides or watch vids of encounters, u won’t need much explained tbh. Of course it’s a little more different when ur actually experiencing it firsthand, ofc that’s where ‘hands-on’ training comes into play. It’s what I did to.. never joined a single training run except for vg either, and yet look here I am with almost 100 li under my belt.
That best advice I can give u is just to dive headfirst into it, heck join exp if u are at least more than semi-exp since that’s how most ppl get their 1st kill anyway. But yeah u also gotta keep in mind some stuff like.. go for those ts and other voice chat clients as a must when u join grps that use em, I mean believe it or not I got more or less castigated earlier when I related my technical issues and difficulties in getting em to work (e.g. browser incompatibilities and stuff). So yeah get on voice chat they actually friendly most pugs anyway and they will help u out give u some running commentary like where next cannons spawn on sab and stuff that can save u some headache in the long run. But I mean otherwise just try to be honest when u can, obv pinging two full stacks of LI and falling face flat on ground every chance u get is counterintuitive, I mean I guess u can see why…
Arun Kar
(edited by nagr.1593)
Hi all, what is the best way to get started with Raiding? Mostly have ascended gear armor/trinkets but no asc weapons yet. Am really into Fractals and up to about 50 now (climbed from 20 this week). and was looking into the next progression, which seems to be raids as dungeons and now ezpz. Not really sure Raid strats, but am good at following directions though, so would be looking for an informational team…
It’s curious that u have ascended armor and not weps.. this seems like a common misconception that’s probably going to only get more misconstrued with the advent or release of legendary armor esp with the overblown hype surrounding it and whatnot. So probably worthwhile to disabuse u of the implicit notion while it still remains in its nascent stage.. but the long and short of it is that statwise weps > trinkets > armor (iirc).
Anyway as to getting your feet wet with raids.. I’d probably advise a swan dive approach into it, though I know I risk getting shot down by others here on the forums for doing so. So funny side story here, I joined a 100 cm group today when still it’s inception or somthin with 2 others in grp, one of them insta-left (I would call it an insta-ragequit, funnily enough) simply upon seeing a war was on board in the grp. I pm’d him and we had a few back and forths and managed to keep it civil, basically me asking why he dislikes wars and him countering that 100 cm is ‘un-meleeable’ in his words, me stating all bosses in t4 are meleeable and interspersing it with helpful L2p quips, him getting angry and pinging me full stacks of LI for some reason, me brushing it off and offering to ping more than max allowed amt of it in one stack, him childishly blocking me and then hate-mailing me vials of salt or some such afterward when he knew I could not hit ‘return to sender’ on him.. u know, funny and trivial everyday stuff that happens with pugs for some reason.
Basically point here is, LI is meaningless as illustrated in this scenario. Dude had no clue what to expect, missed out on a good grp that got done maybe half hour and one wipe across the bosses (on the orbs on last one). Now apply this to raids where LI is actually used.. knowing that some1 ran raids x times over the span of many months is infeasible to determine skill imo. How many x times you’ve got kill on a boss (or almost kill) is more important indicator at least for ‘hands on’ exp imo, however that’s not rly possible to get a measure of either. So LI, the more imperfect standard, is prevalently used instead.
Being relatively newcomer to raids (easily more then 6 months late in getting hot myself) I can relate.. tho I suppose I am slowly becoming as jaded as most others who ask for 200 li and stuff, that’s just cos no one bothers to read lfg posts (a common widespread problem that started waaay before even hot). So yeah lie to get ur 1st kill if u have to, that’s what I did. I use the term ‘lie’ here half-jokingly as it’s not necessarily as such. I mean just read guides or watch vids of encounters, u won’t need much explained tbh. Of course it’s a little more different when ur actually experiencing it firsthand, ofc that’s where ‘hands-on’ training comes into play. It’s what I did to.. never joined a single training run except for vg either, and yet look here I am with almost 100 li under my belt.
That best advice I can give u is just to dive headfirst into it, heck join exp if u are at least more than semi-exp since that’s how most ppl get their 1st kill anyway. But yeah u also gotta keep in mind some stuff like.. go for those ts and other voice chat clients as a must when u join grps that use em, I mean believe it or not I got more or less castigated earlier when I related my technical issues and difficulties in getting em to work (e.g. browser incompatibilities and stuff). So yeah get on voice chat they actually friendly most pugs anyway and they will help u out give u some running commentary like where next cannons spawn on sab and stuff that can save u some headache in the long run. But I mean otherwise just try to be honest when u can, obv pinging two full stacks of LI and falling face flat on ground every chance u get is counterintuitive, I mean I guess u can see why…
Best advice I can give you, OP: Don’t be like nagr, don’t lie! Always be honest, you’ll be surprised how many people appreciate honesty.
If you need support, theres a big guild called Raid Training Initiative theyre about the best you can get for a starting point. They do training runs of bosses and events, and practice kill runs (which often result in kills, duh)
Good stories nagr, but I have to agree with Coconut here — you’re derailing solid advice and basically saying, “hey, don’t do any homework at all and just find a way to ping 100 insights and it’ll be fine”.
The only good piece what you said is to be on voice chat, typically TS though some are preferring the more staticky (even with the app) Discord. It’s great that you’re taking the initiative and trying to lead groups, and hopefully people actually experienced chimed in to prevent failure… but to address the lying part of your advice — truth is a good commander will be watching different parts of the team, and will know right away if you’re full of BS. You’ll simply be dishonorably discharged if join reqs were set and you blatantly lied about your qualifications. If it’s not a training run there’s a reason for the advertisement being the way it is — after all, sometimes people are in the mood for teaching, and sometimes they just want to get it done.
I personally use the steps I’ve posted, as do dozens of friends and acquaintances I’ve spoken to. It’s solid advice not based on lies.
Good stories nagr, but I have to agree with Coconut here — you’re derailing solid advice and basically saying, “hey, don’t do any homework at all and just find a way to ping 100 insights and it’ll be fine”.
Where did I say that – where?
So yeah lie to get ur 1st kill if u have to, that’s what I did. I use the term ‘lie’ here half-jokingly as it’s not necessarily as such. I mean just read guides or watch vids of encounters, u won’t need much explained tbh.
that sounds familiar? yeah basically mirrors what u said earlier..
a good commander will be watching different parts of the team, and will know right away if you’re full of BS. You’ll simply be dishonorably discharged if join reqs were set and you blatantly lied about your qualifications.
And how do u define lying exactly? There’s a little white lie and a huge big one that’ll wipe ur group and kill ur chances of successful kill. I agree the latter should be punishable by swift discharge. I have kicked a ps on VG once for running fire runes -> 0% boon duration, in addition to this no banners at all but selfish traits. Not specified in post explicitly either. Should someone have told him to run dual banners at all times? How is ‘exp’ defined to you – exp with ur class and its mechanics, or exp with the encounter? If it’s both or either then y not state that in LFG, instead of ‘X LI, killproof, ping gear’? A person can meet gear and LI reqs but be terrible at his class or role (like orb pushing at kc, or using spirit res on platforms in xera) do u think this should always be punishable by insta-kick since they obv don’t meet the qualficiations? I might even agree they deserve to be kicked, but does this necessarily or usually happen? No, they are 7/10 times not kicked for failing the implied class check. So what do you define as qualifications or exp in that case – what do u believe most others would consider as such?
Obviously ur only discharged in such circumstances if u call urself out by urself actions, and then u deserve it. Like stealing and being caught red handed, that deserves punishment simply for failing to do it right. But lie abt qualifications and no one’s the wiser, then there’s very little chance of getting discharged as u say.
I personally use the steps I’ve posted, as do dozens of friends and acquaintances I’ve spoken to. It’s solid advice not based on lies.
Have I quoted ur post or even mentioned it in my response? You never stated anything abt lying (or not lying) in ur post, so I dunno how I could be accused of statuing anything contrary to what u said in any way. Only point I disagreed with is need for training runs and guilds, training runs can be a colossal waste of time and an exercise in frustration basically, and oh yeah u can still have a tiff with guildies and end up with one of u blocking the other, thus never seeing the other’s chat ever. But other than that.. no. I dunno why u are putting words in my mouth here..
Arun Kar
(edited by nagr.1593)
@nagr, you’re really true to your name
But it’s true, you’re derailing the original discussion which is ‘how to start raiding’ by making topics of your personal raiding experiences that do not add to the question. Your stories may be valid or not, I’m not going to have that discussion, but they have no validity here because you’re arguing personal experiencies that don’t relate to the original topic. you make matters worse, when you are called out on it, you start an argument which only further derails this whole topic.
so please I am not asking you to pack up and leave, just stick to the topic of OP or make a new topic on the forum for your own experiences.
@nagr — Well, I was on a phone in my last posts so was trying not to go crazy with quotes. But when you told the anecdote of starting your own group with 100+ LI req when even you didnt have it, with kind of a carefree tone… I wasn’t even sure if I wanted to read the rest. And yeah, LI is not always the best indicator since someone could’ve been carried the whole time and not actually have individual skill.
For me, priorities would be
gear+food > knowing class > knowing boss > boss kills/LI
You could skirt the system and look for shortcuts, and sure that might even work, but it’s really not good advice in the long term. Not good if you’re trying to establish more permanent connections and get into static groups.
@nagr, you’re really true to your name
Ok? That’s like saying a book is true to its cover. Maybe it’s so, but it’s not necessarily nice to say either.
But it’s true, you’re derailing the original discussion which is ‘how to start raiding’ by making topics of your personal raiding experiences that do not add to the question.
They do add to the question. OPs topic was on best way to start raiding and since I’m a relative newcomer as well, I gave him some helpful advice that I myself used to garner exp and weekly kills. The truth is no one held my hand when I started, no one’s going to hold his either. I understand what that’s like
you make matters worse, when you are called out on it, you start an argument which only further derails this whole topic.
Other ppl are the one starting the arguments and disagreeing with my advice, I am simply defending myself by refuting their claims through examples of personal firsthand evidence.
If anyone should be accused of derailing the thread, imo it seems like it would be u for starting an ad hominem attack while at same time adding nothing helpful or relevant to what OP was asking for.
@icy I think your missing my point which was LI is meaningless and speaks nothing abt a players skill or experience with their class, roles, and their rotations for example. I could ping u whole stacks of LI if it made u feel better for having me in the grp, but it wouldn’t be the whole truth either. I could have as little as single digit LI or easily triple digits of it, it still doesn’t prove a whole lot. It’s not the entire picture, just a small part of it
point proven
First off, you should approach this problem is a sensible way, starting with easiest bosses, and working your way up. Roughly, I would say in terms of difficulty (easiest first):
1.)escort
2.) trio
3.) gorseval (no updrafts is easier than updrafts if you know your dps rotation)
4.) keep construct
5.) sloth
6.) vale guardian
7.) sabetha
8.) xera
9.) Matthias
But before you can try to kill these guys, I would recommend first maxing out your gliding mastery. As leyline and updrafts are useful. Doing the easy daily adventures (such as drone race) is a good way to do this with minimal effort. Mushroom mastery is also useful. Additionally, you need to bind your special action key. Now you are ready for the easiest encounter: escort.
So, read up/watch videos on escort (first boss of 3rd wing), and join an lfg for that. You first time, you should probably be on the ground team. Don’t lie about Legendary insights. Escort is easy enough that people rarely put LI requirements, if you can’t find an escort lfg to join, make your own. Lead it in team speak or discord. Once you get an escort kill, you will unlock your raid masteries. Max these out as soon as possible, as you need them for various roles on some bosses. They are pretty easy to max out with daily adventures.
Now, the next boss for you to learn, should be trio in terms of difficulty. Unfortunately, trio is harder to do, because the instance opener has to have already killed sloth to get to trio. If your joining an lfg, this isn’t a problem. But if your making your own lfg, it is. So, a good second boss would be keep construct, as you can reach it after clearing escort. As long as everyone knows their dps rotations, keep construct is a fairly easy boss. Before trying to kill him, go to the dps golem and test out your knowledge of your class. You can compare dps to qt’s benchmarks (http://qtfy.enjin.com/dps), keep in mind they have completely min maxed with infusions and are using food. If you skip either of these, your dps will suffer quite a bit. Food and utility should be viewed as necessary, but infusions you can skip for now.
I think that is enough for one post. Good luck.
(edited by thrag.9740)
Only 1 problem with the QT benchmarks. If you play power necro, they didnt even bother. So you will have to look elsewhere for rotations on that.
First off, you should approach this problem is a sensible way, starting with easiest bosses, and working your way up. Roughly, I would say in terms of difficulty (easiest first):
1.)escort
2.) trio
3.) gorseval (no updrafts is easier than updrafts if you know your dps rotation)
4.) keep construct
5.) sloth
6.) vale guardian
7.) sabetha
8.) xera
9.) Matthias
Problem with the list is that it’s deliberately vague. I mean I guess it’s aite if ur just generalizing but imo difficulty is gonna be drastically scaled or varied depending on ur role and stuff. So just FYI we could split it into 3 diff roles/approaches to illustrate if we wanted to, not rly the holy trinity or anything but based essentially on how much stuff u gonna be expected to juggle, obv some support/dps roles can sit on sidelines and do nothing while others handle the hard stuff, so that changes things too. Also on the list for condi/ ‘extra’ roles (which for xera for ex., would include platforms and shard clears and stuff) I’m just guesstimating since I obv have no clue.. judging purely tho from how many of them ragequit or get worked up over it.
I dunno that all these lists would be overly helpful tbh but prob especially the last, since no one point it out to me whilst I was learning to grasp these things myself.
Support/melee:
- vale guardian
- kc
- xera
- gorseval
- trio
- escort
- sloth
- sabatha
- matthias
Ranged/condi/extra roles: (*)
- escort (wargs)
- gorseval (spirits)
- trio (sab)
- vale guardian (greens)
- sloth (slubling)
- kc (orbs)
- sabatha (cannons)
- matthias (survival)
- xera
Tank:
- gorseval (no updraft)
- kc
- gorseval (updrafts)
- vale guardian
- xera
(*) – best guess :P
Arun Kar
I started (and subsequently quit) raiding late and completely solo, at a point where people were already running in 50 and 100 LI req groups. But here’s what worked for me.
1) Read the guides and watch at least couple videos. Most of it probably won’t stick but you will have a general idea of what to expect. Focus on wing 1, escort and trio. This is where most training and newbie groups start.
2)You’ll want to gear up at least two classes that fit into the meta. Choose classes that you can play reasonably well and enjoy playing. This can’t be emphasized enough. If you choose based on popularity alone but hate playing ’em you might have a bad time. Some people can be pretty finicky about team comps, so the more options you have the better. One DPS and one condi is a good place to start. Full ascended gear is ideal, but exotic armour with ascended weapons, trinkets and back item is perfectly viable as well.
Stick to the meta. It’ll cost you, but if you’re ever in a position where you have to ping your gear this can a long way in convincing people that you’re not a complete muppet (half of your success getting into raiding will be convincing strangers to take a chance with you).
Buy appropriate food and utility too. It’s fine to save the pricey stuff for when you expect a kill, and use the 2nd best up until then. You may also want to ‘look’ the part. Don’t be running around lookin’ like you only just hit 80, put your best skins and title on. Impressions count.
3) Find some all-welcome, first timer and no LI groups on the LFG to get your feet wet with. Make your own if none are available and prepare to wait. Be sure you have access to at least TS3 and Discord, and a chat channel with ‘Say’, ‘Whispers’, ‘Party’ and ‘Squad’ enabled. You probably don’t need to actually voice chat unless you really want to, but listening is essential.
Have a go at it, wipe over and over but most importantly learn a little. Don’t sweat it too much, you’ll probably never see any of these people ever again anyway. You may not even get past the first phase for any bosses (with luck you’ll score a couple of kills though) but you will have a much better idea of how your class(es) play and what to do.
4) Serious business time. Get into an organized group. You absolutely will want to find a raiding/raid training guild, or at least a guild with some experienced raiders that does weekly runs. The entire point of the first three steps is that by the time you’re ready to commit, you’re in a position where the experienced raiders will feel like you’d make a worthwhile contribution and not just be another scrub looking to be carried.
Good luck.
Only 1 problem with the QT benchmarks. If you play power necro, they didnt even bother. So you will have to look elsewhere for rotations on that.
A thread asking about how to start raiding probably shouldn’t venture into off meta builds. Not saying they can’t be very helpful. I myself have a minstrel chrono tank, my guild often has ran with an auramancer healer ele, and we had condi mesmer being used before the recent reddit threads about it. But when your first beginning raiding, it is better to stick with something guaranteed to work that will be easily accepted in lfgs.
Only 1 problem with the QT benchmarks. If you play power necro, they didnt even bother. So you will have to look elsewhere for rotations on that.
A thread asking about how to start raiding probably shouldn’t venture into off meta builds. Not saying they can’t be very helpful. I myself have a minstrel chrono tank, my guild often has ran with an auramancer healer ele, and we had condi mesmer being used before the recent reddit threads about it. But when your first beginning raiding, it is better to stick with something guaranteed to work that will be easily accepted in lfgs.
I’d argue that minstrelchrono is way better for safer clears, even the elite guilds use it in tournaments now (see mighty tepots elitist raiding tourney interview). DPS is rarely the issue with chrono, and mistrel chrono makes you kitten there unkillable. But as for necro, yes, its safer to stick with condi because people will accept it more often. However I have done plenty pug runs with power necro’s. It’s all up to the OP what they want to run, but they need to accept the consequences of running it.
I’m just throwing it out there because power necro is just so easy for people to dismiss, so easy that the guild a lot of people rely on for DPS denchmarks didnt even bother to do them for the build.